Podcast Summary:
Redacted News
Episode: EXPOSED: How the CIA Influenced Christianity in America
Date: December 27, 2025
Host: Natali Morris (with guest Jay Dyer)
Overview
This episode of Redacted News explores the complex entanglement of Christianity, American politics, intelligence agencies (notably the CIA), and mass media. Natali Morris, seeking clarity on recent shifts in the American religious and political landscape, interviews philosopher and analyst Jay Dyer. Together, they dissect how state and non-state actors—including intelligence agencies—have shaped Christian beliefs and institutions to serve geopolitical interests, particularly focusing on the emergence and spread of Christian Zionism, the manipulation of evangelical patriotism, and historic and ongoing CIA infiltration of religious movements.
Key Discussion Points & Insights
1. Origins and Spread of Dispensationalism and Christian Zionism
- Jay Dyer traces the roots of dispensationalism (the idea that biblical prophecy mandates strong support for the state of Israel) to 19th-century British and American movements, highlighting figures like John Nelson Darby, Samuel Untermeyer, and the rise of the influential Scofield Study Bible.
- Dyer contends that geopolitical motives—especially British and later American imperial interests—intentionally promoted dispensationalist theology in the U.S. as a means of garnering support for the establishment and ongoing defense of Israel (04:10–09:21).
“There was a geopolitical motivation behind the push for American Protestant churches to adopt Evangelical Zionism…funded and promoted through the Scofield Study Bible.”
— Jay Dyer [04:10] - Notes that prior to this, mainstream Protestantism did not embrace these views (Lutherans, Presbyterians, Methodists, etc.), and that the rise of dispensationalism paralleled global events such as the Balfour Declaration (08:00).
2. CIA and Soft Power Manipulation of Christian Movements
- Dyer outlines years of intelligence involvement in religious spheres, especially post-WWII, where the CIA, Pentagon, and other institutions intentionally co-opted Christian movements to serve as “soft power” during the Cold War and beyond (14:17–20:05).
“The idea was, why don’t we turn the churches into a form of soft power? … [Even] missionaries [have been] used as spies.”
— Jay Dyer [16:52] - He points to examples like Calvary Chapel founders’ connections to intelligence and manipulation of evangelical groups to align them with U.S. and Israeli interests (15:22–16:52).
3. Recent Religious Movements & Co-Optation (Charlie Kirk Memorial, Nondenominationalism)
- Natali observes the sudden rise of “on the spot” conversions and nondenominational Christian movements in the wake of Charlie Kirk’s death, raising the question of who gains from these waves of revival.
“Three months past that event, those people will be in a dragnet of dispensational Christians… that handed power to politics I don't think are ordained by the Bible.”
— Natali Morris [12:44] - Dyer concurs, cautioning that many such conversions, while sincere, quickly funnel believers into networks engineered for political or geopolitical ends (16:11–16:52).
4. Religious Groups as Proxies for Espionage and Power
- The discussion turns to how various religious groups (not just evangelicals but also Jehovah’s Witnesses, Scientology, Mormons) have been used for intelligence and espionage purposes globally (19:04–20:05).
- Dyer references books like Lost Hegemon and I Will Be Done showing documented historical examples of missionary work as a front for espionage.
5. Patriotism vs. State Worship
- A nuanced debate explores the tension between genuine patriotism and the risk of conflating support for one’s country with uncritical allegiance to the state or government policies (21:08–24:06).
“There's nothing wrong with being a patriot… but when the state oversteps, the church has a duty to oppose.”
— Jay Dyer [21:41] - Post-9/11 fervor and the transformation of American evangelicalism into a vehicle for state narratives and foreign policy are discussed (21:41–24:00).
6. Hierarchy and Corruption in Christian Institutions: Catholicism, Orthodoxy, and Beyond
- Dyer recounts his personal journey from Baptist to Catholic to Orthodox Christian, motivated by doctrinal evolution and disillusionment with Vatican politics post-Vatican II (25:38–28:08).
“The Vatican has really gone off in this Davos World Economic Forum direction. In fact, the previous Pope had the same mentor as Klaus Schwab.”
— Jay Dyer [28:08] - They discuss the Vatican bank scandals, P2 Lodge, Operation Gladio, and how intelligence agencies subverted not just the Vatican but Italian politics (28:26–31:13).
7. Spirituality as Social Engineering: Oprah, Individualism, and Modern "Witch Movements"
- Natali points to Oprah’s non-denominational spirituality and its connections to “anarchist” movements, commercializing faith and creating atomized spirituality (33:43–36:22).
- Dyer links these phenomena to the broader American ethos of individualism, arguing that even movements purporting to be “outside the system” are often manufactured or infiltrated by power centers—sometimes even as part of counterintelligence (36:42–37:19).
8. The Orthodox Perspective and Why Jay Chose It
- Dyer explains that Orthodoxy, with its decentralized structure and lack of a single human authority (no Pope), offers some insulation against total institutional co-optation (38:12–40:31).
“You can never escape institutional corruption totally…Orthodoxy is somewhat immune to being totally taken over.”
— Jay Dyer [38:12] - The spiritual battle, as seen in Orthodoxy, is both material (political, institutional) and metaphysical (demonic vs. angelic realms) (40:59–42:13).
9. End-Times Beliefs: Tool of Control or Source of Comfort?
- Both note how end-times speculation can both anesthetize believers (“make them catatonic”) and be manipulated by those in power, while also providing comfort in the face of overwhelming evil (43:54–45:40).
“I just think that a lot of the end time stuff ends up being a tool…If you want people inactive and controlled, give them an ideology...you’re not supposed to be involved.”
— Jay Dyer [44:13]
10. Reading Recommendations and Further Inquiry
- Dyer suggests the following for deeper dives:
- Lost Hegemon and Full Spectrum Dominance by F. William Engdahl
- Tragedy and Hope by Carroll Quigley
- Various works analyzing soft power, religious engineering, and elite geopolitics
- Jay’s own books, which tackle film symbolism and the occult in Hollywood ([48:23]).
“We cover a lot of classics on my channel…those formative, geopolitical stuff is good to read.”
— Jay Dyer [49:22] - He notes the dearth of work specifically covering the intersection of intelligence agencies and American religion in depth.
Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments
- “People funneling into these groups are going to be put into that mindset which ultimately has a geopolitical agenda, has nothing really to do with Christianity.”
— Jay Dyer [16:11] - “The Vatican has really gone off in this Davos World Economic Forum direction…That to me is a huge, you know, red flag.”
— Jay Dyer [28:08] - “When you link yourself like this, you end up getting a new master. And I think that's why the Vatican has been so on board with all the New World Order, you know, Davos globalist stuff…”
— Jay Dyer [29:04] - “I've never seen someone who sees the subversion of propaganda as a religious practice. But I think that it is…”
— Natali Morris [32:28] - “What Joseph Campbell…it's really just watered down Carl Jung type archetypal stuff … I think that people like Oprah have figured out that religion is, from a practical perspective, a very good grift.”
— Jay Dyer [33:43] - “Orthodox Christianity is sort of the means by which one wins that [spiritual] battle.”
— Jay Dyer [42:13]
Timestamps for Key Segments
- 03:00–09:21 – Dispensationalism, Scofield Bible, Zionism
- 14:17–20:05 – CIA/Intelligence use of churches, Calvary Chapel/Jesus Movement, soft power, missionaries as spies
- 21:08–24:06 – Patriotism vs. state worship in American Christianity
- 25:38–31:13 – Jay’s journey through Catholicism, Orthodoxy, Vatican scandals, Gladio, CIA/Vatican subversion
- 33:43–37:19 – Analysis of American spirituality, Oprah, new-age movements as soft power
- 38:12–42:13 – Orthodoxy’s structure, spiritual battle, why Orthodoxy?
- 43:54–45:59 – Practical implications of end-times beliefs, role as social control
- 47:17–49:22 – Reading recommendations, where to start research
- 48:32–49:22 – The occult in Hollywood, Exorcist’s CIA backstory
Concluding Perspective
Natali and Jay Dyer stress the importance of questioning religious and political movements, remaining aware of the forces—both seen and unseen—that shape mass beliefs and behaviors. Jay advocates for Orthodoxy as a spiritual anchor relatively resistant to institutional co-optation, while recognizing the impossibility of total insulation from human corruption. Both emphasize the need for seekers to remain vigilant and deepen their inquiry—reading widely, engaging critically, and refusing to accept comforting narratives without scrutiny.
For further exploration:
- Check out Lost Hegemon and Full Spectrum Dominance by F. William Engdahl
- Tragedy and Hope by Carroll Quigley
- Jay Dyer’s own analysis and books on Jay’s Analysis
- Research declassified programs on doctrinal warfare and soft power
- Investigate the backstories of major faith-based movements and their founders for potential state influence
For more interviews like this, visit Redacted News and Jay Dyer’s content at Jay's Analysis.