Ep 429 - Aging Up Your Book Taste + Becky Spratford!

Summary

Reading Glasses: Episode 429 – Aging Up Your Book Taste + Becky Spratford! Release date: September 18, 2025 Hosts: Brea Grant and Mallory O'Meara Special Guest: Becky Spratford

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Episode Overview

This episode of Reading Glasses explores how readers can “age up” their book taste—specifically, how to transition from reading Young Adult (YA) to adult fiction, or whether you even need to. Hosts Brea Grant and Mallory O'Meara share advice, personal experiences, and actionable tips for readers navigating this shift. They also address listener feedback and reading dilemmas, recommend fantasy books with “no spice,” and interview horror expert Becky Spratford about her new book Why I Love Horror, wheelhouses, trends in the genre, and more.

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What Are the Hosts Reading?

[00:59–06:05]

Brea

• Current Read: Wearing the Lion by John Wiswell (a Heracles retelling)
  • Brea admits to not knowing much about Greek mythology, finds the dual perspective (Hera and Heracles) humorous and accessible.
  • “It's written in this very funny, very modern, sort of inaccurate [voice]… It's really charming and I'm learning a lot about Greek gods. Fantastic book.” — Brea [03:15]

Mallory

• Current Read: A Resistance of Witches by Morgan Ryan
  • Historical fantasy set in WWII about a British witch fighting Nazis and political resistance within her own magical council.
  • “You pick it up and you're like, wait, I just read 20% of it—oh god! It's excellent, it's really pulse pounding.” — Mallory [05:26]
  • Touches on the comfort (and anxiety) of reading about witches fighting fascism.

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Listener Feedback & Community

[06:05–17:16]

• BookCon is back! [06:05–06:46]
  • Meredith shares the return of BookCon, April 2026, NYC.
  • Mallory: “This is big news for readers.”
• Book Gift Horror Story: [06:46–08:42]
  • Shelley in Minnesota received a book about laundry from her father-in-law—a family joke and an example of the worst book gift.
  • “Laundry. Period. Laundry period.” — Shelley (read aloud by Brea) [07:09]
• International Moving Advice Sought: [08:46–09:54]
  • Adria is moving from CA to Norway and wonders how to move her sizable physical library. Brea and Mallory invite listeners to share tips.
• Book Wheelhouse Shares: [09:54–10:10]
  • Adria: “Low to medium stakes fantasy and mystery, cozy feel-good reads… cookbooks, gardening books, and random ass micro histories.”
• Etsy Registry Announcement: [10:10–12:47]
  • The hosts replace their Amazon wishlist with an Etsy registry, favoring indie sellers and privacy.
  • “I'm marrying Book Buddy, you're marrying your Kindle Paperwhite.” — Mallory [12:13]
• Book Club Update: [12:47–13:48]
  • Book club on October 5th discussing The Bewitching by Silvia Moreno-Garcia; will be recorded for members as a bonus episode.
• On Host Bullying and Listener Behavior: [13:48–17:16]
  • Mallory and Brea publicly address negative emails, especially those targeting Mallory’s musical preferences.
  • “There’s two people on this podcast. One can like musicals and one cannot. That’s what the world is!” — Brea [14:48]
  • “Just do it—don’t tell us. If me not liking something you like is going to change… Don’t tell me about it.” — Mallory [15:58]

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Main Topic: Aging Up Your Book Taste

[21:01–35:53]

Inspiration Email from Avery [21:01–21:55]

Avery asks: How do I move from YA/middle grade to books that fit my evolving taste as I head into college, without sacrificing the elements I love?

Hosts’ Personal Experience

• YA wasn’t a defined category “back then”
  • Mallory: “It’s a common story for precocious readers my age, we all just started reading adult books because that’s all there was.” [24:13]
  • Brea: Only started reading more YA due to the podcast; key transitions for her happened via exposure in college classes.
• The generational shift: More niche age-targeted categories now exist, making transitions less “accidental” for today’s readers.

Tips for “Aging Up”:

1. Don’t Force It! [25:39]
   • “You don’t need to ‘age up’ your taste. But growth is good! You can outgrow books.” — Brea
2. Embrace New Adult Books: [28:25]
   • These serve as a bridge between YA and adult fiction (ages 18–23). Try read-alikes for favorite YA titles.
3. Follow Your Wheelhouse by Genre, Not Age: [29:50]
   • If you liked middle grade mysteries, try adult mysteries. Same with sci-fi, fantasy, etc.
   • “Look for those same wheelhouse elements in more adult books—keep the stuff you love.” — Brea [30:59]
4. Explore New Genres Entirely: [31:50]
   • Mallory and Brea both shifted hard into new-to-them genres (Mallory → horror, Brea → sci-fi) as a form of “aging up.”
5. Sample Adult Books by YA Authors: [31:31]
   • Many authors write across age brackets (e.g., Lev Rosen).
6. Let Class Assignments Inspire You [27:05]
   • Take cues from college reading, professors, and new friends.

Avery’s Custom Recommendations [33:59]

Wheelhouse themes: friends-to-lovers, soft characters & anxiety rep, magical fantasy, boarding schools, underdog women with powers, quirky fairy tales, secret worlds, and nonfiction about tech/pop culture.

• Bria’s Pick: Academy for Liars by Alexis Henderson
  • Magical dark academia, secretive school with persuasion skills as magic, underdog female lead.
• Mallory’s Pick: Ninth House by Leigh Bardugo
  • New adult dark academia set at Yale; underdog woman, secret magic, hidden societies.

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Interview: Becky Spratford, Author of Why I Love Horror

[39:00–64:35]

What’s Becky Reading? [39:24]

• Cursed Daughters by Oyinkan Braithwaite
  • Multi-timeline family curse; “It lives up to all the hype. Generations of cursed daughters, three timelines, perfectly done.” — Becky [40:16]
• Long Low Whistle by Laurel Hightower (Killer VHS series) —“They're all books where movie monsters come to life and old VHS tapes summon long-buried evils… marketed as Goosebumps for adults.” — Becky [41:54]

Why I Love Horror — About the Book [42:26]

• An anthology of personal essays by 18 leading horror authors (e.g., Stephen Graham Jones, Tananarive Due, Clay McLeod Chapman, Rachel Harrison, Paul Tremblay, Hailey Piper) explaining their love of horror and how it shapes their work.
  • “For years, I ran a series on my blog called Why I Love Horror… I wanted to talk directly to readers, because horror is so popular.” — Becky [44:15]
  • Each essay is paired with introductory context, recommendations, and “readalikes”—“36 authors you can try, if you like one, you’ll find another!” [47:49]

Notable Discussion Points

• The “H Word” and the Literary Divide: [53:18]
  • Becky refuses to use “literary horror”—all horror is worthy of being called literature.
  • “All books are literary. Every book has intrinsic value.” — Becky [53:38]
  • She observes a current horror renaissance due to diversification of voices and publishers finally using “horror” as a selling point.
• Monsters as Comfort: [57:08]
  • Shared from Jennifer McMahon’s essay: “The monsters she saw on TV, in movies—she felt a connection to them that she could not feel to anything else. And it brought her so much happiness and comfort.” — Becky [57:08]
• Wheelhouse as a Horror Reader: [58:29]
  • Becky craves books that are “slightly askew,” feel atmospheric, and where all details matter.
  • “I want it to feel like I'm in the place, but things are just not the way they are… if I need to put the book down and go outside for a breath, that’s a great book.” — Becky [59:05]

Upcoming Events [60:57–63:05]

• Becky will be at Parnassus Books (Nashville, with Alma Katsu & Rachel Harrison), Anderson’s Books (Naperville), New York Public Library (October 7 with Clay McLeod Chapman, Victor LaValle, Grady Hendrix), Story Fest, and a virtual event with R.L. Stine.

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Recommendations: Fantasy Books with “No Spice”

[64:42–67:43]

Listener request: Hannah seeks non-YA fantasy with minimal romance or “spice,” tired of over-hyped or hyper-romantic BookTok picks.

• Bria’s Pick: Emily Wilde’s Encyclopedia of Fairies by Heather Fawcett
  • Cozy, clever, off-page romance, features an adult protagonist, great fairies. “We may have to retire this book, but it's as good as those Sarah J. Maas and Fourth Wing books.” — Bria [65:53]
• Mallory’s Pick: The Magician’s Daughter by H.G. Perry
  • Historical fantasy, isolated island, secret magic, coming-of-age with no romance subplot.
  • “No romance in this book and it’s really great—definitely an underrated book.” — Mallory [67:28]

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Notable Quotes & Moments

• “All you need is a little spooky flavor and we’re good.” — Mallory [41:06], about picking October reads
• “You don’t have to love the things you loved 10 years ago… We should always be growing.” — Brea [25:38]
• “Look, there’s two people on this podcast. One can like musicals, and one cannot. That’s what the world is.” — Brea [14:48]
• “Don’t throw the baby out with the bathwater.” (mildly gruesome etymology digression) — both hosts [29:50–30:26]
• “Goosebumps for adults is really what my brain needs right now.” — Mallory [42:12]

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Episode Timestamps At-a-Glance

• [00:42] – Episode theme & guest intro
• [00:59–06:05] – What Are You Reading?
• [06:05–17:16] – Listener Feedback, community, host notes
• [21:01–35:53] – Main Discussion: Aging Up Book Taste, Tips & Recs
• [39:00–64:35] – Interview: Becky Spratford (“Why I Love Horror”)
• [64:42–67:43] – Fantasy with No Romance/Spice Recs

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Further Resources

• Reading Glasses Discord: Active community for book discussions, book moves, and more.
• Etsy Wishlist Registry: Linked in show notes for gifting hosts non-Amazon book goodies.
• Upcoming Book Club: The Bewitching by Silvia Moreno-Garcia, Oct 5 (members only).

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Summary prepared for listeners by an expert podcast summarizer. This episode delivers empathetic, practical book advice while celebrating personal reading growth and horror’s resurgence.

Transcript

[A]

Foreign. You're listening to Reading Glasses, a show about book culture and literary life designed to help you read better. I'm author and book devourer, Mallory o'.

[B]

Meara. I'm Bria Grant, filmmaker, musical lover, and E reader. This episode, we're talking about an age of. You want to take it out? Should I start over?

[A]

I'm gonna go lay down in the road.

[B]

You may do a different opening. Sorry.

[A]

No, it's fine. But you can. We could talk about. You could do a bookmark about.

[B]

We could do a bookmark about musicals. In a second, y'.

[C]

All.

[B]

We're gonna do a bookmark, and you're gonna hear from Aunt Bria. Oh, and she's coming to town to tell you a little something. Okay.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

This episode, we're talking about how to age up your reading taste from YA to adult, or if you should even bother. Plus, we have friend of the show, Becky Spatford, on to talk about her new book, why I Love Horror.

[A]

Oh, my God, folks, this book is so good. This interview is so good. So excited for you to hear this.

[B]

And we will recommend fantasy books with no spice.

[A]

No spice. Mild salsa fantasy books. But first, what are you reading?

[B]

I like a mild sauce if it has a lot of garlic.

[A]

Ooh.

[B]

Makes it good. I am reading the new John Wiswell book.

[A]

Ooh. Oh, the Hercules one.

[B]

It's the Hercules one, which.

[A]

That's exciting.

[B]

As, you know, as people who listen to the show know, I actually don't know that much about Greek gods. It's like sort of a. A hole in my knowledge. So when I'm reading a. So it's a retelling of Hercules, and.

[A]

And it's gay, right?

[B]

Not yet. And by the way, look at the way this is spelled. It's Heracles, and that's the way it's.

[A]

Spelled in the book.

[B]

Is Heracles a different character than Hercules? Is Hercules and Heracles the same character? You looking that up?

[A]

I'm looking it up. Oh, yeah. So when's the Greek name? One's the Roman name.

[B]

Okay, sir, I'm gonna.

[A]

Heracles is the Greek name. Hercules is the Roman name.

[B]

Okay, this was confusing to me till just this moment because I kept thinking Heracles, because he is named after the God Hera, the goddess Hera, who is his aunt. He calls his aunt. But technically he's the son. He's one of the. The offsprings of Zeus, I guess. Yeah, he may know all this to me. Very exciting, because I don't know what the.

[A]

You didn't even see the Disney movie.

[B]

No, weirdly, I've never seen the wow.

[A]

Big Musical lover over here.

[B]

I actually watched a few minutes of it when I was at Disney World fairly recently, but I've never seen it. I think I might watch it after this. People love it. People really like that movie. I think I'm slightly too old for it, is what it is. I. I would have been too old for when it came, but anyway, so. So Heracles is the main character, not Hercules, but it's the same person depending on which I view, like Greek or Roman. And so it's told from Hera's point of view and Heracles point of view. And hopefully I'm saying that right. And it starts with Hera going, my, like, good for nothing husband. My stupid dipshit husband. It's written in this very funny, very modern, sort of inaccurate.

[A]

That's great.

[B]

So I like John Wiswell. I loved his last book, as a lot of you may know. Someone you could build a nest in was one of my favorites of last year. And this one's great. It's very approachable. So if you don't know much about this world, like, I'm learning along all serious. I was like, the Hydra. Great. I'm learning about that. Like, it's really good. It's really charming and it seems to.

[A]

Be a hallmark of John Wiswell's work.

[B]

Yeah, yeah, it's really charming. It's. It's just. It's really lovely. I'm loving it. I'm learning a lot about Greek. You know, I love to learn. Learning a lot about the gods. Loving it. Fantastic book. What are you reading, Mallory?

[A]

Oh, my. My God. Okay, so this was a book that was in our most anticipated books episode for September or August, whichever. July. Wow. God, I'm on deadline, folks. Folks, my novel is due next month and I don't know what year it is. I don't know where I am. But anyway, this book was in our most anticipated for July, and we were correct in anticipating it because it bangs. It is.

[B]

We need a word for like, anticipation, correctness. Like, you know, we're like, yeah, we.

[A]

Well anticipated.

[B]

Yeah, well, we well anticipated.

[A]

It is a Resistance of Witches by Morgan Ryan. So this is. Oh, God. It's a historical fantasy book set in World War II. And it's about this. It's. There's a couple different POV characters, but the main character that you start with and she's. You go through with the whole book is this woman. She's a Young witch in Britain. And her, she's like the right hand witch to this woman who runs this secret witch academy. And the, the council does not believe that they should get involved with World War II. But her, the, the witch that she works for who runs the academy is like, no, these Nazis, this is really bad. If we don't do something, the world is going to go to. And she's personal. She used to be friends with Winston Churchill. So she goes to meet with him personally. And so she goes against the witches of the Academy and gets the witches involved in, in World War II. And then you flash forward to a few years later, the war is still going. They haven't been able to win it yet. The witches on the council are very upset that she has gotten them involved in all of this because, you know, they haven't beat the Nazis yet. And then she gets assassinated and the main character has to take her place. And like they're trying to find this grimoire that is full of this like dark magic. And the witches of the Academy council still don't want her to do this stuff and are actively working against her. And she finds out that someone inside the academy has been helping the Nazis. And so she goes on this adventure to like find this book and she gets involved with this man who is an art curator and he's been trying to protect art from the Nazis.

[B]

And you know, Mallory loves that, Loves an art.

[A]

I didn't even connect to that, that. But yeah, it's, it's, it is so great. It is. So the pacing is. It's one of those books where you like pick it up and you're like, wait, I just read 20 of it. Oh God. Like, it's excellent. It is. It's really pulse pounding. It is. I, I love historical fantasy and this is just, it feels very soothing right now to like read about witches fighting Nazis. And it's really also disturbing because you're like, oh, this is just the same old fascist playbook. Like, we are going through a lot of this stuff right now, so it is scary. But in, in the meantime, you can read this excellent book. It is A Resistance of Witches by.

[B]

Morgan Rya, reading Wearing the lion by John Wiswell.

[A]

So I want to take a moment to share some listener feedback. Meredith wrote in to say, listening to the newest episode. Someone wrote in looking for a way to find book conventions and mentioned that the New York one is no longer happening. This is bookcon. Someone, someone was lamenting the fact that Bookon no longer exists. But Meredith says, great news. It's back.

[B]

Hey.

[A]

April 18th and 19th, 2026 at the Javit center. They have a new Instagram account where they're posting all the news about the event at Book wanted to share. I'll be going and cannot wait. Oh, this is big news for readers.

[B]

Find this other Glasser bookcon was like.

[A]

One of the big cons.

[B]

Oh really?

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And why was it canceled?

[A]

Maybe Covid probably. But this is very exciting for readers. Merida, thank you for writing in letting.

[B]

Us know Shelly wrote in and said, hey friends, writing you from sweltering Twin Cities, Minnesota today. As a relatively new listener within the last year. Absolutely adore the podcast and my TBR list is groaning under the weight of all the new recommendations you've given me. So thank you so much for that. I was just listening to your episode about gifting books and had to tell you a story about the worst book gift I was ever given.

[A]

We got some really great emails, but this is maybe my favorite.

[B]

Okay, normally I'm the kind of person who would love a book gift. Anyway, I had to tell you that last Christmas my father in law gave me a book about laundry and then wait. What's really funny is Shelly writes a book about laundry. Period. Laundry period. As in putting clothes in the washing machine, adding soap, moving them to the dryer and drying them. I don't want to call out the author nor the title of the book because as an author myself, I know how hard they worked on it. I would never want to disparage anyone for writing about a passion project. Laundry is your passion. Okay. Anyway, but at the time, man oh man did I blanche when opening up that package and into sitting among the most hated titles at the tippy top of my bookcase and will never, never, never be read. By the way, get rid of this book. This remains a talking point between my husband and I and even now, just to get a laugh out of each other, we'll say things like let's never be the kind of person who gives our children's spouses books about fudgeing laundry. Oh, absolutely.

[A]

It sounds like like a joke, like something that would be like in a cart, like an animated show. Like yes. Oh, what did the father. The father in law is like what a women like what can I get a book about? Yeah, women love laundry.

[B]

Yeah. You know, I had this roommate one time who said one year she was it. It was Christmas and she noticed that every gift her mom got was kitchen related. And after that she was like I'll never buy my mom anything kitchen related because she was like, does she really like the kitchen that much? Like, and I think she liked to cook, but still it was sort of like, yeah, okay. Yeah, like, yeah. Wow, this is amazing.

[A]

I kind of want to look it up and see what book this is.

[B]

Shelley finishes by saying, absolutely. Love the show. Keep up the good work. We really need you in times like these.

[A]

Next up, we have a question. Sometimes people write in and ask international questions from us. And because Bria and I are both based in the us, both based in la, sometimes we have a hard time answering international questions. So Adria wrote in, said we're gonna.

[B]

Rely on the glasses.

[A]

Yeah. I'm sending this out into the glasser universe and hopefully someone can help Adria who says, hey Mallory and Bria, I know you guys talked about moving with books on the show before, but I'm not sure what to do in my situation. I'm anticipating a move from California to Norway within the next year to start a life together with my fiance. However, despite my ebook devourer tendencies, I have a rather substantial physical library that to take with me. How does one move a personal library across nine time zones? Do you ship the books? Do you pack a suitcase full of books? We haven't finalized any moving plans yet, so any advice will be welcome no matter when you guys have time to tackle this. So if anyone has done an international move with a lot of books, please write in. Neither. I mean, I have traveled internationally quite extensively and so have you, but I've never had to move my entire library that far. I've done a cross country move from New York to la. Yeah, but this is a whole different thing. So if anyone's done this, please write in with some advice. Bria, you want to read Audrey's Wheelhouse?

[C]

Yes.

[B]

Low to medium stakes fantasy and mystery cozy feel good reads, urban fantasy, witchy vibes, steampunk and gas lamp fantasy. Oh, Gas lamp fantasy. Okay, I can see what that is. Regency era mild romance cookbooks, gardening books and random ass micro histories.

[A]

Love it. You can email us at reading glasses podcast gmail.com if you want a list of all the books we talk about on the show delivered to your inbox every month. You can sign up for our newsletter. There's a link in the show notes. And speaking of links and the show notes, we got some big news. We've been trying for quite a while to find an alternative to our Amazon wish list because you know, we don't.

[B]

Want to support Amazon.

[A]

Yes, but Amazon wishlists are so popular because they are the easiest to do. And we found people wrote in with some suggestions for us and we looked into them and they are quite expensive for shipping.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And I was really bummed out because one of the first things we looked at a long time ago was an Etsy wish list. And that wasn't working out because you can't hide your address. But then I figured out a workaround.

[B]

Yeah. We got a registry.

[A]

A registry and I are getting married to our E readers. So we finally. Our wish list is being replaced by an Etsy registry. So you can go on there. There's a link in the show notes, there's an Etsy wish list link and there's all kinds of cool book tech. There's those bookmark purse things.

[B]

Yeah. Make sure you put those bookmark purses.

[A]

People have been sending us those.

[B]

Now we know that there is some AI on Etsy now we. I just sent Mallory article. I was like, oh no. So if we have some AI you can tell us like I think this is AI but like we went through it.

[A]

We don't think there's anything.

[B]

Yeah, yeah, we think we got. We think we got all the AI out. We're trying to do specifically like small book sellers do people making cool bookish accessories on Etsy which is exciting for us.

[A]

Yeah. So if you buy stuff on there, it will get shipped to us.

[B]

Like do you know how many candle makers there are on Etsy?

[A]

So many candle makers.

[B]

We could buy candles for the next millennium.

[A]

I mean I will be.

[B]

But we are.

[A]

Thank you for your patience. It's taken us a really long time. This was a lot harder of a. Of a task than we anticip because we don't. There was one thing that we looked into and anyone sending us stuff was going to have to pay almost $20 in shipping. We don't want. We don't want you folks to be. To be spending that much money and we want to also protect our privacy. So we finally found something that we think will work. And yeah, if anyone ask, Bri and I are mar. I'm marrying book buddy. You're marrying your Kindle paper white.

[C]

Correct.

[A]

And we're very excited for our happy new lives. Second bookmark. Very exciting. Just a reminder, folks, the class or book club's happening October 5th. It is happening 5pm October 5th. That is a Friday. It's 5pm Pacific time. As you know, it will be recorded this time. People have been asking for us to record Glasser events for quite a while, but because they cost us money just as much Money as a regular episode. We did not feel comfortable doing it. And it was, you know, we were nervous that people would not speak freely because they were being recorded. And, you know, it's just, it was. It's a.

[B]

Well, we'll have a system. Like, if you. If you're like, I want to speak freely, but don't put this on the podcast. We can do that, but we're going to release it eventually, two members only.

[A]

As a bonus episode.

[B]

So you have to be a member to listen to it or to come to the recording.

[A]

Yes. But thanks to all our wonderful members, we feel comfortable spending the money doing this and making it available for everybody. So the event again is October 5th at 5pm Pacific Time, Friday. It's going to go for about an hour and a half. Again, we are reading the Bewitching by Silvia Moreno Garcia. We're very excited. So come on down. Or, you know, if you're not a member, you can join right now. Go to maximumfund.org join sign up, email us, let us know you want to do this event. And it's going to be me and Bria talking about this book. And Glassers are going to come up and tell their opinions about it. What you thought of this book, what you thought of the characters. We're really excited. And if you can't make it, it will be available as a bonus episode. But again, bonus episode. Members only, members only. So Glasser Book Club, October 5, 5pm Email us for the invite. And Bria, you have a bookmark that I was not aware of.

[B]

You'll need. You'll need to quit bullying Mallory.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

I'm not. You think this is a joke. Valerie's laughing, but it actually is hurting her feelings. And yeah, we don't talk about this much on the show, but we are human beings. So when you write in mean emails like, stop it. Stop. Stop writing those emails, they will be deleted. We're not going to read them like you're writing into now.

[A]

You're writing. Whenever we see a.

[B]

You can write us emails.

[A]

Not.

[B]

Y' all know what I'm talking about. Do I even have to say it? Do I have to?

[A]

Whenever I get an email that has a. I've just started deleting them. If there's a musical in the. In the. In the log in the subject, you can block. Yeah, Bria was like, I think you should just block all emails that have.

[B]

You can block those.

[A]

The world musical in them. Yeah, they're starting to get pretty disturbing. They're just going to get deleted. They've. They've crossed the line into. People have been sending some pretty. Not just hurtful stuff, but also very disturbing stuff. Weird guys, some really strange upsetting. Yeah, it's just disturbing.

[B]

But we get it. Look, there's two people on this podcast. One can like musicals and one cannot. One can like. We can like different things. Like, it's okay. That's what. That's what the world is. And I don't know, like, I'm sorry if that's, like, hurtful to your taste when someone doesn't like something you like, but that is. That's the way things go. There's a lot of things I don't like that Mallory love. Mallory likes music. That I think is bad. Okay, well, that's. That is.

[A]

The funny part is so many people were like, it's just. It's not who you are, Mallory. I'm like, I watch sports and lift.

[B]

Mallory's a jock. Y' all kind of forget that sometimes. Like, I'm a little artsy freak. Mallory looks like the artsy freak. No, she's a jock. And she could beat us all up, but I won't. She could give us a wedgie and we can do nothing about it. Okay.

[A]

That is. Yeah, there's been a few emails from people who've been. And saying, it just doesn't fit your personality. I'm like, I like lifting weights and listening to metal and watching sports.

[B]

You can be. You can be multiple things. You can like weird fantasy books and weird Mallory reads, but also like sports. Just y' all stop. You need to stop. Okay? And if you can't handle that, if.

[A]

Or please stop. But also so many people have written and saying that they wanna. They're gonna cancel their memberships that they're gonna stop listening to the show. Just do it. Don't tell us if me not liking something that you like is gonna change. Just you think. Don't tell me about it.

[B]

I don't even understand that because, like, you're gonna cancel your membership and you think Mallory's gonna start liking something she doesn't like. It's taste. It's a matter of taste. Yeah.

[A]

People have told me that she did.

[B]

Just say she liked Hercules. I just want to point that out.

[A]

I mean, this. Disney. Disney movies that I really like.

[B]

But if you listen, just don't bother writing about it. If you have an opinion and tell your friends, but you don't have also.

[A]

Shout out to the person in the discord some. I forget who it was, but somebody was like, like you don't like someone's opinions. Why are you listening to their podcast, A medium designed to. To deliver people's opinions. Yeah, but yeah, there's been some. It's starting to get pretty weird. Yeah. I don't know what else to tell you folks.

[B]

Yeah, but just if you write in, you're not going to get a reaction from us. So like.

[A]

So this is it. We're done.

[B]

We're done. This is it.

[A]

We're done talking about it. They'll all be deleted. I get a lot of hate mail as we've talked before. People don't like that. I swear. People don't like that. I don't like musicals. Just stop listening to the show. I'm not going to stop swearing. I'm not gonna like musicals. This is who I am as a person. Like your emails are just gonna get deleted and you look like an.

[B]

Yeah, yeah. Quit bullying people. Stop it.

[A]

Don't you have anything better to do? Go read.

[B]

Go read a book about musicals. Okay, let's keep going.

[A]

So before we talk about aging up book taste, we're going to take a quick break. Reading Glasses is sponsored in part this week by zocdoc. Folks, we're always scrolling, scrolling, scrolling. And one of the bad side effects of the many of scrolling is that you're always seeing some weird health fad on social media. Maybe you should eat a lot of cheese, maybe you should get a specific color of light, maybe you should be gurgling a specific type of oil or it's. There's a new one every week and it is very overwhelming. We're all trying to take care of ourselves, but it's hard. But the best thing you can do is turn to real life healthcare professionals who can help you meet your health goals. And with zocdoc, it is so easy. You can find doctors that are right for you, that are in your network, that are well reviewed and most importantly, instantly book an appointment. And the Coolest part of ZocDoc is it's totally free. The app is free. You can check out their website as well where you can search and compare high quality in network doctors across every specialty and click to instantly book an appointment. You can filter for all kinds of stuff. You want to find doctors who take your insurance, they're nearby, they're a good fit for any particular medical need you have and highly rated by verified patients. Appointments made through Zocdoc also happen fast, typically within just 24 to 72 hours of booking. You're not going to have to Wait three weeks, several months. Sometimes you can even get a same day appointment, which seems kind of like magic. Bria and I have both used Zoc doc before and it has really saved us. Finding a doctor is hard, especially if it's a new kind of ailment. Then you, you haven't seen anybody for it before. You need a specialty doctor or you've maybe you've moved to a new city. That's what happened to me when I moved to la. Like a few months after I moved to la. I really needed a doctor same day. And you know what? I used Zoc talk. And that was like 10 years ago. Zoc talk has gotten even better since then. If you have something going on or you're concerned about something, or maybe you just want to talk to a real life doctor and ask about these weird Instagram fads. That's the way to do it. So stop putting off those doctor's appointments and go to Zocdoc.com glasses to find and instantly book a top rated doctor today. That's Zocdoc.com classes Zocdoc.com classes Glasses hi everybody, it's Ellen Weatherford and Christian Weatherford.

[C]

People say not to judge a fish.

[A]

By its ability to climb a tree, but we can judge a snake by its ability to fly, or a spider by its ability to dive, or a dung beetle by its ability to navigate with the starlight of the Milky Way galaxy. On Just the Zoo of Us, we rate our favorite animals out of 10 in the categories of physical effectiveness, behavioral ingenuity, and of course, aesthetics. Guest experts like biologists, ecologists, musicians, comedians, and more join us to share their unique insights into the animal kingdom. Listen with the whole family on maximumfun.org or wherever you get your podcasts. This week we're talking about aging up your book taste. When you become an adult, do you need to stop reading ya? How do you start reading adult books and figure out your taste in a different reader age bracket? Can you force yourself to change like a book Pokemon evolving up all right, Bria, you want to read the email that's inspired today's episode from Avery?

[B]

Sure. Hey Bria. Mallory, I'm looking for some book recommendations to graduate from my high school slash mostly YA reading taste to something that is a better fit for my current place in life.

[A]

Life.

[B]

In the fall, I'm off to college and I know to keep my sanity, I need a few good books that I don't have to struggle through while I'm adjusting to a new lifestyle. This summer I've been trying to wade through my physical tbr, but I've found that most of those books consist of my middle grade and early high school taste. That is to say, mostly ya. Don't get me wrong, I love some ya. Some of my favorite books are YA and even middle grade. But it seems like I have left some of that taste behind, ultimately making my goal of tackling my physical TBR that much harder. So I've been stuck with my wheelhouse and knowing what books to pick up that feel more adult, though that may feel like the wrong term than the mostly YA books from my middle slash high school years while keeping the best elements I love. Heavy, hard to get through books may not be the best because I'll be adjusting, but I'll take anything.

[A]

All right, so before we get to recommending some books for aging up your book tastes, let's talk about this. Did you do this when you like any transitional phase in life, when you went to high school, when you went to college, like, did you ever feel like consciously I need to read older books?

[B]

No. This is something maybe a younger generation may be more aware of. I could, I know my tastes were changing. And like, I think like when I went from high school to college, I really was learning about feminism and feminist books. But I didn't take that many books to college. And this is going to shock everyone. But I didn't took hardly anything and I don't think I took any books. Oh, maybe I took a couple of.

[A]

Books because Kindles didn't exist yet.

[B]

Yeah. And I worked at a library up until that point and I liked reading, but I got my books from my dad were at the library. So at the time I maybe took like my zine collection, you know, and a couple books, but not much. When I moved to la, I moved in my car. So I had to move everything I had like in my car, including my dog and like a small little twin fold out mattress.

[A]

Wow.

[B]

So I took hardly any books then as well. But for me it was like I did understand college was really exciting and it felt like I was diving into subjects I wanted to know more about. And I still have some of those books I bought that first year because I was really like, I wanted to learn about intersectional feminism and American history, two subjects I was really interested in then and still am obviously. And I feel like a lot of those books I even still have. But no, like I wasn't like, I, I basically left everything behind. So I wasn't like aging anything up really. And I And I don't think I was aware of it. It was just like, I know I'm interested in this thing. Maybe I wanted to be like, I'm not this person anymore. I'm an adult, you know. But it wasn't like something I was super aware of. What about you?

[A]

I think I did this accidentally when I was a teenager. I think it's because this might be a generational thing, is when, like, YA wasn't really a thing when we were.

[B]

It was just now. Yes, you're right. Because when I worked at a library, we had a. We maybe my last year of working at the library, which had been 99, 2000, we started like a small ya.

[A]

Section and it was like you had like whole popularity. Yeah.

[B]

Harry Potter.

[A]

Yeah. His Dark Materials.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Island of the Blue Dolphins.

[B]

Yeah, that's right. That's right. That's a good one. I don't remember what else was in there, but it was very, very small. Like it was just now it was like. Yeah. So. Yeah, that's. You weren't even thinking about the age. It was like middle grade, obviously was very different, but YA was not a thing.

[A]

Yeah, it was more of a gray area. Yeah.

[B]

We invented the ya. Yeah.

[A]

Like, I mean, so when I was a teen, you kind of went from reading like younger stuff like island of the Blue Dolphins to reading it. You know, there was not a lot.

[B]

Because there's kids in it.

[A]

Sure are. But I think it's a pretty common story for like precocious readers of my age or older that we all just started reading adult books because that's all there really was, was available. I read a lot of fantasy as a young teen. Like, I started reading Tolkien when I was 11. You know, I didn't. I just sort of jumped into adult stuff. I was big on R.A. salvatore. I didn't come back to ya for a really long time, honestly, until I started doing this show. So by the time I was 18, I was like, smoke cigarette. I was like, smoke cigarette. I've been reading about child group sex And Stephen King's it since I was, you know, 12 or whatever. You know, I like, I can see for a teen now with. Now that, you know, the age groups are so clearly delineated that it would be an issue where it's like, you make me make a more conscious decision. But I think I just kind of did it accident. There was no. There wasn't a moment where I was like, I need to start reading adult things. It was like, what is around the house that I can Read.

[B]

Yeah. Yeah.

[A]

All right, so what are our tips for aging up your reading taste? How do you find this is such a great. Honestly, I wanted to devote a whole episode to this because it's such a great question. How do you find your wheelhouse as an adult?

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

How do you figure out how to be an adult reader? Reader.

[B]

Yeah. I mean, I think you and I both will say there's no need to quote, unquote, age up your taste. Like, I think Avery is very thoughtful in this email, and it just feels like she's outgrown a lot of her books, and I think that's totally cool. I think you should keep growing forever. Like, we should always be growing. We should. This is controversial, but I don't think you have to love the things you love 10 years ago. I think you and I like even doing this show. It's so interesting because we, like had to talk about what we loved eight years ago. And like, I read a lot more YA eight years ago and I don't read that now.

[A]

You were the YA reader when we started this podcast.

[B]

I feel like you're the middle grade.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Reader. Which you aren't a middle grade. Yeah, I did not started.

[A]

Nope.

[B]

And I think that, like, that is important to know how your taste is changing. I think, you know, we continue to learn, explore the world. You find new things you like. I think, like, adult wheelhouse wise. I personally was introduced to a lot of authors and that's how things changed for me. So, like, I started learning about more about politics, and then I got into sci fi, and then I got into comic books in college. And it was really a gradual change with people handing me stuff and like, what I was assigned in class, which, you know, thank you to my liberal arts degree. Like, that actually was something. I had really good professors that designed really cool, interesting books about things I was interested in. So I think, okay, first of all, just specifically for Avery, I think lean into these classes that you're taking. I don't know, maybe. I don't know if they'll. If you were to be a full math major and you never have to read like a novel, but you can.

[A]

Talk to Paul Tremblay, who is a math teacher but also writes books.

[B]

That's true. But like, and. And you know, take advantage of the fact that you are in a place where there are people who can introduce you to new and cool things. So if there's a professor who signs you a couple books where you're like, this is cool. See what else they're Recommending see what else are on their other syllabi. Ask them specifically. Go explore those authors. Like, I think there's just like a. That's the first thing to do is like, you're going to a place where there are people who are going to be able to give you some good advice. Not. And in the college kids around you, the people around you are going to have like, I learned about comic books through like a boyfriend in college. You know, like, that was how I got into comic books. And there's just gonna be people with different tastes. And I think just being open to like what is interesting to you at this moment is the most important thing. What's your first advice?

[A]

I mean, first off, even though we are all about reading what you like on the show, and I do think you should keep your love of YA books if you want. I think a great impulse. Like, I think it's really introspective to be able to recognize that you're having a transitional moment in your life and to be able to step back and say, does my reading taste need to change? Am I becoming a different person? Should I adjust my re? Like, this is really, really. I think this is a cool impulse. I just think it's a great sign of knowing yourself well as a reader. My first tip is to try new adult, which is brand new people just.

[B]

I just learned about what this was like two weeks ago.

[A]

People just started talking about this a few years ago. It's a very spec. I think we now when we grew up, it was just like, well, you go from box cart kids to flowers in the attic. Like there's like not a lot of in between. But now it's like so niche. There's so many niche age ranges. And new adult is like specifically for 18 to 23. It's like people who are literally new adults and they're literal bridge books. And I think this might be good for Avery. I'm sure you can find read alikes for like take make a list of YA books that you love and see if you can find books that are read alikes for those YA ones that you love. And if there's a YA book on your tbr. But it feels too like if there's a book you're excited about, but you're like, this does kind of feel too young for me right now. Sell it at a used bookstore and get something similar that's in a the age bracket up, you know.

[B]

Yeah, I think that's really smart. And also just want to point out those books on Your TBR you're getting rid of, they still exist later. So if you're like, I just want to return to this middle grade book, don't worry, it's still there. You can still return to that book. Okay. So the other thing I would encourage you to do is look at your wheelhouse. Not based on age. So if you are reading a bunch of middle grade mystery books or. And you loved those books, like try a mystery book that is an adult mystery book. If you are, you know, like, make sure you're not leaving. Don't throw out the baby with bath water. You know, like, make sure. Do we still say that? Is that an appropriate thing to say? Seems kind of.

[A]

I don't think babies are going to get mad. They can't talk yet.

[B]

It's so violent though, when you think about it, like baby with the bath water. That, who came up with that?

[A]

Well, it was a big problem for a while. Yeah, well, it was a thing, as far as I know. It was like a thing where families would all use the same bath water and the baby was the last to be washed, apparently, because they can't protest. What are they gonna do?

[B]

So dirty baby.

[A]

And the bath water was so gross by that point that it was hard to see through the water. So don't throw the baby out with the bath water.

[B]

Don't throw the baby out with the bath. But it wasn't like a, it wasn't like a.

[A]

No.

[B]

People aren't yeeting of throwing babies out with the bath water.

[A]

No.

[B]

Okay. Okay, that's good. Anyway, I just am saying, like, okay, yes, maybe you don't want to read Boxcar Kids. Gosh. There's an updated reference for that that we're not using.

[A]

Babysitters Club.

[B]

Like, so you may not want to be doing that, but you are like, oh, I love that they're solving these mysteries. Babysitter. That's what they do, right? They. I've never read a babysitter's club book. I don't think.

[A]

Yeah, I, I, I know this because there's a babysitter named Mallory and I got very excited. Not a lot of Mallory's in media. They talk about to Mallory at the babysitter's collection club.

[B]

I love this show Twisted Metal. And there's, there's one episode where they talk about Babysitters Club.

[A]

Quite. That's adorable.

[B]

Very. It's really funny. Anyway, I got off track. What was I saying? Oh, yeah. So, so anyway, figure out what that wheel, what your wheelhouse is because there may Be some of those books that you have still that you want to hold on to because you're like, what I really liked about this book was the mystery and not the age or the science fiction or the literary fiction aspect of it. And then look for those as you like. Look for things in that same wheelhouse which because while you may want to age up your characters, you may not want to get rid of the things that drew you in the first place.

[A]

Also, I just realized there's a lot of authors that write in all age ranges. Like Lev Roson, mystery author.

[B]

Oh yeah.

[A]

Love has YA books, but he also has adult books.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

So that would be a great thing.

[B]

That's a good idea. That's a good idea. So yeah, maybe some of these same authors. I mean. Yeah, I mean Mallory just read a middle grade book by Paul Tremblay, you know. So like there's definitely. Who are doing all sorts of different age ranges. That's good. Good call. What else you got?

[A]

Also, as just on the completely different end of the spectrum, I would try a new genre. Like why this is the time, you know, like I was basically only reading fantasy from age 9 to, I don't know, age 17ish, 18ish. And then I got into horror wicked hard. Wicked hard. And looking back, getting a totally new genre was my version of aging up. My reading tastes like even though I don't think I was doing it on purpose, I you're becoming an adult and your life is going to change a lot and try a new genre to see if you like it. Like there was a couple again, I did read it at a very young age. There was another Stephen King that I read way too young. But I was not really into horror, you know, got real really into it because I got. I also got into horror movies. I just got into monsters and horror in general. And that now looking back it's very clear to me, I'm like, oh, that was me aging up my especially because back then they were. There was really Goosebumps was kind of the. And Christopher pike were like kind of the only there were not a lot of like YA horror and even Goosebumps is really like young middle grade. So I if I wanted to read horror I was probably gonna have to read adult books. And so this genre will have no associations with teen you and it can feel very grown up to have a new taste in books. And I definitely felt like that when I was this age. I was like, I read horror now.

[B]

I actually kind of felt like that when I moved into like science fiction. So I was like, I now am a science fiction reader. Because I had, like, dabbled, but not. I. Yeah, the same thing.

[A]

Exact same thing with horror.

[B]

Yeah, Yeah. I was like, I'd read Kurt Vonnegan, which is science fiction adjacent. I read a lot of, like, literary fiction stuff, but I was like, yeah, now I'm a science fiction person, which I still am.

[A]

All right, so let's give Avery some Rex. Avery says, can you guys recommend some more adult books? Wheelhouse elements that I know work is friends to lovers with soft characters and anxiety representation, Magical fantasy, unusual but not creepy. Boarding schools, Underdog women with powers, quirky fairy tales, secret fantasy worlds that live alongside ours. Non fiction about tech, social media, pop culture, or current societal standards. Thank you for taking the time to read about my little book problem, and thank you for such a fun show. Bria, what do you think Avery should read for this? Now?

[B]

I'm worried this is a little too creepy, but I have one that's a boarding school.

[A]

I don't think this is creepy, but it's.

[B]

Imagine it's a college. So it's a. Graduating up a little bit. It's.

[A]

We're both doing college books.

[B]

Oh, that's funny. It's an Academy for Liars by Alexis Henderson. And it's weird. College says magical college. So it's. It's basically about a young woman who gets a call, and they're like, you're going to this college. And the college is instead of magic, instead of teaching magic, they teach the power of persuasion, which basically, in this world is magic, because they can. They can persuade so hard that. That it becomes magic.

[A]

Folks, have you ever got persuaded so hard?

[B]

That's. Listen, I have, actually. It is. It's a beautiful. Basically, it's a secret school, so it checks that out. Secret world alongside ours, which checks a box for you. And underdog woman with powers that checks that box. And unusual school. Hopefully it's not too creepy, but I think. I think you'll enjoy. It's a. It's a fun one, and it's a little bit. It's a college. It's a college dark academia book.

[A]

I'm doing the literal exact same.

[B]

You're doing college dark academia book.

[A]

9Th House by Leigh Bardugo.

[B]

Great. Wow. We are really like. We're like, you're going to college.

[A]

Wow.

[B]

Here's your college books.

[A]

Well, we both love reading a book that is. Mirrors our life. Yeah, we both really love that.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

So in Ninth House, the main character, she's 20 years old. Her life is a mess. She's the survivor of an unsolved multiple homicide and on her hospital bed is offered a deal from a mysterious benefactor. She gets a full ride at Yale in exchange for covertly monitoring the secret society. So it's got magic unusual school, underdog female main character, secret world that lives alongside him. The mainstream one. I think think Academy for liars and 9th house is like a one two punch of new adult dark academia Underdog ladies.

[B]

Yep, yep.

[A]

Avery, we hope you love this and let us know. Keep us posted so you can send your thoughts about aging up your book. Taste at reading glasses podcast gmail.com before we talk to Becky Spratford about horror. Folks, you are going to want to listen to this interview. It's amazing. But first we're going to take a quick break. Reading Glasses is sponsored in part this week by Green Chef. Folks, fall is the best time of year for me. It's hockey, it's horror books, it's horror movies. But it's also the most delicious time of year. Everything in fall is delicious. You want some nice warm flavors to make everything feel cozy. Maybe while you're reading it's the perfect time to try Green Chef. But what is Green Chef? It is a pre made meal kit service that makes it easy to spend less time in the kitchen and more time enjoying fall AKA reading horror books and with their new heat and eat meals, enjoy a delicious wholesome meal in just three minutes. Perfect for supporting your wellness journey. Green Chef recipes feature fresh organic seasonal produce and 100% responsibly sourced proteins to help you feel your best. The recipes change every week so you're not going to get bored. And with week to week flexibility you can adjust your plan to match your mood and your schedule. Folks, you know I hate cooking cooking. Truly. I wish I could just plug myself into the wall like a phone, but I can't. We're not there yet. Maybe someday, but not yet. Until then, the next best thing is using Green Chef. It makes it so easy. You don't have to figure stuff out. You don't have to hunt down a weird ingredient. Everything is delivered to you. Truly. Everything you're gonna need. Even down to spices and sauces and little like pre portioned packets. If I can do it, you can do it it. Maybe you want to enjoy some fall flavors. Maybe you have some goals you want. Like me trying to not eat like a divorced dad. Green Chef really helps with that. So make this ball your healthiest yet with Green Chef. Head to greenchef.com 50glasses and use code 50glasses to get 50% off your first month. Then 20% off for two months with free shipping. That's code [e-mail] 50glasses. 50glasses. You guys want to try and do this promo with British accents?

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Yeah, of course. Let's do it. Okay. Okay. Ify you go, boy. Bro.

[C]

This is TV Chef Fantasy league. Fantasy league.

[A]

Okay, Sierra.

[C]

We take cooking competition shows and treat.

[A]

Them like fantasy sports, like a newscaster. Very posh. Right now we're doing the Great British Bake off or the Great British baking show, if you're listening from the U.S. ooh, that was really soothing. You chose like a prim and print proper mountain abbey. Thank you. Okay, if. Yeah, I think you have the best accent. You want to take us home? Subscribe to TV Chef Fantasy League on Maximumphone.org and wherever you get your podcasts. Better than my Boston one. And here we are with friend of the show, All Timer guest. We're so happy to have her back. Becky Spratford. Becky, thank you so much. Congratulations. You're finally here talking about your own book. We're so happy to have you.

[C]

Thank you so much, Mallory. I know I've been here before talking about, like, other people's books and how to match people with books. And now you're here. I'm excited to talk to you about my book because I know your listeners love horror as well.

[A]

Yes, I'm very. I was been so hyped about this book for so long. I'm so excited it's finally coming out for spooky season. But before we get into it, very important question on reading glasses. What are you reading?

[C]

You know, and this is. I know you're struggling with this on reading glasses too. You know, reading ahead versus reading books that are out. So because I review for book list and Library Journal, I am always ahead.

[A]

Yes.

[C]

So as we're recording this, I just turned in my October 2025 column for Library Journal.

[A]

Exciting.

[C]

Two of my favorite books from that column were. One is like, barely horror, but I totally grabbed it because I was like, I'm not missing this book. And it's Cursed Daughters by Oyiken Braithwaite.

[A]

Oh, my God. Yes.

[C]

To my sister, the serial killer.

[A]

Bria and I are really hyped about this because my sister the serial killer was very, very highly recommend recommended book on reading glasses. We've talked about it a bunch, and it's been a little while since that book came out. So this is a buzzy release.

[C]

It's a. It lives up to all the hype. It was so good. Generations of cursed daughters. Three timelines that are just done perfectly because in the places where they overlap, they share so much about the characters who are the narrators. Because it's three different women in a family. And when they share something about themselves in one timeline, we can see the ramifications in another when a different woman.

[A]

Oh, that's just so awesome. Perfectly done. Oh, so good.

[C]

Anything away. But it does have an underlying, you know, spiritualism, ghosts that. And curses that, you know, it's up to you. Do you believe that they're there or aren't they? But. But I thought there was evidence that there is some kind of curse.

[A]

But I think that totally counts for Spooky season. All you need is a little spooky flavor and we're good.

[C]

And then another thing, another book that I loved. In that group of eight is one that your readers might not know about as much or your listeners. Sorry, I'm so used to readers. It's called the Long Low Whistle by Laurel Hightower.

[A]

But here's the thing.

[C]

It's part of a series, and I'm gonna give it to you to put in the show. Notes. Notes. That's called Killer VHS series by Shortwave Publishing.

[A]

Oh, wow. We are very in for this. This is.

[C]

Oh, yeah.

[A]

Squarely in Bria and I's wheelhouses.

[C]

You are gonna love this. Listen to this. There's seven of them now. This one was fantastic. They're all books where movie monsters come to life and old VHS tapes summon long buried evils. Oh, my God.

[A]

This is amazing.

[C]

Oh, my gosh. And Long Low Whistle is. Is cryptid. So set in an abandoned mine.

[A]

Oh, my God. So in, all in. I don't even need to know the plot that I'm good.

[C]

That's all you need to know. But all of the books are told, sort of marketed as Goosebumps for adults. Totally.

[A]

Oh, my God, this sounds incredible. Goosebumps for adults is really what my brain needs right now. Okay, so speaking of spooky reads, you have to tell us about your new book. It is Glasser Nick Nip for sure.

[C]

Yeah, I know. And it's. It's so many people. Nip.

[A]

Right.

[C]

I'm getting people telling me that they're so glad this book is out because they can give it to their friends and family as well.

[A]

Excellent gift book.

[C]

I love horror essays on horror literature. And basically the book takes today's most important horror authors.

[B]

18.

[C]

And it's the generation that Begins with Brian Keane and is exemplified by Stephen Graham Jones. So I like to say that Brian Keane and Stephen Graham Jones are the bread. And then there are 16 other authors in there as the sandwich.

[A]

And they're all authors that Reading Glasses listeners love.

[C]

Hailey Piper, Tananarif, due Jennifer McMahon, Paul Tremblay, Clay McLeod Chapman. A favorite of all of ours. Yes, and Jennifer McMahon. I mentioned Cynthia Palaio, just. There's so many. Rachel Harrison.

[A]

Oh, God.

[C]

So many great authors. That's just some of them. They're all listed there in the book when you go and look at it, to order it. But the idea is, for years, I ran a series on my blog for librarians, because librarians, as a group, they're better now, but for many years, they've been afraid of horror, and they still are when they're old. You know, all the ones that listen to your show love horror. We know this. But the vast majority out there and in my textbooks for libraries, I always said, hey, your horror readers aren't monsters. They just like to read about them.

[A]

Oh, I love that.

[C]

So that's what I push, and I've been pushing for years. And one of the things I did to help get them there is every October, I would do a series, and I still do it, called 31 Days of Horror. And I do 31 Days of Blogging aimed at librarians to help them be better at helping horror readers.

[A]

Oh, I love that.

[C]

And as part of that, I started a series about 10 years ago called called why I Love Horror. And it was invite only. And the idea was I said to authors, I said, listen, you write me a blog post, 1500 words or less, that explains your answer to that question. I did not give them guardrails. I did not tell them how to tackle that because they're authors, let them do it. And I let them tackle that question. And I got some amazing results. And the example I said both to the library workers reading and to the authors was, look, this example is here for library workers to have an example of someone who loves horror. So they get different wheelhouses, different appeal factors, different entry points, different experiences so they can see somebody who loves horror. And then the authors, I told them, you're doing that as an example, but also share other authors with them and have what you write reflect how you write and promote yourself so they can learn something about you. Well, that was just so. It's been so popular. I'm still doing it again this year on my blog, RA for all, or I invited some of the authors who are listed as read alikes for the 18 authors in this book and a few other people that I've worked. Haven't worked with before. But I thought this idea is like, you know, this would be a great book to get out to readers. I'm always talking to librarians, to library worker. I want to talk directly to readers because horror is so popular, and over the years, I've gotten to know all these people. So I had the idea. I'm like, I'm gonna do this. So I talked to Cynthia Palayo, who is a dear friend of mine, and I'm like, hey, how do I do this? She's like, well, let me. Let you talk to my agent, Lane. I talked to Lane. Lane's like, of course we want to do this. And then I started asking authors while we were talking about. And I'm going to give these authors so much credit. Every single one of them that's in this book said yes. Before I had a book deal, they didn't know who would put this out. They didn't know where.

[A]

Well, that's the strength of you, Becky.

[C]

I mean, I said to them, 2 to 4,000 words, right? For this. And then we were so lucky that Joe Monti, who I've known for years at Saga Press, we'd known each other because I was reviewing his books, and he was putting out books and really making the case for horror to be something for all readers. He wanted this book immediately. And so we started working on it. I'm gonna give a shout out to Clay McLeod Chapman.

[A]

We love Clay.

[C]

His essay is great. It's so Clay. But also, he turned it in before we had a book deal.

[A]

Aww.

[C]

And Stephen Graham Jones, who turned it in, like, the next day. And I will say, also, Paul Tremblay has drawings with his daughter. He's like, can I do drawings? I'm like, sure. He's like, aren't you gonna ask? I'm like, nope, just do it. So him and his daughter collaborated. And in fact, the other day, he said the radio NPR in Boston contacted him and was like, can we talk to you and your daughter about your love of horror?

[A]

Oh, I know.

[C]

And he was like, this is so great. So. But because I'm a librarian, I don't just give you their essays. I give a little essay at the beginning of each essay. I guess it's not like an essay. It's like a paragraph. Because I'm always going to librarian. Right?

[A]

Yes.

[C]

This is who the author is. Why you should know who they are, what their Essay's about framing it in the context because you know, a good anthology flows right. There's a reason I didn't just go.

[A]

Like a good playlist or a mixtape. You really gotta pick the order.

[C]

And then I said, not only you know what to expect, but where to start with, with that author and who is another author who's a read alike. And I did. No repeats. Speaking of playlist, playlist, no repeats. So you actually get 36 authors here that you can try. And so if you like an author and you already knew you liked them, and you read Rachel Harrison's essay and you learn why low fat yogurt is terrifying, you then can see what I suggest you start with, with her. If you haven't read her, who else? You could try. But I also hope you're gonna find an author you didn't hear about and somebody who's writing that really captivated you. And then you're gonna go try their books, buy them, get them at your local library, however you're gonna do that. And then finally, like I said at the beginning, I've heard from people, Becky, early readers, this book. Now I'm just gonna give this to my friends. Cause they're like, why do you like horror so much? And here's the answer. There's not one. Right?

[A]

Yeah. Oh, my gosh. Okay. So you are known as the horror librarian. How did you get into horror? Is this a lifelong. You get into it as an adult. Like, how did this. How did this love affair start?

[C]

You know, like everything, it's. You look back and you realize that the. That the road was laid down way before you knew.

[A]

Yes.

[C]

And of course, I'm going on a lot of podcasts and they're asking me, like, well, why do you love horror? Which I purposely don't answer in the book because it's not about me. So I've been looking at this. Now, the easy answer is I got into doing reader's advisory very early in my career. In the late 90s when I was in library school, I was introduced to the idea of readers advisory, right? Listening to what people like and helping them find books that. What they want to read. And through that, I got asked to write the American Library Association's Reader's Advisory Guide to Horror. So I had already. I had always liked books that were speculative and darker. And we'll talk about maybe where that started. And I always enjoyed those books. But then when they asked me to write this textbook, which turned into three editions over the years between like 2001 and 2021. I got to become an expert in it and keep reading it. But when I look back, I thought it all started at the B. Dalton at the mall. Because I'm a Jersey girl. At the mall, when I was set free and found the occult section.

[A]

Oh, wow. Yeah.

[C]

And my dad loved Stephen King. So, like, there was. And my parents let me read everything and anything. They did not censor any. So my dad likes Stephen King. So I peeked at some of his Stephen King. It didn't speak to me as much, I think, as a young woman in the late 1980s, early 1990s.

[A]

Yeah. Not surprising.

[C]

Yeah, exactly. I mean, I just don't have that.

[B]

But.

[C]

But I. It was. I was 11 or 12. And I know it was before my Bat Mitzvah because I would go to the mall with my dad alone after Hebrew school while we were waiting for my sisters to kind of go to sleep. We didn't want to come home right when they were going home. And so it was near my Bat Mitzvah time. So I was less than 13. And I found flowers in the attic.

[A]

Oh. And the musical strains began. A light beamed down from the ceiling of the bookstore.

[C]

And I was like, wow, dad, can I get this? Sure. It's like six bucks or whatever they were back then. Three bucks.

[A]

Sure.

[C]

And I think. And it's funny. Cause now that I talk about this. And I just turned 50 this year, so I'm like, in the middle of January. And a lot of people, I'm hearing, my age and younger, are also saying they found horror this way. Because, you know, I was too old for goosebumps. I've gone back and read them and loved them, but I was not the target audience. So then looking back, though, even further, why did I pick up flowers in the attic? Like, what was it that intrigued me? Yes, the COVID was amazing. But the first book I was obsessed with was where the Sidewalk Ends by Shel Silverstein.

[A]

Okay. I can see some of the surreal, bizarre.

[C]

Go back and look at those.

[A]

I remember those books. There's a few books. There's a few poems that I really remember.

[C]

I read it over and over again. I listened to the cassette. I think I broke it. I listened to it so many times. One of the first poems is a boy writing a poem from inside a lion. Cause he's been swallowed.

[A]

I remember this one.

[C]

There's a Sarah, Sylvia Cynthia Stout. Would not take the garbage out. And it ends. And she is killed by the garbage. Cause she's so obstinate.

[A]

There's a lot of darkness in the.

[C]

Poem about a guy who. Who's so hungry he completely eats himself. Cannibalism. And I'm like, wow, these were really dark. And what I loved about them is that they were just a little bit outside my reality. Right. You could like, you could understand where they came from, but they went to these dark places and I was like, oh, that's kind of cool.

[A]

And so a seed was planted. Yeah. Wow. Wow, that's amazing. So fast forward to today. You love horror. You are a horror professional. Truly. Do you think horror still gets a bad rap in the book world, in the world of media in general? I know in the film world there's a lot of. There's constantly a lot of talk of horror being sort of, you know, the lowest rung, kind of a lower class type of entertainment. Do you feel that there's. There's still that in the horror world that is not looked at it as, quote, real literature Literature?

[C]

Yes and no. So, yes, overall, yes, yes, yes. I have a deal with my editors at Book List and Library Journal. I might describe a Stephen Graham Jones book. It might sound like I'm calling it Literary Horror. If they ever put the word literary in front of the word horror in one of my reviews, without me, I.

[A]

Would karate chop quit.

[C]

Done. You won't even hear from me again. And they know that because I hate that. Right. Because that is like saying that all horror isn't literary. All books are literary. Right? Every book, no matter what it's about, it is a work of literature and it has intrinsic value. I know you all believe this, and I totally believe this. And years of working at the public library, I pushed this message. Now we are in a horror renaissance right now.

[A]

Yes, we are.

[C]

And that is one of the reasons this book can come, because we have some amazing voices. And one of the things that I think the reason we're in a horror renaissance isn't just because there's better writers, because the writers have always been great, but because we're allowing all voices to speak. And, you know, when you have a person like, let's just take what I think is the best book of the year, the Buffalo Hunter Hunter by Stephen Graham Jones. And when you take this idea of manifest destiny of the American west and you tell it from the lens of a native person, the horror there, it's there whether you call it horror or not. Right?

[A]

It's terrifying.

[C]

You put in a vampire, it makes it more horror, but it's terrifying on its own. One of my other favorite authors who's in the book Haley Piper. Her tagline is make horror gay AF all the time.

[A]

I'm so excited for her new book.

[C]

Oh, it's so good. It's also one of the best books I've read all year. I feel like your reading readers need to read Haley Piper.

[A]

Oh yeah.

[C]

Like she is perfect for everybody who's listening to reading glasses all the time. And A Game in Yellow is a nod to the King in Yellow by by Chambers, but it's also a sapphic erotic love story as well and absolutely terrifying.

[A]

I already have it on hold. I. I might be first in line at the library for it. I deep searched it. I am ready and truly as soon as I heard about it.

[C]

Well, and stories like this, that story is so existentially terrifying and it uses both this classic of cosmic horror as the basis. And you don't have to know about the King in Yellow. She does a great job like making the part you need to know clear. But then this whole idea of living a life in a marginalized body in a marginalized experience and how that brings horror every day, just wanting to be yourself. It's. The books are great, so we're in a renaissance, but publishers are starting to use the H word.

[A]

Yes. No more supernatural thrillers, right?

[C]

Or like, well, it sounds like horror, but really it's a gothic or it's a ghost story.

[A]

Just call it horror.

[C]

Generational trauma. I'm like, yeah, with a whole bunch of monsters, you know. But I will tell you that that Jennifer McMahon just told me this recently. We were chatting and she said for the first time ever, her publisher's going all in with the H word to her book coming out in 2026.

[A]

She's been publishing for so long, she has so many books out. And yeah, so many of her books are supernatural thrillers are, you know, they're everything but horror. And so I'm very happy for her to finally. And I think because of that a lot of of horror readers don't aren't as familiar with her because she's sort of sectioned off. So I'm glad to see her welcome be welcomed into the fold a bit.

[C]

Well, and she feels like she's in the fold, right? She feels like she's a horror author. So here's the thing about Jennifer McMahon's story essay in my book, right, she talks about how as a young girl growing up with a mother who was mentally ill and had addiction problems and living with her grandmother and understanding really early on that she was different than the other girls she didn't know what gay meant. Like, she didn't understand that, but she knew she was different than other girls. And she talks about in her essay. And, I mean, you want to cry, but it's so. It just rings so true. The monsters that she saw on TV in movies, she felt a connection to them that she could not feel to anything else. And it brought her so much happiness and comfort. And it's. I just hope for people to read these essays and find something of themselves in them.

[A]

Oh, amazing folks. And I have. I blurbed it. I loved it. Like, I cannot wait for people to read it. I'm so, so excited. And so you, again, are the horror librarian. You write about horror all the time. You're recommending horror all the time. I am dying to know, what is your specifically horror wheelhouse? Like, what are your favorite horror tropes?

[C]

I will tell you in a second, but first, shout out. I have a finished copy of why I Love Horror, and your quote is in there in the front pages.

[A]

Oh, yay. Thank you so much for that. So, so glad.

[C]

So what is my wheelhouse? It's so funny because I'm always asking everyone else, right? And I love this. The table's being turned on me. First and foremost, I don't read for a specific monster. Like, I know you love haunted houses, Mallory, and I love them. We will not turn down a haunted house book. But I don't specifically go into things looking for that specific type of trope. Right, the haunted house. What I like are books that are, I always say this slightly askew. I want it to feel like I'm in the place, but then things are just not the way they are.

[A]

Things are a little bit wrong.

[C]

Just a little bit wrong. And I love books that I can feel the fear. I don't need a jump scare always. But I want to feel that atmosphere. I like to say if I need to, I can't stop reading, but I need to put the book down and, like, go outside and take a deep breath. That is a great book.

[A]

Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah.

[C]

And then. And then finally, I am. And because I'm a reviewer, maybe I am a sucker. Well, not a sucker. I am. I make sure. I demand that details matter. Don't give me all these details that don't matter later. Because horror authors do a really good job of putting little hints in that are going to come back later. I don't want them forecasted. And that's one reason I think I really like Stephen Graham Jones. Because nothing is wasted there in his works. I remember. I'm not going to spoil it for those who haven't read Camp Damascus yet, but when I was reading Camp Damascus by Chuck Tate, and this was his first mainstream book, right? His first book with Tor Nightfire, I was reading and I was in the couple first pages or like the first few chapters, and there was a word in there that I was like.

[A]

How.

[C]

Does this protagonist know that word? And I circled it and I wrote, hmm. And then it came back. There's a twist in that book that comes pretty early on. And I was like, that was brilliant. Brilliant. Because there was one word that I. One little clue that I was like, this is not here. This is not right. And then I was like, good job, Chuck.

[A]

Oh, that's awesome. Oh, amazing. Okay, so you're doing a lot of fun events. What, this. This episode is coming out the week of your publication date. Do you tell people, where are you going? Where can they see you? Are you doing virtual events in person events?

[C]

Yeah. Well, so the day this comes out will be a few days before the book comes out. And I will be at Parnassus Books in Nashville with Alma Katsu and Rachel Harrison.

[A]

We're going to be talking about huge reading glasses, authors.

[C]

I know. It's going to be so much fun. I'm really excited. I'm going to be there. Anyway, so we got this all together. One of the things I'm super excited about, and I want all of you, if you're going to Pierre this, use the link that reading glasses will provide or go to your local indie. Because my local indie, Anderson's Books, which is in Naperville, Illinois, is doing my release party on the 23rd at my library, the Lagrange Public Library, and they're giving 20% of sales that day to the library, which, you know.

[A]

All right, we'll put a link specifically to that.

[C]

Yeah. And I have a link to all my appearances, but one of the big ones, if you're in or around New York City on Tuesday, October 7, and I have a link for it, I will be with Clay, Rachel Harrison, Victor Lavall, and Grady Hendricks at the New York Public Library.

[A]

God, I wish I could be there. What a party.

[C]

We are so excited. I tell a funny story about this. We're all allowed to sell one book because the New York Public Library has their own bookstore and everybody was sending in what book they wanted. It's all their newest books. And Grady, being Grady, was. Was like, fuck it. Paperbacks from hell.

[A]

Oh, that's hilarious.

[C]

Somebody's gonna be so mad that they can't get, like, Witching for Wayward Girls or.

[A]

By the way, that's so funny.

[C]

I loved it. He actually wrote that.

[A]

It was like, that's amazing.

[C]

It's gonna be great. And there's a couple other places I'm gonna be at the Seattle Public Library in November with Sadie Hartman and a few other places. I'm gonna do Story Fest. Mallory, I know you've done Story Fest.

[A]

Oh, yeah, I have done two Story Festival Fest. We always have an absolute blast there. We love the team, we love the space, we love the readers there. I. You're gonna have the. The best time.

[C]

So, yeah, I'll give a link for that, but. And I keep updating it, so I'm excited about that. And then later in February, I'll be doing an event. Speaking of Goosebumps with RL Stein.

[A]

What?

[C]

Online for. For Illinois librarians, but I think other people can sign up. I'll get you the link.

[A]

Okay. Fantastic. Oh, this is so exciting. All right, I'll put a link to your blog online, but are you on Blue Sky? Where can people find you?

[C]

Yeah, you can find me on Blue Sky. That's the best place to interact with me. I don't do anything else because I just don't have the brain space for it.

[A]

I do not blame you.

[C]

And I really, you know, I do some interaction, but I'm just. I'm trying to do my own thing right, you know, Valerie, keep my head down and run.

[A]

It's. Yeah, I'm. I'm off social media completely. And I have. I. My novels due in October. So it's. I, I. It really sucks your time away. It sucks away the time that you could be reading.

[C]

Totally agree. In fact, that's funny you bring that up. I just hit my last deadline that I purposely past. Becky was very smart. She knew that future Becky would be very swamped in September and October. So I have no deadlines to read for reviews until October 28th. This is the longest I've gone ever.

[A]

Oh, well, going over.

[C]

Over two months and I went to the library. I have a stack this tall, including some books you recommended on reading classes.

[A]

Oh, fantastic.

[C]

Stack this tall for me to start reading for fun.

[A]

Oh, my God, that's the best. Oh, well, you deserve it. I'm so excited for your tour. I'm so excited for you to have, like, a. A time to celebrate yourself, celebrate this book, and read what you want. So, folks, get this book Find Becky online. Becky, thank you so much for joining us.

[C]

Thank you, Mallory. It's always fun. Coming on.

[A]

Now, let's answer a recommendation request from one of our listeners. Hannah writes in. Hello. I want to start by saying that I appreciate what Book Talk has done bringing in more readers, but I find that most books on there are very hyped or just have too much spice and not enough plot. I loved A Darker Shade of Magic in the whole series and I'm looking to get back into fantasy. Do you have any wrecks with only almost no spice? Not ya. And I've already read Sarah J. Moss and 4th Wing. So this is the opposite of our other show, Bria.

[B]

Yeah, but that's fair.

[A]

This is, this is why I wanted to pick it. I was like, wow, we need to. Don't we need to keep up our, our talents in recommending non spice books?

[B]

Yeah, don't tell the smutties. But sometimes I'm like, I can't with the spot. I need to concentrate on. I want to plot. I don't know. So something nice by. Okay, I'm gonna recommend. Have we retired the this book?

[A]

No, but I thought about doing this too. This is a good one.

[B]

Should we retire it after this?

[A]

Maybe.

[B]

Okay. We may have to retire this book, but it's Emily Wilde's Encyclopedia Fairies by Heather Fawcett. The glassers love this. If you haven't read we love this. We love it. It's a series. You have three books. So you can dive in. You can. You already do those Sarah J. Moss and 4th Wings books. Guess what? This book is as good as those books. I, I, listen, I, you know, I loved some of those books. I think this book is as good as those books.

[A]

Truly.

[B]

I think this is so good. It has an adult, adult, not YA character and she has a love interest. But it ain't too spicy.

[A]

It is so off page. It is wild.

[B]

Yeah. It's so off page. Yeah.

[A]

Everything is very, very mild.

[B]

Yeah. It's got a scientist lady. She studies fairies and then she finds some fairies. It's fantastic.

[A]

Beautiful pipeline.

[B]

That actually is exactly what the plot. But it's really lovely. It's super well written. It's fantasy. But like not in a way it's, it's different than the fantasy. Maybe you've been reading it sounds like. And again, not specific. Spicy and just and really sweet and adorable. And the main character is really just. We all love her. She's a little like.

[A]

We love Emily lady.

[B]

We love her. What do you got?

[A]

I'm gonna recommend a historical fantasy called the Magician's Daughter by H.G. perry. Also a magic book. So this takes place in England in 1912. It's about a young woman. She lives on this isolated island with her magical guardian. She's very, like, sequestered from the world. She has to stay on this island. Island to be protected. You don't know why at first. And then one night, her guardian doesn't come back.

[B]

Oh.

[A]

And she needs to venture out into the world. It's good. It's very good. And of course, she finds out that the state of the world of magic in England and she herself are not what she was raised to believe. That is a fun trope that we don't get.

[B]

I do love that trope.

[A]

Someone who is raised to believe one thing and then something happens, and then they find out the world is completely different. That's fun.

[B]

That is a. I. There's has to be a word for that because there's something that, like, I do. If there is a book that. That is the reveal. I'm like, oh, thank God. Like, the world is different. It's usually, like, super dark, but I love it.

[A]

Yeah. And this is not super dark, but there's also. There's no romance in this book. And it's. It's really great. I feel like this is definitely an underrated book. So I'm recommending the Magician's Daughter by H.G. perry.

[B]

And I'm recommending Emily Wild's Encyclopedia of Fairies by Heather Fawcett.

[A]

So if you want us to answer your recommendation request, send it toreading glasses podcastmail.com. as always, always want to thank our wonderful mods who run our Discord server. And remember, folks, it's getting chilly. This is the first kind of chili. I'm so excited. This week has been in the 70s during the day. It's going to be in the 50s at night. You want some sweatshirts? Why don't you get a library user sweatshirt? They're so cute. They're so fun. And they are in our Void merch store. There's a link in the show notes. And if you like the show, please rate and review us on the podcast listening app of your choice. We're trying to get to 2000 on Apple Podcasts. If you are on Apple podcast user, now is your time. Rise up. There's a the signal in the sky. I don't know what the signal of a Apple podcast review would be. Five stars. Five stars are in the sky. Please take 30 seconds. We're trying to get to 2000. We're getting really close. We are. I think we're at like 120something left that we need, folks. We know you, we know you can do it. So go on, open up your mobile app, give us five star rating, write us a nice little review. Review. We've been seeing the five star reviews you folks have been leaving us, and it's definitely been making me feel nice and has been balancing out the weird hate that I've been receiving. So thank you, thank you for that. And we are gonna release a fun, silly ama episode when we finally get to 2000. So you, you have, you have the power to unlock this. You can email us at reading glasses podcast gmail.com, find us on Instagram at Reading Glasses Podcast. Thanks for listening and thanks for reading. Maximum Fun, a worker owned network of artist owned shows supported directly by you.