Tony Kornheiser (2:45)

This is a very hard question for me to answer because I do not have the wpi, the wilbond power Index in front of me and I do not participate in a confidence pool every single week. So I'll just babble for a while. You and I are both agreed that there is not a great team in the NFL yet. And you and I are both agreed that every time we say somebody's good, they lose within the next week. Like Detroit lost early, the packers lost early. The Chargers began to lose. Buffalo. The Colts are losing all the time. Buffalo started losing. And the Rams and Seattle have lost within the last couple of weeks. All right, the top of the AFC right now are the Patriots, the Broncos, the Jaguars and the Texans. Do we trust them? Two of them are on real turnarounds. The Jaguars and the Patriots are on real turnarounds. You know, Houston has a great defense, but not much of an offense. Not really much of an offense. So I don't know about that. And you mentioned the Buffalo game against New England. I don't know who's going to win that. I agree with you about the West. I agree that San Francisco and Seattle and the Rams are at the top. So I'm going to go this. But I don't know, like Detroit could beat the Rams this week. I will say I will agree with you on Buffalo and I'll go with the neighboring team in the conference. I will say the Rams because I don't trust the young quarterbacks in their second and third years to get there. I don't. That's reasonable. Let's move to the NBA and the great run the Oklahoma City Thunder are on as they attempt to defend their championships. They're 23 1, which conjures up visions of the warriors from 2015 when they started 24. 0 and ultimately won a record 73 games. Tonight, Oklahoma City plays Phoenix in the quarterfinals of the NBA Cup. Will buy. And you were adamant that the Thunder would not repeat as NBA champions. Are you still feeling that way?

Mike Wilbon (4:40)

No, not today. I'm not. Not over the last month. Tony, it'd be stupid to feel that way in the face of what OKC is doing. They haven't even put their preferred starting lineup out there on the floor. They haven't Because I mean, J Dub is just working his way back. They haven't. They've had the MVP out there. SGA looks every bit of SGA from last year. And so therefore you go, my God, there's no weakness. They don't have a weakness. They've got depth, they've got now experience, they've got an IQ that is just off the charts about how to play.

Mike Wilbon (5:17)

They just look too good. Tony. But the reason I said no is because over the long haul, things happen. So I'm going to stay with that long haul and look toward the February, March, April, and I'm going to say not repeat. But I ain't feeling that today.

Tony Kornheiser (5:33)

Let me just take a couple of seconds to talk about the NBA cup, which nobody understands and nobody really cares about. They seem to be regularly scheduled NBA games on different colored courts. I like the different colored courts. They should go to them all the time. But in terms of the cup, what is the goal, what is the aim and how does it end? I don't really think anybody knows what or anybody cares. Today, for example, on this network this morning was a graphic that said, and I'm quoting here, Orlando makes the NBA cup semifinals for the first time. Like this is the final four. This is the third time they've had this cup. There's 25 teams that haven't made the semifinals. All right, Oklahoma City, I'll be very brief. They're really good. They're still really young and they play really hard. They, they gotta go 50 and 8 from now to match the Warriors. They went 50 and 8 last year. Over two year span they went 52 and 6. They're really good. And they're not jaded. They don't want to get off the court and go to dinner. They want to win. So I like them.

Mike Wilbon (6:34)

Good point. They're not jaded, Tone, that's an important point. They seem enthused about this, not cynics. That's a point in their favorite. Real important. Yeah, I may wind up backing down yet. And now to a big comeback in college hoops. Last night, 10th ranked Brigham Young was down 22 to Clemson in Madison Square Garden. The world's most famous arena. Last night came back to win at the buzzer. The comeback was led by heralded freshman A.J. debanza, who had 22, 7 and 5 in the second half. Tony, you watch this. So big deal, little deal or no deal?

Tony Kornheiser (7:14)

I think it's a big deal. And I think it's a big deal because this is a guy who everybody Projects to go in the top three of the draft. And as you said, they're down 21 points after the first half. They went. BYU went the last seven minutes of the first half with no points. Clemson outscored them 21. Nothing. They're down 21 going into the second half. And this kid. First of all, let's go over those numbers again. In one half of a college game, not 48 minutes, college game, 22 points, 7 rebounds, 5 assists. He outscored Clemson by himself in the second half. 22, 21. He shot 7 out of 11. Clemson shot 7 out of 27. And Mike, he did it in Madison Square Garden. You know what the song says, do it there. You can do it anywhere. He. Clemson, having watched this game, Clemson, all he really had to do was walk out onto the court and win, you know, in the second. And then they just take him. Do it. If you, if you watch their offense, they just dribbled around the perimeter of the three point line for 15 to 22 seconds and they didn't get very many shots where you'd say that was a good shot. And this kid overwhelmed them. He did.

Mike Wilbon (8:22)

I'm gonna use, I'm gonna, I'm gonna go to a comparison that is blasphemous. But you and I have watched and you more than me. Every great player who has played in Madison Square Garden For 50 plus years, we've seen all of them. And now I'm going to say something. It may make you cringe. I'm going to say it anyway. When I was watching this kid a little bit, I didn't watch as much of this game as you did. And I watched all the highlights later. You know what he reminds me of Bernard King.

Mike Wilbon (8:54)

Where he gets his shots when he's working that baseline.

Tony Kornheiser (8:59)

Yeah. Not as thick. The juts may not be quite as quick, but he's. Yeah, but he's got something.

Mike Wilbon (9:05)

You get that comparison, right? I'm not totally crazy.

Tony Kornheiser (9:08)

No. BYU doesn't have a whole lot of histories of basketball power. They got one highlight, 1981, Danny coast to coast, beating Notre Dame, getting to the final eight. It's a long time between highlights. This is a highlight, kid. Let's take a break. Coming up, is Philip Rivers making the right decision? We will get perspective from Steve Young.

Mike Wilbon (9:29)

Well also ask him what the hell's wrong with the Eagles offense. What's up with that, Tony? The kid looks, doesn't he look ready? I mean most of these kids aren't ready and they get overstated. This kid looks Ready.

Tony Kornheiser (9:42)

He's very quick to take one dribble and go right up.

Steve Young (9:46)

Boom.

Tony Kornheiser (9:46)

He's very quick.

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Steve Young (10:52)

Welcome back to Pardon the Interruption presented by Grey Goose, part of happy hour.

Tony Kornheiser (11:04)

We've got NFL questions for our great friend, the man who taught me everything I know about private equity, hall of Fame quarterback Steve Young. And we have to begin with Philip Rivers. We have to. Philip Rivers said today, this is a direct quote. It's one of those deals where a door opens and you either walk through it and find out if you can do it, or you run from it, unquote. If a team had called you, Steve, years after you retired, and for all I know, maybe one did, how would you weigh that decision?

Steve Young (11:31)

Yeah, I mean, for a little while, there's a little bit of dance step because. Let's go backwards. I think we talked about this. When you're playing, you're one of the best in the world at something. And when it ends, it ends too early. And you crave it because it took all of you, spiritually, emotionally, intellectually, physically, you. You poured yourself into it. To be any good in the NFL, to be great, you want to keep doing it. And it's just. It's hard to leave. And so we all talk about it. Jerry Rice and I talked about it for, I don't know, maybe for 20 years. Like, I think we could still do it. But you have to be honest with yourself. You have to be mature enough to realize it is a young man's game. It's an elite athletic event, and you have been sitting on your couch. And I don't care how much you've been trying to stay in shape. If Phillip says, I've been staying in shape, you've been preparing for pickleball or Pilates with your wife. Like, you have not been getting ready for the NFL and what's going on. So my biggest worry is that you blow the Achilles, you blow your knee out, your shoulder gives out the second. But less worrisome is you look like a fool. Because, I mean, look, everyone says, you know, you've been out for four years, you look like a fool. I'm okay. But no one wants to get really hurt. You are not prepared. Nobody. The best athletes in the world get hurt after preparing year round. And now you're gonna show up after being on the couch for four years. That's tough. But I understand the draw, Philip. I understand the draw, brother. If someone called me right now, I'd be like.

Steve Young (12:56)

It is my era. Maybe. Maybe I don't. Is this really happening? Honestly? Is this really happening? Is he starting? What's. What are we gonna say? It's Wednesday. Is it happening?

Commercial Announcer (13:09)

Right?

Mike Wilbon (13:10)

It's out of Walter Wizard. It's just, you know, he's not coming out. He's not coming out to sit on the bench, though, Steve. And you know him, he. I mean, his ego is pretty damn healthy.

Steve Young (13:21)

If he does it, let me say it after I went off on and on there, if he does it, we all need to just bow down and just say the great Philip Rivers, because that's amazing.

Mike Wilbon (13:31)

No doubt, no doubt.

Steve Young (13:32)

All right.

Mike Wilbon (13:32)

We will move to something more realistic and problematic, which is the Philadelphia Eagles in their offense. I don't remember you ever having offensive issues once you got rolling in San Francisco, but you're looking at the Eagles. They seem to be struggling after. They're struggling, not seem to be. After a Super bowl run. What is the main thing that's broken here and what do you fix?

Steve Young (13:55)

So last year, the super bowl run was fueled by the running game. And it was like. And it augmented by some, you know, some explosive passing game. But it didn't ask Jalen to become a sophisticated passer. Like, it didn't. It didn't say, you can't do it. I'm just saying didn't ask him. And they ran it all the way to the Super Bowl. This year, the running game is not doing that. So you don't have that one, two punch that. That I think was super bowl ready. So now you have to integrate. If you're not going to be a great running team and dominate and Saquon's not going to be mvp, essentially, then you've got to have an integrated effort to become a sophisticated offense, which includes both Saquon and these elite weapons. And I think what's happening is they're getting the least out of both, and that's why they're struggling and they're getting the least out of the quarterback because they ask. So they've been asking so little. They. It's time to ask more. And it's hard to make that transition. Not that you can't do it, but you don't just go from first gear to eighth gear. That's weird. But, you know, you just can't do it that fast. And so I think that's the problem. They're in a tight spot that neither are working from last year. And the fact is they have not developed what you're seeing in Green Bay, in San Francisco, in la. They have the innovation. They just practicing it.

Tony Kornheiser (15:19)

We will get you out of here on this. Thank you for mentioning Green Bay. Packers head coach Matt LaFleur complained about Micah Parsons being held up by the Bears without any flags, and he said this direct quote. I guess I don't know what holding is anymore, unquote. Do you think there's more holding now or has this been happening forever?

Steve Young (15:39)

There's two things that you will hear the most on the football field. One is a receiver coming back to the huddle, telling everyone that he's open. That's number one. The number two thing that you hear everywhere on the football field is I'm being held by the defensive lineman. So that is, like, ubiquitous through time, eons of time. So that's not going to change. I think that the nuances now is that officials are now trying to get so specific and so nuanced. They're trying. Everything's about getting more offense.

Commercial Announcer (16:09)

Everything.

Steve Young (16:09)

All the rules, safety rules in the last 10 years have all been against the defense. And so they're trying to have holding battle nuanced so that it's contextual. And now the line judge and the head referee are like, that is holding. But contextually, I think I'm going to hold the flag, you know what I mean? So I think that's what's happening, is that they're trying to give the offense as much advantage as possible, because that's what we've been doing for 10, 15 years. And we're trying to have holding because holding is Always around. It always will be around. But how it gets flagged, you know, it seems to be that they're. They're being a little bit more nuanced about it and in the favor of offensive linemen. That's what it looks like.

Tony Kornheiser (16:49)

Thank you, Steve. Always a pleasure to have. Appreciate it.

Steve Young (16:54)

All right. Maybe I will come back.

Tony Kornheiser (16:56)

Yeah, good.

Steve Young (16:59)

If Phil Verbers dominates Jerry, we're doing it. I'm calling him up. He's down the street. We were talking about the other day. We're going to start go throwing the ball around and it's happening.

Tony Kornheiser (17:10)

That would be great. That would be great. People would come to see that. Yeah. Let's take one last break. Still to come, Pete Alonso leaves the Mets for the Orioles and is ACC.

Mike Wilbon (17:21)

Commissioner Jim Phillips right. The College Football Playoff needs more teams, Tony. If they come back, we got to come back. We got to come back as sports writers and go cover Steve and Jerry coming back. 8 and 81. 8 and 80, baby. 8 and 80.

Tony Kornheiser (17:38)

That's fine as long as I don't have to do it at night games when I'm asleep. Like game games.

Mike Wilbon (17:43)

You covered Monday night games when you were a young man.

Tony Kornheiser (17:47)

I know, but I'm not a young man. And neither are you and neither are Jerry and Steve.

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Steve Young (20:28)

Pardon the interruption is presented by Great Goose Make Time Wait. Please enjoy responsibly Part of Happy Hour.

Steve Young (20:37)

Happy time people.

Tony Kornheiser (20:38)

Happy 29th birthday Joe Burrow I think Burrow is the best quarterback in football, but he gets hurt so regularly. He was drafted overall number one by the Bengals in 2020. After leading LSU to the national championship in his rookie year, he tore his acl. In his second year, he won Comeback Player of the Year and took the Bengals to the Super bowl, completing 70.4% of his pass. Two years later in 2023, he hurt his wrist. In 2024, Burrow again won Comeback Player of the Year, leading the NFL in passing yards, passing touchdowns, 43 and completions. This year he was out with turf toe. His career completion percentage is 68.2. It's the best ever in the NFL. In his typical game, Burrows scores 38 and the Bengals give up 42.

Mike Wilbon (21:25)

With all that, here's who he ate. He ain't 15 on Kansas City. He ain't Patrick Mahomes. I'm not even sure he's Josh Allen. Tony, you're talking about passing. Marino was the greatest baby at passing, but I ain't putting him as the best quarterback not with Montana and Elway and Brady and nowadays best. But Kenny Anderson completed like 70%. He was never the best quarterback. So I am separating passer from quarterback.

Tony Kornheiser (21:52)

A little different for me, that's fine. As I always say, Patrick Mahomes is the best football player on the planet. I always say that. Happy anniversary, Scotty Pippen. On this day, 23 years ago, with Pippen playing for Portland and Michael Jordan playing for Washington, the two former teammates on the Chicago Bulls faced each other for the only time in their careers. Pippen came out on top as the Bulls handily beat the Wizards 98 to 79. Pippen had 14 points, seven rebounds and five assists. Jordan, who also scored 14 points, said afterwards, and I quote, it was a sad, sad game we played. The most unfortunate thing is we can't take our game checks and give them to our fans. It was unfortunate they had to pay to see it. His horses were ready. My mules were sick. I have to take razzing for the time being. Unquote. God bless Michael Jordan for that quote.

Mike Wilbon (22:41)

Tony Pippen was on the Blazers then. I don't remember the game. I choose to forget it. I'm sure I was there. I know I had to cover it more. So I remember Michael Jordan's first trip back with the Wizards. First trip back to play against the Bulls, to play against Chicago. It was the same day as the Fog Bowl. I remember that because it was also depressing on some level. But Pippen versus Jordan. I choose to just not acknowledge it.

Tony Kornheiser (23:08)

Yeah, I mean I, I should have said the Blazers. Obviously it was the Blazers. Happy trails. Sharon Moore. Michigan fired its head coach late this afternoon with cause after the university said it had found credible evidence that Moore engaged in an inappropriate relationship with a staff member. Moore had the Wolverines job for two seasons after Jim Harbaugh left for the NFL. Moore went 8 and 5 last season, 9 and 3 this season. Michigan will play Texas in a Citrus bowl on New Year's Eve. Associate head coach Biff Poggi will coach the team in that game.

Mike Wilbon (23:40)

Wow. You don't know what this means going forward for Michigan. Not just this season, what's left of it, but beyond. And you don't know what it's going to mean for more. I guess there'll be more details in the coming days, weeks and months.

Tony Kornheiser (23:56)

And a bonus. Happy trails to the Mets for Pete Alonso. The slugger is reportedly finalizing a five year wind $155 million deal with the Orioles. Alonzo led all big league first basemen in home runs, doubles and RBI last season. Since the start of 2022, the 31 year old has averaged 39 homers per the Mets have now lost Alonso and Edwin Diaz to free agency.

Mike Wilbon (24:19)

Isn't Camden Yards more friendly to hitters than Citi Field? I don't know how that works out. Soon.

Tony Kornheiser (24:25)

I want to see him with the Orioles. I think it'll be great. Let's go quick to the big finish. SEC commissioner Jim Phillips said today he's in favor of expanding the playoffs. Are you with him?

Mike Wilbon (24:34)

No, but Jim on most things, but not this. I'd rather see it at 8. The NFL approved Philip Rivers wearing Daniel Jones number 17. Does that make sense?

Tony Kornheiser (24:44)

That was Rivers number all the way through his career. Mostly obviously with the Chargers, but in the one year in Indy as well. The White Sox won the lottery for the first pick in the 2026 baseball draft. Is that significant?

Steve Young (24:55)

No.

Mike Wilbon (24:55)

This isn't the NBA, is it? Wembanyama at the top of the strap. The Commanders will start Marcus Mariota instead of the again injured Jaden Daniels this week, but have made no decisions and claim for the rest of the season. Your thoughts?

Tony Kornheiser (25:10)

Shut him down. Don't get him injured again. Shut him down. Last one. The Knicks and Magic advance to the semis of the NBA Cup. I'll bet you're excited.

Mike Wilbon (25:19)

Not one. As you know and I echo your sentiment. Complete.

Tony Kornheiser (25:26)

We're out of time. We'll try to do better the next time. I'm Tony Kornhouse.

Mike Wilbon (25:30)

And I'm Mike Wilbond. Same time tomorrow.

Steve Young (25:32)

Knuckleheads at tab we're all in on the NFL Miss by five on select primetime NFL matchups.

Tony Kornheiser (25:40)

Miss by five on any rushing or.

Steve Young (25:41)

Receiving yards market and TAB will still.

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