The Charlie Kirk Show, September 24, 2025

Summary

The Charlie Kirk Show – Real America’s Voice

September 24, 2025
Host: Andrew Colvett (Executive Producer, filling in for Charlie Kirk)
Key Guests: Dr. James Orr (Cambridge professor), Blake Neff (Producer), Tom Homan (Former ICE Head), Terrence Bates (News), and more.

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Episode Overview

This deeply emotional episode is the first major broadcast of The Charlie Kirk Show following the tragic assassination of Charlie Kirk, a prominent political commentator and activist. The show serves as a combination of tribute, reflection on Kirk's legacy, response to the recent wave of political violence (incidents targeting ICE and law enforcement), and a live discussion around the troubling escalation of political polarization and rhetoric in both the US and UK. Andrew Colvett, executive producer, leads a conversation with special guests—most notably, Dr. James Orr, a close academic friend of Charlie’s, and former Border Czar Tom Homan—about political violence, free speech, and the continued importance of Kirk’s mission.

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Key Themes & Discussion Points

1. Remembering Charlie Kirk: His Mission and Martyrdom

• Opening Tributes: Powerful, faith-centered eulogies highlight Kirk's sacrificial influence on college campuses, his dedication to spreading the gospel, and his message of repentance both in America and abroad.
  • “Charlie Kirk is in heaven because his Savior sacrificed himself for Charlie Kirk.” (D, 02:19)
  • “The lesson of Charlie’s life is that you should never underestimate what one person can do with a good heart, a righteous cause, a cheerful spirit, and the will to fight.” (D, 04:11)
• Martyrdom & Legacy: Parallels are drawn to Christian martyrdom, emphasizing that his death is the beginning of a lasting movement, not the end.
  • "The tyrant dies and his rule is over. The martyr dies and his rule has just begun." (A quoting Kierkegaard, 04:53)

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2. Escalating Political Violence — Focus on ICE Attacks

Reporting on Attacks ([08:16-16:39])

• Tom Homan: Discusses three recent targeted shootings against ICE/BP offices in Texas; attributes increase to inflamed anti-ICE rhetoric from politicians and media.
  • “Assaults on ICE officers are up over 1,000%. And no, the rhetoric hasn’t stopped...If the hateful rhetoric didn’t decrease, it’s going to end in bloodshed, someone’s going to die. And of course, I was called a fear monger...Unfortunately, I was right.” (F, 10:14)
• Impact on Law Enforcement Families: Homan describes personal toll—living with 24/7 security and separation from family due to credible threats.
  • “I have a 24/7 security detail because of threats against me...I’m not shutting up. I’m going to continue fighting.” (F, 15:35)
• Moral Responsibility of Politicians: Guests urge all political leaders to de-escalate divisive rhetoric that can incite violence.
  • “To every politician who is using rhetoric, demonizing ICE and demonizing CBP: stop. This has very real consequences.” (D, 18:58)

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3. The Threat to Free Speech & Cultural Legacy, US and UK

Reflections with Dr. James Orr ([20:32–44:01])

• Kirk as a “Modern Prophet”: Orr recounts Kirk’s notable intellectual curiosity, humility, and commitment to defending Western civilization’s foundational values.
  • “I have never come across a young person with that thirst for knowledge, that thirst for intellectual formation, spiritual wisdom… Extraordinary respect and humility.” (E, 22:50)
• UK Impact & Reaction:
  • Kirk’s campus debates, notably at Cambridge Union, challenged leftist “groupthink”. Orr notes a spontaneous vigil in London after Kirk’s death, describing the outpouring as “extraordinary."
  • “He genuinely was an Anglophile...calling our leaders to repent, calling our citizens to remember themselves." (D, 27:09)
  • “Thousands and thousands of people around the Cenotaph and Whitehall. Just so moving.” (E, 31:10)
• Free Speech in Crisis:
  • Both UK and US guests lament the demonization and dehumanization of conservatives, and the trend toward political violence or lawfare when speech fails.
  • “If one side is so quick to resort in the end to lawfare or warfare or violence… where does that leave liberalism?” (E, 30:46)

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4. Debate over Political Violence and Rhetoric

The Oxford Union Incident & Campus Culture ([38:55–44:01])

• Celebrating Violence: Outrage over Oxford Union president-elect George Abaronier’s celebratory messages about Kirk’s death.
  • “Charlie Kirk got shot. Let’s f**ing go.”* (Reported via A, 40:17)
  • The show calls for institutional accountability, condemning any normalization of violent rhetoric on elite campuses.
    • “Even if you disagree with Charlie...he did not deserve this. And for somebody to represent your school that would celebrate his death is shocking.” (D, 41:07)
• Data on Justification for Violence: Polls show 30% of young “liberal progressives” aged 18-39 believe violence is sometimes justified for political ends.
  • “That is extraordinary. That should be a sobering stat for anybody.” (D, 44:01)

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5. Media & Misinformation: Jimmy Kimmel Controversy ([62:08-75:11])

• Kimmel’s Comments: Backlash ensues after Jimmy Kimmel’s remarks allegedly blaming Kirk’s death on right-wing/MAGA influences, despite evidence otherwise.
• Apologies and True Contrition:
  • Dr. Orr differentiates between genuine Christian repentance and political non-apologies.
    • “Repentance...means a complete transformation of one’s mind...There cannot be civil discourse if it’s, you know, if one side is constantly paying the consequences for indiscreet speech or violent rhetoric and the other side effectively gets a free pass.” (E, 67:40)
• Right to Free Speech vs. Incitement:
  • The hosts and guests make clear that while they are free speech absolutists, celebrating or inciting violence is both morally and legally distinct.
    • “There is ugly speech, there is deranged speech, but there is not hate speech...But incitement...when you’re calling for violence for somebody...that’s illegal.” (A, 74:04)

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6. Political Violence Data: Manipulation & “Both Sidesism”

([96:33–103:40])

• Questioning the Narrative:
  • The show examines studies claiming right-wing violence dominates, pointing out how data is often manipulated to exclude or mischaracterize leftist violence (e.g., 2020 BLM/Antifa riots).
    • “One of these studies...was literally just compiled by an Antifa person...” (A, 97:24)
    • “The true character of a political movement comes out in moments of crisis and tragedy...the contrast is as clear as day between what happened in May 2020 [Floyd riots] and Charlie’s death...” (E, 102:56)
  • Notably, the aftermath of Kirk’s death was peaceful (“not a single arrest”)—contrasted sharply with left-wing riots.

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7. Vision for the Future: Continuing Charlie’s Mission ([105:10–108:54])

• Kirk’s Early Charisma:
  • Recollections of Charlie’s remarkable rhetorical talent and perseverance as a cultural leader from his teenage years.
• Inspiration and Call to Action:
  • Dr. Orr and others call for recommitment to Kirk’s values of “faith, family, flag, and freedom.”
  • “We must honor him in the months and years ahead. Honor his legacy...there’s a torrent of [Kirk’s influence] all over the west now.” (E, 108:06)
• Final Reflection:
  • “You and he shared a mission to save the west and we must do that. We must. It’s worth saving. It’s beautiful. And that was his passion.” (D, 108:54)

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Notable Quotes & Timestamps

• “You cannot defeat us. You cannot slow us. You cannot stop us. You cannot deter us.” (D, 03:21)
• “The lesson of Charlie’s life is that you should never underestimate what one person can do with a good heart, a righteous cause, a cheerful spirit, and the will to fight.” (D, 04:11)
• “Assaults on ICE officers are up over 1,000%. And no, the rhetoric hasn’t stopped...If the hateful rhetoric didn’t decrease, it’s going to end in bloodshed, someone’s going to die...” (F, 10:14)
• “Prophets are rejected. That is sort of the model. And he was a prophet taking the truth around the world, even to the UK.” (D, 32:43)
• “The true character of a political movement comes out in moments of crisis and of tragedy. And...the contrast is as clear as day between what happened in May 2020 and Charlie’s death...just so peaceful. There was nothing.” (E, 102:56)
• “What an exemplar he will be in death to so many, many who’d never really come across him before. As true, as I said in Britain, he’s being discovered for the first time by millions of Brits.” (E, 108:28)

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Important Segments & Timestamps

| Segment | Timestamp | |------------------------------------------------------|-------------| | Spiritual tributes to Charlie Kirk | 01:25–05:30 | | Tom Homan on ICE attacks & political rhetoric | 08:16–16:41 | | Reflections on Charlie’s UK trip, campus culture | 20:32–33:36 | | Spontaneous public vigils in UK | 31:10–32:43 | | Discussion of UK campus violence/apathy | 38:55–44:01 | | Jimmy Kimmel controversy; free speech analysis | 62:08–75:11 | | Data debate: media bias on political violence | 96:33–104:10| | Final reflections—Charlie's mission & inspiration |105:10–108:54|

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Tone and Language

Reflective and reverential, with undercurrents of urgency, indignation, and hope. The show fluidly moves from mourning and tribute to analytical critique of the media, politics, and cultural direction in both the US and UK. The hosts maintain a mix of faith-informed optimism and hard-nosed political realism, heavily using Christian terminology and emphasizing historical and philosophical context.

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For Listeners New to the Episode

• This is not a standard news breakdown, but a living memorial and wake-up call.
• The episode is essential for understanding the climate of contemporary political violence, especially how opposing ideologies frame and react to tragedy.
• It captures the breadth of Charlie Kirk’s influence—intellectually, culturally, and spiritually—while showing the fraught landscape of debate, free speech, and social breakdown on both sides of the Atlantic.
• It features both emotional first-person stories and vigorous intellectual debate, offering a holistic sense of the issues at stake after Kirk’s assassination.

Transcript

[A]

This is an iHeart podcast.

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[E]

Today, Charlie Kirk rests in glory in.

[D]

Heaven for all eternity. He has gone from speaking on campus in Wisconsin to kneeling at the throne of God, where he is right now.

[F]

Verily, verily, I say unto you, this is Christ speaking. Except a corn of wheat fall onto.

[D]

The ground and die, it abideth alone. But if it die, it bringeth forth much fruit. And I want to thank Charlie for his sacrifice, because much fruit is going.

[A]

To be realized now.

[E]

I want you to know that Charlie.

[D]

Right now is in heaven. Not because he was a great husband.

[E]

And father, not because he saved millions.

[D]

Of kids out of darkness on college.

[E]

Campuses, not because he changed minds and.

[D]

Chased votes to save the country. Not because he sacrificed himself for his Savior. Charlie Kirk is in heaven because his Savior sacrificed himself for Charlie Kirk.

[E]

But the main thing about Charlie and.

[A]

His message, he was bringing the gospel to the country. He was doing the thing that the.

[E]

People in charge hate most, which is.

[A]

Calling for them to repent.

[B]

I believe Charlie is still urging us on, urging us not to sit back, not to be quiet, but to carry on his mission forward, loudly, proudly, and with the same conviction he showed.

[A]

Sacrifice is a gift. Sacrifice is that last full measure of devotion for God, for country, and for his people. We will devote the rest of our lives to finishing the causes for which.

[D]

Charlie gave his last measure of devotion. You cannot defeat us. You cannot slow us. You cannot stop us. You cannot deter us.

[A]

We will carry Charlie and Erica in our heart.

[D]

But we go forward strengthened by his faith and bolstered by his courage and inspired by his example to defend the country he lived for. You see, Charlie Kirk was a true believer for the cause of freedom, for.

[A]

The power of young people, belief in our republic and our founding principles in.

[D]

America first and make America great again. But more importantly, he was a true believer.

[A]

Only Christ is king, our Lord and savior.

[D]

The lesson of Charlie's life is that you should never underestimate what one person can do with a good heart, a righteous cause, a cheerful spirit, and the will to fight.

[C]

Fight, fight.

[D]

Charlie lived what our founders envisioned.

[B]

Freedom, the right to speak even when we disagree. Freedom. I may not agree with what you say, but I will fight to defend.

[D]

To the death with my very life.

[B]

Your right to speak.

[C]

Now.

[D]

Our whole administration is here, but not just because we love Charlie as a friend, even though we did, but because.

[A]

We know we wouldn't be here without him. In the words of Soren Kiergaarden, the tyrant dies and his rule is over. The martyr dies and his rule has just begun.

[B]

On the cross our savior said.

[D]

Father.

[B]

Forgive them, for they not know what they do. That man.

[D]

That young man.

[E]

I forgive him.

[B]

There's a lot going on in Hollywood. How are you supposed to stay on top of it all? Variety has the solution. Take 20 minutes out of your day and listen to the new daily Variety podcast for breaking entertainment news and expert perspectives.

[C]

Where do you see the business actually heading?

[B]

Featuring the iconic journalists of Variety and hosted by co editor in chief Cynthia Littleton.

[D]

The only constant in Hollywood is change.

[B]

Open your free iHeartradio app, search daily Variety and listen now.

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Stop settling for weak sound.

[D]

It's time to level up your game and bring the boom.

[A]

Hit the town with The Ultra Durable LG XBoom Portable speaker and enjoy vibrant sound wherever you go. Elevate your listening experience to new heights because let's be real, your music deserves it. The future of sound is now with LG XBoom. And for a limited time, save [e-mail] with code Fall25. Bring the Boom XBoom.

[E]

Every day is a battle for your mind.

[D]

Raging information coming from every angle with.

[C]

The will to deceive.

[D]

Fear not, you found the place for truth.

[A]

The voice of a generation that still.

[D]

Has the will to believe in the greatest country in the history of the world. This is the Charlie Kirk Show. Buckle up. Here we go, everybody. Welcome to the Charlie Kirk Show. This is Andrew Colvett, executive producer of this show. And that empty chair reminds us of Charlie's legacy, his memory and the fact that political violence took his life. An assassination did. And this Morning, we awoke to more news of political violence targeted at ICE in Texas. And to start off the show, and we had a whole show planned, but I thought it was important that we do this simply. It hits very close to home for this team, I can tell you. And so I wanted to have border czar Tom Homan kick off the top of the show with us. So borders are. Homan, thank you for joining us. What can you tell us about what happened in Texas?

[F]

Well, this morning, a lone gunman was targeting an ICE facility in Dallas, Texas. It's where aliens are processed either for removal or transfer to a facility. And again, it's the third shooting that's occurred in Texas against immigration officials. And we had a shooter show up at a border patrol facility and open fire trying to kill border patrol agents. He was killed by agents. Then we had a group of people show up with weapons at an ICE detention facility in Alvarado, Texas, and try to kill ICE agents. And they did shoot one officer, a local police officer who was also responding to the scene. And now we have this today, where a lone gunman stood at perch and opened up on ICE during a transportation transfer. And we know we have at least two dead and officers are uninjured. And it later was announced by Cash Patel that one of the bullets had an anti ICE slogan on the bullet. So this was clearly a targeted attack against ice.

[D]

Well, borders are. I just know that Charlie, this is his show, he was such a supporter of yours and was worried for our brave men and women in law enforcement that were doing what the voters had voted for very, very clearly, to remove illegal aliens from this country. And we've seen these stats that the targetings are on the increase, that assaults against ICE officers. Are we still seeing a ramp up? I mean, this instance is awful. Thank God no law enforcement were harmed or injured. But, you know, our prayers are with the families of the detainees that have lost their lives. But are we seeing this continue to ramp up across the country? Are we still seeing it go up? Are we seeing any calming down of the violence and the attacks against ICE officers?

[F]

First of all, you're right. I had many discussions with Charlie and he always ended the discussion to be safe and that ICE officers should be safe because the rhetoric has continued to increase. Assaults on ISIL officers are up over 1,000%. And no, the rhetoric hasn't stopped. And I said months ago, months ago that if the hateful rhetoric didn't decrease, it's going to end in bloodshed, someone's going to die. And of course, I was called a fear monger. The left says I was making irresponsible comments. Unfortunately I was right. And just this past weekend we saw protest turned criminal in Chicago and in Boston. I mean in Chicago, the ICE facility is under attack. Portland, in Portland, Oregon, the ICE facility there has been under attack for months. So you know, no, it has not slowed down either. Has the hateful rhetoric from some up on Hill, some are congressional representatives and other people who are in a position where that small fraction, I would say on the left, not everybody on the left is a bad person, most of them aren't. But there's that fraction that listens to this rhetoric and they feel empowered to take action against ice. If you've got a member of Congress comparing ICE to the secret police, which is a direct affiliation with the Nazis or calling straight out Nazis to terrorists or Governor Newsom just recently said the secret police, I mean he just passed legislation about. I mean bottom line is that rhetoric is causing some of this violence. And I've been calling for people to stop the hateful rhetoric because it's more are going to be hurt. Matter of fact, when we talked about the person that was shot at the Elbow City and we talked about the gunman that was killed at the border patrol facility, I said at that time there's going to be more if the rhetoric doesn't stop. I've seen this game before. I've seen this story before and I just hate to see it right now. I hope between what happened to our officers across the country, what happened to Charlie and what's happened today, I mean at what point do people just stop the hate? You can disagree what ICE does, but taking those sort of actions, it's just, it's unbelievable. There's no excuse for it.

[D]

I want to show you a graphic. I'm going to put up a graphic. It's basically who, which groups justify violence based on age and political affiliation. If you could put up 141. This is the question, is it ever justified for citizens to resort to violence in order to achieve political goals? And this is the percentage responding, yes. And you can see there, Tom, at 18 to 39 year old liberal progressives, that's 30% believe that sometimes violence is justified to achieve a political goal. And I believe that matches with what happened to Charlie. I don't know the age of this particular shooter in Texas, but we are seeing an alarming rise. And by the way, it's worth noting, conservatives 18 to 39 are the most peaceful node on there Besides moderates over 60. So we're doing our part on the right to quell the violence, to quell the rhetoric, to say, lean into Jesus. Do not give in to hate. Forgive your enemies. We have to find a solution here. And yet that one node, you can see it, it sticks out like a sore thumb there, Tom. 18 to 39, 30% of them believe violence can be justified. Your thoughts?

[F]

Well, it's not the country I grew up in. I mean, you never heard of this when I went to college. You never heard kind of this. It's justification for violence ever. I really think many of the colleges have failed us and also think that the negative publicity being pushed by 90% of the media, 90% of the media constantly attacking this administration and the work we're doing. And I've said it before, I think there's groups out there that hate President Trump more than they love their communities or more than they have any common sense. There's no reason for it. I mean, it's just. It's out of control. And you're right, the last four years on the Biden administration, everybody was angry about the border. Everybody's angry about what? The number of Americans dying from fentanyl, the vast increase in sex trafficking, the cartels having placement in this country, killing millions of Americans with poison. You didn't see that counter protest that turned criminal. So it's mainly on one side. And again, I'm hoping today, on top of everything that's happened in the last few months, let's stop the hate. Let's have a meaningful debate, which Charlie was all supportive. Let's have a debate about the issues. Let's get back to talking. Rather than putting bullets in a firearm.

[D]

Tom, I want to make this personal. About one minute remaining. I know that this kind of rhetoric has directly impacted your life and your family. Whatever details you can share, I want the audience to know what the real impact is for real people like yourself. One minute.

[F]

I have a 24. 7 security detail because of threats against me. I don't live with my family because I don't want them around danger as much as I can. So, you know, it's tough, but I'm not going away. I'm not shutting up. I'm going to continue fighting to make this country great again. President Trump made a promise to the American people. He brought me to help him in that promise to make America safe again. And we're going to continue working to remove the worst of the worst illegal ambulance in this country to make our community safer. Hard stop.

[D]

Well, God bless you. Sir, thank you for joining the show. I thought it was important to lead with that. And on behalf of a grateful nation, Tom, thank you for your service. Thank you for your courage, thank you for your voice and thank you for the results because this is what the American people voted for and we will not be deterred. The truth will be the truth and we cannot be cowed by these vigilantes and we got to do something about it, but we will not be cowed. Tom Homan, thank you so much. Borders are for the Trump administration.

[F]

Thank you, sir.

[D]

More when we get back from break. We'll be right back.

[B]

There's a lot going on in Hollywood. How are you supposed to stay on top of it all? Variety has the solution. Take 20 minutes out of your day and listen to the new daily Variety podcast for breaking entertainment news and expert perspectives.

[C]

Where do you see the business actually heading?

[B]

Featuring the iconic journalists of Variety and hosted by co editor in chief Cynthia Littleton.

[D]

The only constant in Hollywood is change.

[B]

Open your free iHeartradio app. Search Daily Variety and listen now.

[A]

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[D]

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[A]

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[C]

Terence Bates here with your Real America's Voice news break. Thanks so much for being here with us. We're working to update you on the latest information involving this morning's shooting at a Dallas ICE facility. Investigators now confirming that at least one victim is dead, two others hurt. However, police are only confirming that no law enforcement official was hurt. There's no confirmation about who the victims are or in what capacity they were at that facility.

[D]

Politically motivated violence is wrong. It was two weeks ago today that we saw a political assassination in Utah that tore the heart out of much of this country. This is the third shooting in Texas directed at ICE or cbp. This must stop. To every politician who is using rhetoric.

[E]

Demonizing ICE and demonizing cbp, stop.

[D]

To every politician demanding that ICE agents be doxed and calling for people to go after their families, stop. This has very real consequences.

[C]

A sniper went on a shooting spree from a nearby rooftop and eventually killed himself. The FBI is investigating the attack, quote, as an act of targeted violence, saying that as you can see here on your screen, some of the bullet casings had anti ICE messages on them. DHS Secretary Kristi Noem posting this message on X writing, while we don't know motive yet, we know that our ICE law enforcement is facing unprecedented violence against them. It must stop. Please pray for the victims and their families. Well, it looks like the federal government will be shut down this time next week. While House Republicans passed a continuing resolution that would keep government agencies funded until November 21, the Senate failed to pass a similar measure and won't return to Washington until right before the deadline to pass a funding bill. Plus, President Trump just canceled a meeting with top congressional Democratic leaders to discuss ways to avert a potential shutdown. That's a quick check of your headlines. I'm Terrence Bates.

[D]

All right. Welcome back to THE Charlie Kirk show. This is Andrew Colvett, executive producer of this show. I am joined by Blake Neff, one of the producers, as well as the great Dr. James Orr. Honored to have you doctor on the show. Candidly, of all the conversations I've had and we've had some amazing guests and some amazing conversations over the last couple of weeks, this is probably the one I'm most excited about because of the way that you and I got to meet. Charlie was there. You met Charlie on his when he went to Cambridge and Oxford, Oxbridge, as you guys, I guess, call the grouping. But we then spent a weekend together in Aspen and we shared some just truly amazing moments. And you also sat down with Charlie for an interview, which will now sort of in a haunting way, but in a beautiful way because I know how much Charlie loved you. Your interview with Charlie on that Aspen trip was actually the last episode that went on the Charlie Kirk show broadcast before he was assassinated. So it's a weird thing, I'm sure, to hear that from me. It's weird for me to say it out loud, but it's true. And I just knew Charlie so well that again, it's sort of fitting because you were like this academic, ideological, spiritual just shining light for Charlie. So much so that I was jealous. When we got back from Aspen, Charlie looked at you and he was like, can you hang out with me on Sunday and just like be my professor for a day? And as far as I know, you guys hung out on Sunday and you talked about the classics and about the canon of Western civilization. And I love that because I know that that was basically the happiest you would ever see Charlie Kirk. So thank you so much for giving him that day so close to the end and for just being somebody that he deeply, deeply loved and appreciated.

[E]

Well, Andrew, thank you. It's just so good to be with you despite the circumstances. And gosh, what a surreal few days it's been. What an extraordinary achievement you guys pulled off. I was so thrilled to have been able to make it to the stadium on Sunday for that, that extraordinary day. And just so many thoughts going through my mind. But, you know, I've been teaching undergraduates, graduate students at Oxford and Cambridge on and off for 15, 16 years, and I can say, you know, hand on heart, I have never come across a young person with that. That thirst for knowledge, that thirst for intellectual formation, spiritual wisdom. You know, I spent weeks trying to. Trying to get him to call me James, but it was always, always Dr. Orr. It's always this sort of extraordinary respect and humility that he had. And you're right. That last afternoon, just before I was getting off to the airport, I think that morning, a car was supposed to pick me up to take me to his apartment. And Mikey, Charlie's chief of staff, rang me and said, I've canceled the car. I said, how am I going to get to Charlie's apartment? He said, no, no, he wants to come and pick you up from the hotel so that he can have more time with you. And we had a day together. We had a wonderful morning and went into his apartment and, yeah, two, three hours of just philosophy, just grilling me on. It's that big, big whiteboard. He wanted me to, you know, map out moral philosophy. Help. He was just prepping, prepping, prepping. What if I get this question? What if I get that question? It was just extraordinary and absorbing it all, taking notes, grilling me, yes, I understand that point, but how do I make it accessible? And there was always this sense of this, the audience that he wanted to reach and, and, and not. And not be in conflict with. Not, not to. Not to sort of dunk on them at all, but to inform them, to educate them, to enlighten them. Just extraordinary. And then got back to London. I'm getting texts from him, Bible verses from him, and then a text on, oh, that lecture by Jean Paul Sartre he mentioned on existentialism in 1946. Can you send me a copy? And can you explain to me that point? Okay, let's do it. And did that. And then on. My last text from him was on 1st September, saying, Can you send me a lecture on natural law? And. And God help me, I never got back to him. It was yeah, it was. It was a busy week and I thought, I've got to sit down and do this properly. And. And then, you know, by the time things had calmed down, it. It had happened. And, yeah, I'd never met anyone like him. And, you know, you meet people who know that there's just. You're going to be friends for years and years and years and you're going to learn so much from each other. And we had great plans. He was so excited about Britain. He loved it so much, was staring now this photo of Winston Churchill and was so excited about what was happening on the right in Britain and wanted to know exactly what all the kind of. All the polling dynamics were and how he could help. Extraordinary.

[D]

You were a really important bridge for him and he was an Anglophile, begrudgingly, but he. He genuinely was. And we'll get into more of that and what his trip to England, I think, really was all about. We'll be right back. So, yeah, I mean, I mentioned just before we hit the break that Charlie was a real Anglophile. I don't think that many Brits maybe appreciated that because he came into England and really lit up the leadership, lit up the current zeitgeist in the country. But it has become clear to me that Charlie, and I've said this a bunch of times, I'm just going to say it again for the sake of this conversation, that Charlie was a modern prophet and he was going around campuses, this country, calling our leaders to repent, calling our citizens to repent, to remember themselves. And he went straight into the belly of the beast in Oxbridge and called on Brits to remember themselves. Stand up, man. Put your shoulders back. Remember who you are. You're a great people, like, wake up. And just like they do with profits, not only is Charlie dead, but in England they rejected him. Tell me about your perspective on that.

[E]

Well, I think it was Jordan Peterson who first connected us about a year ago, I think. And so he was. Charlie had been on my radar for a while. We had a lot of mutual friends. But he was very excited about his trip to England and started peppering me with texts and requests like, what will the audience be like? What are the kinds of questions that I should be thinking about? What are the topics? You know, he was just prepping, prepping, prepping. And so he came to Cambridge. I went to the Cambridge Union to just give him some moral support with my son and half a dozen students, and we were the only ones supporting him. My goodness. It was all.

[D]

And Blake.

[E]

And Blake, you Were there, of course, and the team. You and the team were there. And, and it was, it was, it was impressive. I mean, it was. He was combative, he was quick. He was. I don't think anyone, any of those students, and they were bright students. I was quite, you know, in a funny way, proud of those, those students. I mean, they were, you know, off the cliff, progressive on a whole load on all the issues. But I thought they, they stood their ground well. And, and then we went for this meal afterwards and just again, two, three hours of just talking and talking stats and I got a call from one of the. This big media platform, GB News, just desperate to get half an hour of Charlie's time. But it was, it was down in London, it was just awkward to get to. I said, look, I know this is difficult, but if you could just, you know, would you consider this? And he said, absolutely, no problem. And you managed to fit it into that very tight schedule.

[D]

That was with Ben.

[E]

Yes, that's right, with Ben.

[D]

That clip went viral.

[E]

Yes.

[D]

It was a good thing. He fitted it.

[E]

It's great. He did it and it was much appreciated. And so, you know, I think it was, it was great. And I sat in that debating chamber and thought, this, this is a proper debate. You know, this is what this place was designed for. And this is really puncturing the groupthink in a way that is pretty rare these days on elite campuses on both sides of the Atlantic. And it was. We were fortunate to have him. And then we got some images there. Yeah, there we go.

[D]

The bouncy Brit, the bouncy British.

[E]

Oh, bless him. Yeah, he, he, that was. Charlie found that so funny.

[D]

He looks like a Harry Potter figure.

[E]

That's it. He was, yeah, quick on his feet, just slithering up and down and. Yeah, amazing. I remember that so well. And it was, it was just great to see. And as I said, it punctured the group think. And you know, I've, I've said this before that the trouble with, with groupthink is that wrong think becomes evil think, you know, when there's just this tiny minority opinion, then that it just becomes subversive. It becomes something that is, that is threatening. And so it's so easy to demonize. And what we saw on both those debates was Charlie's ability to put across cases and positions in a winsome, civil, respectful way. And, you know, I think the assassination has just, it's triggered off a whole lot of very interesting debates on the free speech side of things, of course. And Charlie's great Free Speech Warrior. We've been fighting a lot on free speech battles on university campuses and. But, you know, if this is, if this is how it ends, if one side is so quick to resort in the end to lawfare or warfare or violence, what do we do? Where does that leave liberalism? Where does, where does that leave before we move on?

[A]

You know, we've seen the reaction around the world, but those Cambridge students who came out to support Charlie last May, how. How have they reacted to this?

[E]

Well, they've. I tell you, they've been in. They've been in. In pieces. They've. They've. It's. It's been very upsetting for them. And my son in particular, who just worshiped Charlie, and Charlie recorded a little video for him, actually, when we. I was here at the offices a month ago. It's been very hard. And even those who, who didn't know him at all, I mean, we gathered the two days after it happened, Friday, it was the Friday evening outside Downing Street. A pretty spontaneous vigil. Thousands and thousands of people around the Cenotaph and Whitehall. Just so moving. Just this very kind of. Very unusual to see that in London. It just sort of. It was. There was a sense of great, great kind of peace and love radio back here.

[D]

Yeah, we'll take radio back, but I love where this is going. Stay right there. Welcome back to radio stations across the country. We have Dr. James Orr, who is a brilliant man and you're a professor at Cambridge University. And you welcomed Charlie to the uk. You helped with get these debates set up for Charlie, which would be one of his last big trips. And it's hard to think about that. He loved that trip. He loved meeting you. You are so dear to him. And I know that you guys had great plans to keep learning from each other, and you are yourself becoming sort of known politically in the uk. And I know that you enter into that with fear and trembling and a great weight on your shoulders, and we can get into that a little bit later. But I love what we're talking about. You were. You were witnessing the immediate aftermath of the assassination, and there was huge vigils throughout the uk. And I said something that before, that prophets are rejected. That is sort of the model. And he was a prophet taking the truth around the world, even to the uk. But there was a remnant that heard what he said. And then you had Tommy Robinson lead this huge march. Elon Musk called in. They talked about Charlie. I saw so many people with Charlie's picture and they were chanting, Charlie Charlie. It was really beautiful for me to see this outpouring of love for Charlie even across the pond.

[E]

What.

[D]

What was that like? Take us into that moment.

[E]

Yes. Well, I. I didn't go on, on that march, but I know that over the summer there was a lot of anxiety in the press within the establishment about. About it. And I remember talking to Charlie about it last. Last month, and, you know, there were just sort of, you know, premonition people thinking that this. This is going to. This is going to end violently. It was. It was. It was demonized. And I think, you know, one silver lining, you might say, is that I think the march, from what I can tell, was broadly peaceful. I mean, there were about 100,000 people marching through the streets, and I think there was something like 25 arrests, which I think, you know, when you compare it to similar kinds of events, it's not out of the ordinary at all. And it was, from what I could tell from just looking at the footage, it was peaceful. And I'm sure that that sense of it being a vigil for Charlie, of being a sort of witness to Charlie, as you say, his face was all over, you know, posters everywhere of him. And I think that would have had a calming effect on the march. And. And I think there was a great atmosphere. From what I could tell, it was broadly demonized in the mainstream media afterwards, as far as I could tell. But I think it went off a lot better than many people were worrying about over the summer.

[D]

Yeah, well, and to the point about violence. And I know that there's an establishment press that is even more entrenched in the UK than there is in the US and they still have more power to sort of set narratives and things. And so that's certainly something that needs to be addressed in the uk but the point is, you had all these people that have a lot of reason to be upset about things, but they are largely peaceful. And that's the actual truth. The actual truth is that it was sort of beautiful and really respectful. And we got a note yesterday. I can't divulge who this is from, but this note was passed along, said, just got off the phone with friend, won't say the name, who is swat, and was tasked with working the memorial for Charlie here in Glendale, Arizona. He said they were all briefed to 100% expect something major to happen. And the whole event came and went without one arrest between Peoria Mesa, Glendale and Phoenix PD, all assisting a complete anomaly for an event even 10% this.

[A]

Size, even the Super Bowl Would have someone get drunk and, like, punch a guy.

[D]

Yeah, they didn't have one arrest. And the power of prayer. You know, I keep saying this over and over again. The first time in my life that I can feel the prayers of strangers just sustaining this whole team through Turning Point. Turning Point action. The Charlie Kirk Show. You can feel it. And you could feel the prayers inside the memorial. And you were there, you actually made it back, which is a whole other saga, which is incredible. And I think such a honor. Charlie would have been just so honored to know what you went through in order to get, like, planes, trains and automobiles for you in that trip. But I want to do. I do want to stay on the uk do you think? You know, a lot of people are talking about this as a revival moment in the US A lot of people are talking about this is the turning point. This is a politically galvanizing moment. Do you feel like this is having at least some sort of the same effect in the uk it's had extraordinary.

[E]

Reverberations all across Europe, I think, and definitely, definitely in Britain, I'm having conversations with people about faith, about family, about freedom, about loving your country that I simply was just very, very difficult to have before. And he's unleashed something extraordinary. A lot of people didn't really know who Charlie was. I think in Britain, it was only when the news broke, people started, you know, you know, the framing, I think even on the BBC. The BBC to start with at least, was saying his is a far right character. Some of the, some of the press were just, were demonizing him. But very quickly that, that shifted and it was just, just, just obvious he was, you couldn't mistake it. He was an extraordinary husband, loving father, civil, respectful in his engagement with. With young people. And that came across very, very quickly. And so it's been remarkable the kind of conversations that have opened up. And I think his legacy is going to be a remarkable one. I think we're having these big debates in Britain at the moment around exactly these kinds of issues and all of those sort of, those great sort of four cornerstones, I think, of the faith, family, flag and freedom that would just celebrate in that extraordinary way in the stadium on Sunday. And it's very difficult still in Britain to have conversations around, around those. But something's shifted. And I'm sure that Charlie's legacy will be to catalyze that and to put those issues back on the table. And they're going to be right, you know, front and center of the British political landscape over the next five Years.

[D]

I just want to make sure you're getting. Because you and James. You and James. You were in England with James. So I just want to make sure I'm giving.

[E]

Blake has views on what's happening over there. Of course.

[A]

Of course. You know, before we move on too far from the debate. I know this is. I followed this. You definitely followed it. But I don't know that a lot of people in the US Know about this. That one of the Oxford Union people that Charlie met when he debated there, he posted something about Charlie's death that was. That was pretty bad. And there's been a backlash to that.

[E]

Yeah, absolutely. So the. I think it's the incoming president of the Oxford Union.

[D]

Do we have that?

[E]

Who debated Charlie back in May, I think said something. I can't remember the words.

[D]

He said yes long. He.

[A]

So President Elect George Abaronier, who. There is an image of them debating. I'll get that loaded to our team so they can put this up. Get that asap, guys. So he posted. He debated chart. He was one of the people who debated him. He was actually appeared to sell. He shared multiple celebratory remarks about the shooting on WhatsApp. According to the Oxford student, one message said, charlie Kirk got shot. Let's effing go. And the other said, scoreboard. Fn. I don't know what that means. I think Ryan would probably be able to tell me what that means. But basically, scoreboard. I mean, it's like basically put a point on the board because we took one down and you can probably tell us more about what happened.

[D]

So has he been punished for this?

[E]

So there was a big debate kind of blew up afterwards. I. To be honest, I was so upset at the time. I was just trying. I was tuning out of the. The negative reactions, and I was trying not to dwell on it too much, but I was getting a lot of texts from people who were signing a letter of. Effectively a letter of no confidence. And I think the threshold is. I think it's something like 150. So if you were an officer of the Oxford Union in the past, you would. You could. You could force. You could force a resignation. I'm not. I think they've hit about 70 signatures and we are.

[D]

I mean, it's very damning. Yeah.

[E]

I mean, I think it's touched a nerve because, you know, the worry is, is this. You know, is this legitimate speech?

[D]

Is this.

[E]

Is this. He was, you know, should he be. Should he be expelled for this? Should he be rusticated?

[D]

Okay, but. But hold on. That this is one of these stupid academic cul de sacs that people that are, you know, educated but beyond their intelligence get themselves into. And this is like, I'm sorry, Charlie Kirk was murdered. Assassinated. Do you think it's okay that Martin Luther King or JFK or Lincoln or whoever was assassinated? Do we think that this is okay? Do we think political violence. Okay, listen, I understand if some fringe character on some discord chat thinks that it's, you know, it's gleeful, but that is, that person does not represent Cambridge or Oxford. That is supposed to be a premier institution. I'm calling, I hope this gets clipped. I am calling on you sane left wing students that are still, you know, advocates for civilization to sign that petition, that letter, whatever it is, get it to 150. That is not okay. Even if you disagree with Charlie. Charlie was a fundamentally good and decent loving husband and father who believed in the building blocks of Western civilization. He did not deserve this. And for somebody to represent your school that would celebrate his death is shocking that you cannot get 150 people to put their name to disciplining or at least, or whatever. I don't even know what this. But the fact that that can go unchecked is abysmal. It is such an indictment of the moral character and the lack of moral clarity that exists at the UK's elite institutions. I just have to say that. Get it over 150.

[E]

Absolutely right. You know, language like that, it lays down the enabling conditions correct for violence.

[D]

And it dehumanizes conservatives that if you are a conservative, you're less than human. You don't deserve to live. And by the way, if you, if you, if somebody kills you, you had it coming. Yeah.

[E]

To be clear, the unanimous reaction on left and right in Britain was one of condemnation and anger.

[D]

Good.

[E]

And so just apparently not unanimous.

[D]

But yeah. Why are there not signatures when somebody actually has to put their name to it? They get weak in the knees.

[E]

Yeah.

[D]

What is there to be weak in the knees about political assassinations?

[E]

No, I, I couldn't agree more. And I mean, two days later, I remember we were, I was having lunch with, with Nigel, Nigel Farage, and, and people, this group walked out and screamed fascist at us. And I just thought to myself, you know, and he gets that all the time, of course, but I just thought to myself, just, you know, Charlie's blood had barely run cold, and still they would have known exactly what had happened. They would have known the kind of rhetoric and the demonizing that can lay down, as it were, the conditions for violence on the left. And I just, you know, I don't see, I don't see how we come out of this. You know, I don't see what solutions liberalism, liberalism has.

[D]

You know, I want to, I didn't mention this, but it's worth mentioning that, that go ahead and put up 141 again. You can do it on the screen. And this is this poll about political violence being justified. 141. And you look at the date that this was conducted, September 12th through September 15th. Charlie was murdered on the 10th. Yeah. This is a poll conducted after the assassination of Charlie Kirk. And 30% of young liberals still believe that. That is extraordinary. That'll make, yeah, that should, that should be a sobering, sobering stat for anybody. We've got to take a quick break. We'll be right back with Dr. James Orr from the.

[B]

There's a lot going on in Hollywood. How are you supposed to stay on top of it all? Variety has the solution. Take 20 minutes out of your day and listen to the new daily Variety podcast for breaking entertainment news and expert perspectives.

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[C]

Terrance Bates here with your Real America's Voice news braid. Thanks so much for being here with us. We're continuing to update the investigation regarding this morning's shooting at a Dallas ice facility. Investigators now saying at least one victim is dead, two others injured. However, police only confirming that no law enforcement official was hurt. No confirmation about who the victims are or in what capacity they were at that facility. We do know that a sniper went on a shooting spree from a nearby rooftop and eventually killed himself. The FBI investigating the attack, quote, as an act of targeted violence, saying that some of the bullet casings, as you can see here, had anti ice messages on them.

[D]

Politically motivated violence is wrong. It was two weeks ago today that we saw a political assassination in Utah that tore the heart out of much of this country. This is the third, third shooting in Texas directed at ICE or cbp. This must stop. To every politician who is using rhetoric, demonizing ICE and demonizing cbp, stop. To every politician demanding that ICE agents be doxed and calling for people to go after their families stop. This has very real consequences.

[C]

DHS Secretary Kristi Noem posting this message on X, writing in part, while we don't know motive yet, we know that our ICE law enforcement is facing unprecedented violence against them. It must stop. Please pray for the victims and their families. An FBI search of former national security advisor John Bolton's Washington, D.C. office reportedly turned up classified documents. That's the word from a court filing that was released on Tuesday. The documents were reportedly gathered in August and allegedly included materials that referenced weapons of mass destruction, among other things. That's a quick check of your headlines.

[D]

Welcome back to The Charlie Kirk Show. Time is flying with you, by the way. Dr. James Orr, it's truly amazing. We have actually Charlie's debate with the it's coming. I don't know that we have it yet with the new incoming president. Yes. So we'll play that before this segment ends. But I mean, give us, I don't know, your just sum it all up, Charlie. England, the UK free speech, wherever you want to take this because we have actually, we were just discussing in the break all these other things we're going to get to. But I think it, I think we need to put a capstone on this hour.

[E]

I once made the mistake of asking Charlie what part of the motherland he was from, his family was from. He said, my surname's Kirk. Where do you think I'm from? I said, yeah, okay. Right. He's proud of his Scottish heritage. He's, he loved Britain and he had this sort of, you know, I think sometimes in our country we get a sense a note of almost kind of a smug contempt from America as to what's going on over here, but it's just not true. And I think and Charlie sort of personified that. Charlie was somebody who he loved the country. He was sort of heartbroken at what he saw was happening to it and the fact that it was just losing, you know, that it was no longer the cradle of those founding values that he believed made America great, that gave America its DNA. And, you know, he was so passionate about us and not just, you know, not just recently. I mean, I can't remember when he set up Turning Point UK it must have been 2017, 2018. I don't know if he's done that and did that in any other country. I mean, he had just a fierce desire to. To kind of connect that sort of Anglo American axis. And I think it's been pretty successful. Tpuk, they're the ones who organized that vigil outside Downing Street. Just.

[D]

He had a good social media following.

[E]

Absolutely right. And so it's something. We talked about it a lot, actually, last month and, you know, how to help, you know, ramp it up and how to kind of develop this sort of, you know, youth movement on the right in Britain. And so he was passionate about it and I think felt, you know, the right's a little bit of chaos at the moment in some ways. I think it's kind of fruitful chaos. We talked a lot about it. There's all sorts of emerging movements. There's a lot of vitality now, I think, on the right, a lot of philosophical energy, a lot of political energy. And you're seeing that now reflected in the polling.

[D]

Do you think that reform. Do you think Nigel Farage is the likely next Prime Minister if things hold?

[E]

Yes, I do. I think he is set to be the next Prime Minister of the United Kingdom whenever the election is going to be held. I think the latest it could be held is. Is August 2029. That's a long time, a long way.

[A]

That's an eternity.

[E]

That was it Adam Smith who said there's a lot of ruin in a nation. Well, I just don't know how much. How much ruin there is left in us with the current government, certainly. But, yes, I think if you were the betting markets and, and the polling.

[D]

Would suggest that Keir is very unpopular.

[E]

Extremely unpopular. Yes, absolutely. I think he's just. This week, his approval rating sank to below what I think Boris Johnson had at his very, you know, at the nadir, at that Nader.

[D]

Exactly.

[E]

And, and so it sounds better.

[D]

There's, there's.

[E]

There's a lot. You know, there's a lot of maneuvering now on the left, which is now fragmenting into the kind of the Rainbow Caucus, the Crescent Caucus, the. The star, the old school Socialists. And it's. It may be that he gets. Likely that Starmer gets unseated. I mean, we're good at ditching prime ministers.

[D]

Yeah. I was going to say, what triggers it?

[E]

Well, so we're a parliamentary democracy. So what that means is you've got, you know, the party that can command a majority and command the confidence of the House of Commons is the government. And now Starmer's got a majority in the. I think 154. And so turkeys don't vote for Christmas, even if the turkeys really, really hate each other. And so it's very likely, very likely that the government will survive in some form till, you know, till the end of the electoral cycle. But I suspect Starmer's not going to be that long in Downing street and.

[D]

One could hope so. Nigel's well positioned, by the way. We were going to play Sweatpants bro, but I actually like this better. Let's play the clip from the UK of Charlie paying you quite the compliment, Blake. 162.

[A]

Blake is like the smartest person I know.

[D]

We're all plenty prepared to like that was. Sorry, I just had to do that for you. Charlie was very impressed by Blake's intellect and by your memory. And that was you traveling with your travel buddy. You guys were international travel buddies at the end. I mean, it really, it really was.

[E]

I picked up on that reverence for Blake over our dinner in Cambridge. And whenever there was this kind of difficult moment, a difficult discussion or we needed some facts, Charlie would turn, turn to his left, say Blake, and he'd always have the answer.

[D]

Well, it's true. You do have a weird, weirdly photographic memory for history. Maybe it's not photographic. Whatever it is, you have a great recall. You have a great recall. We're going to transition an hour to and we're going to talk about this Jimmy Kimmel controversy and we're going to start debunking this both sideism with some actual facts. And I think that's important. We'll be right back with Dr. James Orr. Don't go anywhere.

[B]

There's a lot going on in Hollywood. How are you supposed to stay on top of it all? Variety has the solution. Take 20 minutes out of your day and listen to the new daily Variety podcast for breaking entertainment news and expert perspectives.

[C]

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[B]

Featuring the iconic journalists of Variety and hosted by co editor in chief Cynthia Littleton.

[D]

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[B]

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[A]

Stop settling for weak sound.

[D]

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[A]

And bring the boom. Hit the town with the ultra durable LG X Boom portable speaker and enjoy vibrant sound wherever you go. Elevate your listening experience to new heights because let's be real, your music deserves it. The future of sound is now with LG XBoom and for a limited time, save [e-mail] with code Fall25 Bring the Boom. XBOOM.

[C]

Welcome back to this Real America's Voice news break. I'm Terrence Bates. The big story of the day involves this morning shooting at a Dallas ICE facility. Investigators saying that at least one victim is dead, two others hurt. Police only confirming though that no law enforcement official was hurt. No confirmation about who the victims are or in what capacity they were at that facility. We also know that a sniper went on a shooting spree from a nearby rooftop and eventually killed himself. The FBI investigating the attack, quote, as in targeted, violent, as an act of targeted violence, saying that some of the bullet casings like the one you see on your screen had anti ICE messages on them.

[D]

Politically motivated violence is wrong. It was two weeks ago today that we saw a political assassination in Utah that tore the heart out of much of this country. This is the third shooting in Texas directed at ICE or cbp. This must stop. To every politician who is using rhetoric, demonizing ICE and demonizing cbp, stop. To every politician demanding that ICE agents be doxed and call calling for people to go after their families, stop. This has very real consequences.

[C]

DHS Secretary Kristi Noem posting this message on X, writing in part, while we don't know motive yet, we know that our ICE law enforcement is facing unprecedented violence against them. It must stop. Please pray for the victims and their families. An FBI search of former national security advisor John Bolton's Washington, D.C. office reportedly turned up classified documents. That's the word from a court filing that was released on Tuesday. The documents were reportedly gathered in August and allegedly included materials that referenced weapons of mass destruction and records related to the US Government. Strategic Communications Inventory. From the search lists several folders that were labeled confidential and some pages that were marked secret. Similar to the search of Bolton's home in August, agents confiscated computers and other electronic devices as potential evidence. The searches were both conducted as part of three felony investigations for gathering, transmitting or losing national defense information in violation of the Espionage act, as well as retaining classified information without permission. Well, it looks like the federal government will be shut down this time next week. While House Republicans passed a continuing resolution that would keep government agencies funded until November 21, the Senate failed to pass a similar measure and won't return to Washington until right before the deadline to pass a funding bill. Plus, President Trump just canceled a meeting with top congressional Democratic leaders to discuss ways to avert a potential government shutdown. Taken to Truth Social, the president writing, I have decided that no meeting with their congressional leaders could possibly be productive. If the shutdown happens, it would mark the 15th partial shutdown of federal services since 1981. The man who tried to assassinate then presidential candidate Donald Trump while he played golf in Florida tries to stab himself in the neck with a pen after a jury took just two hours to convince him to convict him. Excuse me. These courtroom sketches illustrate just how it all went down. The 59 year old was found guilty of attempting to assassinate a major presidential candidate, possessing a firearm in furtherance of a crime of violence and assaulting a federal officer, among a long list of other charges. He now faces up to life in prison during his sentencing Dec. 18.

[D]

Appreciative of the justice that was given and the way it was handled by Pam Bondi and Todd Blanche and everybody that it's been and their team of people, it was really well handled and it's very important. You can't let things like that happen. Nothing to do with me but a president or even a person. You can't allow that to happen. And so justice was served and we'll see what happens.

[C]

Prosecutors say the guy spent weeks plotting the attempted assassination. He lost the case and his freedom after representing himself during the trial. Attorney General Pam Bondi says the verdict illustrates the Department of Justice's commitment to punishing those who engage in political violence. That's a quick check of your headlines. As always, we appreciate having you along for the ride. Now let's get you back to your regularly scheduled programming.

[B]

There's a lot going on in Hollywood. How are you supposed to stay on top of it all? Variety has the solution. Take 20 minutes out of your day and listen to the new daily Variety podcast for breaking entertainment news and expert perspectives.

[C]

Where do you see the business actually heading?

[B]

Featuring the iconic journalists of Variety and hosted by co editor in chief Cynthia Littleton.

[D]

The only constant in Hollywood is change.

[B]

Open your free iHeartradio app, search daily Variety and listen now.

[D]

Stop settling for weak sound. It's time to level up your game and bring the boom. Hit the town with the ultra durable LG X Boom portable speaker and enjoy vibrant sound wherever you go. Elevate your listening experience to new heights because let's be real, your music deserves it. The future of sound is now with LG XBoom. And for a limited time, save [e-mail] with code Fall25. Bring the Boom XBoom. All right. Welcome back to the Charlie Kirk Show. This is Andrew Colvett, your executive producer. I am joined by the great British patriot Dr. James Orr, who It was interesting actually when we hung out in Aspen. There had just been this piece that came out about you calling you the mentor of J.D. vance. And you are friends with J.D. we are friends with J.D. he actually hosted this show the Monday after September 10th, and was a great honor, great tribute. But you took umbrage with that, didn't you? That framing of things? Because J.D. hung out. He went on vacation or something in the Cotswolds.

[E]

Yeah, I've known him for a few years. He had a trip to England over August. It was supposed to be a family.

[D]

Holiday, but it worked the whole time.

[E]

It turned into a media circus, and he had to cut it short. He did some golf up in. Up in Scotland, I think. And no. Yeah, I took umbrage at the description. This idea that I'm somehow mentored the Vice President, the United States is not true at all. I've learned a great deal more from him than he's ever learned from me. But the last time I saw him in Washington must have been just a few days before it happened. I think about a week before it happened. And I just said, look, I was out in Arizona and spent some time with Charlie and his team. And it's. My goodness, you're in. You're in good shape for 2028. That machine is going to be. Is roaring, and with energy and enthusiasm.

[D]

We hope he dives in. I mean, every indication. You would think a vice president would be primed for that, but he's very coy about being very respectful. And, of course, we appreciate that it's still the era of Trump, and we're into that, too, but. Yeah, tell us about your relationship with him. I think that's interesting.

[E]

Well, we met. Gosh, I think, Yeah. A few years ago in the summer of 2019, I think it was through mutual friends. And, yeah, we hit it off. He was a private citizen at the time. I'd read Hillbilly Elegies when it came out, I think in 2016, a Texan friend of mine, it was end of October 2016, pressed a copy into my hands and said, trump is gonna win, and this is why you need to read this. And I read it, loved it. So he was on my radar early on and then had the chance to meet him in 2019. We hit it off. We talked a lot. Not actually very much about politics at all, though. You know, he did a lot of philosophy, talked about faith, talked about theology. And I thought, gosh, this guy's promising he could be a congressman one day. Congressman looks like he got a bright future.

[D]

Yeah. Everybody, by the way, you know, I usually don't share numbers, but him hosting Charlie's show. And I hope people understand there's a difference between a million views on YouTube and a different. And a million downloads of a podcast. I've never seen a podcast.

[A]

Let's just say it's true. It's our most downloaded podcast episode.

[D]

It's the most downloaded podcast episode, and I will just say that ever. Of all time. And JD did such a magnificent job. And I was thinking about that this morning, what he said on his episode when he hosted. He said, yes, we want unity, but first we have to have truth. And I think that is really relevant to something that's happening in our own news cycle right now. And the truth is. And I think we're going to discuss both this hour about this. Both sidesism. It's a lie. But also, Jimmy Kimmel said that, you know, he essentially inferred, stated, I think, very clearly that the shooter came from Maga. And that really upset me. Had a trans boyfriend or whatever. However you're supposed to say it. I think that's probably the right way to say it, that he was into all this weird stuff. He was writing all of these notes on these bullet casings and things like that, and his own parents were worried about his radicalism. And then to go on the air and say, no, actually, it was from maga. Maga killed him. What that means to me is that you can lie with impunity, that there is a machinery in place that will defend you. Your life is not important. The. And I'm free to desecrate your memory because conservative's bad. And what. You had it coming and more should. It's basically a license to say, we're gonna support you guys if you guys go do this stuff out in the real world. And that's not okay. And so we have clips. Blake. I don't know which clip it is. Jimmy Kimmel, in response to the backlash he received. Yeah, but we can just play one of these. I mean, it doesn't matter. 132. I don't think what I have to say is going to make much of a difference. If you like me, like me. If you don't, you don't.

[E]

I have no illusions about changing anyone's mind, but I do want to make something clear because it's important to me as a human.

[D]

And that is. You understand that it was never my.

[E]

Intention to make light of the murder of a young man.

[D]

I don't think there's anything funny about it. I posted a message on Instagram on.

[E]

The day he was killed, sending love.

[D]

To his family and asking for compassion. And I meant it, and I still do. Nor was it my intention to blame any specific group for the actions of what it was. Obviously a deeply disturbed individual. That was really the opposite of the.

[E]

Point I was trying to make. But I understand that to some that felt either ill timed or unclear or maybe both. And for those who think I did point a finger.

[D]

I get why you're upset.

[C]

If the situation was reversed, there was.

[E]

A good chance I'd have felt the same way.

[D]

So what I'm lacking there is a. I'm sorry I lied. I misrepresented the nature of who the shooter was. I'm sorry, I will do better. My sincerest apologies to Erica Kirk and to the Kirk family. And James, you're a Christian. Explain the difference between what he did, sort of parsing words, never kind of owning was sort of, I'm sorry if you were offended. Explain what a Christian, what Christian contrition looks like, what it looks like in scripture historically, what it means and what that was lacking.

[E]

Yeah, I mean, look, I could hear some contrition in his voice as he was clearly emotional. Whether the emotions was being driven by what had happened to him, you know, the fact that his career looked like it was on the precipice. I, I, I don't know, I mean, I think, you know, true contrition expresses itself in actions and you know, I, I detected a bit of a hint of a politician's apology there. Just deeply, deeply sorry that, that, that offense has been caused. But you know, repentance, you know, the Greek, the New Testament is metanoia, which means a, a complete transformation of one's mind, of one's intellect, one's understanding, one's heart. And you know, the Latin translation I think is pinetamini, which is kind of not just repentance but do penance. And there's a lot of debate about that in the Reformation about, you know, his sort of repentance is something not just of the heart but you've got to do it, you've got to do stuff that shows the, this kind of, the outward working, the outward expression of inner contrition within, within, within one's heart. And I don't know, look, I don't have a window into, into men's souls. I don't have a window into Jimmy Kimmel's soul. I just hope that this incident, this whole sorry saga has made the left, has made the kind of American liberals think a lot harder about the language that they're using and just being aware that spinning the kind of conspiracy theories that are completely fact free, as seems to be the case with this extraordinary charge that the killer was motivated by, but was part of the MAGA movement, just simply absurd, not a shred of evidence for it. I just hope that this will give them pause for thought and it'll just slow things down. And yeah, I mean, there cannot be civil discourse if it's, you know, if one side is constantly paying the consequences for, you know, indiscreet speech or violent rhetoric and the other side effectively gets a free pass. And, and that seems to be what's, what's happening just not just in America, but all across the landscape of Western, Western culture, Western politics.

[D]

Yeah. And I mean, Blake, I don't you have kind of a contrarian take here because you think this, we should just sort of move on from this topic. I want the. I want more.

[A]

Well, so I. What's frustrated me about it is they went and due to sort of how it unfolded, we allowed it to become that like Jimmy Kimmel was this free speech martyr against like, you know, because we had Brendan Carr at the fcc, he stepped out and he basically said, you better take him off the air or we're going to like investigate ABC and Disney and they're going to have to answer for all these things. And you took what it should have been, which is Jimmy Kimmel said something disgusting and there was, there really was this big organic anger against them and that got tamped down and it turned into, oh, this guy in the Trump administration is silencing Jimmy Kimmel, who is also lame and not funny. And it took something that was good and it changed it and it also colored and unfortunately what we also saw, which was the very organic anger against all the other people who said disgusting things.

[D]

Yeah, I want to keep talking about that. We'll do it in the break. Quick break on radio. We'll be right back. Yeah, keep going with that though, Blake. And I mean, I know there was, I will say one of the things that I noticed and you saw this with the Pam Bondi. I think, I think it was a misspeak on Pam Bondi's behalf because she kind of clarified her point after she was, she was talking about incitement. She meant to get to incitement. She said hate speech. But I would just say there was a lot of voices that on the right that said, we don't agree with the way she said that. Yeah, that's, that's not our and that was also frustrating. It's not Charlie's pov.

[A]

We've had to endure now we've had to endure all this stupid, nasty, fake stuff on the left. We're like, oh, the left, the right doesn't care about free speech at all. They want to crack down. No, the backlash to Bondi saying the hate speech thing was immediate. It was basically randomness. Yeah, it was dial this back right now. And she did, thankfully. But it is a similar. It was a similar issue here where I think there is a huge amount of genuine backlash to what Kimmel did. I think he probably would have gotten suspended. In fact, we got reporting from the Wall Street Journal and others that suggested he was going to be suspended at minimum, even without what Carr said. And I think it put the wrong color on it, that there was that kind of overt threat. And then the way he was. If you go to Carr's Twitter account, he's like posting all these memes and just like bragging about what he did. And I understand the impulse. It is a way. There is an element where the Trump movement made the movement more assertive, more, you know, more bragging. And we've seen, we've seen it with like the ICE stuff where they're like, we're deporting people. And here's a meme of this person who is also a, you know, a child predator getting deported. And it's great and people have liked that. But you do have to be careful because we do want to make sure that this is about that, that Charlie, who is a martyr for free speech, a martyr for Christianity, and we don't want that to turn into Charlie is ever considered some sort of like justification for an anti speech.

[D]

Charlie would reject that, by the way, completely. He was basically a free speech absolutist. I mean, I think I say basically because, you know, I'm just hedging in my mind maybe some sort of incitement he would draw a line at. But, you know, he believed in ugly speech, he believed in vile speech. He believed in the freedom to say evil things. I mean, that does cross the line into incitement, which is illegal when you're calling for violence for somebody. But I mean, I struggle with asking the question, you know, when we think about some of these ugly reactions, people celebrating, you think about the Oxford kid sweatpants, bro, you know, where you're celebrating the murder of somebody, is that not incitement in a certain way? I think the spirit is certainly the same legally. The, the barrier, you know, is different.

[A]

So One of the things that makes American free speech so exceptional even compared to other Western nations is we have kind of the Brandenburg standard for speech. It's a Supreme Court case, and it's basically like it is in fact only incitement if you are directly calling for some criminal act and like in a specific way. So if someone were to say someone should go to the Utah Valley event and shoot Charlie Kirk, that is incitement. But even saying someone should shoot Charlie Kirk isn't by itself. And you know, that lead that enables a lot of ugly speech, as Charlie himself said. I think he has a tweet where he says, like, there is ugly speech, there is deranged speech, but there is not hate speech. And the thing with incitement, what's good about that strict standard is that gives us. So it means that an authoritarian government like the Biden administration has so little grounds to come out and say, and the left loves to do this where, oh, this thing you said, you know, that was actually inciting hate against migrants, that was inciting hate against trans people, that was inciting hate against minorities. Just because you say, oh, I don't want more immigration. And certainly Dr. Orr can tell us all about how that's been abused in.

[D]

The uk that's where we're going next.

[A]

Which they'll claim, they'll claim that's a free speech country, but it's clearly not.

[D]

But that, that this, this is the distinction and I think it's really good. Important for us to remain morally very clear on this. I, what I was trying to say was that celebrating nasty 100% and it is in the, it is from the same demonic spirit that I think somebody would, you know, this incitement legal. So I'm talking. There's two distinctions. There's almost like the, the demonic spirit that I would call it versus legal standard. And I'm not conflating the two. I'm saying so, you know, if you're going to celebrate that, certainly maybe you didn't break a law, but you are, you are participating in the same demonism. And I would just say I have not fully internalized that other than to say that may you live a life so remarkable, so courageous and so true that the demons celebrate when you die and may your enemies, your enemies celebrate because you, that means you have done something. You have been so extraordinary that you live rent free in their heads. And they know not, they don't know anything else to do other than to say, you know, thank goodness that extraordinarily effective person is off the board and. But, you know, in Soren Kierkegaard's words, that's really just the beginning when a martyr dies. And so we're going to welcome back radio. We'll be right back in just one second. So, Dr. Orr, Charlie was a free speech absolutist and one of the themes of his trip to the UK was about this issue of free speech. We've heard that in the UK, 30 arrests are made a day for people criticizing immigration. Basically just this sea of humanity. And, you know, we have a ton of immigration into this country, which is one of, you know, my pet projects is to limit that. But we also have a country that's much larger and you. It sort of can absorb the visceral feel or the visual feel of it can absorb it a little bit differently than the UK, which is, remind me, what are you, 60, 80 million? I can't remember. So if you have a couple million migrants coming to the uk, I mean, it's instantly very visible. It's very. It impacts the daily life of a lot of Britons. Really quickly tell us about the state of free speech in your country. Did this hundred thousand person march push back against that? Was that a theme of it? Explain.

[E]

Yeah, yeah, sure. Well, of course, you know, just go back to your earlier conversation. We don't have anything like the sort of, sort of, you know, the jurisprudence that's built up around the First Amendment over, you know, in, over the last hundred, 150 years. But I think up until the end of the last century, there was no sense that there was a kind of, there were free speech problems in Britain. It's really been the last 25 years, I think, intensifying of the last 10 to 15. And I don't think there's any real doubt that it is connected to the rapid demographic change at scale that we've witnessed in the last 25 years, but particularly in the last five to 10 years. And what happens there, I think, is that the sort of sense of a kind of high trust society, a moral community, that is, it basically shares the same universe of norms and standards of speech that kind of gets fragmented and silos begin to open up and there's really just a dialogue of the death between, you know, different blocks within different demographic blocks. And so that's sort of, that sense of being a, you know, in a shared enterprise is starting to kind of unravel. And what happens there is the state increasingly has to police these fragile boundaries between these different, these different silos. And that's what we've seen in the last 10 to 15 years, we've seen it under a Labor government, left wing government, we've seen it under the Conservative government. The last Conservative government brought in something called an Orwellian phrase, non crime hate incidents where police can record your name, whether they accept that no crime has been committed, that you're exercising lawful free speech. But they make a note of it, it goes on your record. Until recently, I think that was on your record forever.

[D]

Now just as database, the state that the Leviathan is just collecting this.

[E]

That's right. The police, you know, they are policing tweets, not streets. And it is getting worse.

[D]

Can Nigel fix this as Prime Minister?

[E]

Well, I think one of the central focuses, one of the kind of guiding one of the north stars of the reform sort of philosophy and policy agenda is without question free speech. So there's a lot of debates I think internally as to what that's going to look like.

[D]

Isn't that just, I mean, isn't that just politics? I want fewer immigrants in my country.

[E]

Yeah. So you look, you're not going to get. Well, you may well get a knock on the door if you say that in the wrong way online. I mean it wouldn't, wouldn't surprise me. But yes, I think that there's, you know, there's this thing about this sort of dominant left wing orthodoxy has become this sort of, you know, the, become the moral universe.

[D]

It's like a puritanical, like a purity spiral.

[E]

Exactly right. So that any dissent, you know, as I said earlier, any wrong think is evil think, you know, it's something that is, that is, you know, you've got to demonize. So it's, it's this old point that we've seen made it many. It's, you know, on the left, the idea is that you're not just wrong, you're morally wrong. On the right, you know, okay, maybe it's not always the case, but I think generally speaking on the right, we do just think that, you know, the left honestly and sincerely mistaken and we don't. There isn't the same rhetoric, widespread rhetoric of demonizing and a kind of name calling that, okay, maybe it's not direct causal incitement, maybe it doesn't meet the Brandenburg standard, but it's certainly, I think shifting the conditions. It's laying down the enabling conditions for violence. If you call somebody public figure Hitler fascist often enough, then it shouldn't be surprising that, that crazy people will do violence against them.

[A]

It's one of the most frustrating Things where we've had the left has certainly pushed in the last couple weeks to try to argue actually like there's more right wing violence than left. And one, it's false. And we'll get into that in the rest of the show. But I'm just, I'm looking at these tweets, Matt Iglesias, that like fat guy from Vox, he was like, people remind themselves of things he said a while ago. I'll read this one quick and we can go back into it. But he said it was when Tucker Carlson got harassed at his home in like 2017 or 2018. People were trying to like kick in his door basically and like terrorizing his house. And he was saying, I'll read the full tweets later. But he was basically saying, this is a good thing, like you should do this to right wing people. And now he's gonna come out and be like, oh, I oppose violence against the right. Well, no, you just are trying to read the winds, Matt.

[D]

Dehumanization, other otherization. We have a little bit of a surprise coming. Don't go anywhere.

[B]

There's a lot going on in Hollywood. How are you supposed to stay on top of it all? Variety has the solution. Take 20 minutes out of your day and lit. Listen to the new daily Variety podcast for breaking entertainment news and expert perspectives.

[C]

Where do you see the business actually heading?

[B]

Featuring the iconic journalists of Variety and hosted by co editor in chief Cynthia Littleton.

[D]

The only constant in Hollywood is change.

[B]

Open your free iHeartradio app, search daily Variety and listen now.

[A]

Stop settling for weak sound. It's time to level up your game and bring the boom. Hit the town with the ultra durable LG X Boom portable speaker and enjoy vibrant sound wherever you go. Elevate your listening experience to new heights because let's be real, your music deserves it. The future of sound is now with LG Xboom. And for a limited time, save [e-mail] with code fall25.

[D]

Bring the boom.

[A]

Xboom.

[C]

Terrence. Terrence Bates here with your real America's Voice news break. Let's take you to the White House where it looks like Ben Carson is standing by. Let's listen and see what's being talked.

[B]

About here for this country and leading this country. And so that was just another step. We have the dietary guidelines coming out very soon. Dr. Carson is going to play a major role in that. We'll have a very big announcement most likely next month. But there will be a fundamental shift in the way that we are suggesting and ultimately the DGAs drive a lot of the government nutrition programs. So that's coming soon. Stay tuned. Amongst other things. Listen, we what the question was about was the hunger survey that USDA cancelled recently. Our research showed by it's not statutory. No one was asking us to do it. There are a lot of other good reports that are out there that better capture the question. This, this specific survey had been used for years, we believe, incorrectly to make the case that under the last administration, spending in SNAP increased, I don't know, 40, 50%. But even that survey showed the hunger in America only increasing 3%. But it continued to be used as a driver. We just felt, and the White House agreed that it was one more waste of taxpayer dollars not being used appropriately. We believe at USDA and with our other counterparts across the government, HHS and others, there are many, many other surveys collecting that data. Well, yes, no, there are other surveys at usda. I don't have the name, but we'll get that to you. And then across HHS and also several of the other agencies as well. So we'll make sure and send that your way. We will not be creating a new one. Just making sure that the ones that are used are the most appropriate.

[E]

We'll do one.

[B]

One more question, y'.

[D]

All, Just as a follow up to that.

[B]

Do you have any updates on how your department is rolling out the changes to work requirements for snap? We are working on that right now. Obviously, work requirements were an important part of the one big beautiful bill and ensuring that every taxpayer dollar was being spent in its highest and best use. And so there's been a lot of narrative around the work requirements. What I will say is those work requirements that were included were for able bodied adults that could work that didn't have children under the age of 13 or 14. So we'll continue to build on that in partnership with the states, of course. They're the laboratories of democracy and more announcements on that are forthcoming. We'll do one more.

[D]

Go ahead. Thank you so much. Secretary. When do you guys plan to make a decision on farmer relief?

[B]

So the farmer relief is continuing. I've had a lot of conversations, conversations with you guys here in the gaggle on that over the last six months. Obviously based on a couple of very unprecedented factors in the last number of years, the farmers, only 5% have made money over the last decade. 5%. It is a continuing struggle in this farm economy. In the last administration, of course we had the cost of inputs go up on average 25%. But even more than that, fertilizer, and increased 36%. Fuel, increased 28%. Seeds, increased 35%. Interest rates for our farmers, by the way, if you're a farmer, you rely on the bank to get your harvest harvested and your next crop planted. Those went up almost 73% under the last administration. At the same time, we had a trade deficit of $50 billion in agriculture just under Biden. We went from a surplus in Trump 1 to a massive deficit under Biden. So that alongside, of course, the President's effort to realign America around American products and making all of these new deals, we are at a point where we're looking at the harvest, where we're looking at our soybean, corn, wheat, sorghum, cotton farmers who are facing very, very difficult times. We are currently in conversations here at the White House across the government on a farmer aid package in our current, our current programming. Right now we've got about $13 billion moving out under ECAP, which is our old farmer payment system, based on losses from last year and the year before. So this would be in addition to that, in partnership with our colleagues on the Hill. We should have an announcement very soon, perhaps in the next couple of weeks.

[C]

Before you go, what about the President's prayer initiative for the 250th celebration of America?

[B]

That's a beautiful thing to end on. Yeah. Why don't we end on that? Because that's a great way to end. We were just talking about this in the last administration. Obviously, faith and religious liberty and working for a higher power, for God, for Jesus, has always been a driver for so many of us in President Trump's administration. But we believe that even now, it's even more of a driver. And you saw that with Charlie's memorial on Sunday. We all just believe we're called for a time such as this. We believe that we're fighting for the soul of America, but also fighting for what's good and right, fighting for our God. And so this president's next step of having prayer and services as a part of that, as we celebrate America at 250. I'm just so proud to be a part of this team every single day.

[D]

Absolutely.

[C]

And we are complex beings.

[D]

We're not just the physical aspect, it's the mental aspect and the spiritual aspect.

[C]

That makes us different from other creatures.

[F]

And we need to recognize that in.

[C]

All of our policies and remember that America didn't become great by accident.

[F]

It was because of the policies, the.

[D]

Judeo Christian values that we live by. And look what's happened as we begin.

[C]

To throw those things away.

[D]

Instead of love your neighbor, cancel your neighbor. Those are not good things.

[F]

So it's good to have a government.

[D]

That actually realizes that. And I think we will be realizing many blessings when we continue to move.

[F]

Down the right pathway.

[B]

Perfect. Thank you all so much. Thank you, everybody.

[C]

You were looking listening to Agriculture Secretary Brooke Rollins along with former Secretary of Housing and Urban Development, Dr. Ben Carson, speaking outside the White House. We, of course, will have continuing coverage throughout the day here on Real America's Voice. But for now, let's get you back to the Charlie Kirk Show.

[A]

Do not allow the signs of the times for you to be paralyzed, static, to not engage in the culture.

[D]

We must challenge people to be greater.

[A]

To reach higher, to be biblical, to be Christlike. And I'm telling you, this generation cannot just be the most conservative generation, but the most Christian generation as we continue to be salt and light in every.

[D]

Single walk of our life. Amen.

[E]

Extraordinary. I mean, just going. I find it difficult to look at old footage and, you know, I've tried to just screen it all out because it makes me too emotional. But he had this extraordinary gift to talk about faith in a way that was just so accessible to. It just grounded everything he said, all of the, all of the politics, all of the sort of neuralgic issues in this kind of non negotiable, you know, moral foundation. And there was just such authenticity and sincerity there. And I said, it's, you know, something that the right really needs to remember that you got to be anchored in clear moral foundations. And I think, you know, without faith and without that sort of, you know, without that framing that Charlie was always so insistent on it, it unravels, it unravels and we get towards a sort of, you know, Nietzsche and nihilism or, or actual racism. And it's just amazing to, to just to be reminded of what he was like in full flight. And I never, never seen him using notes, never seen him reading from a speech, but just extraordinary fluency and extraordinary sort of, I think, just rhetoric, just raw rhetorical flairs for someone that young.

[D]

The story of how Charlie was discovered is, I think, very telling and actually something that Ben Shapiro, because he had come in on the Tuesday after it happened, and he said, you know, Charlie wasn't charismatic at the beginning. Ben said wonderful things about Charlie. Please don't take this the wrong way, but it's actually a bit of the opposite of that, is he was gifted from God without any training with this rhetorical flare. And the story was that Bill Montgomery was at some sort of Tea Party rally. And Charlie was 18, and he was going to be one of the speakers because he had, I think, gained a little bit of local notoriety for organizing. So they invited him to be one of the speakers. 18 years old. And the story that was conveyed to me is, everybody's asleep. Actually. Bill told me this story, actually, many years ago. He said, everybody's kind of asleep and dazed and bored. And then all of a sudden, Charlie took the stage, and Bill said it was like he looked at everybody in the audience. All of a sudden, Charlie starts speaking, and everybody goes head up, ears perk up. Because Charlie just had this way of. His words would pierce, like, they would pierce your mind and your heart. And I think this is. He was. His moral clarity was so strong that he did. He was sort of like a dividing line. Like, his words were a sword, and they were sharp and they would cut through and it would force you to pick a side. He didn't leave you any ground to sort of remain in the mushy middle. He would say things, so. And he took a lot of flack for that. He took a lot of heat, took a lot of slings and arrows because he was so morally clear. And he would say it with such force that you had to sort of wake up and perk up out of your seat. I actually forgot that Bill told me that was the first time I ever met Bill Montgomery, and may he rest in peace. He died in 2020. But, you know, that was Charlie from the start.

[E]

It's easy to think, you know, obviously after 2016, on both sides of the Atlantic, you know, there was, you know, many, many more people are coming through, and the sort of. The new media emerged. You know, you started to see a lot of incredible conservative voices coming through. But Charlie at 18, this is. We're the Obama years. This is the early 2000 and tens when it was extremely costly and very rare for people of any age to be coming out. That, you know, to have that kind of trenchant, clear moral horizon and that clarity, it's just. Just remarkable. And it must have been, you know, Kirk Contra Mundum in 2012. And I can't, you know, I wasn't tracking American politics that closely back then, but, you know, I would have thought within the GOP that would have been very unusual. And he was. I don't know what sustained. I don't know where he got it from.

[D]

You know, it was straight from God. I mean, that God had a plan from Charlie's for his whole life. But that 18 to 31 charisma, like that's difficult to explain so much into it. And you saw it up close in those last trips. But he, his schedule was truly to manage those. That schedule that he kept, especially at our conferences, it was booked from 6am to the time he put his head down on the pillow. It was truly remarkable how much discipline it took. And I want to say, you talk about his fluency and this is something that Blake and I talked about. I actually had a line in my speech at his memorial and I cut it just for time. But this show was how he got battle ready. And everybody kind of reflects how Charlie leveled up over the years. And I do think it was the show because every day he was forced to come on the show and defend his values or his political takes or his how he was reflecting on the current news of the day. And it just gave him repetitions, repetitions, repetitions. And originally the show was a three hour show. So he was doing a three hour show. We didn't move to a two hour show until January of this year, which was really wonderful for his schedule because he could get more done. But it did really make him battle ready. And some of the arguments we'd have before show, I mean, it was. That was really special moments, right, Blake? Yeah. I mean, it was your line. The battle ready was your line. So I was trying to give you credit for was a good line. But so we do have a potential surprise coming for you. Somebody might be joining us. I don't want to flag it unless it ends up happening out of respect. But nevertheless, I really hope it happens because it would be, it would. I think it would be a really, a really sweet moment if we can do it. But in lieu of that, however, Blake, let's talk about both sides. Ism.

[A]

Yes, let's do that.

[D]

Are both sides equally guilty of political violence?

[A]

So this is. We've seen this a ton in the past. Well, since this happened. So this came out, it was obviously the most spectacular, the most damaging assassination in the US since RFK probably 50 years ago and actually almost 60 years ago now. And so it's been. And so people are like, well, this fits into, you know, and it came right after, you know, there was this apparently racially motivated stabbing on that bus in Charlotte. And people are saying, okay, there's a lot of left wing violence out there. And so these experts trotted out with some charts that were in the Economist or in Cato or whatever where they're like, Actually, actually left wing violence isn't common. It's right wing violence that's way more common.

[D]

I even heard them mentioning J6.

[A]

Yeah, J6. They have DHS. You know, DHS was made that a huge priority under Biden. They always like to make it a priority because you know, that's who works at a lot of, who is doing a lot of that work at DHS or at the FBI. Make you know, remember when they were investigating pro life like Catholic churches, because this was going to be this terrorist nexus. And so finally people are saying, you know what, let's actually look at the numbers. What is, what is the real deal with these numbers? Because they're just getting pushed. And so one of these studies that went really popular, it was literally just compiled by an antifa person. An antifa person made a study of what was more common, left or right wing. And if you dig into the numbers, there is so much lying about it. So I'm looking at this thread by Tim Carney where he just looked at some of the numbers in what they were using for this database. So for example, a suicidal young man made a hit list that included Trump on it. He then later killed two strangers who were both white. This was counted as right wing political violence according to an ADL study because the shooter had a swastika on his gun. There was a felon in New Hampshire, Jesse James Sullivan, in 2024 he murdered his half brother who was white. But they counted it as a right wing political violence because he had joined a white prison gang while he was in prison.

[D]

By the way, what happens in prison, you have to find somebody that will protect you.

[A]

There's someone I found where someone like sent anti gay, like made a harassment call to George Santos and said that he had like hurt the gay community with what he did. And that was like right wing anti government threats.

[D]

All right, well we're going to take a quick radio break. I think we're going to keep going in the, in the, in the stream. Hang, hang tight. All right, welcome back for the stream. Keep going. Blake. Yeah, George Santos, he. So this guy calls him and makes a threat to him because he, because George Santos made fools of the gay community.

[A]

Yeah. Gay activist left a threatening voicemail for George Santos and said he felt he had untaken under anti gay acts. And that was right wing government focused violence. And then another one was a homeless man broke into a hotel and attacked someone and used a racial slur. It was later put in a mental institution. Oh, that's, that's right. Wing racially motivated violence. And so this happens over and over. And there's even a chart that was in, I think this was in the Economist or somewhere. But it shows that, you know, over time and how it they allegedly, there's all this right wing violence that peaks in 2018, 2019, and then it goes down in 2020. And that's how you always know all this stuff is bs Whenever they put out these studies, they don't count what was clearly the biggest outburst of politically motivated violence in our lifetimes, which is in 2020, George Floyd died. We had gigantic riots in Minneapolis where they burned down a police station. We had gigantic violence in. Sorry, one moment there. We had gigantic violence in Minneapolis. We had gigantic violence in D.C. and.

[D]

That was counting this all as right wing.

[A]

I think they're just not even counting it. They're just like, oh, that's something else. This is mostly, though it's mostly peaceful protests or they'll say someone has to be con. So the prosecution project, this is one that was getting shared a lot, that was supposedly tracking what violence occurs and what they'll often do. So for example, in this chart they say resulting in a guilty verdict. So if they have clearly hundreds or thousands of people going around smashing windows, doing graffiti everywhere, terrorizing the public. But, but, oh, nobody was convicted of this.

[D]

Right? This is a great point. That's a great point because nobody was convicted of anything. As a matter of fact, the cities ended up settling with many of the Protestants giving them money.

[A]

Giving them money. Or St. Louis, a mob brays and terrorizes that family. Was that the McCloskeys?

[D]

Yeah, the McCloskeys.

[A]

The McCloskeys. The McClosKeys bring out empty guns to have these people not storm their house and attack them. And I bet that's probably counted as nothing or it's going to be counted as right wing violence.

[D]

Sure.

[A]

You know, anti, anti protester, anti racial justice. And it's just a total sham. Yeah, it's a courthouse in Portland for. Oh, that was another one. One of the data sets that was getting shared around. It did not count a member of Antifa taking a gun, shooting a Trump supporter in the head in a murder. And they didn't count that as left wing political violence. Probably because he wasn't convicted because he was killed by the police before he actually.

[D]

Well, and this is why it's such a salient point you're making is because we saw in the aftermath of what happened to Charlie, we didn't riot, we didn't burn down Buildings. We didn't. It is I.

[A]

We need to learn the talking points.

[D]

We did not loot businesses.

[A]

We prayed and like everyone knows this. Nobody is like, nobody actually, you know, was, you know, prepping their stores or anything or nobody was doing excess preparations like, oh, we have to be ready. Nobody, you know, after Charlie, there's no one was worried about the Charlie Kirk riots. Nobody was even worried about that. We might have worried about other violence happening, but nobody was worried. Oh, all of those conservatives who like Charlie Kirk are going to go and burn down, you know, Salt Lake City.

[E]

Yeah.

[A]

Burn down Phoenix. No one was worried about that. We do worry about that all the time with antifa, with blm, with causes that are on the left. This is what the reality is.

[E]

And we are just statistics studies BS about this. You can trade statistics and studies all you like, but the true character of a political movement comes out in moments of crisis and of tragedy. And I'm sorry, but the contrast is as clear as day between what happened in May, the aftermath of the Floyd killing in May 2020 and Charlie's death. I mean, what you were saying earlier, Andrew, just not a single arrest, you know, at 100,000 people in that stadium. And I, you know, we were all there. It was just so peaceful. There was nothing.

[D]

There was almost 300,000 people in and around the stadium. Got a welcome back radio. Hang tight, final segment of the day. Excited. Alright, welcome back, the final segment of the show. It has flown by and it's really a tragedy, Dr. Orr, because we could, we could really, I mean, if we wanted to just pick, you know, a single thread, pick any of them from the Western canon, you would then be let loose like a mustang to just, you know, delve into this chapter and verse of this ancient text and we could go on for hours. So it's almost a disservice to you to make you reflect at all on the, you know, the ice shooting or you know, the statistics about X, Y and Z. Because truly you are a marvel and you are a unique human that understands the Western canon and what built Western civilization, unlike anybody I've ever met. And I had some wonderful time with you and we have a really dear shared friend, Don Williams, who was actually the man that married me and my wife, who you happen to know and we discovered our mutual connection. Don went to be with Jesus a couple years ago, but a truly remarkable man that had a great, great life and a great ministry and he ministered to you and he ministered to me. And so I think the floor is Yours, my friend, like, end this. End this hour as you see fit. And I mean, maybe it's remembering Charlie. Maybe it's what you hope to see come from this. And yeah, whatever it is, the floor is yours.

[E]

Thank you, Andrea. The checks in the post later. That's so good of you to say. And. And it's so strange to meet not. Not just Charlie, but, But. But you and his team just. Just a few months ago. And yet, you know, felt like just, you know, the lifelong friendships were emerging and we just had these. These great plans. And I. I learned far more from Charlie than I think he learned from me. Because, you know, I think I was joking earlier. I was. I spent months trying to get him to call me James, but it was always doctor or that incredible kind of.

[D]

Right.

[E]

Humility.

[D]

It's ironic that he's known to be sort of anti college and all this stuff, but yet when he met a true scholar, how much reverence he actually had.

[E]

And that came across, I thought, in Larry Ann's beautiful tribute to him in the stadium. And I've never, never seen Larry, you know, deeply kind of moved like that. He's always very good at keeping it together. But I. It was just such an extraordinary testimony. I think he mentioned at one point that, you know, he said to. He said to Charlie, you know, you gotta learn, and it's gonna take suffering. It's a great bit of wisdom from Aeschylus's Agamemnon Pathemata, Mathemata. You have sufferings, learnings. And that idea that Larry's just instills that in his. In his, His. In his cohorts at Hillsdale, and then just Charlie goes off and does all 31 Hillsdale courses available, then, you know, comes back, comes back for more and just extraordinary. And I. I think, you know, it's hard to. Hard, you know, hard to replace somebody with that. That kind of package of. Of powers and skills and abilities and aptitudes.

[D]

And you can't replace him.

[E]

But. But I felt on Sunday, you know, something had shifted and that although he could not be replaced, there was something. Something stirring, something that is. Something that is. That is peaceful. Something that is, you know, that is kind of recovering the ancient. The ancient vision for the west, of hope, of faith, of love, the great, you know, the great trinity of theological virtues. And it was just extraordinary to witness that. And there's a kind of envy. I remember that last show we did that was aired as his last show. We recorded it back in August. And I think I opened it by saying, I don't normally like watching things I do, but I wanted to watch that because I wanted to be reminded of him and of our time together. And I think I just started by saying, look, you know, young people are always saying we want to change the world. And I tend to think that the world would be a much better place if you're young people try to change it. But in of terms, but in Charlie's case, I said, you know, you really are changing the world. You are really shifting, shifting things in extraordinary ways. I think I said at one point, we need to bottle some Kirk juice and bring it back, to bring it back to the mother country. But I think there's going to be a lot of Kirk juice in Britain now.

[D]

It's been better than bottled. It's been unleashed.

[E]

That's right. That's right. There's going to be. There's a torrent of it all over, all over the west now. And what a role model he will be. What an exemplar he will be in death to so many, many who'd never really come across him before. As true, as I said in Britain, he's being discovered for the first time by millions of Brits.

[D]

France, I've heard similar stories about France.

[E]

That's right. And even Spain, especially among the young. I haven't lost count of the number of people saying, never heard of this guy. But my, my children are talking about it. My children are incredibly upset. And it's just an extraordinary legacy. I count it just such a high honor to have got to know him in the last few months of his life. And we must honor him in the months and years ahead. Honor his legacy.

[D]

You and he shared a mission to save the west and we must do that. We must. It's worth saving. It's beautiful. And that was his passion. It's just been an honor to have you here, Dr. Orr. James. I don't know. At last. Yeah. Doctor, we'll see you tomorrow.

[E]

Thank you, Andrew. Thank you, Blake.

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