Space Capsules

Summary

Radiolab – "Space Capsules"

Episode Date: November 20, 2007
Hosts: Jad Abumrad
Podcast: Radiolab (WNYC Studios)

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Overview

This episode of Radiolab, titled "Space Capsules," springs from the iconic Golden Record launched aboard the Voyager space probe—a message in a bottle meant for extraterrestrial listeners, curated by Carl Sagan and Ann Druyan. Host Jad Abumrad invites various creative luminaries—a chef, a composer, a novelist, a comedian, and a writer—to imagine what they themselves would place in a modern "space capsule" as a portrait of humanity. The results are personal, poignant, stirring, and witty, reflecting both the universality and the diversity of human experience.

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Key Discussion Points and Insights

Introduction: The Voyager Golden Record

• [01:43] Jad Abumrad recounts the original Voyager record and its mission:
  • Included a "mixtape of the human experience"—sounds, music, heartbeats, and more—intended for eventual discovery by aliens.
  • Ponders the "cool, somewhat naive, but amazing idea" of sending human culture into the cosmos.
• Radiolab then asks contemporary figures: What would YOU send into space?

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Five Modern "Space Capsules"

1. Alice Waters – The Transformative Power of the Table

[03:17 – 06:03]

• Alice Waters (chef, Chez Panisse):
  • Would send the experience of sharing a meal:
    • A "table" in the broadest sense, as a universal place people gather to eat and communicate.
    • Describes a meal symbolic of connection:
      • "Salad made with all these little young shoots of scallions and little radishes scattered with mustard flowers... fish soup with fennel and some grilled toasts... a little white wine to begin... red wine with cheese at the end."
  • Emphasizes the sensory and communal aspects of eating:
    • Quote: "It's not simply about the food. Yes, I think the food should be delicious, but it's really about communicating, sharing that moment in time." ([05:18])
    • Food as education of the senses, engaging "smell and... touch and taste," making life a "beautiful experience."

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2. Philip Glass – Two Sides of Music, and the Salt March

[06:25 – 09:10]

• Philip Glass (composer):
  • Would choose to send Bach and music from many world traditions.
  • Praises Bach's genius:
    • Quote: "He had the ability to do two things at once... with one part of his brain, he was able to create music that we empathize with." ([06:29])
    • Music as a guide: "He takes you by the hand, as it were, and walks you into states of being that you didn't even know existed." ([06:40])
  • Argues for inclusion of global musical traditions—"throat singing in Siberia," "flute playing... in South India."
  • Shares a personal story:
    • Watching Gandhi's Salt March on film in the Himalayas; deeply moved by the sight of "this tiny little man... surrounded by thousands upon thousands of people leading this march." ([08:36])
    • The Salt March as a symbol of social change: "How people that appear to be powerless and insignificant can bring about huge changes." ([09:04])

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3. Michael Cunningham – The Power of Music, Film, and Speeches

[09:16 – 13:12]

• Michael Cunningham (author, The Hours):
  • Would send:
    • A Chopin nocturne—envies the expressiveness of music compared to writing.
    • "Joni Mitchell’s Blue" as a love song that remains meaningful both at 15 and 50.
    • "Bernard Herrmann’s soundtrack from Vertigo," and "great Hollywood music," which stirs us because "we want to be swept away."
  • Cites Hollywood stories as mirrors to "passions that we harbor in our tiny little breasts" ([11:14]).
  • Recalls iconic lines and moments—from Faye Dunaway in Chinatown to MLK's mountaintop speech:
    • The King speech as an exemplar of faith amidst adversity:
      • Quote: "It has always seemed to me one of the most remarkable human instances of faith and love and belief in the face of the worst that can happen." ([12:14–12:34])

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4. Margaret Cho – The Beautiful, the Everyday, and the Affirming

[13:34 – 16:27]

• Margaret Cho (comedian, author, activist):
  • Would send:
    • Cultural icons: "Elvis Costello and Björk, who's also somewhat of an alien."
    • Wagner's "Tristan and Isolde"—her favorite opera.
    • The unique sound of dogs imitating sirens: "We almost never see the dogs on our planet make that o shape with their mouths. I love that sound."
    • A photograph of the first lesbian couple married in San Francisco:
      • Quote: "The image of these two women... finally getting [acceptance] for a moment is just so spectacular and heartbreaking and heart exploding at the same time." ([15:33])
    • "Mandarin oranges canned in heavy syrup... almost like a kiss. I would never, ever want any alien to be deprived of the joy of a geisha canned mandarin orange in heavy syrup."

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5. Neil Gaiman – Strangeness, Stories, and Humanity’s Range

[16:27 – 19:10]

• Neil Gaiman (writer, storyteller):
  • Would send:
    • "The Wizard of Oz" film:
      • Calls it "an incredibly peculiar movie," rich with "strangeness and a hope and an oddness," with "really cool songs." ([17:04])
      • Imagines alien social scientists puzzling over "The Office" (UK TV series):
        • "Some people never quite notice that it’s a comedy... I'd love to see what the aliens make of it." ([17:35–17:54])
    • Lou Reed’s "Street Hassle," for its depiction of "horrible urban grunge and death and prostitution" ([18:16]).
    • The Arabian Nights ("giant 2000 page Arabian Nights")—giving a skewed but rich perspective on storytelling and world history.
    • Shakespeare, if reduced to a single line:
      • Quote: "We are such stuff as dreams are made of." ([19:07])

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• Alice Waters [05:18]:

  "It's not simply about the food. Yes, I think the food should be delicious, but it's really about communicating, sharing that moment in time."

• Philip Glass [06:29]:

  "He had the ability to do two things at once... with one part of his brain, he was able to create music that we empathize with."

• Philip Glass [09:04]:

  "It articulates in this very simple act how societies change, how people that appear to be powerless and insignificant can bring about huge changes."

• Michael Cunningham [12:14 – 12:34]:

  "It has always seemed to me one of the most remarkable human instances of faith and love and belief in the face of the worst that can happen." (on MLK's final speech)

• Margaret Cho [15:33]:

  "[Their] image... is just so spectacular and heartbreaking and heart exploding at the same time." (On the first married lesbian couple in San Francisco)

• Neil Gaiman [19:07]:

  "We are such stuff as dreams are made of." (Quoting Shakespeare from "The Tempest")

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• Introduction and Voyager Golden Record – [01:43 – 03:13]
• Alice Waters (Food & Connection) – [03:17 – 06:03]
• Philip Glass (Bach, Salt March) – [06:25 – 09:10]
• Michael Cunningham (Music, Films, Speeches) – [09:16 – 13:12]
• Margaret Cho (Icons, Oranges, Affirmation) – [13:34 – 16:27]
• Neil Gaiman (Oz, The Office, Arabian Nights, Shakespeare) – [16:27 – 19:10]

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Conclusion

Radiolab’s "Space Capsules" episode is a reflective, inspiring collage of what makes us human—our desire for connection, our passion for art, our assertion of justice and love, and our sense of humor and strangeness. It’s a time capsule for aliens and ourselves, showcasing not only distinctive choices, but also the ever-present hope that our best selves might be understood—even light years away.

Transcript

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[Radiolab Host or Guest]

I quite you're listening to Radio Lab.

[Radio Lab Announcer]

The podcast from New York Public Radio.

[Margaret Cho]

Public Radio, WNYC.

[Jad Abumrad]

And npr. Hello everyone. Jad here from Radiolab. This is the Radiolab podcast. Something a little different this week. A while back we did a program on the Romance of Spirit, and as part of that program I interviewed Ann Druyan, who is Carl Sagan's widow, about how they made the gold record that went aboard the Voyager space capsule. On that record was a kind of mixtape of the human experience. All of these different sounds, music, natural sounds, heartbeats, all kinds of different sounds which represent life on earth so that it would go on this record, go into a capsule, get shot into space, and one day, billions of years from now, be discovered by some alien life form who then play the record and then know about us? That's the idea. We thought, what a cool, somewhat naive, but amazing idea. And it got us thinking, what would we do if we could put stuff on that record? So then we began to ask people around us and eventually tracked down some writers, chefs, artists, different kinds of folks who are out there in the public eye and asked them, what would you put on the record we got a bunch of answers back. We put a few on the show that we broadcast, and a couple we weren't able to include for time. So we're gonna play them for you now. Five space capsules, okay, from five different people, starting with Chef Alice Waters.

[Radiolab Host or Guest]

When are they coming?

[Jad Abumrad]

No, they're coming.

[Alice Waters]

Second Stadium.

[Jad Abumrad]

Yeah.

[Alice Waters]

9:15. I'm Alice Waters, and I run Chez Panisse restaurant in Berkeley, California.

[Jad Abumrad]

Who's the other one?

[Alice Waters]

The Ravinians.

[Philip Glass]

Six people.

[Alice Waters]

When I thought about this, the first thing that came to my mind was a table, because that's a place where people come together to eat. Everyone has to eat. And normally, people of all cultures have gathered around a table of sorts. Maybe not a table that had chairs all around, maybe a fabric that was laid out on the floor. It's a place where we communicate to each other. I absolutely imagine food on the table. We're in a moment of spirit here at the restaurant. So we're serving the first peas. Certainly would have a salad made with all these little young shoots of scallions and little radishes scattered with mustard flowers at this moment in time. And maybe we could have some fish soup with fennel and some grilled toasts. Well, we're drinking a little white wine to begin, and then probably we're going to have some red wine with some cheese at the end. I want the experience of being connected sitting at that table. I love to talk at the table. It's not simply about the food. Yes, I think the food should be delicious, but it's really about communicating, sharing that moment in time. My vision is really about opening people's senses and educating their senses so that they can experience this world in the fullest possible way. Food is a way of doing that. It's an everyday experience that engages your sense of smell and your touch and taste, and it can be a beautiful experience.

[Jad Abumrad]

All right, that was Chef Alice Waters. Next up, this you may remember from the space show. We played a part of it. Composer Philip Glass. As you listen, think about what you would put onto that capsule. A song, piece of writing, maybe a photograph. How would you want an alien to best see you and us? Here's Philip Glass.

[Philip Glass]

This is Philip Glass speaking. The reason I've chosen Bach is that he had the ability to do two things at once. One was to deal concretely with the language of music. Almost, you can say grammar of music at the same time. While he was doing that, let's say with one part of his brain, he was able to create music that we empathize with. He takes you by the hand, as it were, and walks you into states of being that you didn't even know existed. Bach goes out in the spaceship, whether anybody can hear it or not. We'll put it in the spaceship. But I would also recommend strongly that we bring music in from other world traditions, whether it's from Africa or whether it's kind of a throat singing that you might hear in Siberia or in the Arctic, or a wonderful flute playing that you might hear in South India. I was in India in 1966 or 67, and I was in a small village in the Himalayas called Kalimpong on the border of Bhutan and Tibet. And a friend of mine, a rug dealer, I had been in his shop numerous times to look at his rugs, ran over the shop and said, oh, Mr. Glass, come with me. I want to show you a picture. And he had gotten a hold of a film clip of Gandhi. It was a march he took in the 30s called the. It was known as the Salt March. English had put a tax on the use of salt. Thousands and thousands of people joined him, and they walked into the sea and they took their garments, put them into the water, and harvested the salt.

[Margaret Cho]

There is an indefinable, mysterious power that pervades everything.

[Jad Abumrad]

I feel it, though I do not see it.

[Philip Glass]

And I saw the picture of this tiny little man, really, surrounded by thousands upon thousands of people leading this march, and it was so moving. I think what you'd have to do is get that piece of footage. It articulates in this very simple act how societies change, how people that appear to be powerless and insignificant can bring about huge changes.

[Jad Abumrad]

Okay, that was Philip Glass. Now for our third space capsule from author Michael Cunningham.

[Radiolab Host or Guest]

My name is Michael Cunningham, and I wrote the novel the Hours. If it were up to me, there are a few things that I would absolutely send into space. I would send a Chopin nocturne. I am always envious of music. Every minute I'm trying to commit a sentence to paper. What I'm thinking is, oh, if only this could be music. My favorite love song is probably Joni Mitchell's Blue. Joni Mitchell is the. Is the voice of our transcendent sorrows. It's remarkable to me that I could listen to Joni Mitchell at 15, before I quite knew what love was, and think, oh, yeah. And I can listen to her at 50 as a scarred veteran of the love wars and think, oh, yeah. One of the things I would. That I find that I listen to over and over again. Bernard Herman soundtrack From Vertigo. I think great Hollywood music is stirring to us because we want to be swept away. It's particular to our species. Emma Bovary wanted to be swept away. Anna Karenini wanted to be swept away. Huck Finn did. And Hollywood at its best best gives us 30 foot tall people who actually feel equal to the passions that we harbor in our tiny little breasts.

[Margaret Cho]

She's my daughter.

[Radiolab Host or Guest]

Faye Dunaway in Chinatown saying to Jack.

[Commercial Narrator]

Nicholson, my sister, my daughter.

[Radiolab Host or Guest]

She's my sister. She's my daughter.

[Commercial Narrator]

I said, I want the truth.

[Radiolab Host or Guest]

She's my sister. She's my daughter.

[Margaret Cho]

She's my sister and my daughter.

[Philip Glass]

Get it?

[Jad Abumrad]

Understand?

[Radiolab Host or Guest]

Or is it too tough for you?

[Margaret Cho]

Or is it too tough for you?

[Commercial Narrator]

We've got some difficult days ahead. But it really doesn't matter with me now because I've been to the mountaintop.

[Radiolab Host or Guest]

I couldn't tell you when I first heard that speech by Martin Luther King. It has always seemed to me one of the most more remarkable human instances of faith and love and belief in the face of the worst that can happen.

[Commercial Narrator]

And I've seen the promised land. I may not get there with you, but I want you to know the night that we as a people will get to the promised land. So I'm happy tonight. I'm not worried about anything. I'm not fearing any man. Mine eyes have seen the glory of the coming of the Lord.

[Jad Abumrad]

Okay, now for our last two capsules. These kind of got lost at space themselves. The audio is a bit crappy. Any case, just imagine you're an alien. You're out there in the ether and you bump into into this capsule, you open it up, find the record, you pop it open, you understand English and this is what you hear. Two space capsules from Margaret Cho, the comedian and author Neil Gaiman.

[Margaret Cho]

My name is Margaret Cho. I am a stand up comedian. I'm a fashion designer, an author, a political activist. I'm a filmmaker, I sing and I'm a political commentator on television shows where I get in fights with other pundits. Well, let's see. I would send some people who are eternally beautiful and perfect to me, like Elvis Costello and Bjork, who's also somewhat of an alien. And Tristan and Isolde by Wagner, which is my favorite opera and should be heard by everyone in the universe. I think that my favorite sounds I would send are when a dog hears a siren and then purses his dog lips and tries to replicate the siren. It's a. And we almost never see the dogs on our planet make that o shape with their mouths. I love that sound. I would put up a photograph of the first lesbian couple to be married. We've been over 50 years together and were married in Gavin Newsom's office, secretly in San Francisco just a couple of months ago. I now pronounce you spouses for life. The image of these two women who have been fighting for acceptance and truth and equality for their entire lives and finally getting it for a moment is just so spectacular and heartbreaking and heart exploding at the same time. Let's see. Mandarin oranges canned in heavy syrup. I love them. They're delicious. I mean, they are dangerous. They're not fresh. They are an aberration of nature. They don't taste like that in nature, but they're so tender and delicate and tart and almost like a kiss. I would never, ever want any alien to be deprived of the joy of a geisha. Canned mandarin orange and heavy syrup.

[Neil Gaiman]

My name is Neil Gaiman. I'm a writer of things and a storyteller. What would I like to send into space? What would I like to preserve? All right, now you can open them. We'll gaze into the crystal. The wizard of Oz.

[Commercial Narrator]

What's this I see? A house with a picket fence.

[Neil Gaiman]

The original weatherman.

[Margaret Cho]

That's our farm.

[Neil Gaiman]

It's an incredibly peculiar movie. I like the idea that an alien race could try and figure out what we were like by watching the wizard of Oz. Her name is, yes, the Munchkins.

[Philip Glass]

But there's a.

[Neil Gaiman]

There's a strangeness and a hope and an oddness to that film. And some really cool songs.

[Commercial Narrator]

Follow the yellow brick road Follow the.

[Alice Waters]

Yellow brick road Follow the yellow brick road.

[Neil Gaiman]

One thing I'd love to send the aliens, just because I love the idea of thousands upon thousands of brilliant alien social scientists trying to decode it, is the English television series the Office.

[Radio Lab Announcer]

Hiya.

[Philip Glass]

Come in.

[Neil Gaiman]

Which is the kind of comedy that.

[Philip Glass]

Just want to know why you think they're leaving.

[Neil Gaiman]

Mate. Has no laugh track.

[Philip Glass]

I'm not. I'm not thinking of leaving. I am leaving. Sure, sure.

[Neil Gaiman]

Some people never quite notice that it's a comedy.

[Philip Glass]

It's nothing I've said or done. No, not at all. Definitely not.

[Neil Gaiman]

And I would love to send them that because I don't put words in your mouth, but what sort of a boss would you say I am?

[Philip Glass]

I'm a good boss.

[Neil Gaiman]

I'd love to see what the aliens make of it.

[Philip Glass]

Okay, David, listen to me, all right?

[Neil Gaiman]

No, you listen to me, Tim. I like depressing art sometimes. I mean, I like the range, the whole chromatic range of art. I'd love to send Lou Reed's street hassle sort of 18 minute song about horrible urban grunge and death and prostitution.

[Radio Lab Announcer]

And murder and stuff was in Matilda.

[Jad Abumrad]

Ripped out her wallet.

[Radio Lab Announcer]

The sex report.

[Alice Waters]

You smiled in dismay.

[Neil Gaiman]

I'd love to send the aliens that as well. It's like, hey, we do this too. I like the idea of pointing out to them that we come in an awful lot of flavors. I was thinking perhaps I'd send them the Arabian Nights. The complete giant 2000 page Arabian Nights. Just because there are so many stories. It would give them a very skewed view of the world as this place that's based in and around 11th century Baghdad. But that may not be a bad thing. The joy of books is there is nothing that encapsulates humanity. You'd want to send them Shakespeare. I think if I had to send just one line, it would be we are such stuff as dreams are made of.

[Jad Abumrad]

Well, that is it for the Radiolab podcast this week. These space capsules were made with the crew from back in the day. Alice Waters was produced by Jocelyn Gonzalez. Neil Gaiman was produced by Muki Yorki, Ranta. Margaret Cho produced by Trent Wolby. Who else should I thank? Lulu Miller, our current producer, Ellen Horn, our executive producer and of course our funders, the Alfred P. Sloan foundation, the Corporation for Public Broadcasting and the National Science Foundation. I'm Jad Abumrad. Thanks for listening.

[Radio Lab Announcer]

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