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Foreign welcome to the Project 18 podcast. I'm Scott, I'm going to be your host today. Thank you for joining us. If you're unfamiliar with this platform and who we are and why we've created it, I just want to encourage you today we have made this space to interact with you and at a level where you have the ability to ask us any of the questions that are on your own heart or on your own mind. We would love to hear from you. It's super easy. All you have to do is click the link that's in the podcast description and you'll be able to connect with us directly. We just want to be a place where folks can come to ask any of the questions that they have about whatever's going on in their life. Maybe they're struggling at work or they have family or friendship situations. Maybe there's faith based questions. And then you'll have the understanding that my friends, my colleagues and I are going to do the best that we can to provide biblical answers and guidance to those questions. We want you to be able to do that without fear or shame or anything like that. All that ridiculous stuff that happens occasionally in faith based circles. We just want you to begin to trust us with those things that are in your heart. Coming up in future episodes, we're going to be doing interviews with people who are a lot like you, that are just have questions about life and we're going to see how they process it through a biblical framework and what their faith does to help them get through things like cancer and other type of tragedies that they're living with every single day. And in the in between times, between us answering those questions, we're going to fill this slot with content about the Bible that is a little bit lesser known. Maybe some of the the things in the Bible that people find mysterious coming from a place that I think those things are important, they're included in the Bible for a reason, that God's trying to communicate something through those, some of those odd stories. And so we're just going to lean into that, we're going to talk about it and hopefully what that's going to do for you is to just provide you with even a richer understanding and depth of the love of God that He has for you in your life and some of the things that he hopes you understand about Him. And today, in fact, we're going to continue along with some of this content. I'm going to start by talking about supernatural content that's in the Bible. We broached this subject back in episode five. If you haven't had a chance to, to listen to that, I'd encourage you to go there and check it out. What I was talking about there is what we're going to continue with today, basically, that the Bible talks a lot about things that go on that we can't always see, things that are behind the scenes, so to speak. And there's this whole reality that we refer to as a supernatural realm where it's teeming with life. God has created lesser beings. We often to think about them in terms of like angels and demons, even though it's a lot more than that. And the things that go on in this supernatural, unseen realm have a great deal of impact in our lives today. And so we're going to just take a look at that, we're going to talk about some things and hopefully, like I said, you're going to walk away with an even deeper appreciation for who Jesus is and what's going on and his intimate care for us in our own life. So let me just jump into this. There are numerous accounts in the Bible that discuss these two realms and the way that they overlap, the way that they connect. And when we see what's going on there, it's as if a veil has been pulled aside. We get a glimpse of what God is up to in his throne room and how these lesser created beings are involved in his universal reign and his earthly rule as well. And so of course, the first place that we look to for answers along these lines of understanding what that looks like is Jesus himself. When Jesus was on earth, he revealed a tremendous amount not only about the supernatural realm, but, but about the nature of who God is because he himself was God. So the second half of our Bible is called the New Testament. There's a book there that's named Hebrews. And in that book, in the very first chapter, the author tells us something amazing about Jesus along these lines, if you go there and you find that you can read this, it says, long ago, at many times and in many ways, God spoke to our fathers by the prophets. But in these last days, he has spoken to us by His Son, who He appointed the heir of all things, through whom he created the world. He is the radiance of the glory of God and the exact imprint of his nature. And he upholds the universe by his word and his power. After making purification for sins, he sat down at the right hand of the majesty on high. Now we know from this passage and many others that Jesus not only revealed some of what goes on behind the scenes, so to speak. But he also came to invite us to actively participate in this overlapping unseen kingdom and his kingdom here on Earth. And we're going to talk about what that means and what that looks like here. Just a little bit deeper. So maybe you are familiar, for example, with a famous prayer that's in the Bible that reads like this in part. It says, yes, your kingdom come, your will on earth be done as it is in heaven. Well, that's actually a reference to this unseen realm of God. But I'm going to do more on that later. In fact, in future broadcasts along these lines, I'm going to spend time talking about Jesus. I'm going to talk about this prayer that he gave to his disciples. We're going to see who he was in the Old Testament. Maybe you didn't realize that there are references to Jesus throughout the Old Testament and he's at work there as well. We're going to take a look at Jesus and who he is in the New Testament, who he is for us today, and then what our future can look like based on the work of Jesus. And by the way, if you read the rest of Hebrews chapter one, it's a great description about he, how he is superior to all the angels and all of these other created lesser beings. And it's just an awesome read. Highly encourage you to read that if you have time. But for today, let's just stay at a 10,000 foot level and, and do a very broad overview of the supernatural framework that's in the, in the Bible. So right from the start, the very few, first few chapters of the Bible center around the creation of the cosmos in the universe. It centers around the creation of earth and humanity. Maybe if you have any familiarity with church setting or the stories of the Bible, you'll know that it starts out with a story that we call the Garden of Eden. And it talks about a man named Adam and a woman named Eve. How are they the first humans that were created and how they chose to eat fruit from a forbidden tree. And what that did was it condemned the human race with sin. So all of that's true, but there's actually a lot more to the story than that as well. And when we understand the rest of that story at deeper levels, we begin to have healthy context of some of the supernatural content of the Bible. So in order for us to get a glimpse of that, I'm going to take us to another Old Testament book that's called Job. And in the Book of Job, we understand that when all of that creation took place, there were actually some other created beings present with God when he laid the foundation of the world. We read in job 38, for example, where God is talking to Job. He says this, where were you when I laid the foundation of the earth? Tell me if you have understanding, who determined its measurements? Surely you know. Or who stretched the line upon it? On what were its bases sunk, and who laid its cornerstone? This is verse seven. Now, when the morning stars sang together and all the sons of God shouted for joy, that paints for us a picture that God having created some of these lesser beings, these other creatures had them present when he laid the foundation of the earth. These created beings are referred to in several passages of the Bible as God's divine assembly. The Hebrew word that is used for them is Elohim. And we get snapshots of them in places like Psalm 82, where it says, God has taken his place in the divine council, or the divine assembly in the midst of the gods, he holds judgment. Or again, in First Kings 22, we reference this in episode five. And Micaiah the prophet said, therefore hear the word of the Lord. I saw the Lord sitting on his throne, and all of the host of heaven standing beside him on his right hand and on his left. Another spot that we're familiar with a little bit from church circles, is Daniel chapter seven. It says, and I looked. Thrones were placed, and the ancient of days took his seat. His clothing was white as snow, and his hair of his head was like pure wool. His throne was fiery flames, its wheel was like a burning fire. A stream of fire issued and came out from before him, and. And a thousand thousands served him. And 10,000 times 10,000 stood before him. The court sat in judgment and the books were open. Again, this is a snapshot of some of these lesser created beings around the throne of God in this supernatural realm, in this unseen place that we can't really see. It only overlaps occasionally with what we live on earth. There's also a great deal of complexity with the description and nature of these creative beings. We tend to want to simplify them by calling them all angels. You know, the kind that float around heaven with harps and wings. And by the way, the Bible never says that angels have either harps or wings. I'll talk about that in just a second. But we love to picture them that way. In fact, the description of angel when we read it in the Scriptures is more like a job title, which means messenger. We think that there are a couple things going on with angels, we like to simplify it by saying there were good angels who are loyal to God, and then there are bad angels that we call demons who have rebelled against God. But it's actually way more complex than that. Just to whet your appetite for what? I mean, consider that there are creatures with different names. Throughout the scripture. For example, there are things that are called cherubs. These things apparently can be written according to Psalm 18:10, where it says, he rode on a cherub, and he flew, and he came swiftly on the wings of the wind. So even if that passage is metaphorical and they can't be ridden per se, I mean, they still exist. We see them protecting the. The Tree of Life in eden. In Genesis 3:24, he drove out the man, and at the east of the Garden of Eden, he placed the cherubim and a flaming sword that turned every way to guard the way to the Tree of Life. By the way, just let me do a little bit of a rabbit trail here. Have you ever wondered why those angels or those cherubs, I'm sorry, had to guard the. The way to the Tree of Life? That's interesting. We never really talk about that, but we can certainly dig into that in a future episode. Like, why are they guarding the path that would lead Adam and Eve, after they've been expelled to the garden, back to the Tree of Life? Interesting study, getting back to cherubs. Though they are also mentioned in other places with fantastic imagery. Like in the book of ezekiel in chapter 10, it describes them as. They had four faces. The first face was like the faces of a cherub. The second, the face of a human face. The third the face of a lion. And the fourth the face of an eagle. And the cherubim mounted up. These were living creatures that I saw by the Chebar Canal. Canal. And it's, like, really interesting. Okay, something's going on here. There's some other type of created beings. We also find some things that are called serifs, which we see this in Isaiah, for example, in chapter six, where we read, above him stood the seraphim. Each had six wings. With two he covered his face, and with two he covered his feet, and with two he flew. So this is where we pull in that wing kind of imagery of angels. We think that, like, all angels have, like, their little bow and arrow and their. They're this, like, you know, float around on clouds and things like that. But actually only like seraphim and cherubim are described as having wings. And we don't classify them necessarily. In the same category as angels, we have some things called fallen angels that I'll get into later. But they're also described as what we call watchers. And they are locked away now for eternity. Second Peter, chapter two, verse four is talking about this. It says, for if God did not spare angels when they sinned, but cast them into hell and committed them to chains of gloomy darkness to be kept in judgment. He's referring to something we're going to get into soon that occurs back in Genesis, chapter six. There are also these things called evil spirits that seem to be wandering about right now. One of the New Testament books, one of the four accounts of Jesus's life, one of the biographies of his life is found in Luke, chapter 11. We read there when unclean spirit has gone out of a person that passes through waterless places, sinking, rest and finding none, it says, I will return to my house from which I came. We do not wrestle against flesh and blood, but against rulers, against authority authorities, against cosmic powers over the present darkness, and against spiritual forces of evil in heavenly places. That's another passage that's found that was written by a guy named Paul. So we have all of these different type descriptions and categories of lesser created beings that cohabitate and live in the supernatural realm, and yet they seem to have and influence in our world today. And when we begin to understand that, then we can understand also that it would seem then that at least some of these created beings at one point in history had the ability to follow God or to rebel against him. There are Bible passages that describe this rebellion. Back in Job, again, God is talking, can mortal man be right before God? Can a man be pure before his Maker? Even in his servants he puts no trust, and his angels he charges with error. So something was going on there where we have an angelic rebellion. And again, back in Psalm 82, I'm going to refer often to Psalm 82, where the author says, I said, you are God's sons of the most High. All of you. Nevertheless, like men you shall die and fall like any prince. Arise, O God, judge the earth, and you shall inherit all the nations. This is a recording for us, a rebellion that took place in that supernatural realm where the result was mortality, that these created beings would one day die like humanity will die. Which I guess leads us to the assumption that they were created to be immortal after that. Not that they were eternally existent from the beginning, but from their creating point they were designed and created. Some of them were at least to live forever, not have to experience death until they rebelled, and that was one of their punishments. And so the fact that these creatures could rebel also led to the fact that many of them did. In fact, the eating account that we understand with the garden is the account of the serpent deceiving the woman and the. And it's a record of one of God's created supernatural beings rebelling against God himself. We have record of this both in the first and the last books of the Bible. In Genesis, in the beginning, in chapter three, we read, now, the serpent was more crafty than any other beast of the field that the Lord God has made. He said to the woman, did God actually say, you shall not eat of any tree in the garden? And the woman said to the serpent, we may eat of the fruit of the trees in the garden. But God said, you shall not eat of the fruit of the tree that is in the midst of the garden. Neither shall you touch it, lest you die. But the serpent said to the woman, you will not surely die, for God knows that when you eat of it, your eyes will be open and you'll be like God, knowing what is good and evil. So when the woman saw that the tree was good for food, and then it was a delight to the eyes, and. And that the tree was to be desired to make one wise, she took the fruit and ate it. And she also gave some to her husband who was with her, and he ate it as well. This is the same story that's at the end of the Bible that we find in the last book called revelation. In chapter 12, it says, the great dragon was thrown down, that ancient serpent who is called the devil, and Satan the deceiver of the whole world. A second interaction is seen in one of the most chilling accounts of what this continued supernatural rebellion looks like as well. We not only have it as the original rebel, this serpent rebels in the garden. But there's a more alarming. Well, an equally alarming account that occurs in Genesis chapter six as well. Interesting verses. These first four verses, it says here, when man began to multiply on the face of the land, and daughters were born to them, the sons of God saw that the daughters of man were attractive, and they took them as their wives, any that they chose. Then the Lord said, my spirit shall not abide in man forever, for he is flesh. His days shall be 120 years. The Nephilim were on the earth in those days and also afterward, when the sons of God came into the daughters of men and they bore children to them. These were the mighty men who were of Old the men of renown. This passage recounts for us that there was a point or points in time when the rebellious supernatural beings came to Earth, had sexual relations with women, and their offspring became known as Nephilim. And these Nephilim will continue to play a huge prominent role in the Bible story. So let me tap the brakes, let me just pause here for a minute just to recap here. There is one all powerful creator God of the universe, and he alone can create and he alone has the power to make his desired will happen. God created both supernatural beings and human beings with the ability to make free will decisions. Many of those supernatural beings chose rebellion. So far we've talked about two of the three largest rebellions that are recorded in the Bible. We have Eden and what I'll refer to as the watcher event of Genesis, chapter six. The term watcher, by the way, is found in the book of Daniel and another ancient book that's not part of our current Bible, that's called Enoch. And I'll talk more about what that means and what that meant to some of the original people, the ancient Judean culture, and how they look to that for some answers as well, and how sometimes our own biblical authors will allude to that book there. So the these three major rebellions then, along with the current work of the evil supernatural forces, become the foundation to what we call spiritual warfare. Another component of spiritual warfare, of course, is our own sin nature. We'll save that for another episode also that is a result of our human rebellion in Eden that took place alongside of the supernatural rebellion of Satan and the Devil. So I see Eden then as like a confluence or an overlapping of both the supernatural realm in our own human earthly location, where both realities were experienced by both the supernatural beings and by us. And that was just normal. I mean, Genesis reminds us that God walked in the garden, for example, with Adam and Ev, and that was very natural. Humanity was created by God because He wanted us to experience his love and to partner with us to image him back to the rest of the world. Eden wasn't the ending ideal. It was the beginning of choosing to partner with him as his earthly family, just like he partnered with his supernatural assembly to rule the heavens. Because of the supernatural and human rebellions, however, that plan didn't work. We both chose to be our own authorities rather than have God's plan enacted in our in our lives. We wanted to be like him, but in our own ways we thought our plans were wiser. Genesis 3, 6 reminds us of that. Where we read a woman saw that the tree was good for food and that it was a delight to the eyes, and that the tree was to be desired, to make one wise. She wanted that wisdom and that would make her like God or make her her own God. She took the fruit and ate it. And she also gave some to her husband who was with her, and he ate it. I believe that there's a passage in the book of isaiah in chapter 14 that tells a similar tale and description of some of the motives behind Satan's rebellion. It says there, how you are fallen from heaven, O day star, son of the dawn. How you are cut down to the ground who laid the nations low. And you said in your heart, I will ascend to heaven above the stars of God. I will set my throne on high. I will sit on the mount of the assembly. In other words, he's. He wants to govern that whole council of created beings in the far reaches of the north. I will ascend above the heights of the clouds. I will make myself like the most High. That was Satan's pride and rebellion that led to his fall. But here we go too. The main story of the Bible tells us, and I don't want us to lose sight of this, of the unimaginable love of Jesus to fix these rebellions. Only he would be able to redeem mankind and restore the original Eden plan. In fact, that's what the book of Revelation is describing, where we will one day have a new heaven and a new earth. Eden will be restored. There will once again be one reality where both heaven and earth come together. They'll overlap and it's going to be normal. This is what it says in Revelation 21. Along those lines, then I saw a new heaven and a new earth. For the first heaven and the first earth had passed away and the sea was no more. And I saw the holy city, the new Jerusalem, coming down from heaven from God, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband. And I heard a loud voice from the throne saying, behold, the dwelling place of God. As with man, he will dwell with them, and they will be his people. And God himself will be with them as their God. He will wipe away every tear from their eyes, and death shall be no more. Neither shall be mourning, nor crying, nor pain anymore. For the former things have passed away. As we dive deeper into the nature of demons, angels and other unseen forces like Paul describes In Ephesians chapter 6, I would caution us not to get lost in the weeds. Of that it's easy for us to fear and fixate on things that are unseen or unknown. I mean, that's human nature. But I would encourage us, all of us, that as we look at some of these things, it's important that we do. I mean, I mean, we have to look at them. They're in the Bible for a reason. Let's just remember this final outcome. We don't live in a balanced yin yang type of a universe where nobody knows the outcome of the cosmic forces. Evil is not necessary for a harmonious balance of the whole. Only God is going to win. If you're in a place of worry today about some of these things, or if you're shocked by the seemingly rapid decline of our culture and the prominence of evil, then it will be good to remember who Jesus is, what he's done, and what he will do. If you have chosen to have believing loyalty in him, in Jesus, that's your new identity and that's the focal point for navigating the supernatural impact of these unseen forces in your life, which are still at work in their everyday lives that we face. So as always, if you need to talk to somebody about this or you feel that you are under direct depression right now, please reach us out to us and connect with us. The next episode that we're going to do, we'll cover more in detail a little bit about this Genesis 6 watcher rebelling. Then we'll get into the third major biblical rebellion that takes place, which is called the Tower of Babel. We'll also discuss the impact that these rebellions had in the ancient world and what it means as we share the story of Jesus in the darkest corners of the world today. But for today, again, I just want to thank you for joining us. I hope you'll come back often. God bless you and take good care.