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- [00:01]
Degree Advertiser
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- [00:32]
Mike Wilbon
Pardon the interruption, but I'm Mike Wilbon. It's International Dance Day, Tony, and sadly, I think we all know what this means.
- [00:41]
Tony Kornheiser
I'm Tony Kornheiser. Penguin Dance. Hit it, boys. Hit it to the side and back to the front. And slow it down and speed it up. People love the Penguin Dance, Wilbaugh.
- [00:56]
Mike Wilbon
They love it. Did you miss a calling when you were younger? Should you have been a vaudevill song and dance man or something in an earlier life?
- [01:06]
Tony Kornheiser
Yeah, I'm old enough to have been in vaudeville, I guess, but I don't know that the Penguin Dance would have worked in all the.
- [01:12]
Mike Wilbon
Vaudeville.
- [01:13]
Tony Kornheiser
Vaudeville, Honky troubles? Not sure. Welcome to pti, boys and girls. In today's episode, the Cavs roll. The Rockies do not rock. And P.K. subban joins us for five good minutes. But we begin today with Golden State beating Houston last night behind a big fourth quarter by Jimmy Butler, who had 14 of his 27 points in the fourth. The warriors have now taken a 3 to 1 lead in the series against two seed in the West. Wilbon, you were there. What stood out to you most about last night's result, Tony, is sort of.
- [01:43]
Mike Wilbon
The difference of the teams physically. You start with that, I start with it. I can't get over it. How the Houston Rockets are just young. They're like not acrobats like trapeze artists. They're just flying around the court. They can get to the basket at will almost whenever they want to. They did it seven possessions in a row to wipe out a deficit and get the lead late in the game. And yet the warriors just keep going about their business. And Houston ultimately does not know yet enough or know how to beat a team. We, we make a lot of physical attributes when we talk about sports, even the greatest of teams when it's the intellectual attributes that usually set them apart. And so with Steph Curry, Draymond Green and Jimmy Butler to start it, and Steve Kerr, they just know how to do what they do. And so Draymond Green, after the game, even took me through sort of how he has to guard much larger players, 6'ten 6'11 guys at 6'5 and how he does this. And even though just the know how the warriors are just a treasure trove. Okay, here's what we have to do in the moment to win this game. Even though they are like drones, they are flying all around the arena, the Rockets, and they do it. And even with that, it's a physical play. Jimmy Butler, who can barely move for three quarters, figured out how to get himself some motion in the fourth. And he goes up above everybody, like Wilt to grab the important rebound of the game. And then afterward, like, you know, couldn't even walk. And you're like, my goodness, this is a championship team. Houston doesn't know enough. They may get there one day soon, but they're not there yet.
- [03:27]
Tony Kornheiser
I don't want to disagree with anything he said. I want to go in a different direction. Mike. I am conflicted and I'm conflicted over Jimmy Butler. I realize that Jimmy Butler is a great player. You don't call someone playoff Jimmy for nothing. He gets to the line more than anybody. He wins games. I appreciate that Jimmy Butler wins games, but I really think that he left the Heat for dead. I mean, he just walked out on a team that he had played for for years. His rampant egomania and his selfishness, it crippled that team. So I can't bring myself to root for Jimmy Butler, though. I think he's a great player and I like to root for the Warriors. I just. I don't know what to do here because I can see, look, they're 27 and 9 since they got him. He has made all the difference in the world. But I don't want to condone Mike, you know, the way that he got there. And you're totally right about Houston. Houston and Detroit are going to be great teams at some point that their time isn't now. Oklahoma City's time is now. They did this before Houston and Detroit. So that's my point.
- [04:45]
Mike Wilbon
Let me just say this about Jimmy. Let me say this about Jimmy Butler. The leagues, all leagues, are full of teams, management who get rid of players all the time. They run them out. And so I'm not going to have any angst because Jimmy Butler said, oh, no, I want to leave. Teams have spent 150 years in American sports throwing players the hell off of teams despite whatever promises they made. And so Jimmy Butler got the best of this one I'm fine with that. I don't have your angst. And I do root for the warriors. And I root for the warriors because of those four guys I named earlier. And I marvel that they are together now and doing what they do. I do it. I hope they keep winning. And, you know, Butler's one of my favorite players ever, ever, ever, ever end a day. So we're on the opposite side of that train.
- [05:32]
Tony Kornheiser
I'm on.
- [05:33]
Mike Wilbon
Let's move to the Cavs. And they're very cavalier. Sweep of the Heat. Cleveland beat Miami in Miami by 55. And the Cavs were playing without all star point guard Darius Garland. The bam out of bio of the Heat said after the game, quote, there's going to be a lot of changes this summer. Understanding how the guy with the silver hair works. Close quote. Tony, you know the guy with the silver hair. You know him and who he is. Does this series tell you more about the Cavs or his Heat?
- [06:09]
Tony Kornheiser
So here I am again. Cleveland is a wonderful team. They may very well be a championship team. They manhandled Miami in this. Now, Mike, you know that I believe that a 1 seed should always sweep a play in 8, which is exactly what they did. Right? But my. My heart goes out to Miami, and it's about Jimmy Butler, who left them for dead on the side of the road. They had no chance. They had no chance last night at all. I watched that game until I couldn't stand it anymore. It's 35. Eight in the first quarter, Mike. 35 to eight. It's a brutal watch at that point. Is Miami a better team than that with Jimmy Butler? They're a much better team than that with Jimmy Butler. A couple of years ago, they made the NBA Finals, and it's essentially the same team that's out there now. So do I think that Pat Riley and Eric Spoelstra don't know what they're doing? Come on. Of course they know what they're doing. But that was a brutal watch last night, and maybe changes have to be made. I just. I just think that at the core of it is Jimmy Butler walking out on. I do.
- [07:21]
Mike Wilbon
Tony. I'm going to go back to the Pat Riley part of this because I got this great text last night, like us, and I'm sitting. I'm in the warriors game, but I'm watching this at 30. That's just the score you named. And I'm like, what is going on here, Tony? Players from the other teams are like, whoa. And a large part of that is because Miami. People look at Miami and marvel at them often. You know, admire them often fear them, sometimes respect them all the time. Because of Pat Riley. Yes, Pat Riley and Eric Spoelstra and the Croup. But Pat Riley and the great Bob Ryan texted me during this. And Ryan, of course, has been following Pat Riley for Pat Riley's whole life in basketball, which is, you know, almost 60 years. And Ryan's text said, how does Pat Riley feel about watching his team get trumped by 37 and then 55 points? And so to me, we'll get to Cleveland. You're right. And I'll give you credit because you've been all year, you've been saying, cleveland, Cleveland, Cleveland, pay more attention. And I've been saying, I don't know. But, Tony, I'm wondering, what is Miami going to do Because Pat Riley doesn't take these things. You love Pat Riley. I know how much you respect him as a. As an executive, as a coach, before that. Like, how does that. Like, what is he going to do next?
- [08:39]
Tony Kornheiser
Miami just lost at home by 37 and 55. That's never happened before. Miami was swept by a total of 122 points. That has never happened before. They were down last night by 60. You want to buy a ticket to that? Let's move to baseball. The Colorado Rockies lost again last night at home to the Braves. Colorado has now lost seven in a row. They are a major league worst, 4 and 24 on the season. That is the worst start in National League history. The Rockies are on pace to go hold on now. 23 and 139. Wilbon. At what point does the performance of the Rockies become a problem for baseball?
- [09:19]
Mike Wilbon
No point. No point at all. This was just done last year by a franchise that's three times older, maybe four than the Rockies. The White Sox, who've been around since, like, the 1880s. It did, you know, it mattered a little bit with them because they've been around so long and you have generations of fans. You don't have that with the Rockies. I'm sorry, I'm not a guy who talks about flyover states because I grew up in one of them. So, no, this isn't the Dodgers or the Giants. It isn't the Yankees. It isn't the Cubs or the Red Sox. It's not even the Braves, who were once on a superstation when that kind of thing existed in America. It isn't. And if it's even the A's who have played themselves from Philadelphia to Kansas City to Oakland to now obscurity. It isn't. It is the Colorado Rockies. And nobody knows anything about the Rockies unless they live in the fourth time zone. It doesn't matter. Couldn't matter. It isn't. Doesn't.
- [10:14]
Tony Kornheiser
I agree with all of that sentiment. I will say, however, that the future of the Rockies is bleak. At the moment, they are in the hardest division in. In all of baseball, the National League West. Yeah, this number is amazing. 45 of their remaining 134 games, just 45 of them are against teams that now have a losing record. They didn't just start losing this year, Mike. This is endemic. They have lost. This is their. This will be their seventh straight losing season. They put three 90 plus losses back to back to back and now they're working on a third probable hundred loss season. So I mean, if you look at the metrics, they're worst in baseball in pitching, in hitting, and in defense. That's all there is. And their farm system stinks. So I'll just take 20 more seconds. Bud Black's been there since 2017, made the playoffs early, but all these losses are on his resume. Their general manager, believe his name is Bill Schmidt, got there in 2021, has never had a winning season. And if you can't put a farm system together, what are you doing? And you hate to say this because it's about jobs, but sometimes you have to make changes for change sake. Because there's no long game here. There's no long game. Let's take a break. Coming up, the Florida Panthers play very edgy hockey and we will ask PK Suban about that.
- [11:39]
Mike Wilbon
We'll also ask him why jets star goalie Connor Hellebuck suddenly struggling. Struggling not as badly as the Rockies. Because these are Vezenatrol women.
- [11:51]
Tony Kornheiser
No, they're terrible. You're right about the white socks. The white socks were historically bad. And nobody said get rid of the frame.
- [11:58]
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- [13:07]
AutoZone Advertiser
Welcome to AutoZone. What are you working on today?
- [13:10]
Mike Wilbon
My car is making this noise. Sometimes it's like and sometimes it's like.
- [13:15]
AutoZone Advertiser
Do you have a dash light on?
- [13:16]
Mike Wilbon
Oh yeah.
- [13:17]
AutoZone Advertiser
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- [13:27]
Mike Wilbon
So you don't need to hear the.
- [13:30]
AutoZone Advertiser
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- [13:33]
HIMS Advertiser
You don't get in the zone.
- [13:35]
AutoZone Advertiser
Auto zone restrictions apply.
- [13:42]
Tony Kornheiser
Let's dig into the Stanley cup playoffs with our great friend ESPN hockey analyst PK Subban. Let's start with this. Aaron Eckblad of the Panthers laid out Brandon Hagel of the Lightning last night. Nothing was called at the time. The Panthers PK play with an aggression that seems like it can destabilize an opponent. How much of an edge is that?
- [14:04]
PK Subban
Oh, definitely. And it can also destabilize parts of your body depending on where they're hitting you. This is very consistent with how they play. It's a pack mentality. I watched Matthew Tkachuk all last game quietly go about his business. It wasn't all over the TV screen. He didn't make a lot of noise, but every time he had a chance to put a lick on Jake Gensel, every time he had a chance to cross check him, every time he had a chance to bump him, he did it. And I watched it specifically. It wasn't something that was talked about, but this is how they play. They play on the edge and they're okay with it going over the edge every now and then. That's playoff hockey as far as I'm concerned.
- [14:42]
Mike Wilbon
Wow. Pk let's move to a series. I'm personally more interested in the Oilers and the Kings back on the ice in Los Angeles again. The Oilers have tied this series 2 2, but they get off to these excruciatingly slow starts and only seem to be able to pull themselves together late. What is up with that and is that sustainable?
- [15:02]
PK Subban
Well, they scored seven goals in the third period of both the last two games and comeback wins out of those seven goals. Five of those goals were with the man advantage, two were power play, two were empty netters, and one, I think, was with the goal he pulled. So what does that say about the Edmonton Oilers? You can't go down a man. You can't be at a disadvantage against them. They're too skilled and too experienced. For the LA Kings that are trying to pull off a tough feat, eliminating the best player that the game has potentially seen in the last two decades or beyond, eliminating him in the playoffs in the prime of his career is no easy feat. If they thought they were going to do that in four or five games, I would have said, guys, I don't know what you're drinking out in la, but it ain't happening in four or five. They know this thing's going to be tough. They got to take care of business at home. It's business as usual. Jim Hiller has every reason to be, you know, a little bit upset. They've had two great opportunities to put this team away, but it's a part of their learning process for those young players. You see Quinton by field, that's not a mistake. That's a routine play when he's trying to get that puck out of the zone, just happens to hit a stick. Those are the things that you learn when you're becoming a championship team. And I don't have to say that on the air. I know Drew Doughty, Anse Kopitar, the veterans of in that locker room are getting this group ready to finish off what they started, and that's to beat this team. I still think they have a good enough team to do it. But make no doubt about it, if they're going to be taking penalties, if they're going to put themselves in odd mad situations, you're giving the best player in the world opportunities, and you can't give them any.
- [16:31]
Mike Wilbon
One of the mysteries so far the playoffs is Connor Hellebuk struggling and being pulled a couple of times. And I know that series, you know, Winnipeg and the Blues are tied at 2. Is tied at 2, PK. But what's wrong with Hellebuck? I mean, we're not used to seeing him struggle like this.
- [16:49]
PK Subban
Well, listen, Conor Hellebuk, he's got two Vezinas. I've said it before, he's probably going to win his third this year. But you know, when people talk about him, not I listen to Scott O'Neill saying, Listen, we got to play better in front of him. But I watched Sergey Bobrovsky last year in the playoffs lead his team, take on the number one power play. I don't care about the numbers. Connor McDavid and the Edmonton Oilers have the most deadly power play in the league. When the game's on the line. He took that on. He went the Stanley Cup. I watched Igor Shisterkin for multiple years take a defenseless team. I don't care what anybody says in New York, the Rangers have been bad defensively for a lot of years. For the past couple years, Shisterkin has carried that load. So for me, Conor Hellebuyck has always been a great goaltender, structured goaltender, played in a great situation. He's got to make second and third saves. He's got to make some impossible saves. I'm not saying all the goals are his fault, but I have to look at the highlight reel and say Connor Hellebuck stole that game for them last night and he still has to do that in this. If he can do that, I think they'll like the results when it's all said and done. But he's got to steal a couple games. He's got to make a couple impossible saves.
- [17:56]
Tony Kornheiser
Let's get you out of here on this. There are two games tonight the Maple Leafs can close out. The Senators and the Wild and Vegas face off tied at two games each. Pk, which game is more intriguing to you?
- [18:09]
PK Subban
I would like to say Toronto and Ottawa. Just as a hometown guy, you know, because we know this, we know Toronto's got to end this tonight. They don't want to go back to OTT. Could be saying to game 7 and with everything going on in Toronto, they don't need that. Their big guy's got to come up big again. But for me it's the Vegas game because Kirill the Thrill Capri Sav. This guy is, as advertised, eight points leads the series. Four goals, four assists leads both teams. And a dominant force on both sides of the puck. Vegas is in trouble. They got to get to their A game and they got to shut down that line. I said it yesterday, I'm going to say it again. Caprisov and Matt Boldy, that three headed monster that they got. Joel Erickson, number one line. They gotta get those guys on a leash. Tony Wilbon, they gotta get them on a leash and fast. Tonight if they don't, they're in trouble. Those guys are lethal. Lethal.
- [19:01]
Tony Kornheiser
That reminds me, I gotta get my dog on a leash in a little while as well. Pk, it's such a great pleasure to have you because you're so enthusiastic. Thank you.
- [19:09]
PK Subban
Love you guys. Thanks Tony. Thanks Wilbon.
- [19:13]
Tony Kornheiser
Tonight's doubleheader starts at 7 Eastern. Let's take one last break. Still to come, the NBA says it is considering yet another new All Star Game format.
- [19:23]
Mike Wilbon
Please. Brandon Nemo puts up some big numbers against Tony's Natnils. Uh oh. What's going on? That was tough, huh?
- [19:32]
Tony Kornheiser
Well, their bullpen is no good and then they put in, you know, a position player, Rosario. And then you shouldn't do that. That's shameful. No, no. You have pitchers. Put in a relief pitcher. Put in a real pitcher.
- [19:43]
Mike Wilbon
Not somebody who waste your bullpen plays 20 to 5 or whatever it is.
- [19:50]
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- [20:21]
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- [20:53]
Tony Kornheiser
Happy time people. Happy 32nd birthday, Justin Thomas. Thomas is coming off his first win in almost three years when he earned by draining a 21 foot birdie putt in a playoff at Hilton Head. Thomas hadn't won since taking the PGA Championship in 2022. He'd also won the PGA in 2007 at Quail Hollow in Charlotte. And what do you know? That major at that course is coming up again in two weeks. Thomas also has two runners up this season and credits improved putting thanks to a three hour lesson he got from Xander Schauffle at the end of last season.
- [21:29]
Mike Wilbon
Well, see, that's part of the problem. Not that it's a problem. But Schauffle, he's part of a generation of terrific young players who are his peers and he's competing with, including Rory, who owns Quail Hollow too. So I don't know what to think. But wow, it's cool to have JT back in the winner's circle and viable.
- [21:48]
Tony Kornheiser
Happy anniversary, Bo Jackson. On this day 39 years ago, the Tampa Bay Buccaneers selected Jackson with the first pick in the NFL draft despite Jackson having vowed never to play for them. Jackson was upset with the team because it told him that a pre draft visit had been cleared by the SEC when it hadn't, and that cost him his amateur status in baseball. Jackson believes the Bucks purposely sabotaged his baseball career and reportedly told them, quote, draft me if you want. You're going to waste a draft pick, I can promise you that. Jackson, in fact, never played a down for the Bucks, who ultimately forfeited his rights.
- [22:26]
Mike Wilbon
This is what I was talking about earlier. Players have been on the short end of this stuff for 140 years, so. And I'm not saying that that was the case with Jimmy Butler in Miami. But what Bo Jackson experienced, he wasn't alone.
- [22:40]
Tony Kornheiser
Happy trails to the leadoff spot for Jose Altuve. The Astros star has to be dropped one spot to second in the order because the time it takes for him to run in from left field during home games cuts into his preparation time for his first at bat. This is Altuve's first season playing left after 14 years at second and he explained, quote, I just need like 10 seconds more. Unquote. Altuve took to the two hole last night, went two for four, including a two run homer in the six as the Astros beat the Tigers eight to five.
- [23:12]
Mike Wilbon
Tony, I know people hearing this are going to think these guys are crazy. 10 seconds. But they're not. The detail with which they go about their lives and their professional lives in every single act on a field or court. You and I have covered a lot of sports in our lives. We're not talking about superstition. This matters to them at a level that most people can't realize, which is why they make tens of millions of dollars in a lot of cases like Altuvez.
- [23:37]
Tony Kornheiser
He's a Hall of Famer. If he wants a bat, second, bat him second. Big finish. Sacramento Kings will reportedly elevate Doug Christie from interim head coach to the real deal. Okay with you?
- [23:49]
Mike Wilbon
Yeah. Doug Christie was 27, 24 in that interim time. It was kind of a bad finish, 7 and 13 in the last 20, but he seems deserving He's a Kings guy. George Kittle agreed to a four year extension with the Niners. Is that deserved?
- [24:03]
Tony Kornheiser
It's a great tight end. Of course it is. Adam Silver says the NBA is considering USA versus the world options for next year's All Star Game. I believe you have that.
- [24:12]
Mike Wilbon
Yeah, I've had it for 10 years. Let's see some action. Brandon Nimmel had a great slamming nine runs batted in for the Mets against the Nats last night. How'd that taste?
- [24:22]
Tony Kornheiser
Didn't taste that great. Nats bullpen is horrific. Let me say that again. Horrific. Last one four NBA playoff games tonight. What's the most intriguing?
- [24:31]
Mike Wilbon
Clippers Nuggets. Tony. Clippers Nuggets is the series that's 2 2. And it has the. I don't know, the background for the most drama. The promise for the most drama. Coming up.
- [24:42]
Tony Kornheiser
We're out of time. We will try and do better the next time. Happy 90th film and happy graduation. Aiden Coffey. Gator Chop, baby.
- [24:51]
Mike Wilbon
I'm Mike Wilbon. Same time tomorrow. Knuckleheads.
- [24:57]
ABC News Advertiser
Rapper Sean Diddy Combs was a king maker. He had wealth, fame and power.
- [25:03]
Mike Wilbon
What's up?
- [25:03]
PK Subban
Welcome to New York.
- [25:05]
ABC News Advertiser
Until it all came crashing down.
- [25:07]
LinkedIn Advertiser
Federal investigators raiding two homes owned by hip hop mogul Sean Diddy Combs.
- [25:12]
ABC News Advertiser
I'm Brian Buckmire, an ABC News legal contributor. As Diddy heads to trial, we trace his remarkable rise and fall. And what could be next? Listen to Bad Rap the Case Against Diddy, a new series from ABC Audio. Listen now, wherever you get your podcasts.