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SHEILA GUNN REID | Alberta's independence movement nears a turning point — what comes after the signatures?
00:31:51
Keith Wilson explains why the Alberta separatist movement may just be getting started and how the pressure building right now could shape Alberta politics for years to come.
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- [00:00]
A
Foreign. It's all over but the signature counting. What happens next for Alberta's independence referendum movement? I'm Sheila Gun Reed and you're watching the gun show. If you're on Alberta X right now, we're on Alberta Facebook right now you are seeing independence canvassers hanging up their badges after a 120 day long haul through some oppressive winter weather after they spent those months collecting signatures. They need to collect about roughly 177,000 of them to trigger a referendum on independence October 19th. And once those signatures are verified, then the campaign shifts into the yes, no campaigning side. And I think that's going to get a little bit rough. But to bring us the nitty gritty on what's happening now and what's happening next is someone you already know. It's Keith Wilson, Freedom Convoy lawyer and independence advocate. Take a listen. So joining me now is Keith Wilson, independence advocate and of course you know him as one of the key lawyers from the Freedom Convoy. And I wanted to get an update on the independence efforts now as we approach the end of the signature collection period. So Keith, before we get going on everything, what happens next, you know, what the federal government is doing to exacerbate independence minded people into, you know, casting a vote on October 19. But where are we right now in the independence efforts?
- [02:13]
B
Sure. Well, we're, there's the specific step that's occurring over the coming days is the final counting internally by Stay Free Alberta and Mitch Sylvester's group on the petition calling on the Smith government to hold an independence referendum in October and that that counting's occurring. Boxes of signature seats are being delivered to their headquarters, being gathered up. So it's the final hustle of gather and deliver and count. You know, we've had remarkable weather throughout the entirety of this thing like these, these. Everybody thought the last couple weeks the weather would be nice and we had two blizzards across the province, people stranded on highways for 20 hours. So I, I don't, I'm, my view is the numbers are probably not gonna like blow everybody's socks off. That's just my sense. I don't know what the numbers are, but I think that that weather's been a huge factor. But there's another really important factor that I've run into so many times, which is fear. You know, the, the move that the federal government did in 2022 in freezing, Tamara Leaches and, and Chris Barber and the other Freedom Convoy leaders bank accounts. And I was there, you know, witnessing that firsthand and have lawsuits outstanding against the federal government for those unlawful bank freezes that has created such a chilling effect, a lasting chilling effect that so many people have said and so many canvassers have reported that people are afraid. They want, they support independence. They're going to vote yes, but they're afraid to sign and put their name on that list for the petition out of fear that the government tyrants will use their powers to freeze bank accounts. And what an indictment of the state that Canada has become.
- [04:15]
A
Yeah, that's a reason to leave. If you cannot exercise your democratic rights for fear that the state will drop the hammer on you and ruin you financially, that's a state you don't want to be a part of. And I, I also have noted that some of the locations where independence events are booked are being canceled last minute. And I'm not saying in the small towns but, but in the big cities, the progressive held hellscapes of Edmonton and to some extent Calgary, they're canceling these independence events where they booked in advance. Everybody knows why they're going to be there. Everybody knows why Chris Scott's going to be there. And then they cancel them sort of last minute which does have again a chilling effect on the signature collection.
- [05:03]
B
Yes. And, and, and it shows a fear of free, free political expression and a fear that once people are exposed to the advantages of independence and the disadvantages and the very dark path that Canada's on and the option for us, our children or grandchildren to free ourselves from that dark future, they get worried that more and more people will get on board. You know, one of the things that I wanted to clarify, Sheila, is we need to keep in mind we don't know what's going to happen with the court case that a few of the first nations have brought. And it's only I think three first nations chiefs. The number of first nations canvassers.
- [05:48]
A
Yes.
- [05:48]
B
In support of independence. The number of first nations that have come forward and made tea to sign and express their serious concern about the hundreds of thousands of dollars that these few chiefs are spending on lawyers instead of helping their people to fight this petition is, is remarkable. But what we. I don't know what the court's going to do. I don't think there's a good legal factual basis. I've talked about this many times. There's no threat to the treaties. The 1930 Natural Resources Transfer agreement demonstrates that. That another level of government can step in and take over treaty responsibilities. The treaties themselves don't aren't just with the crown. It says with his Majesty, the King and all successors and assigns. So it always suggested that the federal government could hand off treaty responsibilities to another entity, another level of government or a new government. In any event, what if the court does come up with some very. What I would call strange decision and. And stop or somehow wipe out the signature collection process by Stay Free Alberta? The reason I'm not overly concerned about that, I'd be disappointed and find it troubling. But the reason I'm not concerned about it is because Thomas Lucas was successful.
- [07:08]
A
Right. Thank you, Thomas.
- [07:09]
B
Threshold for a referendum, not a void vote in the legislature. He's now trying to get out of this huge cell phone that he did. It's brilliant karma. But he's now trying to say, oh, I just wanted to vote in the Ledger. No, you didn't. You're. I've put up on the social media and others have his actual application form. It uses the word referendum twice and it says, by signing this petition, I'm calling on the Alberta government to hold a referendum on whether Alberta should stay or leave Canada. That's an independence succession referendum. So the premier already has a mandate to hold, in my view, a referendum in the fall. And some people have said, oh, well, then they're going to have to use his wording that's not true. The reason it's not true legally is the wording for the referendum on independence in October will be determined by the Alberta government's cabinet under the Referendum Act. So the Citizens Initiative act provides a mechanism to flag to the government, the provincial government, saying, hey, this is an issue. This is the issue, this issue that's important to us. We want you to put it on a referendum. And here's how we, the citizens, would frame the question. But there's a different legal obligation on the cabinet under the Referendum act to consider constitutional principles and other things when selecting the wording of the question. So the ultimate party who determines the wording of the question is the cabinet. And they're not directly bound by the wording of the question from the petitioners. So the. The Smith government will have to review what question they put on the. The ballot for independence. And I think they should pick a form of question that's as compliant as possible with the Supreme Court of Canada's decision and the Clarity act, which is a question very similar to which Stay Free Alberta's question is. So I am not losing any sleep over these things. I think the important task is for us to continue to talk as Albertans about the dangers of staying in Canada for our kids and our grandkids and the advantages of becoming independent and the viability of that path.
- [09:28]
A
Right. And for people who are on the fence, maybe you don't believe in a Alberta utopia. This is your chance to stick it to Mark Carney and tell him to go F himself. Like, this is your one chance to do this for a generation, to send a message to the Laurentian elites that we don't agree with what they've done to what was left of this beautiful country in the last 11 years. And man, I'm just so excited to cheer for Thomas Lukas, hapless buffoonery. Wonderful. Just moving on to what happens next. So we've got the petition signatures. Let's say they. They clear the bar for entry to the referendum. What happens next? So. So instead of signatures, shift into active campaigning. What are we going to see? What is that going to look like?
- [10:31]
B
Well, the official campaign period won't begin until the cabinet issues an order under the Referendum act setting the question. And that's obviously going to take some time. And in the meantime, it's just a normal democracy, political free expression and advocacy. And anybody with a view on any topic is free to express it, is free to open up a website to talk about it, is free to put up a billboard to advocate their view or. Or do whatever they do, hold town hall meetings and so on. So I think you're going to continue to see lots of different groups because there's several out there and there's new ones popping up all the time that will continue to try and inform people about the advantages of independence and its viability and the dangers of staying in Canada. And I think that you're going to see. See that ramp up and we're going
- [11:25]
A
to see the voices of. No, the Project Fear get louder and louder and louder. The people who say that this can't be done. It will ruin everything. Excuse me. What's the difference for people who say like, oh, the interest rates are going to go out of control and you're going to have out of control inflation and you won't be able to get a pipeline built. Yeah, thanks. That's now. So we're gonna have a lot of people on the federalist side trying to scare people away from their own future.
- [11:55]
B
Yeah. And I mean, they're going to do Project Fear. And it's ironic because anytime they try this Project Fear, it doesn't stand even a superficial level of analysis. And let me just give you a couple of quick examples. One is the Federalists have argued in Ottawa, has said if Alberta were to become independent, you'd be so vulnerable in your trade relationship with the United States. You wouldn't have any leverage. Meanwhile, Carney's absolutely blowing his negotiations with the largest economy in the world, our largest trading partner as a country, a country in a market that allows Canada, has allowed Canada to have the standard living that Canadians have had. And now that things are on the rocks because Carney's such a poor negotiator, and the ideological extremists in Ottawa have let ideology prevail over practical reality. Minister Hodgson, Federal Minister, announced last week that they have a plan. They have a plan to, for Canada to get leverage in their negotiations with the United States under Kuzma. And that plan is to leverage Alberta's oil industry, our energy industry. So I, my head exploded. I tweeted about this. The irony, they're saying, oh, Alberta can't separate because you'll be so vulnerable to the United States, you'll have no leverage in your negotiations. Canada is now looking for negotiations as a nation, and they, they can't find any leverage but for Alberta's wealth. So it just demonstrates the merits and the strength of our position. The other thing is they keep talking about, people keep raising these ideas that the other provinces are some going to. How. Going to retaliate. They're not understanding the factual reality and the strength of Alberta. You know, Doug Ford, apparently, I'm told by multiple reports, did not. Premier Ford did not realize when he threatened to cut off electricity to the the United States several months ago when things flared up in the auto patch. He did not realize that the pipeline supplying the bulk of energy that goes to the refineries and airports and fuel stations in Ontario goes through the United States, starts in Alberta. And didn't seem to realize that Trump could just send a couple of county sheriffs into a compressor station and say, shut it down. Right. It's just there. So much of the rest of Canada is so oblivious to the raw economic horsepower of Alberta and our strategic position for them. Right. And the Americans realize that we supply 55% of the oil imports to the United States come from Alberta. So this notion that if Alberta becomes independent, Kearney's going to somehow do something to retaliate against Alberta, that just has no air of reality in, in the real world.
- [15:06]
A
Right. And with what, how, you know, Canada is in a vulnerable place as far as access to energy without Alberta, and that is with the limited pipeline supply that we already have. So, I mean, people say, whoa, what are you going to do about the military what do you mean? Americans love us? You think they're going to let anything happen to us? And do you think the Canadians are going to do anything to us? With what? Are they going to throw tampons at me from the men's room? I mean, there's a lot of people who are concerned about the fine line items. And those things were sorted out once within confederation. They can be sorted out just fine outside of confederation, too. I think we're bright people.
- [15:48]
B
Well, and not only that, Sheila, remember too, it's so important to emphasize that the bulk of things that governments do that affect us daily in our lives and our kids is provincial and municipal. And there's only a few things that the federal government actually does. You know, passport offices, border control, monetary policy, military and a few others. And all of the details of those functions are known. We know. So we're basically taking over a business unit and saying, all right, Alberta right now runs registries for motor vehicle, for personal property, security registry, for financing, for marriage, you know, for death, for all of these things. Okay, now we're going to have to deliver a service where we confirm people's nationalities and issue a passport. I'm pretty sure, given how poorly most other provinces deliver motor vehicle registry services compared to the efficiency and low cost and hyper accessibility, that we do it here in Alberta, we're going to be able to run a better passport office than the federal government. So again, we're not going into this uncharted territory. The functions that Alberta would need to take over from the federal government are all known and are being delivered today. The only question is, when Alberta takes them over, are we just going to maintain the same quality of service delivery or are we going to improve it? And I'm very optimistic, given our track record as a province and the culture of our people, that will improve it. So. But then there's the dark side of all this. You know, every week I joke that, you know, in. In Independence Square five years from now in Edmonton, commemorating Alberta becoming independent, an independent nation state in 2027, there will be a small little statue of Mark Carney. And the reason they'll feel a little statue is we're just going to have to acknowledge the critical role that he's providing in advancing the cause of independence. You know, they talk about investment, will leave if Alberta becomes independent. While at the same time Trudeau, Liberals and Carney, Liberals and Carney was briefing and advising the Trudeau Liberals on their economic policy. The RBC confirmed over a trillion dollars worth of investment left, right and Half
- [18:21]
A
a trillion was from Alberta.
- [18:24]
B
Right. And, but every other week there's announcement like there was this past week where shell just did a 20 or 60, whatever. It was a huge deal in acquiring ARC, a big investment in Alberta. So, so they're sucking and blowing. They're, they're demonstrating, you know, and now announced the sovereign wealth fund.
- [18:48]
A
Right.
- [18:49]
B
On a team meeting with some clients this morning. And I joked that I, I just got back from the bank and they said why? And I said, Well, I borrowed $5,000 to invest it in this sovereign wealth fund, you know.
- [19:01]
A
Right. Just what. So I saw somebody joke, I saw somebody joke that they, they're going to start calling their credit card bill their sovereign wealth fund because that's literally what the federal government is doing, just allocating debt and then calling it a sovereign wealth fund.
- [19:19]
B
And what's troubling is so many people in other parts of the country seem to fall for this stuff.
- [19:26]
A
Yeah.
- [19:27]
B
And, and, and you know, people say, oh well, Quebec was a distinct society at a distinct culture. And I've advocated consistently as you know, and I think you have as well descriptively that Alberta has its own culture.
- [19:41]
A
Absolutely.
- [19:42]
B
Aspects of our culture is we can smell, we smell it from far away.
- [19:49]
A
Yeah.
- [19:49]
B
And so Carney continues to advance policies. His, his spring economic update now confirms the incredible number. Over $60 billion a year just in debt servicing payments. That goes to nothing of value. So the reality is Canada's future continues to get darker. There's no fundamental change in trajectory. Carney is still obsessed with net zero policies. One of their press release on the sovereign fund said they're doing all these things to unlock our vast resources. And what leaped out at me in those words was, well, who has them locked up? Yeah, the world wants them. Investors want to pay for them. There's one party that has them locked up and that's the liberal government in Ottawa.
- [20:46]
A
Yeah.
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B
Tomorrow he could repeal Bill C69. He could repeal the no Alberta oil tanker ban on the West Coast. He could repeal the net zero. He could repeal the carbon taxes. No buyer in the world is prepared to pay for carbon taxes. Could you imagine the increased revenue to the economy, an investment if they lifted the industrial carbon taxes alone, got rid of the pathways project and the methane rules. All of these things make our oil less competitive. Third largest preserve in the world. The world wants it. So these guys are not changing course. And what they are doing is they're creating this idea of a king, like an old school king where you come before the king on bent knee and It's King Carney. If you want to get your project approved, you now have to go to him and get his permission to put it on the major projects list. Sheila, we, you and I have, were raised in an Alberta and in a Canada where if you had an entrepreneurial idea and you could meet basic regulatory reasonable thresholds, you went ahead and did it. You created jobs, you created wealth, you donated back to your community. And they're shifting to a different type of system where one man, King Carney, little man sitting on a big throne, controls all and can direct it to his ideological pursuits. More and more Albertans are waking up to that and I think they're going to vote for independence in October of this year.
- [22:28]
A
Now, Keith, I hope you're right. But you do, you do a lot of educational videos to help people navigate a lot of the misinformation you see on the Project Fear side. And I'll put the media squarely on the Project Fear side. So how do people find out what the truth is and reality is? Where do they find your social media?
- [22:57]
B
Well, I, I have a, I have a YouTube channel. It's called Just Search Keith Wilson Casey or Keith Wilson, Alberta, and you'll. And put the word independence in there and you'll find YouTube channel. I try and do a video a week or two a week depending on what's going on. Some what I feel is misinformation or significant development so people can get their bearings. And I'm also very active on X and it's at I K Wilson, at IK Wilson. But there's also lots of other great sources, rebels doing great work. And I do agree with you, Sheila, that that what's remarkable about the Federalists who are becoming more vocal, whether it's Jason Kenny or Thomas Lucasic or whoever is none of them offer an alternative plan to address the clear problems of the country and the clear unfairness and grievances that Ottawa imposes on Alberta. So even for those who don't are not yet resolved in their mind as to whether they're comfortable enough becoming fully independent, the vote in October is an opportunity for them to send a strong message to Ottawa that there has to be fundamental change here. So I think that that's sort of a dual track that we're on right now. There's the, there's the reluctant Federalists and then there's the ardent separatists or people support independence and their interests align.
- [24:29]
A
Yep. Well, I, I agree with you. This is the one chance in a generation to send these people a message and make sure they get it loud and clear because last time, last time when Canadians tried to send these people a message, we all saw what they did to the freedom convoy. Let's show them something back. Keith, thanks so much for jumping on the show today. We, you know, I should. Regular viewers will already know, but you're a regular guest on all of the rebel news programs. Ezra show, now my show. You're on Rebel Roundup as well. So I'm just grateful for you to take the time to explain what's happening as we shift to the next phase of the independence movement. Appreciate you.
- [25:16]
B
Thanks for having me on.
- [25:25]
A
All right, friends, last portion of the show always goes to you at home because without you, there's no rebel news. We don't take money from the government. We never will. So we rely on you. But because we rely on you, we better give you your opportunity to let us have it in return. If you don't like what we're doing, let us know. If you do like what we're doing, please let us know as well. And I think I'm going to get some people on the federal list side of this a little bit upset at me with today's show and that's okay. This is a place where I take constructive criticism. You tell me why you're mad at me and I'll tell you why I think I'm right. But I must tell you, normally I make a call out for viewer feedback via email. If you want to email me, it's sheilaebelnews.com put gun show letters in the subject line. However, this week for a few glorious days, days I'll never forget, I was without my Outlook email account. It felt like I was riding down a hill on a bike and just freewheeling, you know, just that sense of freedom just going with the flow wherever the wind takes you until you get access to your email again and it's just people yelling at you and wondering why you haven't responded. So I may have missed some of the viewer feedback this week that came to me by email but I did take a look of about what you had to say happening over on YouTube and this was on my recent video on how much money has been going to downtown Toronto broadcasters from the local Journalism Initiative. The Local Journalism initiative. I hate it. I don't think it should exist. Especially in a time where of Internet, Starlink and cell phones and all that stuff. It's easy to just create news content even if you're in a so called news desert rurally. This is coming to you from under the stairs in a log cabin in a hay field. Okay? So it can be done as long as you're not being metered by the state, which is what's happening here. But yeah, the most underserved place according to these government payouts in the entire country was downtown Toronto. I joked in my video like, yeah, next Bay street bankers are going to need Northern development funds for some reason. So I wanted to know what you guys have to say about this because you know, I hate those government bailouts. I particularly hate them for journalists. Lawrence Johnson 4882 says the Liberals keep shoveling billions to the state run media and nothing is ever done about it. Well, I tried man, I tried. I at least told the liberals what I thought about their bailouts when I testified at committee. Steve Dennis 8292 says, Control the media, control the war. You know, when the war is on your mind. Phil Lefkowitz 6685 said, that was excellent Sheila, thank you. Well, thank you so much. Robin Kleinstuber5217 says, Discussing amounts of taxpayer money wasted on buying loyalty of these news entities to be well behaved laptops lap dogs for the corrupt liberals in power. Disgusting. Truth gets sacrificed for twisted fiction in the same manner when dictatorships seek control of all media outlets. You know, it's so funny because on the live stream this week we reacted to a video of journalists who were asking Carney about the fiscal update, the spring fiscal update, and they were saying tell us what the good news is, tell us all about the good news. I thought they were just saying, oh, we're going to polish your turd of a fiscal update. And we're hinting at you that no matter what you say to us, it's going to be good news. But now reflecting on it, I see that they have extended this funding in the fiscal update, which means the good news they were asking about is can you give us more money? Are you giving us more money? And hot damn, he sure did. It's almost like they knew in advance. David Morgan 8705. Defund all media. If they can't survive on their own, then goodbye. We are better off without them. Exactly. Jason S6021 Government funded media is no longer media, it's propaganda. I said at the very least it's politically contaminated. Even if you can maintain some independence, there are some people who still work over at Post Media. Joe Warmington is one of them. Rick Bell is one of them that I think they are independent thinkers of the state, but their work feels contaminated, even through perception of the government money, if you get what I mean. And I hate that for those guys because I like those guys. Dylan Innis, 8541 says, I wish the media would remember that taxpayers are paying the bill and they ought to serve the citizens, not the government. Yeah, they don't. They hate you. They hate you. They just see you as a pocket to pick. Thank you. Just think about how they treated the freedom convoy. That's how they think about regular Canadians. All right. Well, everybody, buddy, that's the show for today. Thank you so much for tuning in. I'll see everybody back here in the same time in the same place next week. And as always, don't let the government tell you that you've had too much to think.
- [31:18]
B
Sa.