A (3:58)

It's so awesome. Yes. Yeah. Yeah. And it's available on Apple, right?

C (4:06)

Yeah, it's, I guess, different countries. It's a little different, but pretty much everywhere it's available like Apple TV and Amazon, and it's transactional Windows, so it's written by. And Google Play as well. And then also on cable boxes, I believe, like in the US Like Spectrum and some other cable. It's like on demand cable as well. You can rent it.

A (4:25)

That's awesome.

D (4:26)

Very cool.

A (4:27)

Yeah, we're so glad. I think that. Well, I love that I'm speaking in the we like you can. Because that's how we work. But I'm so grateful that you put out your story because of the fact that it. Because this disorder is so misrepresented or just. It's a very narrow representation and even where it is accurate, you know, to some small subsection of the population's experience. So, yeah, I think it's really amazing that you shared your experience. One of the things that I was taken by within the film is the fact that you demonstrated what an imaginal exposure looks like. And first of all, because I used to work in film and television as I think we've talked about briefly. But, yeah, so it was cool as, like, seeing it as used as a tool for exposition. I was like, oh, that's really. That's well done. But it also was such a neat thing to be able to. Yeah. See something that, like, that it's. It's very niche. Right. Like, most of the people in the world wouldn't know what an imaginal exposure is. So I don't know. That's a very specific thing to talk about. But I guess I'm curious as to what it was about the imaginal that seemed important to you to include in the story.

C (5:56)

Yeah. I love that you brought that up. I mean, I knew that I really wanted to combat all this stuff that we're talking about and to combat all of these sort of, like, mainstream perceptions of ocd. I knew that the tonally within my film, that I really wanted to ground it in reality and to have it be incredibly naturalistic. And so it's a hard thing to do because it's an invisible illness and it's in one's head. And so I, as I, Right from the beginning, as I started, decided to write the film, I was thinking about how I wanted to do that because I wanted to ground it in reality and not have the audience leave the world of reality. So I didn't want to do any sort of, like, cutaways into his head or any of those things. I wanted to ground it. And so. Well, one. And then coupled with that, I mean, imaginal exposures were the biggest thing that helped me in my own recovery. I used them quite a bit. And so in threefold, by using the imaginal exposures in the film, it created a private moment with the character. So, you know, you got that sort of really, like, intimacy in that to just be alone with this person as they're struggling to actually get sort of, like feedback in the scene with audio. And because that was a huge thing that helped me. It was sort of because you. With. As, you know, with the imaginal exposures, you can either just write them out on paper and read them back, or you can record them and play them back. That just. That was the thing that helped me the most. There was something about those initial spikes that I was experiencing by hearing my own voice saying it back to me that really activated me in a way that was good. I mean, in the sense of, you know.

D (7:30)

Right. In the long term.

C (7:32)

In the long term, it's good because you want to do the scariest thing. Right. I Mean, at the time, it felt, you know, horrible and dark and the end of the world sort of. But as I started to do that, I realized that that's what helped me the most. And then I also just think it coupled as a very effective cinematic tool to stay in that world of realism while also, like I said, like, providing intimacy and sort of like a window into this. This main character's brain without having to sort of resort to sort of like cheap cinematic tricks or cutaways or things like that.

A (8:07)

Yeah, yeah. And it did just that. It was very, very intimate moment with the character. And for anyone who's watching who's not familiar with imaginal exposures, we do have a whole episode on that. Maybe. Kelly, do you want to, like, speak to what they are from a clinical perspective, though, since. Yeah.

D (8:24)

So imaginals are just as quickly as possible, we're talking first person, present tense, like, I am going to. Or I am going to murder my partner tonight when I get home, or I'm going to harm them, or I have harmed them over and over and over until anxiety kind of slowly peters off a little bit and we listen to them kind of at nauseam until we become bored almost with the content. You can generate them in any way. Like Dylan was saying. You can either write it, you can record your voice, listen to it. You can actually record your voice listen to it and hold a knife if you want. Right. Like, we can double down on these exposures as well, but the idea is that it becomes less of a novel thing.

A (9:10)

Well said. Nice nutshell.

C (9:12)

Absolutely.

D (9:13)

Yeah. I was going to ask something specific, but. Oh, I was going to ask you. I loved how. I hate that this happened to you, but I love how in the film we do see your whole life, kind of how that impacts OCD and the stuff outside of ocd. And I think that's a lot of times when we see our clients, they kind of treat OCD like it's like, in this vacuum, like it's the only thing we're treating. But in reality, there's this person who has all these other things going on in their life. And I thought the film did a great job at showing the whole person. And I guess I was just curious what that was like for you going through treatment. And I don't know how accurate it was, but there was a lot of external factors going on. But what was it like for you in real time?

C (10:14)

Yeah, I'm glad that you spoke to that, because that was just a big thing of. It's hard enough For I think, the sufferer themselves when they're getting diagnosed. Especially I'm speaking to late onset. I think obviously when you're, you know, if you're getting diagnosed really young, maybe you have a different experience and it's kind of. I think there is a little bit something different about late onset being like you've sort of already cemented your worldview and your identity and that sort of gets flipped on its head and you got to like, reassess everything.

D (10:41)

Am I?

C (10:42)

Who am I? Yeah, there's the added existential component to it of like, who am I now versus, I guess I would imagine when you're sort of early onset or something like that, it's kind of like who you are and what you know and what you remember. So me struggling with that, I mean, it's hard enough, I guess my point being that it's hard enough for the sufferer at that point to sort of navigate that, let alone people in their lives that have known them their whole lives who are also trying to recalibrate that. And so I really wanted to show that. And also the other I think I'd say to that too, is that, you know, I think that people with OCD are very highly functional. So even me, even when I was at a 10 in terms of my anxiety level, I was able to be very functional in my day to day, whether it was holding down a job or within relationships. You know, I think that I always say that with OCD or with people with anxiety disorders, I think that if you're actually seeing it break through, I mean, that's just like an iceberg thing. Like if it's, if you're seeing it, everything else that's going on underneath it must be very deep and extreme. And so I just wanted to show that I wanted to show the, the rest of this person's life. And I want to show like everybody around them. Because also as we were talking about too being this sort of like truism in terms of the representation. I also wanted, I also wanted people say if you're a parent and your child has OCD or if your partner has OCD or something like that, I also wanted you to be able to watch a film like this and be able to see sort of like not just the experience of the suffer, but it sees sort of like, at least you know, from my experience, like kind of a bit of the experience of people around me and sort of like things that they wrestled with or that they were trying to understand and to also be able to get that Education as well. Because I think that film, I'm obviously a huge believer in the cinematic art form in terms of cinema is so experiential. So I think that a family member like that, watching a film like this versus reading a book, even though there's fantastic books, some of them are depicted in the film. You know, I have John Hirschfeld's book When a Family Member has ocd, that's kind of a big proponent in the film. There's great resources, but I think that something like watching a story, watching a film, that you can sit and eat some popcorn and sit down for two hours and not have it feel like you're going to school and hopefully getting an emotional ride and. And at the end of it, you know, I've just had so many experiences like that through the theatrical experience and the theatrical run of the movie and now that the film's out, people reaching out through social channels or whatever it is and just letting me know that they, they understand now that they get it and you know, the light bulb went off for them and you know, they understand now how to connect with their child or their partner. And you know, for me, that's the, the, the coolest thing of this whole process has been able to have those sort of, you know, experiences with people. And I think that, that really, you know, all of us need the help of other people. I think is really like the theme of the film. That was another reason that I showed all of these people around it too, was that I think on any mental health journey, it's. It feels like you're so alone and it feels like you're white knuckling it. But really the only way through all of that is to really let other people in your life and to be vulnerable and to share your world and let them share yours. And I mean, it's been unexpected. I think that when you're making a film, it's like your head is just down and you're just trying to make this film that I really didn't stop to think about. Now at this point in the process, how many people, whether it's OCD or not, I mean, I just have people after screenings that are coming up to me and talking and they feel so inspired to share their experiences with me, whether it's not even OCD based. It'll just be like people sharing their PTSD experience out of the military or different things and just like how they went on their own mental health journey. And they feel so inspired to share that. And I love that it's Unexpected. But it's also, it's really sort of the reason I made the film was to sort of like allow people to hopefully just allow that conversation to take place and to feel okay with it. Because, I mean, I had my own judgments as, as a, as a. When I was getting diagnosed, I was like, wait, what?

A (14:54)

Of course, like what?

C (14:55)

Like my own judgment stigmas and things like that where I think I was always an ally and an advocate, but it was sort of like, oh no, I'm an ally and an advocate, but like I don't have a mental health.

A (15:04)

Right, right, right, right.

D (15:06)

But that doesn't apply to me.

C (15:07)

Yeah, exactly. That's sort of just fallacy that you're like, oh, wait, you know, I am human and this is some. That can happen to anyone.

A (15:15)

And yeah, being in the vulnerable position.

C (15:18)

Yeah, totally. And I'm sorry, that's a bit of a winded response. But I think that's why I wanted to sort of encompass all of these people around him in the film was to show this character and just different facets of its life. You know, I actually was working in a rehab and the main character's working in a rehab. And I also just found during that period of life that there was just really intense parallels between the mental health journey, between the alcohol and addiction recovery journey, and that there were so many parallels there. And especially I worked at a holistic rehab that was really like dual approach. So pretty much all, all of the, all of the clients that were coming in were also dealing with mental health issues on top of their addiction issues. And so that was just becoming like a thing for them to mask the real issue. And so we were sort of like working on all these different fronts. And I thought that there was really something cinematically compelling about a character who is simultaneously kind of going through his darkest hour while he's empowering and helping other people through their darkest hour. And I think that that's really true to life. I think that, you know, that is what gets us through. You know, even when you're struggling, if you help somebody else, like that cycle, you know, I really wanted to show all of that in the film and.

D (16:34)

I think it also sent a message that maybe you're not aware of too, which is wonderful, is that it gives hope to other people that I can deal with all these other very hard things and, and I can still recover with my ocd.

C (16:49)

I hope so. Yeah, I really hope people get that message.

A (16:52)

Yeah, yeah, I had a follow up question about that, but I just noticed in the, the thread that somebody was asking about different themes of Pure O. And I wanted to sort of maybe divert in that direction briefly and just to the extent that you're comfortable. Right. We obviously, like, there are and lots and lots of different themes and subtypes. So if anyone's interested in learning more about those, we have lots of episodes on them too. And there are resources on all of our. Our social media pages as well. But I. I think I'm curious. Yeah, like, to the extent that you're comfortable about, like, you know, what kind of themes you have experienced historically.

C (17:35)

Sure. A lot of them are depicted in the film. And in the film too, I really wanted to show in the group therapy scenes and, you know, have characters representing different subsets and, you know, showing the umbrellas of all these things and. But yeah, mine, I mean, I really started out with harm. OCD was my thing. I sort of thought it was suicidal ideation and realized that it wasn't. It was just this obsessive loop of what if? I what if, what if, what if, what if? And it never sort of was going past that. And that lasted for a while. And then it's. Before I was able to really get in and get clinical treatment, it was sort of sort of morphing around based on big life events, you know, so it was really harm towards myself. And then I got engaged during that period and then it turned into like, oh, my gosh, I can handle this if it was me, but what if I hurt my partner? And so then it was. And then it became harm OCD towards my partner. And then during that engagement process, it started to become relationship OCD because I started to get very perfectionistic about, like, oh, we need to make sure this relationship's perfect before we get married and we need to iron out everything, which is. So I would say those harm and relationship OCD in my two main subsets. And obviously I've had moments of it morphing around and, you know, one day here or there where something's sort of taking loose and I'm sort of probably run the gamut of most of them with that, but in terms of it actually taking hold and being like a big block that I really had to seek clinical treatment for. Harm OCD and relationship OCD are the two. Two that I've struggled with the most.

A (19:10)

Well, thank you for sharing.

C (19:11)

Yeah, absolutely. But in the film too, it's like hit and run. OCD is really like kind of giving its due. And, you know, there's pedophilia OCD and you know, Scrupulosity and, you know, characters sort of struggling with different subsets within the film as well.

A (19:26)

Yeah, yeah, right.

D (19:28)

The group therapy scenes. Right.

A (19:30)

Yeah, yeah. Which was a great way. Like, I love that it. That introduced so many different people's experiences.

D (19:37)

Yeah, it's great.

A (19:38)

Yeah, yeah, absolutely. But the. And just for the record, as we talk about on here, right, like, the. The work is the same regardless. And I think that, you know, if you learn to work with harm ocd, right, and your experience of that, you're also learning how to navigate relationship OCD and self harm thoughts and all, you know, all of these different themes that might arise. But I guess to that end, like, if we're looking at your experience, like, I loved what Kelly was talking about in the film, right, You're. You're looking at a person who is living a very full life and that there's a lot of challenges arising. I'm curious if you found that much in the way this parallel exists between how we work with Harm OCD and relationship ocd, have you found that the skills that you learned in the treatment process were able to generalize more broadly to the challenges that were coming up in your own life, whether during this period or beyond?

C (20:39)

Oh, my gosh, absolutely. Because, I mean, you hit the nail on the head, you know, that the content doesn't matter about this stuff. And so the biggest, I think, thing going forward is it's not even the treatment of it. It's the more recognizing it when it's morphing, because sometimes, you know, it just slips in there and you've got like a couple of days, you know. Oh, I didn't realize that's totally what I'm doing here. So more the recognizing of it, but in terms of the skills that it uses, I mean, for me, meditation changed my life, and not in some hippie dippy way. And I think, you know, like, no.

D (21:12)

You have to break. It's a thing. You have to break that barrier.

C (21:14)

Oh, my gosh. Of course. I sat down for two minutes the first time. I was like, oh, this is crazy. There's no way, you know, and.

D (21:22)

And it is a nightmare in here.

A (21:24)

The worst.

C (21:26)

And I. And I really worked my way up and I, you know, half an hour a day for years, you know, and for me, it was a big to sidebar for a second, but there was a big Harvard study that was everything before that was very anecdotal and things like that. And then they finally did like a sort of like live MRI, MRIs on the brain and like, really, like. And they saw that 27 minutes a day for eight weeks, really? I amplified your gray matter in your brain and the capacity of how it was working. Regulate joy and optimism and all these things. I started reading this, I was like, okay. I was like, I can do that.

A (21:57)

8.

C (21:57)

And it has to be 27 minutes a day. It doesn't have to be in one sitting. So I was like, I can. I can do this. And it was when I was in that state of like, I will try anything. I am at my rock bottom. I will try this. And at first it was like two minutes. I was like, oh, my God, there's no way I can do this. And then I just.

A (22:12)

Only 26 left to go. Or wait.

C (22:14)

Yeah, only 20. Yeah, whatever it is. And I'm like, oh, my God, this is torture. I can't do it. But I was willing to do anything. And I think that that's the same peril that we're talking about here with, like, alcohol and addiction is that, like, whatever it is, wherever you are, you have to be at your rock bottom. I was in plenty of OCD groups with people that just weren't ready to be there. You know, they. They weren't even accepting that they had ocd. They were sort of like, I don't know. I don't know. I don't think this is a thing, you know, or forcing me into this group or whatever it is. And you're like, oh, you're just not ready. You know, you have to be ready, and it has to take everything. So. So I kind of went off topic there. But no, I think that basically all of the tools that go into OCD recovery, I think absolutely work in your generalized life. Like, things like. Like, you know, mindfulness and meditation and like, it. It didn't just make my OCD better. It just made my life better. It makes me be able to handle stressors better. Just made me, you know, everything. It affected my life and in the most beautiful way. And I. And I couple that with working in a rehab. I think if everybody. If the general population was to work in a rehab for, like, six months, the amplified exponential growth that you experience there, I always say it, you know, as much as maybe I hopefully help some people, what I got out of that experience of, like, learning through having to teach and through having to explore these modalities is somebody who is, you know, a teacher of them and learning all these things. I just think that this amplified growth that you. I experienced during this time, absolutely generalized in my life has changed Me and. And the. For the better. And I. And I have. I've transitioned to a place now in my OCD journey to a lot of the gratitude stage. I still have moments where it comes up and I hate it, and I can't stand it, and I'm having a really hard day. And, you know, but for the most part, I really do feel grateful, you know, especially for what I do. Something like making films and, you know, writing films and just basically creating puzzle. And I let my ocd. I find out where it suits me, and I find out where it's helpful, and I allow it to be there. And I try to recognize when it's maybe, you know, I'm fighting with my partner and it's coming out, that's not good. But if I'm working on something artistic that's trying to give back to society or I'm trying to. I think that I see pros and cons to it. And so I've reached a point where I am grateful for it.

D (24:33)

It's wonderful.

A (24:36)

Yeah.

D (24:36)

I mean, I think I can speak to that. Probably Lauren, as well, is. I mean, I've never worked in a rehab, but obviously I'm a therapist. And I can tell you that being on that other side of it and suffering yourself with it is like you have to hold yourself accountable, even more so. And you learn so much from other, you know, from clients, and it just. It helps you grow. I don't know if I'd be in my recovery if I hadn't been a.

A (25:09)

Therapist, to be honest.

C (25:11)

So, yeah, I would say that I feel like I would generalize here, but I feel like that that's probably a lot of people who are. Who are, you know, helping others and giving back is that they went through something themselves. And that sparked, I think, a lot of people when I was working the rehab, a lot of other counselors that were sober, and I'm not sober myself, and I kind of came into it through different. A different avenue. But so many people talk about it that, you know, you end up in a rehab because you are. You are driven to. Because either you went through it or you have firsthand experience with a loved one or a family member that, you know, you either lost to addiction or you struggled with. And that there's a very, very big component with that in that space. And I find that I found that in the OCD space, too. I think my therapist suffered from ocd and. Because you can speak to it more. But I think even in the therapeutic community, in the. Not in the ocd, specialized community. But it just, you know, therapists as a whole, I think OCD is still pretty misunderstood. And so I was lucky. I think it only took me, like, a year in talk therapy or maybe a little bit under to have a therapist sort of unlock, like, hey, this is sounding like this mental. Because I didn't have any physical composure compulsions or anything. And so it took about a year. And from what I've researched, I. I was lucky. I mean, a lot of people are taking over a decade, you know, two.

A (26:32)

Yeah.

C (26:33)

Yeah. I don't even know. It's just like, that's.

A (26:36)

Yeah.

C (26:36)

I just can't even imagine being where I was at mentally.

D (26:40)

Yeah.

C (26:40)

For 15 or 20 years before I was able to realize, oh, wow, I can get into, like. At least for me, it was maybe like, a year of specialized treatment. And I'm. And I'm. And I feel pretty good. I feel like I can manage this thing and I can get on, and this isn't a death sentence. But to be sitting with that for 15 or 20 years, that's another reason I made the film. You know, I want people to be able to see this film. And I've had it already. I've had a couple people had this, really. During our theatrical experience in Los Angeles, we had. We had somebody who had shown up because. Oh, I think it might have been you guys were there, actually. I think it might have been the one that you guys moderated a panel on. But we had somebody who was there because their child had ocd. And at the end of the film, they sort of raised their hand and were like, oh, I was here just to try to understand my child. And now I realize, like, I thought they got it from their mother, but they got it from me. Like, I. I thought that it was ocd. It was just physical, like, light switches and things. And I'm realizing that I have what's being represented here. So then he was able to sort of, like, seek out treatment for. For himself and his child. It's just like, things like that. I was like, that's amazing. I mean, people that can recognize that maybe within the film and then seek out a medical professional and say, like, hey, I saw this film, and, you know, it's kind of unlocking something, like, maybe could this maybe be a thing? Because it kind of was hitting close to home. That would be amazing to try to get some of those people that we're speaking to that have been suffering for 15, 20 years to be able to realize that this isn't that this is very treatable, you know, and I think.

A (28:09)

It'S bound to happen. Honestly, that's the beauty, like, of what you've put out there is that it's. It's going to help a lot of people see their experience or a close loved one who's. Who's confided in them. They're going to be able to say, hey, look, I. I saw this thing, right? And I think you might have this where, you know, for, like, I can speak for myself. It was. It was 17 years right from onset to correct diagnosis. And I was a kid and I had no idea. And I was listening to Allegra Castins, who's a therapist within our community, and then Advocate was recently on, oh my gosh. Podcast. It's. I think it's called We Can Do Hard Things. Glennon Doyles. Anyway, I think so. But anyway, I was listening to her on that and, you know, she talks about her first. The first 15 months, I think, of her experience. She didn't even Google her symptoms because she was scared about what she was going to find. Right. Like, it is so incredibly isolating and so scary to not know what it is that you're experiencing. And the fact that, like, I know that for Kelly and I, we've, like, part of why we became clinicians and why we do the advocacy work that we do is because we're really passionate about helping people to have a name and for what they're experiencing and to be able to address it effectively. And I think that that's precisely one of the things that your film does.

C (29:34)

Oh, my gosh, 100%. I just think that most of us just want to know what we're dealing with. And I think especially with. With something like OCD that revolves around uncertainty, the uncertainty of not even knowing what it is, just. Just killer. And I think that absolutely, that just finding out what you're dealing with is half the battle and to be able to. To understand that.

A (29:56)

So, yeah, it's a great service you've done, and I know that it's going to impact a lot of people.

D (30:02)

Very grateful.

C (30:03)

I hope so. Yeah, I hope so. And I hope that there's more. It's been really lovely. And some of these, like, we just played a film festival here in LA last weekend, and, you know, there was. It was great. There was an outing and there were some other young filmmakers in LA that were coming. They're like, oh, I heard this. It was great. And they're from the younger generation. They're like, oh, I'm Making some short films right now about my OCD experience. And I have a feature that I'm trying to make and I think I saw that there's another OCD film that's coming out. Oh, Exposure. Yeah, Peter's film, Exposure.

A (30:34)

Yeah.

C (30:34)

I think I saw that he got a deal with Gravitas and I think it's coming out this summer. I just know that. I think that I would love. That I would love to just see. This is just one film and it's, you know, but I'd like to see more and more films, you know, especially me. I feel like I, you know, the first. The first part of my film, I have to really explain this thing to the audience because I know it is the next film that's coming out. Like, they don't have to do that. They can just like start with it from the beginning because it becomes more in the public know. And I feel it. I feel like through this experience, meeting people like yourselves and really engaging with my activism and meeting people through this film, it feels like OCD is primed to have a moment, to sort of. It feels like maybe the next. I mean, think. I think depression and generalized anxiety is more well understood in the public sector. And I think that. I think that we're starting to be primed to.

D (31:29)

It's our turn.

C (31:30)

Yeah, I think so. I think it's, you know. Absolutely. I think that it's getting there to where people. I have people that have seen this film that knew nothing and, and they found it just as interesting as I did. They were like, oh, I was just interested by all this. This is so fascinating just from a. You know, obviously it's torturous and all these things, but. Yeah, it's also just fascinating to. For. I think the. For the non sufferer to really get a window into what this looks like.

A (31:57)

Yeah. How our brain. Brains sort of try and keep us safe. Right. Yeah. So misguided. But look, I realize we're getting close to time and I guess I'm curious, do you have any last thoughts for anybody who's tuning in in terms of if they're in the thick of the struggle?

C (32:18)

Yeah, absolutely. Well, one. One thing I would say is that this is not a death sentence. And I know that it just feels like it's just like never going to end and you'll never get past this. And that's how it feels when you're in it. I truly know that. I've been there in my own experience. Experience. But it's not. I mean, obviously, if they're already on this podcast. They found people like yourselves and they found different channels that are speaking to this. The treatment is out there. I would say to look into the IOCDF and for resources there. Made of Millions is another fantastic organization that we've partnered with that I found through this experience that has great resources and I think is a little bit younger and has some different, different ideas that are out there. If you want to sort of see the broad scope of things, I'm here in Los Angeles. OCDLA is a fantastic resource and that's where I got my treatment. There's so many resources out there right now. But yeah, in a general sense, I would say you're not alone, that this is a huge, huge 5% of the world's population. You don't have to suffer in silence. You're not alone. And also it's okay to talk about these things, even as your therapist, because that's another thing I'd say is that I think when I was in the thick of it, it took me like eight months to even build up the courage with my therapist meeting every week to even mention the harm thoughts, because I was convinced that I was going to be institutionalized. Like they were going to come get me and lock me away and throw the. Throw the key. And if I even mentioned this idea of it and realizing that as soon as I brought it up, my therapist was. Was like, ah, sounds like you're presenting mentally with OCD a little bit. It was just like such a throwaway that I was like. It literally took me eight months to even like subtly try to like bring that up.

D (33:59)

Right, right.

C (34:00)

And so I think if you're in the thick of it and you're watching this and you're listening, just say that it's okay to trust. You know, if you're with the right therapist and you feel that if you. And you'll only know, but if you're getting treatment and you're with the right therapist, that it's okay to talk about these things that are OCD and that they. They are there to guide you and that the help is there. And yeah, hopefully you can continue to follow people like you. Check out the film, share the film with people in your community. Because I think that knowledge is power and the more that people kind of like an exposure in a very meta way, I think the more that people get exposed to the idea of all these taboo subjects and realize that it's not that crazy, I think that we become a little desensitized to it as a culture and be like, oh, it's not that big a deal. We can just get you the treatment versus trying to, like, deal with this interim period of, like, shame and isolation and struggle. Because that's the biggest thing of all this is that, like I said, once you actually get into the specialized treatment sooner than later, most people are going to get better and you can speak to it too. But I also think that most people with ocd, it really is that first acute onset period that you really are grappling with and dealing with. And then of course, it's lifelong and you're managing it. But it's at least for me, I don't think it could ever be as bad as that first. First wave because I won't allow it to. I'll get ahead of it. I'll know what it is, and it won't take two years of running rampant before I figure out what it is and get treatment. So not that. Not that it goes away by any means, but through periods of remission and periods of managing it. Just knowing that if you're going through it right now, that like, you are in the worst of it and that you can get that treatment and you can get better. And not only get better, but you can thrive. That's another reason I made this film. I wanted sufferers to see somebody like me who was in the worst period of my life, who's now made a film and it's out there in the world and it's got a worldwide distribution deal and it's a movie that's real, that people can experience and see and so also show people like myself that you can accomplish your dreams and that you can not only get better, but you can thrive.

A (36:07)

Wow, what a great message.

D (36:11)

Yes, thank you, Dylan, thank you so.

A (36:13)

Much for being here with us and thanks everyone who was able to join us today. We will be back in a couple weeks time to do this again to chat more about ocd.

C (36:26)

Well, thank you so much for having me on. I thank you for using your platform to amplify not only ocd, but my film. Really appreciate you having me.

A (36:33)

Yeah, absolutely. Thank you.

B (36:40)

Thanks for joining us. Just as a reminder, this podcast is not therapy, nor is it intended as a replacement for therapy. If you need further support, we encourage you to seek treatment with a registered professional who specializes in ocd.

A (36:54)

If you have a moment, we'd love to hear what you think. Feel free to leave us any feedback by reviewing us on your podcast app of choice. You can find past episodes on our website@ purelyocd.com Remember, this podcast is for you, so please let us know what you would like to hear. We want to make our message as helpful as it can be.

B (37:12)

We hope you will join us in the future as we continue our discussion on all things ocd.

C (37:23)

Sat.