The Charlie Kirk Show, September 29, 2025

Summary

The Charlie Kirk Show – September 29, 2025

Podcast: Real America’s Voice / iHeartPodcasts
Episode: The Charlie Kirk Show (Special Revival Edition)
Guests: Pastor Mark Driscoll, Pastor Josh McPherson
Host: Andrew Colvett (Executive Producer, standing in after Charlie’s death)

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Episode Overview

Main Theme:
This episode centers on the aftermath of Charlie Kirk’s assassination and the remarkable spiritual revival it has triggered across America. The discussion focuses on the personal, church, and national implications of this movement; the historical context and ingredients of revival; and practical exhortations for pastors and Christians navigating this pivotal moment. The show specifically addresses the impact of Kirk’s legacy on faith, public life, and the rise of what the hosts consider a new era of bold, uncompartmentalized Christianity.

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Key Discussion Points and Insights

1. The “Charlie Effect”: Revival Sparked by Martyrdom

• [02:53–06:29]
  The episode opens with emotional testimonies from individuals who credit Charlie Kirk’s death with igniting a profound spiritual hunger, prompting thousands to return to church after years away.
  • Several callers express how witnessing Kirk’s assassination or memory motivated them to revisit faith and community.
  • Many churches report surges in attendance—some even reaching “Easter-level” numbers.

“Charlie’s death really ignited a spiritual flame inside of me that I have never, never in my life experienced before. It is. It's like a spiritual switch.” – Listener Testimonial (03:01)

• [13:05–13:37]
  The hosts and guests discuss how Kirk’s life and message were so inseparable from his faith that, in his passing, it was impossible for even secular observers to avoid the topic of Jesus.

2. Historical Understanding of Revival and Martyrdom

• [13:37–16:25] Pastor Mark Driscoll:
  • Defines “martyr” as “witness” and recounts the early Christian tradition of martyrdom.
  • Cites Tertullian: “The blood of the martyrs is the seed of the church.”
  • Draws parallels between Kirk’s public death and martyrdom triggering movements in church history.
  • Notes, “When it came to the funeral, everyone who talked about Charlie had to talk about Jesus.”

3. Real-Time Report of Spiritual Awakening

• [16:25–18:27] Pastor Josh McPherson:
  Shares how pastors across the nation are reporting dramatic increases in church attendance and baptisms. Many cite Kirk as the primary catalyst for renewed faith, including those who had resisted Christianity for years.

“At my church, we baptized 45 people yesterday… one guy had heard a hundred sermons from me, but it was Charlie's martyrdom that broke him…” – Pastor Josh McPherson (17:18)

4. The Ingredients and Signs of Revival

• [25:33–29:57] Pastor Mark Driscoll:
  • Revival is often preceded by new technology (Roman roads, printing press, radio, TV, now social media).
  • A “moment” (often martyrdom) can become a “movement” if followed by sustained change and leadership, especially among young people.
  • American revivals have historically been youthful movements, e.g., Great Awakenings, Jesus Movement, and he includes Kirk: "Charlie Kirk, 18. Started proclaiming..."

“Most revivals are led by youth... When revival hits, it's new technology. It's a moment that activates a young generation that leads to a movement.” – Pastor Mark Driscoll (29:15)

5. The Role of the Church and the Challenge of “New Wineskins”

• [39:41–41:24] Pastor Mark Driscoll:
  • Revival is accompanied by reformation: God cleaning up cowardly churches.
  • Claims God may “bypass pulpits” to spread the gospel via mass digital platforms, as with Kirk’s memorial.
  • Praises the decision not to copyright or monetize Kirk’s funeral stream, calling it “the biggest gospel presentation in any moment in the history of humanity.”

“Thank you for being the person who allowed the gospel to go out to the largest audience in the history of humanity.” – Pastor Mark Driscoll, to Andrew Colvett (41:29)

• [42:10–42:51]
  Erica Kirk’s public act of forgiveness toward her husband’s killer modeled Christ-like forgiveness, which Driscoll identifies as the deepest shaft of revival.

“The moment was when she chose forgiveness over unforgiveness and bitterness and vengeance... She modeled, if she could, [forgive], you can too.” – Pastor Mark Driscoll (42:36)

6. National and Cultural Impact – Faith in the Public Square

• [45:13–48:30]
  J.D. Vance's public confession that the event made him more open about his faith is highlighted as a pivotal moment; the hosts speculate this may mark a national shift toward open Christianity in leadership.

• [54:00–56:13] Pastor Josh McPherson:
  Argues for the necessity of distinct “lanes” for family, church, and government, with the church boldly proclaiming truth and not shying away from the public arena.

“The beauty... I don't need our government officials to preach the gospel, but we need them to stand on the foundation of the moral law of God so they can do their job and really stay out of the church's lane.” – Pastor Josh McPherson (55:30)

7. Responding to Criticism of “Christian Nationalism”

• [70:58–75:36]
  The hosts rebut media claims that current events represent “religious nationalism.” Driscoll argues that nations built on Christian values are historically good for people, and that public faith is not dangerous but beneficial for society.

“Nationalism is what God did to save us from destroying ourselves... United people without God are dangerous people.” – Pastor Mark Driscoll (74:06)

8. Kirk’s Unique Witness: Uncompartmentalized Christianity

• [77:57–79:14]
  Kirk is praised for refusing to separate his faith from his social and political commentary—a stance the hosts encourage in all Christians.

“The most important thing, and Charlie always says this, was preach the gospel. The second most important thing is to make sure you can do the first.” – Andrew Colvett (78:34)

9. Charge to Pastors and Churches: The “Cowboy” Model

• [104:27–106:12]
  • Pastors are challenged to lead courageously, not just as gentle shepherds but as “cowboys” who will actively defend their flocks from “wolves”—falsehoods and evil in culture.
  • Masculine fortitude and courage, not fear, are held up as contagious and essential for church leaders.

"A pastor is supposed to be a cowboy, supposed to be able to kill wolves and protect sheep." – Pastor Mark Driscoll (104:27)

10. Six-Point Exhortation for Pastors (Practical Guidance)

• [113:49–118:13] Pastor Josh McPherson:
  Offers a systematized list for pastors navigating the revival:

  1. Set forth the truth plainly – Like Paul and Kirk, clarity is essential.
  2. Demonstrate the Spirit’s Power – Rely on God’s Spirit, not just human wisdom.
  3. Boldly proclaim the truth – Refuse to be deterred by potential backlash.
  4. Live not by lies – Do not be silent in the face of cultural falsehoods.
  5. Enjoy the King – Set an example of joy and beauty in following Jesus.
  6. Fight downhill – Stop ceding ground to corrupt institutions; build new ones if necessary.

“They’re just fearless, for Jesus’ sake. And they’re seeing their churches explode...” – Pastor Josh McPherson (114:13)

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Notable Quotes & Moments

• “I think I told you before that this is the first time in my life where I could say I feel the prayers of strangers all around the country and world.”
  — Andrew Colvett (11:58)
• “I want to be careful with this. I don’t want to turn Charlie into Jesus... But when Erica said, ‘I forgive him,’ forgiveness of sin is what unleashes the power of the Holy Spirit. ”
  — Pastor Mark Driscoll (42:51)
• “Courage is contagious, and so is fear. That’s what you saw with Charlie. If Charlie had manifested fear, nobody would have showed up for his funeral. Because he manifested courage, there’s an entire generation saying, I choose faith, not fear.”
  — Pastor Mark Driscoll (106:38)
• “If the pulpits of America don’t disciple the culture, the culture will disciple the culture... secularism has a god, and it’s the god of self.”
  — Pastor Josh McPherson (78:42)

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Timestamps for Key Segments

| Topic | Time (MM:SS) | |-----------------------------------------------|----------------------| | Emotional Impact & Testimonies | 02:53–07:29 | | Historical Martyrdom & Revival | 13:37–16:25 | | Pastors Recount Revival Stories | 16:25–18:27 | | Ingredients & Examples of Revival | 25:33–29:57 | | “New Wineskins”, Church Bypass & Erica’s Role | 39:41–42:51 | | J.D. Vance’s Public Faith Moment | 45:13–48:30 | | Faith & Legislation: Church/Gov’t Roles | 54:00–56:13 | | Christian Nationalism Media Critique | 70:58–75:36 | | Exhortation: Six Points for Pastors | 113:49–118:13 | | Final Encouragement & Doctrine Giveaway | 118:13–119:15 |

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Takeaways for Listeners

• A Spiritual Groundswell:
  Kirk’s death has acted as a lightning rod for spiritual revival, drawing even former atheists or estranged Christians back to faith communities in unprecedented numbers.

• Leadership by Example:
  Forgiveness, humility, uncompromising truth, and joy are essential marks of Christian leadership in this “new wine” era.

• Courage Over Fear:
  The boldness of Kirk, his widow Erica, and high-ranking officials like J.D. Vance are inspiring others to live their faith publicly without reservation.

• Challenge to Pastors:
  Churches must “shepherd” courageously, combining tenderness with toughness (the “cowboy” spirit), and must not shy away from cultural or political arenas.

• Living Public Faith:
  The accusation of “Christian nationalism” is reframed as the rightful public expression of foundational American and Christian values.

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Closing Thought

The show closes with the offering of Pastor Mark Driscoll’s book “Doctrine” for free download as a resource for those reigniting their faith. The hosts urge leaders and listeners alike to respond with truth, courage, joy, and action—to seize this unique cultural and spiritual moment.

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For Additional Resources:

• Download “Doctrine” by Mark Driscoll: Text ‘doctrine’ to 99383 or visit charliekirk.com
• Practical Next Steps for Churches & Pastors: See the six-point list at [113:49–118:13]

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This summary captures the flow, tone, and heart of the episode, serving as a guide for those seeking to understand or revisit the central themes and insights discussed.

Transcript

[Pastor Josh McPherson]

This is an iHeart podcast.

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[Pastor Josh McPherson]

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[Charlie Kirk]

The Charlie Kirk show starts now. I don't know if anyone is ever going to see this video, but hi, my name is Haley and Charlie Kirk's death led me to give my life fully To Jesus Christ. Charlie's death really ignited a spiritual flame inside of me that I have never, never in my life experienced before. It is. It's like a spiritual switch.

[Terrence Bates]

I didn't know Charlie Kirk.

[Charlie Kirk]

Never met that guy before in my life. And something else that I've never done.

[Terrence Bates]

Before in my life is believing God. I'm gonna wear this suit to church.

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I'm gonna go to church.

[Charlie Kirk]

I'm going to try to be a better father, husband, and leader for my family. I've never, ever opened the Bible before. In fact, I know nothing about Christianity or Jesus. But yesterday, after witnessing the assassination of Charlie Kirk, I. Something was calling me to my husband's Bible.

[Pastor Josh McPherson]

I'm going to be heading to church here shortly. I'm excited to go and learn and get to meet new people, something that I've been wanting to do for a while.

[Charlie Kirk]

So the first time ever in over 15 years, I'm going to church. It has been so heavy on my heart that I just. I needed something. So after Charlie Kirk's death and seeing what this world truly is, now's the time.

[Pastor Josh McPherson]

There's no more waiting.

[Charlie Kirk]

This was my first time going to church in almost seven years, maybe even.

[Pastor Mark Driscoll]

More than seven years.

[Charlie Kirk]

I went to church today because of Charlie Kirk and his family. I am heading to church today. I have my Bible today. There was literally dust on the COVID when I pulled it out. I've seen so many videos this week of Charlie talking about how time and time again, like, he wants to be known for his faith above all else. And I'm trying to be more like Charlie Kirk. And maybe if someone sees this video, they'll be encouraged to walk back into a church today, too.

[Pastor Josh McPherson]

We are ready for church now.

[Charlie Kirk]

I have not been to church in years. Today will be my son's first day.

[Pastor Josh McPherson]

First time to church.

[Charlie Kirk]

And today is the first time that me and my fiance together collectively are going to church. Today is the first day that my family. My family is going to church. So this is all because of Charlie and his gospel, his words. And today starts our turning point. I just arrived at church for the first time in a very long time. I needed some kind of refuge, some kind of, you know, hope that not all is lost. Well, it's Sunday morning, and I'm going to church for the first time in about 12 years. I'm about to do something that I have not done in 25 years and I have never done of my own volition. I'm going to church.

[Pastor Mark Driscoll]

Good morning.

[Charlie Kirk]

I thought I'd come on quick and give an update of what I'm doing today because I'm actually really excited and really looking forward to it. I'm actually headed to church for Sunday service for the first time in a long time. I just went to church for the.

[Pastor Josh McPherson]

First time in several years.

[Charlie Kirk]

Had tickets to see Charlie October 29th at Old Miss. I was really looking forward to it. I've been a lifelong atheist. I never believed in God. But I saw the joy that it brought to Charlie and it brought me to God and really moved me to see him. And I was looking forward to meeting him and telling him that you helped me find God. After 10 years, not reading any scripture, not stepping foot in church, not even making a prayer, Charlie Kirk is the.

[Pastor Josh McPherson]

Main reason for me finding my faith again.

[Charlie Kirk]

You don't think it's crazy to get in church? Here's the line for the second service. And there's never a line, by the way. There's never a line. Okay, I see. Thank you.

[Pastor Josh McPherson]

There's never been a line here.

[Terrence Bates]

Charlie Kirk.

[Charlie Kirk]

Look what you did. No parking. No parking at all.

[Terrence Bates]

None.

[Charlie Kirk]

Had to park like 5 blocks away.

[Terrence Bates]

From church because everyone wants to come now.

[Charlie Kirk]

Amen. Thank you, Jesus.

[Terrence Bates]

Thank you, Charlie.

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[Pastor Josh McPherson]

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Featuring the iconic journalists of Variety and hosted by co editor in chief Cynthia Littleton.

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Every day there's a battle for your mind.

[Charlie Kirk]

Raging information coming from every angle.

[Pastor Mark Driscoll]

With the will of to deceive.

[Charlie Kirk]

Fear not. You found the place for truth.

[Pastor Mark Driscoll]

The voice of a generation that still has the will to believe in the.

[Charlie Kirk]

Greatest country in the history of the world. This is the Charlie Kirk Show. Buckle up. Here we go. All right. Welcome to the Charlie Kirk Show. I'm Andrew Colvett, executive producer of this fine show and we have had quite a weekend. I will tell you that watching, if you were watching on Real America's Voice or on the stream, you saw an intro that our team put together talking about how many people are going back to church because of what happened to Charlie. And you've heard a lot of people talking about revival. You've been talking, you've been hearing a lot of people bring up that God is working in their hearts for the first time in a long time that they're opening their Bible. So I wanted to have a show devoted to that question, what is revival? What does it mean? What are the necessary ingredients that make up a revival? And how do we ensure that we do all that we can to press into it and pour into it so that it grows and grows and grows. How do we not thwart the spirit? So joining me today are two men that know all about that topic and they've studied it and they know much more than I do about it. And by the way, one of which book that we mentioned last week because it was one of Charlie's favorites and that's Doctrine by Pastor Mark Driscoll So welcome, Pastor Mark.

[Pastor Mark Driscoll]

Yeah, good to see you, buddy. Thanks for having me. And thank you for your team. Just cannot even imagine the difficulty of processing the grief of the loss of someone that you love and also the increased workload. So thank you for leading the team and praying for you and Erica and everybody.

[Charlie Kirk]

Well, thank you, Pastor Mark. We, we feel the, the prayers. I, I think I told you before that this is the first time in my life where I could say I feel the prayers of strangers all around the country and world. And I think that's, you know, a big part of what you're seeing us pull off. And whether it be the, the memorial or getting the show together and growing the tour and so many things, I'm so proud of the team. So I, I'm with you on that. And then Pastor Joshua McPherson. Did I get it?

[Pastor Josh McPherson]

You got it. Nailed it.

[Charlie Kirk]

Sort of ish. He's going to be nice about it. And you're up in the state of Washington. Yeah. Wenatchee. And you have stronger man nation.com strongermannn nation.com and you've been in and around TPUSA faith and some of the team with us. So honored to have you as well to talk about this. I know you preached about revival over the weekend.

[Pastor Josh McPherson]

Yes. It's an honor to be here and just echo what Mark said. Marveling at the strength and grace of your team in light of the events and very grateful what you guys are doing and here to serve.

[Charlie Kirk]

Well, that's, that's amazing. So, Pastor Mark, start with you. You watched the intro and I.

[Pastor Mark Driscoll]

It was moving.

[Charlie Kirk]

If you're on radio, please check out the stream later. And check it out. It's basically clip after clip after clip of people that don't look like the. You know, probably the image a lot of people have of what a Sunday Christian looks like. And yet here they are being so dramatically impacted by the legacy of Charlie and the life he led, the message he preached. Are we seeing this at the local level with your guys, communities that you Pastor, can you see? Are you hearing about it from other pastors that you know.

[Pastor Mark Driscoll]

Yeah. So start maybe at a higher level. So a martyr is someone who dies for their faith. And so the Bible is written in a couple of ancient languages. One of them is Greek, and the word means witness or testimony. And you know that somebody really believes something when they're willing to die for it. That's the ultimate allegiance that you can demonstrate. And so the first saints in the history of the Christian church were martyrs. They were people who were basically willing to die for their love and devotion to Jesus Christ as God and Lord and Savior. And so the first Christians, they died out of their love for Jesus. Early reports say that in the first few centuries of the church, there were between 5 and 10 million martyrs. I mean, so we just had a funeral for a great man. Imagine 5 or 10 million of those. And then Tertullian, the church father in the third century, he said that the blood of the martyrs is the seed of the church. And so the reason that Christianity spreads so wildly and rapidly is people no longer fear death.

[Pastor Josh McPherson]

That's right.

[Pastor Mark Driscoll]

And so, you know, there is a mockery even of death in First Corinthians 15, whereo, death is your sting, where, O death is your victory.

[Charlie Kirk]

I said that in my. My speech.

[Pastor Mark Driscoll]

Actually, you did, and you did a great job, and I want to honor you for that. And, and so within that, once Jesus came back from death, the believers no longer fear death because the issue of the Christian faith is the resurrection of Jesus Christ. That is the issue. And so once death is defeated, it is no longer feared. So people are willing to die for Jesus. And that was an incredible witness and testimony. And so when Charlie died, he died publicly. I can't think of a more public death in my lifetime.

[Charlie Kirk]

There hasn't been one.

[Pastor Mark Driscoll]

And it was surreal for me and I'm sure for most watching on the phone going, is this AI. Is this. Is this not real? This can't be real. I'm praying, Lord Jesus, please, I hope it is not real. But Charlie loved Jesus Christ, and his highest allegiance and devotion was to Jesus Christ. You know that, I know that. And so when it came to the funeral, everyone who talked about Charlie had to talk about Jesus because Jesus was the person Charlie was always talking about. And so now in his wake, what I really honor about Charlie and I really appreciate about Erica, they pointed everybody who was following them in the right direction. Get a Bible, go to church, keep going. Erica said, and now people are actually following their leadership and their example, which is incredibly honoring to the Lord Jesus. And there will be incredible blessing that comes upon them and the organization for that act of obedience.

[Pastor Josh McPherson]

That's right. That's right. We're seeing it on a local level. I'm in touch with over 50 pastors and different text threads, talking constantly. And. And there's been a series, I think, of tests for churches and pastors in the last five years. Covid, different administrations.

[Pastor Mark Driscoll]

You know, blm, would you say it's for like. Like Covid was a Test.

[Pastor Josh McPherson]

Covid was a test.

[Pastor Mark Driscoll]

So then Black Lives Matter was a test. Yeah, the election was a test. And the. The martyrdom of Charlie Kirk. Those are four tests for pastors and churches.

[Pastor Josh McPherson]

That's exactly right. And pastors who are passing the test in terms of stepping out, being public, being more bold, being more clear, setting forth the truth, plainly not worrying about parties, but cutting through the noise to speak the truth, and not being afraid to recognize that there is not symmetry between political parties right now in terms of morality and being willing to call that out across the board. Andrew, we're seeing those churches and those pastors, Easter level attendance, Easter level salvation responses. It's like there's a moment where. And we're talking all day, you know, with these pastors, and they're like, you know, up 35%, up 45%. One church up 80%. And just an outpouring of people. Like at my church, we baptized 45 people yesterday. The consistent testimony. I'll tell one story. This is negative on myself. A guy had been coming to Grace city church for 10 years. A little embarrassing. 10 years in a city group. His wife, a follower, stubborn, unwilling to submit to Jesus, had been following Charlie, had heard a hundred sermons from me, been following Charlie. And Wednesday afternoon, God breaks him. And as a result of this event, in Charlie's martyrdom, he breaks down weeping in his office, gives his life to Jesus. He's this introverted, quiet guy who would follow his wife to church but never talk about Jesus. We have not been able to shut him up. He's bringing neighbors and friends and co workers radically saved in the wake of this horrific event.

[Charlie Kirk]

That reminds me, when I got saved, I couldn't stop reading the Bible and I couldn't stop talking about it with people. And I think that's actually a really interesting proof point when somebody is really saved. Forgive me, guys. I don't want to interrupt this conversation, but I do have to do a little family business here. As you in the audience would know, we haven't been doing ad reads. We haven't been talking about any of the partners on this show for the last, I don't know, 18 days, 19 days. And that was out of respect, obviously, for what just happened. And I just said no. And I told our partners, our broadcast partners, that we couldn't. And it wasn't out of disrespect for the advertisers. It was out of just respect for what we've all just been living through. But today we're going to start again. And the reason is is because we love our advertisers and they've been supporting us and they've been faithful to us. They've been faithful to Charlie and this team. And so today we're going to do that. So I hope that that makes sense and I hope you understand. And I just want to say a thank you to our advertising, you know, our network partners and our advertising partners for bearing with us and you've been fantastic and deserve a lot of praise. Now I just cut it short, so forgive me. Not a good start. But Alan Jackson Ministries, we are honored to be partnering with them. Culture and Christianity. The Alan Jackson Podcast. I want you guys to check it out. What makes it unique is Pastor Allen's biblical perspective. He takes the truth from the Bible and applies it to issues we're facing today. Gender confusion, abortion, immigration, Doge Trump and the White House issues in the church. He doesn't just discuss the problems, he explains them from a biblical perspective. And we love that in every episode he gives practical things we can do to make a difference. So again, that's the Culture and Christianity podcast. It is informative and encouraging and you can find it on YouTube, Spotify or wherever you get your podcasts. Be sure to subscribe so you don't miss any episodes. Again, that's Alan Jackson Ministries, good friends. It kind of breaks my heart to read that one first because Charlie and Erica were going to be at that event and obviously God had other plans. So anyways, thank you guys for your patience with us as we get back into a little bit of regular rhythm here. More with Pastor Mark and Pastor Josh when we get back. Don't go anywhere.

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[Variety Podcast Host]

There's a lot going on in Hollywood. How are you supposed to stay on top of it all? Variety has the solution. Take 20 minutes out of your day and listen to the new daily Variety podcast for breaking entertainment news and expert perspectives.

[Pastor Josh McPherson]

Where do you see the business actually heading?

[Variety Podcast Host]

Featuring the iconic journalists of Variety and hosted by co editor in Chief Cynthia Littleton.

[NFLShop Advertiser]

The only constant in Hollywood is change.

[Variety Podcast Host]

Open your free iHeartradio app search daily variety and listen now.

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[Emily Maitlis / John Sopel]

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[Pastor Mark Driscoll]

Listening to the Charlie Kirk Show.

[Charlie Kirk]

All right, welcome back to Real America's Voice. I again, as I said, we're trying to get back to a little bit of regular order. And I just want to say again, thank you to our advertising partners that have been so gracious and patient with us and thank you to the audience and give us a little grace as we remember how to do regular order. But I'm really honored by this next partner. And that would be Real America. Sorry? Well, Real America's voices are our network partners. We appreciate them too. But why Refi now? Y Refi was actually one of the folks was there that day with his daughter and when Charlie was assassinated, that's how much they cared about our campus tours and they sponsored the entire campus tours. And as soon as all this happened, they called us and said, you know what? We're not going anywhere. We're in. We love you guys and anything you need. And so I'm honored to talk about why refi.com they of course help with private student loan debt and they'll help you with that. Doesn't matter what your credit is, it doesn't matter what your history is. They will help you get out of that. But more than anything, they're just good people and they've stood by our side in this, and I want you to honor them and support them if you can, please. Why? Refi.com. we'll be right back with radio. All right, welcome back to the Charlie Kirk show, radio stations across the country. I'm here with Pastor Mark Driscoll and Pastor Josh McPherson.

[Pastor Josh McPherson]

Crushed it.

[Charlie Kirk]

Dang it. I'm gonna get it.

[Pastor Mark Driscoll]

Good.

[Pastor Josh McPherson]

You should do this for a living.

[Charlie Kirk]

Yeah, eventually. Yeah. I'm new, so forgive me. So anyways, we're talking about revival, and we were just talking about this manifest presence of God and that you can sort of feel the Holy Spirit and this is that common, that that's this outpouring, when you look at the history, is revived. By the way, tell us some examples of revival so that we have something to compare it to.

[Pastor Mark Driscoll]

Yeah, so. And thank you for the honor of having the conversation. And it's for those who don't know, it's wild because, I mean, I've known you for how long?

[Charlie Kirk]

I want to say 20 years, which is wild.

[Pastor Mark Driscoll]

You were in college.

[Charlie Kirk]

Yeah.

[Pastor Josh McPherson]

Teaching your kids in Sunday school at Marshall. That's one of the stories.

[Pastor Mark Driscoll]

Yeah.

[Charlie Kirk]

Wild.

[Pastor Mark Driscoll]

And so what happens is what precedes revival is often a new way of distributing information. So in the days of the New Testament, you wouldn't get Christianity in the Apostle Paul unless you had Roman peace and the road system. So then Christianity could spread. And similarly, when you get new technology, it tends to be used of God for revival. So, for example, the printing press with Johann Gutenberg, it allowed the Protestant Reformation. Then comes the advent of technology that allows people to meet in stadiums. Well, now you get the Billy Grahams. He couldn't do that before. You get radio. Now you're getting to go into countries and closed areas. Then you get television. And now it's a new opportunity. And now we're in a digital age. And Charlie showed with his life and legacy the impact of new media. So what precedes revival oftentimes is new technology that opens new opportunity. And then what usually happens is in revival, God isn't doing something new. He's doing what he's always doing in deeper and greater measure. God is always saving people. God is always changing people. God is always manifesting himself. But in a revival, it goes from like a creek to a. To a torrent.

[Pastor Josh McPherson]

Flood.

[Pastor Mark Driscoll]

Yeah. To a flash flood. And all of a sudden it's like, okay, we're. We're used to a few people coming to church or reading their Bible or asking about Jesus, and. And now all of a sudden, it is a moment. And so revival is usually preceded by a moment. And in the early church, that moment was the martyrdom of Stephen, the first martyr in the New Testament. And actually revival started first time that I remember in the Old Testament with the murder of Abel. Cain kills Abel. The first martyr in the Bible was Abel. And then it says at that time, people began to call upon the name of the Lord. And so historically, there is a moment. Oftentimes that moment is a martyrdom, and then there's a movement. And so it goes from a moment to a movement. And now that person's life becomes their legacy. And other people are following in their footsteps and wake. With the death of Charlie Kirk and his clarity about the Gospel of Jesus Christ and him answering questions about Christ right before he was murdered, we now have a moment. The question is, will it become a movement? In 10 years of people are still reading their Bible and still going to church and still learning about Jesus, you know, you've got a movement. Historically, one of the most interesting things in the history of movements, they tend to be ignited by young people. I wrote a few notes down. So Jonathan Edwards, during the Great Awakenings, he started preaching at 19. George Whitfield, 25. Circuit riders were in their 20s. The average died by their early 30s. The Methodist.

[Charlie Kirk]

Yep, they were amazing.

[Pastor Josh McPherson]

Wrote themselves.

[Pastor Mark Driscoll]

They wrote themselves, yeah. There were certain guys that literally killed six horses just riding to preach. D.L. moody, 21. Bonhoeffer, 25. Charles Haddon Spurgeon, 19. Billy Graham, 19.

[Charlie Kirk]

Charlie Kirk, 18.

[Pastor Mark Driscoll]

Charlie Kirk, 18. Started proclaiming. And what you see is that most revivals are led by youth. The United. This will be shocking to people who think that it's all political and not spiritual. The United States of America was an attempt at a youth movement to spark a revival. The pilgrims who landed and the Puritans who landed tended to be in their teens and 20s, and they were rejected and mocked for being, quote, mere children. And they were coming to establish religious liberty and freedom. Historically, we saw it with the Jesus movements in the 60s and 70s, the entirety of the second, they were all hippies and young. In the second great awakening, it was mainly college kids. So when revival hits, it's new technology. It's a moment that activates a young generation that leads to a movement. And so we have. All of the ingredients are here. And I hope and I pray that that is exactly what we're on the precipice of.

[Charlie Kirk]

Yeah, I just want to affirm some of your observations there. I mean, I was in the room, I was watching the analytics come through and we would see, I mean, we did 15 billion views on social media.

[Pastor Josh McPherson]

Insane.

[Charlie Kirk]

In the lead up to the election and then we basically doubled it in the spring after it. So I mean, we just. And I kept telling Charlie, I was like, you are insanely famous, man. We need to like. But you didn't really know it. No, I didn't. I kept going like it was. I tweeted really close after we kept having to recalibrate because I just was like on a two year delay somehow of just how many people knew who he was. And I was like, I'm still getting used to this. We're gonna take a quick radio break. We'll keep going in the stream. Don't go anywhere.

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[Pastor Josh McPherson]

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[Emily Maitlis / John Sopel]

The stories making the news headlines across the world. The news agents we're not just here to tell you what's happening, but why. From me, Emily Maitlis and me, Jon Sopel with Global's award winning podcast, the Newsagents Dropping daily covering everything you need to know about politics and current affairs. And the newsagents USA listening to the newsagents on America's number one podcast network, iHeart. Open your free iHeart app and search the newsagents to start listening.

[Terrence Bates]

Welcome back to this Real America's Voice news break.

[Charlie Kirk]

Welcome back.

[Terrence Bates]

I'm Terrence Bates. Thanks so much for being here with us. Happening right now at the White House, President Trump scheduled to be meeting with Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu. The two are holding a bilateral meeting and are scheduled to hold a news conference together within the next hour or so. You can see the arrival here. Today's meeting comes on the heels of Netanyahu addressing the United Nations General assembly on Friday. That same day, President Trump alluded to a nearing to nearing a peace or ceasefire deal in Gaza. And just this morning, White House Press Secretary Caroline Levitt saying that all sides are, quote, very close to agreeing to a comprehensive plan to end the war in Gaza. She says the president's special envoy to the Middle east sent each side a detailed 21 point plan for ending the war. Leavitt also says the commander in chief expects both sides to agree. Quote, the president knows and believes that this is as good of a plan as these sides are going to see and that's why it's a 21 point plan, she says. President Trump also set to meet with top congressional leaders today as the deadline to avoid a government shutdown is now just hours away. Today's meeting comes after the commander in chief canceled a planned meeting with Democrat leaders from both the House and Senate last week, saying that he didn't believe talks would be constructive. Congressional Republicans are calling on their Democrat colleagues to agree to a continuing resolution that would keep the government funded through November 21. While the measure passed in the House, Senate Democrats rejected the resolution and are demanding that recent cuts to health care programs be rescinded as part of any effort to keep the government open. Many believe that Democrats will force a shutdown tomorrow if they don't get their way. Amid the government shutdown tug of war, President Trump is calling Portland, Oregon a war zone. That's why he's federalizing a couple hundred Oregon National Guardsmen to patrol that city. On Truth Social 47 writing at the request of Secretary of Homeland Security Kristi Noem, I am directing Secretary of War Pete Hegseth to provide all necessary troops to protect war ravaged Portland and any of our ICE facilities under siege from attack by antifa and other domestic terrorists. That's a quick check of your headlines. I'm Terrence Bates.

[Charlie Kirk]

The next great awakening is here. Welcome back to the Charlie Kirk Show. Welcome back to the Charlie Kirk Show. I'm Andrew Colvett, executive producer of this fine show, having an amazing conversation. I hope you guys are enjoying it because I'm like just fixated and fascinated by it. And I hope everybody we're going to get to some prescriptive items of what we need to do to be a part of what God's doing in a revival. So I'm excited to talk about that. But first I want to tell you about my Patriot Supply. One of our great partners, been truly faithful to this show, never wavered, always said, what can we do? What can we do? How do we be more involved? So let me tell you about them right here. September is National Preparedness Month. So it's a perfect time to ask yourself some questions like how much food do you have on hand for emergencies? How would you get clean water if the tap went dry tomorrow? What would you do if a storm knocked out the power for a week? By the way, I got stuck. I couldn't fly out because we had like a monsoon crazy storm here in Phoenix. And it was most rain we'd had in seven years in a single day in Phoenix. Like, okay, God, let's do this. Luckily, our friends at my Patriot Supply are making disaster preparedness easier and more affordable than ever by giving you over fifteen hundred dollars worth of emergency food and preparedness gear for free. They just launched their Preparedness Month mega kit and it includes a full year of emergency food, a water filtration system that can purify almost any water source, a solar backup generator, and a lot more. This is very new. I, I, this is great. I haven't seen this from them. And here's the best part. If you go to my patriotsupply.com Kirk you can get 90 preparedness essentials totaling over 1500 dollars absolutely free. Head to my patriotsupply.Com Kirk mypatriotsupply.com Kirk portions of the show are brought to you proudly by them. They've Been a wonderful partner. So I was just telling you about. Because God goes where he's wanted. And Charlie wanted this. He wanted to see the youth. He devoted his life from the time of being 18, and he was mocked and ridiculed and told it was fool's errand. And he just kept at it. He just kept at it. He just kept at it. And then all of a sudden, you saw that spring forth, and I was relating to you that story of John Wimber, who founded the Vineyard, and he really wanted to see God's miracles. We could debate the merits of whether that was useful or not, but he worked at it like a Fool for 4 years.

[Pastor Josh McPherson]

Pure hunger and desire.

[Charlie Kirk]

Pure hunger and desire. And then all of a sudden, if, you know. If you know anything about the Vineyard church movement. Yeah, it explodes.

[Pastor Josh McPherson]

Worship movement.

[Charlie Kirk]

Yeah. And they have this Toronto blessing, and a bunch of, you know, people experience a manifest presence of the Holy Spirit there. So I'm not relating the two, but there is this sort of thing where I want to tell people out in the audience, if you hunger and desire for the things of the Lord, if you push.

[Pastor Josh McPherson]

That's right.

[Charlie Kirk]

When they're. When it feels like you're getting nowhere, sometimes God's going to answer that moment with something truly remarkable. I'm not promising it God will do what he will do, but I just couldn't help but think about how badly Charlie wanted this. And so to see it come to fruition is amazing. And then to hear you say that revival starts with the youth. I mean, there was. You'd go to one campus and put Charlie there, and these kids were hanging from lampposts and finding stairs to climb up and hanging on railing. And you couldn't fit them all in these. In these campus squares. And it just. It feels like that's what's happening. And then you put together the final thing, and then the floor is yours. Mark, when we met, you said, well, we're going to see. Is God going to bypass the pulpit?

[Pastor Mark Driscoll]

So, yes, I believe that. So in addition to revival, there's reformation. So Reformation is God pruning, cleaning up a church, oftentimes because of its cowardice or tolerance. And tolerance is the counterfeit of repentance. And so any of the churches that have brought in sort of bought into the progressive agenda of tolerance. They are not honoring God because that is the counterfeit of repentance. And so I believe that reformation is God cleaning up the church.

[Pastor Josh McPherson]

Yeah.

[Pastor Mark Driscoll]

And then revival is God bringing people to himself. But if people want to go to church, if the church doesn't have any courage or clarity, it's not going to be helpful to those new people.

[Pastor Josh McPherson]

Yeah.

[Pastor Mark Driscoll]

And so this is. I believe what God is doing is he is. In this moment, he has bypassed the pulpits and he instead chose to have the gospel preached in the largest platform in the history of the world. There's two things, actually, three things I want to say about that. Number one, when we had lunch and, you know, it was just good to catch up with you, there was one thing that I felt that the Holy Spirit told me to tell you, and that is that whoever decided to allow the livestream of Charlie's funeral and memorial to not be copyrighted, but to be freely shared, to say thank you on behalf of Jesus Christ, because that permitted the biggest gospel presentation in my awareness, of any moment in the history of humanity. And I believe you made that decision to allow it to be streamed and not copyrighted. And for those who are tuning in, there's money, there's power, there's favors that can be curried through taking that moment and trying to monetize it. And what you chose to do was maximize it.

[Pastor Josh McPherson]

That's right.

[Pastor Mark Driscoll]

And so in that moment, we as pastors honor you.

[Pastor Josh McPherson]

That's right.

[Pastor Mark Driscoll]

Because in that moment, you decided, I'm going to allow the most people to hear about Jesus and not worry about what I get in return. And so I know I was your pastor for some years, and I love you, and I just want to say I'm incredibly proud of you.

[Pastor Josh McPherson]

That's right.

[Pastor Mark Driscoll]

And on behalf of Jesus Christ and Christians, thank you for being the person who allowed the gospel to go out to the largest audience in the history of humanity. And most people don't know that that was your choice, and I know it was with Erica's full support.

[Charlie Kirk]

Totally. Yeah. It wasn't just me, you know, but the whole team didn't even question when it was like, no, we got to go forward. And this is for everybody, for Charlie, the gospel.

[Pastor Mark Driscoll]

But then, too, not to interrupt you, my friend, but the moment that if revival does break out, where there was, I believe, a shifting, breaking in the unseen realm, was Erica Kirk.

[Pastor Josh McPherson]

That's right.

[Pastor Mark Driscoll]

She was elegant, courageous, emotionally present, completely appropriate, devotedly loyal to her God and her husband and her family.

[Pastor Josh McPherson]

Yes.

[Pastor Mark Driscoll]

But the moment was when she chose forgiveness over unforgiveness and bitterness and vengeance. And to me, revival is all about the forgiveness of sin.

[Pastor Josh McPherson]

Yes.

[Pastor Mark Driscoll]

And she modeled if she could. This is like, I want to be careful with this. I don't want to turn Charlie into Jesus. I know that Charlie knew that he wasn't Jesus. But when Jesus was on the cross, he prayed, father, forgive them. When Stephen the martyr was being martyred as the first martyr in the New Testament Church, he echoed Jesus words and he said, father, forgive them. And then when Erica said, I forgive him. Forgiveness of sin is what unleashes the power of the Holy Spirit. And revival is all about one thing, the forgiveness of sin through Jesus Christ. And so in that moment, Erica used the platform that God gave her. And in that moment, God bypassed many pulpits. And there was more courage and clarity with the presentation of Jesus on that day than in many pulpits. And we were sitting there next, we kept looking at each other. We're pastors. And it was wild. It was just. It was like, is. Is anybody not going to do it? I mean, is everybody here an evangelist? I mean, it was wild.

[Charlie Kirk]

I know. And to hear even like Tulsi, who's, you know, not a Christian, she. She got darn close.

[Pastor Mark Driscoll]

She tried, she tried.

[Pastor Josh McPherson]

She died.

[Pastor Mark Driscoll]

She could have.

[Charlie Kirk]

She's about to preach the gospel.

[Pastor Josh McPherson]

Hey, man, let's go.

[Pastor Mark Driscoll]

And I'll leave it at this. The second. The second moment to me that was incredibly sacred and could be the spark of revival was the humility of J.D. vance when he said, basically, I'm paraphrasing that I've always been a Christian, but I've not spoken openly and boldly, as I've talked more about Jesus in the last few weeks than I have in my whole life. To be the Vice President of the United States of America and to publicly confess that your allegiance to Jesus has been less than 100%, you don't have to do that. And he did that. And he did that as an example of humility. And I would say to all pastors and Christian leaders who maybe have not been totally courageous and fearless, follow his example and apologize to your people. And so in that too, though, I mean, when J.D. did that, I believe that if he is going to become our next president, I believe that was the moment because that was the moment that he chose humility and to honor Jesus above all else. And I believe Jesus honors those who live under his authority. But you were saying backstage that that wasn't part of his notes.

[Charlie Kirk]

No, he ad libbed that moment. Yeah, because I could see backstage, I mean, it was a surreal backstage, you got President Trump walking around and, you know, Don Jr. And Pete Hegseth and all these people, right? And I'm watching who, by the way.

[Pastor Josh McPherson]

Preached a great Sermon on the martyrdom of Stephen.

[Pastor Mark Driscoll]

He did a good job. And when Hexetho Rubio said, jesus is king overall. And I'm like, you run the Department of War and you're under authority.

[Pastor Josh McPherson]

That's right. I interrupted you.

[Charlie Kirk]

No, you're absolutely right. Well, I just want to. I want to give JD A little bit more, you know, kudos here. He's not held back since he's changed. Check out clip 18. You said that you hadn't read the Bible or talked about the Bible as much as you have in the last two weeks since Charlie was killed.

[Terrence Bates]

I always felt uncomfortable talking about that because I grew up in a country.

[Charlie Kirk]

That was very secular. I don't feel uncomfortable talking about that stuff anymore. I'm going to talk about God. I'm going to talk about my faith, because that's what Charlie would want. And I think it's the best way to honor my friend.

[Pastor Josh McPherson]

When he said that, I had a thought. And this is kind of for theology nerds. Aaron Wrenn wrote an article that kind of broke up evangelicalism into three kind of epochs of time. 1954-1994 was positive world where it was socially advantageous to be public with your faith. You couldn't get elected for public office unless you identify with Protestant or, or Catholic Christianity. You know, all these kind of things. Leave it to Beaver era, whatever. And Then he identifies 1994 to 2014 as neutral world where Christianity's stock is kind of falling. It's not necessarily socially advantageous to identify as a Christian anymore, but it's not socially disadvantageous. Yeah, it's just neutral. So people weren't hostile, they were just indifferent to Christianity. Right. And in 2014, he marks a distinct change. Obergefell, we have a ruling in the highest court of the land that's now codifying anti Christian morality into our code of law. So that's the change. Right. And he marks other social things where we went from culture being neutral or indifferent towards Christianity to being. To culture being hostile towards Christianity. So now it wasn't just socially advantageous or neutral. It's now socially disadvantageous to identify yourself as a Christian. Christians go underground. Okay. There's open hostility towards Christianity. And what we see is people having a sense of moral duty to suppress Christianity because it's evil now. Right. One of the marks of this era has been like the public offense is to go public with your Christianity. I had the thought, just a sense in my spirit, when JD Said that something broke in reality of neutral. He's saying I will now be aggressively, unapologetically, consistently, passionately, clearly public about my faith. And when you have one of the highest authorities in the land saying that something's changed and something shifted, and Charlie was doing that when it was dangerous and when it was costly and when very few other people would do it, and now you're seeing the prophets go first. Right. Boom. There's a breach in the wall. And it feels like talking publicly about Jesus now could start becoming a cultural norm where it was culturally disadvantageous before. Which is pretty wild to think about the impact that could have as it ripples throughout the land.

[Charlie Kirk]

Yeah, that's kind of where I was going to go next. But we're already there. We have one minute here. Real quick, Mark. But I think people worry about the purity of the gospel being diluted a little bit when the leaders start happening. That's not what I saw, though. I saw a very sincere presentation from the heart, from the. Yeah. From the most powerful people on the. You know, in the planet. And is there power in that? I mean, obviously it's what we've always wanted, so. But. But there is a concern, I don't know, for me, that it. That it would become hijacked somehow or.

[Pastor Mark Driscoll]

You know, movements are messy. They just are. And there's going to be mistakes made and then there'll be, you know, changes made. And that's just the nature of everything that is in the process of growing and flourishing. There's a little pruning along the way.

[Charlie Kirk]

Yeah, well, because you think about the Roman Empire, right? It was when it was. When it was underground, it was spreading like wildfire. When it became institutionalized, that's when you get some corruption. Get some corruption.

[Pastor Josh McPherson]

That's right.

[Charlie Kirk]

All right, we're gonna go to a quick break. We will be back in just a minute. Don't go anywhere.

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[Variety Podcast Host]

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[Pastor Josh McPherson]

Where do you see the business actually heading?

[Variety Podcast Host]

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[Variety Podcast Host]

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[Propane Advertiser]

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[Emily Maitlis / John Sopel]

The stories making the news headlines across the world. The news agents we're not just here to tell you what's happening, but why? From me, Emily Maitlis and me, John Sopel with Global's award winning podcast, the News Agents dropping daily covering everything you need to know about politics and current affairs. And the newsagents USA listening to the news agents on America's number one podcast network, iHeart. Open your free iHeart app and search the newsagents to start listening.

[Pastor Mark Driscoll]

New wine in churches that won't talk about Charlie. They're just proving that they're the old.

[Charlie Kirk]

Wineskin or schools and universities. I mean, guys, I'm getting flooded with people, you know, there's a story, I won't, I won't break it. Now I'm getting a whistleblower. Just why we've been on the show of a major company in America that won't let their employees donate to Turning Point right now because they have like a match. They have a match program, right? So if you're a company, you can donate.

[Pastor Mark Driscoll]

Oh, I know I won't say it.

[Charlie Kirk]

But yeah, I'm not ready yet. I gotta talk to them. But I'm being alerted to this. You know, over the weekend I highlighted Lipscomb Academy, which is a Christian school in Nashville where a bunch of conservatives, prominent ones send their kids to this school. And about 20 young men showed up in Suits and ties to honor Charlie the day after he was murdered. And the principal called him in and said, you got to take those off. It's against dress code because there's nothing.

[Pastor Josh McPherson]

Worse than young men wearing a suit and ties.

[Charlie Kirk]

Yeah. And it's funny, I told you this before the show. There's just like a feeling that men want to put a suit jacket on. That's a grow up thing.

[Pastor Josh McPherson]

They want to grow up.

[Charlie Kirk]

It's a good thing. Put your shoulders back, own your life, be a man, move forward with dignity and respect. That's a good thing. And this school, shut it down and punish the kids. And they haven't uttered Charlie's name since. And so all the parents and teachers are really upset over at Lipscomb Academy. We're going to be watching you, Lipscomb. We'll be right back. All right, welcome back. Radio stations across the country. You were, you were about to say Pastor Josh.

[Pastor Josh McPherson]

Well, you were talking earlier about, okay, what happens when the lines get blurred and government, you know, Christianity, how this works. I think one of the things to keep in mind is, and this is more kind of caiperian jurisdictional theology, but God has different spheres of human sovereignty and he appoints those spheres with responsibility and authority. So you have the family, the household. Mom and dad are in authority over the kids. Their responsibility is to raise the kids, shepherd the kids, educate the kids, the well being of the family. Then you have the church. Their responsibility is to preach the pure gospel, to administer the sacraments, and to be a culture and government's conscience in the bold declaration of the truth. And then you have the government. And it's a distinct lane that God's given authority to and responsibility for. But it's a small lane, and I think Charlie understood that. But if that lane grows, it starts impeding on the other lanes to the detriment of all the jurisdictions. But the point is God has given them a job and it's to bear the sword against evildoers, it's to reward the righteous, and it's to defend the people by allowing there to be an orderly nation by protecting borders. That's Romans 13. And so I don't need those in government to necessarily even preach the gospel. I mean, the memorial was like, amazing. What I need them to do is to do the job. So one of my favorite speeches was Stephen Miller. When he stood up and he's like, you are nothing. You have nothing. We're coming after you. It's like, I want the preachers to preach the gospel and I want the Government to bear the sword against unrighteousness. And then you're into morality. Who gets to define what's righteous, what's unrighteous, who gets declared the standard of morality? So we need our government to be built on the morality of something. And so the whole idea that's being exposed, I think, is the myth of the neutrality of secularism. Every government has to have a worldview that they draw from to know how to do their job. And so the beauty of, like, I don't need our government officials to preach the gospel, but we need them to stand on the foundation of the moral law of God so they can do their job and really stay out of the church's lane, which is what we could get into later if we wanted to. What we're seeing happen in the White House. I think they understand the need for the government to get smaller so the church can do their job.

[Charlie Kirk]

Yeah. One of the things I do want to talk about is the tendency of the mainstream news media to describe what's happening as Christian nationalism. So I do want to get to that, and I think that's instantly where I go there. But I. You know, the other thought that I have, just based on what you're saying, is that Charlie was expert at sort of not bifurcating his faith and not compartmentalizing his faith. His faith was just everywhere, all the time. It didn't matter what he was talking about.

[Pastor Josh McPherson]

That's right.

[Charlie Kirk]

And I noticed the same instinct that I have. It's like, well, okay, I'm talking about Lipscomb Academy, you know, on Twitter and X saying, listen, I'm hearing a lot of really bad things, like, people running that school are not on the team. As a matter of fact, they're hostile to a lot of what God is doing in this moment, and they're hostile to the kids that love Charlie. Well, that doesn't feel very Nashville conservative enclave. It feels like people have infiltrated that school that need to be fired, and.

[Pastor Mark Driscoll]

It happens all over.

[Charlie Kirk]

But that comes from my Christian conviction. That comes from a sense of righteousness. Like, I'm not putting one in one compartment and putting another in another compartment. I'm saying, listen, Charlie was confronting evil wherever he saw it, and he's proclaiming the truth. Well, you punish kids for, you know, trying to honor Charlie by wearing a suit and a tie. That's an amazing gesture. You should have. You should have honored that. And they didn't. And you talk about tests, and it's like, you passed the test or you failed the test. Well, they Failed it. And I don't see it any other way. Now, listen, the school's gonna do what they're gonna do, but I think there's a power in us as Christians. Not saying, well, I put my Christianity here on Sunday. And then when I go to Washington D.C. as your congressman or as your vice president or whatever, I'm gonna put it over and I'm gonna put my faith in a little box. There is power being unleashed. And I gotta believe that that's part of the new wineskin. Because the devil knew that this was gonna happen or something.

[Pastor Mark Driscoll]

He was helping architect it.

[Terrence Bates]

Yeah.

[Charlie Kirk]

And by the way. And exactly. But God, like there's. And I think he's laying the trap. So Christian National, Christian national and Christian National. Well, guess what was gonna happen. Charlie Kirk was gonna die a martyr's death. And then the world's most powerful leaders were gonna get up on a stage with 100 million people streaming it, and they were gonna start speaking the truth about Jesus Christ. And guess what? Christian nationalism, Is that really Christian nationalism or is that just living your faith in public?

[Pastor Mark Driscoll]

Well, so Jesus is Lord overall or he's not Lord at all. We believe that he right now is high and exalted. He's over government, he's over family. He's over nations, cultures, businesses, churches. And so to say Jesus Christ has jurisdiction here, but not there is to be disloyal to his sovereignty and to his lordship. It just is.

[Pastor Josh McPherson]

Yeah, I mean, even from a sociological perspective, you're either going to have nationalism or globalism or globalism or anarchism. Right. And so you're going to have tyranny, anarchy, or an orderly society. So let's just start there. Nations are a good thing. And then that nation is going to be built on a worldview. And we think the Christian worldview is a superior worldview that does the most good for the most people, even those who don't adhere to it.

[Pastor Mark Driscoll]

But if our rights come from our Creator, the question is, what's his name? That's the question.

[Charlie Kirk]

Well, we'll pick it up for the stream in just one second. Radio hour one comes to a close. Radio hour two to begin in just a few minutes. We'll be right back.

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[Pastor Josh McPherson]

Where do you see the business actually heading?

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[Emily Maitlis / John Sopel]

The stories making the news headlines across the world. The News Agents we're not just here to tell you what's happening, but why? From me, Emily Maitland and me, John Sopel with Global's award winning podcast the News Agents dropping daily, covering everything you need to know about politics and current affairs. And the newsagents USA listening to the news agents on America's number one podcast network, iHeart. Open your free iHeart app and search the news agents to start listening.

[Terrence Bates]

Welcome back to this real America's Voice news break. I'm Terrence Bates. Happening right now at the White House, President Trump is meeting with Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu. The two are holding a bilateral meeting and are scheduled to hold a press conference together within this coming hour. Today's meeting comes on the heels of Netanyahu addressing the United Nations General assembly on Friday. That is the same day President Trump alluded to nearing a peace deal or even a ceasefire deal in Gaza. And just this morning, White House Press Secretary Caroline Levitt saying that all sides are, quote, very close to agreeing to a comprehensive plan to end the war in Gaza. She says the president's special envoy to the Middle east sent each side a detailed 21 point plan for ending the war. Leavitt goes on to say the commander in chief expects both sides to agree. Quote, the president knows and believes that this is as good a deal as these sides are going to see and that's why it's 21 points. President Trump in the meantime, set to meet with top congressional leaders later today as the deadline to avoid a government shutdown is just hours away. Today's meeting comes after the commander in chief canceled a planned meeting with Democrat leaders from the House and Senate last week, saying that he didn't believe talks would be constructive. Congressional Republicans are calling on their Democrat colleagues to agree to a continuing resolution that would keep the government funded through November 21. While the measure passed in the House, Senate Democrats rejected the resolution and are demanding that recent cuts to health care programs be rescinded as part of any effort to keep the government open. Many believe Democrats will force a shutdown tomorrow if they don't get their way. President Trump calling on the Department of Justice and the FBI to take another look at the events of January 6th. It's one of his latest truth social posts. Here's what he writes. As it now turns out, FBI agents were at and in the January 6th protest, probably acting as agitators and insurrectionists, but certainly not as law enforcement officials. I want to know who each and every one of these so called agents are and what they were up to on that now historic day. Many great American patriots were made to pay a very big price only for the love of their country. I owe this investigation of dirty cops and crooked politicians to them. Christopher Wray, the then director of the FBI has some major explaining to do. That's two in a row, Comey and Ray who got caught lying. With our great country at stake. Meantime, Georgia Congressman Barry Loudermilk is already leading a congressional effort to reinvestigate January 6th. House Speaker Mike Johnson describes it as a committee to investigate the previous J6 subcommittee.

[Charlie Kirk]

Why? Because there was so much bias in the system and that that committee was rigged. I think and I think they, they. My theory is I've always believed that they got rid of evidence and they hit some of this. So all of it's going to come out. The American people deserve full transparency, full transparency. Congress is working on and that's what the administration is working.

[Terrence Bates]

I'm always meantime, amid the government shutdown Tug of War President Trump calling Portland, Oregon a war zone. That's why he is federalizing a couple hundred Oregon National Guardsmen to patrol the city on Truth Social 47 Writing at the request of Secretary of Homeland Security Kristi Noem, I'm directing Secretary of War Pete Hegseth to provide all necessary troops to protect war ravaged Portland and any of our ICE facilities under siege from attack by antifa and other domestic terrorists. I am also authorizing full force if necessary necessary. Thank you for your attention to this matter, he writes. In response, Oregon is suing to block the move, saying that you can't use National Guard soldiers to enforce domestic law enforcement. The state's governor also argues that there is no real crisis in Portland. The deployment now puts Oregon at the center of the constitutional legal debate about how much authority a president, in this particular case President Trump has when it comes to overriding a government and deploying guardsmen. Well, New York City may be one step closer to electing Communist Zoran Maldani as its next mayor now that incumbent Mayor Eric Adams is out of the race. The embattled Adams was running as an independent after it became clear that he couldn't win a second term as Democrat, Mamdani and former New York Governor Andrew Cuomo remain in the race. Mamdani, by the way, considered the frontrunner after being after beating Cuomo, excuse me, in the big apples Democratic primary. President Trump says Sunday's attack on a Mormon church appears to be yet another targeted attack on Christians in this country. At least four people are dead, eight others hurt. That's a quick check of your headlines. I'm Terrence Bates.

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[Pastor Josh McPherson]

Where do you see the business actually heading?

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[Emily Maitlis / John Sopel]

The stories making the news headlines across the world. The News agents We're not just here to tell you what's happening, but why? From me, Emily Maitlis and me, John Sopel with Global's award winning podcast the Newsagents Dropping Daily, covering everything you need to know about politics and current affairs. And the newsagents USA listening to the newsagents on America's number one podcast network, iHeart. Open your free iHeart app and search the newsagents to start listening.

[Charlie Kirk]

All right, welcome back to the Charlie Kirk Show. I am Andrew Colvett, executive producer of this fine show, and I'm honored to be joined by Pastor Mark Driscoll and Pastor Josh McPherson. McPherson. I almost got it. Did I get it? You crushed it. See, I doubt myself.

[Pastor Josh McPherson]

You're doing great.

[Charlie Kirk]

So it's not see, what was the fear in McPherson? No fear in McPherson.

[Pastor Josh McPherson]

My mom's lying.

[Charlie Kirk]

That's a good one. Because I'm tempted every time I say it to say McPherson. And all our guys at the TPSA faith team are huge admirers and followers of yours. And here I am like Fearson, Fearson butchering my name. I know, it's just so disrespectful. But I honor you and I'm grateful for you to be here. And you know the TPUSA Faith Team is going to give me a stern talking to. I can assure you after this. All in love. All in love.

[Pastor Josh McPherson]

I'd expect nothing less.

[Charlie Kirk]

So here I want to now transition our conversation so.

[Pastor Mark Driscoll]

So I can't use that word anymore.

[Charlie Kirk]

By the way, we are Going to.

[Pastor Josh McPherson]

We're going to shift the conversation.

[Charlie Kirk]

We're going to pivot a little bit. I'm going to go to this conversation about Christian nationalism, and I'm going to play some clips of what they're now saying about this. And then we're going to talk about the demonic. And then I want you guys just prepare your spirits for this. I. I think it's important that pastors are encouraged, warned, and, you know, given some guidance on what this season will entail. You talk about new wineskins and new wines. So I want to talk about that. That's kind of, I think, where we're going. We'll see if that materializes. But I'm going to play these two clips here. Let's go ahead and play cut seven. You are seeing here is a movement called Christian nationalism that merges Christianity as it's been practiced in America for centuries with a very specific interpretation of what the founding Fathers wanted, what Aristotle wanted, this strain of interpretation of the Bible. Merge Christianity and protecting the Western civilization.

[Pastor Josh McPherson]

Values into one and the same thing.

[Charlie Kirk]

All right, so that's Tina Nguyen from Verge. I think she's at the Verge. She was with Puck. She's been with Political. I've actually known her for a long time. She's always been very nice to me and a standup operator. I actually told her I was probably gonna like, slam her with that clip today, but I said I would do it nice because she's actually nice and she. Listen, she is misinterpreting the signs of the times, but we can get into that in just a second. I told her that. Let's go ahead and play Cut eight. This is Don Lamond talking about something similar.

[Terrence Bates]

What we saw in that arena was not simply faith finding public expression. It was religious nationalism on full display. That is the truth.

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[Terrence Bates]

This is my freedom of expression. This is my First Amendment right to.

[Charlie Kirk]

Be able to tell you the truth. Mark, is that the truth?

[Pastor Mark Driscoll]

So our nation is founded on rights. We are told that those rights come not from government, they come from God. And that God has authority over government and that all governmental authority is derivative from God. The question then is, what is the name of this God? That's the question. The Muslims would say his name is Allah. The Christians would say his name is Jesus Christ. And so at the end of the day, as soon as you answer the question of what the name of that God is, you're picking a team. And what I find interesting is. This is slanderous. It is. It is fear Based, it is fear mongering. And as Pastor Josh said previously, you get anarchy, you know, which if you want to know what that looks like, you know, go to Portland tonight, you get globalism, where we send all of our young men and dollars overseas until we cease to exist as a country and eradicate our borders and allow criminals and cartels to be in charge. Or you have nationalism. And nationalism is what God says is best for human life and flourishing. The first attempt at globalism is back in Genesis, in a place called Babel, that is ancient Babylon, that is today Iraq. They all have the same language, they all get together and they're trying to chase this Marxist utopian counterfeit vision of a perfect life on earth without God. And it's globalism. God looks down and says, they're united, and unless we spread them into nations, they're going to do tremendous evil. So united people without God are dangerous people. And so then God scatters them into nations and he confuses them into languages. And so nationalism is what God did to save us from destroying ourselves at the end of the age, according to the storyline of the Bible, depending upon your reading, at the end of the age, all the nations will seek to come together into a globalistic vision. But then the question is, who gets to be the leader? And it's not Christ, it's the Antichrist. And so if all power is consolidated globally, one demonically satanically possessed person wielding all of that power becomes the end of civilization. And so globalism is a naive myth from the earliest days of Genesis. And nationalism was God's answer to globalism. It says in Acts 17, God determines the times and places in which we live. God had me though, Irish by descent, born in America in 1970. And that was God's decision for me. I love my God and I love where he put me.

[Charlie Kirk]

And we were talking the break, Pastor Josh, that you feel like you understand why Charlie was so dangerous to some of these ideas, whether we call it demonic ideas, whether we call them just far left ideas. And I don't think all left left ideas, just for the record, are demonic. I'm just saying there are some that are demonic. There's some that are left and far left. Why was Charlie so dangerous to kind of this. This old lie?

[Pastor Josh McPherson]

Well, I think what made him effective and therefore dangerous was that Charlie was not primarily a political animal. And he said this in his own words. And Charlie's political theory was rooted in biblical theology. And he had an ability like maybe nobody's ever seen to connect the dots with what's happening in the realm, with what God has said from his moral law. And so there's this obscure quote from John Frame who gave us tribe respectibalism. I think that's kind of where you got it early on. And John Frame talked about the necessity of understanding the gospel as the center. Now there's been a gospel centered movement in American Christianity in the last 20 years. But what the gospel centered movement did, I believe is turn the gospel from the center to a boundary. So John Frame explains like this. And this is what I think made Charlie so profound and trigger me on time here for running out. When you view the gospel as a boundary, it means all you can do is talk about the components of the specific gospel. Justification by faith alone, regeneration.

[Pastor Mark Driscoll]

What is the gospel? For those who don't know, let it rip. It's Jesus Christ. Jesus is God. Become a man to live without sin. The only human being to ever live without sin. Declare himself to be God. The only founder of any major world religion to declare himself to be God. To die on the cross in our place as our substitute for our sins. To physically, bodily raise from the dead, opening heaven and triumphing over Satan, sin, death, hell and the wrath of God. The gospel is the good news about who Jesus is and what Jesus does. And no one is who Jesus is and no one does what Jesus does. That's the gospel.

[Pastor Josh McPherson]

Amen. So what the gospel centered movement did, I believe was turn the gospel into a boundary. That's all you can talk about.

[Charlie Kirk]

I totally agree. And this is one of the things with TPOSA faith that we did, we said churches, if you don't speak into this void about sex and identity and about marriage, gender, gender, whatever, abortion, you are leaving this vacuum that will be filled by people that do not share your values. And so you don't have to agree on post trib, pre trib, you don't have to. We're not getting into that. We're saying speak up, stand up and speak into the public arena because we are losing our country. The most important thing, and Charlie always says this, was preach the gospel. The second most important thing is to make sure you can do the first.

[Pastor Josh McPherson]

That's right.

[Charlie Kirk]

And so stand up, church, fill the void. Do not be cowards. And that was what made him truly unique.

[Pastor Josh McPherson]

If the pulpits of America don't disciple the culture, the culture will disciple the culture to themselves because secularism has a God and it's the God of self. And so when John Frame talks about the gospel being the center, he says it in such a way so as to say it doesn't limit what we talk about, actually gives us permission and obligation to connect everything in life under the sun to the reality of the gospel. And that's what Charlie did. I believe in such a powerful way. Sex, relationships, politics, governments, nations, connecting them to the reality of God most explicitly found in Jesus Christ in the gospel.

[Charlie Kirk]

You know, I have to tell us to tell the audience about another partner. And it's funny because for those who missed it, we're getting back to a little bit of regular order. And our partners, our network partners, our advertising partners have all been so generous and kind and gracious as we've been working through the last couple weeks. And there is no roadmap for this and there's no instruction manual, so we're just doing our best. But I tell you what, when we have to talk about partners like good ranchers and yeah, they sell meat. It's really good and it's, you know, it's made in America. I love them. I love their product, but I love the people behind it even more. And they're Christians. Ben and Corley are amazing people who have come on this show and given a testimony about Jesus Christ. Now, Jesus healed Corley from cancer and I cried when I heard it at the time. And so, yeah, they sell boxes of meat and you should buy it. I get it. And their chicken nuggets are amazing. Charlie, his kids loved the chicken nuggets. My kids love the chicken nuggets. And so you should go to goodranchers.com insert promo code Kirk for $40 off and support them. Thanks so much. We'll be right back.

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[Variety Podcast Host]

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[Pastor Josh McPherson]

Where do you see the business actually heading?

[Variety Podcast Host]

Featuring the iconic journalists of Variety and hosted by co editor in chief Cynthia Littleton.

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[Emily Maitlis / John Sopel]

The stories making the news headlines across the world. The News agents We're not just here to tell you what's happening. We but why? From me, Emily Maitlis and me, John Sopel with Global's award winning podcast the News Agents dropping daily covering everything you need to know about politics and current affairs. And The News Agents USA listening to the News Agents on America's number one podcast network, iHeart. Open your free iHeart app and search.

[Charlie Kirk]

The news agents to start listening around 18 or 19.

[Pastor Mark Driscoll]

Yep.

[Charlie Kirk]

Well, okay. Two ingredients. Check, check, check. There's a, there's a moment that leads to a movement, right? There is these other ingredients that people are called to repentance. And you've got all these and forgiveness. Repentance and forgiveness. And you know, that's been obviously true because his Charlie's legacy in his life was so exemplary that all these, you know, all these people are like how do I be a better husband? How do I be a better father? And you know, and so you've got all these things. But then what about the church? If we're, is it bypassing the church? Is it new Wineskins, what is your challenge and your instruction to the church? The pastors out there that are seeing their pews filled and maybe some that aren't, you know, so there's like some, you know, there's a Fox News poll that says there churches are experiencing a 15% increase in congregation. Well, some are experiencing 80% or 100% lines out the door. There is obviously, you know, when we think about revelations, you know, you're going to snuff out the Lampstands. Well, are some churches going to fold their. You know, close their doors during this time while others explode and grow? So that's the question for. And we'll ask it in radio. We will be right back. Welcome back to the Charlie Kirk Show. My name is Andrew Colvett. You were looking at the empty chair of our dear brother and friend, and we are trying to honor him as best as we know how. And one of the ways I think we do that is we encourage the church, we admonish the church. How does the church capture this moment? What is your word for pastors and shepherds?

[Pastor Mark Driscoll]

Go there in a moment. So let me just say this, though, for you. Looking at the empty chair, I walked in, I got pretty choked up. How many times have you sat here with Charlie? And now you're possibly your best friend. I want to speak for you. He's gone. I mean, you've got a job to do. You're leading up. But just personally, as a human being, as a pastor, I just feel like asking, like, yeah, where are you at in all of this?

[Charlie Kirk]

You know, a lot of these army guys and special Forces guys reached out and they. They said, you know, comes in waves. Don't, don't. Don't be upset at yourself if you're not feeling what you feel like you should be feeling one moment, and don't be upset if in the next moment you feel like you can't take a step forward. And that. My man, that is true. Like, it is so true. I've been. You know, there's moments like when we were getting ready for the memorial, it was just. We were so busy, I didn't have a chance to think or grieve. It was just like, let's go. You know, we got. We have a job to do, and then you get done with that. I remember I was on Jesse Waters on the Monday, and it was like Jesse asked me that same question. I was like, you know, to be honest, Jesse, it's kind of hitting me all over again. It was like the comedown after the. After that big event. And then this weekend, you know, it just hit me again. So I think that's just gonna be the way it is. And I'm not afraid of it. I embrace it. You know, I tweeted out. I was like, I can't believe he's gone, because it still doesn't feel real.

[Pastor Mark Driscoll]

It still feels very surreal.

[Charlie Kirk]

Yeah, it does. And I miss him a lot. And I. You know, these, like, old habits that you put. You know, we worked together for eight years. You know, you're thinking about texting him or, you know, or something funny or some. Something, you know, he would say about something. And. And I guess, you know, I just know that he's in glory and, you know, as Erica said, he's on a work trip with Jesus. And, you know, and I'm just truly humbled that I got to see it so up close.

[Pastor Josh McPherson]

Yeah.

[Charlie Kirk]

And I know that the whole team here in the studio feels the same way and at Turning Point and.

[Pastor Mark Driscoll]

Yeah.

[Charlie Kirk]

Yeah.

[Pastor Mark Driscoll]

Well, you're grieving the loss of your friend and under tremendous work, doing things that there's no precedent or playbook for you just doing the best every day as you're able, and your team's doing an incredible job.

[Charlie Kirk]

Well, thank you. I mean, honestly, that's one of the blessings of being with this large team, you know, because, you know, you're feeling weak, and then you see, you know, somebody else, you know, really doing a great job and being courageous, and you're like, I can do it, too. And I think we all feed off each other and, you know, we. It's a team, it's a staff, it's a job, but it's really a family. And when something like this happens, it galvanizes you and really bonds you together.

[Pastor Josh McPherson]

And I think there could be a lot of really weird ways to handle this moment. And just my experience outside looking in, a lot of discretion, a lot of wisdom, a lot of grace in how you guys are handling it, I just think is evidence of the spirit of God leading you guys and giving you guys grace for this moment.

[Charlie Kirk]

I mean, we got the whole world praying. I mean, I'm not. I'm very aware of that, you know, and I said it before, but it bears repeating. I think a lot of us feel it. Like we feel the prayers of strangers.

[Pastor Mark Driscoll]

Yes.

[Charlie Kirk]

And that's a wild thing. You know, I've heard presidents talk about that before where, you know, you feel sustained by the prayers.

[Pastor Josh McPherson]

Yeah.

[Charlie Kirk]

And to know that so many people have been praying for us. I mean, I don't talk to a single person that doesn't tell me we've been praying for you, you know, so thank you for asking.

[Pastor Mark Driscoll]

We love you. And you forget that, like, Charlie is a husband, he's a father, he's got a wife, he's got kids, he's got friends. And to the team here, it was a very warm, personal relationship. And sometimes in a media world, we think that people are just ideologies and not, you know, human beings with families and relationships.

[Charlie Kirk]

Yeah, there was definitely this very distinct effort the entire career to make him wooden and two dimensional. And to us, he was always in, you know, Technicolor 3D and one of the warmest, most generous, gracious, loyal, just good hearted people, kind hearted people, joyful, funny, it's hilarious. I mean, doesn't get nearly enough credit for helpful.

[Pastor Josh McPherson]

One of Charlie's secret sauce was he embodied truth, goodness, beauty. He was a truth machine that was anchored in the goodness of the moral law of God and the wisdom of the word of God. And he was demonstrating real time with his beautiful wife and his beautiful kids. The beauty of the Christian worldview working itself out in the heart of a man. And when you combine that just razor sharp logic, untruth, a commitment to fundamental goodness for all mankind, and then living out the beauty of a Camelot story, a beautiful wife, a family he loved, It's a powerful 1, 2, 3 punch that you can't ignore. It's self authenticating. That worldview is working. I think that was part of what was so compelling about Charles.

[Charlie Kirk]

What's amazing is how much Erica embodies all of those qualities as well. Remarkably, I always knew it's to see her have this platform to be. I mean, we've talked about the Charlie effect and now one of the things I'm seeing more and more on social media is the Erica effect. Right.

[Pastor Mark Driscoll]

She could turn a whole generation of young women as he turned a whole generation of young men. If so, that would be revival.

[Pastor Josh McPherson]

That's right.

[Charlie Kirk]

Wow. Okay, well, let's talk about that in just one second. One quick break with radio. We're going to keep going on the stream.

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[Variety Podcast Host]

There's a lot going on in Hollywood. How are you supposed to stay on top of it all? Variety has the solution. Take 20 minutes out of your day and listen to the new daily Variety podcast for breaking entertainment news and expert perspectives.

[Pastor Josh McPherson]

Where do you see the business actually heading?

[Variety Podcast Host]

Featuring the iconic journalists of Variety and hosted by co editor in chief Cynthia Littleton.

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[Variety Podcast Host]

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[Emily Maitlis / John Sopel]

The stories making the news headlines across the world. The News Agents we're not just here to tell you what's happening, but why? From me, Emily Maitlis and me, Jon Sopel with Global's award winning podcast the News Agents Dropping daily covering everything you need to know about politics and current affairs and the newsagents USA listening to the news agents on America's number one podcast network, iHeart. Open your free iHeart app and search the newsagents to start listening.

[Terrence Bates]

Terrence Baby Bates here with your real America's Voice news break. Thanks so much for being here with us. Happening right now at the White House, President Trump meeting with Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu. The two are set to hold a bilateral meeting and then they're going to have a joint news conference together. And that's expected to happen. Excuse me. At any moment you can see the podium set up. The reporters are already in place, simply waiting for the arrival of President Trump and his Israeli counterpart. Today's meeting comes on the heels of Netanyahu addressing the United Nations General assembly on Friday. And that very same day, President Trump alluded to nearing a peace or ceasefire deal in Gaza. Just this morning, White House Press Secretary Caroline Levitt saying that all sides are, quote, very close to agreeing to a comprehensive plan to end the war in Gaza. She also says the President's special envoy to the Middle east sent each side a detailed 21 point plan for ending that war. Leavitt goes on to say the Commander in Chief expects the both sides to agree. Quote, the president knows and believes that this is as good a plan as these sides are going to see, and that's why it's a 21 point plan. Again, we're expecting that news conference to happen at any moment. The moment it does, we'll take you there live. We also could get an answer to what Caroline Levitt said about both sides agreeing to a peace deal, or at least a deal to end the war in Gaza. Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu at the White House today, and he could very well make that announcement here in short order. Meantime, President Trump is set to meet with top congressional leaders later on today as well. This as the deadline to avoid a government shutdown is just hours away. Today's meeting comes after the commander in chief canceled a planned meeting with Democrat leaders from the House and Senate last week, saying that he just didn't believe talks would be constructive. Congressional Republicans are calling on their Democrat colleagues to agree to a continuing resolution that would keep the government funded through November 21. While the measure passed in the House, Senate Democrats rejected the resolution and are demanding that recent cuts to health care programs be rescinded as part of any effort to keep the government funded. Many believe the Democrats will force a shutdown tomorrow if they don't get their way. That's a quick check of your headlines again. We'll take you back to the White House the moment President Trump and Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu come out to address the media. For now, let's get you back to your regularly scheduled program.

[Pastor Josh McPherson]

All right.

[Charlie Kirk]

Welcome back to the Charlie Kirk Show. Andrew Colvett, executive producer of this show. And I'm going to tell you about one of our partners. We're getting back into regular order. Bear with us as we do. I still got to kind of get the rhythm down again because we've, our partners have just been so gracious to us and understanding that we are going through something unprecedented. But I'm honored to be able to honor our advertisers and our networks and help everybody who's helped us so much. So please support these companies. And this one is Patriot Mobile. Glen Story, I hope you're watching out there. You've been a tremendous friend. You've texted, you've called, you've seen what you could do, you've made donations. Patriot Mobile is your mobile carrier that you need to go with. So there's only one mobile company in America that boldly stands in the gap for every American that believes that freedom is worth fighting for, and that is Patriot Mobile. For more than 12 years, Patriot Mobile has been on the Front lines fighting for our God given rights and freedoms while also providing. And this is the key. You got it. Yeah. You can have the mission, but you gotta be good at it. Exceptional. Nationwide cell phone service with access to all three of the main networks. Don't just take my word for it. Ask the hundreds of thousands of Americans who've made the switch and are now supporting causes they believe in. And boy, Patriot Mobile has been such a stalwarts, defender and supporter of Turning Point USA and this show. And so call 972 Patriot today or go to patriotmobile.com Charlie. That's patriotmobile.com Charlie. They'll give you a free month of service with that promo code that is patriotmobile.com Charlie. Or call 972 Patriot and make the switch today. Thank you to Patriot Mobile for helping out so much. You know what you've done and for supporting this show. Thank you, Glenn and Jenny. All right, so we are talking about, you know, the spirit of the age. You made this comment that I just felt was really powerful. Pastor Josh, you said, you know, when, when Erica said this statement that you're not rivals and she's defining the roles of men and women, that she put a spear through the spirit of the Jezebel. Spirit of our age. Let's play this cut and then I'll, I'll let you put a finish that up. Clip 27.

[Variety Podcast Host]

But please be a leader worth following.

[Charlie Kirk]

Your wife.

[Variety Podcast Host]

Your wife is not your servant. Your wife is not your employee. Your wife is not your slave.

[Charlie Kirk]

She is your helper.

[Variety Podcast Host]

You are not rivals. You are one flesh working together for the glory of God.

[Pastor Josh McPherson]

It's incredible.

[Charlie Kirk]

Let's go. It's incredible.

[Pastor Josh McPherson]

It's so beautiful. It's putting a spirit through your heart of chauvinism that would look down on a woman.

[Charlie Kirk]

Yeah, got both sides. That's a good point.

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Yeah.

[Charlie Kirk]

She was an equal opportunity.

[Pastor Josh McPherson]

Everyone got to get shot. You know, everyone got to get a dress. So chauvinism, there's no room for that in biblical Christianity. Feminism, where men are put down and women are elevated. And so it was powerful. Can we read Bible verses on this show?

[Charlie Kirk]

We could preach the gospel.

[Pastor Josh McPherson]

Let's go. Because you reminded me of this when you said it in 2nd Corinthians 10. In light of talking about spiritual warfare, Mark and I'll be interested you think of this. Paul says this. He says the weapons we fight are not the weapons of the world. On the contrary, they have divine power to demolish strongholds. Now watch this. We demolish arguments and every pretension that sets itself up against the knowledge of God. That's what she was doing, and that's what made it so powerful. And then watch this. And we take captive every thought to make it obedient to Christ. Christians typically read that verse, and a buddy of mine pointed this out, and we think of it as personal. Take captive my thoughts. You know, don't have lustful thoughts. Whatever. Paul is referencing taking captive thoughts in the context of public argumentation. He's calling Christians. That's a wrong thought. Charlie was going around campuses and he was publicly taking captive those demonic thoughts and ideologies that really had the hearts and minds of students captive. And he was saying, that's a wrong thought. That's a wrong idea. And he was demolishing these strongholds that set themselves up against the knowledge of God with the truth of the gospel. And that's what Erica was doing, and that's what made it so strong.

[Charlie Kirk]

Well, yeah, I mean, Charlie, there's this great clip of him saying, my job is to confront evil. We might actually have that clip. I think we do have that clip. Field. My job is to confront evil and to proclaim the truth. But let's just play this one just because it's fun to hear. Hear it in his own words. Let's play cut 28. This is Charlie with Tucker Carlson.

[Pastor Josh McPherson]

This is why your faith is the most important thing. Because for those of us that are Christians, you actually see what's going on, which is that we do not wrestle against flesh and blood, but against principalities.

[Charlie Kirk]

And darkness and spirits.

[Pastor Josh McPherson]

That there is a spiritual war here. There is a God, and we are not him. That there is an entire dimension of.

[Charlie Kirk]

Angels and demons and spirits that are.

[Pastor Josh McPherson]

Constantly struggling around us, and that there is a supernatural dimension.

[Charlie Kirk]

Amen.

[Pastor Josh McPherson]

Crushed it.

[Charlie Kirk]

It's no notes.

[Pastor Mark Driscoll]

Well, see, part of it, too. I said this is. I think that of all the political pundits and commentators I've met, very few would qualify to be a pastor according to the qualifications in the Bible. Charlie did his character, his marriage, his personal integrity. And so I think an entire generation that was not in church, but they were online, I think they looked at Charlie as not just a big brother, but their pastor. So they were looking to him as to, okay, well, how do I get married? How do I have a family? What makes life meaningful? How do I know where the truth is? So Charlie was functioning as a pastor for an entire generation. And so when he died, even those who weren't Christians, they felt this devastating personal Emotional loss. And that's why. And then they went to church because that's what Pastor Charlie told them to do. And so I believe that he is well known for his political work. I think that now we're seeing his spiritual work was at least as equally impactful.

[Charlie Kirk]

And so I mean that. This is where I want to end this conversation. In the time we have left, we got the rest of this segment. The next segment. What's your word? So Erica said, go to church. Elon Musk retweeted it, which is wild.

[Pastor Mark Driscoll]

I hope that he was tweeting it on his way to church.

[Pastor Josh McPherson]

We saw Elon Musk singing along, singing some worship songs. Let's go.

[Charlie Kirk]

There's the tweet. She's not a super activist tweeter poster, but when she does bingo, she makes gold records. Is this she?

[Pastor Mark Driscoll]

And thank you for doing this, Erica.

[Charlie Kirk]

Yeah, thank you. And just to see Eric Elon post that. And he posted, you know.

[Pastor Josh McPherson]

Anyways, my point is, what's happening there, I think, is. I don't know sure where Elon is with Jesus, but there's just a recognition that cultural Christianity is good for everyone.

[Charlie Kirk]

Yes. I think Elon is very well aware that he does not want to live in an agnostic, atheist, Muslim country. He wants to live in a Christian one. He wants to live in where people have virtue and honor and honesty and integrity. And they don't target him just because they don't like the fact that he's so rich. I mean, I think he's all. That's very much playing into this. But I gotta believe that you do not sit through. And he sat through so much of it.

[Pastor Mark Driscoll]

He sat through hours of gospel preaching.

[Charlie Kirk]

And it's hard to sit through that and to feel the Holy Spirit and go, it's not real.

[Pastor Mark Driscoll]

Well, and to ask, too, what happens when I die? And what will they say?

[Pastor Josh McPherson]

Yes. And what was so powerful about that memorial?

[Charlie Kirk]

And probably be confronted with the fact that he's under incredible amount of threats.

[Pastor Josh McPherson]

That's right.

[Pastor Mark Driscoll]

Oh, his life is constantly in danger.

[Charlie Kirk]

Yes.

[Pastor Josh McPherson]

Yes. I was going to say, a friend pointed out to me that was not an event that had been planned for 10 months.

[Pastor Mark Driscoll]

Yeah, that was a week.

[Pastor Josh McPherson]

The event we sat in that was so sweet and so powerful didn't exist 10 days earlier. And what it demonstrated was when you bump Christians with tragedy, what pours out is hope. That's what's so powerful.

[Charlie Kirk]

Well. And so what is the message to the shepherds, the pastors out there? Pastor Mark, Pastor Josh? How do they Pass this test. And how do they step in to the anointing of this new wine that is being poured out in the country? Because I think it's critical. One of the things Erica said, she said shepherd them. Shepherd them.

[Pastor Mark Driscoll]

So I'll pick it up there. There is a wild misunderstanding of what it means to shepherd. So in the Bible, you know, animals are out in the field, they're exposed to wolves and predators. And so the shepherd has two jobs. One, to be tender with the flock, two, to be tough for the flock. If we took out the word shepherd and we inserted the word cowboy, you would have the biblical understanding of a pastor. A pastor is supposed to be a cowboy, supposed to be able to kill wolves and protect sheep. And the problem we have today, they're not fighting wolves. And as a result, they're really not loving sheep. And so, you know, the whole cultural phenomenon of the west and western nostalgia and Yellowstone, people watching that ultimately what they are thinking is this is what leadership should be like. It should be more like a cowboy. And so I think part of the new wine that is going to form a new wineskin will include pastors who are not just guys who feel comfortable holding sheep and walking around singing songs, but they're cowboys that also know how to defend and protect. And when a wolf shows up, are not afraid to put them down.

[Pastor Josh McPherson]

Dude, Charlie was a cowboy.

[Pastor Mark Driscoll]

He was a cowboy. Charlie Kirk was a cowboy and he moved to Arizona and he fit really well because it's still a cowboy town.

[Charlie Kirk]

Well, and he, you know, you're talking about the Old Testament would use the word shepherd, right? The David was a shepherd, but he was killing lions.

[Pastor Mark Driscoll]

Yeah.

[Charlie Kirk]

That would come after the sheep.

[Pastor Josh McPherson]

He was carrying bags of enemies, foreskins around on his belt.

[Charlie Kirk]

Yeah, yeah.

[Pastor Mark Driscoll]

One, two, three. Not it.

[Charlie Kirk]

Exactly. He was a dude. He was a dude. And I think that's what you're getting at, right? This, like this. There needs to be a little more.

[Pastor Mark Driscoll]

Masculine fortitude in leadership.

[Charlie Kirk]

Well, I remember when you, when I was sitting listening to your preaching, you would talk about. Yeah, there was this thing that you would say. We have this idea of Jesus being this spandex wearing fairy princess that just is singing these beautiful hymns in the clouds. It's like, no, look at Revelation. He's wielding a flaming sword and he's coming to destroy the enemy and to protect his people.

[Pastor Mark Driscoll]

Yes. That's the storyline of the Bible. And so for the church, fear is contagious and so is courage. And that's what you saw with Charlie. If Charlie had manifested Fear. Nobody would have showed up for his funeral because he manifested courage. There's an entire generation saying, I choose faith, not fear. I choose courage, not cowardice.

[Charlie Kirk]

Well, here, let's play this clip. This is Charlie with George Janko, who's also in the local area. Oh, one second. We almost got it loaded.

[Pastor Mark Driscoll]

Okay.

[Charlie Kirk]

And when we do, it's gonna be real good. I promise.

[Pastor Josh McPherson]

Super good.

[Charlie Kirk]

Our studio's like, hold it. This is. Yeah, it's loaded. This. Let's go ahead and play. Cut 30.

[Terrence Bates]

These moments where you're fighting for your.

[Charlie Kirk]

Your country and you're getting these threats, does it alarm and concern you for your children? I mean, yes and no. I mean, my wife is the best.

[Pastor Josh McPherson]

Person ever, and she's a patriot and she's a believer. And we don't want to have to.

[Charlie Kirk]

Be accountable to God when this life passes and he asks, why did you not trust in me and not fight evil?

[Pastor Josh McPherson]

Because we as Christians are called to fight evil.

[Charlie Kirk]

It's one of the less. Less lesser known scriptures. Psalm 97, 10.

[Pastor Josh McPherson]

For those of you that love God.

[Charlie Kirk]

You must hate evil.

[Pastor Mark Driscoll]

Pastor Charlie.

[Pastor Josh McPherson]

There it is.

[Charlie Kirk]

Well, it's funny because Cowboy Pastor Charlie spoke at so many churches, like, so many churches in the last few years, and he was always very clear, like, I'm not a pastor. I'm not a pastor. You know, he. He was like, I, you know, didn't want the label.

[Pastor Mark Driscoll]

He was an accidental pastor.

[Charlie Kirk]

He was an. Well, yeah, And. And, you know, that was all him. I remember when he was starting it, I was like, okay, Charlie, have you met any. The church can be worse than politics. Like, it's brutal out there.

[Pastor Josh McPherson]

He talked about. He was told early on not to combine the two. And then somehow, either on his own with your mentoring, he's like, no, no, we have to connect these two or we won't be faithful.

[Charlie Kirk]

No, exactly. He didn't bifurcate his faith. He did not compartmentalize it. Speaking of another guy that does not, I want to tell you about Alan Jackson, great partner of this show. We're honored to be partnering with Alan Jackson Ministries, and today I want to point you to their podcast. It's called Culture and Christianity, the Alan Jackson Podcast. What makes it unique is Pastor Allen's biblical perspective. He takes the truth from the Bible and applies it to issues we're facing today. Just exactly what we're talking about. Gender confusion, abortion, immigration, Doge Trump in the White House, issues in the church. He doesn't just discuss the problems. He gives practical things we can do to make a difference. His guests have incredible expertise and powerful testimony. Each episode you will recognize the power of your faith and how God can use your life to impact our world today. The Culture and Christianity Podcast is informative and encouraging and you can find it on YouTube, Spotify or wherever you get your podcast. Be sure to subscribe so you don't miss any episodes. They have been so faithful to us and we love those guys. So please check it out. Support them. We're gonna keep going. We've got some six points coming up for pastors. Don't go anywhere, you're not gonna want to miss it. We'll be right back.

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[Variety Podcast Host]

There'S a lot going on in Hollywood. How are you supposed to stay on top of it all? Variety has the solution. Take 20 minutes out of your day and listen to the new daily Variety podcast for breaking entertainment news and expert perspectives.

[Pastor Josh McPherson]

Where do you see the business actually heading?

[Variety Podcast Host]

Featuring the iconic journalists of Variety and hosted by co Editor in Chief Cynthia Littleton.

[NFLShop Advertiser]

The only constant in Hollywood is change.

[Variety Podcast Host]

Open your free iHeartradio app, search daily Variety and listen now.

[NFLShop Advertiser]

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[Propane Advertiser]

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[Emily Maitlis / John Sopel]

The stories making the news headlines across the world. The news agents we're not just here to tell you what's happening, but why? From me, Emily Maitlis and me, John Sopel with Global's award winning podcast, the Newsagents Dropping daily covering everything you need to know about politics and current affairs. And the newsagents USA listening to the newsagents on America's number one podcast network, iHeart. Open your free iHeart app and search the newsagents to start listening.

[Charlie Kirk]

It's time for a whole new generation to wise up and rise up. The CHARLIE Kirk show alright, welcome back to the Charlie Kirk Show. Genuinely honored by Y refi and their, their incredible support of this show. They were one of the first to call and say, you guys aren't going anywhere. We're gonna stand by your side, whatever you need. And that's why we yrefi.com yrefy.com and they help you with student loan debt. So if you have private student loan debt, which is about 45 billion of which is labeled distressed, they can help you. They refinance distressed defaulted private student loans that others won't even touch. And they support shows like ours that go through a traumatic experience and they won't leave our side. And so if that tells you anything about the type of character that is inside of this organization and what they do for their friends, they will be your friends and they will stand by you so you don't have to be burdened by this debt, by this private student loan debt anymore. They can help get this load off of your shoulders. They will shoulder it with you. You can even miss payments every so often. They don't care about what your credit score is. So part of putting your shoulder back and being a man or a woman, being an adult growing up is taking care of your financial house. So help them, let them help you. We'll be right back with radio you final segment, guys. This is flown by pastor Mark Driscoll. Pastor Josh McPherson.

[Pastor Josh McPherson]

Nail it, bro. Third time is charm.

[Charlie Kirk]

That's just becoming a gag. It's becoming a bit. So guys, you have. So I guess I'm going to throw it to you, Pastor Josh, your admonition, your exhortation, your encouragement for pastors, you've got, you've kind of got it systematized so you got a six point list.

[Pastor Josh McPherson]

Well, I appreciate the book of acts and just an encouragement. Every pastor should preach verse by verse to the book of acts. You'll see profound patterns that apply to this moment. Talking pastors all across the country, I think there's reason to be encouraged. We Are seeing. I would call it like 3.0 church planner, 1.0, 2.0, 3.0, church planner. They're bold, they're courageous, they're differentiated. They're not running the human calculus of how this is going to cost me politically or will the board throw me out or will the big donor leave? They're just fearless, for Jesus sake. And they're seeing their churches explode two, three, four, five years in. There's 5,000, 6,000, 7,000 people there. Numbers I've never seen in my lifetime. So just to encourage people listening, God is moving and working. And there's a remarkable crop of leaders coming up who are differentiated, fearless leaders. But here's what I've seen. There's three kind of categories of pastors. There's the confused pastor who's calling me on Saturday. Are you going to talk about Charlie or not? I don't know what to do. And they're not necessarily nefarious or cowardice. They're just unclear. Right. And so I want to speak to those. There's the cowards who know what they should say but have run the human calculus of what it might cost them and chose not to. Then you have the captured. They're just playing for the other team. It's the fourth padre, the courageous that I believe, see the anointing of God and the move of God in this generation. That's who Charlie was. And so this sixfold grid of pastors asking them what to do, this is what I tell them to do. We got time for this?

[Charlie Kirk]

Yeah.

[Pastor Josh McPherson]

Number one, set forth the truth plainly. We see. Paul said, I preached to both Jews and Greeks. Repent. Charlie was brilliant at this. He had an ability like nobody I've ever seen to set forth the truth in a plain, understandable way. Number two, demonstrate the Spirit's power. Paul said, we came not with wise and persuasive words. Here's the thing. Was Charlie wise? Was he persuasive? Yes. But why was he so effective? Because he was working with the power of the Spirit. He wasn't just there using man's arguments. You know, Jesus said, hey, don't worry about what you're going to say when you go before principalities and powers, I'll be there with you. That was literally Charlie's life. No notes, no AI in front of thousands of people on a microphone. Right. I think he was a walking demonstration of the Spirit's power. Oftentimes the Holy Spirit is the most uninvited guest in our church. We have to invite the Holy Spirit, we have to plant, preach, grow churches that God wants to be at. Churches for God, not for man. Charlie would say that often. Third, boldly proclaim the truth. Paul said, I have not hesitated. And many pastors hesitate. Should I, would I stop running the man calculus of the cost that it's going to require of you and boldly proclaim the truth, whatever the cost, because here's the cost that you should run. Will I say something or not say something that could cost me the anointing of God. That's what matters. Not who leaves or who stays or who tweets about you, but what God thinks about you. And if that's the grid through which you run the decisions that you make, you'll please the Lord, and he'll bless you. Number four, Live not by lies. Eric Metaxas talks about the spiral of silence. The less people speak up, the higher the cost for those who do. We saw that with Charlie. Start speaking up. Refuse to pretend that boys can be girls and men can lactate. It's like, do not live by lies. In silence in this culture is perpetuating the lies. So we have to speak up about the lies. If you're on the walls being attacked and you're not at the point of the breach, you're not being faithful. Number five, you got to enjoy the King Charlie did this so well, set forth a clear and compelling vision of the beauty of following King Jesus, which means don't stop laughing and loving while you're making war. Okay? We're to be laughing, happy warriors. And Charlie embodied that so well. He wasn't angry. He wasn't brooding. He wasn't shadowy. I mean, he. He was. He was strong. He was strong and happy, and that comes from Erica and his children. And lastly, we gotta fight downhill. And this would be my encouragement. Stop seeding the home field advantage. Right? And I think this might look like if an institution is corrupt, we might need to step back from those corrupt institutions and start building new ones and.

[Charlie Kirk]

Better ones, like arcs, Browning ones that are doing the right thing.

[Pastor Josh McPherson]

That's exactly right.

[Charlie Kirk]

I love that. And we should make that available to everybody. That list in the minute I have remaining. I want to honor you, Pastor Mark. Charlie loved this book. This is called Doctrine. And it was when he was asked a couple weeks before he mentioned this book that this is one of the books that was really impacting him. And it's by you, Pastor Mark, and Gary Beshears, and you generously have offered it free to this audience. So I want to make sure we have this on the lower text doctrine to 99383. Please put that on the. There you go. Text doctrine to 99383. You'll get a free copy of it. PDF you get teaching sermons and all, you know, all these other resources totally free, no strings attached.

[Pastor Mark Driscoll]

Just Bible teaching.

[Charlie Kirk]

Just Bible teaching. And here's the thing, guys, you can also go to charliekirk.com we're going to put it up for download there. And I asked if there was some way we could help you and you just refused. And I just want to bless you and honor you for that.

[Pastor Mark Driscoll]

Yeah, we don't want anything just to help.

[Charlie Kirk]

No. And it's just a really sweet gesture and it's, it's been my honor to host both of you. Thank you so much.

[Pastor Mark Driscoll]

Thank you. Thank you.

[Charlie Kirk]

We'll see you tomorrow, everybody with Steve Dase. Until then.

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[Pastor Josh McPherson]

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[Charlie Kirk]

Take a deep dive into the stories.

[Emily Maitlis / John Sopel]

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[Pastor Josh McPherson]

This is an iHeart podcast.