THE STEVE GRUBER SHOW - DECEMBER 24TH, 2025

Summary

Podcast Summary: THE STEVE GRUBER SHOW - DECEMBER 24TH, 2025

Podcast: Real America’s Voice
Host: Steve Gruber
Guest: Paul Seegert (Employee Benefits Practice Leader, Acrisure)
Date: December 24, 2025

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Episode Overview

This Christmas Eve edition of The Steve Gruber Show delivers a blend of holiday reflection and hard-hitting commentary on American health care. In the first segment, Steve connects the Bible’s nativity story to everyday American life, emphasizing the hope and humility of Christmas. The episode’s core is an in-depth analysis of the U.S. health care system, especially the impact and legacy of Obamacare. Health care expert Paul Seegert joins for a frank, solutions-oriented discussion about premiums, transparency, profit incentives, and potential alternatives such as Health Savings Accounts (HSAs) and collective bargaining co-ops. The show closes with Gruber’s take on the looming 2026 midterms, Republican strategy, and potential Supreme Court impacts.

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The Real Meaning of Christmas (03:25–08:47)

• Holiday message: Steve Gruber opens with a heartfelt Christmas Eve reflection, drawing from the biblical account of Christ’s birth and its meaning for ordinary people.
• Lessons from the shepherds:
  • Gruber shares the true spirit of the season—hope and good news for the "ordinary"—underscoring that God chose humble shepherds, not elites, to receive the Christmas message first.
• Quote & Commentary:

  “Do you ever feel discouraged by your ordinariness? ... That is exactly the kind of person that God reveals himself to. ... You have the ability to rest in and deliver that same message that those shepherds did more than 2000 years ago: Glory to God in the highest and on earth, peace, goodwill toward men. ... Jesus Christ is the only one who can bring lasting peace and goodwill.” (Steve Gruber, 06:52)

• Memorable moment: Gruber encourages listeners to embrace their human weaknesses, referencing Paul’s words in 2 Corinthians:

  “My grace is sufficient for you, for my power is made perfect in weakness.” (Steve Gruber quoting Paul, 08:51)

• Actionable advice: Read the Christmas story aloud to your family as part of celebrating the deeper meaning beyond gifts and traditions.

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Deep Dive: The Crisis in American Health Care (15:40–50:28)

The Current State of Health Care in America

• Obamacare under fire:
  • Gruber brings in Paul Seegert, a critical voice against the current health care model, to dissect what’s gone wrong post-ACA (Affordable Care Act/Obamacare).
  • Seegert, a former NSA Russian analyst turned insurance expert, famously quips:

    “The insurance industry is far dirtier than the Russians.” (Steve Gruber recalling Seegert, 16:28)

• Main Problems Identified:
  • Soaring premiums and deductibles (+100% in 15 years)
  • Insurance company profits up 1,000% in a decade
  • System rewards higher costs—not efficiency or outcomes
  • Consolidation leading to healthcare deserts—rural hospital closures, loss of critical services
• Subsidies & "False Solutions":

  “We mostly fight over who's going to pay for something that's broken, not how to fix it.” (Paul Seegert, 17:21)
  “People can make hundreds of thousands a year and get subsidies—it's unsustainable.” (Paul Seegert, 17:21)

How Did It Get This Bad?

• Market incentives misaligned:
  • The more procedures cost, the more profit for insurers under the “cost plus” model.
  • Example: 20% of Obamacare money goes straight to insurers, incentivizing higher prices.
  • Hospital and provider consolidation reduces care access—"We create healthcare deserts."
• Transparency? Not really:
  • Supposed price transparency yields “150+ different prices” for the same procedures.
  • Seegert’s personal story: as a cash payer for his child’s birth, the bill went from $28,000 to $2,800.

  “On average the discount is 80 to 85% if you are a cash payer ... that kind of negates the whole purpose of insurance.” (Paul Seegert, 26:50)

  • Most consumers don’t know or can’t access such options.

The Subsidy/Profit Loop

• Political dynamics:
  • Democrats “feed the Obamacare monster” with subsidies, insurers donate 90%+ to Democrats.
  • Insurers present “losses” to justify rate hikes—but these are circular accounting tricks inflating in-house costs across subsidiaries.

  “The biggest winners, clearly, in the Affordable Care Act era of healthcare ... have been large insurers. We're left with four big players ... the only winners.” (Paul Seegert, 34:30)

  • 100 million Americans in medical debt, despite “the best health care in the world” in terms of medical capabilities—if you can access it.

Potential Solutions

Health Savings Accounts (HSAs) (32:41–33:40)

• Proposed reforms:
  • Direct more money to people through HSAs, enable consumer-driven care.
  • Genuine price transparency and the ability for consumers to shop on cost/quality.
  • The government’s role should be setting rules and guardrails, not propping up an inefficient insurance intermediary model.
• Free-market examples:
  • Lasik and cosmetic procedures have dropped in price and improved in quality via direct pay/free market dynamics.

Rand Paul’s Co-op Proposal / Association Health Plans (44:45–46:13)

• How it works:

  • Individuals, small businesses, or trade groups join forces (like Costco members) to negotiate as a large pool directly with insurers.
  • Purpose: Achieve large-group insurance prices, better leverage, real competition.
  • Blocked: Efforts at association health plans were stopped by court challenges.

  “If one person negotiated for all 44 million [Costco members] and they bought a group plan ... they would drive prices down by sheer might and leverage.” (Rand Paul, 44:45)

• Further innovations:

  • Guest suggests going further: co-ops could negotiate directly with health systems and cut insurance companies out altogether.

Three Key Steps for Reform (48:17–49:50)

1. Implement meaningful Health Savings Accounts with real consumer power.
2. Enforce transparency rules that work—prices are clear/upfront and patients can choose accordingly.
3. Enable collective bargaining or co-ops (association health plans), and even direct negotiation with hospital systems, bypassing insurers.

• Quote:

  “In cash-based transactions or where consumers directly pay, quality goes up and price comes down ... The insurance payment model is just completely in the way.” (Paul Seegert, 48:17)

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Political Impact & 2026 Midterm Outlook (54:29–end)

• Political preview:
  • Midterms are already shaping up, with Trump on the campaign trail and looming Supreme Court cases expected to impact congressional redistricting.
  • Gruber predicts strong Republican gains, citing economic and legislative factors.
• Closing sentiment: Gruber wishes the audience a Merry Christmas and encourages engagement on these critical health care topics.

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Key Timestamps

• 03:25 – Steve’s Christmas Eve reflection begins
• 05:36 – Rabbi Jonathan Cahn on the symbolism of the shepherds
• 15:40 – Health care segment with Paul Seegert starts
• 16:28 – Seegert’s “insurance is dirtier than Russians” story
• 18:56 – Insurance industry incentives, cost “plus” model explained
• 20:53 – Hospital consolidation, creation of “healthcare deserts”
• 26:50 – Consumer price examples, cash payer savings
• 32:41 – Solution segment: HSAs, co-ops, and true free-market ideas
• 44:45 – Rand Paul outlines Association Health Plans
• 46:13 – Why insurance companies don’t want co-op competition
• 48:17 – Seegert’s three-step plan to fix American health care
• 54:29 – Gruber’s outlook on 2026 elections and national politics

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Notable Quotes

• “Do you ever feel discouraged by your ordinariness? That is exactly the kind of person that God reveals himself to.” – Steve Gruber (06:52)
• “The insurance industry is far dirtier than the Russians.” – Steve Gruber quoting Paul Seegert (16:28)
• “We mostly fight over who's going to pay for something that's broken, not how to fix it.” – Paul Seegert (17:21)
• “In cash-based transactions ... quality goes up and price comes down ... The insurance payment model is just completely in the way.” – Paul Seegert (48:17)
• “If one person negotiated for all 44 million [Costco members] ... they would drive prices down by sheer might and leverage.” – Rand Paul (44:45)

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Summary Takeaways

• Christmas message: Hope and good news are for everyday people, not elites—both spiritually and practically.
• Health care crisis: The U.S. system is plagued by runaway costs, profit-driven insurance companies, and a subsidy loop that doesn’t reward efficiency or consumer power.
• Real-world examples show: When consumers pay directly for care, competition lowers costs and raises quality.
• Potential solutions: Health Savings Accounts, genuine price transparency, collective bargaining co-ops, direct negotiation with providers.
• Political outlook: The state of health care will feature prominently in upcoming 2026 midterm elections, adding urgency to reforms.

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Tone:
Direct, conversational, urgent, and solution-focused—matching the host’s energetic, common-sense style and the expert’s frank analysis.

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This summary delivers the main themes, arguments, and memorable moments so listeners can engage confidently in debates about health care, policy, and the meaning of Christmas in America, even without hearing the full episode.

Transcript

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[Steve Gruber]

Ah, there's always something to make you look around and say, hey, you know what? I live in a pretty great country. President Trump is calm, on point on his game, and unlike the last guy, he is competent and coherent. Come on, man, we're not bending the knee anymore. We're here to take a stand for God and country. This is the Steve Gruber Show. Yes, it is. And Merry Christmas Eve, my friends. A special day. Hope you're able to spend the rest of today and tomorrow with the ones you love focusing on the Christmas story and the real reason. You know me, I'm not shy to call for change where I think it's necessary. But it's also important to remind ourselves of the everyday miracle of life and the good things that God has gifted us. And most importantly, the good news he has for us, for little old ordinary us and me. Chapter 2 in the book of Luke in the Bible tells us about that good news. And no one tells it better than Linus. After Charlie Brown asks what Christmas is all about, Linus says, look, Charlie Brown, it's not about the little tree. It's not about any of that. I actually can't play the clip for you, sadly. But he says it's not about that tree. It's about the birth of Jesus. It's not about the presence and family. Those things are great. They are. But it's about the birth of Jesus. And even Linus has it figured out. That's what Christmas is all about. The good news shared to ordinary people who then share it with others. Yeah, listen to this. And the glory of the Lord shall not. Let's focus on those shepherds for a moment this morning. Shepherds? They weren't royalty. They weren't rabbis. They didn't have the luxury of spending every day in the temple and didn't have the messianic prophecies memorized word for word. But they are who God sent his angel messengers to first they are who he entrusted was sharing the good news to everyone else in Bethlehem. The fact that they were in Bethlehem and they were shepherds is actually significant. Listen to this messianic Rabbi Jonathan Cahn explain the relevance.

[Rabbi Jonathan Cahn]

Bethlehem, if you go there, it's filled with hills and there are still shepherds there. It's a place of shepherds and lambs. And it's without doubt that Bethlehem was a key place to raise the temple lambs. The lamb. Not just lambs, but lambs for the sacrifice. So where would the Lamb of God be born? In the place of the lambs. And not just the lambs, but the sacrificed lambs. You know, the Lamb of God who is the sacrifice lamb is going to be born where the sacrificed lambs are born and who greets the. Who's there when you have the birth of a lamb? The shepherds. They're the ones, they have to be. They're there with a birth. They have to take care of that lamb. They have to make sure everything's right. So who greeted Messiah in Bethlehem? The shepherds. Because he is the lamb and he is the sacrifice lamb. So they were greeting, they were, they would be greeting into the world lambs that were for the sacrifice and so they did for Messiah. And at the same time, who is Messiah? He is the good shepherd. So what's in Bethlehem? The shepherds. And they're there at his birth also because he's the good shepherd. So shepherds greet him as the great shepherd at his birth.

[Steve Gruber]

The good shepherd, capital G, identified that Christmas night with the lowly shepherds, the most ordinary and blue collar of Bethlehem's residents. Do you ever feel discouraged by your ordinariness? Ever feel that you can't affect a change in the world because you might not have the platform, the credentials or the money? I'm here to tell you today that is exactly the kind of person that God reveals himself to. The kind of person who he entrusts with his good news, with the hope that changes lives. There's a lot that can get you discouraged out here in the real world these days. And people don't trust the celebrities or the politicians, the bigwigs to deliver hope anymore. They need the real life truth, the touch of their neighbors, their barbers, their friends and family that bring hope to them. That's you. You have the ability to rest in and deliver that same message that those shepherds did more than 2000 years ago. Glory to God in the highest and on earth, peace, goodwill toward men. Peace, goodwill. That's what we need more of in this world. And Jesus Christ is the only one who can bring lasting peace and goodwill. First, you have to embrace and accept his sacrifice. Then it's up to you and me to share it. His glory meets you where you are, whether it's on the hillside while these dirty, tired shepherds took care of their lambs, or whether it's in your car on the way to work while you ask God for the kind of help that only he can bring. His glory is for you and for me. It's meant to be shared. Sometimes we can lose the message, lose our purpose, when we get too focused on the negative, like these kids who derailed their church's Nativity program. Listen to this.

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[Steve Gruber]

Kids. It's a lot cuter when those kids fight than when we do. Though God used the ordinary, grueling process of childbirth to bring his son to us, he first visited the ordinary, lowly shepherds on that hillside to share the good news, his delights in the ordinary. The apostle Paul shares a message God shared with him in 2 Corinthians 12:9, where he writes, but he said to me, my grace is sufficient for you, for my power is made perfect in weakness. Therefore I will boast all the more gladly about my weaknesses so that Christ's power may rest on me. Do you feel tired or weak this Christmas season? It's in that weakness, that humanity, that Christ says his power is made perfect. Embrace that good news today and share it with the ones you love. Like I said, it's great to share that time with your friends and family, and I want you to do that today. But I also want you to share the good news, maybe pick up the Bible, dust it off, read from Mark, Matthew, Luke and John. Read the Christmas story, read of the immaculate birth of Christ. Share it especially with your kids and your grandkids and those that are troubled today, because this is a message that transcends time. This is a message that transcends time and changes hearts. Sure, presents are great. Our tradition in this house, we open one on Christmas Eve, then the rest on Christmas morning with the family. And that's a wonderful tradition. But we will also do it with the knowledge of who we're celebrating and why. Who we're celebrating and why. It's that hope, that good news that we must remember today and on into this evening. And yes, we can get the updates on Santa Claus flying around the world. It's all fun. It is. It's a magical time of the year. But it's magical because of the birth we celebrate. So my hope for you today is that you accept the good news that you embrace the reason for the season and spend time with those that you love. And if you're struggling today, get on your knees and pray. God bless this season, God bless this country, God bless you for being here. Merry Christmas Eve. I'll take a break and I'll be right back.

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[Trainer Games Narrator]

Ten athletes will face the toughest job interview in fitness that will push past physical and mental breaking points. You are the fittest of the fit. Only one of you will leave here with an IFIT contract worth $250,000.

[Steve Gruber]

This is where mindset comes in.

[Trainer Games Narrator]

Someone will be eliminated.

[Washington Post Advertiser]

Pressure is coming down.

[Public Investing Advertiser]

Trainer Games on Prime Video January 8th Watch the trailer on trainergames.com Season 2.

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Of Unrivaled Basketball is here and the talent is unreal. The best women's players on the planet are running it back with even bigger moments and bigger stakes. Don't miss as Paige Beckers, Nafiza Collier, Kelsey Plumb, Briana Stewart and more take the court and redefine the game. This isn't your regular season. This is unrivaled, where the pace is faster, the energy is higher and every athlete shines. Unrivaled basketball season two, sponsored by Samsung Galaxy, tips off January 5 on TNT, TruTV and HBO.

[Public Investing Advertiser]

Max support for the show comes from Public, the investing platform for those who take it seriously. On public, you can build a multi asset portfolio of stocks, bonds, options, crypto and now generated assets which allow you to turn any idea into an investable index. With AI. It all starts with your prompt. From renewable energy companies with high free cash flow to semiconductor suppliers growing revenue over 20% year over year. You can literally type any prompt and put the AI to work. It screens thousands of stocks, builds a one of a kind index and lets you back test it against the S&P 500. Then you can invest in a few clicks. Generated assets are like EFTs with infinite possibilities, completely customizable and based on your thesis, not someone else's. Go to public.com podcast and earn an uncapped 1% bonus when you transfer your portfolio. That's public.com podcast paid for by Public Investing Brokerage Services by Open to the Public Investing Inc. Member FINRA SIPC Advisory Services by Public Advisors, llc SEC Registered Advisor Generated Assets is an interactive analysis tool. Output is for informational purposes only and is not invested investment recommendation or advice. Complete disclosures [e-mail] Disclosures A new year.

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[Steve Gruber]

It has become the hot topic for sure. That is health care in America. Health care in America has become a huge hot topic. Democrats want to continue to do more of the same. Continue to take your tax dollars to feed the Obamacare monster. Rates go up, the services you get come down. Many people can't afford it. And then they blame Republicans who not one voted for Obamacare in the first place. And here we are. Joining me today is Paul Siegert. He's an employee benefits practice leader at. I've known Paul for a number of years now. He's been on the program. He appeared at a documentary with me a couple of years ago called Flatline. You can find that documentary on healthcare. It's called flatlinefilm.com flatlinefilm.com Paul, welcome back to the program.

[Paul Seegert]

Thanks for having me.

[Steve Gruber]

Nice to see you. It's been a bit. One of the things you said to me that I still chuckle about to this day, you used to work at the nsa. You were a Russian analyst, right? You were a Russian analyst. That's what you did for a living. And then you got into the insurance industry and you said to me one of the first times we met, the insurance industry is far dirtier than the Russians. And that still sits with me. Is it true?

[Paul Seegert]

I think more true today than it was the first time I said it, yes.

[Steve Gruber]

Yeah. So here we are. You've got these lobbyists in the halls of Congress working hard to get these subsidies pushed through. The Democrats want three more years of these Subsidies. Obamacare has been a failure by design, I believe, Paul. But there's no way the Obamacare plan, whatever it is, will function properly now or ever, will it?

[Paul Seegert]

Well, not unless we're willing to borrow hundreds of billions of dollars to subsidize it. I think the thing that's been most ironic to me is to watch how we mostly fight over who's going to pay for something that's broken, not how to fix it. You know, when you look at premiums that are tens of thousands of dollars because we've allowed health care conglomerates to form and other things that we could kind of point to and talk about, we need to fix some of those underlying problems, and we've never addressed really any of them. We just allowed cost to climb and we hide that behind subsidies. We can have people making hundreds of thousands of dollars a year in this country getting subsidies today. In some cases, their whole premium is covered and they can make 2, 3, 4, 5, $600,000 a year. We're in a really crazy place that is absolutely unsustainable.

[Steve Gruber]

Well, I haven't figured out that formula, how to get it all paid for. I don't know how people do that, but there must be some formula, some magic deal to get there. But look, here's the thing. President Trump came out, started talking about health savings accounts. I think that's a good idea because he said, and the Republicans are going to reveal something, I'm told before the end of the month, maybe as soon as this week, but I would guess not quite yet. That would include health savings accounts and possibly co ops that Rand Paul is talking about. We're going to get to that in a minute. But first, the insurance company profits have gone up 1000% in 10 years. 1000%. Because the money that people pay into the government for Obamacare, 20% of that goes straight to the insurance company, doesn't it?

[Paul Seegert]

Right. It's an incentive for cost to go up. If you look at the cost of the health care procedure today versus pre Affordable Care act days, it is higher, and not by a little. When you put them in a Cost plus model, they do far better if an e replacement costs $100,000 than if it costs $20,000. So the incentives are so misaligned that you have a whole system that does better if it's less efficient. You know that the medical loss ratio rule that you're talking about that's part of the Affordable Care act was really never set up to do. Well, if you're an optimist, it wasn't built well, but it's an absolute mess that's driven up costs tremendously. And then these organizations said, well, how can we return even more profit to shareholders? And so we allowed healthcare conglomerates to form. You know, it used to be, as an example, United and Optum were separate companies. Cvs, Caremark and Aetna were three different companies. Express Scripts and Cigna were two different companies. And now you have these conglomerates. We won't let two budget airlines merge because, you know, people might be upset about airfare going up potentially, but we'll allow these healthcare conglomerates to form. And then as a result, premiums are up about 100% in the last 15.

[Steve Gruber]

Years and continuing to sort of.

[Rand Paul]

You know.

[Steve Gruber]

One of the things that I saw, one of the things that I saw when I traveled the country doing that documentary film a couple of years ago, you'd have these big companies come in. They'd buy four hospitals, say, and they'd look at these four hospitals in Tennessee or wherever they might be, and they'd say, okay, these four hospitals are all profitable, but these two are not as profitable. So we're gonna close those two, and the people will go to these other hospitals. But what happens is you lose your emergency room, you lose your obstetrics, you lose your oncology in that community. And what they have proven by doing this, people won't travel that far. People end up dying, don't they?

[Paul Seegert]

That's right. Yeah. We create healthcare deserts because of this consolidation that absolutely have not created better health outcomes. I mean, we've got a disparity between urban and rural areas in health outcomes, in life expectancy, in the name of profit. The experiment is not going well.

[Steve Gruber]

No, the experiment is not going well, and it's coming at the expense of Americans, ordinary Americans, who lose access to health care. I mean, if you have a hospital today and it goes away, then you don't have the ability to get to the emergency room if you're having chest pains. I mean, that's just an easy example. Ers close. One of the first things to go away is labor and delivery. Apparently, that's an expensive part of the hospital. They don't like that. They like surgical centers because that makes a lot of money. Labor and delivery, they don't care for so much. One of the things I want to get to here, Paul, is something you mentioned. You said knee replacement. But whatever the procedure is, some of These procedures have 20 different price points, 100 different price points. Depends on what your insurance is, who's paying how it's getting paid. That's crazy to me.

[Paul Seegert]

Over 150 is actually very common. And then you think about these transparency rules that we put in place as part of the original Affordable Care Act. One of the few parts that I thought could be helpful and they become really unuseful. I mean, so much information. It broke the Internet. You can't as a consumer go on and look at these 150 different prices and wage your way through it. What's even worse is that it really doesn't matter. In the current system, if you tell that hospital that you have insurance, you're going to have to pay whatever the agreed upon amount is. You don't get to negotiate a better price.

[Steve Gruber]

That's your contract. The contract says this. We're going to talk more about the price points and how this is not good for the American consumer as we continue the conversation with Paul Seeger about where we are with health care in America. Paul, sit tight. We'll be right back.

[LG Gram Laptop Advertiser]

Did you know Microsoft has officially ended Support for Windows 10? Upgrade to Windows 11 with an LG Gram laptop? Voted PCMag's Reader's Choice top laptop brand for 2025. Thin and ultra lightweight, the LG Gram keeps you productive anywhere, and Windows 11 gives you access to free security updates and ongoing feature upgrades. Visit LGUSA.com iHeart for great seasonal savings on LG Gram laptops with Windows 11 PC Mag Reader's Choice used with permission. All rights reserved.

[Trainer Games Narrator]

Ten athletes will face the toughest job interview in fitness that will push past physical and mental breaking points. You are the fittest of the fit. Only one of you will leave here with an IFIT contract worth $250,000.

[Steve Gruber]

This is where mindset comes in.

[Trainer Games Narrator]

Someone will be eliminated.

[Washington Post Advertiser]

Pressure is coming down.

[Public Investing Advertiser]

Trainer Games on Prime Video January 8th. Watch the trailer on trainergames.com Season 2.

[Unrivaled Basketball Announcer]

Of Unrivaled Basketball is here, and the talent is unreal. The best women's players on the planet are running it back with even bigger moments and bigger stakes. Don't miss as Paige Becker, Snafeeza Collier, Kelsey Plumb, Brianna Stewart and more take the court and redefine the game. This isn't your regular season. This is unrivaled, where the pace is faster, the energy is higher and every athlete shines. Unrivaled basketball season two, sponsored by Samsung Galaxy, tips off January 5 on TNT, TruTV and HBO.

[Public Investing Advertiser]

Max support for the show comes from Public, the investing platform for those who take it seriously. On Public, you can build a multi asset portfolio of stocks, bonds, options, crypto and now generated assets which allow you to turn any idea into an investable index with AI. It all starts with your prompt. From renewable energy companies with high free cash flow to semiconductor suppliers growing revenue over 20% year over year, you can literally, literally type any prompt and put the AI to work. It screens thousands of stocks, builds a one of a kind index and lets you back test it against the S&P 500. Then you can invest in a few clicks. Generated assets are like EFTs with infinite possibilities, completely customizable and based on your thesis, not someone else's. Go to public.com podcast and earn an uncapped 1% bonus when you transfer your portfolio. That's public.com podcast paid for by Public Investing Brokerage Services by Open to the Public Investing Inc. Member finra SIP Advisory Services by Public Advisors llc. SEC Registered Advisor Generated Assets is an interactive analysis tool. Output is for informational purposes only and is not investment recommendation or advice. Complete disclosures [e-mail] Disclosures A new year.

[Washington Post Advertiser]

Is on the horizon and your 2026 savings start here. Right now. You can access the Washington post for just $2 every four weeks. Head into the new year with six months of savings at the special intro raid. After that, it'll cost $12 every four weeks. Cancel anytime. You'll get unlimited access to trusted journalism that helps you understand the year ahead and the world around you. Now's the perfect time to subscribe because great habits and great savings start together. Go to washingtonpost.com iheart that's washingtonpost.com iheart and start your year informed with the Post.

[Paul Seegert]

Okay, me pillow.

[Steve Gruber]

All right, so transparency. Here's what I don't understand and I'm bringing Paul Segert back in because here's what I don't understand, Paul. If I go to the hospital, an MRI costs whatever an MRI costs. You know, an oil filter costs what it costs. A gallon of gas costs what it costs. But not, not in medicine, not in healthcare. 150 different pricing points for an MRI or a larger procedure. How does that even make sense? And how do they create these bizarre formulas to arrive at this destination?

[Paul Seegert]

That's a negative outcome of the whole insurance payment model. I mean, if you go in there and you are a cash payer today, on average the discount is 80 to 85% of what they're going to charge if you have insurance, which kind of negates the whole purpose of insurance. The idea was that these big insurance companies go out and negotiate Better deals for their customers and therefore they would attract customers because they created value. We've gotten so far away from that. We're in a place now. I just mentioned to you during the break, I had a baby 20 months ago. They thought I had insurance. I was a cash payer. At least that's how I presented. They thought they were going to bill me $28,000. I said, Whoa, whoa, apply the cash discount. The baby ended up costing $2,800 on a credit card. 10% crazy system.

[Steve Gruber]

That's a 90% discount. I'm not great with math, but I can do a 90% discount.

[Paul Seegert]

So crazy.

[Steve Gruber]

So how many people know that?

[Paul Seegert]

I don't think many people do. Yeah, they don't. And that's the challenge. I like the idea of the health savings accounts. We can talk more about that. But as soon as that consumer tells the provider that they have insurance, they're stuck with whatever the negotiated reimbursement agreement is, an amount.

[Steve Gruber]

So real quickly on that point there. $28,000 for the new child, which by the way, is just your down payment. $28,000 that is covered by insurance. Or maybe it's not. So your out of pocket expense could well exceed the $2,800 that you paid as a cash payer. Real quickly, 20 seconds on that.

[Paul Seegert]

Yeah, well, no question it would have because I would have hit my max out of pocket.

[Steve Gruber]

Right.

[Paul Seegert]

When you look at the max out of pockets in these Affordable Care act plans, they go up every year. An individual max out of pocket could be $9,000.

[Steve Gruber]

Doesn't make any sense. All right, Paul, we're going to continue this. We're going to talk about those health savings accounts and the idea of co ops like Costco negotiating for health insurance that Rand Paul's put forth. We'll be right back. It's the Steve Gruber Show.

[LG Gram Laptop Advertiser]

Did you know Microsoft has officially ended Support for Windows 10 upgrade to Windows 11 with an LG Gram laptop? Voted PCMag's Reader's Choice top laptop brand for 2025. Thin and ultra lightweight, the LG Gram keeps you productive anywhere. And Windows 11 gives you access to free security updates and ongoing feature upgrades. Visit LGUSA.com link iheart for great seasonal savings on LG Gram laptops with Windows 11. PCMag reader's choice. Used with permission. All rights reserved.

[Trainer Games Narrator]

Ten athletes will face the toughest job interview in fitness that will push past physical and mental breaking points. You are the fittest of the fit. Only one of you will leave here with an ific contract for $250,000.

[Steve Gruber]

This is where mindset comes in.

[Trainer Games Narrator]

Someone will be eliminated.

[Washington Post Advertiser]

Pressure is coming down.

[Public Investing Advertiser]

Trainer Games on Prime Video January 8th Watch the trailer on trainergames.com Season 2.

[Unrivaled Basketball Announcer]

Of Unrivaled Basketball is here and the talent is unreal. Paige Beckers, Nafiza Collier, Kelsey Plumb, Brianna Stewart and more are back to redefine the game. Unrivaled basketball season two, sponsored by Samsung Galaxy tips off January 5th on TNT, TruTV and HBO.

[Public Investing Advertiser]

Max support for the show comes from Public, the investing platform for those who take it seriously. On Public, you can build a multi asset portfolio of stocks, bonds, options, crypto and now generated assets which allow you to turn any idea into an investable index with AI. It all starts with your prompt. From renewable energy companies with high free cash flow to semiconductor suppliers growing revenue over 20% year over year, you can literally type any prompt and put the AI to work. It screens thousands of stocks, builds a one of a kind index and lets you back test it against the S&P 500. Then you can invest in a few clicks. Generated assets are like EFTs with infinite possibilities, completely customizable and based on your thesis, not someone else's. Go to public.com podcast and earn an uncapped 1% bonus when you transfer your portfolio. That's public.com podcast paid for by Public Investing Brokerage Services by Open to the Public Investing Inc. Member finra S I P C Advisory Services by Public Advisors, llc. SEC Registered Advisor Generated Assets is an interactive analysis tool. Output is for informational purposes only and is not investment recommendation or advice. Complete disclosures [e-mail] Disclosures A new year.

[Washington Post Advertiser]

Is on the horizon and your 2026 savings start here. Right now. You can access the Washington post for just $2 every four weeks. Head into the new year with six months of savings at this special intro rate. After that, it'll cost $12 every four weeks. Cancel anytime. You'll get unlimited access to trusted journalism that helps you understand the year ahead and the world around you. Now's the perfect time to subscribe because great habits and great savings start together. Go to washingtonpost.com iheart that's washingtonpost.com iheart and start your year informed with the Post.

[Steve Gruber]

All right, Paul Segert is an insurance expert, an employee benefits practice leader for Acrisure, and he's been involved in this health care mess for many years now. Paul, let's continue the conversation. I think we both obviously we agree Obamacare doesn't work. I think it was designed to fail to bring us to a single payer system because for some people, they think, well, that's utopia. But then I look at what goes on in the UK or Canada, I'm like, that's no panacea, that's just another mess. But that's where they want to lead us. But let's talk about this country, Obamacare. How do we fix it? What about these health savings accounts? Let's start there.

[Paul Seegert]

Well, we do need to create a system where consumers are rewarded for consuming well. And the system in its current form doesn't do that. We talked a minute ago about the fact that if you have insurance, you don't get to negotiate what you pay. You can't really be a super smart consumer like you can in so many areas. Once you tell the provider that you have insurance, you're going to be billed whatever the agreed upon reimbursement amount is. I think we have to fix that. If you can't consume based on cost and quality, how do you consume? Well, so we need to make that information available and we need to reward consumers when they consume that way. I think the health savings account idea gets us moving in the right direction. But we also have to take this system that's driven up premiums 100%, deductibles 100%, and put 100 million Americans in medical debt. And be honest, that subsidizing all of that with hundreds of billions of dollars of debt doesn't even begin to address that problem.

[Steve Gruber]

You know, going back to what we were talking about as far as one procedure costing 150 different price points, if you put that in front of somebody, you printed it out and put it on a piece of paper said, well, here's what it could cost. It could be $2,800 or it could be $28,000 depending. And then just list out if you have this, this is your. That would be so telling and educational to Americans to go, what the hell. Because I don't think most people realize that. I don't think most people realize the game that's being played on them. I mean, you've got a group of people, the Democrats, who want to extend the Obamacare subsidies for three years. And of course, if you look, the insurance companies, 90% of their political donations go to the Democrat Party. 90%, gee, why is that? Because they continue to subsidize their bottom line, right?

[Paul Seegert]

Yep. Oh yeah, it's allowing them. The biggest winners, clearly. In the Affordable Care act era of healthcare, I think the only winners if we're being honest and just follow the math and the money, the only winners have been large insurers. We're left with four big players who, as you pointed out rightly earlier, have seen their stock price go up 1,000%. And at the same time, we've got 100 million Americans in medical debt. That's not winning for consumers. That's losing. I mean, 100 million Americans in medical debt. What did we do to address that and solve it? We changed credit bureau reporting requirements and rules so that it would be a little bit less obvious. I mean, that to me is a travesty. It should not at all work like that. When we truly have the best health care in the world, people fly here from all over the world to get access.

[Steve Gruber]

That's correct. We have the best payment model. If you can get access. That's exactly right. That's why people come here for knee replacements and open heart surgery and all sorts of things. Because they can't get it in England, they can't get it in Canada. If they do, they have to stand in line for a year. That's the single payer system at work. You stand in line and before you ever get to the head of the line, you drop dead. That's not much of a health care system either. What about health savings accounts? Instead of sending the money to insurance companies, let's start with that idea. You send the money to the people. Does that make sense to you?

[Paul Seegert]

Right? It does make sense. And then we also need to pass some common sense. Now, I'm not a politician, but if I were to thank God, wave a magic wand and say, how do we fix this? We need to create a system where those dollars in that account, people can consume with those effectively. We need to make transparency rules that really work. You know, we have all the technology in the world. It shouldn't be that hard to figure out around town, where can I go to get this MRI that can range in price from 700 to $7,000? Where can I go for the $700 version? And when I consume that, well, why wouldn't the plan reward me for doing that way?

[Steve Gruber]

You know what it makes me think? Okay, it's snowing where I am, right? And it makes me think, yesterday I bought some tires. What do you do when you buy tires? Or what do I do? I call the three different stores that I know. Hey, here are the tires I need, here's the size I need, what do you got? I go with the best price.

[Paul Seegert]

Right?

[Steve Gruber]

That's what you do. If you could do that with healthcare, about any procedure, whatever it might be, or medication, you know, that would be a winner. But we don't have that option right now, do we? I mean, you really don't?

[Paul Seegert]

No, we don't. We don't. Not only is it too complicated, you're not allowed to really do that. If you have insurance, you have to pay what they agreed upon, that we even have cases where in health plans that we manage where the provider bills less than what the agreed upon amount was and we're required to send them more than they build because of how this crazy system works. That does not make sense. We don't have people think capital.

[Steve Gruber]

Wait, wait, wait. You're required to pay more than the bill?

[Paul Seegert]

That's right. If that's the agreed upon amount, that's a crazy system.

[Steve Gruber]

The procedure is 100 bucks. The deal says you'll pay 500. So that extra $400 goes where? To the bottom line?

[Paul Seegert]

Yeah, you got to send it and.

[Steve Gruber]

The shareholders celebrate, right? That's what you're telling me?

[Paul Seegert]

Well, yeah, that's right.

[Steve Gruber]

What a system. Who designed this?

[Paul Seegert]

Yeah, yeah. Well, big insurers have been kind of running point on how all of this works for many, many years. I mean really since pre Affordable Care act days. But it's gotten far worse in the last 15 years.

[Steve Gruber]

It's gotten.

[Paul Seegert]

All these mechanics work.

[Steve Gruber]

Yeah. So let me ask you, it is fixable, right? It is fixable.

[Paul Seegert]

I think it is. We have the smartest minds in the world here and we have all the technology we need. I mean, I have a smartphone sitting in front of me. I can research anything. Now, in the age of AI, this should be imminently solvable if we have the will to do so. You know, I guess if you want to get reelected, it's hard to not vote for perhaps some subsidy extensions. I've seen that some Republicans, and I'm not, you know, necessarily saying I'm on one side or the other by saying this, but they want to do a one year extension. I mean, I guess get it past the midterms or whatever, but when are we going to address the real problem that we've created a system that doesn't allow people to consume? Well, I mean, capitalism is not the problem. We've never actually had. Or free market forces aren't the problem. We've never had free market forces in health care in this country.

[Steve Gruber]

Not in my lifetime.

[Paul Seegert]

In many decades. In many decades. Right, right.

[Steve Gruber]

Not in my lifetime or yours. That's right. Because you've got government regulations, you've got insurance company lobbyists, you've got. And the government's just another problem. You know, the government reimburses hospitals, as I learned in my travels a couple of years ago, but they don't do it well and they certainly don't do it efficiently. And what they offer is a fraction of what it costs. If somebody walks into an emergency room in a rural hospital in the middle of nowhere, the reimbursement might be $25. That doesn't even pay for the nurse for the half hour.

[Paul Seegert]

17, 118, 120% of what they get reimbursed many times just to break even. And so when people go out and say, if we're going to talk about how to solve the problem, and you'll have people that do a lot of math based upon reimbursements, they'll say, hey, a single payer system would cost less. Well, yeah, but the whole system would collapse. These hospitals are going out of business in rural areas and poor urban areas because their payer mix, their customer base is primarily people who have government insurance, Medicare, Medicaid, and that's putting those facilities right out of business. So you cannot use that math or that reference point to say this is how we can fund a single payer system. Unless you just want the whole thing to collapse. It wouldn't work out.

[Steve Gruber]

It's not sustainable, quite clearly. All right, we're going to hear about the co op suggestion, the idea from Rand Paul after the break here so that you have the power to negotiate health savings accounts. Good idea. Some free market in there and maybe co ops. Paul Segart. We'll be right back.

[LG Gram Laptop Advertiser]

Did you know Microsoft has officially ended Support for Windows 10? Upgrade to Windows 11 with an LG Gram laptop? Voted PCMag's reader's choice. Top laptop brand for 2025. Thin and ultra light, lightweight. The LG Gram keeps you productive anywhere. And Windows 11 gives you access to free security updates and ongoing feature upgrades. Visit LGUSA.com iHeart for great seasonal savings on LG Gram laptops with Windows 11 PC Mag Reader's Choice. Used with permission. All rights reserved.

[Trainer Games Narrator]

Ten athletes will face the toughest job interview in fitness that will push past physical and mental breaking points.

[Paul Seegert]

Points.

[Trainer Games Narrator]

You are the fittest of the fit. Only one of you will leave here with an IFIT contract for $250,000.

[Steve Gruber]

This is where mindset comes in.

[Trainer Games Narrator]

Someone will be eliminated.

[Washington Post Advertiser]

Pressure is coming down.

[Public Investing Advertiser]

Trainer Games on Prime Video January 8th. Watch the trailer on trainergames.com Season 2.

[Unrivaled Basketball Announcer]

Of Unrivaled Basketball is here and the talent is unreal. Paige Beckers, Nafiza Collier, Kelsey Plumb, Brianna Stewart and more are back to redefine the game. Unrivaled basketball season two, sponsored by Samsung Galaxy, tips off January 5 on TNT, TruTV and HBO Max support for the.

[Public Investing Advertiser]

Show comes from Public, the investing platform for those who take it seriously. On Public you can build a multi asset portfolio of stocks, bonds, options, crypto and now generated assets which allow you to turn any idea into an investable index with AI. It all starts with your prompt. From renewable energy companies with high free cash flow to semiconductor suppliers growing revenue over 20% year over year, you can literally, literally type any prompt and put the AI to work. It screens thousands of stocks, builds a one of a kind index and lets you back test it against the S&P 500. Then you can invest in a few clicks. Generated assets are like EFTs with infinite possibilities, completely customizable and based on your thesis, not someone else's. Go to public.com podcast and earn an uncapped 1% bonus when you transfer your portfolio. That's public.com podcast paid for by Public Investing Brokerage Services by Open to the Public Investing Inc. Member finra SIP Advisory Services by Public Advisors, llc SEC Registered Advisor Generated Assets is an interactive analysis tool. Output is for informational purposes only and is not investment recommendation or advice. Complete Disclosures available at public.comdisclosures ever wish.

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[Steve Gruber]

All right. In solving the Obamacare problem. It's a problem because medical debt is the leading cause of bankruptcy in America in 2025. It's a sad thing. Paul Seegert is still with us here. Paul, Medical debt is a horrendous thing, but it can be solved. First of all, we have to get rid of Obamacare and replace it with something that works for people. We start with Health Savings Accounts and that would actually build wealth for your child. Your 20 month old child, right? If they had a Health Savings account and they don't use the money and they're young and they're healthy and they don't need the money. It continues to roll over. It can build actual wealth. Maybe they can buy a house. Maybe they can do other things. Maybe they don't feel so disconnected from the American dream. Second part is Rand Paul's idea, which I think is very good, and I want you to hear it directly from him. Rand Paul saying, what we need is the ability to negotiate, and there is strength in numbers. Here he is.

[Rand Paul]

This is an idea I've been talking about for several years, and President Trump has engaged on this idea in his first term. He actually tried to put it in place through an executive order, but the Democrats sued in court and stopped us. Basically, it allows people to buy insurance as a group. So if you're an individual accountant and you have three employees, or you're a landscaper and have four employees, you're a small group. You don't have any leverage to get a better price from big insurance companies. But what if you could join Club Costco? Costco has 44 million members. And if one person negotiated for all 44 and they bought a group plan like Toyota or General Motors does, they would be the largest corporate or largest collective entity in the country. They would drive prices down by sheer might and leverage. In all likelihood, whoever was in charge of the buying group would sit down with the CEO of UnitedHealthcare and Blue Cross, and they were would have to negotiate and they would get things that nobody's been able to get in the past. So this is an idea of letting people join a group like a co op or a collective, to bargain together. And they're called Association Health Plans.

[Steve Gruber]

Association Health Plans. I like his idea here, Paul. And look, even if you had the four big companies, United, Blue Cross, Blue Shield, the top four, the big ones, well, then they would be cutthroat against each other, wouldn't they? That would drive down. It was interesting to hear him say Democrats sued to stop us from doing this. Why would Democrats sue them? To stop the American people from getting a better deal at a better price.

[Paul Seegert]

Well, I think it's not in the interest of insurance companies for this to occur. You know, they're going to do far better dealing directly with each state to set rates for small groups where they tend to get what they want. In terms of increases each year, we're coming off of a fifth. This year is the highest increases in insurance premiums for health care in 15 years. And these insurers can go to the head of insurance for each state and the commissioner or whatever they're called in each state and say, hey, here's our losses, we need an increase, here's how much we need. And get that done with often little pushback, little to no pushback, you know, so it's a much better arrangement.

[Steve Gruber]

We've already covered the fact, Paul, their profits are up 1,000% in just over 10 years. I mean, their profits are in the billions and billions of dollars and they're having losses. I don't see that. I guess I'm missing that part of the balance sheet.

[Paul Seegert]

Yeah, yeah. Well, they're really kind of false losses. You know, it's saying, hey, this, we've created this healthcare conglomerate. We're allowing our owned companies to overcharge each other. For example, the drug benefit, the pharmacy benefit manager is overcharging our health plan, but we own the pharmacy benefit manager and we're allowing that all to occur, which inflates costs. So then we can go to the insurance commissioner and say, look at how much it costs our health plans to buy drugs, even though we're the ones selling the drugs to the health plan at an inflated cost. It's obviously it's a math game that's worked out well for them and not well for anyone else.

[Steve Gruber]

Right, so let's go through. We got about two minutes here. Give me your three steps to fixing health care and coverage in America so we have less money out of pocket and better services. It can be done. You said it's a math game, but I don't want to get gained by the insurance companies. I don't want to get gained by politicians. And there's politicians on both sides playing this game. They get tremendous amount of money for their campaigns from the insurance industry that they're subsidizing through taxpayer dollars. Give me your steps to fixing that.

[Paul Seegert]

Well, I think health savings accounts are one of them. That's a step in the right direction. Another one is transparency rules that really mean something and then allow consumers to consume with those dollars in those health savings accounts. Outside of the arrangement between the insurer and the provider. We have examples of healthcare working quite well. You have to remove the insurance payment model. Primarily look at the cost of Lasik surgery over the last 15 years. Cost has gone down, quality has gone up. Where it's a cash based transaction or a real transaction between a consumer and a provider of a service without an intermediary gumming it up, it works very, very well. Other examples would be cosmetic procedures. You can get a cosmetic procedure today by a very top person in the country. For less than you could 10 years ago. And the quality is as good or better because there's real forces of free market, forces of competition there. We need to bring those forces into our current system and reward consumers for consuming well. And that to me is. That's the rule of government or the role of government is to create good guardrails and rules for engagement between those selling services and those purchasing services. But the insurance payment model is just completely in the way. I like the co op idea. Go a step further. Let that co op negotiate directly with big health systems. Cut the insurer right out of it. You know, they'll on their own get a far better transaction going without.

[Steve Gruber]

That's a pretty good idea right there. Cut the insurance out completely. Go directly to. I'll use Henry Ford Health, the largest in Michigan. You know, there's your health care system and now Blue Cross that services this region of the state of Michigan. Therefore, we're going to negotiate directly with you for services for our patients. Really good idea, Paul. It's been a masterclass here. An education and what's wrong and what can be fixed and it can be fixed. But it does take political will on both sides of the aisle to make this happen. And it's not to continue fleecing taxpayers. Paul, I really appreciate you taking so much time today and walking us through this because you know it so well. Thank you.

[Paul Seegert]

Thank you for having me.

[Steve Gruber]

Really appreciate it. I hope you learned something as well. I did. And that's a pretty good idea to negotiate directly. Not just insurance companies, maybe take them out of the way. Negotiate directly with the health care providers, the big conglomerate hospitals and so forth, or the surgery centers. I'd like your feedback. Send me an email. SteveGruber.com SteveGruber.com Send me an email. What are your thoughts on what we discussed here today? It impacts everybody. It will have political ramifications in November of next year. I'll take a break and come back. It's the Steve Gruber Show.

[LG Gram Laptop Advertiser]

Did you know Microsoft has officially ended Support for Windows 10? Upgrade to Windows 11 with an LG Gram laptop. Voted PCMag's Reader's Choice top laptop brand for 2025. Thin and ultra lightweight, the LG Gram keeps you productive anywhere. And Windows 11 gives you access to free security updates and ongoing feature upgrades. Visit LGUSA.com for great seasonal savings on LG Gram laptops with Windows 11. PCMag reader's choice used with permission. All rights reserved.

[Trainer Games Narrator]

Ten athletes will face the toughest job interview in fitness. That will push past physical and mental breaking points. You are the fittest of the fit. Only one of you will leave here with an IFIT contract for $250,000.

[Steve Gruber]

This is where mindset comes in.

[Trainer Games Narrator]

Someone will be eliminated.

[Washington Post Advertiser]

Pressure is coming down.

[Public Investing Advertiser]

Trainer Games on Prime Video January 8th Watch the trailer on trainergames.com Season 2.

[Unrivaled Basketball Announcer]

Of Unrivaled Basketball is here and the talent is unreal. The best women's players on the planet are running it back with even bigger moments and bigger stakes. Don't miss as Paige Beckers, Nafiza Collier, Kelsey Plum, Brianna Stewart and more take the court and redefine the game. This isn't your regular season. This is unrivaled, where the pace is faster, the energy is higher and every athlete shines. Unrivaled basketball season two, sponsored by Samsung Galaxy, tips off January 5 on TNT, TruTV and HBO.

[Public Investing Advertiser]

Max support for the show comes from Public, the investing platform for those who take it seriously. On public, you can build a multi asset portfolio of stocks, bonds, options, crypto and now generated assets which allow you to turn any idea into an investable index with AI. It all starts with your prompt. From renewable energy companies with high free cash flow to semiconductor suppliers growing revenue over 20% year over year, you can literally type any prompt and put the AI to work. It screens thousands of stocks, builds a one of a kind index and lets you back test it against the S&P 500. Then you can invest in a few clicks. Generated assets are like EFTs with infinite possibilities, completely customizable and based on your thesis, not someone else's. Go to public and earn an uncapped 1% bonus when you transfer your portfolio. That's public.com podcast paid for by Public Investing Brokerage Services by Open to the Public Investing Inc. Member finra, SIPC Advisory Services by Public Advisors, LLC SEC Registered Advisor Generated Assets is an interactive analysis tool. Output is for informational purposes only and is not investment recommendation or advice. Complete disclosures [e-mail] Disclosures A new year.

[Washington Post Advertiser]

Is on the horizon and your 2026 savings start here. Right now you can access the Washington post for just $2 every four weeks. Head into the new year with six months of savings at this special intro rate. After that it'll cost $12 every four weeks. Cancel anytime. You'll get unlimited access to trusted journalism that helps you understand the year ahead and the world around you. Now's the perfect time to subscribe because great habits and great savings start together. Go to washingtonpost.com iheart that's washingtonpost.com iheart and start your year informed with the Post.

[Steve Gruber]

Well, as we run through this Christmas Eve special program of the Steve Guru show, for all intents and purposes, we are on schedule now as the 2026 midterms really are officially underway now. And so as I think about Christmas Eve, I think about Christmas tomorrow and then I think about New Year's just a week from now, which puts us squarely in election season. Donald Trump has taken his show on the road a couple of times now to Pennsylvania, North Carolina. He's going to continue that. Democrats are going to argue that Trump's on the bout and so is he. He's going to put himself fairly squarely on the ballot. He's going to make people decide, do you like a secure border? Do you like inflation below 3%? Do you like the idea that you're going to get $2,000 checks? Do you like the idea that here in the next few weeks people are going to get giant checks for refunds, 11,000 to $20,000, according to Hassett, Kevin Hassett. I mean, these are all very positive things. And so that sets the stage for, for the midterm elections. And of course, you've got a huge decision coming out of the Supreme Court in June about whether or not you can gerrymander based on race. It's a case out of Louisiana. If that goes through in favor of the Republicans, which I believe it will, it's been decided before, that could move a dozen seats in places like Louisiana, Mississippi, Alabama, Tennessee over to the Republican column and other places as well. Meanwhile, states like Ohio, North Carolina, Missouri have already decided to do redistricting, which means more seats coming to the Republicans. The Democrats really could find themselves behind the eight ball in this deal. I think the Senate is safe. I think the Republicans have a chance to pick up two to four seats in the Senate, taking them from 63 to possibly 65 seats because you got states like Georgia, Minnesota, Michigan and New Hampshire all in play. They're all in play. And with a positive economic situation unfolding that'll put the Republicans in the driver's seat. The question is, can they hold the House? They certainly can with redistricting. And of course, a favorable Supreme Court decision would really push the Republicans over the finish line to hold on to Congress and keep Speaker Mike Johnson where he is. All right. We're gonna take a break. I hope you've got your Christmas shopping done because you're basically out of time now. 7 11's open late, though. We'll take a break. We've got two more big hours of the Steve Gruber show still to come.

[LG Gram Laptop Advertiser]

Did you know Microsoft has officially ended Support for Windows 10? Upgrade to Windows 11 with an LG Gram laptop, voted PCMag's reader's choice top laptop brand for 2025. Thin and ultra lightweight, the LG Gram keeps you productive anywhere, and Windows 11 gives you access to free security updates and ongoing feature upgrades. Visit lgusa.com iheart for great seasonal savings on LG Gram laptops with Windows 11. PCMag reader's choice used with permission. All rights reserved.

[Trainer Games Narrator]

Ten athletes will face the toughest job interview in fitness that will push past physical and mental breaking points. You are the fittest of the fit. Only one of you will leave here with an IFIT contract worth $250,000.

[Steve Gruber]

This is where mindset comes in.

[Trainer Games Narrator]

Someone will be eliminated.

[Washington Post Advertiser]

Pressure is coming down.

[Public Investing Advertiser]

Trainer Games on Prime Video January 8th.

[LG Gram Laptop Advertiser]

Watch the trailer on trainergames.com Season 2.

[Unrivaled Basketball Announcer]

Of Unrivaled Basketball is here and the talent is unreal. Paige Beckers, Nafiza Collier, Kelsey Plumb, Brianna Stewart and more are back to redefine the game. Unrivaled basketball season two, sponsored by Samsung Galaxy, tips off January 5 on TNT, TruTV and HBO.

[Public Investing Advertiser]

Max support for the show comes from Public, the investing platform for those who take it seriously. On public you can build a multi asset portfolio of stocks, bonds, options, crypto and now generated assets which allow you to turn any idea into an investable index with AI. It all starts with your prompt. From renewable energy companies with high free cash flow to semiconductor suppliers growing revenue over 20% year over year, you can literally type any prompt and put the AI to work. It screens thousands of stocks, builds a one of a kind index and lets you back test it against the S&P 500. Then you can invest in a few clicks. Generated assets are like EFTs with infinite possibilities, completely customizable and based on your thesis, not someone else's. Go to public.com podcast and earn an uncapped 1% bonus when you transfer your portfolio. That's public.com podcast paid for by Public Investing Brokerage Services by Open to the Public Investing Inc. Member finra SIPC Advisory Services by Public Advisors LLC SEC Registered Advisor Generated Assets is an interactive analysis tool. Output is for informational purposes only and is not investment recommendation or advice. Complete disclosure disclosures [e-mail] Disclosures A new.

[Washington Post Advertiser]

Year is on the horizon and your 2026 savings start here. Right now you can access the Washington post for just $2 every four weeks. Head into the new year with six months of savings at the special intro rate. After that, it'll cost $12 every four weeks. Cancel anytime. You'll get unlimited access to trusted journalism that helps you understand the year ahead and the world around you. Now's the perfect time to subscribe, because great habits and great savings start together. Go to washingtonpost.com iheart that's washingtonpost.com iheart and start your year informed with the Post.

[Unrivaled Basketball Announcer]

This is an iHeart podcast. Guaranteed Human.