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- [00:00]
A
This is an I Heart Podcast. Welcome into Real America's Voice News. This is Sunday the Road Forward with a word of hope and encouragement for you and those you love. I'm Dr. Tim Clinton. I'll be your host. Our special guest joining us this week, he's the founder and CEO of well Verse, a ministry to members of Congress, ambassadors at the United nations in New York City and other elected officials. Dr. Jim Garlow is back with us. He's lead pastor of New Life Church International in Plant City, Florida. Bishop Calvin Koberis is back with us and he is author, evangelist and founder of Student Leadership University, someone who speaks to more young people in America than anyone I know. Dr. Jay Strack is with us. He is the CEO of Luke, where he supports our military, veterans, law enforcement and their families with trusted healthcare staffing solutions. John Sanders is with us. Thanks for watching. My fear doesn't stand a chance when I stand in your love My fear doesn't stand a chance Chance when I stand in your love My fear doesn't stand a chance When I stand in your love oh, I'm standing Yes, faith is back in America and everyone's talking about there's a massive faith surge right now. God is in the middle of all of it. And in the aftermath of the horrific assassination of TPUSA leader Charlie Kirk Till TPUSA events are continuing and they are massive. Virginia Tech, Utah State University, packing the places out. It's quite moving, really. Elon Musk shared Erica Kirk's quote, go to church message, sparking a wave of spiritual revival and increased church attendance nationwide. People are asking, will faith shape America's next chapter? I think it's going to Americans continue, however, to be concerned and fearful of potential acts of violence and terrorism on American soil. Rightfully so. And we are on the heels of our 2025American association of Christian Counselors United World Conference we held at the magnificent Opryland Hotel in Nashville. We were sold out with over 7,000 mental health and ministry leaders there. All I can say is what a move of God we opened up with Chris Tomlin in concert. Never took our foot off the gas until the end. God is raising up a generation of those who have not bowed the knee to BAAL and they're standing strong. I opened up with the message out of Hosea 2:15 one that in the valley of Achor, that place where there's trial and tribulation, darkness, the scriptures cry out that we should return to the Lord. I think we're seeing that right now. And a Door of hope will be opened wide. In times like these. Our hope, our strength comes from the Lord. Here's a great verse to hold on to this week from the bible. It's Psalm 99. The Lord is a stronghold for the oppressed. A stronghold in the times of trouble. Hey, let's pray. We'll get started. God be with us. Bless this time together. Use it for your glory. Thank you God for the move of spiritual revival we're seeing across our country. God be in the midst of it. Draw us to yourself. Let the people be encouraged. We love you and thank you for your faithfulness in our lives. In Jesus name, amen. Let's get started. You know, I realize there are a lot of choices when it comes to who you choose for your cell phone service. And there are a lot of new ones popping up all the time. But here's the truth. There's only one that boldly stands in the gap for every American that believes that free freedom is worth fighting for. And that's Patriot Mobile. Here's the best part. You can use the promo code Road Forward for a free month of service right now. You know, for more than 12 years Patriot Mobile has been on the front lines fighting for our God given rights and freedoms while at the same time providing exceptional nationwide cell phone service with access to all three of the main networks. Don't just take my word for it. Ask the hundreds of thousands of Americans who have made the switch and they're now supporting causes they believe in simply by joining Patriot Mobile. I sure have. Switching, by the way, is easier than ever. Activate in minutes from the comfort of your own home. Keep your number, keep your phone or even upgrade Patriot Mobile's all US based support team. They're standing by right now to take care of you. You can call the number 972-PATRIOT 972 PATRIOT right now or go to patriotmobile.com forward/road forward. Use the promo code Road Forward for a free month of Service. That's right. Patriotmobile.com forward/road forward. Or call 972 Patriot and make the switch today. Joining me now is Dr. Jim Garlow. He's the founder and CEO of well Versed Ministry to members of Congress, Ambassadors at the United nations in New York City, other elected officials. Dr. Garlow, what a delight to have you. Thank you for joining me.
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B
Good to be with you, Tim.
- [05:22]
A
Jim. Hey, over the last year or so, a lot of lions of the faith, if you will, have passed on to glory and I know this is a special weekend for you because you are officiating Dr. James C. Dobson's memorial service. Jim, what a privilege. And by the way, you know, it's a sad time, a glorious time. At the same time, you know, just your take on and what your thoughts are as you go into the weekend.
- [05:49]
B
Well, I gotta tell you, of all the times I have spoken and like you, I've spoken a lot of times, I've never felt so unworthy speaking in advance. I have this one because of the magnitude and the impact of his life. We only have rare moments where we have someone when they pass their. We can speak about their influence being on millions and then we can even use the B word, billion. You could use that kind of word for Billy Graham or Bill Bright, Charlie Kirk and you can for James Dobson. There's very few who cast a shadow that tall. So this is an enormous loss for us, but it's a moment that we need to really cherish. Cherish not only the fact that he has finished well like he wanted to and he's enjoying eternality with heaven in heaven, but at the same time the recognition that this is one of the most tremendous lives we just witnessed has just been in our time frame and we've gotten to be with him, we read about John Wesley or Martin Luther, etc. But we got to be with a person like that and to know him well. What an honor.
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A
You know, as I reflect on Dr. Dobson, Jim, I think a lot about the time I got to spend with him. I co hosted radio with him and for him for about seven years. And actually I remember going into my undergraduate studies at Liberty University on a Wednesday night we had a class, it was in Marriage and Family. And I remember one of the textbooks was Dr. Dobson answers yous Questions. And I got so fascinated by him and so encouraged by him that cut my teeth in wanted to learn everything I could about what he was thinking, feeling and what I really appreciated, not just his stance on the family, but his commitment to righteousness and culture. Jim, through the years he has been a bold strong voice saying, hey listen, we've got to get this right and this is not a time to be timid but to anchor ourselves and boy, think of the ministries that have quote spun out of. If you will focus on the family and Dr. James Dobson's family talk, it is again just what a privilege to have some time with him, Jim, like you said, to honor him.
- [08:04]
B
You know, when you look at the numbers, I think it's something like 70 books he wrote. Now I've written A number, but I'm nothing close to 70. And they certainly don't have the substance and impact that he has had. And then he's on something like 4,000 radio stations. I don't remember something at 29 languages. This is profound influence. But if we shift the focus off of that incredible footprint and go to the character of a man, I was talking with his wife and talking with his daughter just a couple days ago and said to me these words. In 65 years of marriage, he never once flirted with another woman. He was never once caught in a lie, ever. He never lied. Those kind of statements of integrity. He was raised by a family who understood how to walk in holiness and righteousness. When he was a young boy named Jimmy, I. I was a pastor, associate pastor at Bethany Personazarene Church in Bethany, Oklahoma, many years ago. And I used to know the people who would tell me Jimmy Dobson was my newspaper boy. Even back then, they respected him. They knew he was a man of integrity even as a youth. This is a life that needs to be studied, not only in its incredible impact, but on the integrity of the person himself.
- [09:28]
A
Jim I remember he was going to a Ralph Reed event, and he was being given the Winston Churchill Award by Ralph and his and his organization that particular night. Vice President Pence was there. President Trump was actually at Ralph's Reed the night before. Gave some honor and accolade to Dr. Dobson. But Vice President Pence introduced Dr. Dobson. Dr. Dobson makes his way up to the microphone. And you know how much he was strong on fathering and these kind of things. I think he was 80, 81 years old. He walks over to the microphone. Jim, I'll never forget, he thanked everybody and was so gracious. And then he kind of looked out at the crowd and looked beyond the crowd and he said these words. I wish my dad was here, because he had just been given this Winston Churchill Award win. Churchill, I think, was his favorite, you know, in history. And he loved Normandy and all those Greatest Generation people and those who had served. But that spoke more to me about the power of a dad than anything. Jim those were kind of moments, you know, that through the years, he just dropped them in. And he would say things like, all that really matters is who you loved and who loved you. Get it right. Relationships are everything. And he talked a lot about be there. In other words, he wanted a spiritual heritage as the greatest gift and a relationship with Christ. Leading someone to Christ, that's the only thing you can take with you to heaven. Jim. Those were his priorities. That was his life.
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B
I just learned again when I was talking with Danae, his daughter, a couple days ago that at Focus on the Family, they had a completely private line to his desk that was only for his wife, his daughter and his son. And Denise said he would take a call from us even in the middle of a board meeting. We always had complete access to him at any time. That's a pretty remarkable statement right there, that he thought ahead and planned ahead so much that there was a private line dedicated just to his wife and his two children. That speaks volumes.
- [11:48]
A
His influence. Last week, Jim, we were in Nashville at our AACC World Conference. We were sold out over 7,000 mental health and ministry leaders there. One of the things we did do is we had a moment on Friday to honor Dr. Dobson, and I brought in Ryan Dobson, his son and I had a few conferences before, brought Dr. Dobson out on stage. It was in a special time in his life. And I said to the audience, if Dr. Dobson has had any influence in your personal life or professional life, I want you to stand and bring him to the stage. Jim, the first time when we brought Dr. Dobson out, they stood on their feet and the place erupted for five minutes in applause. Now, fast forward to this past week when I brought Ryan to the stage in this moment, I said, I'm gonna say this to the crowd again. If Dr. Dobson had any personal or professional influence in your life, I want you to stand to your feet and tell this son how much you loved his father. And Jim, I have goosebumps on me even right now. What happened in that room? It was a moment and Ryan just wept and fell into my arms and we hugged each other because, I mean, only heaven will tell of the influence of Dr. James C. Dobson. And I just thought, you know what, God, May we all live with that kind of character and testimony to the glory of God. Let me give you the closing word, Jim, as you again prepare for this special time in the memorial service.
- [13:24]
B
It's interesting. I don't know if it was the first time I ever heard James Dobson on Focus on the Family, but if it wasn't the first, it was the one early. But it so impacted me. I remember exactly where I was in, what town I was in, what I was driving at the time. This was a long time ago. And it completely revolutionized my life. What just one short interview he did with an individual. I went out immediately about the book, and it transformed our family life just from one simple little radio interview that I heard with him. Again, I remember right where I was the moment of impact upon my life. This is the kind of thumbprint that he left on millions of us, literally millions of us. This is a special moment we get to participate in. This weekend is really rich and special as we celebrate this one powerful life.
- [14:23]
A
You know how much I love and appreciate and respect you, Jim. We'll be praying for you. And as always, thank you so much for taking time to join us.
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B
Such a joy to be with you, Tim. Thank you.
- [14:35]
A
Coming up next, lead pastor of New Life Church International in Plant City, Florida. Bishop Calvin Colberis is back with us. For more encouragement and to stay connected, follow Dr. Tim Clinton on Facebook, Instagram and X. We love being a part of your life. Joining me now is Bishop Calvin Koberis. He's currently serving as lead pastor of New Life Church International in Plant City, Florida. He's a member of the National Faith Advisory Board. He's a strong voice for righteousness and culture. Bishop, welcome back. Thank you for joining me.
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C
Good morning, Dr. Clinton. Thank you for having me.
- [15:16]
A
Bishop get started. There's a real faith surge going on in our country. Everyone, everybody's talking about God. People are going back to church. Hey. In the aftermath of that horrific assassination of our friend, TP USA leader Charlie Kirk. Hey. The events are continuing. I don't know if you saw the footage from Virginia Tech, Utah State University. Place packed out. Seriously packed out. It's moving, really. Bishop Elon Musk recently shared Erica Kirk's quote, go to church message. I really believe maybe the seeds of revival are being sown. Bishop and something's going on. People are asking this, will faith shape America's next chapter? Bishop, your take.
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C
Well, I tell you this. A world in chaos needs a church in revival. And that's exactly what's happening right now. The church is in revival. The enemy would think taking out Charlie Kirk would end us, but that really, it emboldened us. It gave us more of a fire. And more than that, we're seeing people respond to the message of the gospel like never before and people platforming the name of Jesus. And the good news for Elon Musk to tell us to go to church. I think we're in the right direction.
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A
Something's going on. Bishop. For sure. Hey, in the middle of it. Bishop I can't believe. Cancel culture. You know, I guess when faith is advancing, evil just continues to surge itself. And people out there, this online hatred, it's unbelievable to me. People commenting about Charlie Kirk. Just nasty stuff being spewed online. Bishop I just, I can't even believe it people who are supposed to say they're inclusive and they care about people and more. No, they can't stand anything faith related.
- [17:04]
C
Yeah, I totally agree. I have been a part of some meetings within my community and around since Charlie Kirk's assassination that unfortunately was clothed as if they wanted to speak on unity, but it was really just to attack anyone who stands with or stance stood for our love, Charlie Kirk. However, in those meeting rooms, what I had to let people who did not know him, never met him, know from a person who have shared stages that he's been on that. Instead of you running with clickbait and running with things that stir up racial confusion and division, let's look at the general message of this man of God. He was a conservative. That, of course, supported his conservative views. But more than that, he stood for the kingdom of the Lord Jesus Christ and preached the gospel and used the gospel to support his moral stance.
- [17:52]
A
Bishop My mind was going back to Utah State University this week where I saw 6,500 people show up at that TPUSA event in Utah. Let me say it again, in Utah. And I thought about the courage of the people and how the strength of a person can strengthen the backbones of others. And hey, here they are showing up. Bishop this past week, you and I, we were in Nashville for the AAC acc, the American Association Christian Counselors World Conference. It was sold out. 7,000 people. Over 7,000 people showed up at the Opryland Hotel. It was magnificent. Bishop There was a fire in that place that I don't know, but you came in, spoke. I mean, you blew the house up. I mean, seriously, with a message to encourage people that in what they're doing, it really matters. And this is the moment where we don't. We don't need to pull back. We don't need to be silenced, ashamed, or stigmatized. This is a moment to step up and into and be a bold voice. Have courage. Bishop it's interesting how the momentum is really building your take on what happened in Nashville.
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C
Dr. Clinton, first of all, thank you for leading an organization that I believe is on the front line of this moment. Why I say that mental health professionals, first responders are needed. There used to be this thing where there was a, you know, all the counselors, all, no, you know, counselors for certain people. Nobody, everybody does not need counseling. But the reality is, I want to tell my colleagues, we do need counselors. Pastors need counselors, counselors need pastors. And we need to collide theology and science and this particular science for the glory of God. Because mental health is a serious crisis of today, with all of the trauma and tragedy that is happening with the preaching from the pulpit and the counselors ministering to people from a Christian context, that is necessary because you have counselors that are woke and crazy and saying all type of other stuff. All they're going to do is stir it apart and make things worse. But when you have Christian counselors that are articulating the gospel as they counsel and work people through the layers of their life that they need to process, I believe that that particular conference that we just left was a charging, a refueling, an empowerment for those leaders to go back, take it up a notch, and not turn down, but to turn up. And not to take God out of their practice, but to highlight the name of Christ and everything that they do and let Christ be the center of their counseling and how they minister to their clients.
- [20:23]
A
You know, when Chris Tomlin opened up the event, it was just stunning. I mean, it really was. And hey, we got angel armies around us. Amen, Bishop. That's what it is. And again, I really believe are being encouraged and strengthened in this moment. Bishop, want to go this way? October, here we are. Pastor Appreciation Month. Bishop, thank you for being faithful. Let me say that to you. I appreciate your word, and I know by the way you've been dogged and chased and people come at you, I want to cancel you. But you're standing strong, Bishop, and matter of fact, God's given you a platform. I mean, it's. It's just expanding. It's global and. But, Bishop, just close us out with a word about the church and about pastors in this moment.
- [21:10]
C
Church, first of all, realize that this is our finest hour. God has given us an opportunity to highlight his name like never before. Let's not miss this moment because we get caught up in the divisive talk or the banter that comes from pulpits and chairs that have no legs. But let us stand boldly and courageously for the things that we know that are true about the word of God and point people to Jesus, who's the author and finisher of our faith. And I want to say to pastors today, this is not the hour for you to hide in your pulpit, hide behind the four walls of your church, but this is the hour for you to take the leadership in your community and stand against darkness. Stand for what is right, and know that you appreciate it. You are valued even when people don't pat you on the back. Great is your reward when you stand before God. And he says, servant of God, well done. So until that day, be faithful unto death, and the Lord will give us all the crown of life. God bless.
- [22:10]
A
Amen. Bishop. Hosea 2, 15, Hosea 14 1. In the Valley of Achor, in that place of darkness, of trial and tribulation, return to the Lord and a door of hope will be open wide unto you. Bishop, always great to see you, my friend. Thank you so much for joining me.
- [22:29]
C
Thank you.
- [22:30]
A
Coming up next, he is author, evangelist and founder of Student Leadership University, someone who speaks to more young people in America than Anyone I know. Dr. Jay Strack is with us. For more encouragement and to stay connected, follow Dr. Tim Clinton on Facebook, Instagram and Facebook. We love being a part of your life. Joining us now is Dr. Jay Strack. He's the president and founder of Student Leadership University, the premier global leadership training program for high school students. He's got a brand new center at Charleston Southern University. He's impacted hundreds of thousands of students around the world, author of several highly acclaimed books. Welcome back. Dr. J. Thank you for joining me.
- [23:18]
D
Well, thank you, Tim, and we're always a pleasure. But yet we also know today and the subject matter is pretty serious. And it's go time.
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A
Yeah, Jay. Israel, Gaza and Trump's peace plan. Everybody dialed into Washington, D.C. this week as Benjamin Netanyahu made his way over. There's a lot of conversations going on, but, Jay, all eyes have been locked in on the Middle east for quite some time. You've been over there a lot, Jay. I think over a hundred times. You know that area really well. You interact with Israeli leadership a lot. Just give us your take on where you see this at currently and what are your thoughts about the, the peace plan?
- [24:00]
D
You know, Tim, on one hand, especially when you consider what all has happened since October 7, right? Since that date, 68,000 casualties on both sides. And we know that led to what took place with Iran. Of course, Iran's been very, very involved with everything going on with the mosque. They're one of their main minor league teams, if you will, and one of their main fronts to increase their power. So the thanks to President Trump, thanks to the United States and of course, Israel has a Masada mentality. And you know, the Masada mentality is, is that we're not ever going to be taken captive and we're never going to be pushed off our land again. And so you put all that together, knowing also the what the Bible teaches about prophecy. We're in the fourth quarter of the ball game no question. And virtually every move has got very serious consequences.
- [25:10]
A
Jay, it looks like Benjamin Netanyahu is all in on President Trump's peace plan. And I think reportedly it's being welcomed by both Arab and Palestinian authorities. Do you think it's going to stick, Jay? What do you think is going to happen? I know he sent a message to Hamas that if Hamas doesn't get to the table and agree to these some 20 different points, that he's going to jump on board with the prime minister and let Israel go forward and just wipe Hamas out.
- [25:38]
D
I think Hamas has been given one more final opportunity. The difference is we have a president now that when he says, this is it, I'm giving you this many days. How many times has the president given a deadline? And the day after that deadline was up, all of a sudden, you know, here came the hammer. In other words. So no one's worked harder for peace, to negotiate peace, but then President Trump. But he also understands that in some places in the world, you've got to set a deadline and you've got to back up what you say. And one thing, Tim, I think everybody needs to be aware of and to rejoice in, back in the president's first term, the Abrahamic covenant, and that began to spread in Saudi Arabia. This mighty powerful Arab nation bought in to the fact that we are the sons of Abraham. We're talking about Christian, talking about Jewish, we're talking about is Muslim, Islamists. So therefore, we ought to be able to resolve some of these problems. So based on that one great victory with the Abraham Accord, as you know, several other major Arab nations have signed on. What makes today and what's going on in this new deadline is that the Arab nations have stood with the United States in saying, hamas, this is your last chance. Come to the table. And I must say, Tim, and trying to be a man of peace, but I understand that, you know, the people there in Gaza are afraid of Hamas. But I had the privilege to say to several leading Arab ambassadors, you know, gentlemen, with all due respect, the United States had to go to war against the most powerful nation in the history of the world when we declared our independence from England. And I said, so the people over there have to accept some responsibility. They have to say, enough is enough. We don't want to live like this. We're not demons, we're not animals. We want to live with like people, with a noble life, a belief in God, and we want to get along with our neighbors. And until the people are willing to make a stand Against Tamas. I, I'm, I'm, you know, I'm, I'm apprehensive about how far we are going to get, because that's what it's going to take. The people keep going along. I think Hamas will be very reluctant to let go. President Trump's the only one who could get us to this point. He, he will keep his promise, as the Iranians found out. And I'm praying, like everyone, this is a chance once and for all in the name of peace.
- [28:51]
A
Jay, we're fighting time. But I wanted to ask you, with the rise of antisemitism here in the country, especially on college and university campuses, and we know the Trump administration is really trying to get that under control. But, Jay, you are making a move to help expose a lot of faith leaders, Christian leaders and more to Israel. You're planning a pretty significant trip, taking some people over the pond, if you will, over to Israel. And your, Your goal, Jay, just talk to us about it.
- [29:23]
D
Very brief, very simple. We have an opportunity to take pastors, youth pastors, those that love Israel, love America, and love people in the kingdom of God. We want them to see where the festival massacre took place. We want them to see the tunnels. We want them to see all the efforts that have been made to feed the people of Gaza. Everybody forgets that. But literally several billion dollars through the years trying to feed the people. But Hamas steals the food from the people, and then everybody wants to blame Israel for what happens to the people that live there. So what we want to do is take, and we're very privileged coming up in first week of December, to take maybe close to a thousand leading faith leaders and let them see with their own eyes the heart of the Jewish people, their desire for peace. Let them see how vicious Hamas is. And by the way, anybody that allows antisemitism to be taught on their campus or in their church or in their school, I promise you, that has to be pulled out like a cancer. It is one of the most satanic, deadly diseases, anti Semitism, and Israel's paid a price for literally hundreds and thousands of years. And it's over. I think with this president and the United States and Christian people saying, we are brothers and sisters in this together.
- [31:01]
A
Dr. Jay Strack, always great to have you, my friend. Thank you for joining me.
- [31:06]
D
Thanks, buddy.
- [31:08]
A
Coming up next, he is the CEO of Luke, where he supports our military, veterans, law enforcement and their families with trusted healthcare staffing solutions. John Sanders is with us. You know, I realize there are a lot of choices when it comes to who you choose for your cell phone service. And there are a lot of new ones popping up all the time. But here's the truth. There's only one that boldly stands in the gap for every American that believes that freedom is worth fighting for. And that's Patriot Mobile. Here's the best part. You can use the promo code Road Forward for a free month of service right now. You know, for more than 12 years, Patriot Mobile has been on the front lines fighting for our God given rights and freedoms while at the same time providing exceptional nationwide cell phone service with access to all three of the main networks. Don't just take my word for it. Ask the hundreds of thousands of Americans who have made the switch and they're now supporting causes they believe in simply by joining Patriot Mobile. I sure have. Switching, by the way, is easier than ever. Activating minutes from the comfort of your own home. Keep your number, keep your phone or even upgrade. Patriot Mobile's all US based support team. They're standing by right now to take care of you. You can call the number 972-patriot972patriot right now or go to patriot mobile.com forward/road forward. Use the promo code Road Forward for a free month of Service. That's right, patriotmobile.com road forward or call 972 Patriot and make the switch today. Joining us now is John Sanders. John served on President elect Trump's transition team in 2016 and 17. He went on to serve as Chief Operating Officer and acting commissioner of U.S. customs and Border Protection, leading over 60,000 employees in defense of America's borders. He's also former TSA chief technology officer and architect of the Precheck system. He built and led companies that strengthened national security and create American jobs. Today he is CEO of Luke. He supports our military, veterans, law enforcement and their families with trusted health care staffing solutions. John, welcome. What a delight to have you. Thank you for joining me.
- [33:38]
E
My pleasure to be here, Tim.
- [33:39]
A
Hey, John, tell us a little bit about Luke and what you're doing in and through that organization. It's quite impressive.
- [33:45]
E
Happy to. Luke has been around for over 20 years. We provide healthcare staffing to the Veterans Administration, the Department of Defense, Department of War now, and the Department of Homeland Security. We're really focused on serving populations that we consider to be heroes, which are our war fighters, veterans and first responders and their families.
- [34:08]
A
John, in the midst of this, you and I developed a friendship and I learned a lot about your passion for and commitment to mental health care. Talk to us about how that came about in your life and why you're so. I'm serious about it.
- [34:23]
E
Yeah, absolutely. Well, as you know, Tim, mental health has impacted my family. I had a brother and sister that committed suicide and I have a daughter that deals with mental health issues, illness and has had several suicide incidents or suicide attempts. In addition, when I was at the US Customs and Border Protection, which is the largest law enforcement agency in the country, they were dealing with a mental health crisis. At the same time, there was the humanitarian crisis on the southern border. And so I saw death not only from a personal perspective, but leading one of the great American law enforcement agencies in the country and watching veterans within CBP, as well as law enforcement officers, commit, commit suicide.
- [35:17]
A
John, when you step back, it's been a pretty tough go. Through the last few years, we've seen soaring levels of depression, anxiety, yes, even suicidality. Loneliness is a big issue, John, and it's really developed, fueled a lot of concern by government officials and more. And when you think about our veterans and their families and federal agents and first responders, you know, all the pressures they're under. John, PTSD is a pretty serious issue. We know what some around 20ish somewhere in there, veterans take their life every day. I just can't take my hat off and salute you more and then enough for your commitment to making a dent, if you will, in this thing. Because we've got to do something, we've got to unite and boy, I'll tell you what, the church, if there's a platform for the helping community to step up in and through, it's the church community. John, you have a real fervor in your heart about engaging people of faith in this area.
- [36:17]
E
Yeah, absolutely. And you know, Tim, I think with the assassination of Charlie Kirk, a lot of people are quoting him. But I think one of the great things he said is we will not have a free society if this country goes atheist. And if you just look at the data around what's happening in the armed services with veterans, a veteran is twice as likely to go see a pastor as they are a secular person. And when you look at the army in particular, there's some studies that have been done for people that come to see chaplains. And 50% of the people that come to see a chaplain have depression issues and 40% have PTSD.
- [37:03]
A
John, I know we just came off the heels of our AACC world conference, the American association of Christian Counselors. We had some. We're sold out. Seven plus thousand people in the room Faith and mental health leaders coming together. You were a big sponsor of that event, John, and you and I have had conversations about you want to recruit clinicians, coaches, you want to recruit chaplains, you name it. People who understand and have a kind of an alignment with people who are going through challenge in their life on matters of faith. You really want to build that as a part of your own staffing engine that you have going on. Because, John, the need is so great. There's a massive gap between those who need help and those who provide help, especially those who provide faith based help. Talk to us about that and how you see it coming together.
- [37:51]
E
Absolutely. And you know, what we're trying to do is create, with great organizations like the American association of Christian Counselors, we want to create an army of 250,000 people that have a heart to help our heroes flourish in the United States. It's a shame that there are people that are seeking help and they cannot get help. And by that I mean they don't want to go talk to another. Not that there's anything wrong with clinicians, but they don't want to go to another doctor to get another pill. They want to go to people of faith. And as you know, and as I believe, at the end of the day, true hope and healing is only going to come from God. So I think it's just critical at this moment in time that we energize people, we tap into the faith community to come out and really help these heroes. Heroes so that they can thrive at the end of the day.
- [38:50]
A
An encouraging piece here, John, is just how faith is surging in America. I know we talked about Charlie Kirk and I was able to go out to Phoenix for the memorial service out there, John, I don't think I've ever sensed the presence and power of God like I did in those moments while I was out there. And you know, when you're going through hard times, people of, hey, the American people, man, they go to God. They cry out to God asking for help. We're seeing it all over the place. Look at what's happening on college campuses. It's amazing to me. Look at the TPUSA events still going on. They went to Virginia Tech, I think Utah. They went up to Utah State University, packed the place out this week. John, it's amazing to me, but people want God as a part of the equation. They want that brought into the, quote, counseling relationship. They want to see God come alive in their life. That's why I think you're so committed. That's why I'm so excited about it.
- [39:47]
E
Amen, Tim. You know, I think God has opened a door and created an opportunity for a spiritual awakening in this country. And I think it's just incumbent upon all of us as believers to walk through that door and do all that we can in fulfillment of the Great Commission and the Great Commandment.
- [40:04]
A
John, in your work, you've come across some data. You and I have talked a lot about it around the human flourishing idea. And there's this global flourishing study that came out. Gallup partnered up to release the information, but it was a guy named Tyler Vanderweil from Harvard who kind of led that and Byron Johnson out of Baylor. The research they found, I think they did some big, massive random sampling of over 200,000 people around the world. I think it's over 20 countries they've got sampling out of. But they found that what are these common denominators that help people flourish? And here's what they found. At the heart of it all is faith. That people who are anchored up in their relationship, John, it does something. And today's generations, as they struggle in this whole area of identity and purpose and meaning and value and why they're struggling with emptiness, John, is that this is that piece that might just pull it all back together again. I'm excited about the flourishing stuff. Tell us a little bit about what you are understanding and what you're hoping. I know you're trying again to build up a labor category around coaching to help step up and into these moments, because there's, again, there's such a wide gap between people who need help and those who provide it. We don't have enough providers.
- [41:23]
E
Amen. And you said it earlier, Tim. I'll just come back to that. It's the four C's or the five C's if you want to look at it, is we need coaches, we need clinicians. So there is absolutely a place and a need for clinicians, more clinicians across the country. We need content, we need chaplains, and we need the church. We need all of that to come together in fulfillment of the mission to help these heroes flourish at the end of the day. And I don't think that. I think one of the things Tyler has just done a phenomenal job is how do you measure that flourishing index or the flourishing score, so that it's evidence, informed. But faith is a key part of it. And I think for too long in this country, we have separated science from faith. And I think what is so great about the global flourishing Study is that if we are going to really thrive as human beings, we have to have faith. We cannot thrive without faith.
- [42:33]
A
Yeah, I was having a conversation this week too with my good friend Harold Koenig out of Duke University. And Harold is probably the preeminent scholar in the world on mental health and faith. And he just said, tim, the evidence is overwhelming. It's too strong. You can't deny it. Faith really does matter at the end of the day. Hey, I love that verse out of Hosea 2, verse 15. Basically, in the valley of Achor, when you're going through those dark moments of challenge and brokenness, return to the Lord and a door of hope will be opened wide. I see it happening in culture right now. That's why we're seeing a revival, a spiritual awakening. And John, I think in the midst of it, just maybe people are gonna turn to God like never before and hopefully a door of hope will open wide. John, I salute you and the great work that you're doing in and through Luke. If people wanna learn more about you, the organization, maybe even how to be a part, where can they go?
- [43:34]
E
I think they can go to two places. They can go to our website, which is lukestaffing.com we have a human flourishing that talks more about this. I think another great resource is we are working with the American association of Christian Counselors creating a human flourishing alliance. There's a page on AACC's website. Go there, sign up. Be involved in helping people flourish at the end of the day. That is my greatest prayer for everybody listening to this.
- [44:04]
A
Amen. John Sanders, CEO of Luke. Thank you so much for joining me.
- [44:09]
E
Thank you very much, Tim.
- [44:13]
A
For more encouragement and to stay connected, follow Dr. Tim Clinton on Facebook, Instagram and X. We love being a part of your life. Hey, these are unprecedented times or difficult times, but God's in control. I know that. And he's at work. I hope you'll press in close to him in his heart. Know that God loves you and that he wants to be in your life. I hope our strength comes from the Lord. Again, here's that encouraging verse from the Bible to hold on to this week. Psalm 99. The Lord is a stronghold for the oppressed, a stronghold during times of trouble. I hope you know that you can look to God for wisdom and direction in your everyday life. Let me also say this, though, there's a professional counselor. I've learned that it's normal to have concern, maybe fear or worry when life isn't going the way it's supposed to. Go also learned that if you aren't careful, it can begin to consume you, control you. It's easy to lose perspective. Maybe some would feel like hope. It can get so dark for some that they feel like life would be better off without them. I say this every week. You don't have to live like that. Taking a step, reaching out for help. It's often the gateway to a new day or a new you. If you or someone you love is struggling, I hope you'll do that. Reach out for help. There are wonderful counselors and pastors who care who can help you find the hope, the answers that you're looking for. There are a lot of wonderful resources out there now. Love to connect you with some of those. You can just simply go up on our website@aacc.net that's aacc.net or try out our new website called Christian Care Connect. It's really a Christian mental health care connect website. Christiancareconnect.com if you don't have a personal relationship with God in Christ, I want to invite you right now to have God come into your life. Simply ask him to forgive you of your sin and to be your Lord and Savior. It's as simple as praying a prayer from your heart to God. Something like this. You can pray with me. Lord Jesus, I need you. I'm a sinner. I believe that you died for my sins. I want to turn from them and invite you into my life, my heart. I want to trust you and I want to follow you as my Lord and Savior. Thank you for loving me, for giving your life for me. Thank you for the gift of grace, forgiveness and the gift of eternal life. I pray all this in Jesus name. Amen. You know what the Bible says? The Bible says in John 3:16, for God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten Son that whosoever believes in him should not perish but have everlasting life. And then In Romans chapter 10, verse 9, it says that if you confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you know what the Bible says? Again, you will be saved. If you prayed that prayer, I believe that's exactly where you are now. I'd encourage you go serve him for the rest of your life. He'll give you the strength to do it. Hey, let me say this too. That if you're struggling with hopelessness and it feels pretty dark and you don't feel like you can get out of that free fall, hope you'll pick up the phone and call the suicide hotline. That number is simply 988-988. Talk to someone and get on a journey to find new life. Before we go, maybe God has gifted you with a heart to help other people. I hope you'll consider being a part of our Mental Health Coach first responder training program. You can enroll right now and be on your way to becoming a board certified mental health coach. Over 70,000 people have now enrolled. Everything you need to know about this program is@lightuniversity.com mental health coach lightuniversity.com mental health coach it's a 42 hour training program featuring some of the world's leading experts, mental health and ministry experts, all on video. You can study 24 7, 365. The best news this kind of program usually costs around $2,400. Might be a scholarship up there for someone just like you. Lightuniversity.com Mental Health Coach I'm Dr. Tim Clinton. As always, thanks for watching. See you next week right here on Sunday, the road forward on Real America's Voice. This is an I Heart podcast.