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Private Practice Startup Podcast
Episode 150: What if I Don't Want to Be a Therapist Anymore?!?
00:37:20
Katie Lemieux, LMFT and Ernesto Segismundo, LMFT
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- [00:02]
Podcast Host
Welcome to the Private Practice Startup podcast where we help ambitious private practitioners across the globe to brand themselves and grow their dream practices. We chat with successful private practitioners, business coaches and marketing experts, bringing you tons of practice building Ninja tips. Visit privatepracticestartup.com for awesome resources, attorney approved private practice paperwork, and our signature marketing E course. Here are your co hosts, Dr. Kate Campbell and Katie Lemieux.
- [00:31]
Katie Lemieux
Hey there Startup Nish. Hey and welcome back to another episode of the Private Practice Startup podcast. We are so excited that you're here. We hope that you guys joined us last week as we spoke to Kurt Widhelm and Katie Vernoy regarding the modern therapist survival guide for life beyond the couch. So we just kind of chatted about being a therapist out there in the world, shared funny stories and talked about different things. We hope that you guys joined us for that for today's episode. It's a special and different episode. This is what we consider a reverse interview where Ernesto Segismundo and myself, Katie, actually had a chat. He had approached me because we've been in conversation really behind the scenes. This is something that I haven't revealed too much yet. And the title of our podcast is what if I Don't Want to be a Therapist Anymore? So I did decide to say yes to doing this Facebook Live with him initially, actually, and we made it into a podcast because I'm at a place in my career where I enjoy what I do. But truth be told, if I really look at what I absolutely love to do is I've fallen in love with business many times over and I eat, breathe, sleep, shower to business and I really need to look at honoring myself. So he invited me to have this conversation with him and although I thought it was a bit vulnerable and since I'm right in the process, I was a little hesitant, but I thought if I'm feeling this way, there's others of you that are feeling this way. And although Kate and I really love to help therapists build and grow their dreams practice, and that's really the business aspect and that's what I absolutely love. Sometimes it's okay that therapy might be a season and that's okay. And so we just had this really authentic conversation about honoring ourselves where we're at. And you know, if you're a therapist and you're a career therapist, that's great as well. The world needs you. And if we're not doing what we are in alignment to do and the stuff that really lights us up, then, you know, we're missing something for ourselves and we're missing the impact on others. So I hope you guys sit back, relax and enjoy this vulnerable and authentic podcast as Ernesto and I chat about what if I Don't want to be a therapist anymore? But before we jump into the conversation, we just wanted to say thank you so much for our loyal listeners. We always love you guys. We really appreciate that you show up each and every week or at most weeks and check out the podcast and see what we're talking about. You really make what we do worthwhile and are totally inspired by you. And if you're brand new here, awesome. We want to welcome you into the startup nation family. We're giving you a virtual hug and we have a gift for you which is our A to Z Cheat Sheet the essentials for building and growing your dream practice. You can head over to privatepracticestartup.com search under the Resources tab and there you'll see the A to Z cheat sheet that also comes with five days of practice building email. So we really want to support you on your journey and let's just take a quick break for our sponsor before we dive in.
- [03:32]
Sponsor/Advertisement Voice
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- [04:38]
Katie Lemieux
We get it. We've been there. We're Kate and Katie from the Private Practice Startup. We've spent a crazy amount of money and over a decade learning and perfecting a proven marketing strategy that works. Let us teach you the step by step proven system to Help you fill your practice with the clients you love and live the life you've always dreamed of. Visit private practicestartup.com look for the e course tab to learn more and see the amazing results our coaches have been achieving.
- [05:04]
Ernesto Segismundo
Okay, I think this is on Facebook now. My goodness. Aloha.
- [05:10]
Katie Lemieux
Aloha.
- [05:11]
Ernesto Segismundo
It looks like I'm in a cloud, huh? Because of all the white sheets right behind me.
- [05:14]
Katie Lemieux
Well, I was wondering what was going on. It's like white sheets on the. Are you in an abandoned house or something?
- [05:20]
Ernesto Segismundo
Right, exactly, exactly. No, I'm actually at my house on Kauai, and in Hawaii, there's a lot of these shingles and old patterns, and so this is actually like, I'm in a white cloud big time.
- [05:35]
Katie Lemieux
That's funny.
- [05:36]
Ernesto Segismundo
Yeah. Yeah. So, hi, everybody. For those of you are joining in, this is an impromptu conversation that we talked about a long time ago. Katie. Right. I was in Florida, and we had coffee. And so happens that I got to talking to Katie about some of the things that's shifting in her career as far as a therapist, couples counselor. And I've experienced the same thing. So we're just going to have a chat. Our goal for this is just to put voice into something you may be feeling as a clinician. So, Katie, I'm gonna have you shout out this conversation.
- [06:12]
Katie Lemieux
So I'm, like, laughing a little bit because I know that you had, you know, approached me about it, and I'm kind of like, right in the middle of this transition, so I was like, wow. Like, I don't. I don't know if I'm ready. It's really vulnerable. And then I get on today, and you're like, we're gonna stream this live in Facebook. So I'm like, awesome. No pressure.
- [06:31]
Ernesto Segismundo
Yeah. Yeah. You know, it's. It's. I think many of us are experiencing this or have experienced it, but we really don't want to talk about it because of, you know, we are trained to be therapists, but we experience these shifting once in a while. And I gotta be honest with you, sometimes we just don't want to see our clients or we're tired, and then it's not. And people say, well, you know, maybe you should explore what's going on internally. Maybe you should explore this with your own counselor. What's going on? Resistance. No, that's bullshit. Sometimes it's just shifting.
- [07:03]
Katie Lemieux
Yeah. And it's okay. And I think that's kind of what, you know, you had approached me about is, you know, the shift in really just Making it okay. You know, several years ago, I had done some work with a colleague, Jason Wasser, and he was like the first person to give, I guess, what I was feeling and not even know, like, a name. He said, you have a lot of therapist shame. Right? Like, we go to school for years and years and years and never mind the licensing process. And for me, it actually took six years to get licensed because I was. I was in management and leadership, and I did my licensure part time. More like pretty and not even part time. So it took me a long time. And so we invest so much time and energy and we were the therapist's identity. And then it's like, well, I can't leave and I'm helping people and everything that we've invested in it, and sometimes it's just not a fit for us anymore, or sometimes we long to do something else, or we have a life transition or change, or we want a different lifestyle and really want to be able to fulfill either our other passions and things like that and really just allowing ourselves to shift. And then there's these, like, private conversations you and I are having because it's like, oh, my God, we don't want to disappoint the field and what will they think? And la, la, la, la, la.
- [08:12]
Ernesto Segismundo
Yeah, yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. So, you know, as a therapist, many times people say, you know, you're burned out, you are. You're tired of this. There's some truth in that. But at the same time, when you're presented with other avenues in your career, it steals or it takes your attention away from that. And, you know, this idea of shift, shaming other people for feeling burned out, you know, other professions for feeling burned out in this field, I mean, that's a real thing and it's a real experience. Right. But at the same time, you kind of think about it, there's so many things that mental health professionals can do now. They can do all kinds of stuff. So tell us a little bit about your experience and what. And I'll disclose mine as well, too.
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Katie Lemieux
Sure. Just kind of like, overall or where I'm at.
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Ernesto Segismundo
Yeah, where you're at. And allowing yourself to do this shift.
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Katie Lemieux
Yeah. So interestingly enough, just a little bit of background is at the early age of 26, I was promoted into management and leadership and didn't know my ass for my elbow, and I didn't trust my staff, and I was a micromanager and everything. And so I really went on this personal journey to really learn how to lead people. And I really Loved it. And interestingly enough, I'm, like, looking back and reflecting on where I am now and where I was then. And looking back, as I realized I would kind of go into a new program every two, two and a half years. I'd love to systemize it, clean it up, and then I'd get bored and I'd get out. And it was at that time, I think I was just looking at it like, well, that's the advancement and moving up the ladder right, at this community mental health agency. And I really want a private practice because, like, that was the next best step. Right. And my staff was, you know, so supportive of me and encouraging and confident in my skills. They said, you need to go to private practice. And I'm forever grateful. You know, being in private practice, I've learned so much about business. Being, you know, working as a couples counselor, I've learned so much about myself and my relationship, so that can never, ever be taken away, and I'm grateful for that. But if I really look honestly, you know, I love working in teams, and I love leading people. And, you know, when I think about, like, what just lights me up is I talk about the prophet, Marcus Lemonis, the TV show. And so for those of you who don't know, he goes into businesses, he invests his own money. I'm not a billionaire yet. He invests his own money to clean up businesses, and he really helps save businesses, which ultimately help save families, relationships, and, you know, jobs. And, you know, it's very exciting because I'm just such a systems person, and I see when I look at a business, as I look to look at all the touch points, you know, I have the marketing expertise, the branding, and the systems, and so, you know, what would it be like? And I've just been in this place of really allowing myself to give that to myself, you know, and knowing that sometimes therapy is a season. I mean, that it has to be your entire life, and it can transform and it's okay. And, you know, as I say that, it's kind of me giving myself the permission, but also giving you guys the permission if you happen to be in this season of your life. And there's some of you that are like, you know, career therapists, and that's cool, too, because.
- [11:10]
Ernesto Segismundo
Absolutely.
- [11:13]
Katie Lemieux
And some people might be in transition at this time.
- [11:16]
Ernesto Segismundo
Yeah, yeah. Just like with you, I've been a therapist, you know, for a huge part of my career, obviously. And, you know, all my trainings revolved around the clinical aspect. And then all of a sudden, video Marketing just hit me in the face, Right? And so I was doing videography, and at the same time I was doing counseling. And I KN for a fact that I could not sustain that type of career had I been seeing clients. 20 clients a week, 30 clients a week. You know, it's just one of those. Those things that you can't do it. So I had to think quickly on what I could do to do what I love in a smaller scale and do the other things that are just evolving throughout time. And this past four years, for me, things have just been evolving like crazy, you know, just because a part of my brain has been opened up for creativity. But then there's that shame part, right? I've been trained to do this. I'm made to be a therapist. I have to be a therapist. And you have people around you going, but you're such a great therapist. Why are you leaving that profession? Right, right. It's just one of those things that's in the heart. It's like, just because you have done all this training doesn't mean you have to be stuck within that box. That's where the. Not your typical psychotherapist came from is the fact that, hey, let's give you permission, evolve, and it's okay. It's not that we're leaving a bad profession to go into a better one. It's all about the. This is a great profession. Now add, because you are developing, you're increasing your identity as a career entrepreneur, right?
- [12:57]
Katie Lemieux
Totally. And you know, as a therapist, I think we are really blessed because we get to have and practice so many skills that are essential in so many other areas. And, you know, wherever we go in business, if that's what we decide, right. Or for kind of launching into a different phase, is, you know, our communication skills, the ability to build rapport, active listening, the ability to work with people to make them feel validated and understood, like, those are all amazing business skills. And really, business is a lot mindset and small amount of skill. And so wherever you are in the season of your career and your journey is, you know, I always believe that, you know, every, every aspect of our life is just a springboard for the next. And it's always perfect to set us up perfectly for the next best spot. And so, you know, that's just kind of where I'm at. And, you know, it is really about giving ourselves permission. And that's why I agreed to have this talk with you because it's, you know, allowing myself to be vulnerable about something I haven't talked about openly, but also knowing that other people are struggling. And I know you've shared some stories with me of colleagues that are struggling in this place. And sometimes, you know, people get tapped out and burnt out, like you were saying, and they want more of a dream life. Like, I can only imagine how many people look at you and say, that is so freaking cool what you do. Like you fly around all these places, you meet all these people. I'm always jealous when you like, have all these like pictures or whatever. I'm glad I get to be in them sometimes. But you get paid to do that. It's a write off, you know what I mean? And it's like, wow, what if we really gave ourselves true permission to really live the life that we totally desire? What would that be like? What would be possible?
- [14:32]
Ernesto Segismundo
Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. And you know, I love the fact that sometimes therapists view their career as this, just this stagnant water circling within, you know, a bucket. But when you look at it as a stream that's flowing through these mountains and these hills, that's what career is, being an entrepreneur. Now, like you mentioned, if you want to be a therapist, just a therapist, that's fine. That's absolutely fine. But for those of you who are speaking to that, there's this longing to do more or add more to your career. That's who we are, giving you permission to evolve and change. And it's fun to be in a place like this. It's fun to be creative, it's fun to move. Because I know that the number one thing that causes depression for me, depression for me, and I'm going to disclose a lot of these emotional responses through my career is boredom. Boredom. I have to keep moving because there's so many great places to visit, there's so many great people to connect with and just so many things. Now, from your perspective, what are some of the things that you experience as an individual, as a therapist, knowing that, okay, I've got, I'm a therapist, but there's also this one avenue that I want to go into. But as a therapist, I feel like in the moment of my life, I'm here, I have to be here. Whether it be finances, whether it be meeting certain types of expectations. What goes on for you emotionally during those times?
- [16:16]
Katie Lemieux
So, you know, I have a lot of empathy for those people just getting into private practice or they're an agency and they're contemplating because for me to take another step in business, and I've been talking to some folks and I'm really feeling called to be more in business consulting and go in, like on site into businesses. I could do coaching online, sure. I get to fulfill that through the private practice startup, and I enjoy that. But I really want to be deeply involved on site and really help people. And so, you know, part of that is like, oh, my God, I have to create another business, another website. And, you know, and I have all the pains that our coaches go through, but also somewhat because it is a completely new business and I have to get clear on my ideal clients and go through all that. So that even as I talk about it just feels like exhausting. Right. I'd rather go take a nap. So that's one of the places, you know, with my private practice, it's like super stable and steady. I really don't do anything except take the calls and show up. Everything else just works itself. Google Ads, I don't have to touch it, just work. And so the other piece is the financial piece, right. And so looking at. And again, really empathizing with those springboarding from agency work in a private practice, it's like, well, where's the buffer? How long and how long is that all going to take? And do I want to go through that panic again? Because, you know, when I launched myself into private practice and of course I know better now, right. I just like threw myself in without a plan and I couldn't breathe for six weeks. And I don't want to go through that again. So. And also just getting really clear and just like taking the time. And I know for me it's been a little bit difficult because I feel stuck. I feel like this resistance. I've actually, just before we hit record today, I was traveling back from my own EMDR appointment because it's like I need to unstuck myself. Of course, we're talking about all the childhood stuff as well, but just looking at what's there, and I'm committed to my own work as always. And so I'm also in this place of personal development as well, looking at things professionally. And for me, I think sometimes I've learned to not push the resistance and just be with the resistance.
- [18:16]
Ernesto Segismundo
Exactly. Beautifully said.
- [18:18]
Katie Lemieux
So it's the desire to be somewhere else, but the impatience at the same time of being where you are. So trying to sit in that and be still in that and do what I can do but not force it. So that's kind of the stuff that I'm going through right now. And you know, in the background, I've had my mental breakdowns and my F it alls and my crying and that's, you know, that's the truth of what goes on. And then just like finding those glimmers of hope and just keep listening to myself. And, you know, I've made some commitments, you know, even though I'm not 100% exactly sure, even though I feel sure like I've made some commitments to talk to people. So I just started sharing with people that I know that know me and say, hey, I really want to do this. I'm thinking about this. I'm in contact with someone who does licensing for business consultants. So, you know, just trying to be accountable to start to look at what that would look like, what is available, what's next?
- [19:11]
Ernesto Segismundo
So yeah, yeah, now I'm going to do some self disclosure and for those of you who are joining and I want you to really hold on because I'm going to be brutally honest about the emotional reaction. And it's a good thing Katie's a therapist too, so maybe you can kind of help me evolve around this. So here are some of the emotions that I feel when I know that I have to see three clients back to back in one day. Just three clients, right? Frustration, annoyance, fear, being stuck, Fear of being dread. Why do I have to see them? When we've been talking about this over and over and over again, all of these things come up. So I'm self disclosing everyone because this is a real emotional response. It doesn't mean that I don't like my clients. It doesn't mean I don't love the profession. It's an emotional response to this idea of feeling and experiencing, this idea that I'm trapped. Yeah, right. And so being trapped is something I think many of us have experienced working in agency work, working in this idea that nothing will go into the direction that we want to go into. These are the emotional responses I go to all the time, even when my clients, new clients come and say, you know, you're the only Filipino therapist in the area. Can you please make room for us? Of course. It goes into my heartstrings, right, this idea that I'm the only one in that area to service that population. And of course I say yes. But this is one of the reasons why I see my counselor as an accountability to kind of limit or, or help me to address that monster within me that just has this negative emotional response when I go into clients. So that's a little, that's, you know, and I've gotten, I've gotten some, some people that says well, you know, maybe you shouldn't be in this profession if you're experiencing that. Maybe, you know, you are destroying your client's relationship when you come with that type of attitude. I'm saying, no, it's being human, bitch. Sorry. No, it really is an emotional response. If I don't express these things. I mean, when I'm in the seat, I'm fine. I do great work. I limit the monster. I limit the emotional response because it's real inside of me. Right? But at the same time, that's why it's so important for me to bounce this off of you. Katie, I've got some other colleagues who are very supportive and give me permission to say, guys, gals, I hate being a therapist in this moment. How can I effing get out of this profession? That's a normal response. It has nothing to do with hating your clients, not liking your clients, not liking yourself, not liking the profession. But it is just what it is. We judge the emotional response on a moral basis. That's not necessarily what we need to be doing. It's just. It is what it is. No morality ascribed to it. Right.
- [22:36]
Katie Lemieux
Well, and I think it goes to, you know, the people looking to leave their agency work when you're just starting to dread it and you're frustrated and you're not showing up as your best self, or say, for example, you're a couples therapist and you're going through a divorce, and it's really, like, difficult for you, is like, you might dread it. And I think, like, what you're trying to highlight is stop attaching, like, the therapist to it with the emotions. It's just like, you know, as humans, when we've reached a place in our life, whether it's getting out of a relationship or whatever else, this relationship talk, right, because I'm a couples counselor, is that we just get that emotional thing. And I think you're right. Like, Ernesto, like, for me is, like, when that keeps showing up even though I've had a vacation or even though I've taken time off or I've changed.
- [23:15]
Ernesto Segismundo
My schedule, self care just to change the emotional response.
- [23:20]
Katie Lemieux
There's something else to look at there, and there's something, like, deeper. And I think it's also responsible of us to say, hey, what's going on? Hey, you know, why is this the way this is? And, you know, maybe like you said, like, I know for me it's the process of getting dressed, putting on the makeup, getting ready to go into the office, packing my lunch. It's like I don't want to do that. I don't want to be there till 8 or 9. Right. But when I'm there with my clients, I'm fine. And, you know, honestly, one of the gifts that I do love about being a therapist is being fully present with other people and just being over there with them. That I always find that such a blessing because it just like, kind of takes away other things and I'm fully present with them in the moment. But, you know, when I think about, like, my ideal position, whether it be like, inside a business, working with the businesses, I love to be home organized, systemizing, like, that's like, you know, that would be my jam. Right. So I love that aspect as well. And so, you know, I know that you're. Why we're talking about this is really just to give permission because, you know, these feelings are true and valid. They happen. It's okay. And if you're in that place is, you know, like, we want to open this platform to talk about it.
- [24:28]
Ernesto Segismundo
Yeah. I remember one time I mentioned to someone maybe about a year and a half ago, I said, I don't. I don't want to be a therapist anymore. I don't like being a therapist, and I just want to f it all, just leave it alone. Just move. Right. And I got an instant shame from that. Like, why you're so good at it and why did you end up being in this profession in the first place anyway? They don't understand that in the moment. In the moment, that emotional response was just so overwhelming that I just had to express. Right. It wasn't. They took my comments as is. They took it as is. They didn't take it as an emotional response to maybe what was I was experiencing within the moment. They judged it as. He does not like therapy, being a therapist. He doesn't like this profession anymore. And if he continues in this path, he then will be causing some harm, emotional and psychological harm to his clients. Now, as a therapist, if you keep all of this emotion in. If you're telling me, okay, if you're listening to this, if you're telling me that you 110% love going into seeing your clients and you never. It's always flowers, it's always dandelions all over the place and butterflies. I'm gonna have a hard time believing you if you don't have that emotional response of, oh, my gosh, these clients again, oh, my goodness. I would say that over and over and over again. You are not respecting your idea of a human being. Right. I Don't know. I don't know. I mean, I struggle with this. That's why I just have a handful of people to go, hey, I just need to talk. I just. I just need to talk.
- [26:23]
Katie Lemieux
Yeah. I mean, it is hard to love something the same every day. And especially I look more at, like, you know. You know, was your kid awake at three in the morning for two hours? And you have clients in the morning, you probably aren't gonna, like, love that day. Or you have, like, those two to three clients that are either really difficult or really boring. You know what I mean? And it's hard. You know, I always think about, like, you know, like, therapists have this to me, like, Secret World, that movie. I love that movie prime with Meryl Streep or any of the therapy movies where the therapist is sitting in the chair and they're saying, yes, and then it jumps to the scene of them, like, going off on them or like, why does he always do this?
- [26:57]
Ernesto Segismundo
Right? And then they're.
- [26:58]
Katie Lemieux
Yeah, like, yes.
- [27:01]
Ernesto Segismundo
Yeah.
- [27:01]
Katie Lemieux
Like, that's human reality, right? That's. That. That's human.
- [27:05]
Ernesto Segismundo
Yeah, exactly. Exactly. So. And. And that's what makes effective therapists, is because they are human in the room, they are vulnerable. They experience these emotions, and they talk about it with safe people. You know? And unfortunately, many folks, when they say, I don't want to be a therapist anymore, sometimes, you know, they also project their own anxiety and their own stuff onto that comment, onto that person. But when somebody does that, it's just, hey, be quiet. I just want you to listen. This is just a tsunami going straight through me, right? I'm not gonna abandon anything. I'll be fine. It's a reaction. It's a reactional response. Right?
- [27:45]
Katie Lemieux
I need to talk about it. I need to talk about it. That's what it's kind of saying, right?
- [27:49]
Ernesto Segismundo
Yeah. Yeah. And then therapists who are in the fixer mode, like I was and I am, how do we stop? How do we not have you experience that? How can we not have you feel that emotion? I'm like, you can't, because it's not yours. So part of the things that we go through a lot in as clinicians is this idea that maintaining all of this can be beneficial when you add some other things, when you tap into your creativity. Right. And just being brutally honest with yourself, that there are times when you don't want to be a therapist and there may be something new that want to add and shift to another level. So what would that shifting be like for a therapist? Maybe, Katie.
- [28:42]
Katie Lemieux
Well, I think, like I said, I mean, there's so many different avenues. And, you know, I love the question, like, what are you wildly passionate about outside the field? And what if you combine your therapeutic aspect and that? I mean, you kind of do that with film. I mean, you still work with therapists, and you still get to kind of tap into their ideal clients in their world. And I know that you're completely inspired by that, so you stay connected that way. But also looking at what are some of the things that you like, the skills that you've learned as a therapist, and where can you take those? And it's all okay. So I think it just is really independent on each person, dependent on each person and their own desires, wants, and stuff like that. Like you said, nowadays there's so much that we can do as therapists. And again, I just. I guess I focus more on the skills that we've learned, which are so, so, so important in so many areas of business.
- [29:37]
Ernesto Segismundo
Yeah, yeah, absolutely. And there's also this idea that, you know, our perception. Our perception about what is this idea of being stuck and feeling stuck. I do believe it's an attitude, it is a mindset that when you think of it, no one is holding you to the fire to just be a therapist. Right. We are holding ourselves to that. Like with you, Katie, you're a therapist, you're doing some other things to offset just this monotonous approach to your career. That's why the. Not your typical psychotherapist has been so inspirational for me, because there's other clinicians that are doing things. They're real estate agents, they're makeup artists, they're home designers. Right. Some people. Some of them even sell products online, but they try to merge that all together. And so I think the idea is this multiplicity of creativity in your life, because in positive psychology, if you're doing just one thing at one time, your mind will get bored. Your mind is positioned to escalate and develop to something much bigger and better.
- [30:51]
Katie Lemieux
Mm, yeah, the entrepreneurial add.
- [30:55]
Ernesto Segismundo
Exactly.
- [30:55]
Katie Lemieux
It's a real thing. And I've had to kind of, like, be okay with that. And when I look back in my career at agency work and skipping to a new, you know, program every two, two and a half years, like, there it is. Right. And so, you know, creating that, but making my life more at ease, but also enjoying more things.
- [31:12]
Ernesto Segismundo
Yeah, yeah. So for those of you are joining in, and, Katie, I don't know if you're seeing this online, but people are making some comments for those of you are experiencing this idea of frustration, feeling stuck being at a place where you have to be a therapist. I want to. Katie and I are here to give you permission to experience these emotions. Freak out, cry, scream, yell, drop some F bombs once in a while. Call someone who are experiencing the same thing who will not shame you for experiencing it. Right. Because at the end of the day, you're, you, you're doing amazing work. And it's okay to say f this, I don't want to be a therapist anymore. And that's just within the moment. Now, if you are at a point where you want us add some things and do something more creative, absolutely give yourself permission to do that. But also give yourself permission to just eff everything up in the moment, break down, have your mascara, whatever it is, you know, all crazy and crap, and just let go.
- [32:27]
Katie Lemieux
Right. And you need to be able to do that. I mean, this is what we would tell our clients, you know, and you need to have those trusted people who can hear you for who you are, are. And, you know, it's funny, like you said, like, I've had to tell my spouse, stop saying I'm a good therapist. Like, yes, I am. I acknowledge that. I appreciate that. But stop, like, saying you're so good, you know, like, I can't believe you're gonna leave the couples. And it's like, stop like that. Like, you know, goes into the shame stuff. And, you know, I know that I always joke around. I said I was always a year ahead in math. It's not that I loved math, it was just I was good at it. You know what I mean? While everyone was taking calculus, I took finite math and oh, my goodness, see.
- [33:07]
Ernesto Segismundo
I don't know how to spell that. See? Yeah, exactly. And so, you know, it's well intentioned, right? It's well intentioned. From that perspective, it's well intentioned. But sometimes, you know, people say things that they don't know, the internal process. And I just love this idea that, you know, if you are at a point in your career, in your life, it's not easy to maintain a private practice or a business. There's all types of, types of roller coasters and up and down stuff, you know? Right. But, you know, it's okay to shift. It's okay to experience that anxiety. I know that I've got a handful of folks who come to me once in a while and go, okay, I just need to vent. Let's talk. And this idea of not judging the experiential or the Experience of it, the emotional responses is the key to getting better and better in your career and in your life. So, Katie, so what, what is in store for you in the future? What are some of the things that's going on?
- [34:06]
Katie Lemieux
Well, like I said, I'm really starting to just kind of look at what it would like, look like to do business consulting. I've even thought about, you know, well, not thought about. I mean, we talked about it is coming into the back end of my spouse real estate business and really systemizing that. It's just not there yet. But that's something that I love. And you know, as I say this is, you know, again, I know I said this earlier, but it's like me giving myself permission to really just be passionate about, completely passionate about, you know, what I do at this stage in the game. You know, I don't know, maybe I'll want a bakery in 10 years, I'm not sure. But also allowing you, probably not, but allowing you guys to just give yourself the permission to, you know, just explore, just to talk, find those people that you can be, you know, truly authentic with and yourself.
- [34:52]
Ernesto Segismundo
So yeah, yeah, and I would echo that as well too, you know, because at this point I'm only seeing two clients a week because if I see any more, I mean, I just can't because I'm managing three different businesses, right. And it's okay. And so I love training therapists. I'm doing their marketing. I love doing the videos, obviously. And now my next love is creating these summits, these conferences in different places. So that's really fun. And like you said, said maybe I'll open up a restaurant in a few years from now, I don't know. But it's okay. It's okay. If I even questioned at one point, should I renew my license for my marriage and family therapist here in California, maybe, you know, maybe, maybe not. But it's okay to have these thoughts, to experience these emotions because, you know, we all shift and we just have to get to that point. Right?
- [35:57]
Katie Lemieux
We do. So unfortunately, I have to go. But I wanted to say thank you for allowing me really the privilege to talk about this. And you know, you asking me is allowing me to stretch myself. And, you know, I did it partly for me, but you guys, for all of you that have watched and I saw some of the comments and I see you guys, I feel you guys, I'm glad I would say thank you, Ernesto, because he was the one with the idea and I appreciate being part of this. So wherever you are on your journey. It's perfectly perfect. Don't judge it. Just get what's next.
- [36:28]
Ernesto Segismundo
I love it. Hey, Katie, you take care now. Thanks again for all you do for the mental health community. And you're an inspiration to me.
- [36:35]
Katie Lemieux
Anyway, thank you.
- [36:36]
Ernesto Segismundo
Aloha.
- [36:37]
Katie Lemieux
Aloha. I'll see you later.
- [36:39]
Ernesto Segismundo
All right. Bye. Bye.
- [36:40]
Katie Lemieux
Bye.
- [36:42]
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