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We interrupt this program to bring you an important Wayfair message. Wayfair's got style tips for Every home. This is Styles MacKenzie helping you make those rooms sing. Today's Style Tip when it comes to making a statement, treat bold patterns like neutrals. Go wild like an untamed animal. Print area rug under a rustic farmhouse table. From wayfair.com fierce this has been your Wayfair style tip to keep those interiors superior.

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Wayfair, Every Style, Every Home. Spent a lot of time thinking about how to start this video, and no meaningful conclusion arrived. I've thought about thousands of things I could discuss. I know I could speak hours on end about this, this topic about why what happened in Venezuela is so meaningful for so many of us, so many Venezuelans. So I've had the hardest time just thinking about how to get started. And so I'm just gonna start a small rant here. As you know, this podcast is dedicated to gamification, game thinking, motivation, behavioral science, which I am extremely passionate about. I think can. I actively think can and is changing the world in many meaningful ways. Yet I'm also from Venezuela. This is one of the last T shirts I bought before I left over 12 years ago. And this has a lot of. You can analyze it from the core drives, all the motivations it has for me, and how important, how meaningful these changes are. But I'm a foreigner right now. I don't live in Venezuela. I live in another country. And honestly, I think I believe very much in people living wherever in the world they see fit and being happy wherever they can and frontiers being relatively open so that people can do that without the bad things. That Venezuela has been a terrible example of how, of how to export criminals because that's one of the things the government did. But beyond that, I've seen, I live in Spain and Madrid. I've seen a lot of the public discourse here about what happened. I've witnessed how there's been shows of massive happiness. You can call them sort of protest. But instead of protesting, people are just showing how happy we are as Venezuelans that, that Maduro is no longer in power. I'm not going to get too much into, you know, what's, what's the situation right now? How, how is that good or bad? How, you know, what's the transition? What do I think a transition should look like? I just, I just want to spend a little bit of time sending a message because I understand that this is a platform and there's people listening, people who have never heard of Venezuela, or they've only heard it from the outside, know very little about it. And I've, I've been seeing all sorts of things on the Internet, from outward, honestly ridiculous stuff all the way to, you know, more sensible people trying to really figure out what's going on. How do we Venezuelans feel about the situation in our country and, and what's happened. And even some people saying apparently horrible things, fellow Venezuelans saying like, oh, you have no opinion on this because you have no idea. I think everybody's entitled to an opinion. That's the first thing. And that's one of the things we lost in Venezuela with the previous government. I'm not sure how this government will behave around that. Hopefully at least a little bit better in the coming years. Just getting better and better. That's one of the things we lost. So I feel strongly about people being entitled to an opinion. And yet having an opinion doesn't mean that you are more right, that you know more about the situation than we do. So that's the first thing, right? Like everybody can have an opinion. It doesn't mean that you're right or that you understand the full scope of that. And then like my background, I don't talk about this on the podcast very often about the other things I've done in sort of past life. I was, I was heavily involved in politics for maybe eight years of my life. Some of the best eight years of some people's lives. People's lives, you would argue. I was started when I was around 20, maybe earlier, maybe 18. I started being involved, you know, not super strong. And then it got heavier and heavier until it became a full time job, full time lifestyle in many ways. And I stopped doing it. Not because I stopped believing in the importance of change, but I still had that strong Core Drive 1, epic meaning and calling. But because Core Drive 2 was not advancing in any way, there were no achievements. My involvement, my sacrifices were not being meaningful anymore. That's the only reason I really stopped doing what I was doing. I was willing for the sacrifice. I did a lot of sacrifice for that. And I just bring that up because I want people to understand that, even though, and part of that background being in politics also involves I was a un, a Model UN freak as well. So I understand at the level that a student can understand, but that is a lot deeper than I would say a lot of people in the similar situation. I also went to Model un, so I understood a lot about international systems. And when getting into politics, part of the things that I was Interested in were precisely how geopolitics happen and all that. So I do understand that the way this was conducted can be scary and can be harsh for many other countries. That situation of, you know, this, the president was deposed by a foreign authority, essentially the acting president, I guess he was not our president. He was illegitimate, he was not elected. In fact he was, he lost an election to another candidate who was, who had to escape Venezuela. So I, I, I understand that the consequences of that are not ideal. Like the way people are saying like oh yeah, but now this, the American government has implied that they can do whatever they want. I understand that argument. Like I'm, in fact I would to a certain extent I would back it up. Problem is, and here's where you know, reality kicks in is in Venezuela, Venezuelans especially the ones who are still there. Because I was a strong, heavy part of that fight for a very long while. In fact, until the day I left, I was very, very heavily involved, very invested personally. But we've tried everything, Venezuelans have tried everything. Every, every thing in the rule book. We did election like the cusp of that was what happened last year. We won the elections and we had proof that we won the election. And the guy who said he had won the elections did not have any proof whatsoever that he was the one who won elections. Yet he swore he would be the president for the next whatever in front of an assembly of Congress that was also legitimately chosen that supports him or whatever. And the criminal justice system that has been completely kidnapped for a couple of decades and the military branch, it's like a long etc. Those are the people that supported him and not even the people, the institutions that have already been kidnapped long before even Maduro was in power. That was came before with Chavez as well. He just deepened the wound to our democratic system. So what I'm saying is we, we played the game fully, the democratic game, the legal game, internal resistance out. I was part of the generation of students who started with the student movement back in 2007, I believe 2008, we won elections against Chavez, stopped one of the reforms. He was trying to change the constitution. And then he just ignored that and made another crazy election and changed it anyways. So we tried everything and without somebody, a bigger bully in a way to stop that crazy government from continuing to oppress people. And a very clear and obvious sign of that is, you know, as, as I'm recording this, I think it was last night here in Spain that we got the news that a bunch of political prisoners were just finally set free. Those political prisoners should have never been in jail for the first. In the first place. But, you know, everybody's happy that they're not in jail anymore. All of these violations of constitutions, international right, et cetera, et cetera. How do you operationalize. Well, you know, it's an internal matter, so Venezuelans have to resolve it themselves. How do you operationalize that? It sounds beautiful. International relations again, model un. I understand that not respecting that principle is like, well, yeah, you know, what's next? Am I next? And that's what part of the presidents in other countries and politicians are thinking like, oh, whoa, okay, so they. So they did that. Am I next? Who's there to judge and consider if that was legitimate or not? And that's the fundamental issue when people are discussing that. And I get it, again, the problem is operationally, in reality, what were we left to do? Is the international system just supposed to abandon countries that have done everything to change their situation? They have the will, the origin of power is supposed to be the people in a country where supposedly elections choose governments. It's not even like, oh, no, the system is not that way. It just doesn't work that way. And that's how this country operates. No, this country has never operated under anything that's different, allegedly, to elections. The person that gets elected, gets into power, does the reforms, does whatever policies. So what were we supposed to do? And is it sovereign for. Yeah, the president said, that cannot be done. But we, the people who have the power, we said, yes, anybody come, please help us. We need to get rid of this person and the power structure that is holding them because we cannot do it ourselves. So was it really somebody else externally just doing that and taking me out of power? I don't. I don't think so. I don't think so. And it's something we were requesting, we needed, we were desperately needing something like this, that it's going to have consequences. I am not naive in that sense at all. I know. You know, this was funded with American taxpayers. They're funding this operation. Who else is paying for it? Americans. Right. So I'm deeply thankful for that help. I don't think it's going to be sort of a free lunch. There's no such thing as free lunch. Right. I understand. That has consequences. We're going to get charged for that service, so to speak. Are we willing to pay for that service? Absolutely. I haven't met a single Venezuelan, especially now that I'm outside. But, you know, I have a lot of friends as well still in Venezuela who was not willing to pay for that price. And what many people are not realizing say, oh, yeah, they're going to take your oil. You think our oil was still ours, that we could use our oil as we decided? Or was it actually taken by foreign powers, not Venezuelan foreign powers, just to name a few? Cuba was living out of Venezuelan oil, actually getting the oil and selling it for the money, keeping some of it for internal use and selling part of it to keep their economy afloat. And don't get me wrong, I understand Cuba needs all this, but, Don, Venezuelans also have a right to that. And there's a long list of this right. So are we willing to give up all that oil that was being sent to foreign powers, being taken away from us now, send it to the US Twice as much as that? Because, among other things, the oil industry was completely destroyed from, you know, it's producing like 10% of what it could be, even 20, just 20% of what it was producing before these people came into power 26 years ago. So we can still give twice as much as that. If there's investment and we produce more, I'd be happy for that to go to whomever provided the service and pay, you know, 10 times over what that operation cost or whatever amount of times, because there's also risks and, you know, constituents and all that. I'm happy to pay for that. Happy? Happy. I didn't, I never, I. I never left my country because I didn't want to be there. I left my country because I was left with very, very few good alternatives. I'm delighted. I'm happy. I'm excited about being here in Spain. We built beautiful things here in, for our family, for our future in Madrid. Significant part of, you know, my immediate and close family is here. We, you know, we've enjoyed our time here. We're very thankful for, you know, Spanish people to have received us. We have European passports as well, nationalities. So we're, we're here, like, in that legal basis. But it's not because I didn't want to be in Caracas. I still think it's the perfect climate. Like, there's so many perfect things about being there, except for how the whole game is set up and how the whole system works. So I don't know if you're still having your doubts about whether this was a good or a bad thing before going on social media and sending your rants, not saying not to do it. You're entitled to your opinion, of course. As I said, before everybody can have an opinion, I think again, I still don't think all opinions are valid, true or anything. Just because they're your opinion doesn't mean that's true or that you could just trump my opinion either. But before going on those rants, how about you, and I'm sure you, you can just walk around and find a Venezuelan. I'm sure you know Venezuelans. If you're not in Venezuela, there's, We're all over the world at this point. Ask them, what does this mean for you? How do you feel about that? Beyond the consequences that I see before I tell them to you, what do you see? How does the future look for you? Is it brighter? What are the risks that you see? Are you scared as well? Try to understand a bit more about the situation before just diving straight into. Your internal political thoughts. And let me give you an example here of a completely different situation. Same government, same president mentioned something and has been talking about Greenland for a while. And I saw this Spanish politician, not just by chance, relatively far left wing, discussing of course saying that that's not acceptable and so on and so forth. And the, the journalist was insisting like, oh yeah, but you know, what do we do? And this person was, ah, multilateralism and collective security. Because this person is advocating strongly against Europe having, you know, more investment or spend on military stuff. The journalist was just pinching him to say that and say, exactly how does that transform into a strategy? Because they were also mentioning like, oh yeah, multilateralism, all that. What do you do in Ukraine and Russia? You know, Russia started invading Ukraine. So. Well, I don't want to get into that again. It's not a situation I can, I've lived or anything, so I don't want to get into that. But what he was pinching him in that direction was like, okay, yeah, but, but what does that mean? What if the US who already has boots on the ground because there's a military base of the US there says, you know what, we have a military, countrymen, you know, this country is ours now. What is a response that you have to that? Because for a military aggression, how do you respond with that? Self. Self defense? No, collective defense or something like that, he was saying, and multilateral. What does that mean in concrete terms? If tomorrow that happens or if, or if, you know that's going to happen in 10 years? What does preparing in terms of collective security mean? Do you, do you prepare more? And he was like, oh yeah, you know, in the end the US is always going to have more Military power and so on and so forth. Well, yeah, but then what do you do? You submit. And that's exactly the point that I'm saying. Like there is in Venezuela, what do you do? All these beautiful words and all these concepts are in the sky of saying, oh yeah, multilateralism and all that, but that in 26 years, 26 years, nothing has happened. And you can even narrow that period down to 5 years, 10 years. Maduro has been in power for over a decade to put that in perspective. And many countries in the world recognized Guaido, who was the president of the national assembly because there were no legitimate elections. This guy continued in power after that. Then he did actually make more elections. And the people in Venezuela even went to vote, even after all that had happened, went to vote massively against that government, against the alternative and in favor of the alternative. The alternative won those elections. How do you translate that power of the people into the power of the people becoming part of the government? There is no practical way. Oh, dialogue and negotiation. Dialogue and negotiation have been on the table with this government for a decade and they've been eluding, doing absolutely anything about it by sitting in more and more and more tables. Norway got sick of that and stopped saying that they were going to provide, you know, facilitation for the peace process or whatever. A bunch of people started saying that and their allies in the region, when they lost the elections, they just shut up. But now that the, the U.S. deposed the president, they're, they're, I guess, amongst other things, they're scared that they might get the same treatment. And that's when they speak up. Why didn't they speak up when being the so called democratic governments, they saw their neighbor and ally stealing elections and doing nothing about it. How do you as a Venezuelan operationalize that? And I'm sorry, this is a bit more of a somber episode than you might be used to, but I'm Venezuelan. I identify fully as a Venezuelan, always have. And I just can't let this situation just go because, oh, you know, it's not appropriate or whatever. This is a platform that is not meant for any political statements or similar. And of course, everything when you talk about these things, it's always political in a way. I'm just getting into this because being in Venezuela, I do feel that I have a certain level of responsibility to also help my fellow countrymen, my country, provide the message of what's actually going on there and why the current situation for us is hundreds of times better than it was. And a very Clear example is what I mentioned. All those political prisoners, some of them had been there in jail unfairly. Those were at least three of them that I know of for two decades. Two decades. Those people had spent quite a few years after the tribunal said, oh, you fulfilled your time in jail. It was whatever, 15 years. They spent those 15 years in jail. Tribunal said these people should get out of jail because they fulfilled their time. They were still in jail among, you know, others, like people who were literally caught, caught in their WhatsApp. They said, oh, Maduro should get out of the government, or I hate you, Maduro. Policemen went through their phone, saw that and said, you go to prison. Those were people who were. And some of them probably still are in prison. So situation is much better for them, for sure. For many of us who at least have hope now that there is going to be change. And you can argue that the elected president has not been put in power yet. You can always say, yet always looks into the future. Mario Karina Machado, who was the one with the internal elections of the opposition. It's not been considered as much as some would have expected. I agree with that. I understand all of that. Still, is having Maduro being in a tribunal in the US being judged for at least some of his crimes better than having him in power oppressing the people even further? Yes. Is the people. Are the people who are in power now feeling the pressure of, oh, we might be next, so we might better at least behave differently than we were behaving before. And definitely 99.9% of the options are a lot better than what they were doing before. So is that better? Yes, it is better. Can things go downhill? Well, you know, it's pretty much the end of the valley at this point for Venezuela, so almost anything is uphill at this point. So I am happy. I am super happy for what happened in Venezuela. This was a bit somber because I did want to make sure that people understand all the crazy amount of stuff that many of us, or all of us in many ways have been through. Biggest. One of the biggest migrations of history is the one from people who, like me, have left our country. I left well before it became so massive. But, yeah, I just wanted to give you a little bit more perspective on that and share. There's. There's a huge Core Drive one in me. There's huge epic meaning and calling for me on this. There's, you know, core Drive five, you know, my fellow countrymen and people, I feel part of me were like, extremely happy about what happened and collectively feeling that joy of the good things that happened. There's a huge road ahead. Many things still to be, to be done, et cetera, et cetera. But at least, at least the beginning of the path has finally been cleared. So I'm not going to end the podcast as I usually do, because this is a very, very different episode. But thanks for listening. Thanks for hanging on for, what, like, 20 minutes I've been talking about this. Thanks for just being here and listening. Talk soon.