← Raging Moderates with Scott Galloway and Jessica Tarlov
Raging Moderates with Scott Galloway and Jessica Tarlov
A New Vision for the American Dream (ft. Mallory McMorrow)
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- [00:01]
Adobe Representative
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- [00:37]
Megan Rapinoe
Megan Rapinoe here this week on A Touch More, we are joined by my longtime U.S. women's national teammate Allie Krieger. We talk about her post retirement plans, the current generation of soccer players, and of course, her boots. Sue and I also get into big WNBA trades and share a new Workout of the week, one you can do from your own home. Check out the latest episode of A Touched. More wherever you get your podcasts and on YouTube.
- [01:11]
Jessica Tarlev
Welcome to Raging Moderates. I'm Jessica Tarlev. When Michigan Senator Gary Peters announced in January that he wouldn't run for reelection, it set off immediate speculation about who would run to hold the crucial Democratic seat. My guest today is Mallory McMorrow, and she's running for that spot. She's been a Michigan state senator since 2019 and has been seen by many as a fast rising star in the Democratic Party. I'm one of those people who is obsessed with your 2022 speech, which I want to talk to you about. I'm a few years late. Mallory McMarrow, thank you so much for joining me and welcome to the show.
- [01:42]
Mallory McMorrow
Thanks for having me.
- [01:43]
Jessica Tarlev
I want to start big picture, like, how's the campaign going? Your fundraising has been incredible. I'm not surprised. But can you talk about how it's been going so far and why you think so many folks are connecting with your campaign?
- [01:56]
Mallory McMorrow
Yeah, the campaign is going really well. I outraised every other candidate in the field on both sides of the aisle in my first quarter in. We raised $2.1 million, which is a big number in and of itself. But more impressive to me is that it came from 28,000 individual donors. We got all 83 counties here in Michigan, 97% of our donations were a hundred bucks or under with zero corporate PAC dollars. So we were making a big bet that people would like the campaign that we're running, and so far that's panning out. We are on a statewide brewery tour, which I'm super excited about.
- [02:32]
Jessica Tarlev
Cause you like beer or cause you're having fun.
- [02:33]
Mallory McMorrow
I like. Well, I am very proudly the 2025 beer defender of the Year from the Michigan Brewers Guild. My proudest achievement. So the brewers have been helping us plan this and I just. We have to bring more people into politics and into Democratic politics. And what better way than just to invite people to grab a beer and get to know me. We're closing down any of the venues, we're not pre vetting any of the questions. And our events are getting bigger and bigger and bigger. We did four stops, we did four breweries in four counties in 24 hours to do our kind of trial run. And you know, this is a November 2026 election. I expected maybe a couple tables of people would come out to each stop. We had more than 750 people that first weekend. So we've had to expand the time that we're at each brewery and it just keeps building. So I feel really, really good about the campaign and I think it's connecting with people because people desperately crave authenticity number one and somebody who sounds and looks very different. I think there's a lot of burnout on politics as usual. Something that feels very stale. And it's the same kind of candidate forums and you're in drop ceiling halls to talk about issues. My brother in law is a realtor and he said this I think better than anybody else you can imagine. He has a lot of different types of clients. And he said, mal, you know, this is a popularity contest and people won't vote for you if they don't like you. So we are running a campaign now this early, just to get to know people first. You know, I want people to know me as a mom and a Michigander and somebody who wasn't always in politics. I'm somebody who likes cars. I used to be a Hot Wheels designer. I bartended my way through college. Let's build up that relationship. And I want people to tell me what they need, need what's going on in their life so that we can build a campaign and a policy agenda that is actually responsive. Instead of me dictating to people, you know, here are my ideas. And that's the only thing that I'm going to tell you. That's not what people are looking for.
- [04:37]
Jessica Tarlev
It's very millennial to crowdsource your policy platform. And I like that. I'm feeling that deeply as an elder millennial myself and something that you've been talking about that has really affected me as someone who, you know, is growing up in a new era vis a vis the American Dream is that you're actually pitching this concept of a new American dream. And we had Rahm Emanuel on the podcast, and he's talking about how the American dream is dead. That's a common refrain, right? Jason Crow talks about. A lot of Democrats are talking about it, but I haven't heard as much about this revitalized vision for it. So can you tell us about your view of what the American Dream should mean and how you think you'd be able to. To bring it to life if you did win this coveted Senate seat?
- [05:21]
Mallory McMorrow
Yeah. First of all, can we just talk about how depressing it is to hear people say the American dream is dead? Like, what are you supposed to do with that? Cry. Except just bury your head in the sand and cry and not.
- [05:31]
Jessica Tarlev
And keep renting for the rest of your life, which is what I'm gonna do.
- [05:34]
Mallory McMorrow
And just. And check out. And this is why people stop voting. You tell people that, like, all hope is gone and they check out. I am. You know, I graduated college in 2008, graduated from Notre Dame with a degree in industrial design. And I always wanted be a car designer. And I had that opportunity. I built a concept car of mine live on stage at the LA Auto show in 2007. And in normal times, that would have set me up for success. Instead, I probably have the worst timing of anybody wanting to be a car designer in American history. And I came out with this degree in my hand in 2008, and I was sleeping in the back of my car. I had no health insurance. The Affordable Care act didn't exist. I had thousands of dollars in student loan debt. I applied to over 300 jobs, and the only job I could get for a while was folding clothes at Urban Outfitters for minimum wage. So I talked to a lot of people. You know, in. In our generation, I felt that to my bones. When you said Elder Millennial, it kind of hits me like a ton of bricks. But, you know, so many people say I have done everything right and I'm still getting screwed. You know, I played by the rules. I went to school or I got a job. I started my career. And there was this culture that came out for our generation that was hustle culture that you had to have a job and a side gig and, you know, set up an online course, and you basically had to work yourself to death just to dig out of the hole. So, for me, this is the moment where I think we have to accept that Donald Trump is going to tear things down to the studs he is burning through institutions. He is going to cut everything down to nothing. And my dad, who's a civil engineer, he's pretty blunt about these things, and he says it's gonna get a lot worse before it gets better. But that gives us an opportunity to build something new. So what I've been telling people is, look, this has been broken for a lot of people like me for far too long, under multiple administrations, under multiple parties. And Donald Trump is the symptom. He's not the cause. So the new American dream is ours to write. It should mean that if you play by the rules and you work hard, you should have access to buy not just a house, but by the house that you want in the neighborhood that you want to live in, that you should be able to send your kids to a great school in your neighborhood, that you don't have to worry about gun violence in schools or in your neighborhood, that your kids should be able to come home safe. And we're not going to spend another generation training kids to make themselves harder to kill. Instead of addressing this key issue, that it should be easier to start a business. If you want to start a business, especially in a state like Michigan, we should be looking for the next Ford and the next GM and the next company who's going to invent the next great thing here in Michigan and support that, and that you shouldn't have to worry about having lead tainted drinking water when you turn on the taps. It should be clean when it comes out. So government should work and work simply. And what I'm able to tell people is we've started a lot of this work here in the state legislature in Michigan. So unlike what we see in Washington, in my state legislature, when we took power for the first time in 40 years, we did the things we said we were gonna do. We repealed the 1931 abortion ban. We expanded reproductive health access. We repealed the seniors retirement tax to lift seniors into a place where they are not rationing their medication to pay their bills. We expanded the earned income tax Credit. We lifted 100,000 families out of working poverty. We banned child marriage, which was still legal here in Michigan until relatively recently. I know it is. It's a dark place.
- [09:13]
Jessica Tarlev
You hear these things and you think like, no, it's not possible, but, no, it is.
- [09:19]
Mallory McMorrow
Well, and we thought we were just removing, you know, a ghost law off the books and it wouldn't be controversial. Five of my Republican colleagues spoke out against repealing the ban of child marriage. So that's the moment that we're living in now.
- [09:32]
Jessica Tarlev
Gotta look at the donor base there. Right.
- [09:34]
Mallory McMorrow
It's yikes. But you know, I think the case to be made is Washington is fundamentally broken. And I talk to a lot of people who are rightfully livid with a Democratic Party who for years and years and years ran on the threat that Roe was going to fall as just one example. And I have people asking why, when Democrats had all of the power in the federal government, did they not codify Roe before the Dobbs decision? Why are they fundraising off of it? Why are they asking me for $5? Why are they fear mongering about this? And what I'm able to lay out in this campaign is you're right, you have every right to be angry. We've shown a very different way to do things in the Michigan State Senate. And I think Washington should be a hell of a lot more like Michigan and not the other way around.
- [10:22]
Jessica Tarlev
I like it. It's too cold for me, but I like it in theory that Washington would be more like Michigan. And you bring up this business as usual problem and we have somehow morphed into the party of the status quo.
- [10:35]
Mallory McMorrow
Yes.
- [10:36]
Jessica Tarlev
And that is the worst place that you can be. Even if the change is bad. People are looking for change agents. And you have not shy about coming after the leadership within the party as well, been outspoken about Chuck Schumer and that it may be time for him to elegantly exit stage left. And you are running against a sitting congresswoman as well, Haley Stevens, who seems to be more of the establishment favorite, let's say in this race. How has that dynamic played out for you? I assume that that kind of talk is resonating now that 60 to 70% of Democrats are basically saying burn it all down. Right. Like if you wanna keep getting our.
- [11:16]
Mallory McMorrow
It really is. And I want to be very clear, I mean, I did make news when I announced this campaign saying no, I would not support Senator Schumer for leader. And I hope that Michigan can serve as an example for Democratic leaders across the country. We now have two cycles in a row between Debbie Stabenow last cycle who decided not to seek reelection. We now have Senator Alyssa Slotkin and Gary Peters this cycle year who decided not to seek reelection. Recognizing that part of leadership is also understanding when it's time to bring up the next generation. And it's not just about age, but it is about recognizing that this is a very different political moment than the majority of the career that many of our more senior colleagues came up in politics where you could more easily work across the aisle and where there were rules and norms and lines you didn't cross. And it is very different operating in the Trump era, where Donald Trump has completely remade the Republican Party in his image, gotten rid of anybody who doesn't bend the knee. You know, this is the state that had Congressman Peter Meyer, who was no longer in office because he voted for impeachment. Right. So it is really resonating that continuing to offer olive branches to people who continue to light them on fire is not acceptable. That Donald Trump really runs this presidency like it's a reality TV show. Every moment from sunup to sundown is programmed from, you know, social media posts to him standing on the roof of the White House to distract from the fact that the Epstein files are still not released, to the fact that half of his cabinet comes from Fox News. They know how to operate in entertainment and TV and capture attention in that. For the Democratic Party to succeed, we need new leaders who understand how to compete and win for that attention and use that attention to offer something better. So not just to be anti Donald Trump, but to offer a vision of the new American dream and what that looks like. Because we are in this moment where I am getting the sense that there's some buyer's remorse even for people who may have voted for Trump. So among Democrats, there is a desperate cry for something new. There are kind of those people in the middle who say, you know what? This is not what I voted for. I voted for IVF access or I voted for him to bring my costs down. I didn't vote for, you know, masked ICE agents to be raiding our communities and for the Epstein files not to come out or whatever it is, and it is working. So I think that in normal times, it would have been a risk to go against party leadership, but there's a reason why the Democratic Party is polling significantly below Donald Trump. So Donald Trump's approval grading may be underwater, but people are not immediately filling that gap with, okay, it's time for Democrats to take over. Unless we see a very new Democratic Party come forward.
- [14:11]
Jessica Tarlev
Absolutely. I was excited to see the support for Brian Schatz as the new number two and love him. And I think that he would be an incredible leader of the party going.
- [14:21]
Mallory McMorrow
Forward and somebody who's willing to throw a punch, right, like call a spade a spade, don't immediately say, well, we need to find bipartisan solutions. And I think that is, to your point, a Democratic Party that's so attached to institutions and process. I have never talked to a constituent who says, I really want a bipartisan solution. They say, I want a solution. I want affordable housing. I don't care how you get there. If it's bipartisan, great. If not, like, just bring my housing costs down.
- [14:47]
Jessica Tarlev
Yeah, the abundance agenda goes for everybody.
- [14:51]
Mallory McMorrow
Yeah.
- [14:52]
Jessica Tarlev
You brought up Epstein, which is a culture war issue. I would say that you struck national gold for your speech in 2022 by talking about a culture war issue. You were accused of being a groomer by a Republican colleague in a fundraising email.
- [15:07]
Unnamed Republican Colleague
Yeah, I didn't expect to wake up yesterday to the news that the senator from the 22nd district had overnight accused me by name of grooming and sexualizing children in an email fundraising for herself. Because I am the biggest threat to your hollow, hateful scheme. Because you can't claim that you are targeting marginalized kids in the name of, quote, parental rights if another parent is standing up to say no.
- [15:38]
Jessica Tarlev
So can you talk about how to thread that needle in talking about culture war issues, but also making it practical for people's lives? Because I feel like too often when we get in the mud about these things, we lose the plot completely and then we're not focused on issues like cost of living, healthcare access, which is absolutely massive, especially looking at the reconciliation bill and the millions that are gonna lose their coverage.
- [16:05]
Mallory McMorrow
Totally.
- [16:05]
Jessica Tarlev
So how did you do it? And what are the lessons for Democrats in navigating what is a very tricky time culture wise? Cuz Donald Trump would love it, right? If, I mean, he doesn't like the Epstein stuff, he'll climb on a roof to avoid it. But it's better than us talking about the economy, cost of living, inflation, healthcare.
- [16:23]
Mallory McMorrow
Right. So I think the reason why that speech resonated was a couple of reasons. Number one, I was pissed off and you could tell. And I got a lot of feedback from people saying, finally, somebody feels the way that I feel and isn't afraid to express it.
- [16:39]
Unnamed Republican Colleague
So I want to be very clear right now. Call me whatever you want. I hope you brought in a few dollars. I hope it made you sleep good last night. I know who I am.
- [16:47]
Mallory McMorrow
But, you know, I thought a lot about whether or not to even respond at all. I was raised to believe that we don't give bullies attention and they'll just go away. But clearly that hasn't been the case. You had the rise of Moms for Liberty groups. You've had the rise of this MAGA style politics that really is about tearing other people down to build up power for some. As if, you know, there's a scarcity in this country instead of recognizing we're the wealthiest country in the world and we should make sure everybody has access. But I rejected the premise of the smear. So I was smeared as a groomer, which is typically levied on the LGBTQ community, of which I am not a member. And instead of taking the bait and debating that issue, I thought a lot about why we were seeing the rise of Moms for Liberty groups and the agony of a lot of moms like me who had just come through Covid, who had felt abandoned by a system that shut down schools and childcare centers that left moms alone. I had actually gotten a call from a constituent of mine, a mom in a more conservative part of my district, who. She left a really long voicemail, and it was very thoughtful, and she expressed how angry and frustrated she was with her school district and the administrators. So she had joined this parents group, and she noticed that originally the group was focused on how do we improve communications between the district and the parents, but it was shifting into book bans and anti DEI measures. And she was, you know, beside herself in this voicemail, saying, I don't hate gay kids, and I don't have anything against teaching diversity in schools, but I also don't feel like I have anywhere else to go to put my voice and express my frustration. So I thought a lot about her when I decided how I was gonna respond. So I was very intentional in speaking directly to people like her to say, I am a straight, white, Christian, married, suburban mom who knows that hate only wins when people like me let it happen. To say that just because it doesn't directly affect us doesn't mean it's not our responsibility.
- [18:56]
Unnamed Republican Colleague
People who are different are not the reason that our roads are in bad shape after decades of disinvestment or that health care costs are too high or that teachers are leaving the profession. I want every child in this state to feel seen, heard, and supported, not marginalized and targeted because they are not straight, white, and Christian. We cannot let hateful people tell you otherwise to scapegoat and deflect from the fact that they are not doing anything to fix the real issues that impact people's lives.
- [19:31]
Mallory McMorrow
So I think the lesson is it's not run away from the issue. I didn't stand up there and say this is a distraction, but I also threw a punch to get back to having the debate I wanted to have, which was about cost of living, which was about, you know, the issues that impact 99% of people. And even if we want to protect the most vulnerable in our community. The way that we do that is by solving the issues that 99% of people face, because then there won't be that desire to blame somebody else. That's what Donald Trump is really good at. Like, you are not succeeding. You're not doing as well as you had hoped. It's somebody else's fault, whether it's immigrants or the LGBTQ community. You know, he just places blame instead of solving the issues. And you pointed out not only is he not solving the issues, we are slashing Medicaid, Medicare, the Affordable Care Act, Blue Cross, even private insurance here is going to go up 16% this year alone so that we can give another tax break to billionaires who do not need it. So that, I hope, is the message, like, do not be afraid to step into the fight. But also don't take the bait and get lost in the mud that Republicans want you to get lost in. Talk directly to people and have a little bit of a spine. You know, people want fighters. People want to see that somebody is fighting for them. And you need to be willing to show that.
- [20:50]
Jessica Tarlev
We're going to take a quick break. Stay with us.
- [21:00]
Terry Gross
In 1961, President Kennedy's FCC chairman, Newton Minow, gave a speech deriding commercial TV programming.
- [21:09]
Unnamed Republican Colleague
I can assure you that what you.
- [21:10]
Mallory McMorrow
Will observe is a vast wasteland.
- [21:13]
Terry Gross
He wanted to do something about it.
- [21:15]
Unnamed Republican Colleague
Is there one person in this room.
- [21:17]
Mallory McMorrow
Who claims that broadcasting can't do better?
- [21:19]
Terry Gross
So Congress created something called the Corporation for Public Broadcasting. You might not have realized when you were interacting with the cpb, but it happened all the time when you were tickled by Elmo. Happy international joke day when someone moved you on the drive home.
- [21:34]
Jessica Tarlev
This is FRESH air. I am Terry Gross.
- [21:36]
Terry Gross
CBB is the reason you're hearing my voice right now. But due to big, beautiful cuts, the organization announced on Friday that it would be shutting down next year. What's taken its place? If you ask this White House, they might say something like Prageru. What is Prageru on today explained. My name is Sean Ramasvooram for today. Explained. I'm outside the Air and Space Museum in Washington, D.C. with one question. Do you think we should go to Mars?
- [22:06]
Mallory McMorrow
I don't think you should live in Mars, no.
- [22:08]
Terry Gross
I don't know why.
- [22:09]
Mallory McMorrow
Just Mars. I think as earthlings, we are a.
- [22:13]
Adobe Representative
Nosy group of people, and I really.
- [22:16]
Mallory McMorrow
Don'T think that we have any business going to Mars. Our knowledge about the solar system and the universe will grow substantially.
- [22:25]
Jessica Tarlev
I think maybe we should just leave Mars alone, just sit with Earth like.
- [22:32]
Mallory McMorrow
So many innovations are going to come out of it because so many different companies are going to be fighting to get, you know, that first ticket to Mars. So I feel, I feel like we should, but at the same time, we should solve some problems here first. I think we need to expand what we know, what we see, honestly, for our own benefit.
- [22:47]
Terry Gross
We should go way beyond today Explained from Vox is taking a summer sojourn on Mars. Join us.
- [22:54]
Cam Heyward
Hey, what's good everybody? It's Cam Heyward, seven time Pro Bowler and defensive captain of the Pittsburgh Steelers and your host of Not Just Football. The NFL season is right around the corner and that means it's time to get locked in on our show, Not Just Football with Cam Heyward. We're bringing you everything you need to know about the upcoming season. We've got some incredible guests lined up, former teammates, current players, and legends of the game. We'll give you insights you won't hear anywhere else. We'll be here every week with game breakdowns, player spotlights, and all the stories that go beyond the box score. Because football is about more than just what happens on Sundays. So be sure to listen and subscribe to Not Just Football with cam heyward on YouTube or wherever you get your podcast. Let's get ready for another incredible NFL season.
- [23:40]
Jessica Tarlev
Welcome back. So you're running in a state that is particularly in the middle of the tariff wars with the auto industry being there. And Trump loves to talk about Michigan and reviving the manufacturing culture and the way things used to be. Obviously that is not going to plan. Can you talk a little bit about what you're hearing on the campaign trail as it relates to the trade wars, but also that kind of nostalgia for a time past?
- [24:09]
Mallory McMorrow
Yeah, it's a great question. Look, in the 1980s, five of the top 10 metro regions in the entire country for median household income were here in Michigan. So by and large, we were one of the most prosperous states in the nation. And there is a desire to want to reclaim that prosperity. But we cannot just do the things we did in the 80s and expect the same results. This is also a state that was devastated by NATO and opening global trade in a way that really took away American manufacturing jobs. So there is a world in which a smart, nuanced trade and tariff policy can be used to, to bring more shifts back online. We saw this with GMs like Orion plant where they announced restarting that plant to bring some manufacturing back here to Michigan. That's great. But on the same token, when Trump went and created these blanket tariffs on basically every product from every country that we use in our everyday lives, from clothes to coffee to bananas, things that we are not about to grow in Michigan anytime soon, that drives the cost for people in their everyday lives through the roof in a way that outweighs any of the job gains. So the way that we're talking about this on the campaign is Trump is operating in this mindset of let's just throw everything at the wall and see what sticks, or announce that we're gonna have, you know, 25% tariffs on Canada, our strongest ally and trading partner. By the way, if you make a wrong turn in Detroit, you are in Canada. These are our neighbors. These are people who cross the border every single day to live or work. And a vehicle can actually cross between the border of Michigan and Canada upwards of a dozen or two dozen times in the process of manufacturing and assembly. So trade on its own has to be done thoughtfully. It has to be done with our allies, with our trading partners, and not by somebody angrily truthing on his social media platform to see what sticks and what has a negative reaction.
- [26:10]
Jessica Tarlev
Wouldn't that be nice? If someone was not angrily truthing?
- [26:13]
Mallory McMorrow
Wouldn't that be nice?
- [26:14]
Jessica Tarlev
I'm going to try to make this segue work. I don't know if it will, but you running in Michigan, you also need to have a very thoughtful, nuanced position on the issue of Israel and Gaza. So there's a huge Arab population in the state. We talked a lot about Dearborn, Michigan, during the 2024 election.
- [26:33]
Mallory McMorrow
Yeah.
- [26:33]
Jessica Tarlev
This is something. I'm Jewish. I know you're married to a Jew, so your tribe adjacent. I know that this is a difficult one for everyone in our party who wants to be supportive of Israel and also wants to be cognizant of the realities on the ground in Gaza. How are you managing this issue and what do you make of the kind of sea change that we've seen in the past few weeks? How people who have been ardent supporters of Israel, strong Zionists, like the Richie Torres is of the world, Lissa Slotin as well, have been changing their tune a little bit.
- [27:07]
Mallory McMorrow
Yeah. You know, Michigan, as a state, we have one of the largest Arab, American and Muslim populations that have direct ties to the Middle east alongside. And I think this is the piece that most people don't know, a very large significant Jewish and Israeli population with direct ties to the Middle East. And I hope that we can be a state that models and shows the rest of the country the rest of the world, that we can have diverse populations living side by side and doing so in a way where we uplift each other the way that I've been talking about this. And unsurprisingly, this has come up at every single event we've been doing, especially over the last few weeks, as we've seen the hunger crisis, the humanitarian crisis in Gaza really take a dark turn. The way that I talk about it is we have to center the humanity of this situation. No life is worth more than another life. And I start from a place of believing fundamentally that Palestinians deserve peace and security and Israelis deserve peace and security. And let's start there. I put out a statement and Senator Slotkin put out a longer written statement. I think seeing that there was a breaking point in Gaza where the most immediate need is to address the humanitarian cris, make sure that aid gets into Gaza, that babies are not starving to death, that families have a chance to survive, that we did see, particularly in the Democratic Party, a sea change. And I think that that was done still with the anchor of believing that there needs to be a strong Jewish state of Israel. That perception is reality. We've seen a lot of pressure from around the world moving away from, frankly, Netanyahu's policies in a way that puts Israel and Israelis at risk. So I've had a lot of conversations with people in the community, with my own husband, with people who feel direct ties to what's happening, to get back to a place of Benjamin Netanyahu is trying to tell us that what we see with our eyes is not true and is not happening. And we've been having really thoughtful, nuanced conversations at events, drawing the parallel. I've said to people that I hope our allies around the world do not wish harm on Americans just because Donald Trump is our president. And this is how I hope that we continue to have a relationship with Israelis in Israel, that this is our democratic ally, they're our partners. And that is not at odds with believing that Palestinians also deserve peace and security and safety. And starting from there, how can we move forward? So I hope that there has been a breaking point that does result in humanitarian aid being rushed into Gaza. I saw a really thoughtful piece from Yair Rosenberg in the Atlantic arguing for potentially a change in approach from Israel of why not rush in so much aid, so much security, that it becomes valueless, that Hamas cannot steal, it cannot sell it at escalated prices. And make sure that addressing that humanitarian crisis is the first thing, because that is what people are so viscerally angry about right now, on top of seeing the video that Hamas put out of hostages, you know, emaciated as well, and digging their own graves. Sometimes we lose the humanity in the issue and it becomes this third rail that we cannot talk about. But that's why, you know, particularly in my state and from my own personal experience, we have to get back to recognizing these are people, and people deserve peace and security in the same way that we as Americans deserve.
- [30:55]
Jessica Tarlev
I agree with that. And I liked Rosenberg's proposal as well. And we have a lot of aid that was supposed to be distributed by usaid. So maybe people would feel like that was being better used if you could bring it over to the Middle east, feed some starving people. While we have been talking, we got some news that the DOJ is floating the release of the Ghislaine Maxwell tapes. Her conversation with Todd Blanche from the doj, about nine hours of it. She also apparently, and I would say, unsurprisingly, that's my own comment, abc saying that she told them that Trump never did anything concerning. So we're all on pardon watch at this point. What do you make of that development?
- [31:36]
Mallory McMorrow
Look, this is. It's a really blatant attempt to skirt releasing the Epstein files. You know, Ghislaine Maxwell and her attorney have said pretty bluntly she is looking for a pardon or she is looking for an ease in her sentence. So knowing that that's the motivation, of course, she would go in and give this testimony to Donald Trump's personal attorney, who is now in this position at doj, relinquishing the president of any responsibility and wrongdoing, because that is the path to a pardon. It's a blatant attempt to hopefully satiate some of Trump's base by releasing these interviews when that's not what the base was asking for. And I would hope that Democrats keep the pressure on. You know, people were not looking for videotapes with Ghislaine Maxwell just from last week. They're looking for the Epstein files. What was in those binders that you trotted out in front of the White House with all of these influencers saying these are the Epstein files? What was in those? Were they empty? Was it blank? We know the reporting from the Wall Street Journal that said that Pam Bondi indicated to President Trump that he is listed in the files multiple times and to not lose the plot on this. You know, Donald Trump ran very openly on eliminating the deep state and being a man of the people. And there is no worse example of frankly covering up for the deep state than doing a look at this shiny object over here so that you ignore the meat of the issue, which is you have these files. You claim to want to release them, but now you're gonna cover up for yourself just so that there can be something put out there to give. Ghislaine Maxwell, who, by the way, just directly responsible for years of abuse of young girls and women like, this is not pardonable. And I think for Democrats or for anybody who believes in the rule of law, we should push back on this with full force and say this is exactly the type of COVID up that should concern you. That there are two systems of justice, One for the rich and powerful and one for everybody else. And it's not enough. It's a bait and sweet. And we should demand full transparency on what is in those files.
- [33:49]
Jessica Tarlev
Yeah, Mike Johnson had a moment of clarity last weekend where he said that he thought that she deserved a life sentence. But Mike Jansen also always falls in line. So we'll see where all of that ends up. Last question. What's one thing that really makes you rage and one thing that you think we should all calm down about?
- [34:07]
Mallory McMorrow
One thing that really makes me rage. That we are the only industrialized nation in the entire world without access to paid leave and. And affordable, accessible childcare. Infuriating. You know, it grinds my gears when I hear Republicans and people like Elon Musk talking about the birth rate as if it is not connected to economic opportunity and access and it is inexcusable. And something that is a big part of my campaign is solving that so that parents do not have to choose between family and their career. That should be an American ideal that we all get behind. Uh, and something we should all just let go. Sydney Sweeney. I did not know who this person was, admittedly, until like this past week. And I'm just. We gotta let it go and move on.
- [34:51]
Jessica Tarlev
Yeah, I mean, I agree with you and mostly because in a couple of hours I have to go talk about it again on Fox and they are not letting it go at this point. I like that answer. Hopeful for both. I would paid leave and also no more Sydney Sweeney. Just let her act.
- [35:06]
Mallory McMorrow
That would be great if we could just move on. If we could move on from a jeans ad and get to how do we have paid leave? I would be much happier.
- [35:14]
Jessica Tarlev
That's a great campaign slogan. Mallory McMorrow, thank you so much for your time. It was great to have you.
- [35:19]
Mallory McMorrow
Thank you.