Pop Culture That Changed Our Minds

Summary

Pop Culture Happy Hour: "Pop Culture That Changed Our Minds"

Release Date: April 10, 2025

Hosts: Ayesha Harris, Glenn Weldon, Stephen Thompson, and Aisha Harris
Guest: Ronald Young Jr.

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1. Introduction to Pop Culture Revelations [03:17 – 03:54]

The episode, hosted by Ayesha Harris, Stephen Thompson, Aisha Harris, and Glenn Weldon, delves into personal revelations each host has experienced through their engagement with various facets of pop culture. The discussion sets the stage for an exploration of unexpected connections and newfound appreciations in media consumption.

Stephen Thompson [00:52]: "At a certain point, most of us settle into a groove with our pop culture consumption."

2. "Friday Night Lights" – A Surprising Affinity [04:16 – 09:05]

Ayesha Harris opens the discussion by sharing her unexpected love for the television series Friday Night Lights. Despite her childhood disdain for high school football—stemming from her upbringing in a sports-centric family—she found herself deeply moved by the show's authentic portrayal of community and character development.

• Key Points:
  • Ayesha was initially resistant due to her background but was "sucked in" by the show's normcore appeal and authentic storytelling.
  • The music and specific sense of place contributed significantly to her appreciation.
  • The ensemble cast and the character development, especially of Coach Taylor, resonated with her.

Ayesha Harris [04:16]: "...somehow Friday Night Lights is my jam, is my total jam, and I have no Idea why?"

Glenn Weldon emphasizes the show's ability to create an immersive environment, highlighting the impactful music and setting that prevent viewers from getting lost.

Glenn Weldon [05:53]: "This show sets a scene and has such an incredibly specific sense of place. How can you not get lost in it?"

Stephen Thompson acknowledges his own appreciation, noting the show's broad appeal across diverse audiences.

Stephen Thompson [07:38]: "It feels like one of the last series that people from all walks of life can agree on."

Aisha Harris mentions her initial unfamiliarity but expresses a desire to revisit the series after hearing her co-hosts' enthusiasm.

3. Breaking Language Barriers with "Train to Busan" [09:28 – 13:10]

Aisha Harris introduces her revelation: the Korean film Train to Busan and her subsequent journey into foreign-language films and series. Initially hesitant due to the language barrier, Aisha overcame this obstacle, expanding her cultural consumption significantly.

• Key Points:
  • Train to Busan ignited her passion for the zombie genre within Korean cinema.
  • Influenced by Bong Joon Ho’s success, she ventured into other international media, such as Alice in Borderland and Squid Game.
  • Aisha emphasizes the importance of subtitles in accessing diverse storytelling.

Aisha Harris [09:28]: "Train to Busan might be my favorite zombie film of all time in terms of, like, spectacle and drama."

Ronald Young Jr., host of Pop Culture Debate Club, echoes the sentiment, highlighting how overcoming the "subtitle obstacle" has enriched his media experiences.

Glenn Weldon [12:22]: "Kids in general are pretty willing to go down this route."

Stephen Thompson reflects on his own barriers and the importance of accessibility in foreign media.

4. Embracing Poetry Through Mary Oliver [13:10 – 19:13]

Glenn Weldon shares his struggle with poetry, traditionally viewing it as self-serious and inaccessible. His revelation came through the works of Mary Oliver, whose accessible and emotionally resonant poetry transformed his perception.

• Key Points:
  • Mary Oliver's themes of nature and self-acceptance provided an entry point for Glenn.
  • The emotional depth of poems like "Wild Geese" and "Summer Day" moved him profoundly.
  • Encouragement to explore beyond stereotypical poetry forms.

Glenn Weldon [13:32]: "Mary Oliver's poetry is extremely accessible and relatable."

Stephen Thompson admits his own aversion to poetry, particularly spoken word, but expresses a newfound interest inspired by the discussion.

Stephen Thompson [18:13]: "It's making me now want to go pick up some poetry, which is something I never thought I would say."

Ayesha Harris suggests additional poets like James Tate and Louise Glück to further explore accessible and humorous poetry.

Ayesha Harris [17:33]: "They are funny as hell and not like funny, I see what you're doing."

5. "Watchmen" – A Standalone Masterpiece [19:13 – 24:19]

Stephen Thompson presents his revelation: Damon Lindelof’s Watchmen series. Unlike typical comic book adaptations, this limited series stands out by offering a fresh narrative that doesn't require prior knowledge of the source material.

• Key Points:
  • Watchmen reimagines an alternate 2019 where the U.S. has a different historical trajectory.
  • The inclusion of significant historical events, such as the Tulsa massacre of 1921, adds depth and relevance.
  • Stellar performances by Regina King and Jeremy Irons enhance the storytelling.
  • The series successfully balances fantastical elements without overwhelming the narrative.

Stephen Thompson [19:27]: "Watchmen didn't make me want to watch all comic book shows and movies, because it didn't."

Ayesha Harris praises the series for its innovative approach, contrasting it with Zack Snyder's more faithful adaptations.

Ayesha Harris [22:56]: "It's such a great choice because this is an outlier in the world of comic book adaptations."

Aisha Harris commends the show's inclusive storytelling and its respectful integration of Black narratives within American history.

Aisha Harris [19:48]: "This series includes black folks in a very, like, meaningful way that also is aligned with the history of the United States."

Glenn Weldon appreciates the series' conclusion, emphasizing the value of ending a show on a high note.

Glenn Weldon [24:12]: "Leave people actually wanting more. This show ends at the exact right time."

6. Conclusion and Final Thoughts [24:19 – 25:08]

The hosts reflect on each other's revelations, expressing mutual appreciation and intrigue. Ayesha, Stephen, and Aisha all express a desire to explore the discussed media further, signaling personal growth and expanded horizons.

Stephen Thompson [25:08]: "I'm gonna go check out some poetry and some Train to Busan now, so thank you."

The episode wraps up with acknowledgments to the production team, leaving listeners with a sense of fulfillment and curiosity about their own pop culture journeys.

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Notable Quotes:

• Glenn Weldon [05:53]: "This show sets a scene and has such an incredibly specific sense of place. How can you not get lost in it?"

• Aisha Harris [09:28]: "Train to Busan might be my favorite zombie film of all time in terms of, like, spectacle and drama."

• Glenn Weldon [13:32]: "Mary Oliver's poetry is extremely accessible and relatable."

• Stephen Thompson [19:27]: "Watchmen didn't make me want to watch all comic book shows and movies, because it didn't."

• Ayesha Harris [22:56]: "If you gotta do ip, do ip. Like this."

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Hosts:

• Ayesha Harris: Engages deeply with narrative storytelling and character-driven discussions.
• Glenn Weldon: Brings thoughtful analysis and personal anecdotes to the conversation.
• Stephen Thompson: Offers insightful critiques and expressive reflections.
• Aisha Harris: Contributes with enthusiasm and personal growth experiences.

Guest:

• Ronald Young Jr.: Provides perspectives on overcoming media consumption barriers, particularly with foreign-language content.

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Produced by: Liz Metzger and Lennon Sherburn
Edited by: Mike Katzen
Supervising Producer: Jessica Reedy
Theme Music: Hello Kamen

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For more insightful discussions and cultural explorations, tune into NPR's Pop Culture Happy Hour.

Transcript

[Ayesha Harris]

This message comes from NPR Sponsor the Official Hacks Podcast from Max. Hacks is back for another season and so is the podcast. Unpack each episode of Hacks with help from the creators, cast and crew. Listen to the Official Hacks podcast wherever you get your podcasts.

[Ronald Young Jr.]

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[Stephen Thompson]

At a certain point, most of us settle into a groove with our pop culture consumption. We know what we love, but we especially know what we're just not that into a certain type of art or a specific genre or artist. That usually makes us say no thanks.

[Glenn Weldon]

Sometimes, though, all it takes is one great outlier or just a willingness to step outside our comfort zone to make us reconsider what we don't like and what a pleasant surprise that can be. I'm Stephen Thompson.

[Stephen Thompson]

And I'm Aisha Harris. And today on NPR's Pop Culture Happy Hour, we're talking about our pop culture revelations.

[Ronald Young Jr.]

Support for NPR and the following message come from Betterment, the automated investing and savings app. CEO Sarah Levy shares how Betterment utilizes tech tools powered by human advice.

[Ayesha Harris]

Betterment is here to help customers build wealth their way and we provide powerful.

[Stephen Thompson]

Technology and complete human support where technology.

[Ayesha Harris]

Can deliver ease of use and affordability.

[Stephen Thompson]

And the people behind that technology can.

[Glenn Weldon]

Provide advantage, advice and guidance.

[Ronald Young Jr.]

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[Stephen Thompson]

Joining us today is our fellow host Glenn Weldon. Hello, Glenn.

[Ayesha Harris]

Hey, Aisha. Glad to talk about revelation. I've been doing a lot of prep work. Number of the beast rider on a pale horse. Oh my God. Seven seals. I'm ready.

[Stephen Thompson]

Yes. Yes. That was inevitable. Thank you, Glenn. Also with us is Ronald Young, Jr. He's the host of Pop Culture Debate Club from Lemonada and the BBC. Hello, Ronald.

[Aisha Harris]

Hello, Aisha. Glenn stole my joke or a joke that I aspire to make someday.

[Ayesha Harris]

See?

[Stephen Thompson]

See, told you.

[Ayesha Harris]

Inevitable. Some say inevitable, some say predictable. Let's go with inevitable.

[Stephen Thompson]

Yes, yes. Look, if it's inevitable, maybe that means it's absolutely right. There are no questions to ask there. Well, we've each brought a piece of pop culture that we didn't expect to like, but did. I'm very excited to hear these picks because, you know, I think we all know each other fairly well. So this should be very interesting. Let's get right into it. Glenn, why don't you kick us off?

[Ayesha Harris]

Sure. If you were to come up to me, Aisha, and say, Glenn, there's the show about high school football. The response you would get from me is not, go on. It would not be. Say more. It's not be. I'm listening now. The response you'd get from me is you'd see, you'd look up to see a glen shaped hole in the nearest wall and some bobby pins twirling in midair. Because I grew up in a household of hardcore football fans. My dad was a high school quarterback. My mom was a cheerleader. She grew up to be the athletic secretary of the school, a high school that I attended. I was dragged to high school football games my entire childhood, which I think explains some of my hatred for the whole world of it. And you. And then you tell me, by the way, the high school in this show, they're playing it straight. There's no Buffy Heathers, Mean Girls, Edge. It's just they're playing it straight. Miss me. But somehow Friday Night Lights is my jam, is my total jam, and I have no Idea why? I mean, I do know why. Because back in 2010, I was assigned to watch Friday Night Lights by this show because we did a segment on pop culture blind spots. And I went back to listen to that episode, and you can hear me struggling with it still, because I had just hit season two, which people who know the show will know that it takes a turn. And I was like, I'm almost out, people. But I did get suckered in. I mean, I don't know why the show is so normcore. It is straight culture. It is the target stretch chinos of television. The gayest thing about the show is Connie Britton's hair, which, I mean, it. Yeah, it's not been considerable.

[Glenn Weldon]

You didn't even mention the music.

[Stephen Thompson]

Yes.

[Glenn Weldon]

I mean, gorgeous needle drops, all that. Explosions in the sky.

[Stephen Thompson]

Yes.

[Glenn Weldon]

This show sets a scene and has such an incredibly specific sense of place. How can you not get lost in it? And, Glenn, I'm just excited that you're into football now. Now you can come over and watch the game with me.

[Ayesha Harris]

Yeah. This turn me. This is the thing. I just got so invested in every tiny change in the Coach and Tammy Taylor relationship, and the show kept thinking it knew what I wanted. It kept throwing shirtless hugs at me. Taylor Kitsch and Michael B. Jordan and Scott Porter and Matt Laura. But I kept loving the characters along the edges. Jesse Plemons. Landry Clark is such a great character, such a great performance. They did some very dumb things with that character, but I never left his side. And, you know, this is a show that centered itself completely on decency. I didn't check before coming on to record this, but I bet there is on YouTube, just a mashup of Coach Taylor looking at somebody from underneath that baseball cap with that stare that says. Well, I mean, it doesn't matter what it says. It could say, I'm disappointed in you. It could say, I'm proud of you. But what it really says is, I care about you. We should all hope to get looked at the way Coach Taylor looks at. I mean, everything. The drywall he looks at. I mean, it's just like, you know, we could talk about how it dealt with its women characters. I think they eventually attained some complexity. I think in the first season, they were a little kind of hanger on y. But, man, what a great ensemble show that kept rotating characters in and out. Right. So that if you did get bored by the Taylor Kitsch Minka Kelly storyline, as I was. You got some Jesse Plemons. You got some Jesse Plemons. Right around the corner. What a great show. What a great show.

[Stephen Thompson]

Yeah. I'm actually kind of disappointed in myself for not thinking of this, like, Glenn. I mean, I didn't grow up with football, but I did grow up just not caring about it, and I still don't care about it. This is the only piece of culture that I actually like that has to do with football. And, yeah, this show I've watched several times. It's just a really good show that feels like one of the last series that people from all walks of life can agree on, which is strange to say. It seems like such a product of that, you know, era. Even if that wasn't the case, like, things were in all sunshine and rainbows in the late mid 2000s when the show was on. But, like, still, you know, this was something most people could, like, agree was like, this is good. This is a good show.

[Aisha Harris]

So I never watched it. So this is a bit of a revelation, I guess, for myself.

[Ayesha Harris]

But where do you come down on football, Ronald? Because people are going to tell you, oh, the show's not about football. The show is about football. You should know.

[Stephen Thompson]

It is about football.

[Aisha Harris]

I like football. And I liked the movie Friday Night Lights. And the problem is, the show started, and I remember seeing a preview and being like, why are they wearing different uniforms from the movie? I don't.

[Glenn Weldon]

Oh, jeez, you're a Friday Night Lights, the movie purist.

[Aisha Harris]

But you're convincing me that I need to go back and give it another shot, because I know I'm probably gonna like it. I just haven't really dedicated the time. Plus, there's so much of it.

[Glenn Weldon]

First of all, Ronald, you're gonna love the show. Second of all, I just imagine you tuning into the TV Buffy the Vampire Slayer and being like, that's not Christy Swanson.

[Ayesha Harris]

There are people who do that. I know people who are like, o, no, it's not the movie. I was like, it's not the movie.

[Stephen Thompson]

Well, Glenn, thank you for that. That was the TV series Friday Night Lights, Texas Forever, as they said many times on that show. Ronald Young, Jr. What is your pop culture revelation that you want to share with us here?

[Aisha Harris]

Okay, so my revelation is there's an entry point, and then I'm going to widen the lens for you. So the entry point is the film Train to Busan, which is a Korean film about zombies, which y'all are all nodding. I hope that you have seen or at least heard of. I'm a huge fan of the zombie genre. I've seen everything. I Don't watch horror movies. I will watch a zombie movie if you tell me there's zombies. And I'm going to watch it because I love trying to strategize. But the reason why I trained to Busan as my revelation is because at the time, I hadn't watched a lot of foreign language anything, any of the Korean, the robust library of Korean dramas and films that exist out there. And this opened the door. I watched this and I'm like, okay, Train do Busan might be my favorite zombie film of all time in terms of, like, spectacle and drama. Like, it'll make you cry. And Koreans do drama very, very, very well. So Fast forward to 2020. Bong Joon Ho is receiving an award for parasite at the Golden Globe Awards, and he says, once you overcome the 1 inch tall barrier of subtitles, you will be introduced to so many more amazing films I'd watch. I had transitioned over to Alice in Borderland, a Japanese series, Squid Game. There was a show called all of Us are Dead. And overcoming that obstacle of the subtitles opened this new world of film and television to me. That may have been obvious to others. It's opened the door, even. I'm watching Dutch stuff, I'm watching Belgian stuff, German, Everything that comes with my purview. I'm like, if it looks all right, I might check it out. So I've overcome that subtitle obstacle, and it's really opened a whole lane for me.

[Stephen Thompson]

I love this, you know, because other people know how to make good movies besides people who speak English. No, it truly, it really is. I think it was a barrier that I also had to sort of get. And I wouldn't say it was a conscious barrier, but it was kind of like what was available right when I was growing up. And I do wonder, though, like, what it's like for those younger people now who maybe only speak one language and that language is English. And then, like, is that barrier harder because we are so attached to our screens when we watch things now. I've tried watching Love is Blind in other languages. And the thing about Love Is Blind. Blind is that I like to watch Love is Blind while doing something else because it's a really hard show to just sit and watch.

[Glenn Weldon]

It does. Yes, I have at least. And obviously anecdotes are not data, but I have two kids who were immediately subtitle snobs. I did not teach them to be subtitle snobs, but they were like, ugh, the dubbed version, you know, when they were like eight. And so I think kids in general are pretty willing to go down this route. And with the way so many TV shows are, the sound mixing on TV shows is so widely so bad. A lot of. A lot of young people today will just put the subtitles on.

[Stephen Thompson]

That's true.

[Glenn Weldon]

In order to follow what's going on. Because dialogue can be so hard to hear, particularly in an age of mumblecore.

[Ayesha Harris]

Yeah, yeah. And Ronald, even if I didn't know you, I would from this pick, I would know that you were not an insufferable snot as a teenager the way I was. I was seeking out subtitles. I would go into the Ritz 5 and fill it just to watch subtitled films. Because I thought that made me smarter. And now you know, it's exactly as Steven said. Now I return to the land of subtitles on absolutely everything. Cause I can't hear a damn thing. I've come full circle when it comes to subtitles.

[Stephen Thompson]

Well, I haven't seen Train to Busan mostly. Cause I'm not a huge. I'm not a zombie person. But we are talking about our revelations. And if Ronald Young Jr. Is very excited about this movie, I might give this a shot. So worth a try.

[Aisha Harris]

Worth a try. Not for everybody, but worth a try.

[Stephen Thompson]

So thank you, Ronald. Of course, that is Train to Busan, but also just generally speaking, foreign language films. We are here for it. I love it. Stephen, revelate me. You know what I mean? Just tell us what you're.

[Glenn Weldon]

Revelate.

[Stephen Thompson]

Reveal. Reveal your revelation.

[Ayesha Harris]

There we go.

[Glenn Weldon]

So in the spirit of football, TV and zombie movies, I've often struggled to read poetry.

[Stephen Thompson]

Okay, same.

[Glenn Weldon]

It is hard for me to get into the right headspace. You know, my whole life, I feel like poetry has been kind of stigmatized as self serious. And I have to confess that I've often liked to think of myself as a philistine. Someone who is too dumb and of course, too cool to read poetry. Now enter the late, great Mary Oliver. Now my partner, Katie has loads of Mary Oliver's poetry books. They've been at my fingertips for the last decade or so that we've lived together. Which is great because if you search for Mary Oliver's stuff online, you're gonna find a lot of it excerpted on blogs that have like a big live, laugh, love. Because Mary Oliver's poetry is extremely accessible and relatable. Her themes, she comes back a lot to nature and animals and self acceptance. This is not poetry that has an extremely high barrier to entry. And so it often gets referenced in very basic ways. One of her classic poems is called the Summer Day, and that's the one with the line, tell me, what is it you plan to do with your one wild and precious life? And that is one of the most embroidered pieces of writing in existence.

[Stephen Thompson]

Someone I knew in middle school or high school definitely had that as their aim away message. Like that was for sure.

[Glenn Weldon]

See also Wild Geese, which is one of my favorite pieces of writing. But the thing is, you know, talking about these things, oh, that's been embroidered on a million pillows. It's so basic. And yet in pulling up the summer day and revisiting it to make sure I quoted the line completely accurately, I got super verklempt. If you don't know Wild Geese, which I just mentioned, it's using nature as a backdrop for putting life into perspective and forgiving yourself. If you Google Mary Oliver, wild Geese, you don't know that poem. You read it now prepare to weep. It's weird. Like, you know, for me, poetry has always been one of those things that I will kind of, that I've kind of culled from my cultural diet as like something that is just not for me, that I'm not gonna understand, that I'm not gonna appreciate. And yet the works of Mary Oliver every. Pull them up. Every time I pull one of those books off the shelf, every time I'm like, I could, I'd like to cry. I can just, you know, dip into her poems and really appreciate them. And that has started to serve as an entry point that has certainly at the very least made me more notionally open to reading other poetry. Ever since I like started dipping my toes into the very, very tepid and well attended waters of Mary Oliver poetry that's made it a lot easier for me to embrace it. So she's super basic in that everyone loves her, but everyone loves her because she rules.

[Stephen Thompson]

I love it.

[Ayesha Harris]

Well stated, Steven. I love this pick for you. I think this is a fascinating revelation for you. And I also have a couple names to throw at you because I hear you fighting against the perceived self seriousness of capital P poetry. I have a couple names for you. One is James Tate. One of his books is called A Worshipful Company of Fletchers. Another name for you is Louise Glick, spelled G L, U, C, K U with an umlaut. She has a book called the Wild Iris. Both of these poets are funny as hell and not like funny, I see what you're doing, but actually like really funny. Really tackling this academic notion of self serious poetry and really just speaking in language that is accessible. But also, if you're willing to kind of dig into it, it just has the word of the day. Revelations to impart while being funny.

[Glenn Weldon]

Well, I don't even have to trundle down to my local library for Louise Glick. I know Katie has, I think, the book you referenced, so I can just pull it right off the shelf.

[Stephen Thompson]

Yeah, but will they make Steven weep? That is the question, right, Glenn?

[Ayesha Harris]

See, that's the. Yeah, that's the limiting reagent in that equation. I don't think they will.

[Glenn Weldon]

You know, I'll send out the call I send out so often. Glen Weldon, help me cry.

[Stephen Thompson]

Yeah, no, it's interesting because I have the same sort of aversion to poetry. I have much stronger feelings about slam poetry, and that's spoken word. Oh, God, don't even get me started.

[Aisha Harris]

What do you mean, Aisha? How could you not love slam poetry?

[Stephen Thompson]

Yeah, no, no, no. Not my thing. But I think for me, there's just. There's something about it that has always just felt inaccessible because I just don't get it. And I felt like I was supposed to get it. It's like going to a museum and looking at art and being like, okay, this is here. What am I supposed to take from this? I think this is a really beautiful pick. Like, it's making me now want to go pick up some poetry, which is something I never thought I would say.

[Aisha Harris]

I like the pick, too. I think that's one thing that always got me about art generally, was I thought that I was disconnected from Aisha. You just said museums and Steven, you're talking poetry until you find the right one that actually moves you. And I felt that way several times about specific poems, but not necessarily about entire books. You know what I mean? But it is making me curious and say, like, huh, maybe I do need to, like, pick up a couple of books. And maybe Mary Oliver is the gateway for me as well. So I like this pick, Steven.

[Stephen Thompson]

That is Mary Oliver, the poet and the poems of Mary Oliver. So before we started recording this, Glenn, Glenn said, I really hope, Aisha, that you've chosen something that is the most sci fi, fantasy, full of lore type of thing. And, Glenn.

[Ayesha Harris]

Nerdy and gnarly is what I said. I wanted it to be nerdy, gnarly, and full of lore.

[Stephen Thompson]

And so I think you're correct about this to some extent. Although my pick is something that I think is more of an outlier within the genre than it is, like, representative.

[Ayesha Harris]

Okay.

[Aisha Harris]

I'm so excited.

[Stephen Thompson]

I'm going with Damon Lindelof's Watchmen.

[Ayesha Harris]

Ah, good choice.

[Aisha Harris]

Good choice.

[Ayesha Harris]

What a great pick. What a great pick.

[Stephen Thompson]

Yes. Okay. So longtime listeners of the show maybe have noticed or maybe not. I don't know if we're ever talking about anything. DC Marvel, for the most part, I am almost certainly not going to be on that episode because I don't care. One of the exceptions, the very few exceptions, was like when we talked about the Penguin, the TV series with Colin Farrell. And I liked that one, too. I could have chosen that one, but I went with this instead. Of course, this is, you know, Watchmen, based on the DC Comics series. And in this version, which came out in 2019, it is an alternate US history where basically in the present day of 2019, at the time Robert Redford is president. See, you've already got me right there. I'm in. And apparently the US has won the Vietnam War conflict. It's an alternate history. And I think the reason why this spoke to me is because Lindelof is very specific about not making this a straight up comic book show. And as someone who knew nothing about the Watchmen before this, I had never seen the movie. I absolutely have never read the comics. This was a completely new world to me. I was still able to mostly follow it and also dig into the themes. And the themes are relevant as hell. This is the series where the Tulsa massacre of 1921 plays a huge part in the story. And you have Regina King. Yes, the King, the Queen, the everything playing Angela, AKA masked vigilante Sister Knight. You also have Jeremy Irons as Ozymandias. He's a character from Watchmen, I guess. Gene Smart is an FBI agent. And I wouldn't say this is a show that made me say, like, I want to watch all comic book shows and movies, because it didn't. It didn't make me do that. But I had heard about it and the premise intrigued me. And of course, this cast was just too good for me to miss. And the fact that it turned out to be a standalone miniseries, I just think it was so creative. It has fantastical elements. I'm not a huge fantasy person either, but the fantasy elements serve the story. It doesn't feel overrun. Like there's all these different themes that I've seen in so many other things that I've loved. And I think that was what drew me to this. So, Glenn, I more or less fulfilled your. There's lore, but it's not like it's like lore that I Had to catch up on in the same way that you might other things.

[Ayesha Harris]

No, but you picked up on something that's so smart about this because this is an outlier in the world of comic book adaptations because you have the Zack Snyder adaptation of Watchmen, which is basically just almost a shot for shot recreation of the comic. And the comic of the time that it came out was also a revelation of a kind because it was about what if superheroes were real. Well, it's been a few decades now, and that concept is no longer new. And it's so much what adaptations should do, which is to innovate and make new and not simply reproduce. And it's such a great choice. Such a great choice.

[Aisha Harris]

So I love this choice because the Watchmen ending the way that it does the series, I was like, no, you don't need to make another. Please don't make another season of this. Like, you answered, everything's fine. I know there's a question mark at the time, but it's the type of question mark that I want. And I could just imagine the ending. And also, this series connected me back to the comic book and the movie in a way that I want it to be. You know what I mean? Like, I felt like there was ways in which I felt separate from it, but this includes me and includes black folks in a very, like, meaningful way that also is aligned with the history of the United States. So I just loved this show from beginning to end. And just like, quick shout out. You know who did the music for this show was Trent Reznor and Ashley Atticus Ross, who obviously gotten awards for their work in other movies. But it just reminds me of, like, when you put together such a stellar cast, stellar directors, writers, and even composers, like, what you can really come out with if you all just concentrate on that one without trying to make something. Everything has to be IP these days. And this is how you do ip. If you gotta do ip, do ip. Like this.

[Ayesha Harris]

Exactly.

[Glenn Weldon]

This is. Oh, I could go into a whole rant about, like, sometimes, really the best thing you can do for a TV show is end it.

[Ayesha Harris]

Yes.

[Glenn Weldon]

Leave people actually wanting more. This show ends at the exact right time.

[Aisha Harris]

Yes.

[Stephen Thompson]

Yes. So you still may not catch me on too many Marvel DC discussions on this show, but if we ever talk about Watchmen again, call me up. Well, we want to know what some of your pop culture revelations are. Find [e-mail] PCHH that brings us to the end of our show. Ronald Young Jr. Steven Thompson and Glen Weldon, thanks so much for being here. This was fun.

[Glenn Weldon]

Thank you.

[Aisha Harris]

It's good to be here.

[Ayesha Harris]

Thank you.

[Stephen Thompson]

I'm gonna go check out some poetry and some train to Busan now, so thank you. This is great. This episode was produced by Liz Metzger and Lennon Sherburn and edited by Mike Katzen. Our supervising producer is Jessica Reedy and hello Kamen provides our theme music. Thanks so much for listening to Pop Culture Happy Hour from npr. I'm Ayesha Harris, and we'll see you all.

[Ronald Young Jr.]

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