← Provoked with Darryl Cooper and Scott Horton
Provoked with Darryl Cooper and Scott Horton
EP:21 - The MAGA Civil War Has Begun! Tucker Carlson v. Shapiro & Levin
01:34:36
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- [00:00]
A
If you're a podcast host, listen up. This one's for you. My name is Ali Jackson. I'm the host of Finding Mr. Height, a dating and relationship podcast that I've been doing for four years now, sharing my positive and practical approach to dating that's built on my own life experience. And I wanted to share another experience that I've had, my secret behind monetizing my show. It's called Red Circle, and I was just telling my colleague about how much I love their platform. With Red Circle, not only am I getting a seamless hosting experience, but I also love the support I receive in ad sales. I it's not just typical ad sales either. It's targeted opportunities based on my show and my life. And the platform is super simple. You just set your preferences and Red Circle matches you with sponsors that align with your show. You can vet every opportunity and their platform gives you great analytics. More recently, too, my Red Circle team has brought me opportunities outside of my podcast on social media to really augment the podcast partnerships. Bring them full circle. I just can't recommend them enough. If you want to give it a try, go to redcircle.com to get your free trial. That's red redcircle.com for a free trial.
- [01:09]
B
All humans break. The difference between humans and gods is that gods can break.
- [01:15]
C
Humans negotiate. Now end this war.
- [01:20]
B
You're watching Provoked with Daryl Cooper and Scott Horton debunking the propaganda lies of the past, past, present, and future.
- [01:31]
C
This is provoked. God dang it. I keep doing that. That's why I shouldn't be live, and that's why I shouldn't be on video. Hey, kids. Happy Friday night. Welcome to the show. Hey, Daryl, how are you doing?
- [02:01]
B
I'm great. I am great. I just got finished with what I hope is the. My. My last time having to travel this year. And I'm really looking forward to just hunkering down in my warm little log house here when it's 20 below zero outside and working on working on my next episode.
- [02:20]
C
So I don't know how that sounds good to you, but sounds good to me that it sounds good to you, I guess. Hi to everybody in the chat room. We have a chat room or two on rumble and on YouTube, so everybody do that. Or if you're on X, I don't know. I can't keep track of them all. But we got some chats here. Big hi to everyone and I've got the Scott Horton Academy on my hat, so make sure to go to Scott Horton academy.com and sign up for the new academy. It's going really great so far. Thanks for asking. And so, yeah, I think we should talk about how you are. I don't know, like the bark on the tree that contains the root of all evil. Something like that. You're. You are Satan adjacent. Daryl Cooper, I saw an edited clip of you that looked pretty bad. What's his name? Old Ben Shapiro. That guy's voice is so funny. It seems like. You know what they should do? They should take the voice of the little twink that the Charlie Kirk assassin was banging and they should give his voice to Ben Shapiro so he sounds like a man and is tolerable.
- [03:35]
B
Dude, his voice is anti Semitic. It's like if somebody did that voice imitating a Jewish person, you would call that person anti Semitic.
- [03:43]
C
Yeah, seriously, get in trouble. Not even on Halloween could you get away with that. Anyway, so I could just hardly listen to the guy, I swear. You know, my anecdote of the whole Ben Shapiro is I knew who he was when he started writing in favor of the Iraq war back in 03 or 4 or whatever when he was a kid. And so I already knew who he was, and I knew that there was nothing that I had to learn from him, nothing interesting there at all. So I just ignored him. And YouTube, man, YouTube would just constantly put him in the right hand margin of my page, no matter what I'm looking at. Bench pair. Bench beer. Bench beer. Years of this. Literally years. And finally, one of the headlines was interesting enough that I clicked on it, and I didn't even realize that I had never heard his voice before until I did. And then I heard it. And he goes, me, me, me, me, me, me, me, me. And I just was like, oh, my God, I can't believe this is the guy who's like, somehow the leader of the conservative movement in America or something, whatever he is. Anyway, so he played this clip of you to prove what a bad guy Tucker Carlson is that he would sit across a table from you. And it starts out without the part about. Yeah, when I'm joking around with my buddy Jocko the Anglo, and I'm picking on him and trying to get a charge out of him. Sometimes in my hyperbolic way, I'll say that Churchill was the real villain of World War II. So that whole part about. Yeah, when I'm jerking my friend's chain around and I'm. And I'm being, like, deliberately provocative, to coin a phrase, then I like to say it like this, Tucker. Well, that part is cut out Right. And then the rest of it is still there, but then it's supposed to just be self evident that you love Hitler or something like that. Although it didn't seem like that was what you actually said. But here's the thing about it is we got a show together. So I could just give you the floor and you could say whatever you want about it. Darrell, how do you like that? Go ahead.
- [05:31]
B
Well, the first thing I want to do is read this comment by one of the viewers. Fear the old blood. Shapiro's voice is an 8th amendment violation. I'd rather listen to RFK Jr. Read me a dirty novel. I love it. I mean, look man, like first of all, there's no reason for somebody like me to real like I have until our producer Chris just showed me the clip. I had heard that it happened, but I hadn't watched it because partly I know what he's going to say, I know what it says, I know what I said on Tucker's show. I know which clips he was going to cut out and I knew what he was going to say about them and what use he was going to put them to. Right. But also the, you know, the other reason that I didn't watch it is thankfully, I mean, you said like whatever, he is leader of the conservative movement maybe like seven, eight years ago. Ben Shapiro doesn't matter. He doesn't matter anymore. And that is one of the best things that is has developed out of like all of these recent events of the last few years is that people like him don't matter. You think about like what it was that somebody like Ben Shapiro, what like what was his gig? What was his job? Why did he get so much seed money for the Daily Wire and why was it promoted just so endlessly on every channel? Why were you seeing it on YouTube like every time you went to the webpage? He had one job. His job was to draw in the right wing American youth, or at least the American youth who were tired of being screeched at by blue haired freaks on their college campuses and they were tired of being chased to their cars by mobs when they dared to go to a Trump rally to draw those people in, tell them what they wanted to hear, go to the college campuses and own the blue haired freaks on stage and make sure it goes viral. But then to make sure that none of those people, none of those people that were coming in as his audience wandered off the reservation on the one thing that really matters to Ben Shapiro and people like him and that is the US stance toward Israel. And this is something that ever since October 7, he. People like him have been unable to keep the charade up any longer, and everybody knows it. They still have an audience. There's a lot of Jewish and Christian Zionists out there who still want to hear him say bad things about Arabs and all that kind of stuff. They're still out there. They have that audience, but they're talking to themselves now. They're not talking to anybody else. And I don't really care what they say about me in their own little cult meetings. You know, I mean, if you think about it. Well, first of all, it's. It's. It's really laughable that. It's laughable that people like Ben Shapiro think they have the ability to police the ranks of the American right anymore. I mean, all the people who are coming at me and coming at Tucker Carlson now, they're the same people who put their names on the COVID of national review in 2016. To say that they would never, ever, under any circumstances, support Trump and now claim to be the leaders of the MAGA movement and, you know, able to decide who gets to stay and who gets to go. It's laughable. It's ridiculous. They couldn't stop Trump then when they had all the institutional power, when they controlled all the conservative institutions and the Republican Party, they couldn't stop him because they didn't. They didn't really even matter that much then. Now they don't matter at all. Okay. At all. And you know, the second thing, it's just. It's laughable that they think they have the right. I mean, if you go through, right. You think about the fact that. Just go. I. I posted this on Twitter the other day, back in 2011, before or after a Republican primary debate, Ben Shapiro, and he posted stuff like this, like different versions of this several times. He said that Ron Paul, okay, one of the kindest gentlemen, whatever you think of his politics, or libertarian, whatever. One of the sweetest, kindest gentlemen. Uh. Oh, hello.
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C
You must one of the nicest guys I ever wrote a book about.
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B
What in the hell's happening to my. Okay, hold on.
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C
All right. And we talked about this last week. What it was, was he said every time Ron Paul picked up a pen, Ben Shapiro would tweet. See, he's gripping the pen like he would the neck of a Jew. Like, he really did that over and over again, which is just like the most insane thing. And then as we were debating on the Tom Wood show, is Ben Shapiro really that crazy or. No, he really is just betting that his audience is that stupid. And that was just his, his kind of resort, his trick. That was all he could do was just try to lie, put the most insane words as possible in Ron's mouth, even though he never indicated anything like that in any way whatsoever. Of course, that is. Yeah, exactly how he was. Now I would just say on. As far as Ben Shapiro not mattering, I mean, he does matter. He does still have a huge audience. And I think that, you know, he and Levin and the other leaders of the war Party are a vanishingly small group, but they do still have a pretty big audience. And I would posit to you, Daryl, that like, you know, I always try to keep this in mind, man, that maybe it's a lesson of the Iraq war that like there are a lot of liars, but there are a lot of people even with power telling lies who believe the lies, right? There are people of like, somewhat like mid ranks in Washington who believe that, oh, Saddam does have the weapons, everybody in town knows it's true and we're doing this and what, and, and don't even know they're lying, that kind of thing. And so, you know, like the Declaration of Independence says, the decent respect to the opinions of mankind. You got to assume that people mean well, but they just don't know what the hell you're talking about yet. You got to give them a chance to understand you on your terms, right? So assume, Daryl, that you had a good person watch Ben Shapiro, a decent guy whose mind you, you could change and is open to hear your side of the story. And now he's saying, all right, so what is your side of the story here? You really think Churchill's worse than Hitler or what is the deal here?
- [11:47]
B
I mean, we've gone over this before on the show. It's brand new again.
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C
That's why that it's brand new again. It's a huge fight right now, so let's do it again.
- [11:54]
B
Sure, sure. So when you say that Churchill. Look, I was making the case that if you've got a country with a leadership like Germany had in the 1930s, where they're, this is a traumatized people coming out of the 1920s, out of the First World War, and you make the decision to, to, to be as aggressive and belligerent as possible with them, to drive them to the point that maybe, maybe they're delu. Forget about what the Germans were doing. You know, the, the, if you, if you go up into. Well, actually, let me just. I didn't plan on talking about this, he scrambled me up. But so like, to. To talk about Churchill, one of the things I've said before is afterwards, Churchill was just kind of a proxy. I'm really talking about, like, British imperial policy at the time. Right. And Churchill was the way that I like to rib jocko. His wife's British. So. Right. That when you. When you get to the point of 1939 when. When Hitler invades Poland, you think about that as like, you know, the way that we would think today about America intervening, you know, because Saddam Hussein invaded Kuwait. Right. The propaganda version of it, this. This crazy guy invaded this innocent country, and by God, like, we have the power to stop him, and we just got to get in and do it. That is not what was going on. Okay. Poland was a tripwire to give Britain and France the. The ability, the right to go to war with Germany because they wanted to do that anyway. Hitler did not want war with Britain and France. That is not something that even mainstream for, you know, just totally mainstream historians will say that he did not want war with Britain and France. He didn't have any territorial designs in the west at all. He wanted territory in the East. He had a whole lot of things he wanted to do over there. Bring the German Reich back together and conquer land in Eastern Europe for their, you know, to give them more. More living space. He didn't want to have to deal with Britain in France. And so my point was you have this war that involves Poland and on the same side, the Soviet Union and. And Nazi Germany. And it was. And it could have stayed a war between those three, and it could have been worked out and Poland would have been carved up in poor Poland. That sucks. I mean, but it sucked to end up in Joseph Stalin's after the war, too, but that it could have remained right there. You know, after Hitler conquered Danzig, he even told his. A collection of his generals who were there, who he had called together. The Reich is now complete, you know, and so does that mean he never would have invaded the Soviet Union and he never would have gotten his hands on all the Jews that lived over there and the Holocaust never would have happened or anything? No, it doesn't mean any of that. It just means that there was an opportunity maybe for an off ramp when we were still at the point of like a couple hundred thousand people dead, Right. Where we could have avoided the total destruction of the European continent. That off ramp was not only not taken, it was. It was. It was just aggressively not taken. Right. And so you go up to 1940. Hitler says, you know, first of all, they, they, Britain and France declare war. Hitler turns around and says, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, look, this is between me and Russia and Poland here. You have nothing to do with it. Let's call this off. Let's not go to war. He offers peace on pretty generous terms considering the circumstances. Like, you know, he was offering to leave a Polish rump state in place, independent and all that kind of stuff, which, you know, again is a aggressive conquest, you know, kind of thing. But he had won the war. I mean, Poland was already finished off at that point. And Britain and France say no, we're carrying this thing on. And so you think about the position Britain and France were in. Were they ready to save Poland in any way? No, no, they couldn't do anything for Poland. For people who haven't looked at a map of Europe in a while, Britain and France are way over here, Germany's over here and Poland is way over here. They have no way to get there except going through Germany. And they had no ability to go through Germany. In fact, they had no plans to go through Germany. The whole idea that France had was building up that Maginot line, you know, so that we could get into another war like, like the First World War, only this time it'd be Germany banging his head against us instead of the other way around. And we'll show them. And so that doesn't work, of course. We all know what happens next. After eight months or so of almost nothing happening at all, because again, Britain and France were in no way prepared for a real war. They declared one anyway. Germany attacks and conquers all of western and northern Europe easily. And when the British escape at Dunkirk and flee across the Channel, he captures all their military equipment. Basically. The French army surrenders. All of Europe is now occupied by Germany. The only power that is left at war with Germany is Great Britain. Great Britain has no capacity whatsoever to invade Europe and go conquer Germany and turn the tables on this. That, that is not something that was a remote possibility that could happen. And so Hitler offers peace again and they say no. Again, not only do they say no, they send their no back with insults, you know, on the radio waves across the channels telling him to stick it in his smelly teeth, right? And you have people like, like, like Mussolini's son in law, you know, who was the ambassador to Germany at the time. And he was there and he's writing people back in Italy and writing in his, in his own diary saying that like, you know, when the British said that they wouldn't accept peace terms. They wouldn't negotiate a peace that at that point in the summer of 1940, the whole Nazi leadership, including Hitler, was dejected. Right. And so you get to that point, and here's the thing. This is. This is the real reason that I consider Churchill. I do consider Churchill a villain in this war at that point. What is the one way that he has to try to win the war that he refuses to end against Germany? Only one way. And it's to hope. Exactly. It's to hope that America and. Or the Soviet Union get into the war and do it for him. And what would that mean under any circumstances, the destruction of the continent of Europe? That is what it must mean if the United States and the Soviet Union invade to take on Nazi Germany. And so he said no to peace, knowing that that was his only hope. And by the way, and I'll get into this in the series when we get up to this part, there were vast, not only lobbying, but underground, clandestine propaganda efforts, all kinds of things going on in the United States by Great Britain to get us into that war.
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C
Justin Raimondo wrote a lot about that.
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B
Yes. Yeah. And so, like. And so to me, I look at that and I say, if you stay in a war that you have no plan to win except hoping that these other major powers come in and just destroy the entire continent of Europe on your behalf, you're one of the bad guys. Okay? I mean, there. There are. There are other just like. Like smaller things. Like the fact that, you know, most people think that it's just because they assume it must have been this way because this is a battle of good versus evil. So, of course, it was this way that Germany was, like, just bombing Britain from the start, bombing London, bombing all their cities. It wasn't actually that way. Hitler's own generals were getting, like, almost mutinous after several months because he refused to hit British population centers, despite the British firebombing their cities, strafing farms, killing farmers, livestock, you know, firebombing crops, firebombing the Black Forest just because, you know, terrorist actions, really, when you think about. When you think about the just absolute lack of strategic value. And we know now, and we know this because we have. And we'll get into all this in the series, we have, like, declassified information from the meetings that were being held in the British Cabinet. The reason they were doing a lot of that stuff was to provoke Germany to commit atrocities against Britain, to bomb London, bomb their population centers in order to create outrage in The United States. And so I'm sorry, like, you don't have to say that. He's as evil as Hitler. He killed as many civilians as Hitler or anything like that. That is a ruthless, psychopathic way to behave as a leader. And a lot of people died. And Europe was destroyed because they refused to compromise. You know, the whole, you know, Churchillian just steadfastness. That was stubbornness. It was stubbornness and ego and pride. And it destroyed the British Empire. Yeah, the British Empire was destroyed out of the whole thing, you know? And so if I was a Briton, I would be saying the same thing. This guy, the decisions he made or they made. Again, Churchill's a proxy for the British imperial policy.
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C
Right.
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B
They destroyed our empire. They cost us the empire. We ruled the world when this thing started, and now we have nothing. Now we're. We're a vassal of the United States of America.
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A
Yeah.
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B
So that was the outcome. And so that's it. I mean, you know, the people out there who are watching who expect me to say, oh, I didn't mean that Churchill was actually a bad guy. No, I'm not a fan of Churchill. You know, and I was very clear in that interview, and I've been clear ever since that. That none of that has anything to do with whether or not it was remotely acceptable for Germany to behave the way it did in the East. They massacred civilians.
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C
And you said that in your answer to Tucker. I'm not saying he committed the worst war crimes and did the worst violence in the war. I'm not saying that. But I am saying this.
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B
So, yeah, yeah, that was. And I go there in your answer, I go through this whole thing, like, for the audience who's watching now and for the people who will watch this later, because I don't owe Ben Shapiro an explanation for.
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C
No, of course not.
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B
That's how I feel. Like, that's why I was just kind of reluctant at first. I just. I almost feel like by even answering the question, like I'm addressing his criticism. I am not. I don't care what he said.
- [22:15]
C
Hey, y'.
- [22:15]
B
All.
- [22:15]
C
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- [23:12]
B
No, no, no.
- [23:14]
C
I set you up and said this is not for him. This is for anybody who saw him and thought, geez, what is with up with that Cooper guy? And they're just some guy who you owe a fair chance to. You don't owe him a fair chance, but you ought to give them a fair chance to understand your side of the story where, in which case they're going to take your side because Ben Shapiro is full of and anybody can read Pat Buchanan. And look when Pat Buchanan in Churchill makes the same case that you just made and it's actually Chamberlain who gave the war guarantee to Poland, not Churchill's. Before Churchill got there, Pap Buchanan knew that everybody was going to call him a Germanic Nazi and whatever. So what did he do? He quoted only historians from Oxford and Cambridge from the very top of their class and said, see, this is what happened. You look at that. I was joking before about they said that George W. Bush was the Winston Churchill of the 21st century. I thought, you know what, maybe that's right, that really Winston Churchill was just the George W. Bush of the 20th man and all this stuff because look, they teach us in fifth grade, Darrell, that all this stuff happened before you were born, when everything was in black and white. And it had to happen that way or it wouldn't have happened that way right up until and including true man using nuclear weapons on the Japanese. If it didn't have to happen, the democracy wouldn't have done it. And so all of the inevitability is so baked in and especially when the enemy is such evil it is beyond question for most people. And then I don't know if you know this, I'll send you the link. Last night my guy, Keith Knight debated a British historian about World War II and kicked his ass, destroyed him. And the guy's first answer was like, geez, he didn't know how to begin to confront Keith's arguments destroyed. And that was on everyone. Go to Zero Hedge on the Zero Hedge debates, Keith Knight up against a pro War. British historian nuked him. Why? Just because Keith cares enough to have an argument and because the other guy's.
- [25:12]
B
Trying to defend a cartoon, right?
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C
You know, he's like, find the guy's name so I can give, so I can say it's right.
- [25:19]
B
He's defending a myth of angels battling demons and calling that history. And that's an easy thing to defeat if you, you know, if you have any actual information. Just, I mean, when you, when you state the facts outright, reasonable people recognize that one side is, is telling a, a mythological tale and the other side is at least trying to do history. Okay? There are no such things as angels and demons in human form controlling countries and, you know, starting wars. These are people. They did them. They did these things for human reasons that are perfectly understandable to us. If you can understand the world that they lived in and the information that they had at the time that they thought were informing their decisions, you can understand it because they were human beings just like us. And, you know, you, they almost like the, the myth has to exist for the simple reason that if you step back and look again at the things that we did during World War II, and this isn't to say that we were the worst perpetrators in the war, we obviously weren't. We didn't, you know, we didn't kill nearly as many civilians as the Germans and the Japanese did, but we, we were literally just bombing cities that we knew were full of nothing but women and children and old men because all the fighting age men were out at the front. And we were just firebombing entire cities, killing 30, 40, 50,000 people a night when, you know, we were doing a, like a Gaza in one night. And we did it again and again and again and again, knowing there was nothing. But, you know, like when we did, when we did Dresden, we knew that Dresden not only did it not have any kind of military value whatsoever, we knew that it was a city that was chock full of refugees because Germans who had been in other cities that we had destroyed fled there thinking, surely they won't destroy Dresden, right? And we knew that. We knew it was full of refugees and we destroyed it anyway. You know, and there's a word for that. It's mass murder. And we committed mass murder on a vast scale. Not as vast as the Japanese, not as vast as the Germans, but vast enough that it should weigh on our conscience. And the only way that it doesn't is, well, we were battling the devil. Those weren't people we were bombing. Those were the mothers and fathers and children of demons. And that's the only way that we were able to come out of that war with a positive view of ourselves. And it's just. It's a cartoon. And it's that that myth has been put. Is. Is being put and has been put for a long time now to very evil purposes. You know, and this has really come out just more recently since October 7, 2023, you know, because that's what all of this is about. Okay. You think Ben Shapiro really cares about just the sort of accuracy of history with regard to World War II? He doesn't care about that.
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C
Right.
- [28:12]
B
He cares about it because he takes it personally, because he thinks it has something to do with his group. He thinks World War II, the biggest, vastest global conflict in world history, 60 million people dead, was about the Holocaust. That's what it's about to him. And that's fine. That's understandable. My wife's Armenian. They think the First World War was about the Armenian genocide. That's perfectly fine. But this was a much bigger historical event than just this one thing that happened on the Eastern front. And today, you know, Ben Shapiro hauls out these. These edited clips from me, brings out other things against Tucker. And he does it for what purpose? Not to correct the record of history. He. He's doing it because people like me, people like Tucker, we are speaking in reasonable ways to normal conservative people who are getting very, very. Who have gotten very squeamish about what they've been seeing live streamed to their phones in Gaza for the last few years. Okay. And it's not. It's not just professional anti Semites and foreign policy nerds who are noticing it this time. You know, back when they had the first conservative civil war back in 2004, when David Fromm and 2002 to 2004, when Pat Buchanan and everybody got excised from the conservative movement for being anti Semitic. What did that mean? Well, they didn't want us to go to war in the Middle east. And they didn't like all of these, you know, all of these Israel first neocons who were in the Bush administration who had written freaking papers talking about the need to get the United States into war with Israel's enemies. They didn't like the fact that they were getting their way. You know, and so this is something that's been going on a long time. But back then, it, you know, there was a few channels of information that they had to control, and they were able to kind of control everything as long as they could make it so that Buchanan couldn't write National Review and couldn't go on Fox News and stuff anymore, then, okay, you pretty much got things handled. They can't do that anymore. Okay? And so we're in a different world now, and regular people are noticing, you know, before it was Pat Buchanan, say, a reasonable criticism of our Middle east policy, and he gets called an anti Semite, and they try to destroy his life. That's Pat Buchanan today because of social media, it's housewives, it's regular college students who are going online and saying, I'm not so sure about all these dead babies. And they're trying to destroy them, right? And that pisses people off, you know.
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C
And they're going after Brett Cooper, right, the from the Daily Wire, who just left the Daily Wire a few months ago, and she said something about, if you love Israel so much, just move to Israel or something. That was it. And they're like, must be destroyed.
- [30:54]
B
Yeah, well, let's talk about that actually, real quick, because something I said earlier about the purpose of Ben Shapiro, the purpose of the Daily Wire, why it was set up, why it got so much funding. Yes. Don't listen to me. You can go on YouTube and hear it from the man himself, okay? He was sitting down on stage before an Israeli audience with an Israeli interviewer talking to him about Israel about a lot of things. And at one point, the interviewer asked him, well, why don't you just make aliyah? Why don't you immigrate to Israel? You know what he said? He didn't say, well, because I love America. I'm American. He didn't say, because this is my home. He didn't say, how dare you ask me that? Do you know how it sounds to people what effect that has on the diaspora when you ask me a question like that in public? No, no, no, no, no. He said, well, because I can do a lot more for Israel staying here in America than I can by immigrating, okay? So hear it from himself. And the idea that that guy has the right to tell anybody on the American right, let alone the America first movement, right, what's acceptable and what's not. I don't think so. And neither does anybody else anymore, okay? Kiss my ass.
- [32:06]
C
Yeah. Seriously. I saw an interview one time, man, with Darren Beatty from Revolver News, who's now at the State Department. And he was on the Glenn Greenwald Show. And the purpose of the show was to pick on Lex Friedman, who I have a soft spot for, because he was nice to Me and whatever. And I actually told him this story as an explanation for maybe why people are so paranoid about him. Because Greenwald was asking beedy, why does YouTube try to force this Lex Friedman guy down my throat all the time? And BD says to him, look, I really don't know about Lex Friedman, okay? I can't speak to that. However, I can speak to Ben Shapiro. And he cited. And I believe him. I didn't track it down, but fine. Darren Beatty's a journalist. And he goes, there was a zoom call that was like on YouTube. It was published or maybe it was a seminar at a think tank on stage, whatever. And somebody asks the lady from Google YouTube, hey, we're so concerned about this Ben Shapiro because he's the leader of the alt right and he's so hateful and bad and whatever, and yet he's all over YouTube. Can't you do something about this horrible alt right maniac? And the lady says, oh, no, no. See, we do that deliberately. When people get interested in alternative right wing politics and they start clicking on this or that, then our algorithms know to feed them a bunch of Ben Shapiro to bring them back onto the reservation, to keep them looking at, say, ooh, look at how, just as you're saying, look at how strongly Ben Shapiro destroys this 19 year old trans girl. You're not really a girl, he says. And the boy runs off crying, support Israel, you know, and that's what it's all about. Just baked into the thing. I think we talked before. I love beating this drum. It's just so hilarious to me. And everyone can look this up. It's in the Al Jazeera documentary on the Israel lobby. They did a great two part investigation on the Israel lobby, the UK side and the US side. And they talked about this Facebook group called Kittens and Donuts. And what it is is it's just housewife stuff for housewives. Kittens and Donuts. Donuts and Kittens. Aren't kittens cute? Don't you like donuts and nice pink frosting and all this stuff and it's cutie, cutie, cutie stuff. And then like every nine weeks or so they go support Israel because they're so good on gay rights and they have female fighter pilots or whatever kind of hasbara crap that they just put in there. When of course that's the entire purpose of Kittens and Donuts. This was never about the donuts, this was always about Israel. And that's how they think that they can get over on you. And so my Point being that that's what Ben Shapiro is. Ben Shapiro is kittens and donuts. Hey, everybody. Somewhat free markets. Hey, everybody. I don't know George Washington's Constitution and boys aren't really girls and support Israel. They're really strong on gay rights and have female fighter pilots and kittens and donuts and things. And that's all he is. Same for Bari Weiss, you know, and it's so transparent. Hell, same for Jeffrey Goldberg, the editor of the Atlantic. These people are what the Israelis called cyanyms, which means they're not exactly like paid Mossad, certainly not officers or even necessarily like agents, but like assets. Hey, you're a friend of ours, you love Israel, you want to do the right thing. Here's what you could do for us. We hate Megyn Kelly this week. Get out there and make sure everybody else does too. And then, you know, that's how it goes.
- [35:36]
B
And they do it with no concern whatsoever for the effect that that has on the diaspora itself, on your ordinary regular Jewish accountant dude who lives down the block from people, you know, because anti Semitism is rising. There's a lot. You know, look, one of the things that happens is people start asking perfectly reasonable questions. They have the whole world come down on them. Up until recently, they were getting banned from literally every social media or YouTube, anything you could think of that, you know, you would, you would get banned from. And when that starts to happen to regular people, they, they start to ask, well, you know, well, the first thing they ask is, well, who else, like, who is talking about this stuff? Because the people that are shutting me down, the people that I was listening to, I thought I could sort of trust, tell me the truth. They're, they're behaving completely irrationally on this issue. Coming at me like I'm the bad guy. And so who else is talking about this? And they start Googling around and they find the only people that are talking about it at all, which up until very recently was basically a bunch of antisocials, because anti social people who didn't give a shit what anybody said about them or whatever, who relished all the hate coming their way, were the only ones who dared to speak about the stuff. And so a lot of the regular people started getting shunted toward them if they wanted to actually learn anything about this, about this. The funniest thing about this whole blow up with Tucker Carlson is like, he's the opposite of that. He was on there with Nick Fuentes recently, and he didn't bring Nick on to Radicalize Tucker's audience. He brought him on to talk to Nick and to talk to Nick's audience and to let them hear that, no, you can. And if you call yourself an American, if you call yourself a defender of Western civilization, if you call yourself a Christian, for sure, then, no, you don't get to dislike Bernie Goldberg, the accountant down the block, because Benjamin Netanyahu is a piece of shit. No, you don't get to do that. That is unchristian and it's unwestern. Un American. That's why he had that conversation with him. And that's anybody with even a remote. The remotest goodwill, you know, the remotest, like, just generosity and the way that you interpret and treat other people. It's totally obvious that that was what was happening. Yeah, but the part that they don't like is he's saying, but you are right about Israel. You are right about the things that you're worried about and concerned about. When you turn on your phone and see, you know, all. All of the atrocities just flying in your face and people laughing about them. You're right to think it's a little bit strange that as the American public has basically abandoned Israel over the last couple years, left, right, and center, it's not reflected at all among our political leaders, among our institutional lead, among anybody who's making the decisions that run our country and affect our life. They haven't changed at all. Well, how is that? Aren't they our representatives? Aren't they people we elect? Shouldn't they be concerned with what the people think and care about if, you know, if they want to get elected again? Not on that issue, because they're working for somebody else. And, you know, Trump is the one who opened this whole can of worms as much as. And I mean really like he really did. There's a reason that, you know, like, Trump got elected behind one phrase, and that is America First, Make America great again was his slogan. America first was what got him elected. Because people left, right and center for decades had gotten tired of Republicans telling them that. That Democrats don't care about Americans. And Democrats were getting tired of their leaders saying, republicans don't care about Americans. People were saying, you know, I don't think any of you care about any of us. You are all working for somebody other than the people who are electing you to office. And they're working for a lot of people. They're, you know, they're working for the military industrial complex, they're working for the pharmaceutical companies, they're working for Just to extend the frontiers of the empire, you know, for NATO, all these things. But people have been saying those things for years. And they don't get canceled from every social media channel for doing it. They don't have Ben Shapiro trying to slander them and ruin their lives for talking about those things. But if they ask a question of why it's somehow acceptable for a sitting U.S. congressman, Randy Fine. To say that blood should flow in the streets of Gaza, kill them all in public, and that's somehow fine. That unless you're some kind of Palestinian activist, you should have no problem with that. In fact, it's just whatever. Somebody can show him a picture on Twitter of a dead baby covered in dust amongst the midst the rubble of a blown up building and say, how does, how does this, how do you sleep at night when you're defending this? And he says, I sleep just great. Thanks for the pick. And people say, what is this? What is this? How is it that this is not okay? And yet I ask, you know, why it is that Benjamin Netanyahu gets more ovations when he comes to speak before Congress than the President does at the State of the Union. I get canceled for that. What is going on here? And just, it's no longer avoidable, you know, people, you can't avoid it anymore. And so Israel isn't the only, you know, interest other than the, than the voters that these people were work for, but Israel's become a proxy for that because of the viciousness of the Zionist movement in this country and just because of the gaudiness and the ridiculousness of the shows of fealty. I mean, just the guy that just got elected mayor in New York, Osama bin Laden or whatever his name was. Yeah, I know his name. I'm just kidding. You know, they, they, when they were first starting to go after that guy, along the stupidest lines, by the way, this is like a AOC liberal who like officiated his friend's gay wedding and he's apparently ISIS and he's gonna inaugurate Sharia law or something, and it's just the dumbest line of, you know, attack you could possibly take, but one that makes sense to those people, you know, and when he had that first primary debate where they had him on stage and they were asking all those people what's, what are you, what's the first place you're gonna visit when you're mayor or something like that, and they're like, one lady said, puerto Ric. All the rest, oh, I'll take My fifth trip to Israel. Oh, I'm definitely going to Israel. I've never been to Israel. I can't wait to go there. And he says, well, I'm running from Air New York, so I'm just going to visit the five boroughs. I'm not going to leave the country to go do anything like that. I have a lot of Jewish constituents here. I can't wait to talk to them. And they played that on every channel as if that was a gotcha.
- [42:16]
C
Right.
- [42:16]
B
And they're so out of touch. They don't get it. They don't understand that.
- [42:22]
C
And they don't.
- [42:22]
B
They don't only think he's right, they think he's obviously right. Right. You know? Yeah.
- [42:27]
C
And like on Twitter, I mean, the reaction to that in the world was, wow, he just made such a fool out of all of them, the way that he handled that. You know what I mean? And then, like, you're saying, they had no idea. They thought that they won that point. And then I was reading this thing yesterday on Twitter. There was a couple of excerpts of an article that a guy ran in the Atlantic or something like that that like, kind of detailed the Cuomo strategy. After that debate, Daryl, they continued to run on, this guy doesn't love Israel enough. We're like. That was like the centerpiece of Cuomo's campaign and didn't even stop to say, oh, yeah, no, I mean, I'm going to repaint the crosswalks and stuff, too. I mean, did he say something about the crosswalks? I'll repaint the cr. He didn't even bother with that.
- [43:09]
B
You.
- [43:10]
C
Oh, no, I don't care about you. I didn't mean to imply that. And that was his campaign. I mean, they couldn't. And you can say whatever you want about this commie, but what? Yeah, one, he's not an Islamist. And two, Cuomo is the worst guy they could have possibly put up against him. This was Governor Totalitarian from the COVID lockdowns. And not only that, but as we know, due to lobbyist pressure, he took people who were currently hot infected with COVID and sent them to the nursing homes to infect and kill everybody else. This guy belongs in prison. They ran him against the commie. That was the best Democrat that they could come up with to keep the commie out. And then he ran on, you don't love Israel enough. Holy crap. Out of touch doesn't begin to describe it. We need to, like, adopt a new word from German shot in something about God dang These people are horrible. Now hold on because we gotta do business for a second here. First of all, the Academy, the Scott Horton Academy of Foreign Policy and Freedom. It's me and a bunch of friends we put together. It's@scott hortonacademy.com it's the first course by me on the terror wars is approximately 30 hours long explaining the last 45 years of American foreign policy over there in the Middle East. And then plus we got James Bovard, we got Ramsey Barood doing Israel and Palestine. A legitimate refugee from Gaza. A wonderful guy too. I know you'll get so much out of it. And, and the great Bill Buford. And very soon we're going to have Adam Francisco debunking Christian Zionism. We have my course that I'm working on, the edits now on the new Cold War with Russia, which is going to be probably twice as long as my Middle east wars course. And so everyone go there and sign up. If you think that I know about stuff and you want to hear me explain this stuff so that you know it as well as I do or close, then that's Scott Hortonacademy.com and then here's my coffee. Thank you for putting on screen, Chris. It's so good. I'm drinking it right now out of my Scott Horton Academy mug here. Hey, well, go ahead. Yeah, show the QR code. I'll show my mug more later, but I'm drinking it and it's so good. It's half Ethiopian and half Sumatran all mixed together. And that's from Mundo's Artisan Coffees. They hate the war party. They support peace, so please support them. This is the best selling coffee at Mundo's Artisan Coffees for good reason. Because of you guys, because of this audience. Help and support this show and help and support a good business in Phil Pepin's Great Mundos Artisan Coffees there. And then I'll go ahead and recommend people just check out libertarian institute.org anti war.com Scott Horton.org for all my archives. I got 6,000 interviews going back to 2003 for you if you want proof that I was right about everything all along. And Daryl Cooper is the great martyr maid. He's now finally produced chapter one of his new podcast series, Enemy the Germans War, which is an absolute roaring success already. So you will want to go to subscribe.martyrmaid.com and that is how you get the Martyr Maid podcast first. And it's a four hour long episode. The first episode here basically talking about the people who would go on to lead Germany in the second war and their experience in the first, and it'll blow your mind and your socks off and all that. So that is again, subscribe martyrmaid.com and then, you know, I guess I wanted to ask you a little bit about Fuentes here.
- [46:41]
B
Well, hold on real quick. I just wanted to say something about the academy real quick.
- [46:44]
C
Okay.
- [46:45]
B
Every once in a while I get these emails from crazy people. I don't understand them, but I do get these emails every once in a while or comments on my itunes, whatever that say. You know, I like Daryl fine, but you know, he goes off on all of these tangents all the time. I wish he would just give me the stuff that I need to know and that's what he should do. Well, here you go. You got Scott Horton Academy. Now that's exactly what you're gonna get. You get the information, you don't have to listen to me go off on tangents and muse about crap. You just learn the stuff that you need to know to be able to go out there and kick the warmongers asses whenever they come across you. So.
- [47:21]
C
And there are some tangents too.
- [47:24]
B
I haven't gotten to those yet.
- [47:25]
C
Yeah, yeah, but no, look, I mean the point of the thing, it's not just, you know, whatever, I want to make money off of videos or something. The point is to do a long form and in depth enough study of this stuff to really help people catch up. I mean, you know, Tom woods point to me, he said to me, he goes, look, man, whenever the good guys go up against the bad guys, we win, right? I mean, watch Anna Kasparian on cnn. You think she's going to walk off of that set without a crown on her head?
- [47:54]
B
Never.
- [47:55]
C
Dave Smith goes on Pierce Morgan. Everybody drops, dude. Dave Smith went up against the IDF spokesman two weeks ago and murdered him. Sorry, somebody mute out that almost cuss word there destroyed this guy. Like he was a Palestinian toddler. It was sickening almost. And so Tom woods thing is, you know, what if we just had like.
- [48:17]
B
Ben Shapiro was probably more sick in watching that than he was watching the Palestinian toddler get cancer.
- [48:22]
C
I know he pro was, that's true, but so like what if we just had a few thousand more me out there? We're just like, you don't even need me. Horton got hit by a bus. But it's fine because we got so many people out there who are pulling this weight that right, like there, there's no argument anymore. Hell, you know I've seen arguments on Twitter where. Or. Or out in the wild wherever, where somebody says something anti war and then someone else goes, what are you, a libertarian? Or what do you like? What are these paleo conservative isolationist types? In other words, instead of saying, what are you, some commie hippie? It's what are you, some kind of right winger that you hate war? We're winning, Darrell. We are winning. Well, in. Out here in the country, in the minds of the people, dude, it is non interventionism is. You know, we're right. Hell, as Colonel McGregor says, time wins more arguments than reason.
- [49:15]
B
Yeah, and look, man, the American people, we can be too trusting. We can be naive. We can get whipped up into a mob frenzy by our leaders. Sometimes the American people are at bottom decent people and will generally do the decent thing if they're told the truth. And I said that on Twitter the other day and somebody objected. Well, what about all these wars? I said if they weren't decent, they wouldn't have to lie to us every single time. That's right. You know, but they do. But now we have the ability to get out there and tell the truth whether they like it or not. They can't shut us down like they did pat Buchanan in 2003. They just can't. And they're losing and they're freaking out and panicking, and that's. That's the source of a lot of this.
- [49:55]
C
Yeah. All right, so now I do a lot of shows and I can't remember anymore what I've talked about on which show or whatever. So if I'm being too redundant from last week, then I apologize. I guess I. A couple things I wanted to say about the Fuentes thing was, you know, I had said, jace, this guy has said some things that are pretty goddang right wing. And then I saw some people in the comments saying that that was totally unfair of me to say and that in fact this guy is like, whatever, totally within the lines. Well, yeah, I think that really ain't right. I think that he's solidly a few clicks to the right of you or Tucker, and you're both a solid click or two to the right of me, or at least one. And so there. There is that. But then I saw a clip of him, and I admit I haven't watched his show. I don't think I've ever seen a whole show of his. I've seen, you know, quite a few clips and especially more recently, but I saw a clip of him and I understand the position that he's in. He's not going to climb down and say he's sorry or anything like that. But he did couch it in this in terms of saying, oh yeah, sure, when I was on a live stream five, five hours a day, five days a week since I was 18 years old, saying crazy stuff to my gamer friends. Then like, yeah, sure, you're gonna be able to find some stuff, which is. Right. Not apologizing, whatever, but who cares? Like, I don't, I don't give a damn if I hear an apology or anything. That's. In a sense, he's, it sounds like he's sort of trying to feel his way to climb down a little bit.
- [51:21]
B
It's more of a climb down than Ben, Ben Shapiro's ever done for saying Ron Paul wants to strangle Jews. You know what I mean?
- [51:27]
C
But then he said in the same rant that, but it is the Jews. And it's so funny because it's the same conversation that he had with Tucker, which is like, in my ears. It's just a total non sequitur where he's saying that like, look, Jewishness and Zionism are correlated, damn it. But like, yeah, but like, don't you remember when you were five and you learned that all squares are rectangles but not all rectangles are squares? That's why we call them Zionists now. Are all neoconservatives Zionists? Yes. Are all Zionists neoconservatives? No. Are all Zionists Israeli nationalists? Yes, that's what that means. Are all Jews Israeli nationalists? No, they're not. And there are millions of them and most of them are regular Joes with regular Joe walk of life, jobs and lives and no political power whatsoever. And their synagogue combined has no political power whatsoever. Right? And so anyway, my point is that one like, whatever this kid is, he's still very wrong about this. But then the thing is, is in that same rain, he's going, yeah, see, it's me and Tucker and Candace against the Jews. And it's like, now wait a minute, man, you know what? Like, I understand it's public choice theory, right? That's good for Nick Fuentes, right? That's not good for Tucker Carlson or for Candace Owens. It's not good for the anti war, right? It's not good for the non interventionist movement, which has been making a lot of headway here lately without some guy going, I love Hitler. Me and Daryl Cooper, we're big Hitler fans. Like, no, dude, that was not. You know what I mean? And that Seems to me what he's trying to do, Charlie Kirk is out of the way. I'm not saying he had anything to do with that. Obviously, the. Charlie Kirk's gone and so he, like, the field is open for Fuentes to. To show up here. And obviously, Daryl, he's got, I don't know, 30, 000 times as many followers as I have. Like, the, the floor is his to. To for this generation coming in, learning this stuff. Like, the question of what is to be done about him is already over. He's going to do whatever he wants. But then what does that mean for us, really? Because Mark Levin is Mark Levin. But again, a decent respect for the opinions of mankind. You go too far to the right, you lose the swing vote, man, and you're just going to end up like, blowing up your own coalition. And I'm not for compromising with the Zionists, I'm for kicking the Zionists out. But when you have avowed fascists saying, yeah, it's time to kick the Zionists out, it's not helpful. In other words, I don't think that Tucker was right that Fuentes is a cointelpro plant, but I think it's rational to wonder if he is. And I think it makes sense that the role that he fills is useful for the left in the same way. It's the same reason he got a big full cover picture and a big spread in the New York Times this week, that this is the new spokesman of the new right. Look, everybody, it's the same thing they did with Richard Spencer back 10 years ago is they go, look, this guy's kind of handsome and the girls kind of like him. And he's the leader of the new fascist right, which is the pro Trump right. Richard Spencer, leader of maga, according to Mother Jones and the New York Times and everybody else. And it's the same thing. And so again, I understand from, if I put myself in Fuentes shoes, I see we're like, well, what the hell? He's painting himself into this corner. He's trying to make the corner a little bigger, increase his influence, whatever, make more money, have more say, have whatever, forget money, have things the way he wants them to be. But I can see how like, man, if. If I found out a bad guy put him up to it, or that the FBI had threatened him with prison time or something and made him do this somehow and that it was a false flag thing. I mean, I'm not saying I think that, but I'm saying it would make sense that this would be the way to wreck us would be to have somebody who's that mean say that. Yes, he's on this team.
- [55:39]
B
Yeah. Victor Klemperer's diary of that he kept in Munich. During the munich Revolution in 1919, you had just these successively crazier red governments that took over month after month until you have just these full blown Bolsheviks eventually. And one of the things he says in that diary is how it was really like, you know, Munich was kind of a passive, non political city. It wasn't an industrial city or anything. And so the middle class was just sort of watching this stuff for their, from their windows for the most part. And they were starting to get riled up and thinking something that was really bad going on here and maybe somebody should do something. But the people who went out and were actually the ones who were protesting against the communist governments that were coming in couldn't shut up about the Jews. And he said that that gave these governments the ability to put a liberal jacket on themselves and go out and say, we're protecting the Jews. And it made the middle class, all the normal people, kind of like pause and like, well, maybe we don't want to necessarily side with those guys. And so that's a real thing, no doubt about it. And the enemy certainly understands that that's a thing and they, and they love it. As far as Fuentes himself, I mean, look, man, I think that, you know, the answer is much simpler. I don't think he's a plant or a fat or anything like that. I think that, you know, when you have, you know, you go back to when I did my first Tucker interview, the one Ben Shapiro clipped, the way that the world came down on me, if that had happened to me when I was 18 years old and it had happened to me, you know, 10 years ago when it happened to Nick, when nobody was standing up for me, nobody would have been taking my side, nobody would have had my back. I would have had, I would have been taken all of this completely by myself. When he had people showing up to his house, people who had committed triple murder earlier in the day, show up with a gun, try to break into his house and get in a shootout with the cops outside his door. This is a kid who, he had no backup, he had no support. He didn't have Tucker Carlson saying, you know, you know, I, I support this guy still. He didn't have Joe Rogan bringing him on and saying, you're not really that bad, are you? And so you get locked into that conflict mode. You know, he's nine years in at this point. He was 18 when all this started. He's 27 now. He's had, he's been at nothing but war with these people for nine years. And the only people who have stuck by him and had his back are his audience. And a lot of those people believe a lot of things that I don't like them to believe. And I, it's the reason that I like the fact that Tucker brought him on the show because he had a chance to talk to those people in a way that gave him enough credibility. Look, I'm being nice to your guy. I'm showing him respect. I'm not bringing him on here to insult him, to insult you. I'm bringing him on here to have a conversation. And here's why I think you guys need to take a step back. You know, that was a great thing Tucker did. And these idiot Zionists and all of these activists who are going after him, I don't know if they're just, they're so self destructively stupid, you know, they don't understand. He is trying to save them from him, from them, from themselves. He's trying to save Jewish Americans from Mark Levin and Ben Shapiro, you know, and they just don't get it. They just don't get it. And so, you know, I think that Nick is a little older now. He's never gonna, he's never gonna go grovel at Jonathan Greenblatt's feet and beg for forgiveness and say I was wrong. All that's never gonna happen.
- [59:10]
C
A.
- [59:11]
B
Because aside from a lot of the just nasty kind of rhetoric that, you know, that comes out, the gamer rhetoric, like he's not wrong about a lot of the stuff he says, he says it a lot in a way that, you know, is going to be very offensive to the sensibilities of anybody that's older than him. And there's a reason, it doesn't offend the people who grew up on Call of Duty servers because they're used to it. You know, that's how people talk to each other. And like, you know, I, I will, I will say, you know, Rogan, I give him credit on this. He, he was, I can't remember who he was talking to this, talking about this to on his show, but he said, you know, he was talking about Nick, talking about Nick. He said, you know, I wouldn't excuse a lot of the stuff he said. I certainly don't agree with it. And I think he, you know, a lot of the stuff maybe should apologize for or something he said, but good Lord, if there had been Twitter when I was 20, thank God there was no Twitter when I was 20. You know, you have a public record of every insane thing I ever that ever popped into my head. Oh, thank God that didn't happen. And a lot of these people who are complaining about all of this stuff, they're thinking they're lucky stars that it didn't exist back then, too. And for people like Ben Shapiro, who it did exist for, this stuff is on the record, right? You know, you got him saying, I'm sorry, like, and this is not just because I'm a Ron Paul fan to say he. That this man, to accuse him of wanting to wrap his hands around the neck of a Jew. That is as nasty a thing as you could possibly say that anything has ever come out of Nick Fuente's mouth. It just is. And you know, the only reason people don't see it that way, the only reason people can read Randy Fine's comments and think, well, you know, that's. Yeah, it's maybe a little over the top, but, wow, this guy who says Churchill might be the real villain of World War II. Oh, my God. That is the result of one thing that you were all forced to watch Schindler's List in class in seventh grade. That's why. Because there. Those things are objectively as bad as anything that they're crying about from the other side. They just are. We're just conditioned not to see it that way, not to think of it that way. You know, in the same way that, like, if, you know, whatever, this is kind of like very 2020 or something, I guess, at this point. But, like, you know, if a black person calls a white person a honky, it's kind of whatever. If a white person uses the hard R like it's a rap, you know, and it's sort of that same thing. We're just sort of conditioned. Well, yeah, you shouldn't say that. But over here. Oh, my goodness. Wow. That's just like beyond the pale.
- [61:38]
C
On the other hand, let me ask you, Darryl, because the comment section here is. No, I'm all wet. That actually. Well, I guess Nick Fuentes isn't any further to the right than I am. And I just am totally wrong using the N word 9,000 times in the last 20 years or whatever it is.
- [61:54]
B
Don't make defenses of Nick that he would not make for himself, okay? Like, you know that. Like, he knows he's a controversy merchant and who cares? That's fine. Like, so is Ben Shapiro. When I point out these things that Ben Shapiro says about Ron Paul, I'm not clutching my pearls and saying, how dare he say that he should be canceled. No, I'm saying. All I'm saying is you don't get to say that and then tell us what other people are allowed to say.
- [62:24]
C
That's not what I'm saying about Fuentes either. What I'm saying is, geez, if this guy's going to be that radioactive, I wish that he would stay away from our best guys who are finally making some real headway here without a bunch of help from a guy. I mean, the last thing I saw of when is from what, like two months ago was point of view. You're my real estate agent. I don't want to live near black people. I hate black people. They smell and they stink and they're criminals. And that's not. No further to the right than me. That's a guy who's a racist scumbag. That's totally different than what we're doing here. Give me a break.
- [63:00]
B
You know, and I think, I think that on that on some level, I think he understands that, you know, and.
- [63:07]
C
I think, by the way, racist. Racist against people who aren't racist. I'm only saying that, like, someone who's proudly racist, like that word does have a meaning if you're not a communist, you know?
- [63:20]
B
Yes. I. I think, though, that, you know, if any. Look, his audience exists, like they've been. You say you wish he would stay away from our guys. He's been staying away from everybody for 10 years, and that hasn't done anything except for grow him exponentially off in the shadows. That's happening anyway, to me. Yeah, Tucker's obviously taking hits from various angles for having him on and having a discussion with him. We need people like Tucker talking to people like him. You know, we need people we don't. We don't need. Like, Ben Shapiro is never going to reach Nick's audience. They do not want to hear from him. They need to hear from somebody who actually has Nick on his show, who treats him with respect, says, you're right about some things. It's horrible what happened to you over the years and all that kind of thing.
- [64:10]
C
But listen, attacking Tucker, I mean, I agree.
- [64:12]
B
No, no, I understand. I'm just saying. But as far as him stay. Staying away from our guys and stuff, dude, we. We have to build those bridges. And it doesn't, you know, the, the problem that everybody says you're platforming him, you're legitimizing the worst things that he's ever said. And no, you're not. That's just ridiculous. Nobody ever believes that people have interviewed terrorists. They interviewed Jeffrey Dahmer. Nobody thinks that they're legitimizing anything they, anything they did. And I'm not comparing Nick to those people. You know, Nick is look older, the older generations. And I'm right on the border of that. People just slightly older than me, they just, they don't understand like just the Internet culture that gave rise to somebody like Nick Fuentes. And we talked about this last week. Like one of the things that has caused honestly like a big part of our culture war these days is that you didn't used to have 65 year old heritage foundation staff members or board members getting into an argument with a 22 year old gamer over the state of Israel. That didn't happen. He talked the, he, you know, he talked to the Brooking Institute guy and they had their debate and the gamers over here said their things and their, you know, just youth language, whatever, and they were talking totally different languages and you know, it's just a completely different vernacular. And all of a sudden you threw those people all into the same pool. And older people, the people who aren't, aren't familiar with this are like, what the hell is going on here? These kids are crazy. Crazy. And, and it's like, I don't know what that means anyway. I don't know what that means when you do that. Chris. Sorry.
- [65:49]
C
He's telling me to check my phone because.
- [65:51]
B
Okay, he wants, hey, we got, we.
- [65:54]
C
Got thousands of people watching. So everybody subscribe and comment for the algorithm and give us a thumbs up and trash us in the chat.
- [66:01]
B
Go ahead, let's get some questions. We got questions. Yeah, yeah.
- [66:06]
C
I mean the, the basic discussion over here in my peripheral vision is that I'm a boomer, even though I'm actually the very youngest person ever born in Generation X, thank you very much. But either. Yeah, so I am, I am. This Guy says for $10 if anybody says the Jews, then that's totally legit. And that's what people like to hear in good discussions with smart people. And they're not going to think that you're a stupid a hole for going around complaining about the Jews all the time. And I'm the one who I guess.
- [66:41]
B
Is just, dude, Scott, Scott is not a boomer. Scott is somebody who recognizes that the boomers are out there and they're watching too, and they vote too, and they have a say in this. And so you can't completely ignore their sensibilities. And it's. When you're. When you're as large of a public figure as somebody like Nick is, you have to account for the fact that they're out there and they still have a lot of institutional power. They have voting power. These are people that you can't completely alienate. And so like you said about the, you know, the first lines of the Declaration of Independence, out of the. Out of respect for the good opinions of men, like, that's. You have to have that to a certain degree and understand, like, that in this world, you're talking to the whole world anytime you put something out there, and if the goal is to be based, if the goal is to be more awesome and hardcore than the next guy, you know, get into a purity spiral with other people on the right, well, yeah, that's what you're going to do. But if you actually want to win, you have to be able to speak to more people other than just your friends, you know, and, you know, and that doesn't mean allowing bad actors like Ben Shapiro to tell you what you can and can't say, but it means just have some respect for the normal people out there who might listen to you if you would speak to them, you know, in. In a language that they could understand. That's all.
- [67:55]
C
Yeah, fair. Well, and like I said, I mean, the guy's got millions of. Of people who watch him and listen to him. He's like, right up there with Candace and Tucker, the most popular political podcast. So he sure got a hell of a lot more say in the way people look at these things than I do. So, whatever. It ain't up to me to do a damn thing, because whatever. I don't know. I thought I looked at him like the conspiracy kooks. The conspiracy kooks are sort of libertarian adjacent, but not all libertarians are conspiracy kooks, although there's a little bit of overlap there. But, like, that crowd is their own kind of separate crowd. And I think what's so interesting to me here is what's going to happen now that this, these two crowds are really beginning to overlap more and more. And at least certainly it's his intention to move much more into the mainstream. As I think, especially now that Charlie Kirk is gone, there's kind of a power vacuum, a leadership vacuum for his generation there. And so then that raises a lot of questions when he goes from the corner he'd painted himself in, as, you know, this I Think whatever, however you want to characterize it. Over there where he was and now again, and I'm not talking about Tucker having him on his show and platforming him and all that. I'm talking about the clips recently I seen. I'm talking about the clips I've seen recently of him saying, yeah, see, it's me and Tucker and Candace and we're all in this foxhole together against the Jews. And it's just like, ah, man, you know what? Like, that's gonna be more harm than good. And I know that Tucker didn't ask you to say that like that, you know, and he did admit, by the way he goes. And me and Tucker don't even agree really. But it's like, okay, well then stop pretending like y' all are joined at the hip, you know.
- [69:41]
B
You know, like, I will say this and we can. Then I want to get to Sharon's question because it's an interesting one. The night after the show, after he had the Tucker interview, somebody sent me the clip. You know, Nick told his audience that, you know, and this isn't going to satisfy progressives, you know, or people who are just going to hate him, to hate him. But he told his audience that if you're born in America and you're America first, then he doesn't care what your background is, you're on the team, okay? Now for him to say that to his audience, that's a message that only he could deliver to them, you know, and all of the stuff that you're talking about that's so offensive to, you know, boomer sensibilities and Generation X, a lot of people's sensibilities, all that stuff, it is true, it drives a lot of people away. But if the guy who would say the things that he says then tells his audience, but if you're America first, you're on the team, that guy's the only one who's going to reach those people. People, you know, And I'm not saying he's doing one in order to, you know, butter them up for like this other message. I'm just saying, you know, you need people like that too, because there's some people out there who are really pissed off. There are people out there who, you know, are really, really anti social because of just a lot they've been dealt in life and because the future that they see, the rest of us are leaving to them and they're angry and they're disaffected and they, you know, they've been told their entire lives that they're the villains of the whole world and the cause of all the world's problems. They have this guy who steps up and gives those people who have been telling them that stuff a taste of their own medicine. And if you can get that guy to be that dude, be the dude that he is. But then just say, but, guys, we don't need to, like, hate the regular guy down the block, like, if he's America first and, like, what are we really fighting about? Like, that's fine. I don't need him to, like, all of a sudden become a Bernie Sanders liberal or something, you know, we need people like that, too. That's all I'll say about that, I guess. Let's get to Sean's question. Here we go. He says, with respect to the US Israel relationship, which group has the most influence? Christian Zionist neocons, the Likud Party, or organized Jewish oligarchs? And I'm not going to answer that question directly. I'll just say so. Christian Zionists in the United States are the, you know, like, if you have, like, a giant robot that's controlled by a guy, like, up in the head, Christian Zionists are the body of that robot. And then you have, like, organized Zionist activism that is up in the head controlling the levers of that thing and driving it around. Without one, you couldn't have the other. Who has most influence. It's kind of hard to say, you know, in terms of what direction the thing goes. The guy up in the head, in terms of whether it goes anywhere at all. The body. You need the body. And so. So that's, you know, I think the answer to that. But I want to. I want to, like, address one point of the issue because he said the last thing he said. Organized Jewish oligarchs. One thing that, that Nick, I don't want to. I don't want to, like, pigeonhole him on this because I don't. I don't watch his show. I see a lot of clips. I've seen a couple of his shows, like his Charlie Kirk post Charlie Kirk show and everything, but I'm not familiar with everything he says. And so I've been corrected before as far as, like, my assumptions about what it is he thinks or says. But to me, like, from what I've seen, he talks a little bit out of both sides of his mouth on the question of the Jews or organized Jewry or world Jewry, whatever, you know, whatever term you want to use on it, you have to be able to draw the distinction between Jewish individuals Which includes Dave Smith, which includes Norman Finkelstein, which includes Jeffrey Sachs. All of these people who, not only have they been battling on this issue for years, they were lone voices in the wilderness for a long time while most of us gentiles were cowering in the corners, afraid of our own shadows, you know, and they were out there taking heat and are still taking heat that most people who criticize them are not even aware of. You know, they pay major social penalties and other penalties for saying the things that they say. And they deserve like, respect for that. Okay, first of all, but to lump them in because they happen to be Jewish. I mean, you can, I mean, look, Nick likes these people. He likes Dave Smith. So he knows. And you know, he's not going to say that. He, I don't think he would ever say it's all Jews. He would say though that, you know, I mean, just think about this. Like you have, like, Jews are politically organized in a way that no other group can even hope to match. And they've always been that way ever since they were living on, in, you know, lower Manhattan, running women's clothing factories and stuff. Like, they have been politically organized. They're really good at it. They, they just, they're very organized. They have an organization called the Council of Presidents of American Major American Jewish Organ Organizations that is nothing but all of the presidents of all the major American Jewish organizations that come together twice a year just to make sure that their efforts aren't overlapping, that they're not spending money on redundant things, that they know what the issues are to emphasize this year. Nobody else has anything like that, okay? And when you have something like that and people live in a country where they say, you know, the, the government really doesn't seem to be working for the people. It seems to be working for these well funded organized interest groups and well organized minority groups, whether it be corporate, corporate lobbies or whatever else. And you have this one hyper organized, extremely motivated ethnic group which again does not include all Jews, but they say they represent all Jews and they're lobbying, they're acting just directly as foreign agents for a country that, you know, again, they could get away with this for a long time, but now they're doing it for a country that has just been live streaming a genocide for two years. And when that starts to happen and ordinary people start to ask questions about it and they get stomped on by these massive, massive organizations like, you got a problem on your hands. And so for those people, you know, you go back to the early days of Zionism early 20th century, up until the 40s, like most Jews around the world, were not only not Zionist, they were anti Zionist. And they were anti Zionist not because they just thought it was so mean to go there and take it from the Palestinians or what. It wasn't about that. They were saying, you're going to go down there, you're going to do whatever it is that you have to do to get this piece of territory, and then you're going to set up a state and you're going to start doing the kinds of things that states do. You're going to start killing people, you're going to start spying on people, espionage all these things. And you're going to be over there saying you're doing it in the name of Jews around the world. And people are going to look at us and say, so what do you think about that, huh? And that's going to come back on us. And that's why they were anti Zionists. And it was only the Third Reich and World War II that changed that. But there was a lot of wisdom in that because that's what happens now, you know, like that's all in Sheldon's.
- [76:52]
C
Book, by the way, if people want to read. There's a real short primer we published at the Institute by Sheldon Richmond called Coming to Palestine, where he talks all about that history. It's really good stuff. Hey, here's another question here. This guy says he's a fan from Edmonton and he signed up for the Academy, got on substack just to subscribe to Daryl, and subscribe today is part of the problem. Cool. Great to have you, Hayden. Hope you get something out of it. And yeah, I don't know, it's funny, there are people in the chat room who are surprised to find out that I'm not a racial, religious, nationalist, I guess West. And so that makes me 72 years old or something like that. But yeah, I'm a libertarian. I, I believe in freedom, not nationalism. I'm not a collectivist and I'm not a Christian and I'm certainly not a racial collectivist.
- [77:39]
B
And I think libertarianism can only work in a nationalist context, my friend.
- [77:43]
C
Oh, please. Anyway, I see all these people in the chat room going, you have no idea what you're talking about about Nick Fuentes, where I've seen enough clips of him being horrible, way beyond, like I already said, I, I, if they were, if there were tweets in Facebook, like save posts of whatever I said when I was in my early 20s or whatever, I would Regret that. But none of that was all how much I hate black people and the Jews and all of this stuff. It was all about how I believe that it the Rockefellers are creating a one world government through the Council on Foreign Relations, which is stupid and wrong, but was not hateful toward regular people and powerless people. And so I saw, as I said earlier in this show, I saw the clip of him saying essentially climbing down. Oh, all I ever said was. But then he goes on to repeat himself anyway. And so, you know, the fact of the matter is like, for one thing, like, there's no one in this country who has accused some Jews of lying us into the Iraq war more than me, particularly David Wormser and Richard Pearl and Paul Wolfowitz and their friends. And yet I am also like, maybe the first to point out that in 2002 and 2003, American Jews, if you divide the different ethnic and religious groups, were most opposed to attacking Iraq. And you might say, okay, well that's because they're liberal Democrats. Well, fine. They weren't Ariel Sharon's men. They were not here to represent the interests of Israel at the expense of the United States of America. That was the Methodist George W. Bush and the Presbyterian Dick Cheney and the whatever he is, you know, Baptist or whatever. Donald Rumsfeld and Colin Powell and Connolly's Arise and George Tenet, they were the principals. And it was Dick Cheney and Donald Rumsfeld who hired all these neoconservatives to get their dirty work done for them. So you can blame the neocons all you want, but George W. Bush ain't Jewish and he was never a Trotskyite. He's born Episcopalian.
- [79:44]
B
You know, I think what they would say is, you know, the answer that they would give to that is that, you know, worms are faith. They didn't happen to be Jewish. They were doing this stuff because they were Jewish. And that's true, but that's not all Jews. And I think they would probably understand and admit that. You know, I think the point Nick says, when he says the problem is Jews is that those guys, they're doing that. They're not doing it just because they like war, just because they happen to think that Israel's like in the interest to the United. They're doing it because they're Jews and they have affinity for Israel. True.
- [80:18]
C
They're Zionists. You had, you have. At the exact same time you have leaders of the anti war movement were Jews too. They weren't working together with the neoconservatives. And they weren't doing what they were doing because they were Jews. They're doing what they were doing because they were anti war and anti Zionism, which is.
- [80:35]
B
I made that. I made a similar point to somebody the other day who was going through and. And listing off, you know, from just the 1960s onward how, you know, the pornography industry was basically started up and run and controlled by. By Jews. And that's true. But what I pointed out to them was Jews have been in entertainment since before there was even film. And when film came along, they were the first ones to jump in because they were already performance artists and all this kind of thing. So they started up Hollywood. And so guess what? But yeah, that's true. They were doing that. But other Jews were making a lot of the best shit that you watch, that you love and that you cheer on. And so, yeah, that's true. They're in those positions. But you can't judge all of the ones over here by what these ones over there are doing. That's all true. And I think, like, look, anybody who claims not to understand that is. Is just an unreasonable person. And I don't think most people, including Nick's audience, for the most part, are unreasonable people. I think that. That, you know, when you're. You have to think about the discrepancy in power between. It's a little different now because Nick's so big, but over the years, the discrepancy in power between people who. People like him and the people that they were fighting against on social media, getting banned by all these things. They were canceling your bank accounts. They were canceling your credit cards. They were having people show up to your house. They were writing stories about you in big media about how awful you were. And what did you have to fight back against that? Well, you know, there's one way you can get under their skin. There's only one way, in fact, and you have. You can say something nasty enough that it's gonna. It's gonna cause them to react emotionally and look like an idiot, and so they can do all those things to you. This is like the one weapon you've got against them. And so that's what people do, you know. And part of it also is, you know, part of it is just like, you know, we used to have, like, in the 1980s, like, when I was in school, elementary school. I'm not that old. You know, we had Satanists back then. Satanists, you know, like people, you know, with the makeup and, like, they're Satanists. Today we don't have Satanists. And it's not because people, like, stop believing in Satan and they believe in Satan back then. It's because that's not how you rebel anymore. That's not how you flip the bird to, you know, the adult world and all the people that are trying to control you and tell you what you can think and what you can say. That's not the way. Nobody cares if you're a Satanist anymore. They care if you're an IC Fuentes fan who's going to go out there and say a bunch of offensive shit on Twitter. That's what they care about. And that's how you. That's how you pull that off today. It's a huge part of this. And, you know, again, it doesn't excuse any of it. It's just. You have to put it in its proper context. You know, it's not always 1933. Sometimes, you know, it's just. Sometimes it's just a bunch of kids who are fighting back, you know, rhetorically on the Internet. And the only way that they're able to do it against people who have the power to actually hurt them, you know, they can say things to piss the other people off. Those other people have weapons that can actually hurt them. And so they're fighting back the way they can, you know, the way. The way young people have always done when confronted with opposition from the adult world. And, look, I'm. I'm on your side in the sense that I want to reel these guys back in. I want to put their energy to use in a way that's actually productive, in a way that I can present to my normie aunt and say that, like, look, this is a great. Like, Nick could have a. To your point, Nick could have just a rant on his show, and somebody sends me the clip, and there's nothing offensive in it. And he just nails the point better than anybody could nail it. There's a lot of people I just can't send that clip to, unfortunately, because they're going to see who it is, and they're going to know these other clips, these other things that he said, and they're just going to tune it out. And that's not what we need. We need to reach those people, too, in the same way that I tell those people we got to reach these kids. And I know they're not all kids anymore. You know, everybody's a kid to me. I'm 44. But, like, you know, we got to talk to all of these people, all of the people who think that we should put this country first, that we should be concerned with maintaining our rights, our right to speak our mind, to live our lives the way we want to, okay, in this country, the way we always have, and to control our own fate as a people, okay? Those people come in a lot of different flavors. You know, they're not all going to think like you on every issue. And you can't be throwing up barriers that make it impossible for them to come over to your side. You have to, like, provide an entry point for those people. And that goes to the other side too, you know, for the people who are offended by a lot of the Griper stuff and like a lot of their rhetoric, it goes to, you have to find ways to bring people together on, on those issues, the people who are on side on the major issue that matters, you know?
- [85:17]
C
Yeah, no, I agree with that. And look, I take my own part of the responsibility for this. Back when I should have been ditching radio and going full into being a YouTube host, I decided to quit and write books and that no one reads and like, go away.
- [85:31]
B
I read them. We all read them.
- [85:34]
C
I only am restarting my, my own show as a, as a video show now. And it's still just interviews. I, I haven't had an opportunity to, to get a good thing going. But I'm old now. Back when I was a young firebrand, things were, were different. But me, a lot of other libertarians, and look, I gotta blame Rand Paul. This is all Rand Paul's fault. Rand Paul got elected on his father's coattails, on dollar support from his father's supporters. And the entire idea in the mind of his supporters was young Ron in the Senate. Man, this is going to be great. And then as soon as he got there, he took the mantle of libertarianism and he threw it down and he said, don't ever ask me about my father's opinions about anything. Don't ever call me a libertarian. Don't ask me about gold money, don't ask me about peace. I'll let you know when I have something to say about something. And told all of Ron Paulianism to go and screw off. But we had no other national leader at all. We had Ron, who's the greatest American ever, and then we had nobody. And now we got Dave. And Dave's great, but Dave's a comedian and he's not a politician and he's not ever going to be a politician. And we got Thomas Massie and he's really good on so Many things. But for whatever reason, he lacks the right kind of leadership quality to really inspire movement. Even the way that Ron Paul did. You know, people's devotion to Ron Paul is, you know, it was born from a sincerity that he brought that for whatever reason, it doesn't quite work with Massey, but we need 10 Ron Paul's right now and we just don't have enough. We need, you know, we need Justin and Lou and, and all the people who are. Who. I mean, Justin's dead, Lou is old and retired, you know, basically semi retired now. And, and we just need a lot more libertarian leaders. So that. Because, yeah, I don't think nationalism is the solution. I think nationalism is going to buy you all the same economic problems that that socialism is going to bring you. And then, you know, as Mises says, the middle of the road leads to socialism. The more you screw up the markets, the more you're going to ask the government to screw them up even more to try to help you. It's the same old road to serfdom. If you've never read Hayek, we've seen this thing before.
- [87:40]
B
It goes, if you're gonna say we want liberty, you have to know who we is, man. Anyway, we got to get to this question. Ryan, first of all, I know you didn't pay for a super chat thingy or whatever, but Islamicacha or Jack Della Maddalena. I'm not picking against Islam until he loses, but I wouldn't be particularly surprised if Jack knocked him out. Meltdown asks. I will support anyone who will help save our country. And I'll throw this one to you. Scott, what do you think of the Heritage CEO groveling after defending Tucker?
- [88:09]
C
Somebody with some money must have got to him, right? I. Look, I mean, this is what we were talking about last week was how great it was that he came out and defended Tucker. Well, now, so much for that. But then look again, it's the great crack up, up. Sorry to be repetitive. I know I probably said this last week and I said this on some other shows, but it's happening on the Democratic side and the Republican side too, where it's just. And it wasn't like this before, particularly because of Christian Zionism and that influence, but just more and more and more you're gonna have it where it's just the people versus the party owners and rulers, and that's going to lead to a hell of a crack up. And I don't know exactly, you know, how bad it's going to be. I think it'll be worse on the Democratic side. Well one on one hand they're such cowards and they just go along with their leadership most of the time and all that. But then again they are so much more fed up with Israel than the right is right now. But then on the right it's getting more and more that way. And then like you said, but geez, nothing changes in Washington at all when public opinion in the country is shifting hard. But it's just like stretching a rubber band or whatever, right? Like at some point the thing's gonna snap. And so I don't know what it's going to look like, but there's a huge crack up coming. I mean Zionism's name is mud. Nobody believes in supporting the Israelis anymore. And I look, I've been doing this for a very long time and I learned back, I don't know, in late Bush years, I guess that if you just explain to the average American who's occupying who over there, they immediately side with the Palestinians. The only reason they side with the Israelis is they think the Israelis are suffering under Palestinian occupation. They're just full of it. They're just told nothing. But if not outright lies, then confusion and wool over their eyes about was the situation over there. Oh, the terrorists are trying to extort land. They won't give the poor Israelis peace until the Israelis give up some of their land to them. It's such a terrible situation. Just, you know what I mean? They just turn it completely Frank Luntz upside down and backwards as per, you know, focus group practice and but once you tell people the truth about Israel, the spell is broken and, and then unfixable. And so things are changing very rapidly. And I think, you know, it's the silver lining on the Gaza holocaust of the last two years is that it's just they went way too far this time. There's nothing that they can do to win people back.
- [90:25]
B
Now I don't think my take on the heritage struggle session, and we'll probably have to wrap it up after this one I guess is just two, two points. One is that Kevin Roberts just, he did the worst possible, he did the worst possible thing that he could have done where the people who are mad at him are never going to forgive him and now the rest of us aren't either. So congratulations, you alienated absolutely everybody for no purpose whatsoever. But then the second point that I'll make is that this is just another example of how self destructively arrogant these people are. Like people see that and the first thing that comes into a reasonable person's head is who else could possibly put the leader of the Heritage for Foundation through a struggle session like this? Tucker, like nobody else. Nobody else. There's 40 million black Americans in the country. They're pretty well organized. There's a pretty, like, large organizational infrastructure. They couldn't make him grovel like that, right. And walk that walk back. The support of his friend or somebody who he claims to be a friend of, you know, Tucker, they couldn't make him do that. There's only one group that could make somebody like him do that. And that's the first thing that comes into everybody's head. And it reinforces that idea that they're saying you're not allowed to think is the one that they're injecting into your brain.
- [91:42]
C
You know, the one guy said in that clip, I didn't see the whole thing, but I saw one clip where the guy said, geez. But Tucker said, if you serve in a foreign military, then you should be stripped of your citizenship. But that's me.
- [91:54]
B
He said, the citizenship oath.
- [91:58]
C
And the guy, you know. Yeah, it's. It's getting pretty blatant, man. It's really something. By the way, I just. Whatever. I. I shouldn't be so peripheral in my. In my chat room vision. Screw you guys. But people keep saying, oh, clips. Oh, we saw clips. I saw very long clips of Nick Fuentes posted by people who love him more than you kooks do, Okay? I didn't see a montage cut up by people who hate him of all of his worst hits. Did I say that? No, that's not what I said. I saw very long clips by his little butt buddies, just like you people, and I wasn't very impressed. Okay, tough. And I saw one guy go, oh, you're gonna lose a lot of viewers after this. Yeah, suck my balls, Kyle.
- [92:46]
B
Well, I mean, as somebody who has heard. I've seen the clips from many of his enemies before, I'm a little bit sympathetic to that argument, but, I mean.
- [92:55]
C
Look, I haven't even seen those. I haven't seen the montages of, like, his worst hits.
- [92:59]
B
I haven't heard of them. Look, he. What we have to say, like, what is possible? What is it that we can actually work with here? And, you know, he. He's got 10 years, since he was a kid, in total, total war with these people, of him saying all of these things in total war mode to an audience that is used to hearing things in vulgar terms, you know, and just radically offensive terms as, like, the sort of coin of the realm. And that's all on the record now. And it's all out there. You're never going to get that guy nor I think would we even want him to come out and repudiate everything and say I'm so sorry. Because then he's not going to be able to talk to the people that he's talking to right now. They'll go find somebody else who will keep talking to them that way. What we can do is get a guy like that to say, you know, I'm 27 now, I'm not an 18 year old gamer kid anymore. I still think all these things, but maybe I'm going to, you know. Yeah, I said a lot of this stuff. Congratulations, you've got a record of every horrible thing I've ever said since I was 18 years old. But I'm not talking like that now. Now what I'm saying is this, this and this. That's I think a big enough and I will absolutely take that.
- [94:08]
C
Yeah, and that was actually the clip I saw yesterday where that was, was what he was basically saying. But then he, as I said, he still went on about his whole thing about the Jews anyway, but essentially, yeah, that was what he was saying. And, and he also said, and this part, I like this sound. This might sound pretty extreme to virgin ears or whatever, but I liked the part actually where he said, oh, Hitler, Hitler, Hitler, Hitler, Hitler. That was a long time ago. And that word has no power here, right? So it was sort of like when that guy Gnome Dwarman said do you disavow Candace Owens? And I said, no, I hereby avow Candace Owens everything she's ever said or ever will say, Screw you, dude, you know what I mean? And so now what are you gonna do? You want to try to beat me over the head with Candace anymore? It ain't gonna work. I already staked out my position on that.
- [94:54]
B
Right.
- [94:54]
C
And so he's sort of saying, look, whatever Hitler thing happened 200 years ago or whatever, who cares? Has nothing to do with that. And, and I think he correctly said, if anyone ever says anything critical about organized Jewish power in America or about Zionism or about Israel, then they say Hitler, Hitler, Hitler and shut that down. And so what he's saying is like, no, I'm going to go ahead and wear that word out. You guys are with you guys, you've worn it out and it just has no power over me or my people. We're just going to say whatever we want. And that part was Good. And then he went off on the thing about the Jews. This is like, okay, dude, well, so which is it then? You know what I mean? Like, you're either the caricature that they claim that you are Orient, you know, I don't know.
- [95:44]
B
All right. But anyway, I think we should probably wrap it up. I don't want to. I don't want to get everyone.
- [95:49]
C
Go watch Keith Knight shred Jim Holland on the zero hedge debate, World War II debate that took place last night. I'll tweet it out here in a minute if you want to look at it.
- [96:00]
B
Cool.
- [96:01]
C
Very good.
- [96:02]
B
Later, everybody. This has been Provoked with Daryl Cooper and Scott Horton. Be sure to like and subscribe to help us beat the propaganda algorithm. Go follow at Provoked Underscore show on.
- [96:20]
C
X and YouTube and tune in next.
- [96:23]
B
Time for more Provoked.
- [96:33]
A
If you're a podcast host, listen up. This one's for you. My name is Ali Jackson. I'm the host of Finding Mr. Height, a dating and relationship podcast that I've been doing for four years now, sharing my positive and practical approach to dating that's built on my own life experience. And I wanted to share another experience that I've had. My secret behind monetizing my show. It's called Red Circle, and I was just telling my colleague about how much I love their platform. With Red Circle, not only am I getting a seamless hosting experience, but I also love the support I receive in ad sales. It's not just typical ad sales either. It's targeted opportunities based on my show and my life. And the platform is super simple. You just set your preferences and Red Circle matches you with sponsors that align with your show. You can vet every opportunity, and their platform gives you great analytics. More recently, too, my Red Circle team has brought me opportunities outside of my podcast on social media to really augment the podcast partnerships. Bring them full circle. I just can't recommend them enough. If you want to give it a try, go to red circle.com to get your free trial. That's redcircle.com for a free trial.