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Private Practice Startup Podcast
Episode 157: Becoming an Authorpreneuer- Writing a Self-Help Book to Grow Your Practice
00:34:13
Dr. Marni Feuerman
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- [00:02]
A
Welcome to the Private Practice Startup Podcast where we help ambitious private practitioners across the globe to brand themselves and grow their dream practices. We chat with successful private practitioners, business coaches and marketing experts, bringing you tons of practice building Ninja tips. Visit privatepracticestartup.com for awesome resources, attorney approved private practice paperwork and our signature marketing E course. Here are your co hosts, Dr. Kate Campbell and Katie Lemieux.
- [00:31]
B
Hey Startup N. Hey congregation. Welcome back to another episode of the Private Practice Startup Podcast. And we wanted to say thank you for joining us again. We're really excited that you're here. Today's guest is not only a guest, but she's actually been on our podcast before. She's a local here in South Florida and actually I said that. I said South Florida like I'm from somewhere else. That was interesting. Not really sure where that came from. I'm channeling my inner someone today. Anyways, she's a local here in South Florida friend and colleague who both Kate and I work with a lot, refer to a lot. And we're really excited to have Dr. Marnie Feuerman back with us today. Last time she wasn't a doctor yet, so she actually had gotten her doctorate degree as well. And she's back to talk to us and you guys today about becoming an authorpreneur writing a self help book to grow your practice. So recently she released a book and we'll tell you a little bit about that as we chat today. So we hope you guys joined us last week as I interviewed Nicole Stoler Peterson on Court Letters, Do's and Don'ts. What was really cool about that podcast was you guys had voted like side by side on two awesome topics. So we just decided to deliver to you guys and do both of her topics. And Nicole is, even though her last name is Stoller, she is stellar. So we had a great conversation regarding that and we really hope you guys make sure to listen that if you haven't already. So we wanted to also say thank you to our loyal listeners and we appreciate you tuning in each week as we share information with you that's really going to help your private practice. And if you're brand new here, we are welcoming you to our Startup Nation family. And we have a gift for you, for you which is our A to Z cheat sheet. The Essentials for Building and Growing youg Dream Practice. That is what Kate and I are all about, is really to support clinicians in private practice. So head over to privatepracticestarter.com, go over to the Resources tab. And there you will see a link to the A to Z cheat sheet. Go ahead and download that. And that will also include five days of practice building emails to really support your journey. So we're really excited to have you guys here and definitely hope that you'll come back. A little bit about Marnie Marnie is a therapist here in South Florida. She specializes in relationship issues and is certified in Emotionally Focused therapy as well as discernment counseling, my number one top referral for discernment counseling. She is a nationally syndicated freelance writer and the author of the Self Help Book for Women, Ghosted and Breadcrumbed. Stop Falling for Unavailable Men and Get Smart about healthy relationships. Please join me in welcoming back Marnie.
- [03:01]
C
Thank you. It's great to be here.
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B
It's great to have you.
- [03:04]
D
Great to have you back for round two. And I'm glad to be back too. I missed the last three episodes. I was super sick. And thank God for Katie, my business partner. She just kept it, kept it going. I can't wait to hear the content from those three episodes.
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B
That's what we do here. Marni, tell us a little bit about the book.
- [03:21]
C
Sure, yeah. Well, the book came from because, as you know, I've done a lot of content marketing. And I was, like you said on the podcast before, talking about content marketing and how to use blogging for lots of different reasons, but certainly to build your business. And so at some point I always knew I wanted to write a book. It's sort of a natural segue when you write a lot. And so the book came from, in part, a couple blogs I wrote that were pretty popular. They got a lot of views, a lot of shares. And so the topic had to do with women who are in unhealthy relationships, sometimes even emotionally abusive relationships, or they're in a relationship with a married man and it's kind of going nowhere. And so they don't and they feel stuck. And so that told me there has to be, you know, people out there really wanting this stuff. So I thought, you know, this is a great thing. It's really neat to actually put out a product. And so the book is just really about women who don't choose partners carefully and they're maybe making bad choices. And sometimes I would see these, you know, these couples in therapy and it almost sounded as if they regretted their choice in a partner, you know, to marry, which is a really, you know, certainly a tough situation to deal with. And so if these women were just repeating these same patterns over and over, and over. You know, they really need to get a deep understanding about why they keep making these choices and why they maybe pick one bad partner after another. And a lot of it relates back to their history, their childhood trauma, family of origin stuff. So I go into a lot of that in the book. And so that's it in a nutshell.
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B
That's awesome.
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D
Tell us a little bit about your experience with writing the book and how that went for you, how long it took.
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B
I love the laughter.
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C
Long. I mean, I was already, I would say, in the groove of writing and setting aside time to write the book itself takes. It took about, I would say like about a year total when I know we're going to be talking about a little bit about this later. So when you write the self help book or when you want to, let's say, find a publisher or an agent, you don't need the whole book written. So you just need a couple of chapters. You need sample chapters and a proposal. So I had had like the first two, three chapters written already. And so then at that point, once you get a book deal, if you're offered a deal, they usually give you a certain amount of time to write the book. And I think they gave me a good amount of time, like about nine months or so. So total writing the sample chapters plus them writing the book, it was about close to a year at that point.
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D
Yeah, that's a good amount of time.
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C
Yeah, yeah.
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B
So who do you have to become to kind of write this book? I mean, and I know you have your doctorate now, so you're used to writing and content writing, like for me to think about writing a book. Although Kate and I have created the marketing E course which there's so much content in there that I'm sure that could be changed into a book.
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C
Yes.
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B
I don't know that I would have the stamina to sit down and commit and write. So who did you have to kind of become to go through that process?
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C
Well, again, I think you have to really like writing. I think being in this field, it's natural to write a book, a self help book because, you know, you probably find that when you work with similar clients over and over. So you have your niche, you have your specialty. Like I would find sometimes I'm, you know, you're doing a little bit of psycho ed even when you're working with clients. And so you find, wow, I'm repeating this thing over and over. Or I had a client and I educated them about, you know, how to change their thinking patterns or Something, you know, something like that. And so it starts to become almost formulaic, like what you're saying to your clients. And so before long, it's almost like you have the skeleton of the book pretty naturally. And another thing is, if you have a whole lot of blogs and it's on a niche topic, sometimes you don't have to completely reinvent the wheel. You can weave together some of your blogs and expand on those blogs or just tie them together in more of a natural way so that you, again, you sort of may even have skeletal items that could eventually become a book. So I think it's just a way of putting your knowledge, your expertise out there. It just happens to be in a book form, but it's really what you're doing. You're just putting it on paper. And certainly a hard part is as a clinician and thinking like a clinician, you want to make sure that you're speaking to a lay audience. And so you're doing a combination of maybe explaining some clinical terms, but you're putting it in a way that the average person can understand.
- [08:35]
B
The more and more you know that we learn about business and success and things like that, it's really actually simple, right? Because book writing, creating an E course, again, it's all really listening to what the client wants. Like, the client gives you the pain points, they give you what you're struggling with, and then you put it in an outline, and then you create the content, and then you take the content and you can just move it in different places, right? Whether it's a book or E course or blogging or things like that. And it's. I remember when I, like, figured that out. Not that I figured out, I had to be told in Russell Brunson's book about how simple it was. And it just, like, made so much sense and it became, like, easier not, not to me that sitting down and writing a book would be easier. But like I said, like, Kate and I have created so much content for the E course, and it's like, wow, that's kind of already in chapters already. And there it is. And like, we wrote everything out so, you know, but in a different platform. So that's really interesting.
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C
It actually happens both directions. So you could take your E course and make it a book. I can take my book, which, you know, again, this is sort of like my thinking down the line is I could break it down whether it's a certain chapter that I want to create an E course from or just the content as a whole. So you can create an E course from the book as well. And you can do it the same way you did it. Because some people may not. You know, everybody sort of desires their learning and their information in different ways. So there's people. That's why you also have the podcast. And what was. What's kind of funny is someone just took a blog of mine that I wrote and recorded it as a podcast. So what's cool about content is you can mold and you could do so many different things with it. You don't want to just create, let's say, a blog and then, you know, and then it's just kind of up there. You can create a little bit of a video. You can create this, you know, something E course related. You can record it as a podcast. So you could do a lot of things. That's why content is such a wonderful avenue for practitioners to grow their brand and their practice.
- [10:36]
D
I can imagine that there's probably listeners who are thinking, gosh, I've always wanted to write a book, or I'm really resonating with what Marty's talking about. What would you recommend is kind of like the overarching steps as far as where to get started and what to do next and how to go about that process of writing a book?
- [10:55]
C
Yeah, I would definitely recommend. And I think I sent this to you, and you're gonna put them in the show notes. There's some good books to read just about how to do this. That breaks it down. And believe it or not, if we're really talking about time frame, when I first started thinking about the idea of writing a book and then. Right. And then reading up on how to do it, I would say it was probably about four or five years ago. So it is a. It's almost like you're scaffolding different things to get to the point of writing the book. Because if you want to do it and there's different ways that the book can come to light, you can self publish. You can, you can. And then you can go with a traditional publishing house, a traditional commercial publisher, which was my goal. That's what. That's what I wanted to do. And we can talk a little bit about those differences. But I think one of the first things people are going to want to think about is what's called a platform or an audience. And this is a toughie because this is something. When I say I started five years ago, it's because I didn't really have a strong platform. And that's really mandatory. You need to be able to prove, if you're wanting to traditionally publish, that you can sell your book. So how are you going to get your books in front of people who's your established audience? So, like, for what you're doing, you actually have a very strong platform because you have a Facebook group with thousands of people in it. You have a podcast. You know, you're out there in the public eye, so people already know you see you. They're familiar with your brand. So mine wasn't so good starting out, so I knew I had to establish that platform and that visibility first. And so that's one of the first things that you're going to want to start thinking about. Because if you want to do the traditional route, you want to be able to say, you know, they're looking at you as, you know, a little bit with, you know, with dollar signs. They don't want to invest in you. A publisher doesn't want to invest in you and your book unless they know that you have some capability of marketing it and selling it. So establishing the platform is probably one of the first steps.
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B
Then what's the next step from there?
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C
The next step would be, again, if you're going the traditional route is to start doing that outline of the book. And what tells you, again, that this is a topic people want. So, for example, if you're blogging and you're like, wow, these articles are really popular, or I have a podcast, and these are the podcasts that were downloaded the most. You know, that's data, that's information for you along with what your expertise is. So let's say it's like mine being couples or relationship issues. It's sort of like you're marrying all these things together. And so then you're going to want a very rough outline of your book. You know, what's the overall topic? What are the chapters going to look like? What's the content I'm including in each of those chapters? So we call that like an annotated table of contents, which is just the general topic for that chapter, and then just a little summary for what's in that chapter. And so then you're piecing together, you're kind of getting an image of how your overall book is going to look. And then you've got to search for publishing houses that are a good fit for you. So if your platform is really big, really strong, let's say you're already famous, you know, we'll take Renee Brown, for example. Okay, Renee Brown has this huge platform, so she's probably going to Go for one of what's called the big five publishers, you know, like Random House, you know, let me think, what are some other ones? Simon and Schuster, HarperCollins, those guys, people like us like me and you. And chances are we're gonna have much bigger success with what's called a small to mid size publisher. So that was my publisher, New World Library. These are legit publishers, but often they tend to specialize in certain things. Like I'm sure you've also heard of New Harbinger or Hay House. So these are publishing houses that already do nonfiction works. They might already do self help, maybe spiritual literature. So this is already their thing, their genre. And so they will be the ones to help you with everything, A to Z, the whole book process. And they also don't take any money up front. They don't charge you. In fact, sometimes they pay you an advance so that you write the book. And you know, they pay you a little bit up front. But what you might want to do before seeking a publisher is seeking a literary agent that also specializes in your genre. And you don't have to necessarily go with an agent, but I would recommend it, especially if you're not necessarily. Your career is not. Is not necessarily writing. So my career is being a therapist. So I felt a little green with the publishing process. And so an agent represents you. They do get a cut of everything. So your advanced your royalties and all of that. They get a small percentage, but what they do is they're the intermediary. So they already have relationships with publishing houses. So if you send your proposal to an agent, they might say, okay, I'm going to take you on as a client. Again, they don't charge you. They get paid only if you get paid if you get a deal. But they have relationships with these publishers and so they get it in front of the right people who will see your work. But then that also. I need to talk a little bit about the proposal here.
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B
Before you do that, I want to jump into the proposal. But before we do that, I'm like, so like involved in the conversation. I'm like, oh, we got to take a quick break for our sponsor, so let's just go ahead and do that.
- [17:19]
D
There are so many ways to keep your practice organized, but TherapyNotes is by far the best. They're easy to use, secure platform, lets you not only do billing, scheduling and progress notes, but also create a client portal to share documents and request signatures. Plus they offer amazing unlimited phone support. So when you have a question, they're there. So you can get help fast. Get started with TherapyNotes today, trusted by over 60,000 professionals. Go to therapynotes.com and enter promo code PPS as in Private Practice Startup and you'll get two months for free. Also, you can listen to episode 54 where we interviewed Brad Pliner and took an in depth view into their ehr. Are you feeling stuck, overwhelmed and frustrated? Not knowing where to start or how to grow and scale your private practice? You've spent years in school and a ton of money getting your degree, but you weren't taught the necessary branding, marketing and entrepreneurial skills needed to be successful in private practice. We get it.
- [18:18]
B
We've been there. We're Kate and Katie from the private practice startup. We've spent a crazy amount of money and over a decade learning and perfecting a proven marketing strategy that works. Let us teach you the step by step proven system to help you fill your practice with the clients you love and live the life you've always dreamed of. Visit private practicestartup.com look for the e course tab to learn more and see the amazing results our coaches have been achieving. So tell us about the book proposal.
- [18:46]
C
Okay, the proposal is generally what you're piecing together that tells you. Tells somebody whether it's an agent or a publisher. It's sort of a broad overview of what the book is about and who you are, how you plan to sell it, who's your target audience, how you're going to help with marketing, promotion, publicity, what your platform is. And then another piece that that's included in there is, you want to compare your, you want to do an analysis. So you want to look into competitive books. So books that are already out there about your topic. And you're going to want to put like let's say three or four books in your proposal that, that show that, you know, hey, these books, you know, did well. There's a market for it. But here's why my book is different, why mine is unique, how come my book is needed, you know, so let's say, let's say like I'll throw out like a big, a very popular book that I hear about right now, which is like Five Love Languages. Okay. Which we know did remarkably well. But let's say you're writing a book that's very similar to Five Love Languages. And so you're able to say, you know, this book did great. It was a best seller, it just flies off the shelves. And this is very popular. However, Five Love Languages, there's a big chunk that was maybe left out that I think I can offer because I'm offering a different piece or something unique or my own take on that topic, or I'm doing it something that's a little more specialized towards a certain population. You know, maybe it's five love languages just for men or for gay and lesbian couples or, you know, something along those lines. So you're saying why it's unique and different. And also you're critiquing the book a little bit, not in a negative way. So you don't want to shred the book. You don't want to say, this book's awful. My book will be better. You're just. You may want to say, but here's why I think maybe five languages didn't do such a great job that I think I could do better. And then here's who I am. And you're going to have to brag a bit. So not just your education, your credentials, but anything else, like if you've won certain awards, if you've done certain presentations, similar, if you have a podcast where you're already discussing this topic, if you do certain activities that show why you are the best person to write that book as well. And so when I know, at the end of the show, I'll tell people where they can get this general template where I go over section by section, what's supposed to be included in a proposal. Because this could be really a bit of an overwhelming process. But this is sort of your sales paperwork. This is what goes before an agent or a publisher first. So that they're looking at all of this and they're saying, wow, you know, I want to hear more, or I think I want to give this person a chance. I think they have what it takes, and they've shown by this proposal that they're worth us taking a risk, putting some money up front so we can get this, you know, we can get this book out for this person.
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B
Very cool. You know, time and time again and for our coaches that are listening, you know, I just constantly hear Kate and I teach about all the foundation of marketing, and we talk about how the system is the same wherever. And it's just so interesting as you, As I listen to you talk, you talk about, you know, who's the ideal client, you know, basically what problem does the book solve. And you talk about that analysis between other books and what you can offer. And what's interesting is you talk about yourself last. And so when we talk about writing your about me page, it really isn't about you, right as you're showing how you can impact, you know, a specific population or a specific issue and, and then kind of talking about yourself last. So I just always hear the template in my mind in marketing and it just continues to affirm, you know, that, you know, once you know a system, it becomes easier. But the foundation of marketing, marketing is really critical for everything. So it's just interesting as you were talking all about that.
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C
Yeah, it is kind of interesting. But yeah, about that part about you kind of comes, yeah, kind of about your expertise, so to speak, kind of comes last because again, first they want to know that you're going to sell them, that they're going to make money. They're not going to lose money off of you. So yes, that is very important.
- [23:27]
D
This is incredibly helpful for you to break it down into the step by step process and it sounds doable, which is exciting. And I'm wondering about the marketing process once your book got officially published. Talk to us a little bit about what your marketing journey has been and what's been working in terms of everything that you've been doing.
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C
Yes, I mean, I think right nowadays, I mean I don't think this was, this was what it was like long ago. But right now the burden to market and promote the book is heavily on the author. So if that's not your thing or you don't like doing that, this may not be a venture for you or you may want to do something smaller scale or self published, but the publisher is going to explain you to do this and so they help you a little bit. They have a PR department, but that PR person is representing all of the authors in that publishing house. So they might have 20, 30 authors that they're trying to, you know, get them into certain whatever media outlets they can help them with. So if you already have media contacts, that's very helpful. So what I would, what I did is I just reached out to anyone and everyone that I've ever had a contact with in the media, but also other professionals, other authors, people I've had contact with that already have written books that I may have met along the way or established some type of relationship along the way for. And a lot of times it's a, you know, could be a little bit of like, I'll scratch your back if you scratch mine type of thing. It's like, well, you know, I reviewed, let's say a book by somebody who I think it was like Michelle Wiener Davis, for example. So when I was writing for was about.com at the time. I read her book and I reviewed it online. And so then here I am a year later saying, hey, would you mind reading my book? And perhaps providing an early endorsement for my book. So it's a little bit of a trade off. So all these of kinds contact that you're having along the way, you reach out to, just like I reached out, you know, to you to say, hey, would you want this on your, your podcast? So part of again, what you're putting in your proposal about your marketing strategy is that, you know, you're gonna have to name drop a little bit. You're gonna have to say, I was quoted in 20 different articles because of Haro. And you've probably done shows on Haro, you know, help a reporter out. So I was actively doing Haro for a couple of years. And so those writers, those journalists tend to reach out to you a lot. And so later on you're saying, I know the journalist who frequently writes for this media outlet and I'm pretty sure she would maybe do a little feature or do something to help me out. So you're naming all of these contacts you've already had, these people you already know, whoever you can, who can help you leverage the publicity for your book. And so you're going to want to be establishing that certainly along the way. And again, when I say started out a few years ago, this type of thing was already on my mind that I knew I had to do these things before I could get, just go out and get a book deal.
- [26:40]
B
So really everything that you do in your business is really helping you out and having that conscious. And I know sometimes we just go along and then it's like, oh, well now I realize like all that stuff I did is helpful, but if you, you can kind of consciously implant it in your mind that, you know, if your long term goal is to write a book or whatever it is, the actions that you take now are really probably going to help you in the future. So I like that and I also like, you know, and I think again, my mind's always in marketing. Right. So like I love the way that, you know, you didn't do it for this purpose, but it was the networking aspect of you help someone out first right before you have an ask and most often then they're willing to reciprocate because, because you've done something for them. So that's really cool. I'm just wondering, Marnie, how has this impacted your private practice? What effects has having a book had on your business?
- [27:31]
C
Sure. I mean, I know we hear this Phrase a lot being that in marketing and if you're marketing your business and branding yourself, people have to know you, like you, trust you, okay? So I think that's really what it's done. It puts you out there as an expert. People automatically see you as an expert in a certain topic. And so I think it's helped in that I think you're automatically, I think just seen differently. You've established credibility, you've already been vetted, let's say by, let's say a publisher who says, yeah, your work is good, your work is good enough that we're gonna pay you for it and put this out there. And so I think people automatically, that just gives you again, I think that credibility and that view that you're an expert, I think that happens right away. So when people are also out there, let's say in a saturated area and they're looking for a therapist for something and they say, oh, but this person actually wrote a book about this. She really know what she's talking about. You're right away rising above. You're looking as the, you know, the cream of the crop in the sea of lots of different therapists, a lot of, lots of different competition. So I think it's really helped in that way.
- [28:57]
B
Very cool. In all the business trainings that I've gone to, I hear so many times people say it's not about the book and it's not about like getting rich off the book. It is about what you just said. It's about the craft credibility, the expert role and things like that. Marnie, as we come to a close, what would you really like for Starter Nation to take away from your message.
- [29:17]
C
Today that I think you as people saying just a therapist, the listeners or anyone who's maybe in a helping profession listening, you have a lot to offer out there where you have something so valuable that can reach so many different people if you write a book, if you write a self help book. And I think it's just a natural segue of the work that you're already doing. And so I want people to feel like it's more within their reach than perhaps they think it is. And you know, there's lots of resources out there to help you reach this goal if you want to write a book. So I think it would be fantastic, you know, for, I would say more therapists to go down this avenue as something that they can do in addition to the clinical work that they're already doing.
- [30:08]
B
Awesome. And I know you gave us actually a ton of resources that we'll include on the Show Notes page. So you guys are going to want to check that out. But you also have a giveaway. And what is that?
- [30:17]
C
Yeah, a lot of what I just talked about and just all of the different components that belong in a book proposal I have completely summarized. So I do have a website where they can access it. And this is special for your podcast listeners.
- [30:33]
B
Awesome.
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C
So they would go to Dr. Marnie online, which is D R M A R N I O N L I N E podcast, and they can get that as a download. Cool.
- [30:48]
B
And we'll make sure to include that on our Show Notes page. And tell us the name of your book one more time and where folks could get that if they would like to get. Grab it.
- [30:55]
C
Yes. It's ghosted and breadcrumbed. Stop Falling for Unavailable men and get smart about healthy relationships. It's available all formats, Kindle audio paperback on Amazon. It's also in all major book retailers. I even saw it online at Target and Walmart, which.
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B
How cool is that? I got chills for you. That's so exciting.
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C
Yeah. So it's available everywhere and I would love for people to check it out. And certainly if you have clients, clients, you know, women who are struggling with unhealthy relationships, I would love for the book to be recommended. And I love the feedback. Anything, you know, anything I hear about, it's very exciting as well. So it's been a great journey.
- [31:36]
B
So I have to share this mad ninja tip with you guys. It's kind of funny. So I actually went into this training and this guy. Oh, his name, his company name is called Rockstar Marketing, and he actually used to do marketing for heavy metal bands. And he tried. Talked about reverse shoplifting. He said you can actually take like a stack of your books and go into Barnes and Noble and put it on the shelf. And what's interesting is when people buy your book, they go into the computer and they realize your book's not in there. So they start ordering it. How cool is that?
- [32:04]
D
So it's called.
- [32:05]
B
He calls it reverse shoplifting. I'm like, that is a mad awesome ninja tip. I loved it.
- [32:11]
C
So that's hilarious. I might have to think about doing that, right?
- [32:14]
B
I think I'd feel so, like, anxious and like, you know, makes them such a rule follower. Like. But I would probably run out of there.
- [32:22]
D
It's very creative.
- [32:23]
B
It is very creative.
- [32:25]
C
Outside the box, thinking with the marketing. Yes.
- [32:28]
B
Yes.
- [32:29]
D
It's been so great having you on today and really appreciate you coming back for Round two We'll put the link for round one of your podcast episode where you talked a lot about the content marketing in the show notes as well. And we want to take a moment to give a shout out to our Startup Nation superhero for this episode who is Cheryl Tarnofsky. Cheryl says, I love these two ladies podcasts. There's so much knowledge, expertise and laughter that I really appreciate. They definitely have inspired me to go through with starting a private practice. If you're not listening, you're missing out. Congratulations Cheryl. That's so exciting to hear that you are following your dreams. You're going to private practice. We are here cheering you on along.
- [33:06]
C
The way.
- [33:09]
B
And you guys want to make sure that you join us next week for Sarah Gershon as we talk about the four mistakes you might be making on your Therap website. So check that out again. This was another request by you guys. We are really doing a lot of work to assure that your voice is being heard and the topics that you guys want to hear. So Startup Nation, we'll see you next time. Have an awesome and inspired day. Take care everybody.
- [33:35]
D
Thanks for joining us on the Private practice startup. Visit theprivatepracticestartup.com for awesome resources, free training, attorney approved private practice paperwork and so much more.