Radio Atlantic: “Is This the End of Kids on Social Media?”

Date: December 4, 2025
Host: Hanna Rosin
Guests: Julie Inman Grant (Australian eSafety Commissioner), Dr. Jo Orlando (Digital Wellbeing Researcher), Australian teens

Episode Overview

This episode of Radio Atlantic explores Australia's bold new law banning people under 16 from having social media accounts on major platforms, beginning December 10, 2025. Host Hanna Rosin unpacks the origins of the legislation, how enforcement might work, the reactions of teens and experts, and the wider implications for society and other countries. The discussion features deeply personal reflections from Australian teens and a candid debate about whether such bans can protect young people—or if they could backfire.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The New Law: Scope and Enforcement

• Australia’s Online Safety Amendment takes effect on December 10, 2025. It bans anyone under 16 from holding accounts on major platforms, including Facebook, Instagram, TikTok, Snapchat, YouTube, and more. Heavy fines await companies that fail to comply.

  • (00:49) Hanna Rosin: “No one under the age of 16 will be legally permitted to have an account on any of the most popular social media platforms. That includes Facebook, Instagram, Kik, Reddit, Snapchat, Threads, TikTok, Twitch, X, and YouTube. So nearly all of them.”

• The legislation is “a radical experiment,” crafted quickly and pushed through with rare bipartisan support. Even its architects admit aspects are untested, including whether age 16 is the right cutoff.

  • (03:03) Hanna Rosin: “The effects will be felt most acutely by kids. And it is truly an experiment. Even the person charged with executing it says that it all moved pretty quickly.”

2. Origins and Political Will

• The idea spread from a South Australian initiative, reportedly prompted by Premier Peter Malinowskis’s wife after finishing Jonathan Haidt’s “The Anxious Generation.”

  • (03:03) Hanna Rosin: “She put the book down and said to me, you better bloody do something about this. And then we got to work.”

• Australian Prime Minister Anthony Albanese frames the bill as direct action for parents:

  • (03:50) Anthony Albanese: “Social media is doing harm to our kids, and I’m calling time on it.”

3. Technical and Social Hurdles

• Age verification is the central enforcement challenge. Simple self-declarations (age gating) are out; platforms must use advanced methods like AI behavioral analysis, government ID verification, and face scans.

  • (06:06) Julie Inman Grant: “Self declaration, age gating is not enough. You need to use a layered safety approach. …They might look at things like 13-year-olds speak to other 13-year-olds. …All of these signals are being picked up by tools that the companies have developed and been using for over a decade.”

• Circumvention is expected. Kids may try VPNs or fake documentation; the law holds platforms responsible for preventing and detecting such workarounds.

  • (08:17) Julie Inman Grant: “Of course, we know that children are going to try and use VPNs and get around things, but the burden’s on the platforms to prevent circumvention.”

• Reporting and Appeals: Mechanisms are required so adults can report underage users who slip through, and wrongly blocked users can appeal.

  • (09:41) Julie Inman Grant: “We’ve also asked them to develop a user reporting form so that parents or educators can report that there’s an under-16 on their platform that has been missed … you need to have an appeals process for those who you may have inadvertently blocked that are 16 and should legitimately be on there."

• Results Tracking: Inman Grant describes plans to monitor closely which platforms are complying and impose fines on those failing to make “reasonable steps.”

  • (10:48) Julie Inman Grant: “I think it’ll be pretty evident in the first couple weeks who is doing this well, who is not doing this well, and who’s not doing it at all… we will be watching and looking at compliance.”

4. Teen Voices: Personal Impact of the Ban

• Anxiety and Isolation: Many teens describe social media as integral—not for content, but for maintaining friendships and making plans.

  • (02:08) Catherine (15): “I just want to be able to communicate with my friends. And without that, I feel like I can’t because I don’t really have anyone’s numbers because it’s, like, inconvenient… I just feel like I’d lose, like, all my friendships.”
  • (15:50) Annie (14): “I feel like it’d be, like, sort of distressing, almost like not being able to have that type of, like, easy way of talking to people. …I’d be, like, lost. Almost like I wouldn’t know what to do.”

• Mixed Anticipation: Some teens acknowledge potential upsides such as increased productivity or less screen time, but many foresee boredom and difficulty maintaining social connections.

  • (16:20) Rachel (13): “I feel like I would feel, like, more productive because I’m not, like, staring at a screen for two hours. So I, like, will go out and hang out with my friends and do all that instead.”
  • (17:00) Cheyenne (15): “I think that will be quite annoying because I’m going to struggle to find entertainment because I’m going to be at home all day. At least I can message people and call people still, but it’s going to be very different.”

5. Expert Analysis: Can Bans Protect Kids?

• Julie Inman Grant: Sees the law as imperfect but hopes for a societal “normative change”—less reliance on digital interaction, more childhood offline, and a shift in parental expectations.

  • (11:14) Julie Inman Grant: “What we’re really hoping for is that there will be a significant normative change for parents so that being on social media all the time is not a battle. …It’s going to be a very broad-ranging longitudinal study to look at what are the benefits, what are the impacts and what are some of the unintended consequences.”

• Dr. Jo Orlando: Digital wellbeing researcher and author. Skeptical about the ban, she argues that banning accounts ignores the deep integration of social media into young people’s lives and may make things worse by pushing usage underground and leaving kids less prepared to navigate platforms later.

  • (19:13) Dr. Jo Orlando: “See, a ban is a technical response… when you think about how all encompassing, culturally, psychologically, social media is, just switching it off isn’t going to work. …Simply switching off social media for young people is one part of just the technology side of it. But we’re missing the social and cultural side and the brain development side here.”

• Media Literacy and Parental Guidance: Dr. Orlando advocates instead for robust, early digital literacy education for both kids and parents to help them understand algorithms, echo chambers, and more.

  • (24:13) Dr. Jo Orlando: “I think what’s really needed first up, I can’t believe we're not thinking about this. …Social media literacy is a thing… It should be just as important as maths and English is at school… I think a second one would be parent education.”

• Risks of Driving Kids Underground: Orlando warns that bans may increase risk because kids who circumvent the rules are less likely to seek adult help if they run into trouble online.

  • (25:51) Dr. Jo Orlando: “The risk for them might actually enhance… If something happens because they’re not allowed to use it, they’re breaking the law. They haven’t told their parents. I think the risk for them then could potentially really enhance.”

6. Global Implications

• The world is watching. Denmark, Norway, New Zealand, and Malaysia are considering similar measures. The US Congress has also taken interest, with Australia’s eSafety commissioner already summoned by lawmakers.

  • (12:28) Hanna Rosin: “Denmark, Norway, New Zealand and Malaysia have said they're interested in some form of ban.”

• Supporters hope the policy will retroactively be seen as historic, especially for younger children who may benefit most. Some older teens reportedly wish such restrictions had existed for them.

  • (27:17) Julie Inman Grant: “It's probably Generation Alpha that will probably experience the most positive generational change. …That's been the really surprising thing we've heard from young people, particularly people over 16. Gosh, I wish this was in place when I was there. I wasted so much time.”

7. Pushback and Legal Challenges

• Not all are on board: two 15-year-olds have challenged the law in Australia’s Supreme Court, comparing it to totalitarian surveillance. But, as of the episode, the government stands firm.
  • (27:59) Hanna Rosin: “Two 15-year-olds challenged the ban last week in Australia’s highest court, saying it disregards children’s rights. One compared it to George Orwell’s 1984, but the Australian government so far is standing firm.”

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• Teen Realization:
  (00:45) Catherine (15): “I don't even know what I'm gonna do. Like, I don't even know what the point of having a phone is anymore.”

• On Technical Evasion:
  (09:02) Julie Inman Grant: “Netflix does it very effectively… so they know how to do this. We're also asking them to prevent what we call age-based circumvention. So generative AI could be used to try and spoof an age assurance system…”

• On Research and Motivation:
  (03:03) Hanna Rosin: “Given the research from all around the world about kids, social media and depression, it was probably inevitable that some country would be brave enough to try this.”

• On Social Media’s Role:
  (17:23) Hanna Rosin: “We don’t really have the right words or metaphors for the role that social media plays in young people’s lives. Like Snapchat isn’t just a disappearing photo app, it’s how many young people meet up, connect, make plans. It’s the staging ground for their social lives.”

• On Social Media Literacy:
  (24:13) Dr. Jo Orlando: “A lot of them don’t even know what algorithms are. …That is a fundamental understanding of social media, that we’re caught in our own algorithm, we’re caught in our own echo chamber.”

• Vision for the Future:
  (27:17) Julie Inman Grant: “They’ll be allowed to have their childhoods… I’d like to believe that we’re on the right side of history here and at least we’re giving it a go.”

Timestamps for Key Segments

• 00:38–02:21 – Introduction of the law, Catherine’s perspective
• 03:03–06:06 – Origin of legislation, enforcement challenges
• 07:16–13:22 – Details on enforcement, technical/circumvention issues
• 14:18–17:23 – Australian teens reflect: anxiety, loss, boredom, possible benefits
• 18:03–25:51 – Dr. Jo Orlando on social media’s role, ban skepticism, need for digital literacy
• 27:17–27:59 – Inman Grant on generational impact, legal challenge

Tone & Takeaways

• The episode carries a thoughtful, sometimes urgent tone. Teens’ voices convey real anxiety and skepticism; experts debate the feasibility and value of radical interventions. The law is presented as an experiment: ambitious, fraught, and globally significant.
• Ultimately, the episode complicates easy answers. It acknowledges both the dangers of adolescent social media use and the complex realities of growing up online.

For listeners seeking to understand the new Australian social media law and its global significance, this episode offers a nuanced, clear-eyed account—anchored in the voices of those most affected.