← Raging Moderates with Scott Galloway and Jessica Tarlov
Raging Moderates with Scott Galloway and Jessica Tarlov
The Trump Administration Can’t Get Their Iran War Story Straight
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Welcome to Raging Moderates. I'm Scott Galloway.
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And I'm Jessica Charlev.
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In today's episode of Raging Moderates, we're discussing why, despite Trump saying the war is partially or completely done, he is ramping up military action in Iran. If you aren't already, please make sure to subscribe to our YouTube page to stay in the loop on all the day's political news. All right, let's get into it. Eleven days into the war with Iran and the message from Trump is, quite frankly, it's just all over the place. On Monday, the peacetime president suggested the conflict might be wrapping up soon, saying the US And Israel are very far ahead of schedule. Well, can you share that schedule with us, boss? Anyways, markets briefly breathe the sigh of relief, but hours later, Trump warned that if Iran threatens global energy supplies, the US Would respond forcefully. The region would open, quote, never recover. Meanwhile, shipping through the Straits of Hormuz, one of the most important oil choke points in the world, is heavily disrupted. So even as Trump talks about victory being close, the actual end game of the war and the pain it's causing for Americans is still pretty unclear. Let's watch a moment from the presser yesterday, Giving mixed signals.
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A
Mr. President, you've said the war is, quote, very complete, but your defense secretary says this, this is just the beginning. So which is it and how long should Americans be putting it in? Well, I think you could say it
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both the beginning, it's the beginning of building a new country. But they certainly, they have no navy, they have no air force, they have no antiaircraft equipment. It's all been blown up. They have no radar, they have no telecommunications and they have no leadership.
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A
It's all gone.
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So, you know, you could look at that statement. We could, we could call it a tremendous success right now as we leave here. I could call it. Or we could go further. And we're going to go further.
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A
Crazy like a fox, right? I love that he's saying it's a totally new country, but that is just being run by the six year old son of the guy that you took
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out, who's supposedly more black, he is
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more extreme and has legitimate axe to grind that you killed his entire family on top of the beliefs that he already had. Trump was so all over in this press conference. And I want to talk about it, but I also want to bring what Marco Rubio said yesterday into the conversation because watching the goalposts shifting in real time is astounding.
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B
The goals of this mission are clear and it's important to continue to remind the American people of why it is that the greatest military in the history of the world is engaged in this operation. It is to destroy the ability of this regime to launch missiles, both by destroying their missiles and their launchers.
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A
Destroy the factories that make these missiles and destroy their navy. Doesn't mention removing the regime, doesn't talk about the nuclear program. No mention of destroying Iran's ability to project power via proxy forces. We're not talking about Hezbollah or Hamas or anything anymore. So they're trying to just clean up their toys and go right, like, because they can't do what they set out to do. And they just fed us a bunch of talking points about how it actually would be a completely new country and how we would be supporting these oppressed people who, by the way, we don't see any rallies in the streets saying America, come help us. We just see death to America, death to Israel. And we know that between a thousand and thirteen hundred innocent Iranians have been killed. At this point, it feels like except for taking out the navy, they've taken down, I think 42 major Iranian vessels, smaller ships has been not as much of the priority. But the navy part of that is definitely true. But there's still producing drones like they were before. And now Rubio is telling us that none of the story that we were sold is actually what we're going to get out of this.
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B
Yeah, there's. It's like, what boxes are we looking to check here? It's not even about mission accomplished. It's what is the mission. And we are on the precipice of potentially losing what was, I would argue, the biggest objective or benefit of this action. And that is, it seemed like early in the war, and this is a war, when the IRGC made what I think is the biggest blunder so far of sending projectiles into every Gulf nation. We had the formation of a stronger informal alliance between the us, Israel and moderate nations in the Gulf. That would have been actually a really big win. And now we're losing their support because the Straits of Hormuz being blocked is just an enormous disruption for the Gulf states. Dubai, arguably one of the most successful urban sovereign centers in the world, in the UAE, kind of the 21st century Singapore, people want out. People are leaving. It looks much more vulnerable than it ever has. And it's not as if you can just turn off the tap and store this oil. There are real issues to oil buildup. They get dangerous. These wells just. They have oil flowing and the oil needs to go somewhere and they can put it on ships. But then what do you do with the ships? They're talking about naval armadas to escort ships through the Straits of Hormuz. But they haven't quite figured it out. It just feels like, again, it was half baked. And it feels as if right now, in order to salvage what I think was, again, an enormous upside to potentially to this war, they need to be more tightly knit with the Gulf nations and say, how do we make the sacrifice? We've all made here a win for you and a more sustainable peace across the region long term. And it feels as if slowly but surely we're eroding all of that goodwill and starting to throw Gulf nations back into the arms of the irgc, because we can't even seem to articulate what it is we're trying to accomplish right now. And the other thing I wanted to ask you was that those images, it felt post apocalyptic of the bombing of oil fields near Tehran and that kind of raining, acidic, black rain, and those fires felt very, very frightening. And also I would argue that a real danger here is the Balkanization and a potential civil war within Iran, because typically you don't get who you want in those situations. And also to gut the economic livelihood of Iran right now is probably you lose an enormous bargaining chip and just creates further instability, which probably isn't good long term for the region. And then when Trump came out, or when the president came out and said that quote, unquote, it got leaked that he was angry that Israel did this. That is such enormous bullshit. I think the IDF is essentially kind of the sixth branch of the US military right now. They are coordinating 100% right now. And this notion like, oh, these guys, these Israelis are out of control, but I'm the good guy, let's negotiate. It's just such. I just think that is such extraordinary bullshit that this is. That be clear, Trump's in charge here, but I think it was a huge mistake to go after the oil fields in Iran at this point. What are your thoughts?
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Well, having a better understanding of how intense the back channeling is between the US and the Israelis and not just our government, but someone like Jared Kushner and that wide ranging presser that Trump gave yesterday, he actually said, based on what Jared Kushner told me, I thought Iran would attack us. Not based on what our intel agencies were telling us, but what my son in law, who has a lot of friends who help him make a lot of money in the region is telling us. And you're completely right. I mean, I think that they had the same reaction that we all did when they saw Tehran engulfed in flames and thought, holy shit, this one is bad, right? Especially on day, what was it, day eight of this war. But what has been interesting to see, and David Ignatius wrote about this in the Washington Post yesterday, that apparently a few senior officials in Israel are voicing concerns about the escalating open ended attack on Iran. So that would imply that they thought it could be more surgical. I don't know if they're being dismissive of our military capabilities and then kind of saying, we gave you everything, right? Like we told you where they were having brunch. We had a, you know, a red light on their forehead essentially, to be able to do this. And you guys are not living up to our expectation or just an acknowledgement that everybody failed in assessing how Iran would react to this. Because there's this machismo that we have Pete Hegseth, right, you know, beating his chest saying, there's nobody like us, there's nobody like us, and there is nobody like us. But Iranian government, the IRGC and the new Supreme Leader are not hankering to get to the table with us. They're going to run out the clock. They're yoloing this and they're making the other Gulf states suffer. I mean, there are 14 countries involved right. Now for something that they marketed at the beginning as a surgical strike. Right. That we could be out of here
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in a special combat operation.
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Right. Which can be very open ended. But we're talking about 14 countries and they're just telling people to pull up their big boy pants and go through the Strait of Hormuz when that's certain deaths. Right. Just get your tankers through. And I think it is interesting and important that Trump spent an hour on the phone with Putin yesterday. So when they came out and said, we're not bothered by the fact that the Russians are not only supplying drones but are apparently giving targeting information for America Intelligence. Yeah, yeah. So he's gone to Putin and I mean, who knows what he actually said. But Pete Hegseth says, you know, it was a very sharp conversation. He told him back off. And also we want peace for Ukraine, as if that matters. You know, this is turning into a global problem. Right. There is nothing small time about what's going on here. And it feels like all the wrong people are smiling at what they're seeing. And I don't know if you caught this, but CNN got a journalist into Iran invited in to talk to a foreign policy advisor to the new Supreme Leader. And so you're watching a communications and marketing campaign play out as well. Right. So on multiple fronts, it seems like flares are going up that we are not moving towards any of the mission goals that were originally outlined. Maybe Rubio's lower grade goals will be accomplished or could be accomplished, but mostly that Jim Himes was right and that we are going to try to find an off ramp with as little humiliation as possible. And Trump will do a big, you know, truth social post and move on to Cuba.
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Okay, let's take a quick break. Stay with us.
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Hey, Kara Swisher here.
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I want to let you know that Vox Media is returning to south by Southwest in Austin for live tapings of your favorite podcast.
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Join us from March 13th through the
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15th for live tapings of today explained Teffy Talks, Prof. G Markets and of course, your two favorite podcasts, Pivot and
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On with Kara Swisher.
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The stage will also feature sessions from Brene Brown and Adam Grant, Marques Brownlee, Keith Lee, Vivian Tu and Robin Arzon.
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It's all part of the Vox Media podcast stage at south by Southwest, presented by Odoo. Visit voxmedia.comsxsw to pre register and get
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your special discount on your innovation badge. That's voxmedia.comsxsw to register. Really, you should register. We sell out and we hope to see see you there.
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After decapitation strikes against Iran's leadership, what can we expect next in the escalating war? The big question is, if there is
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going to be a next strongman in Iran, what kind of strongman will that person likely be? I don't think that there's going to be another powerful cleric supreme leader.
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I'm John Finer.
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And I'm Jake Sullivan. And we're the hosts of the Long Game, a weekly national security podcast.
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This week we sit down with Kareem Sajapour to discuss what to expect in
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this next phase of the war against Iran. The episode's out now.
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Search for and follow the Long Game
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wherever you get your podcasts. Ambassador Rahm Emanuel served as President Obama's chief of staff, an administration that had to deal with its fair share of global conflicts. He dealt directly with Israel's prime minister
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and thought plenty about the threat from Iran.
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But Emmanuel told me that the pace of action from this president in the Middle east is giving him whiplash. In 15 months, this president has taken military action against eight countries. Now we got three more years to go. In 15 months, Iran twice. But you have Syria, Iraq, Somalia, Venezuela. I'm losing Nigeria today. Explained in your feed every weekday and on Saturdays, too. Yeah, it does appear that the market is more optimistic about this work coming to a close. I mean, essentially oil has come back from I think a high of $112 to approximately, I think it's right now trading at about 83 bucks. So it's come down substantially. It's off 12% just in the last day.
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Do you think that's because of Trump's comment or what do you think that's a result of?
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You know what? That's the correct question. The honest answer is I don't know. I think that it's looking increasingly like the regime is going to survive here and also that there's increasing pressure if you will declare victory and leave. But the markets, which absorb millions of points of information and are unemotional, non political, it's just pure fear and greed seem to be saying that the Straits of Hormuz will eventually or sooner rather than later be open. And that would be a function of one of two things, our ability to create convoys to escort ships safely or that this conflict is going to come to some sort of resolution or start to wind down. And given what I've heard, it's more the latter. I don't think the Trump administration has been able to instill a great deal of confidence that they'll be able to create safe passage if this conflict continues at the same level of intensity it is right now. But the markets seem to be saying, and the S and P is flat and almost looks pretty boring over the last few days, that this will be over sooner rather than later. The issue is, again, and I don't understand why they aren't creating a series of objectives, declaring, you know, declaring that they could say they've already met, as the president said, and then the most important thing, and the problem is this isn't a president that appreciates diplomacy. To get all of the Gulf nations together and say, we've all made huge sacrifices here. How do we make this a win for all of you moving forward? What is it you want to make sure. And they might say, just get the fuck out of here. Or is it, do you want us to ensure that the launch capabilities are further neutered? Do you want to make sure that the Navy is totally is unable to have any sort of mining capability or to deploy mines in the Straits of Hormuz? But I would argue that Secretary Rubio should be getting all the Gulf states in a room and saying, how do we make this a win for all of us, including you? Because to me, again, the biggest benefit coming out of this would be if we isolate Iran through an alliance with all the Gulf countries, including Israel and such, that they have faith that we are, in fact, a really strong, responsible partner. Because it feels as if. It feels as if every day that is weakening and again we are shoving them back into the arms of Iran, which is really, from a foreign policy perspective, in my view, on a meta level, the biggest mistake of the Trump administration and Secretary Rubio, and that as they're under the impression with a third of the world's GDP, we can take on the other 2/3. We used to be able to do that because we cooperated and we were the operating system for, call it 60 or 70% of the world's military and GDP. But going at it alone is contrary to every basic notion of strategy in geopolitics. And that is the most successful geopolitical action, or where the whole is greater than the sum of its parts because of cooperation in a unified West. And we had a moment, and I still think we have that moment where I don't want to say the west, but call it capitalist or, you know, the modern world comes together and presents a united front to Iran and other rogue nations that includes the Gulf states. And that was the moment. It feels like that moment is passing any Thoughts before we move on here, Jess?
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No, I agree with you. And I'm, I'm thinking about, you know, next month, Trump goes to Beijing or is supposed to, and what do we look like for that meeting? I mean, this has to be done by then, right? I would presume. And it seems like, you know, the off ramps are hap. Are happening. But I am concerned about that, like what the perception is of our capabilities, how strong our leadership is, how much they're thinking through important alliances all over the world that can counteract the influence of China and make sure that, you know, Beijing doesn't have our proverbial number. Everyone should listen to China decode. They talk about this all the time, which is another Prachi Media podcast. But I definitely wonder if that's in the back of their minds as they're trying to deescalate from this, that there are, proverbially speaking, bigger fish to fry. And there would be a way to keep Iran more in check through diplomacy. And it's diplomacy plus business deals because everybody just wants to get richer and they're willing to compromise on a whole host of things if that's possible. But the time for that big meeting that you were just talking about was before these strikes happened two Saturdays ago. You know, and I wonder if cluing in the Gulf states more as to what the US And Israel were thinking. Trusted partners, not just, you know, broadcasting it over social media, but having, you know, real diplomatic conversations about the concerns that we have about missile capabilities, nuclear capabilities, whatever it is. On top of the talks with the Omanis and the Iranians to try to get a new nuclear deal would have been to our benefit. And it's going to be very hard to make it up to these countries after all is said and done when we have spent billions of their dollars because they've had to defend themselves and we're helping with munitions and money. But there's still a great cost to each of these nations who I think thought generally speaking were just making business deals with this guy and our new allies in Israel as well as, as far as economic cooperation goes. And now there's bloodshed and there's a whole lot of money flying out of our door and who is going to refill our stockpile because we didn't plan on a march war with Iran. Right. That, that wasn't on our schedule. And I don't know how you repair those kinds of relationships, especially when they're so new. You know, there's something to these long term, all that we've had And I hold out faith that the European alliance, the NATO alliance, et cetera, that that will carry on with us far into the future. But Gulf nations are new friends to a large degree, and I don't think that we're showing up properly when it comes to conflict. Maybe we are in business development and building a new resort wherever, but I think the last 10 days have shown that we're a pretty unreliable partner and that we will spend your money and you will shed blood for us. And I'm not sure what you got on the other side.
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B
Yeah. So just looking at some of the polls, 36% of U.S. residents approve of how Trump is dealing with Iran. A better way to say that is 64% don't approve. 86% of Democrats and more than 61% of independents oppose U.S. military action in Iran. And talk about a nation divided. 84% of Republicans either strongly support or support American military involvement in the region. 70% of Republicans, up from 64% in 2025, perceive Iran to be a major threat. 27% of Democrats, down from 38%, share this view. So again, how do you feel about this? Ask me if you're a Democrat or a Republican or.
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Though everyone is against boots on the ground.
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Yeah, that seems to be something.
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That's a line in the sand.
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You brought that up from the very beginning. That also what you brought up, that thought was really interesting. I hadn't considered was that your generation since 9 11, where a lot of people signed up and felt like they got a bad deal, is especially opposed to boots on the ground.
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There's also this story that just came out. I think Axios had the scoop that back in August, the Ukrainians who have been begging us for more support for the Tomahawk missiles, that would have really helped when we got into trouble, even because of the effect on Russia that they tried to sell this battle proven tech for downing Iranian drones. They did a whole PowerPoint presentation and we basically said, no, thank you. And they said, no, this is gonna be really good if you need to go up against folks in the Middle east like Iran. And they were dismissed. And apparently there's a lot of regret within the administration, which totally makes sense, like coulda, woulda, shoulda. But I don't know how other countries are thinking more about our well being or planning ahead better than we were. And it's just so ironic, of course, that it's the Ukrainians, right, that were the ones that came to us and said, if you get into this kind of mess, this is the way that we can help you get out of it. And now last minute, we've had to call them and they have come to our aid. But the fact that there was literally a PowerPoint presentation is blowing my mind this morning.
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Well, I think one of the learnings is going to come out of this is the same learning that's coming out of the Ukraine war, and that is asymmetric warfare. And that is our Tomahawks cost millions and the Shahid drones, I believe, cost 20K. It's 20.
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20K. We spent $4 million for $20,000 to combat.
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Yeah. And it's, I don't know, like, what is it? Revenge is a.
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A cruel mistress.
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Revenge is a dish best served cold. I just love the idea of the Americans leaning on the Ukrainians for. For military advice. Anyways. All right, Jess, before we go, some big news. We'll be at south by Southwest this weekend.
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Yay.
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Yeah. Right. In the great state of Texas.
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I'm so excited. And it'll be 80 degrees. It's been nice here the last couple of days. It's fine.
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Beautiful today.
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Nothing like eight. I know.
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So we'll be at south by Southwest. If you're down there and you see either Jess or me, please say hi. We do. We're friendly. Also, in addition to now being five days a week, Raging Moderates is now available on Substack. Subscribers will get A.D. free episodes, live streams, and a place to engage with Jess and me and other listeners. Find us at ragingmoderates.proptinemedia.com Again, that's raging moderates.propertymedia.com that's all for this episode. Thank you for so much for joining us today.
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See you later, Sam.