He Built a Thriving Business: Now He’s Trading It for Financial Freedom with Rentals

Summary

Episode Summary – Real Estate Rookie, April 6, 2026

Episode: He Built a Thriving Business: Now He’s Trading It for Financial Freedom with Rentals
Hosts: Ashley Kehr & Tony J. Robinson
Guest: Justin (Salon owner & real estate investor, Buffalo, NY)

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Main Theme & Purpose

This episode explores the financial and personal journey of Justin, an experienced salon owner from Buffalo, NY, who is transitioning from his long-standing business into building wealth through real estate, especially with a focus on rentals. The conversation covers Justin's progression from a "house hack" duplex purchase to more strategic, larger investments—including taking on a daunting, dilapidated commercial property. The episode focuses on practical lessons for beginners: starting small, learning as you go, and seeking financial freedom by replacing active business income with real estate passive income. The guests emphasize building a personalized path into real estate, learning from mistakes, and the importance of mentorship and team building.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Justin’s “Why” – From Salon to Rentals

• [00:44] Justin didn’t have a single “aha” moment but gradually realized the need for a more leveraged, time-freedom-focused life as he faced the physical and time limitations of salon work.
  • “Over the last 20 years, particularly the last five years, you start to question, okay, what's down the road?” (Justin, 00:44)

2. The First Deal – A Duplex “House Hack” Spark

• [01:52] Parents advised Justin to buy a double (duplex) instead of a condo, a suggestion that launched his landlord journey.
  • “I didn’t even know what a double was… The whole idea, really what sold me, was I could live there for free and have a tenant pay my entire mortgage and then some.” (Justin, 01:52)
• [03:46] Fortunate early experience with a great tenant made landlording “easy.”
• [05:23] Justin started without real estate community or information overload, which helped him act without analysis paralysis.
  • “Sometimes it’s easier not to be surrounded with an overwhelming amount of information.” (Ashley, 05:24)

Numbers on the First Deal

• [07:06] Bought for $92,000, mortgage ~$600/month, tenant paid $850—cash flow positive right away.
• [08:43] Still owns the property; now worth ~$270,000, rents are $1300/up + $1300/down.
  • Nearly $200,000 in equity built over time.

3. Scaling Up and Strategizing

• [09:26] Second duplex in Kenmore, bought two years later for $148,000, showing quick appreciation in the market.
• [10:18] Justin balanced enjoying his business with planning for a healthy work/life balance. Real estate was a way “to make money while I sleep.”
  • “It wasn’t so much adding something as it was removing too much of a good thing… it’s just not healthy, nor is it something I particularly wanted to do.” (Justin, 10:35)

4. The Proud, Risky Deal – A Mold- and Termite-Infested Commercial Building

• [14:14] Found a vacant building (for 7 years); former pediatrician owned it but neglected everything except the lawn.
• Red flags: Mold, termites, heavy overgrowth—daunting for many, but that kept the price low.
• [17:29] Mold remediation cost ~$2,000; termites ~$1,200—far less than most people fear.
  • “You pay for it. It can be taken care of… It’s not always as expensive as you think it’s going to be.” (Justin, 17:29)

Notable Quote

• “The building doesn’t have mold. This area over here has mold. Let’s remediate that area.” (Justin, 19:54)

Renovation Approach

• [20:49] First major reno. Admits he had no formal scope or budget, just “ignorance and discipline.”
  • Pulled ideas and guidance from an architect.
  • Funded work from salon income, did the reno in stages over a year.

Final Numbers

• [23:43] Purchase: $165,000
  Renovation: ~$97,000 (rounded later to closer to $300,000 total with all factors)
  • Refinanced, appraised at ~$690,000, but only pulled $100k to buy more multifamily—cautiously kept cash flow balanced.
• [26:03] Rented previous salon space for $300 more per month (for 1,000 sq ft) than he now pays to own a 3,000 sq ft building.

5. Learning from Mistakes

• [28:21] Recent “humble pie” deal: Overconfidence led to buying a property with tighter numbers; lost money, but gained lessons.
  • “Take your time. Make sure that it’s… what you are looking for, that the numbers actually work, that you get a better sense of the community.” (Justin, 29:48)
  • Now taps his mentors more and double-checks every deal carefully.

6. Building the Real Estate Team

• [35:59] Relies on:
  • Trusted real estate mentors (“coaches”)
  • A great attorney
  • Reliable realtor
  • Property management team (crucial with a growing portfolio)
  • “If you’re going to do things, first and foremost, get a teacher…because you’re always learning.” (Justin, 35:59)

Finding Mentors

• [37:04] One mentor was a long-time hair client who kept nudging Justin to invest real estate profits.

7. Deal-Finding Strategy & Scaling

• [34:41] Justin says he looks “everywhere”: MLS, off-market, expired listings, mailers, short-term & long-term rentals, even expanding beyond NY.
  • “The wider your net, the more you’re going to catch… And that has a huge effect.” (Justin, 34:41)

8. Future Goals & Financial Freedom

• [37:57] Currently ~40% of the way to matching his salon income with rental cash flow.
  • Aims to diversify into short-term rentals outside New York for higher returns, actively looking and networking to build that next stage.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• “When things did go wrong, I had to make sure I had the funds to be able to call somebody to take care of those things properly. And not me YouTubing everything that I have no idea how to do.” (Justin, 02:38)
• “You really need to maybe inch your way along and segregate what you like and don’t like… there’s so much out there.” (Justin, 05:52)
• “I wasn’t forecasting what the equity was going to be… I was mainly looking for a place I could run my business out of that was affordable.” (Justin, 25:24)
• “Every time I do something that does scare me or that is pushing me a little more forward… I can’t be afraid. I got to do it.” (Justin, 27:23)
• “Take your time… get a better sense of the community… I would definitely tap everybody that I can.” (Justin, 29:48)

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Important Timestamps

• 00:44 – Justin’s “why” – The gradual push out of the salon and towards time freedom.
• 01:52 – Parental advice leads to first duplex.
• 07:06 – First deal numbers; immediate positive cash flow.
• 08:46 – Appreciation and current value of the first property.
• 10:35 – Why Justin added real estate: needing time, not just more business.
• 14:14 – Commercial deal: finding, funding, and facing big problems.
• 17:29 – Mold & termite costs breakdown; busting myths on renovation fears.
• 23:43 – Full numbers breakdown on the commercial deal; refinance strategy.
• 28:31 – The “humble pie” bad deal and learning from mistakes.
• 34:41 – Justin’s current deal-finding strategies.
• 37:57 – How close Justin is to reaching his passive income goal and next steps.

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Tone and Language

The episode maintains a warm, approachable, “rookie-level” tone, with all three participants encouraging transparency about mistakes, fears, and hesitations. Practical advice is grounded in real numbers and tangible takeaways, making the lessons extremely accessible for new investors. The focus is on learning, progress, and asking questions—rather than claiming overnight success or pretending there’s one right way.

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Takeaways for Listeners

• Start with what you know and need; don't be afraid to listen to others' good advice—even if you don't understand everything at first.
• Don’t be intimidated by fixer-uppers—get real quotes on scary issues before deciding to walk away.
• Build a solid team and find mentors you trust.
• It’s okay to make mistakes—just make sure you actually learn from them and tweak your approach next time.
• Diversification, persistence, and “wider nets” are key to growing your portfolio, even if your initial deals are driven by “personal need.”
• Progress toward financial freedom is a marathon, not a sprint—track your numbers and have a clear target like Justin’s (matching his business income with rentals).

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For listeners new to real estate:
This episode is a reassuring blueprint for trading active, time-bound businesses for the flexibility and power of rental properties—mistakes, fears, and all.

Transcript

[A]

Hey, everyone. Welcome to the Real Estate Rookie Podcast. I'm Ashley Kerr, and I'm joined with my co host, Tony J. Robinson.

[B]

Today we have a really special guest coming out of Buffalo, New York, a guy who's been cutting hair for over 20 years, runs his own salon, and somewhere along the way decided that real estate was going to be his exit ramp from trading time for money. Justin, welcome to the Real Estate Rookie Podcast.

[C]

Thank you so much for having me.

[D]

I'm thrilled to be here.

[A]

Well, Justin, I love your story because you're still in the thick of it. You haven't quit your day job yet. So before we get into the details of your journey, I want to know what was the moment where you looked in the mirror and said, I have to build something outside of the salon?

[C]

The first thing was understanding that you can't do everything right and that there seems to be a shelf life, particularly in the beauty industry where, you know, you're on your feet a lot. And I've been doing this for 20 years, and I'm fortunate to still feel good physically about it. But I think that as you look towards the future and you want to be able to pull back, you're either pulling back to spend more time on things that you enjoy, like your family activities, things like that. I think that you start to analyze, okay, what can I get into? What can I divest into that's going to give me more freedom and more time? So I'm not sure if it was a particular moment, but I think that over the last 20 years, particularly the last five years, that you start to question, okay, what's down the road? Right? So I don't think it was a particular moment, but I think it was a culmination of leading up to that.

[B]

All right, but, Justin, take us back. Right? I want to go all the way back to 26. You're renting an apartment, your parents drive. Drop a piece of advice that really kind of changes everything for you. What did they say and why did you actually listen?

[C]

Well, first of all, my parents are amazing people. And, you know, I think that when you are fortunate enough to have that, you, you, you lean into them because they're there. I was renting an apartment, and my first thought was, oh, I, you know, I like. I still do. I mean, I like the apartment condo type of living. And when I was paying rent in an apartment, I thought, okay, maybe I should buy a condo and put my money there. And my parents wisely said, what about a double? And I didn't even know what they were talking about. I didn't even know what a double was. I thought they meant like a double wide. I was confused. A double. So when I was living in the city of Buffalo, the area that I was living in called the Elmwood Village, it was gaining a lot of traction and things were getting expensive. So there is an area a little north of where I was living called North Buffalo, and there was a double there that I went to look at. And the whole idea really what sold me was I could live there for free and have a tenant pay my entire mortgage and then some. I mean, it's. Of course, it certainly meant taking on the role of a landlord at the time, which, you know, kind of sink or swim. Just throw yourself in and see what happens, right? And you're also, I might add, that you're speaking to someone who. I barely know how to swing a hammer. So when things did go wrong, I had to make sure I had the funds to be able to call somebody to take care of those things properly. And not me. YouTubing Everything that I have no idea how to do.

[B]

I mean, what awesome advice from your parents to, you know, early on in your career to have you kind of lay that. That solid financial foundation. Now at 26, I mean, you know, I think about me at 26, I was like a couple of years out of college. I was still very much trying to figure life out. But you're like managing a tenant, right? Like you're a landlord at 26. What was that experience like for you going into landlord for the first time, especially being that they were your neighbors.

[C]

The experience, to be honest with you, was. Was easy slash easy because she was a wonderful tenant, right? I. And I was able to. When I bought the house, it was empty, so I was able to screen people come in interview. And she was a great person, a great woman. And it made the. It made the being a landlord, I mean, looking back now, really easy. One critical mistake I made was trying to save money. I didn't hire a plow service and I didn't get a snowplow. And I remember like our first major storm. She was like, is the plow coming? And I'm like, I don't know if they're coming. I didn't get one. And that was a problem. But, you know, as. As that parlayed into more properties, all of a sudden, you know, the problems compounded because it wasn't like, can you fix my, you know, can you call

[E]

someone to fix this?

[C]

The furnace isn't working where it Was like, maybe I've got four of those phone calls now or five of those phone calls now, or it was just. At the time, it was just myself. It was, it was much easier. So fortunately, the transition of sliding into being a landlord at the time, it wasn't terrible really. But again, that's. I was very fortunate for that.

[A]

That was like on my very first property, I forgot to add in when I ran the numbers snow plowing and didn't account for it. And then it was, oh, time for snow plowing. That's actually a good chunk of the cash flow that's gone now. But I think one thing too that I've noticed is that you probably hadn't heard of bigger pockets. You probably weren't involved in any real estate community or networking when you got this duplex. Is that correct?

[C]

You are correct, yes.

[A]

I think that sometimes it's easier not to be surrounded with an overwhelming amount of information. And that's what puts a lot of people into analysis paralysis. Where if you're not even exposed to all of the different ways that you can invest in real estate, all of the different ways you can fund the deal, all the different ways you can property management, you know, like, it's almost easier to get started because you're not overwhelmed with information when you're first starting for sure.

[C]

And it's scary too. Like, I'm afraid now in 2026, I'm afraid to be on social media and be like, oh, look at this short term rental. And you know, Austin, Texas. And I click on it and then the whole night I'm inundated with short term rentals coming at me and it's like there is an analysis paralysis there because there's. And it's, it's a double edged sword, right? There's so much information out there. It's so good. And you know, obviously biggerpockets being one of the, my main sources, but I think that you really need to maybe inch your way along and segregate what you like and what you don't like in terms of a pocket. Because to your point, there's so much out there.

[B]

Yeah, you bring up a good point, Asher. Like we are not in an age where we have a lack of information. If anything, I feel like what probably holds most rookies back is a lack of execution, right? Maybe a lack of dedication. But like the information, it literally exists everywhere, right? But just maybe having the discipline to jump in and make things happen. But for you, Justin, you did. And I guess I'm curious. I mean, Your first deal was a house hack. It sounds like you got a great tenant. The goal was to maybe not necessarily be paying rent. So if you recall, what were the numbers on. On that first house? Act like, what, what was your mortgage and what were you actually collecting in rent and what were you paying to live there?

[C]

I mean, Ashley being from Western New York, she's going to cringe when I say this, right. But I bought a double in North Buffalo for $92,000. And then that was 16 years ago, and it was $92,000. I want to say my mortgage, you know, principal tax, everything was. Insurance was around $600, and my tenant was paying me, I think 850 at the time. Wow. I know, it was amazing.

[A]

That's pretty good rent for that long ago.

[C]

I know that's right. And I think I just, honestly, I think I just threw a number out there and she was like, okay, like, okay, let's take it. Let's do it.

[B]

I mean, but that, like, that's a perfect house because for a lot of folks, the goal is just to maybe subsidize part of their living expenses. But you, with just one other unit, you were cash flow positive on, on your mortgage. Right. Obviously you said other expenses there, but like, your rent was covering your actual cost of ownership. So that is like a home run. First house hack. Yeah.

[C]

And again, it was nothing. It wasn't, you know, to be totally transparent, it was nothing. Me forecasting, like, oh, this is great. I studied all this. I know what I'm doing. I know I didn't know anything. And I got very fortunate that that's the way it worked out. And then, you know, that was what, 2015, 2014, whatever it was. Well, it can't be right longer than that. And then that area started to grow and you started. Then I started to do a little more research and understand the appreciation that was going on around me. So, yes, to your point, I was, I was very fortunate for that.

[A]

Do you still have that property or did you end up selling it?

[C]

Nope, I still have it. I still have it. Yep.

[A]

What do you think it's worth today?

[C]

I just did an analysis on it, and I want to say it's worth like 270, if I'm not mistaken.

[A]

So like almost 200,000 in equity built up over.

[C]

Yeah, which is, which is great. And I did do a refinance on that property about three years ago to buy another one. But. But as it sits right now, I want to say it's around 270 and

[A]

have you raised the rents at all? And what are the rents at currently?

[C]

The rents are 1300 for upper and 1300 for lower.

[B]

That is great.

[A]

So now that you did your first deal, what does the rest of the timeline look like? How long until you got that second and kind of tell us what that deal looked like?

[C]

The rest of the timeline. I lived there for a couple of years before I started to explore other. Other real estate purchases. And then I ended up primarily focusing on multifamily because of the return on the initial investment. So then they were there for a couple of years, and then I bought another double in Kenmore, which is about 10 minutes north of North Buffalo. And that was another multifamily, another double, and then that one, I want to say. So two years later, I bought a double and it was already 148,000. Right. So it's almost the same square footage. It was a little better of an area, but I already paid then I was. I had paid $60,000 more two years later for another double, basically the same size. So. And it showed you right where the. The market was going at that time.

[B]

Justin, let's talk a little bit about the. The mental side, or you. You said your mental state before. Real estate was great, but clearly something was missing. How did you. How did you hold both of those things at once? Loving what you do in your business, being, you know, what I. Running your salon, but also knowing you needed something more.

[C]

I don't know if it was needing something more as it was taking a step back from the beauty industry itself. I. I've started. I've been in the beauty industry 20 years. I started my own business 15 years ago, and I love it, don't get me wrong. But as you grow in life, and I have a wife, beautiful, wonderful wife, I have two beautiful, healthy children, you start to understand that there's more to life than standing behind a chair cutting people's hair and doing that, which I love to do. So it wasn't so much adding something as it was removing too much of a good thing. Building a business, as both of you know, well, it takes a lot. And the sustainability of working 55 hours a week with a wife and children, it's just not healthy, nor is it something I particularly wanted to do. And of course, as many people know, as you start to take a step back from your business, you inevitably lose a little capital that's coming because you're not working. So it was more about how can I supplement but also make money while I sleep. If you will and start to make my money work for me versus in addition to, you know, putting in the stock market and things like that.

[A]

We're going to take a quick break, but when we come back we're going to talk about a building that Justin bought that was vacant for seven years that had mold, termites and so much more wrong with it. We'll be right back after a word from our show sponsors.

[D]

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[E]

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[A]

go into the deal that you're most Proud of. So this is a commercial building that has been sitting vacant for seven years with mold, termites, the whole thing. So walk us through that. From the very beginning. How did you find this deal and what made you say yes? Despite. Despite all of these red flags, I was.

[C]

So when I first left the salon I was. Started my career at, I was renting the space, and I was in that space for five years. And the, you know, you. You. Obviously, it's much better to own than it is to rent. So I started to toy around with the idea of I should buy something and put my, you know, put the money to work that way. The. The hard thing about the. The town that I'm in is, you know, a lot of the buildings were very expensive to buy, and it was out of my. My price range for sure. And then I happened to be driving along this main road where I live, and there was a building, a big giant for sale sign. And when I looked to the left, it was like, I couldn't imagine why anybody would want to buy this building. It was terrible. So then I looked it up, and I thought, oh, and I saw the sale price. I was like, okay, I'll go take a look. So when I reached out to the realtor and when we went to look at it and that gentleman opened the door to go into the building, the smell of mold, it was like a punch in the face. Like, I. How can this building be standing? Right? So the backstory of the building is the gentleman who owned it prior to me was a doctor, a pediatric doctor, and he owned it for quite some time. And when I spoke to him about why he was selling, he said, he loves being a doctor. He didn't love being a business owner. And one thing after another, he just didn't want to maintain the building. And he wanted to be. To go to the hospital and just work and not be responsible for everything around him. So he literally. He had a water leak in the building. He fixed that. He shut the doors, and literally the only thing for seven years he maintained on the building was cutting the lawn because he had to.

[A]

So he didn't get a fine.

[C]

Yeah, exactly. He didn't want to get a fine. Most people. It's weird, most people didn't even know the building was here because I had taken down so many trees and overgrown bushes, and I think I took down, like, five trees in the front lawn alone. So once we kind of got a clear view of what the cost was going to be, then it was diving in and finding contractors and working with the town to get approval of everything. And we went from there and the rehab, because I kind of meal pieced everything together. The rehab took about a year because I was funding it out of my own pocket. I didn't want to take out any loans or anything. So that took about a year. But it was the smartest way to do it financially and probably the only way to do it for me at the time.

[A]

Before we get into the details of the numbers on the deal, I wanted to ask specifically about the mold remediation and the termite extermination. So what were the costs for those two things? Because I think those are like big scary things that people say, like, no, I don't want to deal with that. But what were the actual expenses to take care of those issues?

[C]

Yeah, well, so when there was a water, there was a crawl space underneath the building. And the previous owner, he did a really good job of getting rid of the mold or the water that was in the crawl space and drying it out. So it wasn't a terrible cost. I want to say the mold remediation for the area that needed to be done was around $2000. And then the termite cost was about 1200. It wasn't terrible. The only reason it was not bad was because he took care of the crawl space. But then where the water had risen to where the drywall sat, he cut out most of it, not all of it. Right. So if a piece of drywall got wet, he didn't make a flush line, get rid of where the moldy was. He kind of chopped into a little bit. So the mold that was left started to move up the wall and that's where it would start to grow. I mean, you know, having the experience, you know, compared to speaking to some people I have now mold termites. I mean, that's why these companies exist. You, you know, you pay for it. It can be taken care of. Right? Everybody. You look at houses on Zillow, whether it's mold or foundation, like I don't want to touch that. But you know, Google mold remediation. There's 10,000 companies that can do it. You just got to pay for it. Unfortunately.

[A]

Yeah, I've had several houses that I've purchased with mold and it is never as expensive as I think it's going to be. We did a whole, I think it was a 1500 square foot house. The whole house remediation, $5000. So like it's. I think you like before you're. If you're listening to this and you're afraid of an issue, a foundation issue. You're afraid, afraid of this, afraid of that, like actually figure out how much it costs. And like Justin, in your sense, like, you know, the 2000. The what? The what? Was the termite one, like, less than 2000, right?

[C]

It was like 1200.

[A]

Yeah, yeah. So, you know, but that's not that bad for when somebody maybe was first listening to this episode and thinking like, oh, my God, mold, termite. That's gonna be $20,000 to think. And that's used to be. What I would think also is that these are really, really big expenses. And that's. So, you know, do your research and get somebody in there to actually quote something out for you before you say no to a property because of just these issues that you think are going to be expensive, but they might not be.

[C]

And it's not to your point. It's not always right. Somebody will say, oh, the house has mold. Or the building that we bought has mold. No, the building doesn't have mold. This area over here has mold. Let's remediate that area. And that's how it was with the termites. There was an area where they were just eating everything. So my whole building wasn't infested. It was like a quarter of the building that they got rid of all that wood and then, you know, fumigated and whatnot. So to your point. Yeah. I mean, it's not. I don't think it's ever as expensive as you think it's going to be, particularly if you're like me and you blow up the number in your head, like, ridiculously, you're always pleased when it's like two grand, like, great. I thought it was going to be, you know, I was going to be half a million, but now it's two grand.

[B]

But, Justin, going into this deal, had you already handled, like, pretty heavy renovations in the past or was this really your first? Like, was this like the biggest renovation project you've done up until that point?

[C]

No, no. I mean, this was, you know, the renovations that we have done or contracted out to do were on our investment property, the first one that we bought. And those were, you know, bathrooms, floor, you know, hardwood floor being refinished, things like that. So this was, to me, this was major. It was major to look at an entire building and okay, how. Where do I begin? And so it was. This was the first.

[B]

Yeah, well, that's my question, right? Is like, where did you begin? How do you. Once you walk into that building, you're getting punched in the face by the mold. How do you start to put together what a potential scope of work looks like and the budget for that before you actually close on the deal? Because I think where a lot of rookies make the mistake is that they. They don't do enough due diligence during their closing timeframe. And then once they actually close, that's where the rehab budget really starts to. To balloon. So how did you avoid that from happening on this deal? Or maybe it did. And if. If so, what were the lessons you learned there?

[C]

I think I avoided it by ignorance, honestly. I bought the building and had no idea of the renovation costs.

[A]

So you didn't even have a budget to go over a budget on, is what you're saying? Yeah, yeah, exactly.

[C]

What I did, though, is I didn't want. I didn't want somebody else to get the building. Right. So a little negotiation of the cost or the price and that was it. I didn't want someone else to get because I knew it was going to be a great find and a great deal if I could get it. And I think for me personally, I'm very good with discipline with numbers and money and things of that nature. So it wasn't so much about like, okay, let's dive into the renovation cost. This is projected. I didn't even know what that meant at the time. For me, it was about, how much am I going to have to work over the next year behind the chair, and how much can I extract from that to have my life and also fund this rehab of the building? So that's. And then the first. The first thing I did was I met with an architect who was referred to me who really kind of became, you know, a beacon to say, okay, this is what we're going to do,

[A]

you know, and you said that, you know, you had to figure out how much hair you had to cut and stuff to, you know, figure out to pull money out of the business to pay for this. All I could think of was Edward Scissors Hands just, you know, going through it. But Pony probably never saw that movie either, did you?

[B]

I actually, funny enough, we just rewatched Ezra Scissorhands this past year, so I'm with you on that one.

[A]

But let's break down the numbers on that deal. So what was the purchase price? What was the rehab cost when you were all done, and what are you renting it out for now, and did you end up refinancing it or anything?

[C]

Yes. So the purchase price on the property was 165, 165,000. A renovation cost rounded up close to about 96,000, all said and done. And I had refinanced about two years ago, and I didn't pull out all of the equity I had in there. The refinance price, they valued my building now at around 690,000, but I only pulled out 100 because I then was purchasing two more multifamily. So I still had obviously, equity in the building, but I didn't feel as though I needed to, to, to pull it all out. And to be honest with you, I didn't pull it all out because I, I didn't want my payment here at a balloon higher.

[B]

Justin, can you just repeat those numbers again? So your purchase price and your renovation cost for how much?

[C]

Purchase price is 165,000. And the renovation cost was 97,000.

[B]

Okay, so you're, you're all in for. Just call it like 270k, right? If we round up, add a little rounding there.

[C]

Yeah, but it's probably more like 2 3rd or it's probably more like 300. I would say closer to 300.

[B]

Okay, call it 300. You said it appraised for 6, 670. 6, 70. Man, that, that is an amazing deal to be all in at three and appraised for almost seven. So you were right. I mean, you said you didn't really know what the budget was going to be, but you had a gut feeling that it was actually going to turn out in your favor. How, how do you, like, why do you think you were right? Because that's, it's a big guess. But you were, you were right. Like, what were you seeing that actually gave you the confidence that you would have so much equity in that deal?

[C]

Well, again, you know, I want to be transparent with everyone that's going to watch this that I didn't, I wasn't forecasting what the equity was going to be. That wasn't what it was about because I didn't even know what that meant at the time. I was mainly looking for a place that I could run my business out of that was affordable. Right. And to show you how expensive this area can be, the rent that I was paying in a thousand square foot space in the village where I was working was $300 more a month than it is for me to own this entire 3,000 square foot building.

[A]

Oh, my gosh. Wow.

[C]

I know. But again, you know, I was very fortunate. The only thing that gave me hope, that was a little bit of insight, was if this building is a complete disaster. And it's $165,000. The ones that I can't afford right now that are down the street, they're selling for five and six hundred thousand. Right? Like, why wouldn't mine be like that? If I make it just as nice or almost as nice. That was the only thing I was going on. Truly, like that was it.

[B]

Justin, I think I'm seeing a theme though in your story. Like even going back to your first house hack, a lot of your investing is just driven by personal need, maybe is the right phrasing, but it's like you needed a place to live and you're like, hey, maybe instead of renting the place, I'll just buy a place and have someone else move in and do it with me. And then you basically did the same thing on this first commercial deal. It's like, I mean, I need a place to rent for my business. It might be better if I just go buy something and have some other people share in that cost with me. And it's like you're using house hacking, but you also applied it to a commercial situation which we haven't seen all that often here on the Ricky podcast. So I, I just, you know, I just love that approach because again, in a worst case scenario, even if you didn't rent out the other space, you're still spitting less on a monthly basis than what you were renting it from someone else. So it still works for you. So it's just an interesting concept in general about the, the personal use component.

[C]

Well, I think it's. Thank you. I mean, I think it's based on need, right? I mean, I needed a place to live, you know, I wanted to own something. But I'm, you know, you talk to any business owner, any entrepreneur, and you know, I'll be the first to admit I, I'm afraid to fail at anything. Right? I mean, I'm. When you buy a house or you buy an investment property or, you know, I, I follow both of you on social media when you guys are doing things. I mean, maybe you're not scared anymore, but at some point you were. And I am afraid of doing things, I'm afraid of buying a property. But I know I want to do it and I know that I gotta kind of man up and do it, but I'm, I'm afraid to not be successful in life, to be honest with you. And I feel like every time I do something that does scare me or that is pushing me a little more forward to whatever that successful may Be. I don't know. But, you know, if I want to get where Tony is and I want to get where Ashley is, I can't be afraid. I got to do it.

[A]

Well, Justin, isn't there a deal you're working on right now that is actually proving to be more difficult and challenging than you expected? Tell us about that deal.

[C]

Yeah, that is a nice piece of humble pie.

[A]

We've all been there, trust me.

[C]

You know, you get a little bit of a sense of, oh, that's how this works. Oh, okay, let's just buy this one, too. Let's do that, too. And, you know, I think that I wasn't focused on the numbers and what they should have been. It was more focused on, you know, this is. This, this. This will work. The other ones have worked. Why wouldn't this one? And it just. The numbers were too tight, and it was. It was an error. Right? It was something I should have been more aware of. And it's a lesson. And it sucks. Like, you know, you're. You're losing money. You're. It's taking your attention. Fortunately, I have, you know, a property management team for all the properties, and they deal with the bulk of it.

[E]

But it's a mistake.

[C]

You know, it's going to end up costing me money in the long run. But I Learned a lot. 100%. I learned a lot.

[B]

Justin, you said you learned a lot. What, what were some of those lessons that came out of this deal? Because I, you know, I, you know, I was always taught, like, you never want to waste a good mistake. Right? You know, or you never want to waste a good failure. Right? There's always something to be learned from it. So what. What were those things that you learned from this deal that you'll take into your. The future of your portfolio?

[C]

Take your time. Make sure that it's. It's what you are looking for, that the numbers actually work, that you get a better sense of the community around said property and what's going on there. It's not just about how a property looks. It's also about how the property looks from the outside in. Right? What am I seeing around the neighborhood that is good and bad? Basically, I would say take your time and make sure that you. I have. I have a few people in my life in terms of real estate that I trust that I can say, hey, what do you think about this? And I think I needed to tap those shoulders in the future. I would definitely tap everybody that I can.

[B]

All right, after the break, Justin's going to break down exactly how he's finding deals today, expired listings, off market contacts and why, he says the longer you wait, the more expensive everything gets. We'll be right back after a word from today's show sponsors.

[E]

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[A]

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[B]

All right, we're back here and Justin, we talked a little bit about you know the, the mistakes and the learning and the, the trials and the successes. But I want to talk a little bit more about your portfolio today and how you're finding deals. So you mentioned expired MLS listings and, and off market broker just maybe break down. For someone who's never done even like a burr deal, what does your pipeline actually look like on a, on a week to week basis?

[C]

I'm sorry, between what?

[B]

Just on, on a week, like on a day to day basis. Like what is your, what does your pipeline look like for, for deal flow?

[C]

For deal finding?

[B]

Yeah, yeah, like your pipeline for deals.

[C]

You know I have a realtor that I work with regularly and I think that I. You have to be open to everything and anything. Right? Like, I mean I'm on a lot of different mailers. I'm on Zillow, I'm on bigger pockets. I'm starting to narrow where I'm looking for properties and it's not necessarily New York State anymore. I'm starting to look elsewhere for various reasons. I'm starting to look at short term rentals versus long term rentals. I mean my pipeline every day is, is a lot and I think that, I think that's okay. People tend to only focus on foreclosures or MLS listings or Private deals. I mean, if it's, if the numbers work, I'll look at everything, at anything. But I think at the end of the day, the wider your net, the more you're going to catch. And I also, you know, you try to make friends, you try to connect with people in the real estate world. And that has a huge effect. Huge effect. I've met a lot of people through, through biggerpockets or through social meetups locally for real estate. And that's fantastic, really is.

[A]

What about building your team in Buffalo? Who have you added? You mentioned you had a property management company. Are there other team members that you rely on to walk you through your deals and get the deals done?

[C]

For sure. When I first started this process of on my own, I had two multifamily. And we've grown since then. But since those two initial properties and my building, what we bought after that, I had two gentlemen who I work with closely here, and I would, I would more or less call them real estate coaches who have been able to kind of navigate me in the different sectors and how to buy and what's good and what's not good. So I rely on them a lot. And then I have a great real estate attorney who handles all my purchases. And whenever we're selling a property and things like that, and a realtor. And of course, you know, the backbone would be the property management company that takes care of the. All those things. So I think that if you're going to do things, first and foremost, get a teacher, get someone that can educate you because you're always learning. A good lawyer and a property management team if you need one, which would be helpful.

[B]

Justin, how did you find, you know, you said there's two people who you consider like your mentors. How did you find them? How did you build that connection with them?

[C]

One of them, I had been cutting his hair for about 10 years and he had sat in my chair in the salon. And he, you know, he was constantly saying to me, you know, you. You have this money sitting here in this building and you're not doing anything with it. And I didn't really know what that meant. And then back to Ashley's question, where it was, you know, what was that moment? I guess the moment when I reached out to him on a professional level, not as a Silas, was, you know, I'm feeling burnt out at the salon. I need to start investing and divesting so I can take a step back. So that's how I met him. And he works with a gentleman who is his business partner. And that's how that relationship began.

[B]

All right, Justin, last big question before we close out here. You said your goal is to match your salon income from real estate so you can have just true time freedom. How close are you to that goal and what does maybe like the next 12 to 24 months look like for you to try and make progress against that?

[C]

How close am I to that goal? I would say I'm about 40% there, 35 to 40% there. So I'm almost halfway the next. The future for me, I think is not in New York State. It's probably in different areas in short term rentals. From what I've been reading about, I've already started to to reach out to real estate professionals and other areas of the country to look into short term rentals because I think that there is first of all, when you look at the numbers, some of the numbers seem a lot better in short term rentals than they do long term rentals. And I think.

[B]

Hey rookies, if you're watching this, we want you to apply to be a guest on the Real Estate Rookie Podcast. That's right. Ashley and I are looking for amazing stories just like yours to be a part of our Real Estate Rookie Podcast. Now look, you don't need to be an expert. You don't need to have done thousands of deals. Even if you've done one deal, your story could help inspire the next listener

[A]

as a rookie investor. Especially if you just got your first deal. It is all fresh in your minds and you are the best person to tell your story. Give your experience on how you got it done to help someone else get their first deal.

[B]

So head over to biggerpockets.com guest if you want to be a part of our show again, that's biggerpockets.com guest and we'd love to have you on.

[C]

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