SECURING AMERICA WITH FRANK GAFFNEY - JAN. 17th, 2026

Summary

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SECURING AMERICA WITH FRANK GAFFNEY — January 17, 2026

Podcast: Real America’s Voice / iHeartPodcasts
Host: Frank Gaffney

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EPISODE OVERVIEW

This episode of "Securing America" with Frank Gaffney is a substantive deep-dive into pressing geopolitical, security, and cultural concerns affecting the United States and its allies. The episode primarily addresses the crisis in Iran, threats to minority populations in Syria, the shifting landscape with China under Xi Jinping, the US government’s approach to groups like the Muslim Brotherhood, and the risks posed by foreign (especially Chinese) acquisition of US land near sensitive military installations. Gaffney brings on seasoned experts — Dr. David Wormser (Middle East analyst), Shadi Kalul (Israeli Christian Aramaic NGO leader), Gordon Chang (China analyst), and George Raceley (Conservative HQ) — to discuss these multifaceted challenges and the US's responses.

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KEY DISCUSSION POINTS & INSIGHTS

1. Iran's Uprising and America’s Role

[02:06–12:05]

• Frank Gaffney introduces the dire situation in Iran, where mass protests against the regime have led to violent repression. He expresses disappointment in the reluctance of the US to decisively support the protesters despite previous promises.

• Dr. David Wormser provides deep background and analysis:

  • The recent Iranian uprising had unprecedented energy, partly supported by pronouncements from President Trump, but ultimately was met with overwhelming lethal force from the regime.
  • Wormser laments the missed strategic opportunity:

    “We had the Iranian street worth 10,000 bombs able to help us here bring down the regime...and unfortunately...the Iranian street has literally been slaughtered into submission.” (04:32)

  • With the protests crushed, the regime will likely exercise further behind-the-scenes brutality, conducting executions after the spotlight fades.
  • Strategic danger remains: The moment for leveraging domestic unrest as a strategic US asset has passed, and other actors (the US or Israel) may soon face hard choices about acting against Iran’s emboldened regime.

• Gaffney raises the danger of quiet, ongoing repression:

  “Is it likely that the regime will quietly be going about murdering those who were in the street...in a way that is not as visible?” (08:36)

• Wormser affirms:

  “Exactly. They have it in their interest...to slaughter the people who are arrested. And there’s over 20,000 people arrested.” (09:06)

Memorable Quote

"The silence of the grave is descending on the streets of Tehran, and that was one of the biggest assets the United States had here."
— Dr. David Wormser (04:24)

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2. Minority Communities in Syria—Facing Genocide

[14:24–24:03]

• Frank Gaffney highlights targeted violence by the Syrian government (and aligned jihadist elements) against ancient ethnic and religious minorities—Kurds, Druze, Alawites, Yazidis, and Christians.

• Shadi Kalul (Israeli Christian leader) gives a firsthand account:

  • Historical native groups like Aramaic Christians are “in the crosshairs,” with little real voice in international policy discussions.
  • Reports of Aleppo’s evacuation ahead of mass violence by Assad-aligned forces are credible. The brutality is likened to ISIS's past atrocities, emphasizing continuity of violent Sharia-centric ideology.
  • Kalul calls the violence explicitly “genocidal,” refuting government narratives that blame only terrorist groups.
  • Policy recommendation:

    "You don't have to impose... a central government, but have a different system to rule this region—with federations in Syria and Lebanon... Not central government and don’t require these groups to disarm as long as they are being threatened." (23:27–24:00)

Notable Quote

“It just remind[s] me about 10 years ago...how they treated Yazidis and Christians by actually ISIS back then. It's the same ISIS attitudes, ISIS mentality. Nothing changed.”
— Shadi Kalul (19:45)

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3. China’s Weakness as a Source of Danger

[26:04–37:26]

• Gordon Chang (China analyst) is brought on to address the nature of the Chinese threat:
  • Consequences of US pressure: Despite belligerent propaganda, China has not responded with concrete actions against recent US moves.
  • China’s internal instability:
    • Military purges and infighting indicate deep dysfunction.
    • Economic distress is worsening, with declining growth and spiraling debt.
    • Xi Jinping’s control over the military is tenuous, making large-scale offensive operations (like an invasion of Taiwan) unlikely as a matter of deliberate policy—but miscalculation is a serious risk.
  • Chang warns: The danger comes not from China’s strength but from its instability and the risk that Xi will “blunder” into war to shore up his position.
  • US vulnerabilities:
    • US failure to weed out Chinese operatives on home soil increases internal risks.
    • Policy uncertainty about South Korea’s reliability as an ally.
    • US military planning is lagging behind the pace and readiness required for a potential conflict.

Memorable Quote

“China is a big threat, but not because it's strong, but because it is weak... the danger of war in East Asia with China is really high, but it's not high because China is going ... to launch an invasion ... Xi Jinping can blunder into a war and probably will.”
— Gordon Chang (27:49)

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4. Muslim Brotherhood and Islamist Networks in the US

[39:38–45:07]

• George Raceley (Conservative HQ) discusses the government’s recent partial designation of Muslim Brotherhood foreign chapters as terrorist organizations.

  • Critiques the US for stopping short of designating domestic Brotherhood chapters and the broader “Mother Movement,” which allows networks to persist and potentially pivot from subversive activities to violent jihad at any time.
  • External lobbies (notably, Qatar and Turkey) and elements within the intelligence community are blamed for hamstringing more comprehensive action.
  • Key concern:

    "We have to recognize that these so-called chapters...are decentralized, diffuse terrorist cells. They operate both to encourage violent jihad attacks in this country and also subversion." (41:21)

• Gaffney underscores the doctrinal risk:

  “When they see the enemy... exhibiting a kind of weakness or lack of resolve... that only... feeds into a doctrinal direction under Sharia to redouble the effort, as they say, to make them feel subdued.” (42:42)

Notable Quote

"The real problem we have here is the lobbying of gutter [Qatar], Turkey, longstanding interests within the deep state...that have waived the president off of this."
— George Raceley (43:30)

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5. Chinese Land Ownership Near US Military Installations

[49:34–52:16]

• Gaffney and Raceley discuss investigative reports revealing Chinese-owned land near Barksdale Air Force Base (home to a critical nuclear command).
  • This is presented as part of a countrywide pattern of China buying properties near sensitive US infrastructure.
  • Raceley criticizes gaps in federal policy, noting that the Treasury-led Committee on Foreign Investment in the United States (CFIUS) prioritizes economic over security interests, leading to risky oversight failures.
  • State-level efforts (like Florida's restrictions) are highlighted, but a call is made for robust federal action.
  • Key Point:

    "Obvious idea of a Chinese intelligence operator owning huge swathes of property around Barksdale Air Force Base somehow doesn't get up the food chain to a...prior restraint type of situation. That's why it ends up in the courts." (51:41)

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TIMESTAMPS FOR IMPORTANT SEGMENTS

• 02:06–12:05 — Iran protests, regime crackdown, US & Israeli strategy (Gaffney/Wormser)
• 14:24–24:03 — Syrian minorities under threat, calls for new policy approach (Gaffney/Kalul)
• 26:04–37:26 — China’s internal instability and international risk profile (Gaffney/Chang)
• 39:38–45:07 — Muslim Brotherhood designation and domestic subversion (Gaffney/Raceley)
• 49:34–52:16 — Chinese land purchases near sensitive military sites and implications (Gaffney/Raceley)

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MEMORABLE QUOTES & MOMENTS

• Wormser (on Iran’s missed opportunity):

  “We had the Iranian street worth 10,000 bombs... Unfortunately... we've lost such a major opportunity.” (04:32)

• Kalul (on the threat in Syria):

  “It’s the same ISIS attitudes, ISIS mentality. Nothing changed. That's their ideology... against anyone who is not a Muslim.” (19:45–20:30)

• Chang (on China’s weakness):

  “China is a big threat, but not because it's strong, but because it is weak.” (27:49)

• Raceley (on the Muslim Brotherhood):

  “These are decentralized, diffuse terrorist cells... very adept at switching back and forth between violent jihad and subversion.” (41:19–41:21)

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CONCLUSION

The episode paints a picture of a world in flux and under threat: democratic uprisings crushed, ancient minorities targeted, great power rivals destabilized by their own rot, and hostile networks operating with relative impunity inside America. The throughline is a call for the US to adopt a stronger, more strategically coherent response—whether confronting Iran’s regime, defending minorities in the Middle East, preparing for Chinese destabilization, or rooting out domestic extremist networks. Gaffney and his guests urge vigilance and a restoration of "peace through strength" for the challenges ahead.

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Transcript

[Frank Gaffney]

This is an iHeart podcast.

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[Frank Gaffney (Host)]

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[Frank Gaffney (Host)]

Quest is a free to play social casino void where prohibited. Visit spinquest.com for more details. Welcome to Securing America with me, Frank Gaffney. The program that's a kind of owner's manual for protecting the country we love against all enemies, foreign and domestic to the global glory of God in our kingdom. I want to talk to you first about a very important development in the Middle east, and here's my thoughts on it. The fate of Iran's despotic regime appears to be hanging in the balance. The country's population, after almost five decades of repression, privation and Sharia indoctrination, are in the streets risking life and limb to demand the mullah's overthrow. Thousands have been shot dead where they were demonstrating. Others who were wounded were subsequently executed. To his credit, President Trump has repeatedly expressed solidarity with those seeking freedom, encouraging them to keep protesting and promising help to those subjected to murderous attacks by Iranian and imported jihadists. On Wednesday, however, the president declared that such attacks had replaced, reportedly been suspended. While he expressed some uncertainty about the accuracy of such claims, the implication was that the promise of US Military action on behalf of the protesters would be suspended as well. America must help the Iranian people prevail, not abandon them yet again. Let's hear what our colleague and friend David Wormser thinks about all of this. He's followed this subject closely for decades and we value his insights tremendously. David, welcome back to Securing America. We're going to use some of your comments for a webinar on the subject today at 1pm Eastern time. Over to you, sir.

[Dr. David Wormser]

It's slightly discouraging because the United States, I think, did encourage a bit these demonstrations. They were obviously the Iranians were motivated by themselves, their condition, their hope, their. Their despair. But this time they got a tailwind from the United States rather than the headwind that the United States has traditionally presented these freedom seekers in Iran. And this time they really took it to heart. And I think there's a sense of disappointment in Iran because they feel that the moment is being lost. Literally the silence of the grave is descending on the streets of Tehran, and that was one of the biggest assets the United States had here. This was not only a humanitarian gesture that President Trump was indicating. This was actually a potential solution to one of the gravest strategic problems the United States and the west has faced for 50 years, which is the Iranian regime and the specter that it's haunting, specter that it's represented in international politics ever since, with a lot of death and a lot of damage done by them along the way. This was a real opportunity, and unfortunately, I don't think it's gone. I think President Trump intends to do what he needs to do. The problem is we had the Iranian street worth 10,000 bombs able to help us here bring down the regime. We had people on the ground, namely the Iranian people on the ground who are willing to do heavy lifting to move it. And any action by the United States in the last two weeks would have resulted, in my view, to an electrification of an already dangerous, dangerous for the regime uprising that the Iranian people had. Unfortunately, when we circle back, even if it's in 48 hours, a week or two, unfortunately, I think the Iranian street has literally been slaughtered into submission at this point, and they can't, and they won't be there as our strategic asset. They'll be sympathetic, but they're really bleeding into submission. So we will have to do this or Israel will have to do this. Somebody will have to do this eventually and soon because Iran will now be emboldened and, and it will seek weapons again. It simply will do what it needs to do in order to threaten the West. And as a result, we're going to have to go back and do it, whether it's Israel, the United States or so forth. But this time, unfortunately, we've lost such a major opportunity and strategic asset with the Iranian street.

[Frank Gaffney (Host)]

So, David, is your view that the street is now, in fact, vacated and that the people there, as you say, have been murderously assaulted to the point where they're not willing to be in the street at this point?

[Dr. David Wormser]

I think that it is going to quiet down now somewhat. There's now there's some cities that are still under the control of the uprising, and that's going to be a bloody situation, and that's going to be somewhat of a problem. But by and large, in most of the cities, Tehran especially, and so forth, you're going to see a deadly quiet descend. It's simply they feel they're alone now. They can't do it alone anymore. There's no point to throwing another 5,000, you know, 10, 15, 20,000 people in five, six days have been slaughtered. They can't go out to the street and every day lose another 2 to 5,000 people without any hope that they'll get anywhere. It's really demoralizing. So I think that is quieted down now. If President Trump gets out there and he says, listen, they promise that they will not attack any demonstrators, and the demonstrators test it and go out there and show up to see if they'll do something, then the regime is maybe in a, in kind of a problem where either they let the demonstrations go on, but then they'll start growing again because they're not responding, or, or they respond and then Trump says, you're killing the demonstrators again. But I actually think that we're not in that sort of a situation. I think we're now sort of a resolution in a negative way, namely that the street really has now been slaughtered into silence.

[Frank Gaffney (Host)]

And, David, as you look at this sort of status quo, shall we say, is it likely that the regime will quietly be going about murdering those who were in the street, even if they're no longer out there, and therefore essentially defying Trump, but doing it in a way that is not as visible as in the demonstrations when they were murdering them en masse?

[Dr. David Wormser]

Exactly. What will happen is they are a regime that relies on the image of omnipotence, brutality to survive. So they have it in their interest, and they know it's in their interest. And it's really the currency of regime rule for them is to slaughter the people who are arrested. And there's over 20,000 people arrested. They said that they would execute them. Now, my bet is they'll have show trials. And the show trials will take half a year, a quarter year, half a year. They're going to let this die down. We when the whole crisis is gone, and then they're going to execute people in large numbers. We have to remember, before this uprising took place, Iran had executed over 2,000 people, political prisoners, essentially, over the last year. This is a murderous regime. This is now going to do it again on steroids. But they're going to do it carefully, they're going to do it quietly, and they're going to do it waiting probably a few weeks so President Trump can say, listen, they're going to try to play him against himself. They're going to basically give him what he needs to say, listen, I stopped the killing, I stopped the executions. The Iranian regime has understood I'm serious, and they're backing down and we can move to a deal. But the Iranians then will try to trap the him in that process again, which will allow them to go return building their weapons and killing people.

[Frank Gaffney (Host)]

Yeah. And this is not your speculation. This is the playbook that the Iranian regime, and for that matter, you know, Sharia supremacists practice all the time. We're seeing it in Gaza as well, are we not?

[Dr. David Wormser]

Correct.

[Frank Gaffney]

Correct.

[Frank Gaffney (Host)]

And, David, just to go back to something you said earlier, you said that Israel is going to have to do it or we are going to have to do it. What is the it that you are referring to in that connection?

[Dr. David Wormser]

Well, the Israelis have to deal with the weapons issues again. I mean, the missiles are being built at a pace greater than before the war in June. The launchers are being rebuilt. Slower pace, but they're being rebuilt. And Iran is sending a lot of equipment to the Houthis. Hezbollah has resumed its rearming. In other words, Israel is now in a countdown for another October 7th with Iran, another June. And so they're going to have to act and they're reaching the red line fairly soon in terms of missiles. The Iranians are also working on making chemical warheads on those missiles, according to several reports.

[Frank Gaffney (Host)]

We have to leave it at that. David Wernzer, God bless you. Keep up the great work. Report back soon. So we'll be right back folks. Stay tuned.

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[Frank Gaffney]

Foreign.

[Frank Gaffney (Host)]

We're back and a very important conversation is in the offing. We're going to be speaking with men I've come to know a little bit in recent months because he is very much in the forefront of the effort to call attention to what is happening in Syria that is imperiling essentially all of the minority communities that have resided there in some cases for thousands of years. The Kurds, the Druze, the Alawites, the Yazidis, not least the Christians, in communities that are now increasingly imperiled and not just by random jihadist elements, but by the government of this Ahmed Al Shara itself. And what we are confronting as a nation is are we enabling what might well be genocide at that government's hands? To talk about all of this, we have Shadi Kalul. He is the president of the Israeli Christian Aramaic Non Governmental Organization. He's a former Israel Defense Forces Christian officer and a freedom fighter who we're very pleased to have met through our mutual friend and colleague from whom we were just hearing, Dr. David Wormser, who spent some time with Shadi and his community and others in the northern areas of Israel learning about what's happening across the border in Syria. Shadi, thank you so much for finding some time for us to give us an update on what is happening in that long suffering country to these communities that are now quite literally in the crosshairs of Al Sharra's forces.

[Shadi Kalul]

Thank you so much for having me and I am happy to be with you and with your audience.

[Frank Gaffney (Host)]

Well, great. Let me start by just asking you, Dr. Wormser, I think in your company for some period in his previous trip. He's just returned now, as you probably know, came away from conversations with people on both sides of the border that something has changed in the attitude of these jihadis towards these minorities, that the kind of tolerance that ostensibly they were to show to at least the people of the book, the guise of dimitude is now over the side and everybody else is just clearly facing the worst of the mistreatment that they can dish out, which oftentimes is genocidal. Is that correct? Is that what's happening in Syria at the moment, genocidal attacks on these minority populations, Sir?

[Shadi Kalul]

Unfortunately, I would say, friends, that we are facing here, historical changes in front of our eyes happening in Syria and threatening actually those that people call minorities are ethnic groups, historical ancient ethnic groups, the natives of the land, like specifically the Christians who are Aramaic people used to live there even before there was Christianity. They adopted Christianity and from the first followers of Jesus, as you know, St. Paul, who came to Syria to that region, and we kept being there in this region. As a Christian, I am speaking on behalf of my people in this region. They have no voice. And I want to thank you for allowing me to be with you and having a voice for them. And maybe this will help saving them and bringing a better resilience for them and bringing hope for them to stay there and testify for our faith and our Lord Jesus in the land. So what the minority, I pray that is so.

[Frank Gaffney (Host)]

Let me just press you on this one point, sir, if I may. As we speak, there are reports of the city of Aleppo being emptied out in the face of what are now seen to be government forces preparing to attack and perhaps engage in mass murder. There is that again what you understand is happening. We've been told to this point that no, no, it's not the government's forces that are, you know, engaged in this kind of thing. It's various terrorist groups and so on. What's the ground truth on that, Scorser?

[Shadi Kalul]

It was the clashes between HDS forces, which is government forces, of Syrian government forces with the help of Turkish forces and against the sdf, which is Kurdish forces. Now in these clashes also like innocent people were hold in between those clashes and many flee and many left because of genocidal action that hts, the government forces did against them. And we saw like some Kurdish ladies that were caught by HTS and they treated brutally by those jihadist groups that belong to the government. So we saw the images and the videos of these poor ladies, how they were treated. And really it just remind me about 10 years ago and 12 years ago how they treated Yazidis and Christians by actually isis. Back then, it's the same ISIS attitudes, ISIS mentality. Nothing changed. That's their ideology. This is hts, the JALANI forces. So don't like be misled or deceived by those groups or HTS being government groups. It's all jihadi groups. Nothing changed. The attitude, the behavior, the brutality, the ideology, the superiority that the Islam should actually dominate this land and prevail in the entire world. That's the ideology. Nothing changes against Israel. It's against anyone who is not a Muslim. Include Christian, Jews, Yazidis, whoever. You just name it. So that's what's happening.

[Frank Gaffney (Host)]

So this ideology has a name. I believe we, we think the best name for it is Sharia. Would you agree?

[Shadi Kalul]

It's Sharia law. It's Islam. It's Islam. Okay. Islam is not okay. There are, there is Islam. It's ideology. It's a political, actually ideology and it's political Islam. Now we are talking about Muslim, moderate Muslims, which is different than Islam. They choose to take what is moderate and behave as moderate Muslims. But Islam by itself, it's very clear what they should do to Christian and Jews. So let's not deceive ourselves, first of all.

[Frank Gaffney (Host)]

And they are, we're almost out of time, Shadi. I, I just want to come back to this point. I, I call it Sharia because I think that's clearly political in character. It is a political ideology, totalitarian and so on. But let me ask you this. The government of the United States at the moment is still on the side of this Al Jelani character. Al Shirah, what should our policy be as you see it, with respect to Syria and him specifically?

[Shadi Kalul]

Sir, I, I see Syria, Lebanon, Iraq, all these regions, specifically Lebanon and Syria as two places where there are so many ethnic and religious groups in this region. There are the Christians, the Maronite, Aramaic population, the Kurdish.

[Frank Gaffney]

I understand.

[Frank Gaffney (Host)]

But just to the question, sir, what should we be doing?

[Shadi Kalul]

What should be done is exactly what you have in the United States federal government. You don't have to impose on those guys, on those groups, a central government, but have a different system to rule this region with the federal government and federations in Syria and federations in Lebanon and all are united under federal government.

[Frank Gaffney (Host)]

Not central government and don't require these groups to disarm as long as they are being threatened by that.

[Shadi Kalul]

Exactly. When you have a federal government, they have police forces.

[Frank Gaffney (Host)]

Saudi I apologize I have to cut you off. We are out of time. Come back to us soon with updates. Thank you for the work you do. Thank you in Israel at the moment. God bless you. Thanks to all of you for staying with us for an important message. And then our next segment. Be right back. Foreign.

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[Frank Gaffney (Host)]

Social casino void where prohibited. Visit spinquest.com for more details. We're back and what a delight to say we are joined by a dear friend and very valued colleague. His name is Gordon G. Chang. He is a man to be followed, as I do at Gordon G. Chang on Twitter on X. But he is also a Senior Fellow of the Gatestone Institute, a Newsweek columnist, and among other books, he is the author of Plan Red China's Plan to Destroy America. We value his visits with us always, but especially at a time such as this, when the United States seems to be increasingly under President Trump, acting in ways that are, well, shall we say, pushing back on Communist China. And I wanted to get Gordon's take on this. We did a webinar on it last week, Gordon, that I found fascinating, in which many of us who had come to the conclusion that the President was kind of, shall we say, if not actually appeasing the Chinese, at least cutting them a lot of slack in the interest of getting this so called trade truce and the rare earth minerals and medicines and so on that we rely on from China to continue to flow here. It doesn't seem as that's as though that's the program at the moment, however, thank God. I'd be interested in your take on how the Chinese Communist Party is responding, sir.

[Frank Gaffney]

We have seen that the Communist Party has engaged in malicious information warfare against the United States after President Trump extracted Maduro and his wife from Venezuela. And we're seeing a lot of malicious propaganda as we are pressuring Iran because Iran is killing protesters in the thousands of. President Trump has threatened military action. But what we haven't seen, Frank, is we haven't seen China take practical actions to oppose the United States. And this shows that China is not nearly as strong as everyone thought. Go to the beginning of this month and everyone says, oh, you know, China is big threat. Well, China is a big threat, but not because it's strong, but because it is weak. And let me just lay this out if I can, please. I think that the danger of war in East Asia with China is really high, but it's not high because China is going with malice aforethought to launch an invasion against Taiwan or Japan or the Philippines. I think it's high because Xi Jinping can blunder into a war and probably will. You know, we look at, for instance, China's just failure to do anything effective against the US this month, and it shows you that China is in disarray. Its military is fighting among themselves. We're seeing purge after purge. This has gone on now at a high level for about two and a half years, and it doesn't seem to be slowing down, which means that generals and admirals are more concerned about what they're doing inside of China than opposed to the United States. But we're also seeing the Chinese people are really unhappy right now. The economy is perhaps contracting, certainly not growing at the robust pace that everyone says, and certainly it's not growing at a fast enough to retire the debt that it must now deal with. So you see China right now just a country in turmoil, and that means that it is not in any position to, for instance, start hostilities with an invasion of the main island of Taiwan. For one other reason that I just haven't mentioned yet is that Xi Jinping doesn't trust any general or admiral with almost complete control of the Chinese military, which is what would be necessary for a combined air, land, sea operation, which, by the way, China, in its thousands of years of history has never done so even in the best of times. Xi Jinping is not going to give some flag officer that power, making him or her. Well, actually they're no hers, making him the most powerful figure in China. But the problem is that Xi Jinping is creating provocations in an arc from South Korea in the north to India in the south. And one of those that they spiral out of control. Xi Jinping can't deal constructively with the international community. He can't de escalate, which means that war, I think, is pretty probable, but it is not going to start in way that we all thought it would. But I do believe that conflict is something that we've got to be much more concerned about than we are right now.

[Frank Gaffney (Host)]

So let me make sure I got this right. Your view is that the Chinese have not responded to various steps that President Trump has been taking that are clearly compounding the kinds of problems that you've just described that she is having at home. And because of his weakness and the need to, perhaps, as tyrants often do, get everybody to focus on something else besides their unhappiness with the ruler, might plunge their nation into war with the United States, among others. And therefore, we have to be very much on guard for what could be coming. And that may take forms other than the kind of attack on Taiwan that you're right, they haven't done to date in the kinetic sense, but they certainly are rehearsing for it. Gordon I think there's no question about that. Indeed, you know, your, your book is about, in part, the the preparations for war. But would the kind of attack that you think might come out of this weakness and, you know, desperate bid to hold on to power be one that did not require the kind of surrender of authority to a general or admiral, but nonetheless be very efficacious against us, namely using the thousands and thousands and thousands of People's Liberation army soldiers that apparently have been inserted into our country during the Biden open Border period to cause mayhem here?

[Frank Gaffney]

Well, I think that there will be mayhem here because we're not going after the networks of operatives, agents and soldiers. But I think that Xi Jinping would only give the go signal if he were planning, for instance, a major invasion. I mean, he will give it if he blunders into war, of course, because then he'll use every means at his disposal. But as I said, I just don't see him with malice aforethought, launching an invasion. Frank, it's not so much that he wants to divert the attention of the Chinese people. Chinese people right now do not want war. They do not want war, and they certainly don't want war against Taiwan, which would be extremely unpopular in China right now. But the reason I worry is because I think Xi Jinping believes that there's a high degree of tension that is in his interest to divert not the Chinese people, but other senior Communist Party figures, because he realizes that if there is a conflict or there's tension, that those figures can't challenge or depose him. So I think he blunders into war when he blunders into war. Yes, he will give the go signal to those operatives on our SO on our soil, but that's not part of an original invasion plan.

[Frank Gaffney (Host)]

Or let me ask you about a related calculation that probably is going on for Xi as he contemplates these kinds of options. The new president of South Korea is, I think, well, pretty much a vowed communist and an ally of the Chinese Communist Party. Does that mean, in your judgment, that it would be unreliable as an ally to the United States, to say nothing of, you know, Taiwan or the Philippines or others in the region that we consider part of our team?

[Frank Gaffney]

Yeah, I don't think that South Korea would help us if there were a war over Taiwan, for instance. And there have been indications that that is indeed the case, that they would not give permission. That's generally been a concern even under conservative South Korean presidents, but more so under EJ Meng, who is very China centric, very North Korea centric. And that's despite having that drum session with Japanese Prime Minister Takechi Sanai on Tuesday, which really was. Took me by surprise. But nonetheless, we heard what EJ Meng said when he was in Beijing this week, and we've got to be really concerned that, you know, we will not be able to use our facilities in South Korea in a general conflict in East Asia.

[Frank Gaffney (Host)]

Yeah, I guess that would throw a wrench in our works for sure. Does it give rise, do you think, to a further incentive in these circumstances, fraud as they are, to. To Xi, to think that he can get away with perhaps even an invasion of Taiwan?

[Frank Gaffney]

Well, it's a factor, of course, but the US Will take our forces out of South Korea if they indeed were to prevent it. You know, Frank, I don't worry so much about the Chinese. I do worry about us. So, for instance, you know, there's a lot of talk in the Pentagon about China invading Taiwan by 2027, you know, the Davidson window and all of that. But you got to remember, you know, these war games, they tell us that if there's a war with China, we're going to lose two carriers. So what did the US Navy do at the end of last year? It actually let out a contract to defuel and deactivate the Nimitz. I mean, you would think that the US Navy would want a spare carrier tied up at Bremerton just in case, in the likely case that we lose one or more carriers in the Pacific. So the U. S. Navy, they say the right things, but they're clearly planning for a war in the2040s, you know, so at best.

[Frank Gaffney (Host)]

At best, Gordon, we have to leave it at that. I'm afraid. I've no, you know that that's not likely to be the case. Things are going to be sorted out one way or the other. I fear far sooner than that. And I pray that we will be heeding your admonitions and mounting once again. Peace through strength. God bless you, my friend, and work you do. Keep it up. Come back to us soon. We'll be right back, folks, with more. Stay tuned. Welcome back. And a very special welcome to a dear friend and very esteemed contributor to the well, the cause of freedom in various capacities, notably as the editor of a very important online resource, Richard Vigory's Conservative HQ. You can find [e-mail] his name is George Raceley. He has served our country in a variety of capacities in the legislative branch, the federal government, as well as on the executive branch in the office of the vice president of the United States. He is, among other things, though, in addition to being our duty genius, I'm fond of pointing out he's a Mensa Society member. So don't take my word for it. He is also a man who has survived and lived to tell the tale of some 300 political campaigns. And we are seeking his help with a very important one. It's a policy campaign really at the moment, but it will be on the ballot in Texas in the next month, March 3rd, to be precise. The Republican primary ballot will have Proposition 10 on it, which says Texas should prohibit Sharia law. And we want to talk with George about that. But before we do, George, first of all, a welcome to you. We're so glad to have you with us, as always.

[George Raceley]

Thanks for having me, Frank. It's always a pleasure to be here with you.

[Frank Gaffney (Host)]

Thank you. And second of all, I wanted to just say you have also been very actively involved. I think, in fact, you've just written a piece at Conservative HQ about this, the president's decision to designate some foreign chapters of the Muslim Brotherhood, but for the moment, not, well, what they call the MOTHER Movement or even its chapters here and elsewhere around the world. Talk to me a little bit about that and then we'll get to the problem of Texas specifically.

[George Raceley]

Well, as as you know, and as we've talked about on previous shows, the after the National Guardsman was shot in Washington, D.C. the President initiated a process to review and potentially ban some Muslim terrorist organizations and their fronts, notably the Muslim Brotherhood and care. And this process took place basically between Thanksgiving and Christmas. And subsequent to that, yesterday One of the cabinet makers charged with doing the review, Marco Rubio, our secretary of state, announced the designation of several, quote, chapters, end of quote, in foreign countries. Lebanon, Jordan and a third one which I can't call up. Right.

[Frank Gaffney (Host)]

Egypt I think it was.

[George Raceley]

Yeah, and, but he didn't designate the U. S. Chapters. And we have to recognize that these so called chapters are, you know, it's not like chapters of the, you know, knights of Columbus or your college fraternity. These are decentralized, diffuse terrorist cells. They operate both to encourage violent jihad attacks in this country and also subversion. And they're very adept at switching back and forth between these two strategies, you know, whichever serves their immediate interest is what they pursue. So right now in the United States they're mostly concentrated on subversion. That's not to say that some of their chapter members or initiates aren't engaged or aren't prepared to engage in violence. It's just that that's not their primary focus right now.

[Frank Gaffney (Host)]

They certainly don't eschew it as.

[George Raceley]

No, no, no, no. And, and I told by seniors the term right now advisor, because that could switch tomorrow.

[Frank Gaffney (Host)]

Yeah, and, and that, that is a literal point, George. You're not just throwing that out. That could happen literally at any time. And that's again what makes so troubling this sort of limited action to date is I fear we're on borrowed time in terms of them going violent. And the more so, George, as you know, because when they see the enemy, which would be us of course exhibiting a kind of weakness or lack of resolve at least that only, you know, feeds into a doctrinal direction under Sharia to redouble the effort, as they say, to make them feel subdued. Yeah, that's a problem.

[George Raceley]

You're absolutely right, Frank. And the thing that's most concerning about this is that they haven't been bashful about saying that. And so you have the explanatory memorandum and you have their Philadelphia conference in which, you know, the progression, shall we say, from subversion to active jihad was, you know, outlined, endorsed and made part of their program. So the fact that we haven't officially designated them in, in their various front groups is very troubling. And I propose that the, the real problem we have here is the lobbying of gutter Turkey, long standing interests within the deep state, you know, the CIA and other intelligence apparatus that we have, who have waived the president off of this and combine that with the statements from gutter and Turkey about not attacking Iran and supporting the freedom movement there, and you have A synergy in which the White House, I believe is, is, if not paralyzed. That certainly kind of stuck in the mud on some of these issues because of all the inputs that they're getting from, you know, particularly gutter and turkey.

[Frank Gaffney (Host)]

Boy. I couldn't agree with you more about that, George. And it's not entirely surprising that the Qataris would not want the United States military to take down a regime that they have long sponsored, even though it's a Shiite jihadi operation, as opposed to the Sunni one of which they've been principally a part. They're good with any kind of jihadi, you know, capabilities brought against Western civilization and hence their efforts make them, it seems to me, not a major non NATO ally, but in fact, a real liability. George, we have to take a break. We'll be right back with more. Stay tuned. George, I think I'm going to ask your indulgence. It's a little bit stupid. Welcome back. We're talking with George Raceley and I wanted to just give you a few thoughts of my own on this question of the Brotherhood's designation. Yesterday, the US Government formally designated three foreign chapters of the Muslim Brotherhood as terrorist organizations. Secretary of State Marco Rubio described them as the opening actions of an ongoing sustained effort to thwart Muslim Brotherhood chapters violence and destabilization wherever it occurs. For the moment, though, other chapters and the Brotherhood's mother movement remain free to pursue their stated goal of waging a grand jihad to destroy Western civilization from within. Unfortunately, every jihadist on the planet and every one of their and their allies still undesignated support networks will perceive that status as proof they will succeed. And according to Islam's toxic Sharia doctrine, when jihadists sense weakness in their enemies, they must redouble efforts to make them feel subdued. That's a formula for much more and terrifying violence in America. We must ban the Muslim Brotherhood. Now those are my thoughts. For more of them, follow me at xrankafney and [e-mail], the website of the Institute for the American Future, which I'm proud to be the president of. It makes this program possible. Please consider [e-mail] George Raceley, thank you for bearing with me. I wanted to just tie up sort of that conversation with you before pivoting to another. And I know you're following these things closely, George. The Chinese Communist Party is, of course, another very dangerous adversary. In addition to the jihadists, the Sharia supremacists, they have been nonetheless allowed to buy up land in places around the United States. And the Daily Caller has been doing some splendid investigative reporting about a fellow by the name of Eugene G J I who has been associated with the Chinese Communist Party's United Front work department. And that is an organization that is responsible for trying to subvert us here as well as use captured elites to assist them in doing just that. According to the Daily Caller, there are two very large and apparently not very well maintained golf courses surrounding basically one of our most important military installations. It's Barksdale Air Force Base, which has on it the Global Strike Command that is responsible for the operations of our nuclear deterrent, two of our legs of our nuclear deterrent, the land based ICBMs or Intercontinental Ballistic missiles and the bomber force. I ask you, sir, what could possibly go wrong with such an arrangement and what should we be doing about it? George?

[George Raceley]

Well, Frank, I mean this is, this is a pattern that's been repeated all over the country. And it's worth noting that the Communist Chinese, or I prefer to call them the Red Chinese because they are a revolutionary state, yes, knows much more about us than we know about them. And for example, Barksdale is where one of the places where the presidential aircraft flew on 9 11, right. And this pattern is seen throughout the country on a very strategic level by the Chinese in Florida. They have attempted to surround our Space Force Command and cape, you know, the Kennedy Space center with similar, you know, holdings of property. And the state passed a law prohibiting that. Now that's working its way through the courts. So far it's been successful and the state legislation, I mean, it is absurd.

[Frank Gaffney (Host)]

That we have to rely on the courts to oh, well, that's the thing, national security requirements like not letting the enemy have cheap and easy shots at some of these extraordinarily sensitive facilities and what goes on on them. Right.

[George Raceley]

Well, that this is a great example of how they, our enemies are experts at using our system against us. And so one would think that there would be some kind of, you know, advanced, you know, sort of pre purchased, pre purchase review of these kind of property transactions, but process, the Committee on.

[Frank Gaffney (Host)]

Foreign Investment in the United States is, I think, supposed to be doing that sort of thing.

[George Raceley]

No, they should be focused on these kind of things, but their focus tends to be on technology and manufacturing, stuff like that. And so the obvious idea of a Chinese intelligence operator owning huge swathes of property around Barksdale Air Force Base somehow doesn't get up the food chain to a, you know, prior restraint type of situation. And so that's why it ends up in the courts.

[Frank Gaffney (Host)]

You know, I have to say, George, I, I've going back to my decades ago now service in the U. S. Defense Department, Pentagon, this organization, CFIUS as it's known, used to drive me to distraction because it, you know, how these interagency operations work, George. It was chaired by the Treasury Department. It is shared by the Treasury Department. And the Treasury Department basically never saw a foreign investment they didn't like because that's kind of their thing is to bring foreign investment to the United States. And consequently you had these guys routinely allowing very dubious, if not actually dangerous investing to take place inside our country. And I, and I know in a lot of states around the country, George, as you do, that efforts are being made to try to make sure that the Chinese can't own land, especially in proximity to sensitive assets of our government, military intelligence, space, what have you. And yet that's not being done as a federal government initiative, as it obviously should be and should have been long ago. George, we have to take a short break. We're going to come back in a moment with more on what is also taking place in terms of the national interests of the United States with respect to China. Stay tuned. I'll be right back.

[Frank Gaffney]

This is an iHeart podcast.

[Frank Gaffney (Host)]

Guaranteed Human.