Radiolab – "This Is Your Brain On Love" (August 28, 2007)

Podcast Host: Jad Abumrad (WNYC Studios/Radiolab)
Guests/Contributors: Neely Tucker (Washington Post), Dr. Helen Fisher (Anthropologist), Annie Drouyen (Voyager Interstellar Record Project)

Episode Overview

In true Radiolab style, this episode explores the science and story of love—from the biochemistry buzzing inside our brains to the cosmic romance of Carl Sagan and Annie Drouyen during the Voyager project. Broadcasting live from a public radio singles event at Brooklyn Brewery, Jad Abumrad dissects the chemical components of love (dopamine, norepinephrine, oxytocin) and reflects on how these relate to passion, infatuation, and long-term attachment. The episode closes with an extraordinary real-life love story that traverses not just human hearts but the stars themselves.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Singles Event and the Big Question: "What is Love?"

• Setting: Radiolab hosts a singles mixer at Brooklyn Brewery for public radio fans.
• Theme: How does love work on a chemical—and human—level?
• Jad Abumrad’s opening challenge:

  “What is love?” (03:49)

• Audience interaction: Attendees wear name tags labeled with different “love chemicals” (dopamine, norepinephrine, oxytocin) to spark conversation and discussion.

2. The Chemistry of Love – Breaking Down the “Chemical Posse”

a) Dopamine – The Spark of Romantic Euphoria

Guest: Neely Tucker (05:17)

• Description:

  “Dopamine is essentially the chemical that makes you feel good in your brain when you’re really, truly, madly in love ... [it] just lights up as something that feels really terrific.” (05:34)

• Function:
  • Responsible for the rush and euphoria of new romance.
  • Likened to the reward pathway activated by drugs.
• Scientific Note: Dr. Helen Fisher’s MRI studies revealed:

  “One of the most important [brain regions activated by love] was a brain region that becomes active when you feel the rush of cocaine.” (07:17)

• Jad’s summary:

  “…when people say love is a drug, it is literally true.” (07:37)

b) Norepinephrine – The Focus of Infatuation

Guest: Neely Tucker (08:30)

• Description:

  “Norepinephrine is a neurotransmitter... what communicates good feelings back and forth, and the faster it goes, the better you’re going to feel... It really leads to very focused thought, attention.” (08:35)

• Difference from Dopamine:

  “Dopamine is the party… Norepinephrine is the thing that makes you ask the good looking blonde... to drop by your place later...” (08:57)

• Physical Effects:
  • Heightens alertness and physical signs: pounding heart, clammy hands, weak knees. (09:49)
• Summary:

  "Norepinephrine is the thing that literally makes your heart pound..." (09:49)

c) Oxytocin – The Foundation of Attachment

Guest: Neely Tucker (12:01), Annie Drouyen

• Description:

  “Oxytocin... is a long-lasting chemical in your brain that can continue to flow without frying your brain... it’s a much more sustainable way to live.” (12:07)

• Emotional Impact:
  • Associated with peace, stability, companionship.

  “The long term or lifelong commitment... encompasses friendship, companionship, and at the end of things, love. That’s sort of what sustains us all.” (12:40)

• Jad’s summary of the trio:

  “In order to have a lasting true love, you need all three chemicals, people, all three. A chemical ménage à trois is what’s in order.” (13:03)

3. Love in Action: The Chemical Name Tag Game

(13:03–14:22)

• Activity: Attendees are encouraged to speak with others wearing different “chemical” nametags and use conversation starters, literally enacting the “chemical ménage à trois” notion for building relationships.

4. Science-Meets-Romance Anecdote: Trying to Hack Love

Speaker: Dr. Helen Fisher (14:42)

• Story: A graduate student attempted to “hack” love by increasing dopamine via an exciting rickshaw ride with his crush, hoping to make her fall for him.

  “An hour later, they get down off of the rickshaw, and she throws her hands up and she says, ‘Wasn’t that wonderful? And wasn’t that rickshaw driver handsome?’” (16:04)

• Moral: The chemistry of love is unpredictable; “you can’t always game the system.”

5. The Most Romantic True Story: Carl Sagan & Annie Drouyen

Segment begins: (17:17)

a) Voyager Gold Record—A Cosmic Message of Love

• Annie Drouyen describes assembling the Voyager Golden Record:

  “…it was a kind of sacred trust…building a cultural Noah’s Ark…” (17:41) “…and it was also the season that Carl Sagan and I fell so madly in love with each other.” (18:07)

• Sounds chosen for the record: Bach, Beethoven, Mozart, human greetings in multiple languages, whale song, and more. (19:01–19:11)

b) Falling in Love by Phone—A True-Life Sci-Fi Romance

• The moment Carl and Annie confessed their feelings:

  “He said, I get back to my hotel room and I find this message and it says annie called. And I say to myself, why didn’t you leave me this message ten years ago, and my heart completely skipped a beat. I can still remember itself so perfectly. And I said, for keeps. And he said, you mean get married? And I said, yes.” (19:50–21:10)

• They were married two months later, and together until Carl’s death.
• The metaphysical twist: Annie’s own brainwaves, REM, and thoughts of love were recorded for the Voyager record:

  “…part of what I was thinking in this meditation was about the wonder of love and of being in love, and to know it’s on those two spacecraft.” (23:30)

• Poignant close:

  “…whenever I’m down, you know, I’m thinking. And still they mover, 35,000 miles an hour, leaving our solar system for the great wide open sea of interstellar space.” (24:04)

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• Jad Abumrad:

  “Dopamine… you are the reason for all the sugary pop songs on the radio.” (06:18)

• Dr. Helen Fisher:

  “When people say love is a drug, it is literally true.” (07:37)

• Neely Tucker:

  “Dopamine is the party… Norepinephrine is the thing that makes you ask the good looking blonde... to drop by your place later.” (08:57)

• Annie Drouyen:

  “It was a sacred undertaking because it was saying, we want to be citizens of the cosmos. We want you to know about us.” (19:15)

• Annie Drouyen - On falling in love with Carl Sagan:

  “We had never kissed. We had never... even had any kind of personal discussion before we both hung up the phone and I just screamed out loud.” (21:00)

• Annie Drouyen - On love’s legacy:

  “And still they move 35,000 miles an hour, leaving our solar system for the great wide open sea of interstellar space.” (24:18)

Key Timestamps

• 01:33 — Jad Abumrad introduces the live singles event and the episode’s focus
• 05:17 — Neely Tucker explains dopamine
• 07:08 — Dr. Helen Fisher’s fMRI research on love
• 08:30 — Norepinephrine and its role in attraction
• 11:34 — Introduction of oxytocin and long-term attachment
• 13:03 — Summary of the three chemicals and the name tag activity
• 14:42 — Helen Fisher’s story about trying to manufacture love
• 17:17 — Annie Drouyen recounts assembling the Golden Record
• 19:50 — Annie describes the pivotal phone call with Carl Sagan
• 23:30–24:18 — Annie reflects on her brainwaves and love traveling into interstellar space

Conclusion

"This Is Your Brain On Love" masterfully blends science, humor, and humanity. It dissects love on the molecular level for singles hoping to connect, then soars to a beautiful, cosmic story that proves love, in all its messy, inexplicable glory, is both chemical and transcendent. Whether in the rush of dopamine or the enduring power of oxytocin—or on a golden record riding a spacecraft into eternity—love’s story is always more than its parts.

For further exploration:

• Check out Helen Fisher’s research and Annie Drouyen’s work on the Voyager project for deeper dives into both science and story.
• Sample the episode’s creative “molecular stings” by Iamjen.

This summary omits ads and non-content segments as requested.