Brent (5:43)

Thank you. I'm so glad to be here. Thanks for having me back again.

Kate (5:47)

I feel like you're always at the cutting edge of things. So how did you fall into like just getting crazy about AI? Tell us.

Brent (5:55)

I don't know. I'm always entrepreneurial, but I've got like such a creative brain. I'm always trying to find like hacks and ways to like, do things quicker and easier. I've always been like that my whole life. Like even in, you know, school, I was like, how can I, like get around this assignment and do it quicker? You know, I've just always been like that. So, you know, which isn't the best thing. But it's serving me now. And about four years ago, I started using this thing called Jasper. It used to be Jarvis, then Jasper and I, I started using it to write like blog posts and like some of my emails and, you know, sales emails for some of the products that I sell. And, you know, I was obsessed with it then. And then Chat GPT came out like about, I guess a year and a half ago now and it just changed everything. I've been obsessed ever since. I use it for just about everything in my life you could even think of.

Kate (6:43)

Really give us some ideas about, like, things people don't think about to use it for.

Brent (6:49)

Okay, so you could take a picture of what's in your refrigerator. You can upload it to Chat GPT and tell it to analyze the picture and then create recipes for dinner that night just based on what's in your refrigerator.

Kate (7:02)

Wow. How did you figure that one out? I haven't heard that.

Brent (7:05)

I did. I just messing around with it. You know, I've got lots of friends that are into AI, so we kind of go back and forth with stuff and we're like, oh my God, have you tried it for this. Have you tried it for this? And then it's like, wait, do you think we could do it for this? And then it just like evolves from there. So.

Kim (7:19)

Yeah, Katie, I know you're going on.

Kate (7:21)

Give us one more.

Kim (7:22)

Hold on, I have a question. So, Katie, I know you're going on a big trip coming soon. Did you use chat GPT for any of your travel itinerary plans?

Kate (7:30)

I didn't. I should have. You know what I mean? Yeah, like hours planning, the whole darn thing.

Brent (7:35)

No, and I was just gonna say I use it for my nomadic lifestyle. So everywhere I go, like in Salt Lake City, I was like, give me a walking tour of Salt Lake City. Because I love to walk and experience floor. I like to see historical stuff, cool restaurants, nice little shops. And it just did a whole walking itinerary for me in about like two seconds. So I'm like, okay. And we went and did it the other day down in Salt Lake City and it even said these places are kind of spread out. So make sure you utilize the Metro for this to get from here to here. Like, it even does the transportation options for me.

Kim (8:07)

So cool.

Kate (8:08)

That's very.

Brent (8:09)

There's a million things like that I could tell you about.

Kate (8:12)

Nice. Well, tell us a little bit about how you are using AI in private practice and how you're helping therapists do the same.

Brent (8:20)

Well, I created the Clinical AI Club. So every month we just tackle a new topic in a way that you can use it with AI. So progress notes. We did that one month. Treatment plans, how to create a group therapy program in your private practice with AI. Like, I gave them an outline and the prompts and they could just put the prompts in and create the program like super quickly. So every month we just do a different topic like that. And it's. It's amazing. But I mean, just the things that you can come up with, really, it's incredible.

Kate (8:53)

Yeah, very interesting. So tell us. I mean, tell us a little bit more because we're talking about how to use utilize AI to master time in private practice.

Brent (9:04)

Well, I mean, definitely for treatment plans. So you could take like progress notes that you've written and you can plug it into like chatgpt with no phi or anything like that. You could say, based on this progress note, I want you to write a treatment plan for me that has, you know, specific goals and objectives that are measurable, that would pass an insurance audit. I want you to write it for me and give me. Write it out for somebody that like, is really like into logical thinking. Make it a treatment plan based on that and it'll make it very specific for that sort of thing.

Kate (9:36)

That's crazy.

Brent (9:38)

I know.

Kate (9:39)

And what percentage of therapists do you think are using AI in this way?

Brent (9:44)

I don't know. I mean, I think it's becoming way more popular now. I think in the beginning people were like, there's no way I'm going to use it. But now, you know, it's just evolving and there's just so many ways to use it and it's really incorporated into everything we do. Even the EHRs are starting to have it incorporated into some of that around like, like the measurements you can do, like the PhQ9 and then taking those measurements and incorporating that into your treatment plans, like with AI tools. So I think before the end of the year, the EHRs are going to have it for treatment plans, progress notes, everything. I really do. So I think we're all going to be using it pretty much all the.

Kate (10:21)

Time, you know, and I'm glad you brought that up because we've been getting some questions about kind of like confidentiality, legal legalities regarding AI. We've been approached by a few companies to either partner or sponsor, you know, and we asked for demonstrations in regards to their product. And it, we weren't so wowed by it.

Brent (10:42)

Right.

Kate (10:42)

To kind of take the lead, kind of be promoting it at this time. But, you know, what are some of the ethical and or legal implications that you're aware of regarding AI and progress note writing, things like that?

Brent (10:56)

I mean, it's just so easy to pop stuff into chat GPT. So I think it's tempting to just like dictate a whole session basically in there. But you just have to be super careful to make sure there's no phi or, you know, we all know this, like in a Facebook group, right? You have to be careful what you put because you don't want to be able to identify anybody. So using those same standards, if you're putting something into a format like ChatGPT, because it's not HIPAA compliant, but a lot of these note writing companies, they are HIPAA compliant. I think they call it like SoC2, HIPAA compliance, where it's just super secure. They'll record your session. Basically you just hit record when you start your session with your client and then when you're done, you end it and it turns it into like a SOAP note or a DAP note or a burp note or whatever you'd like it to do. Or from there you can then, say, make a treatment plan out of that. I've seen that in a few. A few of the companies that I've reviewed also. So just making sure that it's definitely HIPAA compliant when you're using that, especially if you're doing the recording. And then the other side of that is an informed consent. So I know you guys have paperwork packages. You've probably already worked this into your paperwork, your informed consents. But making sure that you're talking about AI with your clients, that they know you're recording sessions. That way that they know that you're writing notes using AI or treatment plans, and then also giving them the option to, like, opt out of that. They don't want you to do that. Being able to talk about that in the informed consent is super important.

Kim (12:28)

Yeah.

Brent (12:28)

So all of my clients, I've talked about it, how I'm using it. They're all fine with it. They're really on board with that. They're like, whatever makes your life easier is fine with me. But, you know, I have heard stories where clients are like, absolutely not. You're not going to record a session. Yeah, I'm talking.

Kim (12:44)

Tell us a little bit about how you approach clients with that. Because that's something that makes me super uncomfortable. If I were a client, I would not want my session to be recorded. I just like to be super private with things, and I don't know, I'm uncomfortable with it. So tell us about how you approach that.

Brent (13:00)

I mean, I used to explain that, and this might not be everybody's style, but I talk about how being a therapist, I love being a therapist, but I hate the paperwork part of it. And that a lot of clients don't know that we have a ton of stuff behind the scenes. Like, we have to write treatment plans and progress notes, and we have to make sure everything matches for the insurance companies and that there's all these tools now, AI tools, that make it so much easier for us to be able to do that. So, you know, I'll explain because I use one called Berries. Barry's got ICU from recording my sessions. I'll just say, and I'll even share my screen if they want to see it. Like, this is what it looks like. I'll say it'll record the session. This particular one that I use, it doesn't store anywhere. Like, even the owners of the company cannot go back and listen to the recording. That's how secure it is. And then it all gets wiped from the hard drive within. I think it's 30 days for that particular one. So I'll sort of explain that. I'll see if they have questions. But most of them are like, yeah, I mean, I don't care if it's going to make it easier for you. I'll say, you know, I'll record the session, it'll help me write the note, it'll help me come up with ideas for your treatment plan and it just makes life easier for everybody. And most, most of them are totally fine with that.

Kim (14:11)

Gotcha.

Brent (14:12)

So that's how I've handled it.

Kate (14:14)

And you said that's called Berries icu.

Brent (14:17)

Is that what you said, Barry? B E R R I E S dot icu.

Kate (14:23)

Gotcha. Cool.

Brent (14:24)

I'm actually consulting with them now to help them understand like how therapists think and what we need out of these notes. Because they're not therapists, they're like developers.

Kate (14:33)

You know, so that's awesome.

Brent (14:35)

Which is really cool to be like doing that part of it, you know, to help them develop the product a little bit further.

Kim (14:42)

For sure.

Kate (14:43)

Yeah, that's cool. I've been, gosh, in my, I don't know, 15 years as EHRs began to be implemented, I sat on like a year long panel, right. Of trying to understand because we were implementing EHR for the first time into community mental health center of 600 employees. Right. So it was like really talking about like use your experience. And then because of all that experience, when I was a clinical director at a substance abuse facility, didn't have any HR yet. So I was the one that, you know, brought it in and I would tell them, I'm like, oh, you need to have these things in your treatment plan, these drop downs, things like that. So, you know, I, yeah, I love that, you know, when people especially, you know, developers and tech companies, I mean, it's necessary but really assuring that they're serving the people that they're working with. Because we've all had experiences on platforms, no matter what type of technology it is, it's not user friendly and it's like they just don't take the feedback. So I'm glad that you're actively working with them. That's very cool.

Brent (15:41)

Yeah, no, I'm super excited about it because I have so many ideas that we're doing in the clinical AI club, but it's not HIPAA compliant there. So I'm like, how can I incorporate all this into this platform so therapists can have it be super, like, super secure and be able to just say anything they want about clients in there and know it's totally protected, you know.

Kate (15:59)

So nice. Well, let's just take a quick moment for our sponsor.

Kim (16:03)

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Kate (16:58)

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Brent (18:28)

Oh my gosh. Oh there's so much. Okay, so blog posts. I just the last module we did last month was how to use it with SEO. Basically how to like, you know, drop your website into ChatGPT and say, Analyze this and tell me more. Opportunities to put SEO enhanced keywords into the copy so I can ensure that I'm attracting my ideal client. You know, things like that, sales, copy, marketing strategies. So you can put into ChatGPT. You could be like, this is my niche. This is where I live. This is how my practices run. Tell me who I need to market with and who and then be like, also, can you write an email so I can introduce myself to people in the community and you know, you could just go down the chat with it and it can help you with marketing. Like that podcast. I have a podcast that just came out. It's run your private practice with AI that I created, but it's all AI created, which is insane. It's literally, I created a GPT in chatgpt to know my voice and how I talk and all of that. So I get it to write these scripts and, you know, it sounds exactly like me. And then I upload it to this other program that has cloned my voice and I put that into a podcast that's a totally AI enhanced podcast and I'm going to teach them how to do it next month in the clinical AI Club. Because I'm like, one, you could talk about your niche, you can attract your ideal client. SEO is great for podcasts and it's a super quick, easy way to get like a podcast out there if you don't have a lot of time. So we're doing that next month in the. In the club.

Kate (20:09)

Fascinating. So one thing you have said, you dropped a GPT and chat GPT. So what in the world does GPT stand for?

Brent (20:17)

Oh my gosh, you had to ask me that. Generated. Oh, I can't even remember what it's like.

Kate (20:23)

I was thinking like, generated personal tone. I don't know, I was like making.

Brent (20:25)

Up stuff like that. Yeah, I can't. I can't remember. But GPTs are basically like little bots that you create that are run by a chat GPT, but you get to train it so you can, you can add like documents that you've written or transcripts from trainings that you've done or just anything. I've created like hundreds of these GPTs at this point. One of them I trained to be an insurance billing bot. Basically, I trained it with every single training I've ever done inside a bill, like a boss. I took the transcripts from all of them and uploaded them to the GPT. So now this GPT thinks just like me. So anytime anybody has a question in my Insurance billing group. I'll just pop it into the GPT and it answers it like perfectly for me, where I could spend probably an hour answering it. But this thing just knocks it out because it's been trained in everything we've ever done and built like a boss.

Kim (21:16)

That's fascinating. I love hearing about like, the, you know, the, the time saving aspects of AI. And then on the flip side, there's also like some concerning stuff too, because you hear about, you know, these clones of people that are, you know, calling and scamming and you think it's your mom calling and she's in trouble in a crisis and you need to pay the tow truck or whatever. And it's exact voice, but it's not. It's AI. So there's just like all these pros and cons to it. So some of it is like incredible. And the flip side is like, whoa, that's kind of creepy.

Brent (21:50)

Yeah, yeah. And I mean, the therapy chat bots, I mean, we should probably talk about that. I just read an article the other day that teenagers are using this. It's called Character AI, but there's a psychologist chatbot in Character AI that has been trained to be like an expert psychotherapist. So teenagers are going to this chat bot and like putting their problems in and help from this chatbot instead of like going to traditional therapists, you know, which is, you know, it's a little concerning. But. But the article was just talking about the statistics and that they were showing a lot of progress and reporting that it was super helpful for them too. So.

Kate (22:29)

Wow.

Brent (22:30)

Which new world.

Kate (22:32)

Yeah, yeah. So just putting in their problems and getting feedback. It's not.

Brent (22:37)

Yeah, yeah.

Kate (22:38)

And it's called Character.

Brent (22:40)

Character AI. You could even like, you could pick all the different characters, like different actors that you love and you could put them in one room together and tell them to have a conversation about something. And it's great because they have the personalities of these different people.

Kate (22:56)

I'm like fascinated by your brain, Kim, because, like, you are very like techie, but you're also a therapist. Like, your right and left hemispheres must light up equally.

Brent (23:06)

Yeah, totally, totally. And I'm so creative and just every day I think of just a different way to use it. And I get so excited, especially with AI Club, because I'm like, okay, I gotta make a video about this. I gotta go put it over there so everybody can learn how to do this. Yeah. So super exciting. But back to the therapy bots. This is what we talk a lot about in the club. And it's like, I feel like therapists really need to get on board with these bots and know that this is happening and like welcome it in our therapeutic conversations. Like, oh, okay, well, oh, you're using the bot. Well, what did the bot say about that? You know, just having like conversations about it because it's going to be happening, you know, it's happening more and more every day for sure. So you know, just a way to like start embracing the AI train instead of like, you can't use a bot, you have to use me, you know, that kind of thing, like try to figure out ways to incorporate it in. Another thing that I've been working on with the company is creating these chatbots for our websites that can do like the intake stuff and collect insurance information, all HIPAA compliant. To really cut out that part of the process that we spent a lot of time on trying to collect information, intake forms, making sure all that's done. These bots, hopefully we're working on it right now, are going to be able to do that for us and also screening questions. So if somebody's like showing up as like suicidal ideation with these bots, you know, being able to give it crisis information right there, but also screening information to make sure they're like appropriate for our practices before we have to get on a consult call or something like that. So I don't know about you guys, but I've spent many, many consult calls where it's like this is not appropriate. I don't even know why I'm on this call. This person is not the right client for me. So incorporating like chatbots on our website that could be trained well enough to be able to do that stuff for us I think is going to be super helpful in the future for therapists that are trying to integrate this AI stuff into their practices.

Kim (25:05)

Wow, it's really fascinating. And will that, I mean it just seems like it's going to take over so many jobs for people, you know, just so many jobs in so many industries that just become obsolete because the AI can do it better.

Brent (25:19)

Yeah.

Kim (25:19)

Wow. It's, it's really mind blowing.

Brent (25:23)

It really is. But you know, I think anybody that's a copywriter or you know, anybody that's threat job is threatened by AI coming in. Like learning how to incorporate it into your life and then be able to use it with your clients, even like copywriters, right? Like hey, I have a business coach and we use chat GPT all the time to do the copywriting and all that. Stuff, you know, so even with therapists figuring out ways to bring that in to your process.

Kim (25:49)

Yeah, I love that. To have more of a open, collaborative process where you're incorporating that and bringing in the strengths and resources from it rather than being threatened by it. I mean, there's always going to be such value of people seeing therapists live in person. And even though there might be AI solutions for that, you know, there's always. There's always going to be a market for what we do. So instead of being threatened and like, freaking out to use it how we can, and then.

Brent (26:18)

Yeah, because you don't want your client to come in and say, well, you weren't available last week and I talked to my chat bot and it said this and you don't want to be, like, shutting that down, you know, you want to be open and welcoming to that sort of stuff, I think. Yeah.

Kate (26:34)

Fascinating stuff. It really is.

Brent (26:37)

It really is. Oh, my gosh.

Kate (26:38)

Yeah.

Kim (26:39)

Is there anything else that we haven't touched on that you think would be really important to share today?

Brent (26:45)

Just, you know, keep an eye on your ethical boards. Because I know, like, for LPCs, they're already establishing a set of guidelines and rules around what we can and can't do with AI. For LPCs, I'm an LCSW, they haven't come out with anything yet, but I know the LPCs already have something sort of established. So I would say just stay up to date with that to make sure you're not violating any ethical standards with your license. Yeah. And just start playing with it. Like, just get it. Log into Chat GPT, it's totally free, and start playing with it. It's just really fun. It can help you immensely with productivity and time saving and just in your life, just like travel and recipes and there's just interior design. Another, you could take a picture of a room that you live in and say, redesign this room for me and it'll do it instantly for you.

Kim (27:37)

So you can create logos, too. We created a logo for my son's soccer team, the Hammerheads, using AI, and it looked like we had, you know, professional designer do it. It was amazing.

Kate (27:49)

That's crazy.

Kim (27:51)

Yeah, it's fascinating.

Brent (27:53)

We did one month in the AI club. We did, like, homework assignments. Right. So you could take a treatment plan or even a progress note with no phi, plug it into ChatGPT and say, I want you to create an individualized homework assignment for this client that would be able to, you know, show progress and, you know, meets medical necessity. Like, you could put all that into the prompt and it'll create a worksheet for you. Or it'll create like an outline and then you can say, turn it into a worksheet. It'll literally turn it into a worksheet. And then if you have Canva, there's. You can. You can basically say, now put it into a Canva template. And you just do at Canva and ChatGPT, that'll automatically bring up templates in Canva where you could put this worksheet and give it to your clients. And it's personalized, individualized. It's going to be helpful for them. And it looks pretty if you put it in Canva.

Kim (28:43)

Yeah. So fascinating.

Kate (28:46)

Yeah. Clearly I'm not even using Chat GPT, like, in any way. That's really helping me other than writing things like shared so much today that I'm like, I should just sign up for Kim's club.

Brent (29:00)

It's only $9 a month.

Kate (29:02)

Yeah, that's amazing. But so share with us what is. What is your club name? And how. How can folks find that?

Brent (29:08)

It's called the Clinical AI Club. You go to www.clinical aiclub.com and every month I give a new topic, and I usually do, like, a training video, and I'll give 20 or 30 prompts around that topic. And then we also have, like a monthly implementation session, so we do 90 minutes where you can just hop on a live call with me and we just go back and forth like, hey, I'm trying to do this, Kim. What prompt should I use? Or somebody else might have an idea for somebody. So we just kind of banter back and forth and try to help each other use AI better. And then I do, like, specialty workshops in there. So I did a workshop on how to build your own GPT. We did that last last month. I. Next month I'm going to do a workshop on how to do an AI podcast, if you want to do that. So I'm going to be doing lots of little mini workshops like them. Also, on top of everything that it already comes with.

Kate (30:02)

Fascinating. And I know you actually, speaking of your club, I know that you have a giveaway for our audience. What is that?

Brent (30:08)

Yes, one month free. There's a link. I guess it'll be in the show notes, but you'll get one month free, so you could try it out, see if you like it. And I would say don't get overwhelmed because there's, like, so much stuff in there already. It could be like, oh, my gosh, I don't even know where to start, but just like, think of one thing you want help with, like blogging or something, and go to that module and try it out a little bit. Yeah.

Kate (30:27)

Awesome. Well, we so appreciate that for our audience and we appreciate having you back on the podcast sharing all these things about ChatGPT and AI that I am not even scratching the surface.

Kim (30:40)

Yeah, possibilities are endless.

Brent (30:43)

It really is. Yeah. Well, thanks for having me. I really appreciate it.

Kim (30:46)

Yeah, thanks so much for being here. I loved this topic. It was so fun and I think everybody listening is going to really feel inspired to step outside of their comfort zone and really, you know, experiment with how AI can help them both personally and professionally and Startup Nation. We hope you enjoyed the episode. We always want to encourage you to subscribe, rate and review, share it with your friends and fellow colleagues. This is a time saver for sure, so we need to get the word out about it and if there's a topic that we haven't had on yet in these 361 episodes, please let us know. We always love hearing your feedback about how the podcast is helpful and also, you know, really cool out of the box ideas if you want to be a guest. So we hope you stay inspired and we will see you on the next episode. Bye everybody.

Kate (31:32)

Take care everybody.

Kim (31:34)

Thanks for joining us on the Private Practice Startup. Visit the private practice startup.com for awesome resources, free trainings, attorney approved private practice paperwork and and so much more.