Human Events with Jack Posobiec, December 26th, 2025

Summary

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Podcast Summary

Real America’s Voice: Human Events with Jack Posobiec

Episode Date: December 26, 2025
Special Edition: Americafest (AmFest) Live Panel
Host: Jack Posobiec
Guests: Rich Barris (“The People’s Pundit”), Graham Allen (Conservative Commentator)

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Overview

This special “Human Events” episode, recorded live at AmFest, features a panel with Jack Posobiec, Rich Barris, and Graham Allen. The discussion centers on the current state of the conservative movement after the assassination of Turning Point USA founder Charlie Kirk. Major topics include the rise of division and infighting among conservatives, the fallout over handling of high-profile issues like the Epstein files, emerging generational splits in right-wing politics, the impact of social media, and the ongoing investigation into Kirk’s murder. The panelists urge for honest debate, transparency, and unity—especially as America heads toward the 2026 midterms.

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Key Discussion Points and Insights

1. Is the Conservative Movement Fracturing?

[03:26–08:00]

• Jack Posobiec introduces the panel and frames the main question:

  “Is Turning Point turning into a food fight?... That’s the outside mainstream narrative. Compare that to what you’re seeing inside.” (03:26, Posobiec)

• Graham Allen argues both unity and disagreement are inevitable, crediting Charlie Kirk's leadership for keeping the coalition focused:

  “We’re never going to agree on one hundred percent of everything... There is infighting going on right now; we’ve seen it live on stage.” (05:02, Allen)
  “My critique is: are we actually having debates, or dropping ‘truth grenades’ and letting the Internet decide?” (06:24, Allen)

• Consensus: Disagreements existed even prior to Kirk’s assassination, but his absence has allowed divisions to go public and intensify.

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2. Age Divides, Media Narratives, and the Battle for the GOP’s Future

[08:00–14:20]

• Rich Barris describes the generational split between “old guard” Republicans (e.g., Ben Shapiro) and the “younger, more MAGA” wing (often associated with Tucker Carlson, etc.):

  “Younger right-wing voters... are not isolationists, but they are more MAGA... because they feel so deeply the dire threat to their own future.” (13:34, Barris)

• Posobiec reflects on the shift from focus on foreign policy to “America First” priorities:

  “They would like to see more of a prioritization on issues of Americans, the issues of veterans, rather than this foreign policy push.” (14:17, Posobiec)

• Allen notes a danger of “America Only” thinking emerging in some circles, as well as the trend of reducing every issue to extreme binaries online.

  “We have allowed this narrative... to pick up more and more steam to where more and more people are becoming... ‘America Only.’” (15:21, Allen)

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3. Epstein Files Controversy: Handling, Messaging, and the Public

[18:41–24:33]

• Posobiec recounts the administration’s problematic release of the Epstein files, calling it a “major misstep” and describing the sequence of events and botched communication:

  “People say, ‘Why didn’t you go hard enough?’ I went all the way in and asked for them... Should have been done right away, they shouldn’t have pumped the brakes.” (18:41, Posobiec)

• Allen and Barris agree mismanagement and redactions eroded trust:

  “People want to know... even at the highest levels [of the administration], they will admit, that was a major misstep.” (20:49, Allen)

• Barris:

  “[Trump] handled that— the whole administration handled that—about the worst you could possibly handle or mishandle a sensitive situation like the Epstein files.” (22:31, Barris)

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4. The Impact of Misinformation and Social Media

[26:32–36:26, 46:22–49:52]

• Allen and Posobiec warn about the spread of conspiracy theories—particularly after Charlie Kirk’s assassination—and the temptation to prioritize clicks or virality over truth.

• On the Kirk investigation:

  “There is another hearing... there has been so much confusion, tension over this issue that I think people have gotten very far away from the actual facts and evidence of the case.” (29:48, Posobiec)

• On social media’s influence:

  “Social media works faster than the justice system... people think that in their homes they should have every piece of evidence... immediately, right now.” (46:22, Allen)
  “People’s perceptions have been so changed... there’s a difference of expectation and when [those] aren’t met... that’s what leads to anger.” (47:42, Posobiec)

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5. The Charlie Kirk Murder Case: Transparency, Trust, and Political Violence

[32:00–45:34]

• All agree: The Kirk investigation’s lack of transparency is fueling rumors but also caution that true-crime expectations might clash with reality.

• Barris:

  “You do have podcasters who decide to live stream an investigation in real time. That’s what people want—they want answers fast. But that can damage a trial.” (35:11, Barris)

• On political violence:

  “This is the most high-profile assassination in our life, political assassination. You have to share more. You have to do better.” (40:05, Barris)

• Posobiec connects the rise of “words as violence” and the radicalization of isolated online groups, using recent cases (trans shooters, Discord channels) as examples:

  “Because they view Charlie’s words as violence directed at them, what have they done? They make literal violent words, violent words.” (45:34, Posobiec)

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6. Personal Responsibility, Grace, and Respect for the Kirk Family

[54:16–59:58]

• Panel denounces “grieving” for Kirk as a means for influencer or “podcast points.”

  “If he sent me something in private then that was meant in private… You’re violating this man’s privacy posthumous—it bothered me bad.” (54:32, Barris)

• Posobiec:

  “They’re not going to have a father that’s home for this Christmas or any Christmas... We should respect them and think about what is best, the best way to respect them in everything that we do.” (56:02, Posobiec)

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7. Moving Forward: Unity over Division

[58:36–60:34]

• Allen:

  “If we don’t figure out this infighting... we’re not going to do well in these midterms. Charlie [Kirk] would have called a massive meeting of the minds... and he would have had everybody fly in... It is on us to lead people in the right direction for mission first.” (58:36–59:58, Allen)

• Posobiec closes:

  “Remember what the mission is... There is more that unites us than divides us... we can do that in such a way where we maintain that grace but we also don’t lose sight of what the greater mission is.” (59:58, Posobiec)

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Notable Quotes

• “My critique is... are we actually having debates or dropping ‘truth grenades’ and letting the Internet decide?”
  – Graham Allen (06:24)

• “Younger right-wing voters... feel so deeply the dire threat to their own future.”
  – Rich Barris (13:34)

• “Should have been done right away, they shouldn’t have pumped the brakes.”
  – Jack Posobiec on Epstein files (18:41)

• “People’s perceptions have been so changed by... social media... when expectations aren’t met that’s what leads to anger.”
  – Jack Posobiec (47:42)

• “They’re not going to have a father that’s home for this Christmas... Respect them.”
  – Jack Posobiec on respecting the Kirk family (56:02)

• “If we don’t figure out this infighting... we’re not going to do well in these midterms.”
  – Graham Allen (58:36)

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Timestamps for Key Segments

| Timestamp | Segment | |:------------|:-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------| | 03:26 | Panel introduction and discussion of infighting at Turning Point | | 05:02 | Graham Allen on coalition dynamics and debates vs. “truth grenades” | | 09:00 | Rich Barris on pre-existing divisions and generational splits | | 13:34 | Age demographics and ideological shifts; “America First” explained | | 18:41 | Epstein files controversy, Trump’s handling, and fallout in the movement | | 26:32 | Social media’s role in the Kirk murder investigation/public expectations | | 32:00 | Panel’s stance on the facts of the Kirk murder; skepticism and trial transparency | | 40:05 | State vs. federal handling of Kirk case, need for more openness | | 45:34 | Words as violence, radicalization, and political violence (Discord and shooters) | | 46:22 | Public impatience, misinformation, and the pace of social media | | 54:16 | The personal side—grace, privacy, and respect for Kirk’s family | | 58:36 | Final appeals for unity and “mission first” | | 59:58 | Posobiec’s closing message: “Remember what the mission is... maintain that grace” |

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Tone and Language

• Candid, urgent, and combative at times; panelists are frank about internal rifts, wrestling openly with difficult topics.
• Highly personal and emotional when discussing Charlie Kirk’s legacy and family.
• Analytical about polling, generational divides, and the media environment.
• Calls for responsibility and unity in both messaging and action.

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For Listeners New to the Episode

This episode is an unfiltered look at the state of American conservatism in the wake of heightened infighting and tragedy. The hosts blend tactical electoral analysis with personal reflections, debate the media’s influence on their base, and directly address contentious issues around political violence and misinformation. If you want to understand the current fracture lines on the American right—and the deep reverence and mourning for Charlie Kirk—this discussion is an essential listen.

Transcript

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[Jack Posobiec]

This is what happens when the fourth turning meets fifth generation warfare a commentator international social media sensation and.

[Rich Barris]

Former navy intelligence veteran this is human.

[Jack Posobiec]

Events with your host jack posobic christ is king ladies and gentlemen welcome aboard to a special am fest edition of human events daily we're very excited here to have the illustrious panel with us we've got rich barris the people's pundit and we've got graham allen longtime turning point conservative probably i want to say you were probably one of the original turning point contributors when they started the entire program out it's been a long time it's been it's been a ride and for sure yeah i remember because i remember i'd be working at one america news and i would come to cover it and it'd be like you anna polina whole number of people up there with charlie that was like the first generation you know the first class i'm the new class of the contributors for sure it's been quite a ride and one of the things and graham maybe i'll even ask you this first one of the narratives that people have been asking about this turning point as they say my gosh is turning point turning into a food fight is it divisive are people divided are people attacking each other up on stage what's going on what is your take on that i'll just say that's the outside mainstream narrative of what's going on in here so compare that to what you're seeing outside versus what you see here well.

[Graham Allen]

I'Ll compare it to what i've asked the people around here and the feedback that i've been getting them and what i'll say is this i agree i'm all about a good fight i love.

[Jack Posobiec]

It grand mallon never shied away from.

[Graham Allen]

A fight i have to pray through it because i i love awkward fighting too much like like that's something about myself however i get it that look our coalition our side everything we're never going to agree on one hundred percent of everything and that's one thing that charlie did so well is he was able to get people to put the secondary disagreements aside for the mission first purpose of hey and charlie behind the scenes on stage you know this jack charlie would never tell anyone what say however he would challenge them to perhaps think about how to deliver it differently he would say okay i know you're really passionate about this but have you thought about if you say it like that is that going to lead to the actual outcome that you want it to be and i thought that's something that charlie did really well and so what i will say now is this i get it we got people in our movement that they don't agree on a lot of things and i think we have to be honest with ourselves there is infighting going on right now we've seen it live on the stage people throwing daggers this and that my question is this i'm all about fighting out the issues i think blake said this yesterday fighting out now in december instead of in november i got it but my question is this we're all about debate and open dialogue my critique of what's going on right now is are we actually having debates or are we actually dropping quote unquote truth grenades of whatever side that we're having the problems on and then we're walking off the stage and we're letting the internet decide and then my question to that is how does that lead us towards the mission of actually making heaven crowded and securing the midterms and so that's my critique of what we're saying right.

[Jack Posobiec]

Now i think that's a great point i think it's a valid point as well that and i remember charlie even at the very last turning point student action summit the one that we had in tampa which was the very as it turns out we didn't know but it would be the very last turning point event that charlie would be at that he held a debate and he moderated on the issue of israel and he had dave smith he had josh hammer two very strong believers different side of the issue but you know i believe two people who are willing to come at that and have that healthy debate and charlie said let's facilitate it let's have that conversation let people decide for themselves he didn't tell either of them what to say he didn't tell anybody what to think but he said let's have the debate because i believe his idea was to keep the coalition together and as you said we need to focus on the main mission winning the midterms and defeating the radical left rich barris you look at this from a polling perspective you see the media narrative of oh there's this this division at turning point division in the coalition the fracture was charlie kirk the tent pole holding it up i think that personally i think we saw a lot of this going on prior to charlie's death as a matter of fact and as unfortunate as it is the last couple weeks of his life were actually focused on dealing with with this division and then what happened was his mitigating presence was lost so those divisions just flared up and spilled out into the public but i just i know from you know being behind the scenes or being able to help wherever i could that those divisions already existed so rich talk to me about are these divisions legitimate are they real do you see it in the polling numbers when it comes out to voters these things that we talk about israel these things that we talk about charlie kirk's murder itself some of these other issues that have come up on stage where do we see that as the actual electorate so.

[Rich Barris]

I'M glad you said that part of it though i think that gets lost in the media narrative it does that this was going on when charlie was still alive he was just glue and with out his presence that left a bit of a void and i felt.

[Jack Posobiec]

Like charlie was in the middle of the tug of war in many ways.

[Rich Barris]

And now we're at i think a point where because of that absence that is happening a little bit early and a little bit premature right this is a midterm season right we could be having this debate in the nomination process for twenty eight it would be more productive to keep the coalition together and make sure everybody remembers you still have to defeat the democrats but from a polling perspective this was going to happen this is a huge age signal we have the old wing of the old guard of the republican party and let's i mean look i'm not doing this to throw any bomb i'm saying let's use the representation you have you know there's shapiro and crowd kind of wing of the republican party and then you have i am not sure he would even castelf this way but you have tucker being used and this is really just a proxy battle.

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[Jack Posobiec]

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[Graham Allen]

Nothing will stand in our way and our golden age has just begun this.

[Jack Posobiec]

Is human events with jack posoba now it's time for everyone to understand what america first truly truly means welcome to the second american revolution you have you.

[Rich Barris]

Know this shapiro and crowd kind of wing of the republican party and then you have i'm not sure he would even cast himself this way but you have tucker being used and this is really just a proxy battle for the future coming up in twenty eight who's going to be the nominee the direction the party is going to go in the fact of the matter is i think some people have to understand the age demographics of this younger voters younger right wing voters are more mad they're not isolationists but they are more maga and that's because they feel so deeply the dire threat to their own future and their own ability to live the american dream you do see this massive age signal with under forty five under fifty whatever however you know demographic bucket you want to put it in so it was bound to happen jack it.

[Jack Posobiec]

Was going to happen well and i see this with younger voters all the time i think we said earlier what did we say under fifty under fifty under fifty under forty crowd is when it comes to a lot of the foreign policy stuff they'll say yeah okay but what about me what about us what are you doing for us what are we getting out of this and so when they say america first they don't necessarily mean that like you say that you know we have to recede from the world and be isolation all this but they would like to see more of a prioritization on issues of americans the issues of veterans and rather than this foreign policy push that they feel for so long had been the focus of the republican party and oh by the way those are the same conditions that led to the rise of maga of botanicalism of donald trump in the first place in twenty sixteen so graham i'll toss that back to you because you're in there you're on the fight right here on rumble every day when you're talking to those people do they want to go back to the old style republican party no nobody wants.

[Graham Allen]

To go back to the old style but again i've talked about this a lot we have a responsibility to have discernment of what we throw out there when we throw it out that's why i've had problems with a certain female vocal person behind the mic that's why i've had questions of some of the things that tucker does i believe tucker believes in the truth i believe tucker believes in finding out the truth i question do you need to have every single one of your conversations in front of your entire audience in front of the entire world does that lead to more clarity or more confusion no one wants to go back to the old way but i see it in my audience all the time you see it all the time this is what we see every single day right now we see either either you've abandoned israel or you're a paid israel shill or or you're paid by qatar to hate muslims and all this other stuff we have allowed this narrative that may or may not be influencing the actual polls but we're allowing it to pick up more and more steam to where more and more people are becoming more and more isolationist and more and more it is america not america first but america only and that's what that's that that is a real and here's that we are.

[Jack Posobiec]

When you talk because you as oh well you're polling voters you're conducting focus groups all the time here's what i would even ask is is that really being driven by a difference in foreign policy or is it being driven by the anger of feeling that these issues are coming ahead of american economic issues.

[Rich Barris]

This is something that's been trending like this for many years now so i do think that what graham said there's validity though to what graham said that there is this other side of that that maybe seize an opportunity to get this fight started now i don't know what i'm not going to you know assign motives to what they may be thinking but they for some reason view that it's an opportunity to try to hatch this out or even bring it in a totally different direction from where it actually started from with that anger so look i think a great example is the trump administration and we this is a reason why that a lot of this really came up it was regardless what was going on you know starting in the spring and then going into the summer there were a lot of these voters who already were angry who felt like they got they wanted more out of donald trump than what they were getting and then trump got distracted and to them it was a here we go again moment every time we get our president every time it's our turn they take it from us that is the feeling the voters have and honestly are they wrong they're right so how are you gonna i mean that's that's just a fact so i mean they're influencers and pundits yeah i get we have a sway over people jack but they're gonna do and think but they're gonna do and think based on the reality of their world and their experience and we're just we're here to be we're here alone for the ride and we're here to be observers and we try to call balls and strikes as we see it but i mean we could exacerbate that public opinion but i don't think we can create it i think that's created by their own reality and their own experience yeah.

[Jack Posobiec]

And i think there's a palpable anger out there and i'll just say it i remember at the last major turning point event that student action summit that was right at the same time and the first big blow up that you saw regarding this was the epstein files yes and the epstein files came out and by the way we did get this trove last night and i've been running around here at these different events but i saw i was able to scroll through a number of the things my god gross some of the grossest stuff i've ever seen they ought to call these the clinton the clinton epstein files by the way because bill clinton's all over there and there's some pictures that just from a cursory look at it those are little kids all right there's little kids in this stuff the epstein files and so i don't think anyone would be surprised if we pointed out that the way the epstein files were treated by the administration was a misstep major misstep first they gave out the binders to you know myself included right i was in the group with the binders and they give this to us and they say hey this is phase one and we said okay what about phase two what about phase three are we going to get more and people come i've talked about a million times but i said look i went to the white house i asked the president of the united states the attorney general director of fbi said release the epstein files please do that and then they hand us this binder and then people say oh well why do you didn't go hard enough i said what else do you want me to do i went all the way in and asked for them and we got what we got then in the summer we were told there isn't anything more now here we are it's december we're getting more and more as horrible and horrific and disgusting as these files are and i'm glad that they're out and i'm glad that people fought to get them out and i called for them to come out on stage at the last turning point event the fact of the matter is should have been done right away they shouldn't have pumped the brakes and that really led to this first break i would say publicly with these type of voters you're talking about i.

[Rich Barris]

Mean graham just young maga in specific.

[Jack Posobiec]

Young maga graham i'm sure you saw the same same sentiment yeah i mean.

[Graham Allen]

You know i mean there's still people mad even about this launch because of all the redactions there's a lot there's a lot of redaction and so people want to know and you know depending on who you ask in the administration right now even at the highest levels they will admit that was a that was a major misstep there and they know it that was a major misstep same thing with the truth of whether we've got the epstein files versus the epstein client list we needed to do a better job of message of messaging than we did which said hey what we should have said was hey we're going to go in there but the democrats have been in power for the past five or four years there's no telling what they have done to this thing there may not be a list there may not be anything we don't know because we haven't been in there yet i think the american people would have restored bonded better.

[Jack Posobiec]

I would say if you remember the very first thing that she said was that the files that she saw made her sick to her stomach you remember when she said that and so i think it was her saying that and then switching but then suddenly we get from doj there's nothing else to getting these pictures which made me i said wait a minute so she must have seen this so she knew that this was real that it was all real and let me tell you something there are no photos of donald trump frolicking in swimming pools with redacted underage girls there's photos of bill clinton in those swimming pools he's in the hot tubs he's in the spas with the girls and you watch suddenly the democrats are all going to stop talking about the epstein files yeah.

[Rich Barris]

And look we can't step over the moment when trump sent that post to those who were frustrated yeah and he said you know what this is a hoax and if you're not hearing me and you won't just go away and leave me alone and then i don't want your support anymore and we heard people in our own polling going no i i strongly disapprove okay elaborate on that why didn't you hear what the president said he doesn't want my support anymore that happened that was real so i mean i mean to throw shade at the president here but it was mishandled it should have been acknowledged that it was mishandled all you had to do was do it graham just that which i told multiple people by the way all you had to do was say listen this is the same agency who had the russia hoax this is the same agency who lied about this right robert mueller's agency jim comey's agency it's gonna take us some time to go through all this stuff to make sure innocent people don't get hurt but we hear you i promise you i promise you still i'll get it to you trump has more grace with the american voter than any politician ever they would have believed that would you have been able to string them along for four years no but it would have given you time to go through it he handled that the whole entire administration handled that about the worst you could possibly handle or mishandle a sensitive situation like the epstein files with multiple myriad pitfalls and instead of trying to course correct he fired off that tweet telling everybody and then they you know that we don't want the support so we can't overlook that and then the pivot and i think this is where israel is almost a victim of this the pivot from that moment to now leave me alone i have to deal with iran for israel was just a one two two piece the chain of maga.

[Jack Posobiec]

That was the next month it was.

[Rich Barris]

It was the very next month and so it made it gave certain female podcasters ammunition and it really did and.

[Jack Posobiec]

By the way and say candace and it's candace not not you know you know it's not like the name who can't be said or something but and it wasn't just her there were a lot of people i think in the audience and a lot of people out there regular folks good folks who felt very upset about all of these things said wait a minute this isn't what i voted for this isn't what i came out for in twenty twenty four and it's an example i would say that proves graham's point about how the things people say and the acts that they take can really have an effect on the broader picture and i want to put a pin in that because that's so important have to be very careful about all of.

[Narrator/Announcer]

Season two of unrivaled basketball is here and the talent is unreal the best women's players on the planet are running it back with even bigger moments and bigger stakes don't miss as paige becker snafeeza collier kelsey plumb briana stewart and more take the court and redefine the game this isn't your regular season this is unrivaled where the pace is faster the energy is higher and every athlete shines unrivaled basketball season two sponsored by samsung galaxy tips off january fifth on tnt trutv and.

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[Graham Allen]

Details today you know they talk about influencers these are influencers and they're friends of mine jack where's jack jack who's.

[Jack Posobiec]

Got a great job the other point of contention that beyond that now the files are out but it's it was done in such a way that you know i don't think president trump is going to get credit for releasing these although he does deserve credit and this is something that i will always defend and point out he his administration actually arrested epstein in twenty nineteen that was the original trump administration and yet everybody seems to overlook the fact that donald trump is the one who actually brought epstein to justice and depending on how far you believe on this some people even think it was his administration that.

[Rich Barris]

Killed him right and honestly if you.

[Jack Posobiec]

Follow they did that i'm just saying that you know wouldn't it logically state.

[Rich Barris]

That not too many jack not many people even as private citizens living in that upper class socialite world ever said or did anything to challenge jeffrey epstein no and we're seeing that was literally the only one to say you know what you know we're not doing this you're out of mar a lago because i'm hearing these stories so nobody else.

[Jack Posobiec]

Can say that when you look at donald trump's association with jeffrey epstein he comes out cleaner than anyone else that was involved with this guy come out cleaner than reid hoffman he comes out cleaner than bill gates larry summers he comes out cleaner then of course bill clinton all these people and yes that includes ehud barak who was a prime minister of israel and who was the head of israeli intelligence all of the by the way all of these things are just true they're just true and if we sit there and try to lie about them and say oh you can't talk about that then guess what that's what galvanizes people and it's what gives credence for some people who believe that perhaps you know israel is controlling all of american thought or all of american politics if you sit there and act like that the other piece that i wanted to get into while we're still well i do have you guys is that you know one of these things now as horrific as every epstein's crimes were they were in the past there are victims the victims i believe are getting reconstitution and reparations now from the estate of jeffrey epstein by the way i love to if there was no epstein client list then who's getting all these retribution checks right so clearly some kind of victim list so there is one case though that is currently pending and it's something that really burned me up last week when i saw tyler robinson walk into that courtroom and he started grinning he started smirking he started sharing these little little smiles with his defense attorney that burn me up that really burned me up and this is a real trial that is ongoing there is another hearing that comes up in february i believe there's another one that comes up the actual arraignment still is still pending it's going to be later on in the winter the actual trial may not start for several months but but because there has been so much confusion tension over this issue that i think people have gotten very far away from the actual facts and evidence of the case that show to my mind based on everything that i've looked at that tyler robinson was the one who pulled the trigger murdered our friend.

[Graham Allen]

Charlie no i agree i i mean i i i do agree in that now do i also have questions with all these discord channels and people that had knowledge absolutely but yeah i mean there is more if this was any other thing everybody would be like yeah you know how many times has there.

[Jack Posobiec]

Been a trans shooter that was involved in one of these cases you know a trans shooter at a school nashville minneapolis the trans shooters that we've seen again and again and again and we say yep that was the person but for some reason this one everyone says no no it couldn't possibly be him well not everyone but certain people and.

[Graham Allen]

Again it goes to the discernment of the things that i'm talking about here candace has just as many connections as we do like she can make the same phone calls we can now whether or not they'll pick up the phone these days are different she can have these conversations she could have had a lot of the conversations early on these things could have happened early on but her choosing along with other people choosing to take it immediately to social media to let people who actually don't have any idea what's going on now candace is even alluding to the fact of yeah there are things we don't know because they're not releasing everything that they.

[Jack Posobiec]

Have to us because i would agree with that i would actually agree with that that in these cases and rich i'll bring you in in a second that i would like to see more records videos whatever is out there released publicly in the charlie kirk murder case we know there's more records we know there's more videos out there people are so sick of being of the lack of transparency you want to get it out there and have it known let the public know and rich because you've done and a lot of people don't may not know this that not only do you do public polling for politics you have corporate clients and you that you work for from brand management these types of perspectives but also you do jury polling in various various locales various jurisdictions so on this issue this question of transparency i get that the legal system says we don't want to show any evidence until we get to that trial phase until we get to the probable cause phase however we now live in a twenty four seven information environment where the stuff you see on your phone on these little pieces of glass every day is constant it is a constant barrage of information so my question is it almost seems like the presupposition has changed from you have to wait until trial to oh they're not showing us information they must be hiding something do you get what i'm saying and do you hear that when you talk to prospective jurors i yeah i do.

[Rich Barris]

And i do think that charlie i'll.

[Jack Posobiec]

Actually say it's kind of like we saw the csi effect in the two thousands now i would say we've got the social media effect yeah and it's.

[Rich Barris]

Crime effect yeah and much more amplified and i i think that we will have to find a better way to tackle our authorities and have to find a better way to attack tackle this because you do have podcasters who decide i think i'm going to live stream and investigation and you know in real time and that's what people want they want answers fast the problem is with that jack i mean immediately my major concern was this is going to take it to jury all you all you need is one person who may even look and sit throughout the entire trial and hear the facts hear the evidence and decide that maybe i still believe somebody else is not being held accountable here and they god forbid cast a not guilty verdict i mean this has happened we've seen this happen before in high profile cases look i think charlie's case is a little bit different jack it has to be treated differently people on the state side of this are going to have to come to grips with the appetite prosecution yeah the prosecution side of the state and by the way i would remind people again you know i don't trust the fbi either but guess what the fbi is not prosecuting this case so i hear this repeatedly well why are you taking the fbi's word for why do you believe.

[Jack Posobiec]

The fbi why are you pushing that.

[Rich Barris]

Fed slop why are you pushing the.

[Jack Posobiec]

Fed why are you pushing fed splotch.

[Narrator/Announcer]

Season two of unrivaled basketball is here and the talent is unreal the best women's players on the planet are running it back with even bigger moments and bigger stakes don't miss as paige beckers nafiza collier kelsey plumb brianna stewart and more take the court and redefine the game this isn't your regular season this is unrivaled where the pace is faster the energy is higher and every athlete shines unrivaled basketball season two sponsored by samsung galaxy tips off january fifth on tnt trutv and hbo max support for.

[Public Investing Sponsor]

The show comes from public the investing platform for those who take it seriously on public you can build a multi asset portfolio of stocks bonds options crypto and now generated assets which allow you to turn any idea into an investable index with ai it all starts with your prompt from renewable energy companies with high free cash flow to semiconductor suppliers growing revenue over twenty percent year over year you can literally type any prompt and put the ai to work it screens thousands of stocks builds a one of a kind index and lets you back test it against the s and p five hundred then you can invest in a few clicks generated assets are like efts with infinite possibilities completely customizable and based on your thesis not someone else's go to public dot com podcast and earn an uncapped one percent bonus when you transfer your portfolio that's public dot com podcast paid for by public investing brokerage services by open to the public investing inc member finra sipc advisory services by public advisors llc sec registered advisor generated assets is an interactive analysis tool output is for informational purposes only and is not invested investment recommendation or advice complete disclosures available at public dot com disclosures ever wish you could try.

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[Jack Posobiec]

Today your ticket to big savings is that big blue envelope in your mailbox valpak it's brimming with deals from big name brands and your favorite local spots dining services stuff you're already buying all for less and you could score one hundred dollars or other instant prizes just for opening it or save even faster with mobile coupons you can use right now at valpak dot com valpak there's definitely something in it for you.

[Graham Allen]

And jack where's jack where's jack where is.

[Jack Posobiec]

He jack i want to see you.

[Graham Allen]

You great job jack thank you what.

[Jack Posobiec]

A job you do you know we have an incredible thing we're always talking about the fake news and the bad but we have guys and these are the guys who'd be getting bullishers the.

[Rich Barris]

Fbi is not prosecuting this case this is a state case all right so again i i i don't want to say it's like almost a matter of national security interest but there is he this was the most high profile assassination in our life political assassination you have to share more you have to try to do better i get it so in the future though we do have to on our side of it that's on the state side from our side of it we do have to think about what grant said at the very beginning of this which is we do have a responsibility i mean we can go back to oj there was a witness in the oj case they saw him pull away but by the time the prosecution ever got around to try to use that witness she had been all over the media and all over all these other people who had other theories of the case and her testimony was garbage it was incredible was never admissible in court was never brought up in court so we also have to do better i get everybody's want and desire for information but take that to the proper channels take that to the don't take it to your podcast audience and start talking because you really can.

[Jack Posobiec]

Take the jury and go out so far as to say you know there there are even medical records that potentially could be released sure a lot of people have questions about the list the ballistics in this let's get a ballistics report out you say what was recovered right we know that we can do this and yeah it is morbid for me to be sitting here in amfest and talking about a guy who was my friend and talking about a guy who did get shot in the neck in front of so many people but if there's questions about the ballistics you can release a ballistics report and you can have that out and you can have people say all right this was the bullet that was recovered we have it we have it in custody it's going to be entered in let's just.

[Rich Barris]

Release that turns out bullets do do strange things they do do weird things right because that's a whole other line of questioning people yeah and so but.

[Jack Posobiec]

I mean that would i think i think that sunlight is the best disinfectant here on a lot of this i really do i would also add that beyond that beyond that you mentioned the fbi angle and audio trust the fbi and i said well here's the thing you don't have to rely on the fbi on this that's your hang up because i certainly have questions as well and concerns but it wasn't the fbi who identified tyler robinson tyler robinson was identified after thirty three hours when the local campus police i'm sorry they completely failed that day there's no question the local orem police department was kept at arm's length they weren't allowed to fly their drones and you know who knows what would have happened if they did right i don't like to go down that road because you can't do that in this lifetime but you know who knows but tyler robinson was turned in by his mother father right it was his mom and dad who turned him in and i don't know any mom and dad that are going to pick up their phone and make that phone call if they're not sure that their kid did something wrong because they knew this was a case where the president united states had said i want the death penalty and you're going to turn your son over and my boys are here today i can't even imagine it's an incredible decision it actually speaks to the goodness of heartland america and the goodness of christian american fathers and mothers that they were able to do that and i think it's totally overlooked and overshadowed and oh by the way those parents did come to that courtroom where he was smiling and laughing in the navy we would say coconut joking i don't know if you guys say that in the army you say coconut joking.

[Rich Barris]

No it must be a navy that's.

[Jack Posobiec]

The navy say okay but yeah all right all right all right but you know it's a it's a squibby thing us would say it but at no point during that hearing did the mother or father go over and the media was all there brian anton was there from news nation i think he's a good guy at no point did they walk over and say hey you need to tell the truth because my son didn't do this they were there for hours hours and hours and hours and you don't see a single family member coming out and look i'm not saying that's dispositive but i am saying there's a dog that's not barking here the.

[Rich Barris]

New york times just did an article.

[Jack Posobiec]

Washington post washington post washington post hey at the friends they interviewed the friends.

[Rich Barris]

But they did and as it turns out this is a major lost opportunity for us to talk about political violence in the wake of charlie's assassination we conducted a large study that got no attention at all with the exception of a couple of times you and i discussed it right when we mentioned the transgender angle before we went into all of this and now i'll just end up wind up putting it out for everybody to see jack but there's something very real there and i think the one thing that my myself that i want to know most of all is what grant said what about those discord mess i just did this research i know now how much more likely these subgroup demographic groups trans right how much more likely they are to accept acts of political violence because they themselves feel like they're in danger of something so they don't view words and violence any differently they they don't distinguish the two so i want to know what was said in those text messages actually in.

[Jack Posobiec]

Those i got it on that full credit doctor chloe carmichael she's absolutely brilliant on this she said her theory is having listed a clinical psychologist your theory was you know how they do the etchings into the bullets of the words think of it the combining of words and violence so what they've done because they view charlie's words as violence directed at them what did they do they create we saw maggione wrote into the bullets the anti ice shooter down in dallas wrote into the bullets tyler rittenhouse wrote on the bullets what have they done pathology it's a pathology where they make literal violent words violent words so graham talk to us about the danger of missing this rise of political violence.

[Graham Allen]

Well the first thing i want to i want to add to everything that you guys and so what i would say is this i think that we live in a world where social media works faster than the justice system and again i think that we as commentators all of us myself included i had this conversation with the vice president probably a week and a half ago we did a bad job and we have continued to do a bad job in letting the american people think that once we won that election that within ninety days everything was just going to be fine and everything was going to be great and now we have a situation the most high profile political assassination of our generation where i think that people believe that because we have social media that in their homes they should have every piece of evidence and every piece of everything in this case immediately right now and that's that's just not the way that it works now granted are there some exceptions for some releases to calm heated things down because of high profileness sure but the vast majority of evidence data all this other kind of stuff that's not the normal way that it happens and and this is by.

[Jack Posobiec]

The way this is what you're talking about is that disconnect that rich was saying that people's perceptions have been so changed by as you say by that social media environment by true crime podcast by all of these things that there's a difference of expectation and when people's expectations aren't met that's when you like relationships as well right when your expectations aren't met that's what leads to anger.

[Graham Allen]

Disappointment dissension correct and because of that it is now taking away from us having the real conversation to your point which is the rise in political violence which is the reality that those of us that do this for a living our overhead cost just went up five x because we all have to figure out like okay i want to go out and do this speaking event do i have to pay a million dollars a year for security and all these things just to have conversations it is a terrible place that we're finding ourselves.

[Jack Posobiec]

Which is what they which is what.

[Graham Allen]

They want which is what they want and and off put a time for an applause there but either way that's what they want and it's because of we have not done a we have not done a proper job of letting the american people know hey i've seen this a lot to the point about the feds in our administration oh we just trust the administration now oh we just trust the feds now we just do this and we do that well we did when we voted for donald trump in november november fifth of twenty twenty four we all agree that charlie kirk was a once in a lifetime leader brilliant christ driven human being that was responsible for probably ninety percent of the people that are in these positions now and so you can't hold two two positions to where you believe that charlie kirk was a once in a generation leader of our movement of our party of people of americans of young voters and then also believe that he had the worst discernment and judge of character of any human being that has ever walked no and i'll let the.

[Jack Posobiec]

Discernment too because there were people right and by the way i'm perfectly happy to follow the evidence wherever the evidence lies and that's what charlie was about standing on truth you have to always stand on truth and i'm not afraid to call out and say i talked about the uss liberty yesterday i'm not afraid to talk about israel i'm not afraid to say that i don't agree with everything the government of israel does you could talk about gaza we could talk about all those things but but do so with evidence do so with truth i've talked many times about how i think that the that the government of israel in their conduct of the war in gaza did not do a good enough job of protecting churches of protecting christians and places of worship that are located within gaza i really believe that that's a huge problem and has created bigger problems from that for them that being said there were people who said that charlie was killed by israel while before his body even made it to the hospital that is not standing on evidence that is taking something that is a preconceived notion a preconceived bias that you are trying to put and paint on your situation because it's pushing an agenda.

[Narrator/Announcer]

Season two of unrivaled basketball is here and the talent is unreal paige beckers nafiza collier kelsey plumb brianna stewart and more are back to redefine the game unrivaled basketball season two sponsored by samsung galaxy tips off january fifth on tnt trutv and hbo max support.

[Public Investing Sponsor]

For the show comes from public the investing platform for those who take it seriously on public you can build a multi asset portfolio of stocks bonds options crypto and now generated assets which allow you to turn any idea into an investable index with ai it all starts with your prompt from renewable energy companies with high free cash flow to semiconductor suppliers growing revenue over twenty percent year over year you can literally type any prompt and put the ai to work it screens thousands of stocks builds a one of a kind index and lets you back test it against the s and p five hundred then you can invest in a few clicks generated assets are like efts with infinite possibilities completely customizable and based on your thesis not someone else's go to public dot com podcast and earn an uncapped one percent bonus when you try transfer your portfolio that's public dot com podcast paid for by public investing brokerage services by open to the public investing inc member finra sipc advisory services by public advisors llc sec registered advisor generated assets is an interactive analysis tool output is for informational purposes only and is not investment recommendation or advice complete disclosures available at public dot com disclosures a new year is.

[Washington Post Sponsor]

On the horizon and your twenty twenty six savings start here right now you can access the washington post for just two dollars every four weeks head into the new year with six months of savings at the special intro rate after that it'll cost twelve dollars every four weeks cancel anytime you'll get unlimited access to trusted journalism that helps you understand the year ahead and the world around you now's the perfect time to subscribe because great habits and great savings start together go to washingtonpost dot com iheart that's washingtonpost dot com iheart and start your year informed with the post the.

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[Valpak Sponsor]

It'S the most wonderful time of the year and valpak is here to make it even better this month as you sip through holiday mail don't miss the blue valpak envelope from dining to holiday shopping there's a sleigh full of savings in your mailbox plus a chance to instantly win dollar one hundred that's right you can find dollar one hundred christmas cash inside want to save even more money on what you love go to valve valpak dot com for local coupons and offers it pays to open valpak no purchase necessary for instant win voip we're prohibited prices are randomly inserted see specially marked valpak envelopes for details.

[Jack Posobiec]

Jack is a great guy he's written a fantastic book everybody's talking about it go get it and he's been my friend.

[Graham Allen]

Right from the beginning of this whole.

[Jack Posobiec]

Beautiful event and we're going to turn.

[Graham Allen]

It around and make our country you.

[Jack Posobiec]

Amen and that's not right and also that is not right can i just.

[Rich Barris]

Add something to that jack and then doing that and sharing personal messages you may have like all this i haven't.

[Jack Posobiec]

Shared that we've seen i haven't shared a single personal message between myself and charlie and you're not going to see me do that never doing that you're just not going to see me do that thank you that's that's when i if he sent me something in private then that was meant in private to get these between and confidence is up.

[Rich Barris]

You keep going you're violating this man's privacy posthumous it makes i i it's it bothered me bad i haven't actually said that out loud so right now.

[Jack Posobiec]

But it's it's it's actually let's not.

[Rich Barris]

Do that to make our own points.

[Jack Posobiec]

I will say this i will say this i try to have grace because i know there's a lot of people that are going through trauma that went through trauma in those early days who were literally had their whole life turned upside down not just obviously you know the business colleagues and friends but let's try to remember that at the end of the day this isn't about how it affects political movement it isn't how it affects a podcast career are you getting more followers subscribers whatever erica and those children are not are his family they're not going to have a father that's home for this christmas or any christmas coming forward and we should respect them and think about what is best the best way to respect them in everything that we do because that to me is way more important than scoring some political points or getting more viewers on my podcast or or whatever it is and you know if people want to get mad at me for saying that then let them get mad because i know what i'm saying is right.

[Rich Barris]

No it is it's one it's one hundred there's a human side of this story it's not just a political story or a story about a movement and factions and there's a human being who had a family and children and you just said it and i just think put yourself in someone else's shoes for a moment i don't think i'd want my kids reading that years later you know just have a little bit it just has always bothered me just to be able to know look i had this message and i had it's crazy it's unseemly now what i'd like to.

[Jack Posobiec]

I mean and i said this before but you know i feel obviously horrible that the charlie's kids are never going to be able to really have that relationship with their dad but in a sense too they're going to have a relationship with sort of the the their digital father right like his digital footprint gets his videos his speeches his debates and and that was his public work but that wasn't charlie you know what i mean like that wasn't charlie the man that wasn't charlie the father the husband and obviously you know he put his heart in his work there's no question about that but you know and and i've got my little kids and and you know i just hope that that someday if they ever want to you know more than happy to just answer every question they want i'll let them know hey i knew your dad this is what he was like outside of the podcast outside of the text messages outside of all that nonsense this is what he really was like this is what really drove him and this is who your dad was and you know when when you have when you have one of your battle buddies go down like that you know there's there isn't really a playbook for that there isn't really a a manual but you just try to do the right thing by his family i think just do the right thing by his family yeah.

[Rich Barris]

I couldn't agree more and you will be there jack i mean that's great you know again you see it a lot a lot more different than i guess some of the other people have chose to make this play out publicly and in front of everybody you know so in the future i asked grammy what could we do better not to steal your i'm just like wondering your thoughts here what could we do better do we as podcasters need to start growing more like the and i don't mean this in that way but in the traditional media do we need our own version of an ap handbook well.

[Graham Allen]

I mean we have to decide why why are we doing what we do now in the first place are we doing what we do now because we want to make money we're doing what we do now because we want to be the most popular one are we doing what we want to do now because we believe that we have influence and because we have influence we should be using that to our agendas and what we think and you know and i think there's a lot of people right now i've heard it on the stage by a lot of really big name people i think i feel i you know i think i feel i've heard it over and over and over and over again these past two days i don't care what you think and what you feel i care about what's true and what's not true and what i know that is true right now is that if we don't figure out this infighting that we've got going on right now we're not going to do well in these midterms and charlie would be the first one to be getting a hold of that charlie kirk would have called a massive meeting of the minds right here in phoenix and he would have had everybody fly in he would have been like all right we are in trouble in these midterms terms if we don't figure this out it is on us to lead people in the right direction for mission first how do we figure out how to all come together even though we're not going.

[Jack Posobiec]

To agree on everything if charlie's not going to be here then it's really as simple as that let's do that in charlie's name let's do it for charlie remember what the mission is and remember that we are more there is more that unites us than divides us there is more that we understand our patriotism our love of god our love of jesus this these are the things that unite us and while there will be divisions though there will be issues where we disagree we can do that in such a way where we maintain that grace but we also don't lose sight of what the greater mission is graham allen where can people go follow.

[Graham Allen]

You brother just google graham allen it's either good or really bad and you'll you'll find it on there so rich.

[Jack Posobiec]

Barris people's fund it yeah we're all.

[Rich Barris]

Over the place jack you know on get her on twitter the best places on locals peoplespundent dot locals dot com pundit locals dot com all right folks.

[Jack Posobiec]

Follow me at human events daily is the show every day jack posobic and i'll be on stage here just a couple hours thank you so much for this live special edition of human events am fest rumble special ladies and gentlemen as always you have my permission belaya shore let's make them wonder let's squeeze them for a change instead of them constantly squeezing us and then finally we rally around president trump we surround him.

[Graham Allen]

With support the radical left knows exactly.

[Jack Posobiec]

What they're doing they want to steal the election.

[Graham Allen]

We'Re going to walk down.

[Jack Posobiec]

Pennsylvania avenue avenue to peacefully and patriotically make your voices heard events in washington.

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Have taken a violent and tumultuous turn.

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January sixth wasn't just a moment in history for thousands of americans it was the moment their voices were taken it's.

[Jack Posobiec]

Insurrection they were persecuted hunted seditious conspiracy.

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But behind prison walls something unexpected happened.

[Jack Posobiec]

They found their voice again started singing.

[Graham Allen]

A national anthem we took it up.

[Rich Barris]

To him and marlowe lot he goes.

[Graham Allen]

I'Ll put my voice on it our supporters made this go platinum real america's.

[Jack Posobiec]

Voice is telling the real story of.

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I take responsibility this is the story they lived government entrapment scheme that this actually was the j six patriots are no longer staying silent they are still.

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They are standing and they are telling.

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Can'T beat us they tried to silence them instead they woke up an entire.

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[Narrator/Announcer]

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