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Mike Wilbon
Pardon the interruption. What? I'm Mike Loebleine. It's International Museum Daytone. What's your favorite museum?
Tony Kornheiser
I'm Tony Kornheiser. It used to be the Louvre, but I haven't been back since we helped ourselves to those crown jewels up top.
Mike Wilbon
Have those been fenced fully?
Tony Kornheiser
Not fully.
Mike Wilbon
Not fully.
Tony Kornheiser
Okay. Not fully.
Mike Wilbon
Some stash held back. Okay. It is the Louvre. It's the Louvre for me.
Tony Kornheiser
Is it for you?
Mike Wilbon
Yeah.
Tony Kornheiser
Yeah. Did you see the Mona Lisa when you were there? The stand on line. It's this big.
Mike Wilbon
It's this big.
Tony Kornheiser
It's this big postage stand, people. It's one of the big surprises of my life, how small it is. Welcome to pti, boys and Girl. On today's episode, the Cavs trounce the Pistons. The Canadiens and Sabres go to game seven and Aaron Ride wins the PGA Championship. But we begin today with the San Antonio spurs taking on the defending NBA champion Oklahoma City Thunder in the Western Conference finals beginning in about three hours in Oklahoma City. Over the weekend, the spurs crushed the Minnesota Timberwolves in Minnesota by 30 points to get to this series. Oklahoma City has been resting for the last full week after sweeping the Lakers. Wilbon, do you give the Spurs a big chance, a little chance or no chance to win this series?
Mike Wilbon
I give him a big chance. I can't wait for this series to start. I, I, I give him a big chance. Not as big a chance as you.
Tony Kornheiser
That's right.
Mike Wilbon
Let me give you some credit. First thing to start out Monday, you said at the beginning of the playoffs, Cavaliers, Spurs. That's right. You're still alive.
Tony Kornheiser
I'm still alive. I'm still alive.
Mike Wilbon
You may be the only person that has that combination.
Tony Kornheiser
Still alive.
Mike Wilbon
Yeah, but you're alive.
Tony Kornheiser
Good, Good.
Mike Wilbon
Well, good. It's a big. They got a big chance. Wembanyama's that good, and the team is that good. And you know, my reservation is that before anyone ascends fully, they have to have heartache. That's right. They have to have despair.
Tony Kornheiser
I'll get to that.
Mike Wilbon
But when Banyama and Harper is coming along and Castle's already along, Cassel, to me, is going to be the new SGA at some point. I really mean that. And while I'm picking Oklahoma City, and I think Oklahoma City is great and may be included with the great teams of ForeverVantage, I'm going to go with Oklahoma City, but narrowly so.
Tony Kornheiser
I am going to pick San Antonio. I know.
Mike Wilbon
I can't even say.
Tony Kornheiser
As you know, for the last three months or so, I've told you, I think that they are going to win the NBA Championship. Oklahoma City. I think they're right there with Oklahoma City. The decisive point for me is that they beat Oklahoma City four out of five times in the regular season. Let me consult my notes here. I know that you like to say that heartache is necessary before one ascends despair. And my reaction to that is, why is that true for a young team? Did you know that Oklahoma City is the third youngest team even now in the league, younger than San Antonio.
Mike Wilbon
But they had that moment of despair which helped propel.
Tony Kornheiser
I'm just going to say to you that I don't necessarily believe that because in this point, San Antonio is older than they are and they don't have to lose to a younger team. San Antonio, those four games. Let me give you the numbers on those four games. 111, 130, 117 and 116. In those four wins, that's an average of 119 points. Oklahoma City, including those games, only gave up 108 points per game, second in the league. San Antonio owned them, Mike. They own them this year. Maybe that's a harbinger of something to come. Now.
Mike Wilbon
I, I, I just think it's to come, like next year.
Tony Kornheiser
Okay, maybe. But Wembanyama makes a difference. As you've said, when Benyama makes a difference, he's going to go up against a guy not as tall as he is, a young guy drafted the year before. And I think everybody wants to see Holmgren in Wembanyama.
Mike Wilbon
I don't like each other.
Tony Kornheiser
I think they want to see that. I do. I do.
Mike Wilbon
I'm just going to remind you of something. You, you, you've covered the league longer, longer than me. You sat in those locker rooms and watched despair in many of those cases I described.
Tony Kornheiser
But I don't think it's an automatic.
Mike Wilbon
Guys are gonna skip the step.
Tony Kornheiser
I just, I don't think it's an automatic. You know, I don't. You base everything on Michael Jordan's career.
Mike Wilbon
No, Michael Jordan gotta had despair. Okay? Shaq and Kobe had despair. The only three people who had no despair, Magic Johnson, Magic Duncan.
Tony Kornheiser
Yeah, no despair.
Mike Wilbon
That's it.
Tony Kornheiser
So everybody else, that's the exception to your rule. But three exceptions is a lot. Let's stay with the NBA. Let's move to Cleveland, routing Detroit last night in Detroit by 31 points to win that series and get to face the Knicks in the Eastern Conference finals. The road teams won the last three games of this series. The Pistons had won four straight elimination games over Orlando and Cleveland, but they didn't win this one. Wilbon, what was the word for this game?
Mike Wilbon
Futuristic. There's a trend. I'm thinking about the margin more than the result. The margin, which is. You and I talked about this in your podcast this morning. I'm going to talk about this game. Yeah, but the three games at the end and other series having these kinds of games and Tony, I think it's mostly because of the three point shot. Maybe not entirely. This is why Steve Kerr has to be listened to. Steve Kerr's smartest man in basketball. Because a three point shot, you go on a four basket run and, and it used to not kill you. What it does now is it sends the other team into desperation and it sends them into some frenzy that then makes an 11 point lead 19 and makes it 24 and there's no recovery. So it's weird. But, but, but, but Cleveland. And again, giving you credit, Cleveland's a better team. What I wonder about Cleveland is why aren't you people better? Not to be that good as last night, but you got stars, you got vets, you got.
Tony Kornheiser
You said that side, Mobley, Allen, you said about Orlando. Why aren't you people better?
Mike Wilbon
Yes, because some.
Tony Kornheiser
This is when it pays off. The playoffs is when it pays off.
Mike Wilbon
Okay, but they should be better in the play. I don't even think they should be in these sevens. Allen, by the way, has played really well. Allen and Mobley, they're big guys.
Tony Kornheiser
They're big guys.
Mike Wilbon
But you know what? As much as we talk about the spectacular guards and they are, they are. They can put up 50 on you. Yeah, that's right. Those two guys, when they play with force like they did against Detroit when necessary, they, they can give the Knicks some problems and they got to deal
Tony Kornheiser
with Kat, I'm going to come off your point here. I am very disappointed in the playoffs. It's like 75% of the games are routes. I have some numbers here. This series was weird because the road team won the Last three games. Yeah. Here is Cleveland haven't won a road game in the entire playoffs. Lost three in Toronto, lost two in Detroit. They win game five, they come home to clinch, they get five. Yeah. And then they go back out on the road and they win by 31 points. Right. That was crazy. You could turn off the TV in the fourth quarter. In both of those games, Cleveland was up by 26 points going into the fourth quarter. Let me get to these things. I'm struggling to remember two games in a row that were close, that had drama. The Knicks were plus 152 in eight wins. Oklahoma City plus 105 in eight wins. Just recently, San Antonio plus 104 in four wins. Okay, four.
Mike Wilbon
Don't you having covered decades of this?
Tony Kornheiser
I think it's the three. Yeah, I do.
Mike Wilbon
I think it's fascinating, even if it's not dramatic. It's an interesting study.
Tony Kornheiser
You want drama in the playoffs, so it's not working for me. These routes. Am I awed sometimes by the runs they go on. But when you get to the fourth quarter and you can switch to another sport, that's not the way it's supposed to happen. Just not.
Mike Wilbon
I'll give you one more chance here.
Tony Kornheiser
Well, please. I wanted to give you my word. Can I just give you my word?
Mike Wilbon
What's your word?
Tony Kornheiser
My word on a personal level is gratifying because I had them the whole way. And on a viewership level, my word is disappointing for the reasons that I've stated.
Mike Wilbon
Yeah. Tonight, close game one.
Tony Kornheiser
No.
Mike Wilbon
In Oklahoma City.
Tony Kornheiser
No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. This is the one game. Oklahoma City better win this game. Better win this one because the other team's capable of knocking them out.
Mike Wilbon
I can't wait for this series. I can't.
Tony Kornheiser
And I also don't believe in that rust resting. I think both the Knicks and the Thunder are rested.
Mike Wilbon
They're ready to go.
Tony Kornheiser
They're championship type teams. They're ready to go.
Mike Wilbon
Okay.
Tony Kornheiser
All right.
Mike Wilbon
And now to golf and Aaron rye winning the PGA Championship at Eironomic. Rye shot a five under 65 on Sunday, including a title ceiling 68 foot birdie putt on 17. Bomb.
Tony Kornheiser
Yep.
Mike Wilbon
To finish three strokes ahead of Jon Rahm and Alex Smalley. Rye is not one of the bigger names on Tour, of course, but Rory McIlroy said, and I quote, you won't find one person on the property who's not happy for him. Close quote. Tone, what do you make of who won it and who did not?
Tony Kornheiser
Some golf tournaments are Won. And some golf tournaments are lost. Nobody lost the PGA. Aaron Rai won the PGA. Agree. Totally agree. Aaron Rai was four under on the back nine yesterday. The harder nine of the two. At nine, he had an eagle. So he was minus six in the last 10 holes on a major on a Sunday. He won that tournament. Scottie Scheffler could not putt on the weekend. Jon Rahm could not putt yesterday. Rory McIlroy kept hitting drivers off the fairway. Into the spinach. Into the spinach. He was even on the par 5.
Mike Wilbon
He goes for 12 on fairways. Attempted yesterday with the driver. I think he was.
Tony Kornheiser
It would not surprise me. He goes over 12 when you hit it as long as he does and you're not under par on the par fives. That's how you lose a tournament. And then Smalley and McNeely and Schmidt, they didn't put any pressure on Ryan Aaron. Rye won the tournament.
Mike Wilbon
He did, Tony. And the reason why I like this, we talked about this Friday. Why I don't anticipate storylines. The event will tell me what the storylines are. And Rye, who's a guy. You and I talked about this on the phone yesterday during live time. Tied for 19 a couple of times. He's around. We knew who he was 290 to 1. But he wasn't like some threat.
Tony Kornheiser
No.
Mike Wilbon
You didn't think he was gonna be 290 to 1. I know. But I like the fact in the PGA, which has produced 10 famous champions in the last 10.
Tony Kornheiser
Used to have.
Mike Wilbon
Used to have.
Tony Kornheiser
That's right.
Mike Wilbon
Events like this where somebody that you sort of knew and you before Google and you had to do some research and find out who it was would win the PGA Championship. I don't. Who knows whether Rye is going to even show for the next two majors, the two remaining or next year.
Tony Kornheiser
Let's get to that.
Mike Wilbon
It doesn't matter.
Tony Kornheiser
That putt on 17, that long 60 foot putt, that's a forever. That was reminiscent of J.J. spawn last year at the U.S. open in Oakmont. And I bring up Spawn because we don't know if Spawn's ever going to win another major. There are a lot of guys who don't. I'll just give you a partial list here of people you will know. Danny Willett, Sean McKeel, Rich Beam, Michael Campbell. They got that one win. Maybe this is ry because Rye doesn't hit the ball long off the tee and nobody thought he was a good putter until the last three or four days. Right. So this could be him too. But the important thing is he won this thing. Nobody dropped it off in the swap.
Mike Wilbon
It was a joke. A thon. And the fact that Rory and Rahm were guys he finished ahead.
Tony Kornheiser
And Scheffler and Scheffler, number one in the world.
Mike Wilbon
Time highlight. If he doesn't do anything else, he's got this one.
Harry Douglas
Yeah.
Mike Wilbon
There are people who don't have one.
Tony Kornheiser
There are pictures of him holding the cup. Okay, let's take a break. Coming up, the Canadiens or the Sabres have the edge in tonight's game seven.
Mike Wilbon
And the Phillies are 15:4 under Don Mattingly. But are we? We were. The Phillies are good.
Tony Kornheiser
We didn't mention the fact that Shea Gilgis Alexander won the MVP and you voted for him.
Mike Wilbon
You have him. I do.
Tony Kornheiser
I would have had Jalen Brown if I had.
Mike Wilbon
I had him third, you know, I mean the top five of the top five.
Tony Kornheiser
Is there any boredom with him being elected again in this way? Boredom.
Mike Wilbon
Put it this way. Whether or not it is, it's. He's done.
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Tony Kornheiser
It is time for the missives from the masses. And I'm going to get the first one here. Take it out of the mailbox. Put on my glasses. Do you give the Canadiens or the Sabres the edge in tonight's game seven?
Mike Wilbon
You know what? You know what, Tony Home Ice does Not mean all that much. We've seen so many teams lose, you know, a game five and a game seven. It's like the NBA. It used to be 90 plus percent, and now both those sports, it's falling off in the last 10 to 12 years. And I don't. I don't know what to think about the goaltending. The goaltending has been iffy. What we're used to is some team emerging and having even a relatively unknown goaltender go nuts and just dominate the post season. We're not seeing that either. We're seeing teams. We're seeing coaches go to goaltender changes in the middle of a series, like, to me, is relatively unprecedented. I think. I think Buffalo seems to have been the story this year. They seem to have some magic dust surrounding them. I'm not rooting against him. I'm just rooting for Montreal. But I'd say Buffalo.
Tony Kornheiser
Yeah, I'm going to say Buffalo because of the home ice. And I'm going to be very specific as to why I'm wrong when I say that on an overall standpoint, I'm right. Because in the history of game sevens in NHL play, it's 118 to 84, 118 to 84, where the home team wins. But. And here's the big but that you are alluding to. We have already seen the Canadiens this year go five and two on the road. Yeah, we've already seen them on the road win a Game 7 in Tampa and Buffalo's 2 and 4 at home. So everything I'm saying sounds foolish as it gets out of my mouth. But, Mike, I cannot root against a team from upstate New York. When I went to Binghamton in upstate New York. I can't do it.
Mike Wilbon
I can't do it. You know, that's why I said they seem to have some magic dust, like it's their year. But Montreal, you point to the 52 record. 52 on the road. On the road. I mean, that's a big deal. And having already won a game 7, all bets are off.
Tony Kornheiser
I am very scared, specifically of what you alluded to. The Cleveland Detroit series, where the last three games, road teams won. In this series, the last three games, road teams have won the last predictable letter. So I'm an idiot. And that's not new.
Mike Wilbon
Game seven and a game one tonight, appealing. Both of them compelling. Phillies. Have the Phillies sold you on their turnaround?
Tony Kornheiser
Okay, so let's understand. There is recent history here, right, with this Phillies team. Four years ago, your Northwestern boy, Joe Girardi. Was canned when he opened up 22, 29. They went to Rob Thompson, who then started 14 2. And that team made the World Series. Now Rob Thompson opens up 9. 19. And they go to Don Mattingly. And Don Mattingly is 15 and four at the moment. They just put five runs on Paul Skeens. That's the most runs he's ever given up, tied for the most ever. Now, let me be realistic here. They are not going to catch Atlanta in the division.
Mike Wilbon
What are they, nine games behind Atlanta right now?
Tony Kornheiser
They're a lot right now. They also, the teams they've beaten lately are under 500. Collectively, I think it's 4:46. Yeah. And they have next month. It's a much harder schedule. But, Mike, they're only three and a half out of the wild card with 115 left to play. And your boy who lived in your apartment swore, that guy's got 8,000 home runs already.
Mike Wilbon
This is tough for me because, you know, I hate. I've now come to hate all Philly teams.
Tony Kornheiser
You gotta stop that. No, no, don't hate the University of Pennsylvania.
Mike Wilbon
I'm not gonna hate them.
Tony Kornheiser
Thank you.
Mike Wilbon
Just because they, you know, they sold their seats to the New Yorkers who went in there and gangstered them.
Tony Kornheiser
That's right.
Mike Wilbon
Well, the Knicks people went in there and said, philly, you think you're tough. You know, you and Rocky have some of this, right? And the Knicks just gangstered them, and they did nothing about it. And the Philly people rolled over like dogs. And so now I love Schwarber. He may be outside of anybody on the Cubs roster right now. My favorite player in all of Major League Baseball, and he looks Ruthiean. He is on a pace to hit seven. I love Schwaber.
Tony Kornheiser
You gotta love Mattingly. You gotta love Mattingly. You gotta love maddening.
Mike Wilbon
But you know what? I want the Phillies to lose every damn game. So, no, they've convinced me of nothing.
Tony Kornheiser
So I've come to be in the studio with you in your heart of anger today about Philadelphia, which you rail against all the time.
Mike Wilbon
Yeah, I do.
Tony Kornheiser
We're gonna have to go for cheesesteaks. That's enough email. Let's take one last break. Still to come, Napoleon Solo takes the Preakness. Could that set up a big finale at the Belmont?
Mike Wilbon
And is the NFL smart to start the season with a rematch of the Super Bowl? So if I want to stay in the Rittenhouse and have cheesesteaks, they'll let me.
Tony Kornheiser
Oh, yeah. Well, I'll go in with you. I'll go in with you.
Mike Wilbon
You know, it's the fans, not the city. But that's who they are.
Tony Kornheiser
That's who they are, but you're yelling at the city.
Mike Wilbon
Good. Well, okay.
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Tony Kornheiser
Pardon the interruption is brought to you
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Tony Kornheiser
Happy time people. Happy 80th birthday Reggie Jack Wow, there's only one Mr. October Kids. Reggie once hit three home runs off three different Dodger pitchers in a World Series game at Yankee stadium. Reggie won five World Series with the Oakland A's and the Yankees. He was Series MVP twice, American MVP, American League MVP once and a 14 time All Star. I did not like Billy Martin and I love Reggie Jackson. When I was a sports writer, Reggie was the best locker room interview in baseball. One time Reggie and I drove across Florida in his Rolls Royce for a story I was doing for the New York Times. I asked if I could sit in the back seat so it would look like he was my chauffeur, and he said, you sit in the front with me. Jim Palmer, a smart guy, once called Reggie a character out of Dostoyevsky.
Mike Wilbon
I was covering baseball. A youngster covering baseball. The end of Reggie's career at the California Angels. And he was so charismatic, intimidating, yet charming. Who's like Reggie Jackson now?
Tony Kornheiser
Seriously, I don't know.
Mike Wilbon
We're going old man again. But, Reggie, come on now.
Tony Kornheiser
We are old man. Happy anniversary, Phillies. Around this day, 47 years ago, the Phillies beat the Cubs in Wrigley 2022 in extra innings, no less, in the highest scoring game in modern Major League Baseball history. The Phillies got seven runs in the top of the first. The Cubs came right back with six. The starting pitchers, Dennis Lamb for the Cubs and Randy Lurch for Philadelphia, lasted only one third of an inning each. By the fourth, the Phillies were up 17 6. But the Cubs scored 13 runs in the next three innings. By the bottom of the eighth, it was 22 22. Mike Schmidt then hit his second homer of the game, this one off Bruce Souter, to win it in the 10th hole. Of course, famers. There were 50 hits and 11 home runs. Dave Kingman had three. Bill Buckner had seven RBI. And only 14,952 people watched it. Did you?
Mike Wilbon
Yeah, I watched it on television. This was a time before Harry Cary and.
Tony Kornheiser
And.
Mike Wilbon
And the Cubs became this monster that they are now. Wgn. That winter put on an alternate ending to that game in broadcast.
Tony Kornheiser
Really?
Mike Wilbon
And you know how. You know what happened in the alternate? Alternate. Ernie Banks is 500th home run wins the game. We needed some fantasy for the Cubs back.
Tony Kornheiser
Happy Trails to the rest of the field at the Preakness Stakes for Napoleon Solo. The colt won the second leg of the Triple Crown on Saturday over 13 other horses, only three of whom ran the Kentucky Derby. Derby winner Golden Tempo skipped the race. I wonder if horse racing could salvage this year's series by setting up what appears to be a match race between Napoleon Solo and Golden Tempo at the Belmont.
Mike Wilbon
This is load, Manager. This is awful.
Tony Kornheiser
Yeah, but it happens two years in a row and five out of eight. So last year, Sovereignty won the Derby and did not. They elected not to run them in the Belmont. Journalism. Not in the Belmont. In the Preakness. Journalism won the Preakness. In the Preakness. They ran off against each other. They were both in the field and Sovereignty won in the Belmont. It was satisfying at that point.
Mike Wilbon
Doesn't matter anymore to any of them.
Tony Kornheiser
It's got to. They've got to change it. They've got to change the calendar. Let's go to the big finish.
Mike Wilbon
Let's do it.
Tony Kornheiser
The Patriots and Seahawks will open the NFL season in a Super bowl rematch. You like it?
Bucked Up Energy Advertiser
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Mike Wilbon
I don't want to open the season with some AFC team. No great match, no old fashioned NFL teams. Aaron Rodgers. Your boy agreed to join the Steelers on a one year deal worth up to 25 mil. As a quarterback. Does he matter anymore?
Tony Kornheiser
It feels like it slipped away a little bit. It does. Jose Mourinho returning to coach Real Madrid. Is that a big deal?
Mike Wilbon
Yeah. I mean, it's years and years after his first stint. But Mbappe and his infighting and nobody knows what's going to happen with them. The Pelicans hired Jamal Mosley. I love Jamal Mosley. As their new head coach. Does that make sense?
Tony Kornheiser
It is very possible Orlando will regret getting rid of him.
Mike Wilbon
I think so.
Tony Kornheiser
But New Orleans stinks. They stink. Last one. Your Cubs host the brewers for three, starting tonight. Feel confident?
Mike Wilbon
Not really. We've lost four. We lost this game nine. Eight to the White Sox yesterday. One of the worst losses in 20 years.
Tony Kornheiser
But a great game, right? Great game.
Mike Wilbon
A great game.
Tony Kornheiser
We're out of time. We will try to do better the next time. Rest in peace, Jigsy. Tomatoes in the sky.
Mike Wilbon
I'm Mike Wilbond. Same time tomorrow. Knucklehead's heads. Here's Sports Center.
Tony Kornheiser
You know what?
Mike Wilbon
The White Sox are exciting. I hate to admit this. Hate to admit it. Good for you.
Hosts: Tony Kornheiser & Michael Wilbon
Episode Theme: Playoff drama across NBA and NHL, a surprise PGA Champion, and fiery sports banter
This episode of PTI is a rapid-fire rundown of Sunday’s biggest sporting events, with Tony and Michael tackling the dominance of the Cleveland Cavaliers, the highly anticipated Thunder–Spurs NBA matchup, Aaron Rai’s unexpected PGA Championship victory, and key storylines across MLB and NHL playoffs. The hosts’ trademark banter, bold predictions, and sharp analysis make this an energetic and insightful listen.
[00:56–04:45]
Historical Playoff Patterns:
Star Matchups & X-Factors:
[04:46–08:19]
Trends Toward Blowouts:
Cleveland’s Strengths and Weaknesses:
Fan Perspective:
[08:45–11:55]
[13:44–15:52]
[16:07–18:22]
On NBA youth and heartbreak:
“You base everything on Michael Jordan’s career.” – Tony [04:28]
“Michael had to have despair...Shaq and Kobe had despair. The only three people who had no despair, Magic, Johnson, Magic, Duncan.” – Wilbon [04:35]
On Modern Basketball:
“I am very disappointed in the playoffs. It’s like 75% of the games are routs.” – Tony [06:38]
“A three-point shot...makes an 11 point lead 19 and makes it 24 and there’s no recovery.” – Wilbon [05:13]
On golf’s everyman champions:
“Who knows whether Rye is going to even show for the next two majors...It doesn’t matter.” – Tony [11:04]
Philly fandom banter:
“You gotta stop that. No, no, don’t hate the University of Pennsylvania.” – Tony [17:26]
“Just because they...they sold their seats to the New Yorkers who went in there and gangstered them.” – Wilbon [17:32]
[23:37–24:35]
Best Quote of the Episode (NBA Paradox Edition):
“San Antonio owned them, Mike. They own them this year. Maybe that’s a harbinger of something to come.” – Tony Kornheiser [03:51]
Runner-Up:
“A three-point shot...makes an 11 point lead 19 and makes it 24 and there’s no recovery.” – Mike Wilbon [05:13]