Your Privacy: Why You Should Care and Tools to Protect It 8 | 7

Summary

Radical Candor: Communication at Work

Episode: Your Privacy: Why You Should Care and Tools to Protect It
Date: March 25, 2026
Host: Kim Scott
Guest: Guy Kawasaki

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Episode Overview

In this engaging and timely episode, Kim Scott welcomes author, entrepreneur, and podcaster Guy Kawasaki to discuss the critical theme of digital privacy and safeguarding personal communication in our modern world. Sparked by Guy’s new book, Everybody Has Something to Hide, and his growing passion for secure communication tools like Signal, the conversation explores the necessity of privacy, the real impact of surveillance, trust in tech companies, and practical steps for protecting your digital life—even if you think you “have nothing to hide.” Guy and Kim weave personal stories, candid insights, and humor into a captivating conversation designed to help listeners care personally about privacy and learn how to challenge directly the status quo around digital security.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Inspiration Behind the Book and Signal Advocacy

• Guy Kawasaki shares how his interest in privacy and secure messaging was piqued through articles by Wired and the Electronic Frontier Foundation (EFF), as well as an insightful interview with Meredith Whittaker (President of Signal).
  • “It all starts about a year ago... I thought, you know, guy, you should get secure messaging too. And I got interested... people are not going to figure this out, people are not going to use it to its highest potential and, you know, completely safeguard their privacy.” — Guy Kawasaki [01:19]
• He humorously recounts turning down a book contract over a pricing disagreement (“1776” instead of the classic “.99”), leading to a clever Kindle price (“$4.04” for “404 Not Found”).
  • “Because I am so freaking clever, Kim, the price is $4.04.” — Guy Kawasaki [04:23]

2. Privacy and Its Subtle Impact on Candor

• Kim Scott tells a vivid story of living in the Soviet Union, illustrating how being surveilled—even when “having nothing to hide”—fundamentally changes behavior and openness.
  • “I realized the fact that I was being recorded ... was having an impact on what I was willing [to say]. And that is the whole point of censorship, is that it silences you without doing anything. And that's why I think Signal is so important ... candor requires privacy.” — Kim Scott [08:29]
• Guy adds that most people are unaware of how exposed they are in daily digital life, making them overcandid by default—until something goes wrong.
  • “I think that 95% of the world, they are totally oblivious that this could be happening. So they are overly candor because they have no idea that it could happen.” — Guy Kawasaki [09:52]

3. Why Everyone Has Something to Hide

• The practical reality: everyday people regularly share sensitive information (passwords, credit card numbers, personal details) over insecure channels.
  • “A very good test is if you saw your text message on a billboard on the side of a freeway, would you say, ah, no big deal?” — Guy Kawasaki [10:08]
• Guy highlights how privacy isn’t just about illicit activity, but protecting all kinds of personal information—especially in a changing socio-political climate.
  • Example: Concerns about private conversations on reproductive health in certain states [11:31].

4. Trust in Tech Companies: Apple, Google, Meta

• Both Kim and Guy discuss how much trust can (or can’t) be placed in tech giants, noting that while Apple is somewhat more trusted, both Apple and Google have complex motivations and track records.
  • “Google’s business model is to monetize your data. I mean, like they say, you know, if you’re not paying for the product, you are the product.” — Guy Kawasaki [13:07]
  • “I do. It does make me wonder what kind of pressure these people are under that they're behaving. Because I'm like, I really. I'm a huge admirer of Tim Cook and I'm a huge admirer of Sundar Pichai. I think they're both really good human beings and great leaders. And yet I don't admire what's happening.” — Kim Scott [13:45]

5. Tech Leadership, Values, and Society

• They discuss idealism in tech, critiquing the outsized influence of controversial figures, and highlighting the good that idealistic, mission-driven leaders can bring.
  • “The people I worked most closely with in tech are problem solvers and they're idealistic problem solvers. They want to make the world a better place. And somehow we have ceded the microphone to Peter Thiel and Elon Musk and it's time to grab the mic back, I think.” — Kim Scott [14:22]
• Conversation spans social responsibility, universal basic income, and trust in philanthropy, with praise for figures like MacKenzie Scott.

6. Balance: Privacy for Individuals, Transparency for Institutions

• Kim argues for the principle: private individuals need privacy; governments need transparency—an ethos essential to democracy.
  • “Secrets, the kind of secrets that you keep have no place in a democracy. So both privacy and transparency, like, how do you balance that? ... I think that private individuals need privacy. But government organizations need transparency.” — Kim Scott [17:32]
  • “I think it’s a very fair principle.” — Guy Kawasaki [18:14]

7. Tools, Adoption Barriers, and Evangelizing Secure Messaging

• Kim points out practical obstacles in adopting secure tools like Signal (app placement, UX quirks), while Guy emphasizes the social adoption challenge:
  • “The wall you’re going to hit with signal is ... you’re going to say, I don’t know anybody else on Signal, so why am I on signal? ... you have to help people get on signal with you.” — Guy Kawasaki [20:02]
• Guy discusses applying Apple/Canva-style evangelism techniques to spread secure communication tools.

8. The True Stakes of Privacy

• They close by reiterating how privacy underpins candor, healthy relationships, and democracy itself.
  • “Everybody deserves privacy, Kim.” — Guy Kawasaki [21:47]
  • “If you don't have privacy and you become aware that all your messages could be used against you,... you're going to stop talking, you're going to stop thinking in the same way, and you don't want a lack of privacy to impact your own communication with your most intimate relationships.” — Kim Scott [22:15]

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On book pricing creativity:
  “Because I am so freaking clever, Kim, the price is $4.04.” — Guy Kawasaki [04:23]
• On the true test of needing privacy:
  “If you saw your text message on a billboard ... would you say, ah, no big deal?” — Guy Kawasaki [10:08]
• On privacy’s impact on self-expression:
  “That is the whole point of censorship, is that it silences you without doing anything.” — Kim Scott [08:59]
• On trusting tech:
  “If you’re not paying for the product, you are the product.” — Guy Kawasaki [13:07]
• On privacy in democracy:
  “Private individuals need privacy. But government organizations need transparency. Is that a fair principle?” — Kim Scott [17:32]

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• [01:19] – Guy’s inspiration for the book and privacy journey
• [04:23] – Book pricing backstory and Signal for Dummies pitch
• [08:00] – Kim’s Soviet Union story: How surveillance changes behavior
• [10:08] – The “billboard test” for privacy
• [11:31] – When privacy is urgent: real-world examples
• [13:07] – Trusting tech companies: who keeps your secrets?
• [14:22] – Tech leadership & societal ideals
• [17:32] – Principle of privacy vs. transparency in democracy
• [20:02] – The social challenge of adopting secure tools
• [22:15] – Why privacy matters in relationships and democracy

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Final Thoughts

Kim and Guy’s conversation is a call-to-action to care personally about your digital privacy, challenge mainstream complacency, and advocate for practical privacy protections in daily life. The episode is packed with relatable anecdotes, sharp humor, and clear-eyed realism about the state of privacy and digital trust. Want to protect your professional and personal candor? Download Signal, rope in your friends, and don’t wait for the world to change—start leading by safeguarding your own privacy today.

Transcript

[A]

Hello, everybody. I'm Kim Scott. Welcome to the Radical Sabbatical Radical Candor Podcast. You got just me and the authors of books I love for the next couple of months. And today I am thrilled to have with us the great guy Kawasaki, who has done many great things. Most recently, he wrote a book called Everybody Has Something to Hide. And he also wrote is the leader of the Remarkable People podcast. Remarkable. The Remarkable Podcast. Am I getting it right?

[B]

Remarkable People Podcast.

[A]

Remarkable. Remarkable. Try to say that 10 times fast. Remarkable People Podcast. Well, listen, I'm really excited to talk to you about your new book. This is your 18th book. I. I believe you've written 18 books.

[B]

I honestly have lost track.

[A]

Wow, that's amazing. That's amazing. So this is a book about signal and privacy. So what, what made you decide to write this book? And I'll tell you why I decided to read it first. Why did you write it? Which is more important?

[B]

It all starts about a year ago, and I started reading this article by Wired about, you know, how to have complet private and secure messages. And then the EFF had a. Has a website that also explains things like this. So Wired, eff. I started reading about this and let's just say that, you know, there's a different political climate these days. So I thought, you know, guy, you, you, you should get secure messaging too. And I got interested in. I started using Signal. And then I. My best friend from south by Southwest, Hugh Forest, asked me, you know, what do you want to do at south by Southwest this year? I said, I want to interview Meredith Whitaker, who's the president of Signal. And he said, okay. I asked Meredith. She said yes. I did a interview with her at south by Southwest about 11 months ago, and she really blew me away in terms of, you know, sharpness and ethics and taking the high road and all that good stuff. And, you know, the articles by the EFF and Wired, they're kind of like, you know, this is why you should use Signal, and this is how to get started. But the more I use Signal, the more I said, my God, people are not going to figure this out. People are not going to use it to its highest potential and, you know, completely safeguard their privacy. So, you know, there should be something like Signal for Dummies. And I actually, I went to Wiley with this pitch. I said, you know, I'll write. I'll write you Signal for Dummies. And they even sent me a contract, Kim.

[A]

Wow.

[B]

But I'll tell you why I blew that up. So they sent me a contract All I had to do was sign. But I said to them, you know, since you're a publisher, you're going to print it in paper. I want the price of the paper, paper version of the book to be 1776. Right. I mean, seriously. Right?

[A]

Yeah, that makes sense.

[B]

That is a good idea, right?

[A]

That's a great idea.

[B]

And they told me all Four Dummies books ends in 99. And I said to them, so, you know, did. Did God tell you that? Didn't.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Did Moses tell you that? Did you know, Muhammad tell you that? Did Buddha tell you that? Like, where is it laid down that

[A]

it must end at 99?

[B]

Yeah, that has to end in 99. And he said, no, that's just the way it is. So I walk for that contract for 23 cents, and I never looked back. And then. And then I decided it would be Kindle only, electronic only. So I thought, now, what price could I put. I can't put 1776 on a Kindle book. So. Because I am so freaking clever, Kim, the price is $4.04.

[A]

Because the 404. You can't find. Find it.

[B]

Exactly.

[A]

I love it. I love it.

[B]

I'm going to write. I'm going to write a book called Pricing for Dummies.

[A]

Flexible pricing. I love it. And I love that you wrote this book, because Signal did seem, at first, a little bit complicated, I will admit. But after reading your book, I want to show you where Signal is on my phone. I put it, like, right down there on my home screen, like, right next to my. The actual phone. Yeah, there you go. I think that's. I think that should be your first chapter, because part of the problem I had with Signal was that I could never find it on my phone, you know, whereas my chat is right there.

[B]

I mean, we don't want to go down too many rat holes, but for the life of me, I cannot figure out when you add an app to

[A]

your phone, why it goes where it goes.

[B]

Where the hell does it go? Does it go to the first empty space? Does it go to the very. I mean, it's, like, totally random.

[A]

Random. It's random.

[B]

I do. And then. And then you try to drag it, and then, you know, like, everything is. Is squiggling and you try to drag. It doesn't go. You want to put it in a folder. When you drag it to the folder, the folder moves. So it's like. It's like a game. You got to drag your icon and put, like, freaking Tim Cook. He should go to fewer movie Previews and work on the UI of iPhone more.

[A]

Yeah. Make it easy to organize your phone. Totally agree.

[B]

Well, I mean, really, I mean, seriously, before I swear, I had an iPhone so long that I swear that before on your computer it would simulate the iPhone and you could, you know, design. You could drag everything, put it in order and you send it to the phone and say, or reorganize like this. Because that's the way to do that. Where you can point, click and drag. Yeah, yeah.

[A]

They need to hurry back.

[B]

I think the Apple executive teams, they all have, you know, personal assistance. So they just tell people, yeah, download that, put it on the fourth, you know, whatever. Yeah.

[A]

You want to hear why I read the book and why I think everybody needs to read the book and start using signal.

[B]

It's probably because you so admire me as a writer. But go ahead, tell me why.

[A]

Yes, I so admire you as a writer. That's number one. No, number one is I so admire you as a human being. Secondly, as a writer. And thirdly, the reason why I feel like true confession. I'm sure I do have something to hide. When I first read the. When I first saw your title, I was like, I might be the exception to that, but I think it's still really. Privacy is very important, even though I have nothing to hide. And here's why. Early on in my career, I was living and working in what was then the Soviet Union, never thinking that my experiences there were going to be so relevant to my life back home in the United States. And when I was, when I was living and working there, all my phone calls were recorded by the Soviet government. I was working with the military industrial complex, so they were doubly. I wasn't just like a student, I was running around like crazy. Cruise missile factories, and that's another longer story. And so every room I was in had a listening device. Everything I did was recorded. And I could actually trigger the recording by saying cruise missile. And you'd hear this very high pitch beep and it was turning on, you know, slick EM and glick EM, which stands for sea launch cruise missile and ground ground launch cruise missile. So I knew this, but I didn't think it mattered. I was like, I have nothing to hide. I'm not going to get thrown into the gulag archipelago. I have my all powerful American passport. The worst that this government can do is send me back home, which is not the end of the world. I thought it didn't matter that every word that I was uttering was recorded. And then I went to visit a friend in New Jersey. And I called my parents from New Jersey instead of from Moscow that particular week. And as I was talking to my parents, I realized that I was having a more open conversation. I realized the fact that I was being recorded and that maybe somebody else was listening to the words I was saying was having an impact on what I was willing. And that is the whole point of censorship, is that it silences you without doing it anything. And that's why I think signal is so important. Like, it's really important to. Candor is something I care a lot about. And candor requires privacy.

[B]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Well, that. That is a very, very good story. I'm going to tell people that.

[A]

Because you don't realize it's insidious when. When you're. When your privacy is eroded, the ways that it impacts you are really insidious.

[B]

Kim. I actually would make the opposite case, which is I think that 95% of the world, they are totally oblivious that this could be happening. So they are overly candor because they have no idea that it could happen. Right?

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And listen, you know, you have the threat of the gulag and cruise missiles and all that, but people have asked me why you say, everybody has something to hide. And I would say a very good test is if you saw your text message on a bulletin or on a. On a billboard on the side of a freeway, would you say, ah, no big deal, because I don't know about you, Kim, but let me confess that my kids say, dad, you know, like, I want to use your Netflix account. Give me your user ID and password. So what do I do? I text it, right? And my other kids are in college and they say, dad, we cannot figure out the housing system. I said, just send me your user ID and password. Or I'm. I'm visiting them on campus, and I cannot get into the campus wi fi, so I don't. Give me your username and password. So, like, all of those cases or, you know, you're gonna arrange for surfing lessons in Hawaii, and, you know, you know, the Ohana Group doesn't exactly have E commerce setup, so they say, yeah, just call us or text us with your Visa number. Yeah, like, I mean, all of that. I'm not saying you have to be a, you know, fentanyl dealer to use signals.

[A]

Yeah, that's true. You don't want anybody to have your credit card data.

[B]

And then, okay, now, so that's one level of paranoia. But the next level of paranoia is what happens if your niece is in Texas or Florida and says, auntie Kim, I miss my period. I don't know what to do. Wow, man, that kind of discuss. Should I go to Planned Parenthood? Oh, man. Let's take this off WhatsApp.

[A]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. I feel okay, maybe. This is nutty. I feel like if both of us are on an iPhone, I don't feel so bad about sending usernames and password. I don't send the username on. I'll email the username and I'll text the password. How stupid is that idea?

[B]

That's a good idea. I never thought of that. Yeah,

[A]

but still, I like the idea of signal where it's going to disappear. Like they're not going to keep that data forever.

[B]

And you know, I like you. I trust Apple more than I trust Meta or Google.

[A]

Yeah, I trust Google, but I don't trust Meta at all. Yeah, well, but maybe. But let's talk about why. Because a lot of people have told me that I'm just biased because I worked at those two companies.

[B]

Well, but, you know, Google has clearly expressed a willingness to obey subpoenas. Right. So, yeah, that's something to think about. But. And Google's business model is to monetize your data. I mean, like they say.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

You know, if you're not paying for the product, you are the product.

[A]

You are the product. Yeah, yeah.

[B]

And yeah, I think a very good test would be that you should never trust a company whose CEO has gone to an inauguration and donated money and seen the previews of movies. And, you know.

[A]

Well, then Apple's also implicated.

[B]

Exactly. I don't, I, Yeah, I am totally conflicted about Apple because if somebody said to Apple, well, if you, you know, give us a back door to icloud backups, we'll make sure you don't get tariffs. Wow.

[A]

Yeah. Yeah, yeah. That's a lot of. I mean, I do. It does make me wonder what kind of pressure these people are under that they're behaving. Because I'm like, I really. I'm a huge admirer of Tim Cook and I'm a huge admirer of Sundar Pichai. I think they're both really good human beings and great leaders. And yet I don't admire what's happening. The leadership in tech is not distinguishing itself in this moment.

[B]

I admire Apple, I admire Google. I can't say I admire Meta, but, you know, it's.

[A]

It is for me too. I mean, in fact, I'm getting together with a group of people in tech because I think that the the people I worked most closely with in tech are problem solvers and they're idealistic problem solvers. They want to make the world a better place. And somehow we have ceded the microphone to Peter Thiel and Elon Musk and it's time to grab the mic back, I think. So there are a lot of great people in tech. Tech is not full of evil people, but there are some notable exceptions.

[B]

Well, you, you gotta admit that Jeff Bezos's wife, number one awesome person. Awesome, right.

[A]

Not corrupted by her money.

[B]

Yeah. Do you know her personally?

[A]

I don't. I would love to. Do you?

[B]

I mean, I know, I know, not for profits that they told me they're getting, you know, a grant from them. And I said, well, did you have a big application? Was there a lot of interviews and whatever? And they said nope. One day somebody called and said, we like you, we're gonna give you money and there's no strings attached. You don't have to be woke or anti woke. You just do what you're doing.

[A]

Just do what you're doing. I think that, you know, I think that, that our welfare system needs some work. It. But I think it's good to give people, to give families who are in need money. It's better to have to have an economy that will pay people a living wage and we don't have that right

[B]

now listen, I am all for trying the experiment of universal basic income. Right. I mean, yeah, I think that's a worthy experiment. And you know, totally. All these angry people, they say, well then all these people who are not, they're not going to lift a finger, you know, we're going to take them off the food stamps unless they're proved they're working. It's like, you know, can you take at least just the middle road? Doesn't have to be the high road. Just take the middle road for a while. My God.

[A]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. I mean, people love to work. In my experience, like if they're, if they have work that has some meaning for them, you know, and, and people want to do a good job. I don't think that people are lazy. By and large. There's not. I mean, there are a few, but there's not. That is not the problem that we're facing.

[B]

Yeah, I mean, listen, I know a lot of immigrants. I don't see them sitting around just cashing checks all day.

[A]

No, no, no. They're working much harder than you or I do and we're working pretty hard. I'm glad that you and I can have this conversation publicly. That is really important. And I'm glad that we can also turn to Signal and have conversations in private. Privacy is really important, even for people who are pretty open saying what they think in public.

[B]

I think you and I both are as privacy goals. So does democracy. I mean, you cannot have a democratic system that doesn't have privacy.

[A]

Yeah. I'm going to tell you another story. So when I was working in what was then the Soviet Union, I was approached by someone from the CIA. They were trying to recruit me. And I looked at him. It was over lunch. And I was like, secrets, the kind of secrets that you keep have no place in a democracy. So both privacy and transparency, like, how do you balance that? Because I think that private individuals need privacy. But, but, but government organizations need transparency. Is that a fair principle or not? What do you think?

[B]

I think it's a very fair principle.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And yeah, I mean, you know, if you're gonna go into that kind of work, you should just understand that it's a transparent business. Right. And if you. If you want to have, you know, your own protection force and your own fleet of gulf streams and, you know, all that, then go work for the guy with the business card that says, I am the CEO biatch. I mean,

[A]

Yeah, okay. We did diss a couple of people. I'm gonna. You're right. You're right. But. But it was well deserved, by and large. I'm optimistic. I think there's a lot of great people in tech. They're building great products like Signal, and. And people should use them.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And. And. And the people like, you need to get. You know, you are being very loud, and I appreciate that because, listen, I

[B]

do not think I'm being very loud. I think, you know, with this book and with Signal, I think I am helping put the tools in place for the people who are really loud and brave. I. I'm just helping people. And I fully understand that if I have become this kind of unofficial evangelist or signal. Signal can be used for good things or bad things. Right. I mean, if everybody was using Signal during the Epstein days, there would be a lot less in the Epstein file.

[A]

That's true. That's very true. Well, Guy, it's always a pleasure to talk to you, and I so appreciate you writing this book. And I hope that folks will put Signal right on there, right where it belongs, and protect their privacy.

[B]

Well, listen, I. I hope we are at least fired you up a little while looking at Signal, but I got to tell you something, so you're going to hit the wall with signal. And the wall you're going to hit with signal is not that it's hard to use, hard to set up, expensive. It's nothing like that. The wall you're going to hit with signal is when you open up signal, you're going to say, I don't know anybody else on Signal, so why am I on signal? Because my kids aren't my family, isn't my colleagues, you know, all of that. And I'm telling you that you have to help people get on signal with you. It could be just your family, which I haven't succeeded at. But, you know, right now, my most active signal messages is with the people I with. Okay? So in case, you know, we ever say anything bad about surfing, man, our messages are gone. But so it. That. That's the challenge. So much of this book is dedicated to the evangelism techniques that I learned at Apple and Canva of how to get people to embrace a new product, because that is the biggest barrier for Signal.

[A]

Well, I found you. I found one of my good friends from Russia when I was on Signal, So I'm off to the race.

[B]

You know, 2 is critical mass.

[A]

Yeah, absolutely. And we already had a little chat, so. So download it and protect your privacy, because there's gonna be. It's good. I think it's important. I think this is an important moment to do it because it seems like we may need it in the future.

[B]

Unfortunately, if you're a bad guy listening to this, you probably need signal, too. And even if you're a good guy now, I mean, you know, administrations change. You know, lots of things change. So, you know, you may be thinking that everything is hunky dory right now, but you just never know what's going to happen and go either way. Right? So, yeah, everybody. Everybody deserves privacy, Kim.

[A]

Everybody. Yes. Yes, I agree. I totally agree. And if you don't have privacy and you become aware that all your messages, you know, could be used against you, you, you, you, you're going to stop talking, you're going to stop thinking in the same way, and you don't want. You don't want a lack of privacy to impact your own communication with your most intimate relationships.

[B]

Amen. Amen.

[A]

All right, thank you so much. Always a pleasure, guy.

[B]

Thank you.

[A]

And let's keep in touch.

[B]

All right, Bye. Bye.

[A]

The Radical Candor podcast is based on the book Radical Candor via Kick Ass Boss without losing your humanity by Ken Scott. The Radical Candor podcast theme music was composed by Cliff Goldmacher. Follow us on LinkedIn Radical Candor the company and visit us at radicalcandor. Com.