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The BEST Ways to Find “Rare” Off-Market Real Estate Deals in 2025 (Rookie Reply)
00:34:23
Are great real estate deals gone for good? Not so fast! High interest rates, inflated home prices, and low inventory have made things difficult for investors, but by looking beyond the multiple listing service (MLS), you could uncover off-market properties that fly under the radar. In today’s episode, we’ll show you how! Welcome back to another Rookie Reply! If you’re struggling to make the numbers work in today’s housing market, you’re not alone! Tune in to learn how we find “rare” rental properties that are either undervalued or overlooked. Not sure where to start your investing journey? We’ll share three key factors that will help you narrow down your options and pinpoint the best real estate market for you. Stick around till the end as we discuss lease renewals, tenant turnover, and how to deal with a renter whose financial situation has changed! Looking to invest? Need answers? Ask your question here!
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- [00:00]
Ashley Kerr
Let's get your questions answered. I'm Ashley Kerr and I'm here with Tony J. Robinson.
- [00:11]
Tony J. Robinson
And welcome to the Real Estate Ricky podcast where every week, three times a week, we bring you the inspiration, motivation and stories you need to hear to kickstart your investing journey. And today we are diving into the Bigger Pockets forums to get your questions answered. And guys, the forums with the absolute best place to go as a rookie to get all of your real estate investing questions answered from experts like myself, like Ashley, and so many more from the BP community. So today we're going to discuss first, how to find off market deals, a big thing in today's market with supply being a little bit constrained. Second, we'll talk about what market research you should do before investing. And finally we'll talk about the best ways to handle updating lease agreements. So with that, let's get into the first question.
- [00:54]
Ashley Kerr
Okay, so today's question is pulled from the BiggerPockets forums. If you aren't already, sign up for a free membership to be a part of the Bigger Pockets community. And you can also leave questions for other investors to answer or maybe we'll pull it to answer on the show for you. So today's question is how to find wholesalers or off market residential properties. I am newer to acquiring properties as my rentals have been past personal homes and when I stumbled upon through a family friend. Outside of driving for dollars, what else can I be doing to find local properties? How do I locate wholesalers in my immediate area? I have found Facebook groups for my state and region, but all the properties are in more populous suburbs further away than I want my properties to be. Okay, so off market deals. So he's off to a great start, this person by using their old primaries to turn into rentals and then getting a word of mouth referral from somebody knowing that they like to have rentals and selling them a property. Tony, how many off market or what percentage of your properties have been from wholesalers or off market deals?
- [02:11]
Tony J. Robinson
Probably close to 50% somewhere in that ballpark. But you know, some we source ourselves, you know, we did a little bit of direct mail at one point. Some from wholesalers that we've built relationship ships with and others from agents that we built relationship with where the properties never listed, they just kind of came to us first. But I'd say probably close to about 50% of the single family homes have come from some sort of off market transaction which I didn't realize and saying it out loud, I didn't realize it was that big of a percentage. But there's a few questions in here. But I guess first let me ask same question to you actually. What percentage of your of your portfolio can came from from off market?
- [02:48]
Ashley Kerr
I would say it's a little less than yours. I would say probably 35 to 40% off market. Just because I've gotten lately pocket listings which technically they're actually they're not put on the mls, they're under contract then put on the MLS as under contract. So I'm not sure how to I.
- [03:11]
Tony J. Robinson
Would still call those off market, maybe.
- [03:13]
Ashley Kerr
A little bit higher percentage then but mostly have been on market deals.
- [03:19]
Tony J. Robinson
I was just going to say just to give like some clarity to the listeners as well. Like we purchase multiple deals from the same wholesaler, right? We purchase multiple deals from the same agent, who's agent slash builder. So it's not like I have this massive network of people just kind of sending me off market deals. But I think the point I'm trying to make is you only need a couple of really good relationships to be able to feed you enough volume of deals that you're. You're looking to add to your portfolio. So just one, one caveat.
- [03:44]
Ashley Kerr
There's so some way to find wholesalers or somebody that's finding properties for you. So they talked about, they found Facebook groups but it's not exactly what they're looking for. And I think another way is to actually Google sell my house fast and up are going to be wholesalers looking for leads by trying to bring people in that need to sell their house fast. And you can go ahead and contact them from their website and say hey I'm a buyer in the area. This is my buy box. This is what I'm looking for. Can you add me to your buyers list? So that's a very easy thing to do. Sitting from home doing that. Going on to the BiggerPockets forums going ahead and you know I'm so and so from here I'm looking for properties here also going to meetups.com or even in biggerpockets on the website they have different meetups physically going to the meetups, connecting with people there, asking who their wholesalers are or meeting wholesalers. The one in Buffalo they always do like a big circle sometimes where you go say your name, what you do and what you're looking for. And so you could say I'm looking for wholesalers in this neighborhood. This is the type of house I'm looking to buy. Something like that. So that's another great way to get connected with, with wholesalers. But the Google search is such an easy way and you're gonna get find like the bigger wholesalers that way too. That usually bring in more volume.
- [05:15]
Tony J. Robinson
Yeah, I love that approach of reaching out to the people that are running ads for we buy houses fast. I've never thought about that. That's a great little tip there, Ash. So yeah, obviously that's one piece is going after wholesalers. I think another approach is maybe sourcing some deals for yourself. So this person mentioned that they're driving for dollars, which is a great way to kind of build. I think some other opportunities to find off market deals are going after expired listings. So if in your area you, you kind of see properties that are sitting, they've gone stagnant now that listing is no longer there. That's an opportunity for you to reach out to those folks as well. Also just going after properties that are on market. And I know this is kind of anti to the question, but you know, and we talk about this a lot of times in the podcast, is that the listing prices is often just a suggestion and you should in no way, shape or form treat the listing price as the end all, be all. You should be submitting so many offers to the point where the majority of your offers are rejected. Right. Because if you're only submitting offers when you feel like you've got a really good shot, you're probably missing a lot of opportunity. I've shared the story before, but there's a property that we were looking at buying in Tennessee as a cabin where down the road from captain that you already have. It was initially listed I think at like 1.2. We offered 700. They didn't even counter. They end up dropping the price. A few times. We counted or reset another offer at 700 and I think they countered at 850 and actually just pulled that property up not too long ago and they just done another price drop from 850 I think down to like 8:40 it's sitting at right now. So a month ago they dropped a price 840. So I might reach back out to them again with another 700 or $700,000 offer and see what happens. So even, even just kind of working those properties that are listed can sometimes be a good way to get, you know, maybe deals that other people are overlooking.
- [07:08]
Ashley Kerr
Yeah, usually I'm against wasting time just scrolling on Zillow, but one thing you can do is to set your filter to sort it for days on market but in reverse. So you're seeing the properties that have been sitting on market the longest first and then kind of work your way down and, and I look okay, like this property has been sitting for 235 days. They obviously may be more open to a lower offer than somebody that's been on market two days. So that's a another thing you can look at.
- [07:39]
Tony J. Robinson
I want to talk about a couple more off market strategies that we've used. But before I do, just one other piece on like the on market side we talk a lot about PropStream. But another app that I've been using a lot recently is Privy. So it's Privy Pro is, is the website and it's very similar to two prop stream. The UI is a little bit more 2025 so I think it's a little bit more updated but I also like it's a little bit easier to comp inside of Privy. There's just a few less steps involved. So what I have for my areas are saved searches. So I have like a little map, a little radius that I drew on the map and I'm looking for any listings that mention the word tlc, cash, investor, damage or repairs. And I'll just go in every couple of days, see what's listed there and I'll make offers that way. I just have like a blanketed template email that I send out and majority of the times the answer is no, you know, and I get people who are like, hey, you know, I've got someone way above what you're offering, but at least I'm, I'm getting my reps in and I'm keeping the kind of pipelines open to potentially find something. So just another option to find some on market stuff as well.
- [08:47]
Ashley Kerr
Okay, so let's talk about that piece a little bit more as to you are actually sending the offers to the seller's agent. Okay, so like one piece I feel like we see very common, and I felt like this in several situations before too is like you almost feel bad giving your agent all of these offers to submit and to fill out all these contracts and do all this work where it can get to the point where some agents get frustrated. Like okay, like these are lowball offers. Like you're wasting my time, you know. So I think that is a great solution of actually emailing the seller's agent directly yourself and almost are you actually writing up like a letter of intent or it's just more of like a, a verbal offer of like, should I go through the process of actually putting together a full, full offer? Or this is not something they're interested in at all. Can you give us a maybe a little bit of your script of what you're actually saying in the email?
- [09:49]
Tony J. Robinson
For sure. Like I'll, I'll, I'll say, hey, my name is Tony Robinson. I'm a local investor inquiring about property xyz. Here's what I can offer, here's how quickly I can close. I have no inspections, financing or appraisal contingencies. And then here's my offer. And it's really just kind of quick and to the point. And like I said, a lot of times I like, hey, thanks, you know, and that's it. Other times it's like, hey, seller might be willing to, to come to y, you know, another time it's like, hey, we're already under contract. But it's a very simple email. Here's my name. I usually also include that. I don't like, hey, I'm not represented by anyone. So if you want to double in the deal, I'm fine with that as well. So maybe there's a little bit more motivation for the seller's agent on that side as well. But I keep it simple, you know, just hey, here, here's my price, here are my terms, here's when I can close.
- [10:37]
Ashley Kerr
I think that's great. So we got a little script here now about to source your deals. So what were some of the other ways that you have gotten off market deals?
- [10:48]
Tony J. Robinson
Yeah, so we, we've tested mail, like direct mail. We've tested texting and cold calling as well. And we picked up one deal from, from postcard campaign that we sent out. Uh, we picked up another deal from like a call, a cold call slash kind of text campaign that we sent out. Um, haven't leaned into many of those super heavily over the last couple of years just because it, it does take a little bit of time to kind of get that pipeline up and running and to maintain that. Um, but we, we have secured deals from both of those channels as well. And I, I think the, the good thing about both of those options is that sometimes you can kind of ride the, I guess maybe ride the momentum of other people's, you know, work on the direct mail side. Because even if you've only mailed them once, maybe mailed them like six times already, and you just happen to be that seventh piece of mail that really kind of gets them over the edge and says, you know, fine, I'll finally do it. And the reason I know that that's true or the reason I believe it to be true is because the first phone call that we got from the very first ever postcard drop that we sent out, the very first phone call became our first off market deal like that we sourced ourselves and we were looking at you like, man, why isn't everybody doing this? You know, why is there? But you know, in talking with him, he had been getting mailed on this property for years and we just happened to be the one that he opened when he was in that, in that mode to finally sell. So sometimes you can get lucky, but to really set expectations, you're probably going to need to hit someone 6, 7, 8, 10 times before they're actually ready to sell. So that's why what I mean when you say you got to build that pipeline.
- [12:20]
Ashley Kerr
I think before we move on to the next question is just one disclaimer out there is to no matter how you're sourcing your deals through a real estate agent or a wholesaler that you're doing your own deal analysis, you're vetting the deal yourself and not relying on somebody else to tell you what the numbers should be too. On a deal, I think is very important no matter how you're sourcing the.
- [12:42]
Tony J. Robinson
Deal 1000% because every wholesaler will send you a deal and say, hey, the rehab is only 25k. You got like a $300,000 spread and here are eight comps that support it. And then like you, you do a little bit of digging yourself and you find that some of those comps are two years old or maybe they're, you know, they're 10 miles away or whatever it may be. So couldn't agree with you more, Ashley. Make sure you're doing your own homework.
- [13:03]
Ashley Kerr
Okay, before we jump into our second question, Rookies, we want to thank you so much for being here and listening to the podcast. As you may know, we air every episode of this podcast on YouTube as well as original content like my new series Rookie Resource. We want to hit 100,000 subscribers and we need your help. If you aren't already, please head over to our YouTube channel, YouTube.comealestate rookie and subscribe to our channel. Are you ready to ignite your real estate investing journey? Join us at BiggerPockets Momentum 2025 where top industry experts and investors come together to share game changing strategies and actionable insights. Your favorite podcast hosts like Tony and I will be doing live 90 minute calls to go over important topics for investing in today's market. These topics include partnerships, market analysis, building a business and Start so much more. My favorite part though is that you will get to be part of an accountability group. Don't wait and go to biggerpockets.comsummit to join myself and other like minded investors to connect at our virtual momentum summit. That's biggerpockets.com summit for decades, real estate.
- [14:14]
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- [15:56]
Tony J. Robinson
How high is the interest rate for the new Laurel Road High Yield Savings account?
- [16:02]
Ashley Kerr
This high.
- [16:05]
Tony J. Robinson
The air is really, really thin up here. The Laurel Road Very High Yield Savings.
- [16:11]
C
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- [16:27]
Ashley Kerr
Okay, welcome back. We have another question. So Tony, what's our next question today?
- [16:33]
Tony J. Robinson
All right, so our second question says I'm a resident of Seattle, Washington and currently own a home with a 2.75% interest rate. Geez. All of my other assets are invested in the stock market. I'm looking to diversify into real estate, preferably a single family home. I'm really getting started and looking for advice on what indicators do you look at before investing into a property. What research do you do about the neighborhood, the school district, or the market trends in general? Lastly, given that I am in a very high cost of living market, what targets do you set with cash flow and your monthly budget? All right, so a couple of things to kind of break out here. Seattle, Washington, expensive market. We know that really good interest rate on the primary. But the question here is really not even about like their primary home, but just like, hey, what should I do if I'm looking to get started to buy that first real estate deal? I'll give my quick thought on the very first step. But I believe that before you even start thinking about markets or potential properties or whatever this may be, you have to establish and understand your own goals and your own motivations. Are you doing this for immediate accumulation of cash flow so you can replace your W2 job as quickly as possible? Are you doing this for appreciation long term so that when you retire at the age of 60 that you've got assets then that you can live off of? Are you looking to do this for the tax benefits? Like what is your actual motivation for getting into real estate? You say diversify, which is one piece of that puzzle. But what are all of the other factors that you're personally considering that has you motivated to actually jump into real estate investing? So I believe very firmly that's always a good solid first step, is to identify the goals and the motivations. What about you, Ash?
- [18:31]
Ashley Kerr
Yeah, I can't agree with you more on that as, because that's really going to kind of set the trajectory or your path that you're going to take with purchasing that property. So you can compare yourself to another investor. But if you have a different reason for investing or a different why, the deal that they have may not make sense to what you want to do or what you want to get out of real estate. So I guess looking at this person's question is to. It doesn't say exactly if they want to invest in the Seattle market or if they're willing to go out of state, but I think Besides setting your, why also the next thing is setting your budget. So what can you actually afford? Like do you have money for a down payment, do you have cash and you want to save or pay cash for the property? How much is that? So kind of establishing a budget, you need to go and get a pre approval to see what that would be. Or maybe you have a private money lender, how much are they willing to lend? You figure that budget out, then we can go ahead and start doing market analysis. So let's just pick one of these things. Let's say they're actually going for cash flow because he does mention what would be a good cash flow to get as an investor. So we're going to go ahead and start looking at markets and doing a market analysis. And the first thing to easily narrow down for a rental property is first which states are landlord friendly? Like if you have the option of investing in any state, you might as well start in a landlord friendly state instead of like me in New York that is very, very tenant friendly. So we can start there, narrow down by state, then we can look at budget. Okay, so what are, you know, the budgets that we can go ahead, what's your budget and kind of narrow down from city. There's, there's some really good websites such as Neighborhood Scout, there's Bright Investor where you can actually go and pull all this neighborhood data. Then see are there any areas that you actually have an advantage or opportunity such as a boots on the ground. You maybe you even grew up there. So you know the neighborhood, that's an advantage. Maybe you have a cousin who's a real estate agent in a market that's an advantage. And actually we did do a Ricky resource YouTube video if you want to check that out, all about market analysis. And here you get to download a whole template checklist of like everything. You should be looking at the crime, things like that that can really help you narrow down a few markets to.
- [21:06]
Tony J. Robinson
Eventually go ahead and pick all good pieces there, Ashley. And I guess the only other thing that I would add because I mean he didn't mention or she did mention cash flow here. So we can maybe assume that that's the target. But I guess the other thing that I typically tell people to look at is they're trying to narrow down the market because that's really the first piece, right? It's just like, hey, where should I invest in? That's, that's kind of the first piece. So you, if we look at like 30,000 foot view, the big milestones, you've got to choose your market. What city should I be investing in? Once you choose your market, you have to then build a process or follow a process for finding deals within said market. And then once you've got a pipeline of deals that you found, you then have to go through the steps of analyzing those deals to see if they meet your investment criteria. And then once you analyze the deals, you find one. Then you go through the steps of getting it set up to either short term, long term, medium term, flip, whatever your exit strategy is. Right. But choose a market and building your team. Building your team. Yeah. And, and I think it, it's really those steps that we want to move through. But one of the first things that you should be doing, yes, definitely building your team. But I think even to help you narrow down the market a bit more is just understanding not only your goals, your motivations, but then also your purchasing power. And when I say purchasing power, how much cash do you have in the bank that you feel comfortable investing into your first real estate deal and what level or what amount can you get approved for on a mortgage? And once you have the answer to those two things, well now you've got a better sense also of what market you should be focusing on because maybe you're, maybe you're a high income earner, right? Maybe you earn 250 a year, but, and maybe you can get approved for, you know, an eight hundred thousand dollar mortgage on your first investment property. But if you've only got 50k that you're willing to invest, it doesn't matter if you can get approved for 800,000. You've got to go find a property where 50k can actually get you into a deal. Right. And it's not on a sign on an $800,000 purchase. So just kind of understanding at a high level, your cash on hand that you feel comfortable investing and your pre approval will also help you narrow down and kind of choose the right market.
- [23:07]
Ashley Kerr
Yeah. And then kind of the last part of his question, quick was, you know, what kind of, you know, target return should I be looking for, what the, the cash flow I should be getting? I think a great starting point for that is I think he had mentioned he invested in the stock market as to what are the returns that you're getting in the stock market because you're, you know, and I usually say like you want to get a better return than what you can get in the stock market, what or wherever else you're investing. But you have to take into account the other advantages of real Estate, such as the tax benefits, the appreciation, the equity, different things like that. So even if you're not getting as great of a return as you would in the stock market, then you know, there's these other benefits, especially if you are, you know, have a high W2 that you have these extra, you know, tax advantages that come with rental properties, especially short term rentals. So I think compare it to the other investments that you have to see if it makes sense for you. But then going into the bigger packets forums and asking people for that specific market as to what types of returns are you getting in this area? Like what is a good return? Is this better for appreciation? Is cash flow better in these markets? Because it's, it's very difficult to find, you know, the happy of both of those things of getting both of those. But it is out there. But if you just want one or the other, that's a lot easier to find than I would say a happy medium of both of, of those. Okay, we have to take one final ad break, but we'll be back with more after this.
- [24:52]
C
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Ashley Kerr
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Ashley Kerr
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- [28:36]
Ashley Kerr
All right, let's jump in to your questions. And we have one final question.
- [28:41]
Tony J. Robinson
All right, so this question says, my tenant called me to explain they are separating from their spouse. They asked how they could be taken off of the lease. My concern is that the remaining party will not be able to afford the rent. Their income isn't much more than the rent itself, so there's no way they could swing it without an additional source. I wouldn't mind terminating the lease early, but the remaining party said they would like to stay and intend on renewing the lease for another 12 months. Should I offer early termination for both parties and find new tenants? Should I just prepare to start the eviction on January 10th or see if they manage to continue making rent and then decide to renew the lease or not? Tricky situation. I'll, I'll kind of give my, my initial thoughts here. And then actually you're, you, you've obviously got a lot more experience here in the space than I do, but in my mind there is a lot of time, effort, energy and money lost that goes into tenant turnover. Because you've got to prep this unit, you've got to market this unit. You have to hopefully find and screen new tenants. So there's time, effort and energy that goes into that. And we don't know what city you're in. Maybe your units can turn like hotcakes and you can list the unit today and have someone in there tomorrow. Or maybe, you know, especially this time of year, maybe winter people aren't looking to move as much and maybe it sits empty for a couple of months and now you've got room to cover on a unit that otherwise would have been filled. So in my mind, if they've been a good tenant, leave it up to them to figure out how they're going to cover the rent. And if they're looking to renew, then maybe they've figured something out. Maybe they're getting some sort of spousal support, maybe there's child support, maybe they're getting a second job. Who knows? But I don't know if I would kick a tenant out under the assumption that they may or may not be willing to pay when historically you haven't seen any issue. So my two cents, as someone who at the moment owns zero long term rentals, take that with a big grain of salt. Ashley, what, what are your, what are your thoughts?
- [30:49]
Ashley Kerr
Yeah, so I think if they have a good tenant history, like they take care of the property, they've always paid on time that they are worth trying to keep around if it works out. So I wouldn't terminate their lease. So especially since how long have they lived there? So when you did their rental application, received their income, you know, could circumstances have changed since then? And also when they're separating, they could be getting some kind of spousal support in the meantime until the divorce is final and then they could be getting alimony from the other person. So I think there's a lot of different circumstances where they could afford this. Maybe they got a raise last month at their job. So you can always open that line of communication and just say, you know, I would love for you to just submit new application or run a new credit check or something like I don't even know if that's necessary to that extent. But just ask for an updated proof of income to show that they can continue to afford the apartment on their own and then that will just kind of open up the discussion and maybe they will end up realizing like, no, you know, actually I can't afford it. I was going to try to. And then you can make the decision of, you know, this is going to be really hard for you to live off $100 a month for all of the rest of your living expenses. I'm going to go ahead and not renew your lease agreement, but I think that other option too is like leaving it month to month and then deciding to renew it at a later date. In New York it's in. This could depend on what state you're in too. Like in New York, if you don't renew a tenant's lease, it's automatically usually goes to month to month tenancy. And if you notify a tenant that you're ending their lease agreement doesn't mean they're actually going to move out. Like they can still stay there and then you have to take them to court for a lease holdover that they stayed along or you know, after their lease had expired. So look at your tenant landlord laws too and see if you, you know, you'd have to go through the eviction process anyways if you try and terminate their lease or end their lease or not renew it.
- [33:04]
Tony J. Robinson
I love the idea of going month to month because I think that gives both the tenant and the landlord the ability to assess on, on a more shorter timeline of what he is is actually working for. So definitely a good option there as well.
- [33:17]
Ashley Kerr
Okay, well, thank you guys so much for joining us for this episode of Rookie Reply. If you want to get involved in the community of real estate investors. Make sure you head over to biggerpockets.com and contribute into the forums. You can ask questions or you can answer them. I'm Ashley and he's Tony. And we'll see you guys next time on the next episode of real Estate. Rookie.