991. Q&AF Ft. Pejman Ghadimi: Maturity Vs. Risk Taking, Equipment Or Employee & Choosing Your Path

Summary

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Podcast Summary: REAL AF with Andy Frisella

Episode 991: Q&AF Ft. Pejman Ghadimi – Maturity Vs. Risk Taking, Equipment Or Employee & Choosing Your Path
Date: January 19, 2026
Host: Andy Frisella
Guest: Pejman Ghadimi (PJ)

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Main Theme/Purpose

This episode of REAL AF is a Q&AF (Question & Answer Friday) format, where Andy Frisella is joined by his longtime friend and entrepreneur/author Pejman Ghadimi. Together, they dive into listener questions at the intersection of entrepreneurship, personal growth, and business decision-making. Key themes include differentiating maturity from risk aversion, scaling with equipment or employees, and how to know whether to follow a proven path or forge your own as an entrepreneur. The discussion is candid, layered with hard-earned entrepreneurial wisdom, and peppered with real talk about discipline, purpose, perspective, and the realities behind "success."

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Maturity vs. Playing It Too Safe: Risk, Complacency, and Growth

(Starts at 06:22)

• Listener Question: “I don’t recognize myself compared to a few years ago. I’m more cautious, have more to lose, and move differently. Am I maturing or playing too small?”
• Andy’s Take:
  • It’s natural to become cautious as comfort grows, but this often leads to complacency and stagnation.
  • “The greatest enemy to a great life is a good life. As life gets good, it becomes harder to break free.” (PJ, 07:07)
• PJ’s Insight:
  • Most people answer their own questions in asking; if you’re afraid to lose the good you achieved, you’re likely limiting yourself.
  • Success requires relentless commitment to your true destination, not settling for interim comfort zones.
  • “Unless I’m getting to that destination, then everything under that was nothing I was going to hold on to anyway.” (PJ, 08:10)
• Reinvention & Competition:
  • Comfort is dangerous; competitors are always advancing. Sitting still means getting passed.
  • Reinventing your business is easier than restarting your entire self after stagnation.
  • “The only way you’re really going to lose what you have is by staying right where you are.” (Andy, 11:01)
• Purpose and Responsibility:
  • Expand your sense of responsibility beyond yourself (e.g., your family, your team, your community). This expansion reignites drive and edge.
  • “The pressure of the responsibilities you choose to bear is what’s going to create that drive you say you’re missing.” (Andy, 13:10)

Notable Quote

“At this point in my life, success isn't about me personally. It's about the people around me. I've taken that responsibility by choice because it helps me continue down the path and keeps me from being stagnant.”
— Andy Frisella [15:00]

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2. Scaling Your Business: Equipment versus Employee?

(Starts at 26:24)

• Listener Question: Should I invest in equipment (CNC machine) or hire an employee to grow my countertop fabrication shop?
• Decision Criteria:
  • Calculate: Can you make more money with just the two of you and the machine? Or does an extra person without the machine grow output more?
  • Consider time saved, scalability, and return on investment for both moves.
• PJ’s Advice:
  • “People also haven’t mathed their business… If your business is already producing, you can probably get a loan and buy the machine anyway… The math is the only way to go forward.” (PJ, 27:39)
• Where Most People Mess Up When Scaling:
  • Hiring only when you desperately need it is too late—forecast your needs and bring people in early to acculturate them.
  • “Businesses are tribal. It takes time for someone new to ‘get’ how you operate; you should always be hiring, always have a pipeline.” (PJ, 28:45)
• Andy’s Story:
  • Realization that investments must be made ahead of growth. Example: Adding a second POS terminal & staff in his store doubled throughput—but only after making the investment.

Notable Quote

"You have to make the investment up front before the business comes in… We always say, well, when we get to here, we'll invest in this. But you can't get there without making the investment first."
— Andy Frisella [34:44]

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3. Discipline, Delusion, & Choosing Your Path: Proven System vs. Original Path

(Starts at 36:24)

• Listener Question: Should I follow a proven blueprint or create my own path? How do I avoid delusion or being just a copycat?
• PJ’s Framework:
  • Success is a progression: Job → Self-employed → Business owner → Entrepreneur.
  • Many never build “someone else’s dream” even in jobs—people are always working for their own reasons (money, skills, advancement).
• Blueprints & Commitment:
  • If you’re not inherently interested in the field or committed to being the best, following a blueprint will end in frustration.
  • “Whatever the blueprint is, whatever the job is, whatever the decision… are you willing to commit to become the best at whatever that is? If you’re not, don’t even start.” (PJ, 41:01)
• Entrepreneur Myth vs. Reality:
  • Entrepreneurship is about uniting people around a new creation—not just running a business or making fast money.
  • PJ distinguishes between being self-employed in a proven business model vs. actually creating something new and unique.
  • “If you want to be an entrepreneur but don’t know what you want to do, entrepreneur shouldn’t be in your dictionary for the next three years.” (PJ, 46:59)
• Mastery, Social Media, and the Delusion of Quick Success:
  • The illusion of instant wealth/success via social media poisons expectations.
  • “Nobody cares that you used to be great, bro. You’re fooling yourself.” (Andy, 26:17)
  • “Fast money made is fast money lost… It takes years of mastery.” (PJ, 53:04)
• Marketplace Value & Reality:
  • “We are the same on a soul level… but our marketplace value is different. We’ve figured out how to do things.” (PJ, 55:36)
  • The world rewards value, not presence—instagram equality is an illusion.

Notable Quotes

“If you’re not willing to commit to being the best, you’re going to lose years. The worst thing is to go down a path, make no money, waste three years, come back to zero.”
— Pejman Ghadimi [41:01]

“You are in the business of you. What level of skill set does your brand represent? What value do you bring to the market?”
— Andy Frisella [50:00]

“If you can't commit to a job that's already been established for you… how the fuck are you gonna commit to forging a path that doesn't exist that you've never seen?”
— PJ [51:35]

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4. The Reality of the Game: Patience, Mastery, and Boredom

(Starts at 62:32)

• Long-Term Commitment & Tolerating Boredom:
  • True success demands enduring monotony, being relentless, and outperforming others for a long time.
  • “You want to know one of the most important things to becoming successful? Tolerate monotony and boredom, and still execute at a high level.” (Andy, 63:30)
• Solitude and Sacrifice:
  • Able to function independently and ignore noise from people or society is critical—“There’s no work-life balance. For the first 15 years, I was in a cave looking at the wall.” (PJ, 66:10)
• Network & Value:
  • Real access to successful people only comes when you have real value or proven grit. “Buying someone a cup of coffee is not value.” (Andy, 70:08)

Notable Quotes

“You have to commit. You have to decide. You have to go at it relentlessly… If you follow their rules now, you’ll have their life later.”
— Andy Frisella [64:00]

“You have to be good at being alone. Solitude is equally part of that journey.”
— PJ [65:26]

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5. Critique of Modern 'Coaching,' Social Media Facades, and “The Bugatti Syndrome”

• Instagram/Online Gimmicks:
  • Instant success stories (“22 with a Bugatti”) are either fake, anomalous luck, or short-lived. “I have yet to see someone like a 22-year-old with a Bugatti who was there next year, and the year after that, and the year after that…” (Andy, 53:04)
• Market Value and Earned Mastery:
  • “What is a Bugatti? It’s the mastery of automotive perfection. Who the fuck are you? What have you done to deserve that?” (PJ, 54:09)
• On “Coaching Coaches to Coach Coaches”
  • Andy criticizes the trend where people sell coaching having never produced, built, or mastered anything real. “Anybody that’s actually built shit has no problem saying, here’s what I’ve built.” (Andy, 61:11)
• Comparisons & Self-Awareness:
  • Don’t be swayed by online appearances—most only show the end result, not the process or struggle.
  • “If you took a normal person off the street, as casual as a day that we have, the stress would crumble someone who is not used to it.” (Andy, 49:23)

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Memorable Moments & Additional Quotes

• On Purpose and Complacency:
  • “Expand your purpose, expand your responsibility. Take more, right? Let that drive you forward.” (Andy, 13:10)
• On Hiring for Growth:
  • “I have an ‘always hiring’ sign basically in all my companies… when the right person comes, it’s not always convenient. You figure out a way to integrate that person because you realize not taking them is so much more risky.” (PJ, 30:54)
• On Enduring the Process:
  • “There was no point where I looked back and thought, maybe I’m being an asshole—I’m not where I need to be yet, so this sacrifice will have been for nothing if I don’t see it through to the end.” (PJ, 66:13)

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Timestamps for Important Segments

• Intro and Format Explanation: 00:16–05:15
• Book/Philosophy Overview (PJ’s Third Circle Theory): 02:52–04:19
• Florida vs. Missouri Banter: 04:20–05:11
• Q1: Maturity vs. Risk Aversion/Playing it Small: 06:22–24:25
• Q2: Equipment or Employee for Scaling?: 26:24–36:15
• Q3: Blueprint vs. New Path/Entrepreneurship Realities: 36:24–62:28
• The Long Game: Mastery, Boredom, Sacrifice: 62:32–68:43
• Closing: Value, Networks, and the Long Road: 68:44–End

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Final Takeaway

Andy and PJ underscore that true lasting success is a marathon of relentless commitment, honest self-inventory, deliberate risk, and willingness to forego comfort for the bigger goal. Avoiding delusion, embracing purpose, and understanding your unique value in the marketplace are all vital. Social media may sell speed, shortcuts, and surface-level rewards, but the game is, and always will be, about mastery, value, and endurance.

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Follow Pejman Ghadimi

• Instagram & X: @icreatemillionaires
• Website: learnfrompj.com (Books, courses, wealth starter kits)

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Share the show. Don’t be a hoe. (Andy, 02:26)

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Transcript

[A]

Yeah, went from sleeping on the floor now my jury box froze up Pole stove counted millions in a cold Bad bitch booted swole got her own bank roll can't fold Just a no head shot case Close, close, close.

[B]

What is up, guys? It's Andy Prisella. And this is the show for the realists. Say goodbye to the lies, the fakeness and delusions of modern society, and welcome to reality, guys. Today we have Q&AF. That's where you submit the questions and we give you the answers. Now, DJ is going to tell you how you could submit your questions. Yeah, guys.

[A]

You can email these questions into ask andy, andy forella.com. you can also click the link in the description below and submit your questions for a chance to be answered or drop them down in the comments of the Q and A videos on Andy for selling motivation.

[B]

This is your first time listening. We have shows within the show. Okay, tonight we're going to have CTI live. We will be broadcasting live at 7pm on YouTube and X. This is where we talk about what's going on in the world. We speculate on what we think, we have some laughs, and then we talk about how we the people have to solve these problems going on in the world. Other times we're going to have real talk. Real talk is just five to 20 minutes of me giving you some real talk. And then we have 75 hard verses. And 75 hard verses is where someone who has completed the 75 hard program comes on the show. They talk about how their life was before, how their life is now, and how they use the 75 hard program to become the version of themselves that you see today. If you're unfamiliar with 75 hard, it is the world's most famous mental transformation program ever. And you can get that for free at episode 2. 08. It is the initial phase of the Live hard program, which is also available for free at episode 208 on the audio feed. There is a book [e-mail] called the Book on Mental Toughness. Uh, you don't have to buy it, but if you do, it's got a whole bunch of more information than what you get in just the podcast. Um, check it out. If you're somebody like me that likes to know the ins and outs, it's a must have. All right, and then we have a fee for the show. And the fee is very pretty much give me all your money, right? Yep. Yeah. Isn't that right, dj? That's right. That's a new fee, right?

[A]

That's Right.

[B]

Yeah. Now, the fee is very simple. All right? We ask very simply that if you get value from the show, if it makes you think, if it makes you laugh, it gives you a new perspective, if you learn some shit, do us a favor and don't be a hoe.

[A]

Share the show.

[B]

All right.

[A]

You almost got me there.

[B]

Yeah. Bringing that water. Got a special guest. I'm joined by one of my very, very good friends, Benjamin Gadimi. What's happening, brother?

[C]

What's going on, man? After 11 years, we're here.

[B]

Yeah. Yeah. So for those of you that don't know, PJ and I have been friends for.

[C]

I think, 15 years.

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

Around.

[B]

And, you know, we've. We've. I mean, we've grown together. We've built things together. And very, very highly intelligent, deeply philosophical friend of mine, he's written a number of books in which you should read all of them, especially Third Circle Theory. But if you want to explain which.

[C]

Books, I mean, Third Circle Theory was your favorite. This is the one that, you know, you talk about a lot on the show. But Third Circle Theory, Radius, Gate of Choice are three basic books that are the framework to what I believe to be the most practical way for a human to become his high self. So it starts with awareness, identity, and then control over time and consciousness. So depending on where you are in life, these books will mean different things to you, so you can just review them each year.

[B]

That's the cool thing about it.

[C]

That's exactly how I love books like that. Yeah. That's how they've been written in a timeless manner. So they're always relevant and even more relevant as you evolve because you'll catch on more things.

[B]

You know, One of my favorite books, dude, is that it's a very basic book called the Magic of Thinking Big by David Schwartz. Very basic. But, dude, if you read that book, like, once a year, it will mean different things to you on your journey. And it's just I really enjoy the books that are written in that way. And Third Circle Theory is, I think, one of the best books ever written, so.

[C]

I appreciate that.

[B]

Yeah. It's the truth.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

So.

[A]

So Florida's home, right?

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

The what?

[A]

Florida is home.

[C]

Florida's home. Boca Raton is home.

[A]

I'm jealous.

[B]

Why?

[C]

The weather is amazing all the time. The women are beautiful, you know, we have no complaints. You should be jealous.

[B]

You guys got Florida, man.

[A]

Florida, man.

[B]

Fucking national celebrity.

[C]

So wild, wild west out there. We get, like, very, like, jaded when we live there. We assume everybody in the world drives Bugatti.

[A]

Yeah, yeah. No, Missouri is kind of the same. You know, no alligators. We got pit bulls, though, and the same state.

[B]

I think everything. It's kind of the same where you were going. It's kind of the same, but not at all.

[A]

Not the same.

[B]

I would say Missouri, man, could give Florida man a ride.

[C]

Easy, I believe.

[B]

Yeah. That's a fact. Like, easy.

[A]

Come on. That's not even. That's not even. That's easy. Yeah, man.

[B]

So PJ's gonna help us answer some questions for you guys today.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

All right.

[A]

I'm trying to make sure he's not looking at my screen.

[C]

No, no, I can't see, dude. My eyesight's been getting so much worse as I get older. I don't know.

[B]

What. Dude, what is that?

[C]

I don't know. Like, I'm 43 now.

[A]

Okay.

[C]

Terrible. I can't see. Like, I. It's weird. Like, when I was, like, much younger, I always had 2020 vision, but up close, it's, like, really, like, difficult. Like, far I can still see really good, but, like, up close, it's, like getting.

[B]

That just happened to me, like, this year.

[C]

Yeah, same here.

[B]

Yeah, it was like.

[C]

I'm telling you, we shared.

[B]

Yeah, dude. I was. I started not being able to read my supplement bottles, and I was like, oh, yeah, it's happening.

[C]

Exactly.

[B]

I was reading a book for the.

[C]

Car, and I'm looking and I'm like, what the. What the fuck is it?

[B]

Yeah, what's happening? And then I find myself with my phone like this, and I'm like, oh, man. It's only a matter of time before I got the text this big.

[A]

You're gonna be yelling at people. Get off your yard.

[B]

Yeah, that's. Oh, yeah, it's 100%.

[A]

It's coming, man. Damn.

[B]

Don't the grass. Oh, man. Well, yeah, man.

[A]

Guys, it's. It's Q&AF. So we, as always, we have some great ones. PJ's gonna help us out with some of these, so. PJ.

[B]

Andy.

[A]

Guys, question number one. Andy. I don't recognize myself compared to who I was a few years ago. Not in a bad way, just different. There's less fire. I'm more cautious. I've got more to lose now. And I can feel it changing how I move. What are some ways to know the difference between simply maturing versus slowly playing too small? It sounds like a risk adverse type of situation you get. Like, how do you deal with the risk the older you get then, like.

[B]

Does that change Well, I think it's natural. You know, I think when people get a little bit of comfort in their life, it becomes more about what they have to lose. When you have nothing to lose, it's easy to go hard, and you don't really worry about it, because the alternative is the shit you've already.

[C]

It's what we talked about earlier. The greatest enemy to a great life is a good life. As life gets good, it becomes harder to break free.

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

But I also want to point out that in his question specifically, he. He specifically gave his own answer. Most people do. He literally said, I don't know if I have too much to lose or how I'm thinking. And so that means that he's already thinking that he's afraid to lose the good he's had or the transformation he's had. So most people actually, in their own questions, answer their own questions, like their own fact, giving away the information as to what's happening.

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

So, like, that's one of the ways this particular situation, I don't know about other people, but generally he's indirectly saying that, hey, I've made some good progress, and I feel pretty good about that. And I just don't have that original drive that got me to that progress. Because technically, if I go from here to next level, I'm just not sure if it's going to pan out the same way. And I have. There's a cost basis that I'd lost because there's actual money to lose now or, you know, time or anything else that comes with that. And so in this particular case, I think you just have to be relentless in your decision very early on in life about what success looks like. You know, like, in my family, we're all poor. So success was like, hey, you know what? If you have a nice car, you have a nice house, you got a couple of kids, this success. And I'm like, the fuck? I don't want that shit. Like, that's fucking gay. I mean, like, I'm sitting there and I'm like, that's fucking retarded.

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

All my family members, I'm like, yo, fucking get it. You all in marriages, you don't like, you're only, you know, situations, you're trying to figure it out.

[A]

Yeah, man.

[C]

Your houses have been the same for 20 fucking years. I'm like, there's no fucking success in that. Now look at other people. I'm like, that guy got 30 cars. He got this, he got that. I'm like, okay, I want his life. So I'M like, okay, so that's my goal, right? That's my destination. So I don't. I remove everything in between to feel like I've made it until I have that. So that way I never feel like I had something to lose because it was never mine to keep, Right? So I go, like, unless I'm getting to that fucking destination, then everything under. That was nothing that I was going to hold on to anyways. It was part of the journey. And so what if I lose it? Because that's. I'm not where I want to be. You know, it's like if you made a trip to. From Florida to California and you somehow end up in Missouri, you got to figure out, like, did I really want to go to California or not? And if you did, that means you might have to, like, start walking if your car breaks down.

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

Like, but. But you got to commit to that destination, whatever that is.

[B]

Yeah. And I think it's also important for people to realize that the minute you stop improving, everybody else is catching up. And there is. There is abundance, but there's also limited success because we're operating in. In a. In an environment that is real. It's a. It's a competition. Okay. If you're a plumber, there's other plumbers. If you're a carpenter, there's other carpenters. If you're, you know, sell supplements, there's other people who sell supplements. And if I were to say, hey, this is where I want to be, okay, I have to be aware that if I continue to just sit there, that other people are going to catch and potentially pass up what I'm doing. And one of the biggest things that I've seen really affect people, especially when it comes to owning their business, being entrepreneurs, et cetera, is that they get to a point where they're doing well and they feel comfortable and they get a little hesitant about continuing down the path. And while they get comfortable, they stop paying attention and they get less sharp. They don't really understand what's going on. And that's a potential for you to get beat.

[C]

And so competition rises at that.

[B]

Correct.

[C]

You know.

[B]

Yeah, correct. So you have to understand that we are not in a static environment. The environment is always progressing. It is always moving forward. Everybody around you, you have to assume is continuing to work. And if you sit where you're at because it's comfortable now, it will become very uncomfortable later for you. So you have the momentum now. You have the skill set that you're acquiring now. You're getting down the path of where you want to go, you just got to continue. And actually, that's a really good spot to be in. And if we're being real, the only way that you're going to really lose what you have is by staying right where you are.

[C]

And it's also much harder to reinvent yourself if you have to start over because you were stagnant.

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

Than if you went through the difficulty of going from, you know, 1 million to 10 million to a hundred million to whatever it is in the same field that you've already gained expertise in. So sometimes when you get complacent, you don't realize that your business also has an expiration date in its current form. And reinventing your business is a lot easier than reinventing yourself. And so one of the things that people don't realize, they get complacent and then their business fails, and then they go, okay, well, I'm gonna start again. That it never hits as well. Right. Like, so they gotta start something new, but they start something new, they gotta go back to putting 10 years again.

[B]

Right.

[C]

So, so it's like, well, why didn't you just push a little bit harder when you were at that edge and reinvent what you were doing to, like, excel again and again and again and again instead of having to stop and say, well, maybe I should do something completely different than being a plumber, you know, maybe you should now go into building some kind of technology. And you're like, well, that's going to take a long time to figure out.

[B]

And yeah.

[C]

You know, and that's much, much harder than just being really good at what you fucking do and never ending that push Right. Until that destinations hit and whatever that is. Right. That's a personal destination from a number standpoint. That's a business destination from where your business goes. But at least it gives you that, that, that Runway. Do not have to reinvent yourself, because once you have like the first 20 million in your bank account, 50 million, whatever that is, then you're like, hey, you know what? I can take time and really choose how to reinvent myself, because I put in the dues right before to get to that point.

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

And now I got that. I got that some. Some time freedom, you know?

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

Versus the other guy that gets to almost 10 million, then drops and goes.

[B]

And there's a big difference between reinventing yourself with a few bucks in the bank versus reinventing yourself out of necessity. Huge difference.

[C]

Significant. Yeah.

[B]

Yeah. You know, the question I would ask you if you were Here in front of me would be okay, you're comfortable? What about your family? What about. What if something happened to you? What if, what if you went away right now? Would your family be good? You know what I'm saying? Are you comfortable? Are you setting the best example by chilling out? What are your kids seeing? What are your neighbors seeing? What are they seeing? Right? Because there's a lot of people that start something, become moderately successful, and then sit on their hands as if they're king of the world. And you know, I could totally relate to what you're saying, but at the end of the day, you have to continue to expand your responsibilities, even if it's not real in the moment, if you want to continue to grow. Because the pressure of the responsibilities that you choose to bear and carry are what's going to create that drive that you're going to want that you're. You say you're missing right now. So if you want that drive back, I would consider taking on more responsibility. And that doesn't mean, like doing more at the office. That means I'm responsible for all of these people. You know, one of the biggest, one of the biggest things, because I was in this place in 2014, and quite right when you and I really started becoming friends, at the time, I was making more money than, than I'd ever made. I was making more money than all my friends by a lot. All right? And I got sick and I was sitting on the couch for 17 days. I had pneumonia and I was watching TV and I'm looking at my phone and I see my bank account going up and you know, I'm winning. And, and, and I'm like, this sucks, dude. I don't feel good. I don't. This isn't what I like. This is why rich people kill themselves, dude. And what it taught me was that I needed to expand my purpose outside of just myself to encompass my team. Okay? And that was the first realization I had about expanding purpose. And I think a lot of times when you, when people get comfortable, the reason that they end up feeling very empty is because they don't expand their purpose as to what they're willing to take on respons, responsibility wise, which is what creates that pressure for you to, to drive. And so if you're looking to regain that edge, it's very simple. Expand your purpose, expand your responsibility. Take more. Right? And let that drive you forward to where you are. Because, dude, at this point in my life, success isn't about me personally. It's not. It's about the people around me. It's about you guys who are hearing this message right now. And I've taken that responsibility on by choice because it helps me continue down the path and keeps me from becoming stagnant to the point where, you know, I'm not paying attention to what's going on in my industry. I'm not paying attention to what's going on in marketing. I'm not paying it and then do to like try and reinvent that. I've seen that crush so many people. And really, dude, the only way I've ever seen people truly lose is not from making mistakes while they move forward. It's from sitting where they get to a place where it's mildly comfortable and they have a hard time breaking past that point.

[C]

And you know, sometimes you can also, like I was saying earlier is reinvent your business by taking risk without having to completely put everything good at stake. So like if your business became what it was based on what you believe they could have been and then you stop competing because you probably ate enough and you survived enough and you're good, at some point you can look at larger scale versions of your business and take on a challenge. How do I go from here to there but reinvent high look at my business to compete on that level outside of my sphere of what I can see, like maybe not in my state, maybe in a country or what are other people doing in other countries around this industry and so on and so forth. Like, because sometimes what gets stale too is the repetition of work, right? The boring shit they say in business, right? That's like really annoying and marginally better each year, which is, that's part most people don't. Yeah, it's like you're doing the same shit over and over and over and you're like, we gained 5% and you're like sitting there like, yeah, we're winning 5%. But those that don't realize that they're like, Well, I grew 30%, 40%, 30% and then 2%, like I'm failing now and sustaining those bad years, which are not really growth years, like sustaining them by preparing strategy sometimes gets confused by people as stagnant. You know, like when it's just part of the process. Yeah, it's exactly like. Yeah, exactly. So not knowing the exact circumstance that a person, the business you're in, etc. Sometimes we get to a level where we feel because we don't have double digit growth or something extraordinary or whatever else, we think of those as like failing years or like, because we had so many growth years, but reality is, they're part of the process because no one has a perfect cycle of, you know, like 25 perfect years of 30% growth every year. We'd all be billionaires. You know, it just doesn't work that way, right? So. So sometimes people just get confused and mistake stagnation, which is the lack of excessive growth, you know, revenue or whatever.

[B]

Because they lack the perspective of going through it before. Right? But if you ask anybody who's a seasoned operator of any sort of organization, yeah, it's part of the deal. You're going to have two, three, four years, sometimes cycles where, you know, you're going to be given 100% effort, but the, the growth is going to be 2 or 3 or 5% or sometimes in certain cases not losing, or sometimes in certain cases losing less than everybody else is losing.

[C]

You know, that's a really good point because in the last couple of years a lot of businesses struggled, right? With all the tariffs, the things happening, changes and the ever moving dynamics. And sometimes, you know, like, I'll have, in my business, I'll have a year where I have like 8% growth and I'm used to like 30% growth. And I'll sit there and I'll be like, thank God. And people are like, what are you talking about? We lost like 22% over last year. I go out, we didn't lose that. We made money. Yeah, and we grew 8%. I'm like, okay, there are people whose stock went 50% down. There's other people who laid off 10,000 people, 30,000 people lost their companies. I'm like, trust me, we're doing really fucking good. We're beating the average by like a substantial amount. Like, and I'm good. Like, I'm super thankful. And so once you change the perspective and if you have a couple of these years, one thing I recommend people do is really look at your business in the metrics of revenue outside of the dollar, which is like, are you growing maybe actual customers? You know, are you losing market share? Like, what's actually happening? Because sometimes you'll realize it's a really good opportunity to reinvent something in your business, to spark it again, you know, because it's like, maybe people, customers have gotten used to what you do. Maybe they're growing at a smaller rate. You got to like introduce something new, do something. And it challenges you as an owner to like face this shit and be like, wow, maybe I have gone lazy. How did I get those first ten fucking Growth years because I was constantly building shit, telling people about promotions, doing marketing, and now suddenly I'm like, what's the metrics on Facebook? Okay, good. Like, did we make some extra money? It's like, I'll just sit back and, like, see how that works out.

[B]

Why you got the hungry guy next to you exactly thinking the way you used to think.

[C]

Exactly right. He's running at this pace. He's like, I want to have what that guy has, and I want to put that shit out of business.

[B]

It's very easy to get passed by when you lose that edge. Very, very easy. And the thing is, you don't really lose the edge. You just forgot how you created it. And how you created it was through pressure. You created it by taking on a massive goal. And you said, I'm going to do this goal. And the problem a lot of people have is, you know, unfortunately, they let's. They. They say, oh, I'm going to sign up for this marathon. And they get to mile 17, they're like, oh, I was good enough. No, the fuck it ain't.

[A]

I ran in the marathon.

[B]

Yeah, you didn't run the marathon, bro. So, you know, I think, you know, at least for me, continuing to expand the vision, continuing to welcome the pressure. You know, I think a lot of people try to avoid the pressure. They. They look at pressure and fear and doubt as negative things without understanding that those things will actually sharpen you and make you better. If you're willing to accept that. Them.

[A]

Yeah, I was gonna ask you guys on this topic because I wonder if this also comes down to, like, a confidence issue. Right? We're talking about re. Sparking that. That light, you know, could it be. Okay, well, damn. Like, I know I'm good now. I see. Okay. Maybe I have some ideas of what I could be doing differently. I just don't have the confidence in my skills or ability to actually follow through.

[B]

Well, did you have the confidence on day one?

[A]

Right?

[C]

Well, I mean, you got here, so I don't think it's a. I don't think it's a confidence. I think you have. You genuinely. When. When you're broke and you have nothing and you're starting. You're hungry, right? Like, you. That hunger is like, I just fucking need food. Right? Like, I need to. I need to win. And then when you start filling your belly, like, the way you get hungry changes, and how hungry you are changes, then you're like, well, I need to rest more because. Because I've eaten now, so. So the. The Drive to hunt for food just starts to slow down because you have a process where food's slowly being delivered to you at a pace so you don't make these leaps towards your business or yourself at this exponential rates. And that's what needs to go back to the original destination you set. Like, are you actually there or not? And if you're not, then at some point you rested too early. You know, in your head you thought you had a rest, but that shit didn't exist. You just invented that. So once you realize the rest was the illusion, then you go, wait a minute. Like, why the fuck am I sitting here waiting around for something to happen? I'm not even where I'm supposed to be. Like, I don't know why I'm lost here. So then you find the drive again to, how the fuck do I keep going towards that journey? I'm going to go, but if you're having bad years, it's part of the process. If you're having tough years or you have to make cuts, or you have to retract before you expand it, or you have to go a new direction, try new things. I mean, I can tell you, every single year we try something new. I have this thing in my company where I'm like, if we're not breaking shit or figuring shit out this year that's new and introduced, then we're not in business. And they go, but it's working. And I go, it's not that the argument is not working, is that it's going to be broken eventually. So I want you to figure out what's next before it fucking breaks. So, so we catch it before it collapses. Right? Like so. And people have to think that way. They have to start thinking, like when.

[B]

You have to innovate before the innovation is necessary.

[C]

Necessary. So when things are good, that's when you work harder. Because you're like, well, look at the environment. I'm better, I'm making more money. So fuck it, push harder. Like, keep crumpling everything around you because you're like, this isn't the time to go on vacation because you made money. This is the time to hit. Because if that hit goes away, you're gonna have to reinvent yourself ten fucking years back to the beginning of that shit. So you might as well, right now, right here, commit to, like, whatever it takes to fucking get there. Whatever shit I gotta put aside that I put aside the first five years, fine. But we're here, we're in the middle of it. So it's not Time to rest. It's not time to go to Italy on vacation and be like, we made some money. Fuck it, And I'm just gonna step away. It's time to realize that you now have shit that other people want. And you didn't have shit. Nobody took you seriously. Now you got shit. People want it, they're coming after it. So now you got to build even faster.

[B]

Yeah. Yeah. I love it, dude. Yeah, bro. I think. I think the. The. The biggest mindset. We talk about this all the time. The greatest people in the world rarely actually achieve their goals, quote, unquote. Because by the time that goal that they've set is within their vision, they're already thinking past that. They are raising the bar before they hit the bar. And that's why when you look at people like Nick Saban or Tom Brady or, you know, most recently, Kurt Signetti, right? These guys, they don't fucking cheer and go party for a week after they won a game. Like, bro, it's back to fucking work, bro. Because they understand. They think the way great people think and great people think. How do I fucking innovate? How do I raise the bar? How do I get better before it's required? Because they've already tasted the. The time in their life where they had to perform or else. And if you had enough of that, you'll remember that taste forever.

[C]

And you can really see this even in sports with, like, boxing. Right? All these comeback stories, like Tyson trying to come back, you know, Tate trying to come back to these games. You look at that and you go, it's not that. Like, you don't have it in you to win anymore. So you haven't practiced in 10 years. Right. Like, so you're. You're, like, been sitting home.

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

Your competition has been practicing every day.

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

For kicking your ass.

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

And you've been sitting there saying, I'm sitting on my title. I'm great. Like, I've won this. Like, you've earned it.

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

But then either you stay home and you call it quits, or you go back to training because you're not going to get back in the ring. Just with one week of training and being like, well, now I'm back because I was once great.

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

And we see what happens.

[B]

No one gives a. That. You used to be great, bro. All right. Kind of fooling yourself.

[A]

Sit back down here.

[B]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. I love it, man.

[A]

I love it. Let's get to question number two. A little tactical business, guys. Andy, question number two. Should we invest in equipment or employees. I'm just starting out. My countertop fabrication shop is just my wife and I right now. We fabricate everything by hand. Would buying a CNC machine or hiring an employee be a better investment?

[B]

Well, it depends on what the return is going to be.

[C]

There's a lot that goes into play. Question, you'd have to know the type of business, what they do with it, like will the machine open more time for them to do what they want to hire?

[B]

Can they, can you, how much more can you produce with just the two of you with the new machine versus how much can you produce without the machine with another person?

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And you have to weigh those things and make a proper decision. But yeah, there's a lot that goes into that. Right. I would have to know much more about what it is you've got going on to answer that question directly. But I can tell you how to think about it. You think about it very simply. Can I make more money with the machine and my wife and I, or can I make more money with the employee and without the machine that will allow me then to invest in the machine later or vice versa. It's a very simple thought process.

[C]

But in most cases people also haven't mathed their business, meaning they don't really know. They haven't done the math behind what impact things have. Because in most cases, if your business is already producing, you can probably get a loan and buy the machine anyways. So the cost basis doesn't always come into the employee or the machine depends on the business. I mean, there's some cases where obviously you don't have any money or any leverage. But if you do the math, generally scaling when it comes to machinery or employment is usually self fulfilling, meaning it pays for itself through the dollar that the sales guy brings in or the cost cutting that the machine does, etc. So the math is the only way to go forward. If you don't have all the context of the situation, what is the cost? What do I get back out of it? And can I afford not to do it rather than can I afford to do it?

[A]

So for somebody to try to scale, I guess this, let me ask this question for him then. Where do people fuck up with scaling or trying to scale? Like I mean just getting started out now you're about to expand or you're thinking about expanding, you maybe, you know, you need to expand. What are some, some maybe not, you know, into the world, detrimental mistakes. But like, I mean, where do most people fuck up?

[C]

I'll tell you where I'VE seen the, the, the larger mistake that I've made personally earlier now I don't make that fuck mistake anymore. I used to hire people when I needed them and I said my, my biggest mistake was at the time I was like, oh, we need a new sales guy, so let's go hire one. Now that we're over, like overdone, too many leads, too much stuff going on, let's go hire a new sales guy. We should have hired a sales guy seven months before that call. We should have looked at the metrics and say, hey, the rate of growth shows that it's going to take six months to train a person to become a tribal part of what we do, right? So on businesses are tribal. Like you have your ways of doing things, you have your culture, you have the way you operate. Like maybe here, the first form, people like work really hard and they're committed to the vision and they don't care about the hours, right? But hiring someone from the outside doesn't always bring that kind of talent because someone on the outside is like, I go home after like 40 hours, you know, I don't know what you guys are doing.

[A]

It's 4:58, right?

[C]

What do you mean? I have something to do. So to find that character, that person that's going to be part of your tribe and then get them used to what, how the tribe operates, even if they're willing and they just don't know. And it's like, this is how things work. It takes time. And I think that sometimes in business we, we look at cost first. We go like, well, if I hire someone now for six months, what if they're not producing the dollar? I need them. But by the time you need them, your rate of dollar is so much higher because you're now losing money by not having them. So, so you're technically hurting yourself more and your dollar, your personal worth in your business is more because the business making more money. And now you have to give your time to training someone at a time where it's just not a fit. So I always say, like having a pool of people, like I have an always hiring sign basically in all my companies, like we're always hiring every position, all the time and people are like, well, what if you have them and they've been here eight years? I'm like, I'm not replacing them. I'm looking at growth. I'm looking at, can I bring someone to challenge them, maybe compete with them, maybe even try to double sales that way? Maybe I should look at A person that is really, like, it's going to be so hard to find them when I need them. So maybe I need to keep them in reserve even if they're not really doing anything. Maybe if the character is there.

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

And I'm going to need to go to 100 interviews anyways. It's not like I'm going to put one ad. 30 people show up, I pick the best one and I go, it's done, finished.

[B]

That's what people think.

[C]

Right? Right. So by the time you, like, find the person that you go, okay, I feel like I could trust you. I feel like I can speak openly around you. I feel like you understand what we do here, and I believe I can spend time training you and you'll take it seriously for next six months. Like, that might take you like, 40 ads, you know, 50 phone calls, 300 Instagram listings, and then eventually get one guy that shows up that's like, that's the guy. But when that guy comes, it's not always convenient, Right? It's not always like, oh, well, he's here. Exactly when we had an opening. Perfect.

[B]

It never happens like that.

[C]

He fits in that bucket. $30 an hour was what I wanted to pay for that job. And the guy's like, yeah, make 300 grand a year.

[B]

You're like, yeah, fuck yeah.

[C]

You know, But. But you figure out a way to basically integrate that person because you realize not taking them is so much more risky and costly than taking them. So you have to, like, think ahead. That's. That's what I've always said in scale. You have to look at the trajectory of scale. And manpower is the most volatile and hardest thing to fulfill. In scaling, you can always buy machinery, you can always buy, like, location. You can get temporary locations, you can buy more crates, you can do whatever, but you can't really bring the right people on exactly when you need them and put them in these cost boxes that are very tiny, and then be like, well, this is so conveniently perfect. And as I make more money, you'll make more money. We're all good, everybody's happy and fantastic and don't fuck up.

[B]

Please do the thing, dude. I'll tell you. I'll tell you a relevant story from my experience that is pretty relevant to this question. So back when we had. We had, like, I think this. We had about 10 retail stores at this time. And all the stores, all of them, we. We could never get more than like, 40 transactions, 50 transactions a day. Okay. And. And they were all like, in the Same zone. And we're sitting here, like, beating our heads on the. On the. On the wall. We're like, dude, if we could just get to 80, then we could hire a new person, put a new. Put a new POS unit in the store, and we'd rock it the out. But we have to. We have to get to 80 before we can do that. All right? And that's what we thought. So we ran a test, and, you know, to get a new POS system for 10 stores. Back then, we weren't really making any money. Was a big investment. So we took one store, and we added a second POS system, which I think we spent, like, five grand on. And then we added another employee, because then there was payroll dollars to go on top of it. Within 60 days, that store went from 45 transactions to 90 transactions. And what we learned was, is that there was a capacity how many people could actually be handled the way that we want to handle them, and that we couldn't breach that capacity without making the investment.

[A]

You were not about to get 90 transactions.

[B]

It would have never happened. It would have never happened. It was. It was literally impossible. And the way that we figured out it was impossible was because I actually went to the store and I sat there for an entire day, and I watched one of our best guys. I. I purposefully went to the store that I thought was the best, and I watched him all day. And then I asked myself, when I walked out, I said, could he have done any more? And the answer was, fucking no. And so we decided to add this in. And by the way, it doubled our. Because then after it worked in one store, we did all 10 stores, and that's what set the company up to really start to grow, which, you know, really everything that you guys see was born from that decision. So you. What you're saying is correct. You have to make the investment up front before the business comes in. And whether that's personal or whether that's equipment, it's reality. You can only do so much with so much. And people have a hard time with this because we always say, well, when we get to here, we'll invest in this. But you can't get there without making the investment first.

[C]

Is also. Because it makes the chicken feel. Yeah, but it makes us feel like we stay poor in business, too, because the more we grow, the more we put our money back in the business to support that growth.

[B]

Right.

[C]

And then we don't realize that the business worth is going up and we're technically getting richer because we're not seeing that money. Right, right. So we get like, well, I can't buy a new car, like I can't buy nicer house, but I'm working way more than before or I'm doing way more revenue. Where's the money going? Yeah, it's there in the baseline. Eventually it blows out and suddenly you're super rich. Yeah, but, but people are used to jobs where they get progressive pay every year and it gets better. So in their businesses, when they get to this place where they're doing better, they expect more money and they don't realize that there's this transition place where you got to keep investing, keep investing, keep investing, and then you get a return.

[B]

So.

[C]

So business isn't proportional in growth the same way a job is, you know, where every year.

[B]

Well, and then the other thing too is that a lot of people don't realize is that the growth that you get on the backside and the enterprise value is exponentially more than what you.

[C]

Would make in cash.

[B]

So understanding that is very important because maybe you have a $5 million business, but now it's a $15 million business, but you're not making any money. Right. So these are things to consider. But without knowing more about this specific situation that I think this is the best.

[A]

I thought that was great. It was great. We got question number three.

[B]

Yeah, already, huh?

[A]

Yeah, yeah, we're there, we're there. This is a good one, guys.

[B]

P.J.

[A]

Andy, question number three. Andy. I'm struggling, I'm struggling with the line between discipline, delusion. On one hand, every successful person says to follow a proven path and execute it relentlessly. On the other, I hear that if the path is clear, it's probably someone else's and greatness requires forging your own way. How do you personally know when following someone else's blueprint is smart execution and when staying on the path is just fear of taking full ownership and building something that's actually yours.

[B]

Oh no. I think this is a great question. Yeah, this actually goes right along with what you talk about. Going from a self employed to a business owner to an entrepreneur.

[C]

So growth and trajectory, destination paths, whatever you call it, are progressive nature. Just like the human being progresses through their growth individually. So when a person says, should I follow a proven path? So let's, let's talk about before even going into self employment, let's talk about a job. Like someone works a job. How many times do we hear bullshit like, well, I'm tired of building other people's dreams. When has anyone that has ever worked a job, built someone else's dream? Never. They work for themselves. How many people would still work that job if they got zero pay for no reason? They would just show up like, I want your dream. And that's all I'm fucking here for. I'm. I don't care for what I want. I just want what you want. And if you get what you want, I'll have salvation. I'll fucking go and just go to rest.

[A]

Said nobody ever, ever.

[C]

So even a job with the right intent, like, you know what? I believe in your cause. I'm here and I want to work in this place still has a personal component of dream, which is like, I want a bigger house, I want a nicer job, I want a promotion. I want these things. So that line has created a lot of corrosion in the world where people have this belief that just having a job as a negative quotation or like, you're not. You're too stupid to go figure your own shit out. You get a job when you lack the ability to market your skills to.

[B]

The public or you have no skills.

[C]

You're going super basic. You have nothing. Then you learn how to.

[B]

If you don't know how to cook fucking French fries.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

And the guy next to you knows how to make the best fucking french fries. It's probably a good fucking idea to follow his little path.

[C]

And. But the point, I didn't go that far back as franchise. We can go to like a normal job.

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

But if you have some skill, like a company will hire you. You might be like, hey, you have good customer service skills. Come here, sell my product. Okay, cool. That skill is there. And there's a value to that skill to you as an employer. And there's a value to that skill to me, to selling it to you as an employer. But I don't have the capacity to sell that to the public, scale it and know how to do that. So I either have to earn more skills by going into that company and saying, can I learn new things? Maybe I'm good at service, but put me in sales, like, let me become a better, more versed person. And that transition occurs even as you go from a job to like self employment, which is like, oh, well, you know what? I have an idea. I've been doing this for people. Maybe I'll start a consulting firm and offer these services and train a few other guys. That's not really entrepreneurial, but it's still innovative. And now you're learning again how to market yourself to the world. Out there, and so on and so forth. So when you follow someone's blueprint, like someone says, hey, if you do this, you'll make some money. You'll go down that path, there's two things you got to ask yourself. The first one is, regardless that it's your dream or not, or that it's a temporary thing or not, are you willing to commit to becoming the fucking best at it? Because if you're not, you're going to fucking fail even at that blueprint that's set for you. And I'm going to tell you why. Because you're going to lose interest. Because the success isn't going to come at the rate that it came for the first guy that invented the blueprint. Usually that's how it works. It's like, hey, I went down this path. I was first. I got all that money out of it. You can still make money. There might be some truth there. I'm not saying like, oh, it's a bad thing to follow that footstep. But it's not going to come at the rate and at the speed or at the increase that the person got it. So you're going to lose interest because you're like, I thought I was going to get millions of dollars, but I really made like 15, 20 grand, and I don't think it's for me. So if you're not willing to commit to what that business is or what that blueprint is, then don't start. Because you're going to drop off and you're going to lose years. You could have invested in something of your own in that path and taken that suffering stage. And that's worse. The worst thing is to go down a path, make no money, waste three years, come back to zero in that loop, and then be like, well, I could have spent three years devoted to this. I still made no fucking money. I would have at least gotten through the trenches by now.

[B]

You don't have been in the same. And most people get caught in that loop forever.

[C]

Forever. Correct. Because it's the next thing that's promised. Because they're looking at the reward, not the work. Whatever the blueprint is, whatever the job is, whatever the decision of the business is, are you willing to commit to become the best at whatever that is? If you're not interested in plumbing and you're not interested in maybe digital media or you're not interested in podcasting, just because someone else has made a billion dollars in it does not mean you will fucking make a billion dollars in it. You are not interested in becoming the best. They were interested in really fucking being on a podcast. You know, like. Like starting a podcast. And so they committed to that art. They didn't commit to the money that came with it. They got so good at it that the money came to them, and they were like, you know what? We'll give you millions of dollars in brand deals. We'll do this. We'll bring you some big guests. But people are like, well, other people did it. Why can't I. Are you even interested? Not. Not. They did it. Fine. It's possible. But are you interested in that topic even to even start there? Because they. They don't take that at all. They don't pay attention to that shit whatsoever. They just go, there's money there. So that's where I should go.

[A]

Maybe this will work.

[C]

But if there's no interest, there won't be a commitment. Like, if there's no. Like, I. I don't know anything about cars or a lot. Like, I get guys come to me and they're like, I want to learn watch trading. I'm like, great, Here, take this course. And they're like, oh, yeah, I don't like watches. Like, then why the do you want to learn? Well, I saw that guy made a million bucks. I'm like, yeah, but he loves fucking watches. He came here and he's like, I love luxuries. I love watches. I'm gonna figure this shit out. And the first thing you tell me is like, I don't like this, so I'm probably not gonna do good at. Yeah, you're probably not.

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

Because you already have this defeated attitude that, hey, I'm coming into this. And I tell you before I even start, I have a handicap. And I'm like, no, you don't. You're a human. You have many things I am working on. You have many things that you probably do that are gonna work out. And the lack of interest is what makes people go, oh, I'll go to next thing, next thing. So, you know, if you want to start your own thing and you don't have the proper, like, either past track record, skill set, or you haven't learned how to market these things, then it's okay to start a smaller business, to inquire some funds, work for someone, earn more skills, get some money behind you, and then be like, how long of a Runway did I build? Three years of survival. Okay? I'm not gonna get too comfortable. I can take three years. I can go launch my own thing. But the other Thing that's also, this society has done is this stigma that if you're not an entrepreneur, you're a loser. You know, like, if you're not like building your own shit, yeah, you're a loser. And you're like, you're not good enough. You're stupid. It takes a lot of like real dedication and effort and time and fucking sacrifice to build shit. And it's not for everyone at all stages of life at the same rate. Just because someone else did it, you're gonna do it. So there, there are guys making 5,600k a year working jobs. Like, I have people in my company.

[B]

Because they become great at that thing.

[C]

Exactly. And they're really talented and I'm great.

[B]

They're irreplaceable.

[C]

They would not do a great job at entrepreneurship. They're making plenty of money. They still drive Ferraris. You know, they're doing their. And they're not like senior level guys that are like, you know, the Guy's been there 32 years and he's looking. It's just guys that three years later they're making like five, six hundred grand.

[B]

So.

[C]

And they live very well. Like, does that guy, should he give up and be like, I'm a lost cause if I don't go out there and build this giant. Why, like, what do you do? Yeah, do you even know what you want to do? Because the idea of entrepreneurship by itself doesn't mean anything. Like, when you're like, I want to.

[B]

Be an entrepreneur, like, how many fucking actual entrepreneurs are there?

[C]

Right? Like, very few.

[B]

There's very few. Because people don't understand what entrepreneurship actually is. You have a really accurate and interesting take on what that is. And you should define that for people so that they understand.

[C]

It's really the simplicity of looking at uniting people around the creation. The creation is the key element. So if you're, for example, Steve Jobs, you unite people around an idea like a phone or a different type of computer. And then first you unite your first layer, which are your close friends, your employees, people that are going to help build it. You got to get them to buy in to that creation. You're going to be like, we're going.

[B]

To do something that's never been done. Exactly.

[C]

Like, let me show you what that creation looks like. They got to buy into there. Their friend have to buy in their funds, whatever you're going to need to get whoever it is.

[B]

And most people aren't going to buy into it.

[C]

Yeah. And then you need to unite customers around it. Right. And Business becomes the vehicle of basically moving that creation to the marketplace. So there are people who have great businesses who are not entrepreneurs and who facilitate the transaction. You could be, for example, a franchisee and say, I want to own 10 Apple stores where we're going to sell these Apple computers, but I don't want to create these. I'm not interested in.

[B]

You can make great money.

[C]

Any of this shit.

[B]

Like that's the whole reason franchising exists.

[C]

Exactly. I'll make my 10% margin. I'm good. Like, we'll sell. This is a great product. I believe in it. I think you guys are doing great. I'll sell the shit out of it because I know how to build sales teams. That's a great business. And you could build millions of dollars in income doing it. Like, you don't have to go to that scale. But I'll also say this, entrepreneurship comes over time. Usually, like you work a job, you work self employment, you build businesses. Only to realize, I'm in this business, I've committed to this industry. There's a void here. This doesn't exist. But I now have experience, some money, I've built contacts and I think I can, I think I can be that guy to fucking bring that to the marketplace. Like, and I think I know how to be that guy because I've seen how to not be that guy over the years and I know now that I'm ready to take that step. But, but a lot of times the idea of being an entrepreneur is more exciting than that. So like when, when you have to ask someone, what should I do in 2026 to be successful? Trust me, you're not fucking ready to be an entrepreneur. Like, there is nowhere the word entrepreneur should not be in your fucking dictionary for next three years. Like, just don't even think that way. Because if you don't know what you want to do, like, you're not going to just start shit and it's magically going to work. It's going to be what you commit to. So if you don't know what you want to do, how do you know what you're going to commit to for ten fucking years? You don't.

[B]

Right?

[C]

And it's going to take longer than 10 fucking years for it to really hit the way. Oh, you know, there's flowers coming from the ceiling, Everybody welcomes you and you're making millions of dollars. It's not how shit works, right? Like they like, what are you willing to lose for? And if you don't buy into that, you're just never going to ever going to become an entrepreneur. You're just going to loop into these opportunities. Like, oh, this guy's going to teach me Forex. I'm an entrepreneur. No, no, you're fucking not. Oh, this other guy is going to teach me how to. Like, I tell my guys that learn watch trading. I'm like, you're not fucking entrepreneurs. You're learning how to fucking sell watches. It's not entrepreneurial. Like, it's a watch. Like, you're not inventing a watch, you're buying it. You're selling it. Jewelers existed before your ass. Jewelers will exist, post your ass. Yeah, you figured out how to do it better and great, you're making money. This model works. It's etc, right? That's it. Like, it ends there. Like, make money. Like, don't start thinking this grander of like, we have an ultimate brand and this brand is like, I'm like, it's a watch. You're selling a watch. Like, don't make things bigger than they are. Make them impactful for what they are and then let that ride you into the next step.

[B]

Yeah, Leverage it. Yeah, right.

[C]

You like my word from.

[B]

Well, it's the truth. It's the truth, dude. And you know, there's a lot of value when you start with zero skill. Like, let's use the French, the French fry guy, right? I like to make things very simple. You, you show up and you have no idea how to make French fries, but you have Captain French Fry of America working right down the next to you. That's a tremendous opportunity for you to follow a path that allows you to make up ground very quickly. Okay? Apply that to whatever skill you want to learn, whatever it is that you do, plumbing, electric, fucking tech, whatever. Get next to someone who has already cut the path, learn everything that they want to learn, and then start thinking about, okay, well, how can I evolve this? How can I take this? How can I put my own spin on it? How can I do this differently? And when you graduate into that world now you're an entrepreneur, so there's a lot of value. And I'm glad you brought up a thing about, you know, a lot of people think, you know, if they have a normal job, they're somehow a failure.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

And it's like total. Okay. It's the path that you choose for your life experience. Right. Not everybody. Like, and I don't say this to like, be an. But if you took a normal person off the street as casual of a day that we've had the stress that I've had during the casual day that you and I have had would fucking crumble. Someone who is not used to feeling that every text that I've gotten today, none of it was good. You know what I'm saying?

[C]

Like, so I haven't even looked at my.

[B]

Yeah, right. Understand the right.

[C]

Good mindset.

[B]

That's right. So. So when we. When we. You know, when we think about, like, the idea of taking a path that is clear versus a path that is unknown, what we were actually talking about is deviating from the clear path. Once you have the understanding of what it takes to clear a path and then creating your own thing, you can make up a whole bunch of progress by modeling other people's behavior. And by the way, like PJ says, you can fucking be very successful in that. Do some of the richest dudes in the. In the United States, number one, you know, they're franchise owners or they're. They're executives at companies, bro. And they've just become great executives. They're great. And if you're the french fry guy and you go out and figure out how to make the French fries, like, French fry America over here, okay? Now you've got a skill, okay? And that skill will translate into other skills. And one of the things that you said that was so important for people to grasp is that you are in the business of you. You are your own brand. And you have to think about this. What level of skill set does your brand represent? What. What value do you bring to an organization? What value can you bring to the market? This is no different than thinking of a company, but you're thinking of it as yourself. And a lot of people don't do that. They do exactly what he said. They're, oh, I'm fucking tired of building everybody's dreams.

[C]

And they don't want to commit to someone else's job because they feel that somehow they should have committed something else. But reality is, if you can't commit to a job that's already been established for you, has guidelines for you, and is simple for you, how the fuck are you gonna commit to forging a path that doesn't exist, that you've never seen? Yeah. They don't understand how the shit looks anyway. Like, it's just so fucking stupid.

[B]

It's. It's like putting the cart before the fucking horse.

[C]

Yeah. And it just doesn't make sense. And that's one of the key reasons why people derail themselves off of a good plan. Like, I've had great employees that were making six figures. Fantastic. Sitting there and fucking killing it. And I'm like, I see this. And I'm like, the trajectory is crazy for you. You're gonna make 300, 400 next year, and it's gonna keep going. I'm like, dude, three years ago you weren't even making $10. Like, you're making like 150k, you know? Like, I feel like I'm behind. Behind who? Like, what the. What the. Like, yeah, three years, 150K.

[B]

Like.

[C]

And they're like, well, there's a guy. What was we talking about earlier? He's 22, he's got a Bugatti. I'm like, what? On. On what fucking planet?

[B]

Like, right.

[C]

Like, maybe in the. With Monopoly money. Yeah, it's going away.

[B]

Instagram world, little toy going to go away.

[C]

It's going to be in your garage.

[B]

Yeah. All you got to do is pay jail. Listen, out of the. Out of the 15 years that I've been doing personal development content at a very high level, I have yet to see someone like, you just said 22 year old. I got a Bugatti 22 year old that was there the next year and the next year and the next year and the next year.

[C]

Money is always good. Always say, fast money made is fast money lost. And what I'm saying is no one said you can't gamble and get lucky and do that.

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

And you can sell that as a dream to someone else. So you can gamble and do that, but reality, it runs out. It takes. It takes years of mastery. And you also have to take this, which Instagram has polluted this shit. Think about it this way. What is a Bugatti? It's the mastery of automotive perfection. Like, think about it that way. It's the highest pinnacle of shit. Who the fuck are you? What have you done to deserve that shit? Like, ask yourself that shit. And I don't mean that in a. Oh, you're not good enough, but you're probably not fucking good enough. So what have you won at? Like, not the. Not. I've gotten away to figure out how to fight my way to getting this fucking car. Well, you're not going to be able to afford keeping this fucking car. So let's talk about, like, what have you done at a level so fucking high, at the pinnacle of fucking mastery that allows you to gift that billionaires that are fucking driving these cars have that you're like, I fit into that circle. No, you don't.

[B]

Yeah, and it's a lie.

[C]

And it's. It's an illusion, right?

[B]

It's. It is. It's ego. It's the overestimation of one's own place in the world. Because we are taught all of this. All of this. What do people say? They say this. Oh, you think because you have this, you're better than me? No, I am better than you.

[C]

Well, I usually say, yes, I am.

[B]

No, no, no, no. I'm better than you at what it takes to get that. That doesn't mean I'm spiritually superior or I'm a better human being superior. It means I'm better at the thing that creates this outcome than you. And that's a real thing. And this idea that we're all equal and everybody's special and everybody deserves this or that is complete fucking horseshit. It's never existed that way in the history of humankind. And you are not going to be the first motherfucker.

[C]

You know, And I've watched something Tony Robbins said recently, which I think is so relevant here, and he's like, we're all equal on a soul level.

[B]

That. That's. That's. But our dude, I saw that same clip.

[C]

The value isn't equal in a marketplace.

[B]

He said, that was that clip with the American income guy.

[C]

Like, yeah, what the do you do for.

[B]

It was such a great line.

[C]

It was a great. Like, I'm not.

[B]

We are the same on. On a. A soul level.

[C]

Correct.

[B]

But I am.

[C]

Our marketplace value is different. Like, we figured how to do things.

[B]

It was such a good way. Dude, I'm such a huge Tony fan because he always communicates things in such a great way. And if. Did. Did you notice in that clip, too, that he goes, so you're a billionaire? And he goes, fortunately, I am like. Like, he said, you have to own it. Yes, you're doing it. But he said, you know, he's. Most people. Like, he said it almost like he was going to say, well, unfortunately, fortunately, I am. And it was just like, yeah, Tony. Like, how do you not want. How do you not want Tony Robbins to win, bro? Anyway, I love Tony Robbins, dude.

[A]

That's a good point, though. It made me think, like, imagine we're all caveman and you kill the el. Oh, you think you're better than me because you killed the elk?

[C]

Yeah, I did something. You're sitting in the cave holding your dick, and it's.

[B]

That all comes from the. This fake that these kids have been taught for the last 20 years. Like, oh, well, you know, I got a trophy at Sixth grade. Field day for showing the up. Well, that's sixth grade. That ain't real life. You know, and this idea that. That's taught to the younger generations and has been for the last two decades. And. And it's not their fault. They don't have a perspective outside of that. But this idea that everybody is equal is not real. That's not a real thing. That's not. It's just not a real thing. And if you go through life thinking, well, I'm as. I deserve that because I'm breathing the air, you're going to have a very disappointing existence, because the world doesn't reward people that breathe air. It rewards people that actually contribute value at the scale that brings you the things that you want. Okay, so Your analogy is 100% accurate. What the fuck have you done to think that you sit at that motherfucking table?

[C]

Exactly.

[B]

And because you don't, you most people.

[C]

That attain the goods without the mastery of your capacity to basically retain them, it just doesn't make sense. Like, if you. If you live in an apartment and you just put all your money and bought a car, what is the likeliness that that's going to sustain? Like, that's not. You're not at that level where you should have this item. You're just trying to do it to feel like you've gotten it. But I'm not saying you shouldn't push yourself, but I'm saying there are levels to the game where you have to understand where you. Where you are and what you need to do to get there, not what you need to do to acquire things other people have that are there. Like. And that's the part people aren't understanding. Like, even cars are generations of, like, excellence that has been passed down from, like, a father to a son who worked at Ferrari, who worked at Lamborghini, who built just the interior of something. And he's like, this fucking leather is the only cow in the fucking world that goes in worlds, Royce. And you're like, I don't understand that. But, like, that guy takes that shit very seriously.

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

And it's mastery on a level. And he's like, I've created mastery, and I've created masterful experiences for people who have mastered their environment so they can sit in this fucking car, touch the steering wheel, and be at peace after they've seen the chaos in the outside world. Like, you haven't earned your fucking stripes. You haven't been to war. You don't get to sit in the fucking car.

[B]

That's it, dude. And that's a real. It's a real thing. It's a real fucking thing. And it really upsets people when you fucking point that out, you know? But, dude, fuck.

[A]

You mean I came, right?

[B]

Yeah, but it shouldn't upset anybody because it's just reality. It's no different than gravity. It is just the way that it is. And if you're offended by that, then you have to adjust how you're seeing the world because the. That reality is never changing. Okay? So you either.

[C]

Even if you fake it, it's going to go away, bro.

[B]

Anyways, and we see. Do we talked about this earlier?

[C]

All the time.

[B]

You know, early. Like in. PJ and I were two of the very first, like, I would say, success entrepreneurs on Instagram. Yeah, Okay, I agree. There's a handful of other guys that.

[C]

Are legit and have done.

[B]

But, you know, back in our day, we were both big car guys. Okay? But, you know, when I met pj, bro, I had a fucking, you know, I had an R8 and I had a fucking Aston Martin vantage that was like 30,000 miles. Okay? This was the shit that I could afford at the time. And here's what we have now. We have these kids, because of Instagram, thinking that they got to go out and stretch themselves so far out into the future by financing a Bugatti for 4, 000 months. You know that like, when they should.

[A]

Be in that ra, bro.

[B]

Exactly. There. Listen, dude, we gotta understand that there is. There's stretching and then there's stupid. Yeah, okay. And because of the pressure that all these kids feel, they. They feel like they got to put all this effort into looking the part when in reality, dude, you don't want to look the part in the beginning. You want to be the part 10 years, 15 years down the road. And it's hard to understand that when you're 20 years old and you look on the Internet and you see people who are two or three years older than you saying, look what I got at 23. And it's like, bro, that's. It's not real.

[C]

But you don't understand the context either. Right? You just see. You don't know if someone's that body. You don't understand what's happening. Like, you just go like, he has it. So whatever he wrote is probably true. So I'm just gonna assume whatever is happening is true, and that's what it is.

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

I mean, it's a way it's set up, you know, so, like, no different.

[B]

Than a Magician, bro. Look over here. Yeah, right? Look over here. Look at this thing. Look at this thing. Look at this thing. And then the truth is right here.

[A]

Pulling that rabbit out your head.

[B]

That's right, bro. And ain't no pulling rabbits out there.

[C]

Raccoon at that point.

[B]

That's a raccoon. Yeah. And then they'll tell you it's a rabbit.

[A]

That's right.

[B]

It's clearly. No, that's a raccoon. No, it's a rabbit. Yeah. Instagram in a nutshell, dude. It's so true, man. And it's unfortunate because, like, you know, all of you guys listening that are young, you have to understand that every single person that you looked up to was in your position at some point in time. And there's no shame in that. You should embrace that. You should be like, all right, look, I'm not gonna be like, one of these fake. I'm gonna actually make it. I'm gonna actually create value. I'm gonna actually build something real. And this is why I'm so critical of the coaches. Coaching coaches to be coaches. Like, that's not a real thing. You don't have anything to coach them on. You haven't done anything. You don't build anything. Oh, I've built lots of. Let's see it. Because anybody that's actually built shit has no problem saying, here's what I've built, and look how fucking amazing it is. Okay? Fortunately, I am right. Exactly. Like, anybody who's real is not going to hide the secret sauce. They're going to say, here's what I've done. This is how I did it. You can decide how you want to do things, but this is. This is the real thing. And there's very few of those people out there. Very few.

[A]

That's real, man. So that's real, dude. I love it, man. Yeah, man, I.

[B]

This is great, dude. Guys, are you inspired?

[A]

I am, dude. I'm ready to kick some ass.

[C]

Was it the raccoon part? Yeah, I think I really like it.

[B]

Yeah. He just heard, Bro. His eyes lit up. You said raccoon. His eyes got biggest. Oh, man. Well, here. At the end of the day, dude, here's what it is, all right? Look, shit's hard. You got to be good, and it takes a lot longer than you think, and you got to be way better than you think. And if you think you're just going to start an Instagram page and come out and a Bugatti out your ass, good luck, because it ain't going to ever happen. You have to commit. You have to decide. You have to go at it relentlessly as if it's the only motherfucking thing that matters for a long time. And other people are going to come to you and they're going to say, well, what about balance? Or what about this or what about that? Those are the rules for everybody else at this point in time. And you will be living by a different standard 20 years from now, 10 years from now, than they will be. If you follow their rules now, you will have their life later. If you don't follow their rules now, you will have a different life later. And the reality of winning is this. It takes more than you think. It takes longer than you think, and you have to be better than you think. And if you can just accept that you don't know shit and you have a long way to go and you commit yourself to that process, the outcome will happen automatically. It is not something that you even have to stress about. And you guys who are young right now are at such a massive advantage because very, very, very few young people truly understand what the we're talking about here. They are going to be enamored by the quick. They are going to be exactly what PJ said. They're going to get into something for a year or two and they're going to say, oh, it's not for me. And then they're going to do another thing for two years and they're going to say, oh, it's not for me. And then you're going to Repeat that cycle 10 years in a row and lose a whole decade, bro. Or two decades, okay? Because they had a bad week or they were bored. You want to know what the. You want to know? One of the most important things to becoming successful the course of your life is the ability to tolerate monotony and boredom and still execute at a high level. Because I'm going to tell you this right now, no matter what the fuck you think, how exciting shit is, dude, if you were to. If you were to pull me out in 1997 when I was 17 years old and said, andy, this is where you're going to be in 2025, I would have been like, holy shit, dude. No fucking way. But you know what? I'm here, and there's days that I come here and I'm like, this is fucking boring. But on those days that I feel bored, there's never a part of me that says, oh, I should be doing something else, or I should just stop this.

[C]

And you have to Be good at being alone.

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

Solitude is equally part of that journey. Because solitude, not just working alone, but just cutting out noise from people telling you which direction you should go, what you should do. And just being alone, man, this is something that's just like. People are like, oh, well, I want to do it. Why are they getting partners? Because they're afraid of being alone. They're like, I don't want to fail alone. Well, why the fuck would you fail? Why would you start something you think you're going to fail at? But the larger equation is I'm just so afraid of being alone that I constantly want feedback and I want my friends as part of this. And I. And it's just not there. There's no work life balance. There's no fucking friend time. There's no, like, oh, I'm just gonna go see a movie tonight.

[B]

Not in the early years, no.

[C]

Yeah, for a long time. I mean, for the first 15 years, I was in a fucking cave looking at the wall. I got a computer all day.

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

Every day. And I was like, it is what it is. It takes what it takes. I lost multiple girlfriends. I lost. You know, all this time. And it just. It was what it was. And there was. There was no point in there where at some point I look back and I said, maybe I'm being an asshole. Maybe I should stop and spend time with my family. And then I realized, I said, but I'm not where I need to be yet. So. So this sacrifice will have been for nothing if I don't see it true to the end. So I'm not losing these fucking years. I'm going to finish this. So you just. You have to be able to do that independently of someone motivating you halfway and coming in and being like, I'm going to help you because you don't like doing the boredom shit. Yeah, like what? You're like, what the fuck are you talking. Who's coming to save you? Yeah, no one's come to save you.

[B]

The last thing you're gonna have, especially when you're. Especially like, dude. Especially when you come from. If you don't. Okay. If you don't come from success and you're not surrounded by success and. And you. Let's just say you come from, like, where you and I came from, okay, A place of. Where very few people around you were, quote, unquote successful. If you can't fucking see it, but you see it for yourself, that's great. But you can't expect the other people to understand it. They will never get it because they've never seen it. Ever. They've never seen it, which is why we talk about this being an obligation. Because if you can show them, then that instills belief in one or two or three of those other people that then also.

[C]

Those guys are afraid you'll make it too.

[B]

Yeah, for sure. Yeah. They're afraid you'll make it.

[C]

You'll make it.

[B]

Yeah. Well, then we get a discussion of fucking.

[C]

They're like, well, you know, like, if he fucking makes it, then what the fuck did I do wrong?

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

Like, what the fuck is going on now? So. So part of them doesn't want to see it. Part of them doesn't want you to even try getting it.

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

And because they know that they might even see potential in you, and they're like, oh, this guy might actually fucking be committed enough to make it. And then they feel really stupid, you know?

[B]

Yeah, well, and you. You know, as. As someone who's been doing what you do for a very long time, the frenemy aspect. Right. Like, some of these people will hang around you pretending like they're supporting you, hoping secretly that you don't make it. And it's very hard to identify those people, like, because it appeases you.

[C]

Look like they're encouraging you.

[B]

That's right.

[C]

Like they're doing shit.

[B]

That's right.

[C]

And so you trust them. And then they throw that one thing trying to dera you halfway without taking accountability for it. This is. This is just a reality of human nature.

[B]

I had someone do that to me not that long ago who I trusted, who told me something about myself that was actually my strength. And they. They said, well, you need to. You need to tone this down and think about this and do this. And it me up. And then I came to realize that wasn't that. That was said to me for the purpose of removing the magic that I had. You see what I'm saying? And, you know, you. You become more aware of these things as you go down the pipe. But, you know, to. To speak to, like, the quote unquote, being alone. You know, when you look at all these people who have done big things and you wonder why they won't let you in their circle. Well, the reason is, is one, you don't have the value to bring. And number two, they've been fucked over by some of the people that they thought were their best fucking friends. So when you're that kind of a person and you've had those experiences, you know, they don't they don't want to have a cup of coffee with you, bro. You know, hey, can I pick your mind? Dying to grow the circle. And by the way, buying someone a cup of coffee is not a fucking value. Yeah, okay.

[C]

As if we can't afford coffee.

[B]

Yes. Like, hey, man, can I pick your brain off the 30 years of business experience that you have over. Over lunch? No, you can't. You can't.

[A]

Not a restaurant in the world.

[B]

That's right. Yeah. So, you know, think about that, too. When people. When you say these things and you try to proposition these people to put yourself, it's. It's no different than what we were talking about with the Bugatti. What do you. Why do you deserve to be at that lunch? What do you actually bring, Right?

[C]

What have you done? Right? What's your track record?

[B]

Have you done anything?

[C]

Why is your perspective relevant to be at that table?

[B]

And by the way, things of value could be things like we talk about with the cultural fit, right? Like. Like maybe there's somebody who is an excellent athlete, and I can see very clearly that they are super dedicated to their craft. And they are. They become one of the best in the world at their craft and they want to sit down and have a talk. Yeah, I'll do that. You know why? Because I know that person possesses the ability to push through towards the thing, and it's not going to waste my time with me sharing some valuable. Right? So you either have to display that you have what it takes to actually push through and achieve things, or you have to bring real value. You know, plenty of people want to help people win. They just don't want to waste their fucking time.

[C]

Right? That's the key.

[A]

Yeah, that's real, man. Well, guys, pj, Andy. Dude, that's a hell of a way to start a week, man. Yeah, that's a beautiful Monday for you guys.

[B]

Yeah, tell them where they can follow you. And also the books that you've written so that you can get these.

[C]

So the easiest way to follow me is on either X or. Or Instagram. I create millionaires. The easiest way. Or you can go to learnfrompj.com and all my books and all the courses are there. There's also a free starter kit to learn about wealth integration and everything else there for people. So.

[B]

Cool. Cool. Well, bro, thanks for coming up, man.

[C]

It's been a long journey, man. We both have gone crazy.

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

Crazy places.

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

11 years later, the reunion.

[B]

Yeah, for sure.

[C]

11 years for next one.

[B]

I might be dead, but we're not for sure, so. Well, dude, thank you for coming up, bro. Means a lot.

[C]

Always, always incredible to see what you guys have built and the culture continuing to grow around here.

[B]

Thank you, brother. All right, guys, don't forget, tonight, 7pm Central, we will be live on X and YouTube. And don't be a hoe. Share this. Yeah.

[A]

Went from sleeping on the floor now my jury box froze up Bow stove counted millions in a cold bad bitch booted swole got her own bank roll can't fold just a no head shot case Close, close.