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Matt Stauffer talks with Michael King, founder and CEO of iPullRank, about what he calls relevance engineering — the work of getting brands and people seen inside AI search engines like ChatGPT, Perplexity, and Google's AI Overviews.

Mike explains why he reads patents and white papers instead of public docs, how he built his own retrieval-augmented generation prototype to understand how these systems actually work, and why visibility now comes from building "surface area" across your whole content ecosystem — Reddit, LinkedIn, digital PR — rather than from links alone. They get into the disappearing line between white hat and black hat, and why AI search has no rulebook yet.

The conversation also turns personal: how Mike mandated his team get faster with AI, how he empowers people from the bottom up instead of issuing ultimatums, and how AI frees him to spend more time on the creative work — including music — that he actually wants to do.

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