Pop Culture Happy Hour – "Brokeback Mountain" (October 2, 2025)

Podcast: NPR's Pop Culture Happy Hour
Host: Glenn Weldon
Panelists: Bob Mondello (NPR film critic), Jarrett Hill (writer), Rihanna Cruz (music and culture journalist)
Runtime Summary: Content discussion begins at [03:01], with ads and credits bookending the episode.

Episode Overview

Twenty years after the release of Brokeback Mountain, the Pop Culture Happy Hour team revisits the film’s legacy, cultural impact, and how its reputation and meaning have evolved. Host Glenn Weldon leads a multigenerational and diverse panel through personal reactions, the movie’s depiction of love and repression, conversations about representation, and reflections on queer storytelling through the lens of both then and now.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

The Film’s Place in Cultural Memory and Personal Histories

[04:18] Recap & Awards:
Glenn Weldon contextualizes the film’s massive cultural resonance, its critical and box office success, and how it became a lightning rod for discomfort, jokes, and memes.

• “Jack's line, I wish I knew how to quit you became a cultural punchline, a meme, even before memes were like a whole thing.” – Glenn Weldon
• Classic line drop: “I wish I knew how to quit you.” – (as delivered by Jake Gyllenhaal/[04:18])

[04:53] Bob Mondello revisits his review:
He notes the film is even more about the men’s relationships with their wives than he remembered, and reiterates how deeply the film struck him upon first viewing:

“Jack and Ennis crafted an Eden atop Brokeback Mountain, but when they came back down, they couldn’t bring themselves to be themselves and it evaporated. Sad story. Terrific movie.” – Bob Mondello ([04:34])
“I remember vividly feeling that this was the best picture of that year and then being really frustrated when it didn’t get best picture, especially considering that it went to Crash.” – Bob ([05:21])

[05:53] Rihanna Cruz’s generational perspective:
Rihanna didn’t see the film on initial release but absorbed its reputation through “cultural osmosis.” As a queer person, she finds herself repeatedly drawn back to the film for its style and haunting emotional pull:

“It feels like one of those movies that I genuinely can’t get off my mind. No matter how hard I try, I’m kind of always thinking about it... This movie just sticks with me. I’ve never let it go.” – Rihanna ([06:22])

[07:27] Jarrett Hill: Fresh Eyes and Contrarian Take
Seeing the film for the first time, Jarrett relates to the cultural omnipresence, but ultimately finds it emotionally cold and frustrating, struggling with its lack of overt intimacy and the tragic arc.

“I watched it yesterday for the first time and at the risk of being the contrary opinion... I was not really moved.” – Jarrett ([07:35])
“...I know that this was something that people hadn’t seen on screen before, but I thought there was going to be something bigger that would happen... I was like, wait, wait, wait... they’re not even going to actually be together?” – Jarrett ([09:00])

Broader Context: Importance & Limitations of Brokeback Mountain

[08:32/09:21] Bob’s Historical Perspective
Bob recalls being a closeted (to the public) gay man when the film debuted, and the impossibility of overestimating its uniqueness at a time when mainstream gay stories were exceedingly rare, and actors hesitated to take such roles.

“Back then, it was the Unicorn. There weren’t other films like this in the marketplace. That’s why it’s powerful for me... actors were afraid to play gay back then–was a big deal.” – Bob ([08:54])

The Problem and Purpose of the Story

[11:05] Glenn: “It’s not about Jack and Ennis. It’s about homophobia.”
Glenn frames the Annie Proulx short story (the film’s source) as less about romance than about the societal and emotional conditions preventing love. He highlights the limitation of the film’s creative team, mostly not publicly queer, and the faintly sanitized nature of the intimacy on screen.

“These scenes aren’t really meant to be erotic because that would offend people. What they are meant to do... is convey loneliness and need.” – Glenn ([13:14])

How Would Brokeback Land in 2025?

[13:43] Rihanna:
Rihanna reflects on ongoing cultural discomfort about straight actors playing gay roles, and the likelihood of modern social media uproar. Still, she values the movie’s emotional power.

“[Today] it would probably get, like, a TikTok cancellation. Like, nobody that made this film is gay–this is why this is problematic... But at the same time... I think a movie always holds up when you can watch it on a plane and be like, that was still good.” – Rihanna ([14:01])

[14:45] Sexuality and Queerness in the Characters
Rihanna and Jarrett discuss distinguishing between Jack and Ennis’ sexualities, repression, and the impossibility for Ennis to even conceptualize being with Jack.

• “Jack is gay, I think, inarguably so... But Ennis, I don’t really know if he’s gay. I think he has a lot of repressed emotions...” – Rihanna ([14:56])
• “There’s such an overt message about the origins of toxic masculinity in this film... you certainly can’t be queer... We see that in the story when Ennis is drinking and drinking and drinking...” – Jarrett ([15:33])

Jarrett relates the film’s emotional repression to his own coming out and the experience of internalized denial.

“As I look at these characters, though, I don’t think these characters would call themselves gay. Certainly not Ennis, because Ennis never gave himself the space to even ask another question about how he felt about Jack.” – Jarrett ([16:30])

The “Queer Pressure” for Happy Endings

[22:02] Rihanna:
Rihanna observes that contemporary queer cinema often feels pressured to provide happy endings, and in so doing, can lose the aching tension that makes Brokeback Mountain so affecting.

“The reason why Brokeback Mountain is so singular... is because I think it’s the best example of a movie about homophobia, personally.” – Rihanna ([22:26])
“Throughout the movie... you’re slowly wringing out the washcloth and it’s like dripping... you steadily lose that power, cause of the, I think, queer pressure to dodge sadness in our media.” – Rihanna ([23:06])

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On the film’s impact and awards:

  “I remember vividly feeling that this was the best picture of that year and then being really frustrated when it didn’t get best picture, especially considering that it went to Crash.” – Bob Mondello ([05:21])

• On what the film means:

  “The story is not Jack and Ennis fall in love. The story is these two men cannot be together, deal with it.” – Glenn Weldon ([19:24])

• Annie Proulx’s take on fanfiction and the intended message:

  “They (the fanfic writers) can’t understand that the story is not about Jack and Ennis. It’s about homophobia... She wrote a story about two men who landed on the moon and tried to take a walk without spacesuits, and they died... the point is, the moon does not have air. They die.” – as read by Glenn ([18:29])

Timestamps for Key Segments

• [03:01] – Panel introduction
• [04:18] – Movie context and “I wish I knew how to quit you”
• [04:53] – Bob Mondello’s reflections
• [05:53] – Rihanna Cruz’s generational/cultural perspective
• [07:27] – Jarrett Hill’s first-time reaction
• [09:21] – Bob’s personal/historical context
• [11:05] – Glenn’s reading of Annie Proulx and the film’s message
• [13:43] – How Brokeback would be received in 2025 (discussion of “authenticity”)
• [14:45] – Nuanced discussion of the leads’ sexualities and repression
• [22:02] – Changes in queer storytelling and emotional tension
• [23:28] – Brief discussion of underwritten female characters, praise for performances
• [26:36] – Rihanna’s comparison to “Love Island” and external influences on connection
• [27:54] – Pop culture ancestral echoes and allusions (Twilight “Eclipse” comparison)

Female Characters: Underwritten or Understated?

[23:28 – 26:32]
The panel debates whether Alma and Lorene are thin roles or beautifully played, with consensus that both Michelle Williams and Anne Hathaway excel in subtle, “between the lines” acting.

• “The eye acting in this is phenomenal.” – Rihanna ([26:29])
• “I could feel what she was dealing with. I mean, when she went out on that staircase and saw accidentally what she saw, it was just, oh, God, the pain.” – Bob ([24:47])

Pop Culture Tangents and Observations

• Rihanna compares the emotional isolation of Jack and Ennis on the mountain to reality TV structures like “Love Island,” where forced proximity breeds intense attachment ([26:36]).
• Bob draws an unexpected parallel to “Twilight: Eclipse,” much to the panel’s amusement, noting that such dynamics recur in pop culture ([27:54]).

Closing Thoughts

The episode finds the panel both critical and reverential toward Brokeback Mountain. It’s acknowledged as a landmark in queer cinema—both for its limitations and its enormous impact. The discussion highlights generational shifts: where one era saw caution and repression, another now demands joy and authenticity, and the enduring challenge is to tell stories that do justice to both queer pain and queer possibility.

For Further Reflection

Glenn Weldon ends with an open invitation to listeners:

"We want to know what you think about Brokeback Mountain. Let us know..." ([28:32])

Produced by Liz Metzger, Janae Morris, and Mike Katsif. Edited by Jessica Reedy. Music by Hello Come In.

End of content summary.