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- [00:00]
Andrew Colvett
This is an I heart podcast.
- [00:22]
Charlie Kirk
The Charlie Kirk show starts now.
- [00:26]
Libby Emmons
People are murdered every single day. But this particular one, I'm trying to understand why this has become such a flashpoint on the right.
- [00:34]
Andrew Colvett
I have to say some of the replies to Musk, some of the comments around this story are baldly racist.
- [00:39]
Charlie Kirk
The president and his allies are using.
- [00:41]
Andrew Colvett
The attack to accuse Democrats of being soft on clock. Yeah, so the President has pointed the finger at Democrats.
- [00:47]
Jack Bosobic
Members of the Trump administration also used the video to criticize Democratic led cities.
- [00:51]
Andrew Colvett
The president blaming Democrats for Zeruka's death. It is Trump aligned influencers who are posting up a storm about this case on social media.
- [00:59]
Libby Emmons
Certain people have been looking for an opportunity to find a case like this, to make a point.
- [01:07]
Jack Bosobic
It all comes of course, as Trump is seizing, trying to seize control of.
- [01:09]
Libby Emmons
Other cities that he says are not safe.
- [01:11]
Andrew Colvett
I mean, Charlotte is a place with a very effective police department, very effective leadership. Murder is down 29%.
- [01:19]
Jack Bosobic
Charlotte police were touting a 25% reduction in violent crime.
- [01:24]
Andrew Colvett
What he really needed was inpatient mental health care. And North Carolina rates last when it comes to mental health bed availability. What are the city managers doing to make sure they are investing in these.
- [01:39]
Dr. James Orr
Individuals to get them to help?
- [01:41]
Jack Bosobic
If you want to be addressing the.
- [01:43]
Dr. James Orr
Mental health issues of these folks and.
- [01:44]
Andrew Colvett
Prevent the recidivism, you do need to.
- [01:47]
Dr. James Orr
Be investing in mental health.
- [01:48]
Jack Bosobic
CNN spoke with his mother and his sister who say that for years they have struggled to get him adequate mental health treatment. And if you really want to know who the criminals are in this country.
- [02:00]
Andrew Colvett
You can Google it.
- [02:00]
Jack Bosobic
You don't have to tr, trust me. But the people that commit 80% of the most violent crimes in this country are white supremacists. Yet for whatever reason, they sit and they serve at the pleasure of the President. They are the ones that were there on January 6th tearing our democracy down physically. And now we have them tearing us down right here from within our prisons.
- [02:25]
Andrew Colvett
Obsolete. Coming through with the quotes, coming through with the titles of the books. I have to read that. Actually, I haven't read that as yet. But I think that frankly, I mean, what purpose do they serve, right?
- [02:44]
Nick Shirley
I think we have to ask ourselves.
- [02:45]
Andrew Colvett
That, which is that, you know, I think a lot of people who defend the carceral state, they defend the idea of it and the way it makes them feel.
- [02:54]
Libby Emmons
I also, with respect, sir, thank you for the information that you have shared on this show. We would appreciate all of the information, all of it, all of the data.
- [03:05]
Nick Shirley
That you say you have.
- [03:06]
Andrew Colvett
I'VE done this show several times.
- [03:08]
Nick Shirley
Every time on your show, I speak.
- [03:10]
Andrew Colvett
With integrity, I speak with honesty and I speak with facts. The bottom line is because of all this false scenario and you use the term disappearing people to the group that.
- [03:22]
Libby Emmons
Was sent to El Salvador.
- [03:26]
Andrew Colvett
US Citizens get arrested every day. US Citizens get arrested by police every day. Are they being disappear? No, the laws are being enforced. They're being arrested. They're being put in detention because they committed a criminal.
- [03:38]
Libby Emmons
Not like what you're doing. We will not let a progressive DA keep this case. Justice will be served. He'll be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law.
- [03:48]
Andrew Colvett
In Mecklenburg county, the sitting clerk is Alyssa Chin gary. On her LinkedIn page, she calls herself a clerk and a DEI consultant and a racial equity organizer and her life mission reparations.
- [04:03]
Libby Emmons
We are here to honor them, to lift their names and to continue the intergenerational work that we are required to do to eliminate structural racism.
- [04:15]
Andrew Colvett
Ms. Stokes was nominated by Judge Carla Archie.
- [04:19]
Jack Bosobic
Horrific new video of a Ukrainian refugee's murder caught on camera.
- [04:23]
Libby Emmons
It is absolutely horrific.
- [04:24]
Jack Bosobic
Trump is now seizing on this to.
- [04:26]
Libby Emmons
Push his nationwide crackdown.
- [04:28]
Andrew Colvett
We cannot allow a depraved criminal element of violent repeat offenders to continue spreading destruction and death throughout our country. We have to respond with force and strength. We have to be vicious just like they are. It's the only thing they understand. 24 of the top 25 most dangerous cities in America are run by Democrat mayors. And it's time to stop this madness. The people of our country need to insist on protection, safety, law and order. We have proven that it can be done. Charlie. Every day there's a battle for your mind. Raging information coming from every angle with the will to deceive. Fear not, you found the place for truth. The voice of a generation that still has the will to believe in the greatest country in the history of the world. This is the Charlie Kirk Show. Buckle up. Here we go, everybody. Welcome to the Charlie Kirk Show. Andrew Colvett in for the one and only Charlie Kirk, who starts his college tour. The fall tour is kicking off today in Utah. We're here@the bitcoin.com mobile studios holding it down for him. Never fear. We've got a great hour two with him. It's such a treat by the way he sits down with James Orr, basically the only conservative at Cambridge University and a great guy that I personally got to spend a lot of time with, have really in depth conversations. The guy has a photographic memory of the western canon. And Charlie and James are going Dr. Orr are going to be talking at length an hour too, so stay tuned for that. You're not, you're not going to want to miss it. But in the meantime, we have work to do. And I have a really special guest to kick off the show with us today, and that would be Libby Emmons, editor in chief of the Post, Millennial and Human Events, a great guest. But Libby, before we dive into it, I you. There was a clip of you and Jack Bosobic on Tim Cass last night and that's why you're here, because it was such a great jumping off point for the discussion I want to have with you. Go ahead and play cut 407 in.
- [06:37]
Charlie Kirk
Reality and you can see the statistics, you can see the data that unfortunately we have a problem of mass violence against white people in this country that has gone completely unchecked and in some cases encouraged.
- [06:50]
Dr. James Orr
And in every single case case, you.
- [06:52]
Andrew Colvett
Have people like Van Jones going on.
- [06:55]
Dr. James Orr
TV and making excuses for it.
- [06:57]
Andrew Colvett
And it's disgusting. It is open season on white people in this country. It has been since the knockout game.
- [07:03]
Charlie Kirk
It has been since White girl bleed a lot.
- [07:05]
Dr. James Orr
And now you have the exact same things going on and on.
- [07:08]
Jack Bosobic
Right? You also, you. I mean, it was, I mean, we also saw, because they viewed them as white, we also saw a young black.
- [07:14]
Charlie Kirk
Woman, they were, they were the Jews.
- [07:16]
Jack Bosobic
Wearing the big hats and thrown off a bridge in Annapolis.
- [07:21]
Andrew Colvett
So that was a fiery little segment and I hope we captured it. I mean, there was a lot going on between, you know, about a three minute stretch. But Libby, Jack's making a pretty, I would say, controversial point that it's open season on white people in this country. We don't, I guess the floor is yours, Libby. Is that true? What are we really dealing with? I want to narrow down on what is happening in this moment. This clip from Irina Zarutska and her tragic death. I think it's radicalizing a lot of people and it's moved the Overton window more rapidly than I have seen anything do in a long time. So, Libby, the floor is yours.
- [08:01]
Jack Bosobic
Yeah, that was a really interesting conversation last night with Jack and Tim and we did get into a lot of stuff. Jack was saying that it's open season on white people in this country. And I think it's really important to remember when you hear a comment like that, that under the Biden admin, the FBI said outright that the biggest domestic threat in this country, the biggest, you know, threat of domestic extremism in the country were from white supremacists. We've had years and years of rhetoric saying that white people are inherently racist, that there's nothing that they can do to undo their racism, that they have to do the work of anti racism, which means stepping back, which means giving up jobs, which means, you know, giving your alleged privilege in society to people who are, you know, black and brown in this. In this culture. And we've seen that repeatedly over the years. With the George Floyd death In, you know, May 2020, that rhetoric really ramped up a lot more. And we saw it throughout that summer, right? I mean, we saw white shop owners in Democrat cities being targeted and harassed essentially for being white while there was a BLM protest going on. We saw Trump supporters being shot because they were white Trump supporters. I don't know necessarily that it's open season on white people now more than ever, but there certainly has been a justified idea of violence against white people for some time. You can even go back several years ago to the whole punch a Nazi concept, and the punch a Nazi concept, maybe it sounds great, you know, like, punch Nazis, but when all white people were equated to be Nazis because they. They can't control their own racism, it becomes, you know, punch white people. And we certainly have seen some of that.
- [09:52]
Andrew Colvett
I, you know, and I totally agree that there is something that we have not been able to talk about. You know, I used to mock this expression from the left that we have to have a conversation about it. We have to have a conversation about racism in America and systemic racism. Well, in this instance, I think there is some validity to this sentiment that we have to have a conversation about what we've not been able to have a conversation about. And the media blackout about this story at the very beginning. I mean, they were forced into this narrative that they. They did not want to go into. They did not want to cover this story because it exposed their gross incompetence. It exposed the failed experiment known as criminal justice reform, which is really fueled by this idea that we have a systemically oppressive country against black people. We have not been able to talk about the other side of the story, which is actually, and this is, I think, the point that Jack was making, that when you look at raw numbers, that there is actually more, you know, interracial attacks against white Americans than the other way around. And, and that's when you. Per capita, it's even more extreme because black people only represent about 12 and a half percent of the population. And so, but let me play a clip here, because yesterday Charlie talked about the fact that Van Jones came after him for race mongering, hate mongering about this. Well, there's a clip going around from Van Jones in that era, 2020, that you talked about, Libby, right after George Floyd died in Minneapolis. 398. So even the most liberal, well intentioned white person has a virus in his or her brain that can be activated at an instant. And so what you're seeing now is a curtain falling away. And those of us who have been burdened by this every minute, every second of our entire lives are fragile right now. We are fragile right now. We are tired. So this is millionaire Van Jones who has one of the most prestigious seats in all of, you know, media and the culture. Who's, who will get up with the elites. The elites. And here he is saying that he's tired. This is 2020. But then he has the gallery four or five years later to tell Charlie that he's race mongering, hate mongering for calling out the fact that this decarlos Brown murderer killed Irina Zarutska because she's white. That's what his allegation was against Charlie Libby.
- [12:35]
Jack Bosobic
Yeah. And we also saw in the video aftermath of Brown slaying Zarutska, him saying, I got that white girl. I got that white girl. Which leads you to believe that her race had something to do with his intention to harm her. And talking about Van Jones back in 2020, he is a very prominent media figure, of course, and it has been leftist media and legacy media in a lot of ways that have been propping up this race narrative. I think a lot of it started in 2012. We really saw the rhetoric in the New York Times and other news outlets start ramping up about how racist the country is. That was a big part of what they started covering. Blm, Eric Garner, all of the rest of it really started to come to the fore. And the idea was that white people were racist, that the entire society was racist, that there wasn't anything that, you know, white people could do to their racism.
- [13:34]
Andrew Colvett
Libby. And I know, I know what you're talking about here. So I'm going to throw this, this graphic up on screen. This is the use of the word racism or racist by the New York Times, Los Angeles Times, Washington Post and Wall Street Journal over the years. And you can see some. It kind of peaked a little bit in 1990. That was probably, you know, with the LA Riot stuff. Yeah, Rodney King. And then it kind of went down again. And then we have the election of Obama and then you have Ferguson and Then you have George Floyd, and it's stratospheric. And this is the point, I think, that a lot of us are making right now, is that we have been living under a narrative, under a narrative built on fake statistics and lies. And those lies have consequences. And those consequences mean that murderers are running, roaming the streets to maim and hurt and kill people like Irina Zarutska. And we're done with it. We're done with it. It's not that we don't like black people or brown people. We love all Americans. We want everybody to be safe and healthy and secure and thriving in this country. But we're sick and tired of living under a lie. Libby, let's just go through the breaks because this is too much fun you to have this conversation. So on stream, on podcast, you'll hear this conversation. We'll be right back.
- [14:54]
Jack Bosobic
I think we saw that his sister said that he's schizophrenic. But there's absolutely no cause to allow men who have been arrested 14 times for multiple felonies to continue to live freely. That doesn't make any sense. And the thing is, too, that we see, I think according to the National Library of medicine, it's like 1% of the population is accountable for 63% of all of the violent crimes. And this isn't the first case either, where we see a case of a man who murders a woman or commits a really violent crime like this. And then you check out the rap sheet and there's like 20 mug shots. Why? Why is this person continuously released? Why do we have more compassion for killers than we do for their victims? And no city council should be like this. Charlotte is a city that got $3.3 million in funding from the MacArthur foundation to reduce their prison population. And that's what they set about doing. This is exactly what Zoran Mamdani wants to do in New York. He wants to turn it into a city where people get murdered on the subway because he has more compassion for people who should be in prison than the people who are going harmed by them.
- [16:09]
Andrew Colvett
Well, and, you know, we go back to this idea of so much of this is built on a lie. Let's go just. Let's just go ahead and show a clip that demonstrates how forcefully the purveyors of this lie push this propaganda out into the pop into the public. This is Jasmine Crockett, and she says 80% of the most violent crime in our country is. Is done by white supremacists or white supremacy. 396.
- [16:38]
Jack Bosobic
And if you really want to know who the criminals are in this country.
- [16:42]
Andrew Colvett
You can Google it.
- [16:42]
Jack Bosobic
You don't have to trust me. But the people that commit 80% of the most violent crimes in this country are white supremacists. Yet for whatever reason, they sit and they serve at the pleasure of the President. They are the ones that were there on January 6th tearing our democracy down physically, and now we have them tearing us down right here from within.
- [17:06]
Andrew Colvett
Now, that, to be fair, that video is from February, but that shows the extent and the depth of the ideological rot that has taken over the dialogue in this country and how it's just not rooted in anything resembling the truth.
- [17:20]
Dr. James Orr
We'll be right back.
- [17:33]
Andrew Colvett
All right. Welcome back to the Charlie Kirk Show. Andrew Colvett, executive producer of this fine show, sitting in for the one and only Charlie Kirk, who's on assignment today. College tour starts in Utah. Lots of fun controversy brewing up in Utah, which means it's going to be a fantastic event. Lots of people coming out for that. I am still with the great Libby Emmons, editor in chief of the Post, Millennial and Human Events. And we're having a good conversation. I mean, this is a really important conversation, Libby, because, again, what we're talking about is the Overton window is changing as we speak. People that were cowed by this you're a racist, you're a racist accusation are speaking out for the first time. And you're seeing this with, you know, Republicans at the local level, you know, in the south, they just did a press conference where they're. They're sick of this. You can tell. And again, this is not anti black. This is not anti brown. This is pro American. This is pro safety. We want everybody to thrive, but we cannot live under the specter of lies and propaganda and expect to get good laws, good policies, and good outcomes. And I think that's what everybody's waking up to. And by the way, I have to play this, Libby. This. This is this morning. This is how deep it goes. From the official Black Lives Matter account, posted this video. Irina Zarutska's blood is still fresh on that train in Charlotte. And this. They have the gall to post this Play Cup 400. Right to violence. All oppressed people have a right to violence. And I want to tell you something.
- [19:09]
Dr. James Orr
It's like the right to pee.
- [19:11]
Andrew Colvett
You gotta have the right place. You gotta have the right time. You gotta have the appropriate situation. And I'm absolutely convinced that this is it. That's this morning from the Black Lives Matter official account. Libby Evans.
- [19:25]
Jack Bosobic
Yeah, I think that's absolutely crazy. And just for reference, where Jasmine Crockett got her numbers of 80%, that came from the ADL. And the ADL said all the extremist related murders in 2022 were committed by right wing extremists of various kinds. And that's where she was getting her numbers from. And that included a killing at a Colorado nightclub that was LGBT related and didn't really have anything to do with white supremacy at all. Mostly they're leaning on that horrifying Buffalo supermarket shooting for their information. And so it's completely not accurate. And we know that the ADL doctors their information to call things white supremacist and right wing, that really aren't right. I mean, we know that so clearly.
- [20:10]
Andrew Colvett
Well, by the way, that completely overlooks the fact that Chicago has been the number one murder capital of the country for the last 13 years. It overlooks the fact that if you go back to 2018, this is a real statistic, 2018 in Washington D.C. do you know how many black people were murdered since 2018 in DC? About 1200.
- [20:33]
Jack Bosobic
Yeah.
- [20:35]
Andrew Colvett
Do you know how many white people were murdered in Washington D.C. in the last. Since 2018? 11.
- [20:42]
Jack Bosobic
Right.
- [20:43]
Andrew Colvett
11 to 1200. Since 2018.
- [20:46]
Jack Bosobic
Getting all of these left wing mayors of various blue cities in the country getting all mad at Donald Trump when what Trump is doing in D.C. specifically is protecting black lives. That's what he's doing. That's what the curfew in the Navy Yard is about. It's about protecting black kids from violence. And these kids, like you were saying, deserve to grow up in a safe country where they're safe from violence and they can thrive. And that's what we want for Americans. That's what we want for everybody here in this country. And yeah, the rhetoric needs to stop. And I think that, you know, projects like the 1619 Project and others really have painted white Americans as vill. And it's definitely done that to our young boys as well. To white boys. It's a big problem.
- [21:29]
Andrew Colvett
Yeah, I totally agree with that. My goodness. What the villainizing of young men in this country has been incredibly destructive. And we see that basically every single statistic that comes out now, they're turning a corner right now. But this, I think, is where I wanna land this conversation this last minute, Libby, is that these policies, not only are they destructive and they result in the death of so many innocent people. And when it's somebody like Irina Zarudska, it's chilling, it's radicalizing. For so many, I've seen so many people post that word. Specifically, I feel radicalized by this video because it's so tragic. But we have to remember that when and the great Heather McDonald coined this term, the Ferguson effect, in 2014, that resulted in dead black and brown kids. Yes, that's what that, that's what the result is. And then once again in George Floyd, these cops don't want to go into urban cores and urban centers to police crime because they know that they'll get scapegoated if something goes wrong, which it often does go wrong because it is a messy job and it's a hard job and it's unpredictable. And what happens more in black and brown people die. And 20 seconds. Libby, the final thought.
- [22:47]
Jack Bosobic
Yeah, I mean we recently saw an execution style killing on a Philadelphia street. We saw of a black woman, we saw a black girl thrown into murdered by an illegal immigrant in Annapolis and thrown off a bridge. We see this kind of crime happening in black communities and two young black people all of the time and it's gotta stop. And these blue city mayors who are so intent on their, you know, soft on crime policies need to give it up and start pretending protecting their populations.
- [23:15]
Andrew Colvett
Libby Emmons, Post Millennial Human Events thank you so much.
- [23:18]
Dr. James Orr
Thanks.
- [23:24]
Brian Glenn
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- [24:58]
Andrew Colvett
This is obviously a horrible, horrible situation, but this is why federal statutes exist. They exist to take care of situations like this because no one should sit in fear when they sit on the light rail. If you sit in fear on the light rail, you sit in fear when you walk around the streets of our center city like I do every day. You sit in fear when you go to our parks like I do with my daughter every weekend. You sit in fear at our sporting events, our entertainment venues, at concerts, at restaurants, at our museums. These are all the things that we have worked as a city so hard to build. We built a city that people want to live in, but we can lose that all if we allow violent crime like this to go on in our streets. And I'm here to tell you the federal government is going to save our city from that early treatment from socialism saves lives. The Charlie Kirk show is back. All right, welcome back to the Charlie Kirk Show. Andrew Colvett in for the one and only Charlie Kirk, who's going to be in Utah today. So keep a lookout for those clips. They're going to be coming real quick. I can prom, I can promise you. I'm so excited to start off the new tour season and just for this one day, we're letting Charlie focus on that, get back in the saddle. And so I get the honor of being with all of you from coast to coast and all across streaming and all the things here@the bitcoin.com mobile studios. I am so excited about this next guest. His name is Nick Shirley. He's an independent journalist. You can follow him on X at Nick Shirley. That's S H I R L E Y Y. Maybe we can help him get rid of that second Y. And then on YouTube at Nick Shirley as well. Nick, I saw your footage and I was blown away. And so, so just really quick, before we get into the footage, introduce yourself to the audience and what, what it is you do.
- [27:06]
Nick Shirley
Yeah, my name is Nick Shirley. I'm an independent YouTube journalist and I go all across the world, not just the only, not just the United States, but all across the world showing the realities of things that they really are, whether it be whether it had been the migrant crisis or the fentanyl crisis or asking people who they're voting for. I go to all the locations or just doing right alongs with gangsters in Chicago as well.
- [27:29]
Andrew Colvett
Yeah. Okay, so this. I saw it. I was like, this is like a. It was some of the most incredible footage I've ever seen, because you went straight into the west side kind of hood of Chicago, and you're hanging out with gangsters. At one point, they point the gun at your cameraman, and you hear him go, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa. I mean, this is. This is really radical stuff, and you put yourself in harm's way for this footage. So I. I just want to start playing some of it because it. Not only is it amazing to see up close, it's also so newsy and everything that's happening, and I think it gives people a really unique insight into how these cultures of crime and real, like, urban warfare happen. Let's go ahead and play. We could start anywhere, but let's go 401.
- [28:21]
Nick Shirley
So right now, you got this massive gun on you. What is this called?
- [28:24]
Andrew Colvett
Aip. Whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa.
- [28:27]
Nick Shirley
And now, after your brother got shot, how do you feel about gun violence? Are you ready for the gun violence to stop or.
- [28:32]
Andrew Colvett
Hell, no.
- [28:32]
Nick Shirley
What do you got tattooed on the face?
- [28:33]
Andrew Colvett
Well, I got a tattoo on my face.
- [28:35]
Nick Shirley
Yeah, right there.
- [28:35]
Andrew Colvett
These my brothers. I'm a Muslim. Muslim. Okay.
- [28:39]
Nick Shirley
How many times you been done shot?
- [28:41]
Andrew Colvett
3.
- [28:42]
Nick Shirley
You got shot right here.
- [28:45]
Dr. James Orr
Looks like another shot.
- [28:47]
Nick Shirley
Well, you got a bullet inside your body.
- [28:49]
Andrew Colvett
Yeah.
- [28:50]
Nick Shirley
Oh, my gosh. And, Spaz, you've been shot too. Right here, right here, right here. You got one bullet shot right here, one right there. And then you have a literal bullet in your rib.
- [29:00]
Andrew Colvett
Yeah.
- [29:00]
Nick Shirley
What kind of bullet you got in here?
- [29:02]
Andrew Colvett
It's like a 40.
- [29:03]
Nick Shirley
40. Ain't that hurt when I go like that?
- [29:06]
Andrew Colvett
Yeah. No, I can't see. So, I mean, how many people did you hang out with, and how many of those people were shot?
- [29:15]
Nick Shirley
Yeah, I hung out with about five people, and each of them had been shot around three times each. And the bullet wounds are there. One guy, literally, like it showed there in the video, he had that rip. He had the bullet lodged into his ribs.
- [29:28]
Andrew Colvett
Jeez. And you asked that one individual in that clip, like, hey, now that you've been shot, are you ready to see the gun violence die down? And his answer was, hell, nah.
- [29:40]
Nick Shirley
Yeah. Not only did he say, hell not, it was his brother that died, his twin brother that got shot and killed. And what they call is the cycle. And the way they explain it to me is that. So somebody kills you or somebody kills Somebody you love that just makes you want to go kill him and somebody else. And then that cycle just repeats and repeats. And that's why there's so much gun violence because everyone's just trying to get. Get back on somebody else.
- [30:07]
Andrew Colvett
Geez. This is a longer clip but I think it's important because it talks about it kind of reve how young this starts. Go ahead and play. Cut. 383.
- [30:19]
Nick Shirley
How old are you?
- [30:20]
Andrew Colvett
I can't even say my age. What? I can't.
- [30:23]
Nick Shirley
Why is everybody so secretive here? Why is there.
- [30:25]
Andrew Colvett
So we out west with it, we out Westwood on the hood.
- [30:28]
Nick Shirley
Why do you walk around with a sheisty?
- [30:30]
Andrew Colvett
Because I don't play no games.
- [30:33]
Nick Shirley
Like are you in high school still?
- [30:35]
Andrew Colvett
Yeah, I'm still.
- [30:36]
Brian Glenn
No, I see.
- [30:37]
Dr. James Orr
I'm out.
- [30:37]
Andrew Colvett
I'm out of high school. I got kicked out.
- [30:39]
Nick Shirley
And what do you hope that happens with your life and your family future?
- [30:41]
Andrew Colvett
I. I hope, I hope we get better. I ain't going back.
- [30:43]
Nick Shirley
What's your current situation?
- [30:44]
Andrew Colvett
Family though we all arguing, doing a whole bunch of. It's just, it's just chaos.
- [30:50]
Nick Shirley
So what do you think would be the solution to get yourself out of the chaos Would be. Would it be to go to college, get an education, move out of Chicago?
- [30:56]
Andrew Colvett
Yeah, then I move out of Chicago.
- [30:59]
Brian Glenn
Been think about moving out Chicago been.
- [31:02]
Andrew Colvett
Posting on their story talking about they going to move out of Chicago, do this, do that. I'm. I been looking at them.
- [31:08]
Brian Glenn
I was like finna get out the rack.
- [31:10]
Andrew Colvett
That crazy.
- [31:11]
Nick Shirley
Is it pretty dangerous to be walking around these streets?
- [31:14]
Andrew Colvett
Yeah, I ain't gonna both.
- [31:15]
Nick Shirley
Is that why you walking down with a shisty?
- [31:16]
Andrew Colvett
I got up thrown by four pipes in one day. One of them shot but didn't hit me. I swear to God. One of them shot but didn't hit me. And that was the first day I ever even knew how to hit a leg on my grandma. I don't even know what he means by that. And actually it's funny a couple times you asked them to translate for you because he's like, you're like I don't think anybody's going to be speaking and translating hood. Hood talk. But I mean this is just. You just met this guy on the street and he'd been shot at. He's in high schooler age at least. And how common is this in the west side of Chicago? We obviously we hear about the south side but the west side as well.
- [31:58]
Nick Shirley
I think it's pretty prevalent to see especially like for instance I was broad Daylight on a weekday at a gas station. That kid was out there walking around and he had been expelled and kicked out of high school. And so there are a lot of people like that. I don't know to what extent, but it does happen. And there's a lot of kids that do find themselves into that gang lifestyle and finding themselves into that cycle, like they say. And it's kind of sad to see somebody, knowing that it's bad, get into that.
- [32:27]
Andrew Colvett
So there's some statistics here, Nick, that suggest that 12.5% of black men in Chicago will have been shot by the age of 40. So obviously that percentage is going to be much higher in the rapper sort of gangster community. But that's more than 1 in 10. So if you're born a black man in Chicago, little baby, by the time you're 40, more than 1 in 10 of them is going to be shot. And I can't instantly compare that to statistics of war in Ukraine or in Gaza or whatever, but I have to believe that that is equivalent, it's probably on par, maybe higher than some of these places that we consider war zones in the country. Do they have enough sense or reflection that they are living in a war zone?
- [33:21]
Nick Shirley
Well, you know, they do call Chicago Chirac. So people are referring it to as, as a war zone. And I mean the casualties there. Every weekend there's about five homicides, five murders, five people get shot. Just in Labor Day weekend, there's over 58 people that got shot and I believe eight people died that weekend. So every weekend people are dying on the streets of Chicago and Trump's even offering to give them help to send the National Guard. And I even talked to the gangsters yesterday. I was just following up with them, seeing how they're doing. And I was asked about if Trump should send in the National Guard. And they, they even said that it would be a good idea to send them in and especially get rid of the illegal gangs, because the illegal gangs aren't playing by the same rules they play by.
- [34:04]
Andrew Colvett
And so they explain, explain that so to these guys. I mean, you know, they're part of a gang, but they're worried about the illegals that are also forming gangs and they're playing by a different set of rules. Rules?
- [34:17]
Nick Shirley
Yeah, like obviously they're from Latin America and they're from cartel controlled countries. So they don't play by the rules of, you gotta do this to make sure you don't get by this. They, those, they don't have those rules where they, where they play, where they do their crime. So. And these gangsters, like the gangsters I was with, they were cool with me. They're nice guys and like, they. If you could give them the option to get out, they probably would. They just don't know how to really get out of that lifestyle. And they're so used to it, they've been brought up into it and they'll say themselves that they were just brought up into it and they never got out.
- [34:54]
Andrew Colvett
It's crazy. It's like. It's like another world, honestly. It's like you're. You're looking at Martians or something. And that's not a racial comment. It's. It's just the amount of crime that they live with and that they're just accustomed to. It's just. I think a lot of people in this audience, it just can't relate. Let's go ahead and play another cut here. 406.
- [35:14]
Nick Shirley
What kind of bullet you got in here?
- [35:16]
Andrew Colvett
It's like a 40.
- [35:17]
Nick Shirley
40. Ain't that hurt when I go like that?
- [35:19]
Andrew Colvett
Yeah. No, I can't feel that.
- [35:21]
Nick Shirley
What'd you get shot for?
- [35:23]
Andrew Colvett
Being me, Being one of them.
- [35:28]
Nick Shirley
Here in Chicago, it's pretty much the murder capital of the United States. So a lot of these shootings and murders have reason to them, or is it just like, I shoot you, you shoot me? This is a war.
- [35:38]
Andrew Colvett
Nah, just be trying to get a name for this stuff right now.
- [35:41]
Nick Shirley
Like a name for.
- [35:42]
Andrew Colvett
To get respect, you feel me? Like street credibility shutter that really none.
- [35:46]
Dr. James Orr
That's what it's really funny today.
- [35:47]
Nick Shirley
So it's just for street cred these days to shoot somebody and kill them. How many people that get shot and die, how many of those killers do you think are still walking the streets? What you mean, like how many people get away after they kill somebody?
- [35:59]
Andrew Colvett
I don't know. It don't take us that long. It don't take us that long for it get back. Oh, so we hear that it's about. It's less than a 50 clearance rate, which is how many murders get solved in the city of Chicago. So more than half never get solved. But this guy says, and this is kind of one of the main characters, that guy, the last guy that we saw there that you talked with, you rode around with him, he drove you around the city. He's also a rapper, right? He says, well, I don't know. It doesn't take that long for us to get a. To get a get back. So he's suggesting, well, even if the police don't get the guy that shot us, we're going to get him. And that is really the cycle in a nutshell right there. Nick Shirley, your reaction to that clip? Nick?
- [36:48]
Nick Shirley
Oh, yeah, so sorry. I thought you were closing out, but yeah, no, the, they, obviously, it's, these communities aren't that big. It's, it's just a few blocks. And it's kind of, it's kind of sad to think that Chicago is running like a country in south or Latin America. For instance. Some of these guys can't go from one street to the next. We, we drove across one area and he freaked out because I had my camera out. And he's like, well, we can't make sure that my car gets put on camera because we're not inside my, my area now. And so these guys don't even feel comfortable going from one street to the next in some of these locations. So there is very much an active war between gangs going on inside of Chicago. And it's not a secret.
- [37:30]
Andrew Colvett
But yeah, I was going to say. So that's my next question. When you hear J.B. pritzker or Brandon Johnson out of the city of Chicago, fight tooth and nail to keep the National Guard out of the city. But even you got these gangsters saying it'd be good to do this. What's, what's that dynamic? How do you, now that you've seen it up close, like, like, what's, do you have a conclusion? If you. Do you feel like it would be a good idea for the National Guard to be in Chicago?
- [37:55]
Nick Shirley
Yeah, I think those, both those guys are pretty stupid, if we're all being honest. Right. Why wouldn't they want their cities to be safer? Why wouldn't they want their streets to be cleaner? It worked in Washington, D.C. and the people you see protesting aren't the people that are inside of these areas. There are all these people coming from the suburbs, a bunch of old white liberals. It's sad to say it, but it's the truth.
- [38:17]
Andrew Colvett
Yeah, Well, I mean, a lot of.
- [38:19]
Nick Shirley
People just want their areas to feel safer, and that's all Trump's really offering to do.
- [38:22]
Andrew Colvett
Yeah. I mean, and to be candid, I mean, that's why I wanted to have you on the show, because I wanted everybody to see just how different the culture is that these people are living under. Nick, thank you so much for showing us this footage, for making the time to come on the show and tell the audience about it. Thank you so much.
- [38:39]
Nick Shirley
Thank you, guys.
- [38:41]
Andrew Colvett
We'll be right back. Don't go Anywhere. Relentless in spirit. You're listening to the Charlie Kirk Show. All right, welcome back to the Charlie Kirk Show. Andrew Colvett in executive producer of the Charlie Kirk Show. Man, what a wild ride this show has been on and what turning Point has been on and what Charlie himself has been on. The country. Excited to tell you about why Refi? Because of course the fall tour kicks off today in Utah. Clips coming up. I'm sure Charlie's gonna be posting about it on his, his ex, his Twitter and other platforms. So keep a lookout. Today. It's, it's gonna be a wild, wild event. I think he's a couple hours from starting and it's already like filling up with people, so it's gonna be crazy. Why? Refi is the sponsor of that tour. And you know, folks, let's face it, if you have distressed or defaulted student loans, private student loans, nobody is coming to bail you out and bankruptcy is not an option. But you can take charge of your situation. And that starts by calling Y Refi. That's Y R E F y dot com. Can you imagine being debt free and not living under this burden anymore? You gotta call them, they're good people. Just hung out with them a couple weeks ago. Amazing people. Why refi offers a 3 minute rate check without any credit impact. Bad credit is accepted if you've got a co borrower. Why Refi can get them released from the loan. You can even skip a payment every six months up to 12 times without penalty. So if this is you, if you have private student loan debt in the United States right now, it doesn't necessarily work in all 50 states but call them to find out if it works in your state. They can help you. These are good people, good patriots that have your best interest interests at heart and they want to help you out and this is the way to do it. Call y refi at 888 y refi 34 or go to yrefi.com tell them that Charlie Kirchhoe sent you great people and they are sponsoring the American comeback tour right now that's going to be kicking off in Utah today. Clips going viral soon, so you're going to want to check that out. We're going to wrap up our hour. We got an exclusive clip from Brian Glenn who sat down with Pam Bondi and we're going to show you that in just one second. Foreign welcome back everybody. Radio stations across the country, Real America's voice streaming podcast. Listen, Brian Glenn is one of these guys. You hear him almost at every single white House press conference, Trump press conference. He's there, he's in the mix. Great guy, really just a gentleman. He's the White House correspondent for real America's Voice. And he got an exclusive moment with Pam Bondi, an interview with Pam Bondi. And on their way to Chicago. And so they let me know that this clip existed. And I was like, absolutely, because we're going to be talking with Nick, who you just met, who's in the streets of Chicago. And a fascinating thing I didn't know he was going to say was that even the native born, you know, mostly black west side and south side gangsters in Chicago that have all been shot and that are living in this war zone known as an American urban core, they don't like the illegals. The illegal gangs don't play by the same rule. And they're even more violent and they're even more dangerous and they're moving into turf and they're causing more and more destruction in a city like Chicago. And so they're on their way to Chicago and Brian gets an exclusive with Pam Bondi. And it looks like the, the federal government has just raided, raided and shut down an illegal Chinese vape factory. So this is an important clip. Let's go ahead and play. I don't know the number. It's 4, 4 12. Let's go ahead and play. This is a long clip, but it's an exclusive interview for 12.
- [43:07]
Charlie Kirk
First of all, Attorney General, I'd like.
- [43:09]
Andrew Colvett
To talk about the crime that we're.
- [43:10]
Charlie Kirk
Seeing in this country right now and.
- [43:12]
Andrew Colvett
The need to make sure we have.
- [43:13]
Brian Glenn
Judges what will prosecute these criminals and.
- [43:16]
Andrew Colvett
Stop releasing them onto our streets again.
- [43:19]
Libby Emmons
Well, we have to have judges that will keep them in jail, and we also have to have prosecutors who will argue to keep them in jail. In Charlotte, North Carolina, I believe we had a progressive, liberal district attorney who agreed with these judges that you could do a written promise to appear in court. And this Guy had had 14 arrests prior to violently, brutally murdering that young woman. No more in this country. We're going to fight back. We're going to take these cases federally whenever we can. He murdered her on a mass transit and that gave us jurisdiction.
- [43:53]
Andrew Colvett
Let's talk about the National Guard real quickly.
- [43:55]
Charlie Kirk
Some cities are saying, hey, we want.
- [43:57]
Andrew Colvett
The Trump administration to come in. We want the National Guard to secure our cities. What's your thoughts on going forward with.
- [44:04]
Charlie Kirk
The National Guard in other cities?
- [44:06]
Libby Emmons
President Trump has every intention of going forward with the National Guard in many cities throughout this country. But you know what he wants them to ask us, he wants them to cooperate with us to help make their cities and their states safe. Crime is rampant throughout this country. Look what we've done right here in D.C. it's beautiful. Now it's safer. It's getting even safer every single night with our Guard, with our dea, FBI, atf, US Marshals working hand in hand with park police, with Metro, with transit authority and the National Guard. So we're going to continue to do that. Stay tuned. We're going to continue to do that throughout this country.
- [44:41]
Charlie Kirk
Just a few weeks ago, parents and.
- [44:43]
Andrew Colvett
Kids, they went back to school now under the Biden administration, parents that they.
- [44:47]
Charlie Kirk
Showed up at a school board meeting.
- [44:48]
Andrew Colvett
They were basically deemed domestic terrorists speaking out. You just pushed out a memo about parents rights.
- [44:55]
Brian Glenn
Just talk about how important that is moving forward.
- [44:58]
Libby Emmons
It's extremely important to President Trump and our entire administration. Parents have the right to direct the moral, the educational, the religious leanings, dealings with their children. Not up to teachers, not up to school boards. Parents have the right to peacefully protest, to be heard at school board meetings and not to be declared domestic terrorists. We are going to protect our parents. And they in turn can protect their children from transgender books and elementary school to be safe to boys staying in boys bathrooms and girls staying in girls bathrooms.
- [45:33]
Andrew Colvett
Thank you. Great work there From Brian Glenn, the White House correspondent from Real America's Voice. And my understanding of that clip is that they were on their way to Chicago, Brian Cotter on the tarmac. Maybe he's traveling with her, I'm not sure. But that's the attorney General, Pam Bondi. And you see that, especially that clip, that portion of the interview where they're talking about the National Guard and these in these cities like Chicago. And then you contrast that with some of the footage that Nick Shirley got out of the west side of Chicago with those gangs and those rappers where they've all been shot and they protect their blocks almost like a mini nation state. And this cycle of violence continues on and on and on. And they even call it a war zone. Chiraq. They actually say it's a war zone. In the footage that Nick has. These are people living in America, but it is not like the America you or I probably know. It is much more dangerous, much more violent. And the cycle of destruction and death and murder just continues on and it spirals out of control. Something has to be done to stop the cycle. I think that's the message, that something has to be done to stop this cycle. And that requires bold action. That requires steamrolling these feckless Democrats that seem to love crime for some reason never fully understand it. But something has to be done. The cycle has to be stopped, and we have to make America safe again. And I hope that President Trump moves forward forcefully. Dr. James Orr from Cambridge with Charlie Kirk in the next hour. Don't go anywhere. We'll be right back.
- [47:23]
Charlie Kirk
Thank you, Andrew, for hosting hour one as we kick off our most ambitious tour yet at Utah Valley University. For hour two today, I have another amazing interview for you that I had a few weeks ago in Aspen with Dr. James Orr from the University of Cambridge. I think you'll really enjoy this. Email us freedom charliekirk.com Watch this. I could say the only conservative professor at Cambridge University, Dr. Orr, who is a contributing editor for Heritage and Culture @ JBC News, Dr. James Orr, everybody.
- [47:53]
Dr. James Orr
Good to be with you, Charlie.
- [47:55]
Charlie Kirk
Dr. Orr, great to see you. First, I want to just, you know, you sat through the presentation. You've been around all of this as a, as a Brit, as a professor, what is your take on this whole thing we have going on here?
- [48:09]
Dr. James Orr
Well, I got to say, first off, I was saying to Andrew earlier, it's a, it's pretty overwhelming for a Brit like me to see the scale of your success and of your ambition, what you've achieved. There's that, you know, lots of students at Cambridge claim they want to change the world, that they can go into jobs that are going to change the world. And I thought to myself this morning, you really could say that you are changing the world. As America goes, so goes the world. And that's what you're doing. You're doing extraordinary things in transforming America, recalling it to its founding ideals, promoting people of caliber and character and courage, particularly among the young. This is a huge problem for us on the right in Britain. We're working very hard on it. And I just felt both envious but also excited because I thought we can bottle some Kurt juice and take it over to Britain. We need to work out what the DNA is and we need to try to replicate it as best we can. It's hard to do that, particularly if you're a movement that's focusing on national pride and national distinctiveness and sovereignty and so on. You can't just copy and paste everything that you're doing. Of course, you have a very different constitutional setup, very different electoral dynamics, very different challenges in many ways. But I think philosophically, we're very much there. We're very much on the same page. That is to say, we want to Work out what the. Not so much what the politics of left and right is. I think that's the sort of the politics, the philosophy of what I call the long 20th century, 1914 to 2016. I think the long 20th century ended in 2016, and the politics of left and right ended in 2016. And we're now talking about the politics of national preference, the politics of national interest. This is still kind of shocking to the liberal ear, but this is the direction of travel for the new right on both sides of the Atlantic.
- [49:56]
Charlie Kirk
So what do you mean by that, the long 20th century?
- [49:59]
Dr. James Orr
Well, so historians like to talk about this, that periodizing in history is always very, very difficult. And, you know, it turns out that human development doesn't always obey neat, neat time periods. But of course, we know what we mean by the 20th century. But I think there are these sort of history doesn't quite obey those neat kind of neat, neat even divisions. And so historians will sometimes talk about the long 19th century that sort of began roughly in 1815 and probably ended in 1914. Right. 1815, Congress of Vienna. And then really you've got this extraordinary period of peace in Europe. And then 1914 is really the point at which that peace explodes. And so I think also we can talk about the long 20th century persisting in some ways beyond 2000 to 2016 as a fundamental watershed moment in how we think about national flourishing, how we think about politics, how we think about the organizing axes and horizons of national flourishing, of mutual flourishing.
- [50:57]
Charlie Kirk
Was that Brexit plus Trump? Is that why you think 2016 was the year that began the 21st century century?
- [51:03]
Dr. James Orr
I think that's right. I think it's always easy to conflate the two phenomena. They are distinct phenomena in lots of ways, but there's lots of overlaps too. And I think that it really marks a moment of change in the west. And it's very convenient point. It's not just Brexit and Trump. It's also the rise of pro nation national conservative movements all across Europe. You're seeing it with Vox in Spain, you're seeing it with Chega in Portugal, you're seeing with AfD in Germany, you're seeing it with the Raison Blame Nationale in France, the Fratelli dell Italia in. In Austria, you're seeing it in Italy. I'm sorry, and. And in Austria as well. All over Europe for deaths in Hungary and going at different speeds. And, you know, one of the challenges, conservatives are always trying to conserve what is our own. And so it's actually very Difficult to form. One of the communists used to have a com intern. It's very difficult to have a con intern because, you know, Marx could say, workers of the world unite. The progressives can say, wokesters of the world unite. Right. It's a fundamentally transnational ideology that's, that's very, very powerful. This is a movement, something that moves in lockstep before conserving our own nations. It's much harder to have that sense of international solidarity. But, you know, I think various movements are trying to catalyze that. The National Conservatism movement, which I'm proudly the chair of in the uk is helping to do that. And, and so, yeah, that's. That. That's a big challenge.
- [52:21]
Charlie Kirk
So, so what do you think led towards that national Conservatism moment? And let's go a step back and also take a moment to introduce yourself. You teach the Western canon at Cambridge, correct?
- [52:35]
Dr. James Orr
I wouldn't say I'm not allowed to teach the Western canon. It would be sort of too big. To give you an example, I teach a program in moral philosophy from Plato through to Nietzsche that includes Aristotle, it includes Augustine, it includes Aquinas, Kant, Hume. So. So as much of the kind of classic Western philosophers as I can fit in. And then I also teach an MPhil program. But broadly speaking, yes, I teach Western philosophers without, but not through the prism and not through the lens of kind of critical theory. I try not to politicize my teaching in any way. Of course, that itself is a political act these days. Just trying to be neutral, trying to. Trying to listen to these ancient, ancient thinkers on their own terms and not trying to force ideological kind of masks onto them. But yes, I see myself very much, you know, as trying to pass on what is best in the Western tradition. I think really universities have only, you know, three primary purposes. That is, to pursue the truth, to preserve the truth, and to pass on the truth. And then those are the kind of scenes, a little bit crude, but those are the kind of the three Ps, those are the sort of three. That's the way I sort of think about what I'm doing. So partly it is preserving the best of what has been said and thought in the west, but it's also not wanting to kind of, you know, be kind of inert in that. Always having that sort of sense of looking forward, testing, always, you know, probing, searching for new things, being open to novelty, open to change, but kind of anchored. Anchored in the great. In the great Western tradition.
- [54:10]
Charlie Kirk
So with that, with that backdrop, post World War II, there was somewhat of a new world order that was established, the neoliberal world order. And it was one that was based on free trade, that was based on both American dominance, but also kind of NATO expansionism, international cooperation, some could call it globalism. And liberalism seemed to be an inevitability. The famous book End of History by Francis Fukuyama was what, 1880s, I'm not mistaken.
- [54:45]
Dr. James Orr
92.
- [54:46]
Charlie Kirk
Okay, 1992, where he basically said, this is it. We've reached it. Like all the ideas that have been tried have led us to this moment. Classical liberalism, whatever you want to call it, liberalism is the best it's going to get. And congratulations, humanity, history is over. What happened From Fukuyama in 1992 to now, what you say, 2016 to now, where you go from this kind of hubristic, prideful, you know, kind of exaltation of liberalism to a completely different moment we're in now.
- [55:20]
Dr. James Orr
Yeah. Well, that book, the End of History by Francis Fukuyama is. It's a fascinating kind of moment of sort of. Kind of hubris, you might say, kind of misplaced optimism. But if you read the very end of that book, the actual full title of the book is the End of History and the Last Man. And he has this fascinating kind of final chapter or two of that book where he says, look, actually, this sort of sense of this end of history dispensation, where everything is. We've hit the sunlit uplands of the kind of liberal utopia and peace and prosperity for all, that, in the end, is not going to satisfy man's instinct. And this is particularly. This is what he calls the. The thumos. This is. This is. If we think of Plato's like, three levels, three level soul. You've got the noose at the top, the mind. Then you've got the thumas, which is courage. It's this sort of sense of the kind of the spirit that animates us. And then you've got the epithelium, which is kind of the base appetites. And Plato says, you've got to have all three of these in check. And what Fukuyama says is that there's a real danger that with this kind of. In the sunlit uplands of the kind of globalized utopia, we're going to suppress the thumos. But that thumos is not going anywhere. It's not going away. It will come back. And so he's very. He's not. He's not quite as naive as that. I think what's happened. You know that you might think of the quest for Thumas as the search for identity. In fact, Fukuyama wrote a very interesting book on identity where he sort of starts to concede that the kind of sort of Berkeley liberalism was never really going to deliver the goods.
- [56:51]
Charlie Kirk
We'll be back with more with James Orr, but first I need to tell you guys about Done With Debt. When you're buried in credit card and loan debt, it's human nature to put it off and say I'll deal with it later if that's you. Here's a hidden fact that the debt strategy experts at Dunwood Debt shared with me. They discovered a little known strategy that works in your favor to dramatically reduce or even erase your debt altogether. They aggressively engage everyone you owe money to in September and here's why. They know which lenders and credit card companies are doing year end accounting and need to cut deals. They even know which ones have year end audits and need to get your debt off the books. That means you need to get started with Done with Debt now in September. Dumb with that accomplishes this without bankruptcy or new loans. In fact, most clients end up with more money in their pocket in the first month. Get started now while you still have time. Go to dunwithdebt.com and talk one of their specialists for free. Visit dunwithdebt.com that is donewithdebt.com.
- [58:03]
Andrew Colvett
In three hours. Then four years at a woke university and it's free. The Charlie Kirk show.
- [58:14]
Charlie Kirk
Okay, now I need to tell you about our amazing partners at Y Refi. Go to y refi.com why refi refinances distress or defaulted private student loans which are different from federal loans. Let's face it, if you guys have a privately held student loan, nobody's coming to bail you out. Well, why refi offers a 3 minute rate check without any credit impact and it may not be available in all 50 states. We are about to start our campus tour and why Refi is the sponsor of it. If you go to yrefi.com you can read testimonials from other people who have been where you are and how they have escaped successfully. Why Refi is not a debt settlement company and they work with each borrower individually tailoring each loan. Each borrower's specific situation you will not be calling a faceless call center. Why Refi does not care what your credit score is. They provide you with a custom loan payment based on your ability to pay. Can you imagine being debt free and not living under this burden anymore. Why refi offers a 3 minute rate check without any credit impact. Go to yrefi.com that is yrefy.com you can get them released from the loan. It may not be available in all 50 states. Yrefi.com remember you can watch this full interview ad free on members.charliekirk.com as well as every other episode. Completely ad free. Sign up today to become part of the members only call. This week we had to take a break from my Asia trip but I'm ready to get back to the calls to talk to you soon.
- [59:55]
Dr. James Orr
And so I think, you know, the suppression of that sense of sense of self, sense of rootedness, sense of home, sense of distinctiveness and what we are and what we love, that was never going to be sort of erased by the liberal doctrines of the blank slate doctrines of human nature. We're rooted, we're rooted human beings, we're related to what's around us. We're conservative about what we love most about what's closest to us. And that's never going to go away. And we got to face up to reality as it is given to us and not as we would like it to be.
- [60:25]
Charlie Kirk
But what went wrong with the liberal project?
- [60:28]
Dr. James Orr
Well, I think the fundamental problem with the liberal project is that it's grounded on fundamentally mistaken assumptions about what it is to be human. The basic idea is that human beings are born into the world with completely independent, completely blank slate. This is a view of the tabula rasa or the white page. And we're completely free of all unchosen obligations. And there can be no obligations that we don't ourselves choose. And this is just a complete fantasy. I don't think it's an accident that the great liberal philosophers like John Locke and Immanuel Kant never had any children. Anyone who's had, anyone's had it, had a child will understand that the radical nature of dependency, that most basic bond we're born into the world with that most literally with a physical bond. We're attached to a physical bond to our, to our mothers. And so that was always going to be a problem that we're not, we're not blank slates. We are connected. We flourish most when we're connected to what is closest to us. And it's not natural to love what is closest to us. I was in France I think last month up in the mountains is beautiful Chateau addressing some must have been 50 or 60 I suppose Conservative right wing students from all across, I think probably, you know, 25 different nations. And I opened. I wasn't quite sure what I was going to say to them, that the organizers hadn't been very clear. So I found myself beginning the session by saying, who here has got the best mum in the world? And every hand went up and they looked around and they started laughing at each other. And I said, notice what you're not doing right now. You're not arguing with each other. You're not discussing what are the proper optimality criteria of being a mother. You're not. That would be a crazy, inhuman thing to do. It's a totally natural thing to think that your mum is the best mum in the world. And then I said, who here lives in the best country in the world? And everybody's hands went up. And my point was, I don't owe you an argument for why my country is the best country in the world any more than I owe you an argument for why my mom is the best mum in the world. Somebody who asks for an argument has had what the philosopher Bernard Williams calls one thought too many. That the person who has one thought too many is like the guy, the utilitarian. He walks up to the river and he sees two women drowning, his wife and a strange woman, and stops to ask what if that strange woman might win the Nobel Prize in public economics? That person has had one thought too many. It is a totally natural disposition of every human to love what is closest to their own. Aquinas sees this. Aristotle sees this at the beginning of one of the greatest works of politics ever written, Book one, page one of Aristotle's Politics. He says, how do we think about how we get on? How do we think about the life of the polis ta politica? He says, well, well, you know, we're born into the world and we're dependent upon each other. Male, female, men and women will bond, then they will have, then they will procreate. There'll be a family, a household, an oikos, but that won't be enough. That will be enough for daily needs, but it won't be enough for sort of, you know, more than daily needs. So you'll have a village and the village will come together, but that won't be enough either. You will need to grow into a polis for self defense and so on. A city state, as it were, a country, a nation. And that. Aristotle thinks, okay, that's pretty small in 5th 4th century BC Greece. But that was the functioning, that was the way in which Aristotle, that was his kind of optimal size for human beings to flourish to, as it were, fulfill their proper ends as human beings. And I think that's still the basic way of thinking about things. I think it's really what you see in Aquinas. I think it's what you see in the Bible as well.
- [64:34]
Charlie Kirk
Wow, there's so much there to think about. So let's pull one of those threads, which is that all the French young people at that chateau will raise their hand who lives in the greatest nation? Why does Europe not vote or believe that vocally in any of their politics? Let's now center our conversation around continental Europe and then we'll make our way to your home. If I may say so, continental Europe is a husk of its former self. It's an open air museum. It's sad. It's depressing. There are pockets, obviously, of joy and of history. But I think you would agree, Dr. Orr, it's not what it used to.
- [65:15]
Dr. James Orr
Be.
- [65:27]
Brian Glenn
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- [67:01]
Andrew Colvett
This is obviously a horrible, horrible situation, but this is why federal statutes exist. They exist to take care of situations like this because no, no one should sit in fear when they sit on the light rail. If you sit in fear on the light rail, you sit in fear. When you walk around the streets of our center city like I do every day. You sit in fear when you go to our parks like I do with my daughter every weekend. You sit in fear at our sporting events, our entertainment venues, at concerts, at restaurants, at our museums. These are all the things that we have worked as a city so hard to build. We built a city that people want to live in. But we can lose that all if we allow violent crime like this to go on in our streets. And I'm here to tell you the federal government is going to save our city from that of the MAGA doctrine and president of Turning Point usa, here's Charlie Kirk.
- [68:14]
Charlie Kirk
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- [69:27]
Dr. James Orr
Yeah, I think that's absolutely right. And we would, it would take a very, very kind of long, long conversation to really get to the bottom of it. I mean, one book I'd really recommend on this is actually by an American, Christopher Cal. Oh yeah. Reflections on the Revolution in Europe. This Is actually goes way back. It's 2009, which is a long time considering what's happened in the intervening period. But I think Caldwell really sort of. It's an incredibly prescient book and he starts to see the kind of. The sort of conditions of the unraveling kind of kicking in. And you're right, you know, after the Second World War, the French had what they call the Trente glorious, the 30 glorious years. In Germany you have, at least in West Germany you have the Vistschaft Wunder. You know, this economic miracle is extraordinary explosion of economic flourishing and national self confidence in West Germany. And I suppose, you know, 1989 has got to feature somehow in the story of Europe's decline or Europe's sort of. Once that, you know, the great bugbear of the Soviet Union and that great enemy of freedom everywhere had been dissolved, then I think there was a sense of, well, you know, before that there was a sense of what are we for? We know what we're for, we're for freedom. And this is something that is pretty uncomplicated and it's going to stitch us together as a kind of. As the West. It was easy to think about the west and it was easy to think about the rest. I think after, you know, 1989 into the 1990s, the fall of the Wall, that the fall of the Wall in a way sort of starts to mark the beginning of the kind of questioning what are we about? What is our story? What are we for? There's a fascinating moment in 2004 when the European Union is trying to work out a constitution. In the end it fails because it can't agree on anything really. And there's a huge debate about what goes in the preamble of the constitution. How do we set out right at the beginning of constitution we, the European Union, who are we? What makes us we? What makes us a we? They said, well, our Hellenic inheritance, Greece and Rome, the Classical inheritance. Yes, the Enlightenment inheritance as well. No mention of the Hebraic or the Christian inheritance. This was seen to be something that was low status, not something that wanted to be admitted. John Paul II is right towards the end of his life, 2004 and got involved and some Italian politicians got involved. There's a huge fight about it. And in the end the decision was no, we're not going to have any recognition of the fact that the European Union is in any way at all the successor to what it really was a successor to, namely Christendom and the Holy Roman Empire. And that which stitched Europe together as a sort of self conscious collective entity that was, that was gone. And I don't want to overstate that too much, but I think that it was an indicator, an index into the way in which the Europeans were beginning to run out of a sense of who are we? What are we for? Where do we come from? And then of course, with the emergence of a kind of technocratic, a democratically unaccountable Potemkin parliament in Brussels and Strasbourg. The parliament is in both places. Wait for this. For 100 million euros a year, the European Parliament moves from Brussels to Strasbourg. I think it's every fortnight back and forth.
- [72:41]
Charlie Kirk
How long's a fortnight?
- [72:43]
Dr. James Orr
Sorry, you don't have fortnights over here. It's 14 days, two weeks.
- [72:46]
Charlie Kirk
We do. Just trying to remember.
- [72:47]
Dr. James Orr
Yeah, fortnight two. So two. And it just sort of think about. They can't, couldn't resolve something as basic as that.
- [72:53]
Charlie Kirk
But they move back and forth.
- [72:54]
Dr. James Orr
They move back and forth. Yeah, just so the Belgians, you know, the kind of Franco German pact is happy and then the sort of, you know, the idea of there being a European Union beyond the Franco German alliance. So that's where you go, that's when you go to Brussels. So all these crazy things, crazy sort of features of the kind of European settlement and there's a kind of democratic deficit, you might say. I used to play this parlor game when I was, I'm now at Cambridge. I was at Oxford in 2016, just ahead of the Brexit vote. One of the parlor games I would play with my. I was the only out of the closet Brexiteer, as far as I know, in the whole of this college, among, I don't know, I think about 70, 80 colleagues. And I used to ask them, who's our MEP? Who's our member of the European Parliament? Like which. Who represents us? Who represents Oxford and the surrounding areas in Brussels, Strasbourg? And no one could answer, no one knew, not even the professors of politics. And there was no reason for them to know because it's a fake. It was and is a fake parliament with very little powers, Very, very little. Few veto powers, very few powers to initiate legislation. Nobody voted for them, nobody had any reason to know who they were. And so that has been a huge problem. That kind of sort of the European Union project has been, you know, from 1992 onwards, where it really became a self consciously political union and not just an economic and trade one. That's really been, it's been a disaster. And I hoped that in 2016, Brexit would be the first brick in the wall, that it would, it would catalyze a kind of domino effect. That was probably wishful thinking because particularly in the euro denomination. So you're in the euro nations, you know, it's one thing for Britain with, with its own pound, its own currency to break away. It would be much more dramatic, there'd be much more dramatic consequences if a euro country split away. But the Euro has been a disaster for the countries who have been members of it. I mean, Italy, for example, has scarcely had any GDP growth. I think it started to pick up recently, really, for the first 20 years of its being part of the euro, effectively nothing at all. Greece and Spain, youth unemployment was through the roof. Effectively. You've got the Spanish currency, the Greek currency, effectively being shackled to the German deutsche mark. And so the Germans weren't complaining because the currencies was artificially depreciated, their exports more attractive. And so it was all this kind of elaborate Ponzi scheme which at some point is going to unravel. And then somehow ideologically, within the elite forming classes in Oxford, in Cambridge and London, certainly in Britain, the idea is that to be European was to be part of the European Union. Those two are absolutely part and parcel. And I never understood this. You know, you can hate FIFA and love football, as I, as I've often said, you know, or soccer, I should say, you can hate FIFA, like the worldwide organization for soccer. And you can, and you can love soccer. In fact, you could hate. I hate FIFA because, because I love football. I don't like what FIFA's doing to international football. I don't like the corruption. I want the game to be a richer game. And I think it's the same with the European Union. And it's had this sort of deadly effect on our sense of what it is to be European.
- [76:09]
Charlie Kirk
What explains the hyper secularization of Europe post World War II? Why did we see such a dramatic drop off of church rates? Is it as simple as they saw tragedy and suffering and nihilism took the void? What? Because Europe has had depressingly low church rates and they just keep on finding new lows every decade. Where. What percentage of people in Europe do you think regularly attend church?
- [76:35]
Dr. James Orr
It varies quite a bit from country to country, but it is shockingly low relative to, certainly relative to the United States. So, you know, in Italy, it's, it's now very, very, very low. I think it's, it's certainly well below 5%. I mean, you Know, religious adherence is just a very difficult thing to measure. You know, is actually going to church, does it, does it, does it count as sort of being a Christian or being, being a churchgoer, you know, in Britain, you know, what, what caused it? I mean, it may be the opposite. I think, I think I'm more tempted to the analysis that actually it's prosperity and flourishing, particularly material flourishing and prosperity that tends to catalyze a sort of collapse in the sense of any need for meaning or any, any, any orientation to, to the transcendent. And I suppose Also in the 60s you're seeing the emergence of, of competing systems of meaning, competing accounts of what it is to have significance, competing sets of answers to life's deepest questions. We see that a lot of that imported from California and, and elsewhere. And I suppose the sort of something, you know, there's something fashionable about religious skepticism that was certainly true in the 60s. If you think back, you know, to the high noon of the New Atheists in 2005, you know, there was something very, very sort of elite. There was something very, a lot of cachet in being, in being an atheist. I'm tempted to think that new atheist, new atheism was just a politically correct way to be skeptical of Islam. I think that the timing works quite well there. But I think if you look in the last few years and I just saw some data out from, from Britain this morning, you know, I think between 18 to 35 year olds, belief in God has tripled over the last five years. Bible purchases has gone up by 87% over four years. Now. It's from a pretty low bait, low base. But something is happening out there. You know, it's still, it's quite, you know, it's still quite small. But the numbers among, among Gen Z, or Gen Z as you call them.
- [78:37]
Charlie Kirk
That something you call them Gen Z.
- [78:39]
Dr. James Orr
Well, because Zed is how you pronounce the letter in English. And I know you Americans have a different way of putting.
- [78:45]
Charlie Kirk
No, it's just, it's interesting. Interesting. So let's now take our attention to your country, which I had the opportunity to visit and you hosted us wonderfully in Cambridge.
- [78:57]
Dr. James Orr
Great to have you. Great to have you.
- [78:59]
Charlie Kirk
Quite the ambush. So not by you, but by Cambridge. But we survived it.
- [79:05]
Dr. James Orr
More than survived it.
- [79:06]
Charlie Kirk
Yeah, I think we triumphed, some could say. And so, and you were so sweet and so kind throughout that entire process. So the United Kingdom or Britain or England, whatever word we want to, want to give it, voted for Brexit in 2016, where are British politics today? What is the status of British politics?
- [79:30]
Dr. James Orr
Yeah, well, it's a great question. You know, in 2016, we have this extraordinary expression of the Democratic will in 17.46 million people voting for the principle that laws affecting the United Kingdom should be made in the United Kingdom and should be accountable to the people and voters of the United Kingdom. It's a very just, you know, seemingly an entirely uncontroversial principle, but it was the biggest vote of we've had in. In the history, in British voting history. And another key driver there was the sense of we're losing our sense. We're losing what it is to use the first person plural, as Roger Scruton, one of my favorite philosophers, likes to put it, that sense of we, we the people. What is it that makes a we? And what was going on in Brexit was this kind of inchoate kind of cry that we are losing that sense of who we are. That every time, for the last 40, 50 years, every time the British people have had an opportunity to express a view on mass demographic change and transition, it has said no or go much slower.
- [80:53]
Andrew Colvett
100% American made and darn proud of it. The Charlie Kirk Show.
- [80:59]
Charlie Kirk
It's time to get your tickets for America Fest, everybody. You don't want to miss it. Watch this. This America Fest promo. Watch this. America Fest is the starting point for us to take America to Greater Heights in 2025. We have a team that is ready to change the world and bring America back to greatness.
- [81:19]
Andrew Colvett
Experience the greatest celebration of America. Four days. Thousands of patriots, the loudest voices, the strongest leaders, featuring Charlie Kirk, Tucker Carlson, Steve Bannon, Jesse Watters, Greg Gutfeld, Grant Cardone, Rob Schneider, Matt Walsh, Michael Knowles, Glenn Beck, Riley Gaines, Todd Chrisley, Savannah Chrisley and more. December 18th to 21st in Phoenix, Arizona. The movement meets here. You won't want to miss this. Register now@amfest.com.
- [82:01]
Charlie Kirk
That'S amfest.com am fst.com and get your tickets. I'll see you next week in Colorado. You guys know how it works. Open mic. We're gonna be here for a couple hours, so get comfortable. So you would get rid of all borders?
- [82:12]
Andrew Colvett
Yes.
- [82:12]
Charlie Kirk
What species is the baby in the womb?
- [82:14]
Andrew Colvett
It's a human.
- [82:15]
Charlie Kirk
Therefore, they should have human rights.
- [82:17]
Libby Emmons
No.
- [82:18]
Charlie Kirk
He's a liar. You're a typical leftist because you only can care about yourself, not about the other people. It's very clear by how you're acting. What can I do to save the country? You answer that question every single day. You are doing something that is bigger than you. A lot of people how we doing?
- [82:34]
Andrew Colvett
I'm on the move like a runaway don't turn it back up and cut the pace I do not care what the others say Listen, I told you that I did not come to play we about to take it to higher heights History's waiting when I arrive Today is a D of a new.
- [82:54]
Dr. James Orr
We.
- [82:54]
Andrew Colvett
Came from the bottom and now we the bosses the future is yours if you give it your all you got nothing to lose.
- [83:30]
Charlie Kirk
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- [84:19]
Dr. James Orr
My Patriot Supply and every time its leaders have effectively ignored that clearly expressed will. And I think 2016 was a moment where suddenly it looked as if we might have the opportunity to finally regain control of our laws and regain control of our borders at the same time. What actually happened in the last five years? One in what have we had is one in 27 people in Britain have arrived in the last five years. One in 60 arrived in the last 18 months.
- [85:02]
Andrew Colvett
Months.
- [85:04]
Dr. James Orr
In the first 25 years of this century. Gross migration, gross immigration, talking 12 to 15 million people, that's roughly four to five times as many people who arrived on our shores in the first thousand years of our history. It's difficult to overstate, and I know you've had, you know, you've had enormous influxes too, under the Biden administration. But you're a much bigger, you've got a much bigger territory and you've got different kinds, different kind of categories of migrants coming in and you've at last got an administration that's willing to do something about it. But praise God for that. Indeed. And that has, but that has had a profoundly kind of traumatic shock on us Brits and it's had a kind of tectonic effect on the landscape of British politics. So what's happening in British politics? Well, quick Update. Last year, July 2024, we saw the Loveless landslide. So we see the Starmer government getting an astonishing 175 odd seats, majority in Parliament, which is an enormous, enormous majority and one of the biggest in living memory on only 20% of the vote, 20% of the people eligible to vote, something like 34% of the vote share. It was, you know, the sofa won, I mean, the couch won that election. It was a very low, very low turnout. Nobody, it was an apathetic election. Nobody seemed to care. Fast forward now. You know, we're just over a year in. Back in the first of May of this year, we had the local elections, which are a pretty good proxy. It's a bit like the midterms and not a bad proxy for what the country's mood in is. And I think, you know, Labour gets, goes from 34% to, to 20%. The Conservative Party goes down to 15% extinction level, almost an unprecedented low. And for the first time in a hundred years, a new party emerges, a third party to rival the duopoly that's had Britain in its grip since 1920, 1923, and that is Nigel Farage's Reform UK, which surged through to win 677 local seats, which if you extrapolate that out, is 30% of the electorate. That's an extra. They were at 14% a year ago. And that, that's going up and up and up. And what you're seeing for the first time in the history of British politics, since there have been political parties, let's say the Tories are emerging in like the 1670s, 1680s and really kind of bedding down in their modern form in the 1830s. For the first time in the history of British politics, there is another right wing party emerging, another Conservative Party, that is. It looks as if, in my view, we'll have to see what happens next. May we have some more proxy elections then? There'll be a general election in 2029, the last point that Keir Starmer can call it. But my sense is that Nigel Farage is on track to be the next Prime Minister of the United Kingdom.
- [88:08]
Charlie Kirk
That deserves some applause. So let's examine that deeper and more thoroughly. Some people in the audience will hear Wait, wait, hold on. The conservative Party, don't we like them? Explain what it means to be part of the conservative party. That's not exactly, you know, let's say the equivalent that we would have here in the United States of what we consider to be a conservative.
- [88:35]
Dr. James Orr
Yes, that's right. I mean, but even here, I suppose in the states, there are lots and lots of fascinating debates, states within the gop, within the Republican Party is talking about what is it to be a conservative, you know, is it to be, you know, Reaganite? Is it to be a fusionist? Is it to be a Trumpist? Is it to be a kind of compassionate Bushite conservative, whatever it might be?
- [88:55]
Charlie Kirk
Okay, I'll recap my Utah Valley tour stop for you tomorrow. Make sure you guys watch. God bless.
- [89:00]
Andrew Colvett
Talk to you then.
- [89:07]
Jack Bosobic
This is an I Heart podcast.