Radiolab – “Stayin’ Alive”

Episode Date: June 2, 2009
Hosts: Jad Abumrad & Robert Krulwich

Episode Overview

In “Stayin’ Alive”, Radiolab takes a characteristically inventive look at the one thing no one can avoid: death. Through four distinct but interwoven stories, the episode explores big questions about the line between life and death, whether our essence or information can survive, the possibility of reviving what’s lost, and a real-world lesson in staying alive—via CPR set to the Bee Gees’ disco classic.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Boundary Between Life and Death

[03:09 – 05:51]

• Robert Krulwich and Jad Abumrad bring in George Church (Harvard geneticist) to probe whether death is truly absolute.
• Church argues that death may not be a sharp threshold—a “point of no return”—but a continuum, especially as technology advances:
  • “Depending on the probability of a doctor coming into the room… and the probability of more advanced technology being able to reverse all kinds of pathological damage, there's a value to saying that there is a continuum between life and death.” (George Church, 04:12)
  • Church speculates about the “information” perspective: if you could record the position of every atom in a person, you could theoretically reconstruct them, even after total destruction.
  • “The main thing that is retained through all this is the information.” (George Church, 05:49)
• Memorable exchange:
  • Robert: “Wait, wait. At some point… you will be dead.”
  • Church: “Unmistakably over with current technology, but not necessarily with future technology.” (04:32)

2. Becoming Part of the Ecosystem

[06:14 – 10:10]

• The episode shifts tone with a story from Bernd Heinrich (biologist, University of Vermont). He recounts being asked by a dying student, Bill, to be buried in the wild—a nod to Edward Abbey’s famous “abbey burial,” in tune with nature.
• Heinrich articulates a different comfort with death:
  • “A casket would be… an unacceptable cage for otherwise free and ever-recycling molecules.” (08:37)
  • He finds the idea of decomposing and being reabsorbed into the web of life “comforting” rather than “frightening”:
    • “To be part of the ecosystem, to be composed into grass, to be composed into ravens, to be composed into flowers and trees… that's a comforting thought to me.” (09:10)
• Hosts reflect on this vision of death as “release.” Jad raises the counterpoint: for all the beauty of physical transformation, the person—“the union that was here”—is gone, leaving a “vacancy.” (10:07)

3. Information Never Truly Dies?

[10:10 – 13:19]

• Jad introduces the concept of lost languages, referencing David Eagleman (neuroscientist). Every 14 days, a language is lost forever; with it, unique collections of ideas die.
• Eagleman shares a stunning (if speculative) proposal: What if conversations during ancient pottery-making were, by micro-vibrations, unintentionally etched onto the surface—making the pottery, in effect, a primordial record?
  • “If you could play it back from these pieces of Roman pottery, you could actually hear the people in the room talking in Latin.” (12:14)
  • Though unlikely, the thought experiment illustrates our deepening ability, through technology, to revive what’s believed irretrievable.
  • “We're constantly coming up with new technologies where then we can retrieve things that we once thought were dead.” (12:34)

4. An Ode to “Persisters”: How to Stay Alive (with CPR)

[13:38 – 16:53]

• Producer Ellen Horn visits a CPR training class in Manhattan, led by Alison Inaba, pediatric emergency physician.
• Correct CPR tempo is crucial, but students struggle to internalize “100 beats per minute.” Inaba’s innovative teaching tip: anchor the tempo to a pop song.
  • “I thought, find a song, a popular song that had a beat of approximately 100 beats per minute.” (15:22)
• The perfect track? The Bee Gees’ “Stayin’ Alive.”
  • “The song he came up with… Stayin' Alive by the Bee Gees.” (15:40)
• The tip caught fire, spreading to CPR classes worldwide.
  • Further, Queen’s “Another One Bites the Dust,” also at 100 bpm, is considered—though with a darkly comic edge:
    • Jad: “Oh, that's so wrong.” (16:35)

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

On the Nature of Death

• “I think there’s a continuum between non-living and living. … There will be a certain point in which you are unmistakably over with current technology, but not necessarily with future technology.”
  — George Church, [04:29–04:32]

On Returning to Nature

• “To be part of the ecosystem, to be composed into grass, to be composed into ravens, to be composed into flowers and trees. You know, that's a comforting thought to me.”
  — Bernd Heinrich, [09:10]

On Lost Languages & Information Retrieval

• “We're constantly coming up with new technologies where then we can retrieve things that we once thought were dead.”
  — David Eagleman, [12:34]

On CPR & Staying Alive

• “The song he came up with... Stayin' Alive by the Bee Gees.”
  — Alison Inaba, [15:40]
• “Another one bites the dust.”
  — Alison Inaba (suggested as a song for CPR), [16:32]

Key Timestamps

• 03:09 — Introduction to death continuum with George Church
• 06:14 — Bernd Heinrich on ecological burial and returning to nature
• 10:10 — Jad & Eagleman on lost languages and information persistence
• 13:49 — CPR class scene: teaching the right tempo with “Stayin’ Alive”
• 16:32 — “Another One Bites the Dust” joke in CPR class

Episode Tone and Style

The episode is lively, thought-provoking, and gently humorous, matching Radiolab’s signature blend of curiosity and sound-rich storytelling. The hosts toggle between philosophical speculation and earthy practicality, with warmth, gentle irreverence, and deeply human curiosity grounding even their wildest thought experiments.

Summary

“Stayin’ Alive” investigates the permeability of the boundary between life and death—from the standpoint of science, ecology, culture, and practical medicine. The episode’s stories—ranging from cryonics fantasies, through ecological burial wishes, to CPR set to disco—underscore how humans both fear and yearn to transcend death, whether through preservation, transformation, or revival. The final note, tying staying alive to the beat of a Bee Gees track, wryly grounds the cosmic in the everyday: sometimes, saving a life is a matter of keeping the right rhythm, one that listeners might just carry with them for the rest of their lives.