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Relatable with Allie Beth Stuckey
BONUS | Her Bible-Verse Parking Spot Was Banned … Then She Fought Back and Won | Sophia Shumaker & Keisha Russell
00:36:50
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- [00:01]
A
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B
Well, thank you all so much for joining me. And if you both could just say who you are and what you do.
- [00:45]
C
My name is Sophia Shoemaker. I'm a senior at Rampart High School.
- [00:48]
B
Awesome. And I'm Keisha Russell.
- [00:50]
D
I'm senior counsel at First Liberty Institute.
- [00:53]
B
So let's talk about this case. Let's talk about this story. It involved a senior parking spot at your high school in Colorado, right?
- [01:02]
C
Yeah.
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B
So tell me a little bit more about the tradition you're painting or chalking. This. This parking spot.
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C
Yeah. So each year, the seniors get to paint their own parking spot. They have to pay for it, and it's kind of just a little tradition they do just to express themselves on their last year.
- [01:20]
B
Okay, and what did you choose, to paint or to draw?
- [01:24]
C
I originally wanted to choose the parable from Luke 15 of the shepherd and the 99 sheep, but then I kind of altered it to a backwards fish.
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B
Okay, and tell me, what does that symbolize?
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C
The backwards fish is kind of what people in the Bible used to draw in the dirt when they couldn't really talk about religion and they wanted to know if the other people were Christians.
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B
An ichthys?
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C
Yeah.
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B
And was there a Bible verse or it was just that symbol?
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C
No, it was just like a group of fish, and then there was one.
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B
Fish swimming backwards, going the other direction, swimming upstream. And were you the only one that did any kind of, like, Christian symbolism?
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C
Well, we weren't actually allowed to do Christian imagery on our parking spaces, but I kind of snuck that one in there. I don't think they realized it, but it was against the rules to do Christian imagery.
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B
Yeah.
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D
When she was told she couldn't do the original design, which you should talk about a lot, but then she decided to do the backwards fish, sort of in somewhat of a protest of not being able to do the original design.
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B
Okay, so back up. You submitted an original design. Okay, tell me about that process. You have to get approval.
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C
So each of the seniors who want to paint their parking spot gets a little pamphlet of the rules and somewhere where they can draw, like, their little submission, and then they have to take it to the stucco representatives and usually get that signed off and stuff like that. And so Your parking space has to look. The drawing has to look exactly how you want it on the parking space, and there's, like, a list of rules, and if you violate one of the rules, your parking space gets, like, painted over, or, like, if it gets denied, you have to redo it. And so, yeah, originally I had asked one of the Stuko representatives if I could do a shepherd and the 99 sheep with the Bible verse. And they said just because of the religious imagery in the Bible verse, it probably wouldn't get approved and stuff like that. And so I didn't want to go through all the hassle. And so I just changed the design completely to, like, kind of symbolize my Christianity. But I don't think they really knew what it was.
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B
Yeah. Okay, let's put up full screen one, which is your original design that you had submitted. Did you draw that yourself?
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C
Yeah, I did.
- [03:39]
B
So are you an artist, then?
- [03:41]
C
My grandparents and some of my family. Family members are artists, but I. I think so.
- [03:48]
B
I mean, I feel like I would buy something like that off of Etsy, so that was beautiful. That's what you submitted. And they didn't even say, you can have that, but not the Bible verse. They said, even the sheep and the shepherd, you can't have.
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C
I think it was mostly just because of the Bible verse, just because people would know it's from the Bible or know it's religious and stuff like that.
- [04:08]
B
But, yeah, um. And then what made you say, you know what? I'm gonna. I'm gonna do another Christian theme design? Because you could have said, you know what? Whatever. I'll just do a flower or something. But you decided to kind of test the limits a little bit more. Why is that?
- [04:25]
C
Well, I just couldn't think of anything else. Like, I knew. I just wanted to, you know, put my Christianity on that parking space, and other Christians would look at that and realize what it meant and stuff like that. And if they weren't Christians or if they weren't rel. They would look at that and be like, oh, I wonder what that means, and maybe ask me and stuff like that.
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B
Yeah. And what happened after that?
- [04:51]
C
After we painted the parking spot.
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B
So did you have to resubmit a design?
- [04:55]
C
Yeah. So I resubmitted my design, and it was that official one, and it got approved, and everything went how it was supposed to. You know, went to the painting day. It was so much fun. I got to spend time with all the seniors and spend time with my best friend. She painted her parking spot right next to mine, and you know, we kind of heard about First Liberty and the Sabrina case, like, on Fox News and stuff like that, and it just really inspired me. And, you know, my mom had said something about First Liberty, and we reached out to them.
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B
Yeah, tell me about the Sabrina case.
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D
So Sabrina Steffens is a senior in New York, and she had a very similar situation where she wanted to paint.
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About her Christianity on her parking spot, and she was told no. So she actually submitted a couple different designs, and many of them had scripture. Scripture references. So she submitted three different designs, and the last one was approved because the only symbol that she could think to add was a cross, and she hid it in a T, basically. So they didn't ban that because it was a hidden cross. And so we wrote a letter to that school district in New York telling them that what they were doing was unconstitutional. We did a lot of media, which you'd be surprised how sobering it can be for a school district to be on national news, to have to explain why they're violating a student's constitutional rights. And so once that happened, the school district relented. It probably took a couple weeks for that to happen. But I told Sabrina, just like I told Sovia, when you do that, other students see it, and they want to stand up for themselves as well. And that's what happened with Sophia.
- [06:38]
B
So tell me, after you started, you know, you heard about that case, the Sabrina case, you heard about First Liberty, what did you do?
- [06:46]
C
Well, my mom reached out to them, and it just kind of landslide from there. Like, they said they would take our case, and then the news got involved, and then they sent the letter to my school, and within a couple days, like, the case was over, and, you know, it got approved, and I got to repaint it and everything, and.
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B
Yeah, so you got to repaint it with your original design in the Bible verse.
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C
Yeah.
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B
Okay, Keisha, tell me about that whole process.
- [07:15]
D
So once Sophia and her mom contacted us, we look at what they have, the evidence they have, the emails they've sent. And in this situation, it was a little different than New York because the school actually had the guidelines posted on their website, which banned any religious imagery at all. The other different thing about this case was that throughout the district, other seniors were allowed to put religious things on their parking spaces. So now you have this sort of inconsistent policy being applied differently, which makes the case very difficult for the school district, because it's harder for them to say, oh, we're controlling this. This is just government speech, when clearly they're not and so when we wrote the letter, we included all of that, and we just said, look, we'd like to resolve this amicably with a letter, but we are willing to sue if you continue to violate her rights. And so we're asking you to change your policy and let Sophia paint what she wanted to paint. And then the news gets involved. And that is also helps with the pressure and helps to sort of reveal what the school district is doing, and it makes it much harder for them to continue it. So that was kind of how things got going. And then eventually, after a couple weeks, the school district relented, and not only did they let Sophia repaint her spot, but they changed their entire policy, removing the religious restrictions and open up the program again for students who had painted their spot but wanted to repaint it with something religious. So really, really great.
- [08:48]
Outcome in this case. Yeah.
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B
So why are we seeing schools do this? Why are they coming up with this policy that doesn't allow Bible verses, even references to Christianity or a painting of a parable? Like, what is their thinking behind that?
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D
Well, it's hard to say because I think different officials have different thinking on it. A lot of people ask me, do I think it's because the districts just don't know any better, Are they trying to, you know, figure out the law? And I think sometimes that's the case. But I actually do think that some. Some of the school districts know that they really shouldn't be doing it, but they don't expect the students to fight back. They don't expect the students to get a lawyer, certainly. So for every, say, one Sophia, there are probably hundreds of students who back down and never fight back and paint the backwards fish or the smiley face of the flower instead. So, you know, I think there's a combination of things going on. But I also think sort of the anti Christian bias in schools is pretty strong, particularly in public schools, obviously, because, you know, it's just Christianity is often targeted in the culture and it begins in the schools. And I always tell people, you know, our schools are supposed to be teaching our students what the Constitution it means and how it applies to them. It's their first interaction with the Constitution, with government. If the school teaches students that the Constitution doesn't apply to them or religion is something to be ashamed of or to ban, then that's what the students are going to think as they grow up.
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B
Have you seen that policies like this are being unevenly applied? You seem to reference that earlier that it's not just a general rule that Applies to everyone equally, right?
- [10:31]
D
Yeah. So, yes, that. That's absolutely the case. There are several school districts, including this one, actually, that we. When you look into the history, you see that they've banned Christian clubs, or they censor Christian clubs, but they allow other clubs to advertise and promote what they're doing and share what they want to share and have posters. But then the Christian club wants to do the same. And all of a sudden it becomes, oh, no, you can't post a P.O. put a poster up with. With, you know, scripture on it, or you can't talk about the fact that you have a Christian club because it's religious and you shouldn't be able to share it. So I've seen a lot of inconsistence, inconsistency in applying policies like this. And it's not just with parking spaces like religious clubs. It happens a lot.
- [11:18]
And with speech in general. Representing a. A teacher right now in Connecticut whose name is Marisol Castro. She keeps a crucifix by her desk, you know, next to her wall calendar. All the other teachers are allowed to decide what they want to put in their personal spaces. But she was removed from the classroom because she chooses to have a crucifix there instead of a New England Patriots flag or something like that. And so we're fighting that case in federal court right now.
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B
And is that a trend that you're seeing across the board, not just in our education system, but specifically Christian beliefs on display seem to unfair discrimination and scrutiny?
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D
Absolutely. All the time.
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C
Absolutely.
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D
100 the case. And that's why First Liberty is so busy. We have.
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B
Right.
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D
We have more requests than we can ever take because Christians are constantly being censored. They're constantly being banned when everyone around them is allowed to say what they want. But then the Christian wants to say something spiritual or they want to quote a scripture, and they're not allowed to do that. So Marisol's case is pretty indicative of what's going on. Going on. You know, all the other teachers are allowed to say what they want. They're allowed to have a baby Yoda, or they're allowed to represent whatever football team or anything like that. But because she chooses to have a religious symbol next to her desk, she's the one who gets ousted out of the classroom. So it's. I. I don't like that it's the trend, but it absolutely is. And it's the reason why, you know, our firm is in high demand right now.
- [12:59]
B
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- [14:13]
Sophia, tell me a little bit more just about your upbringing and about your faith. Obviously this is a huge part of your life or you could have very easily said this is not that important to me, but you chose to fight, which means it is very important to you. So just tell me more about your background.
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C
Yeah, so I grew up in a Christian household, always going to church on Sunday. And you know, my parents did a really good job of. Even though we were moving every two years because of my dad's job, we were always finding a home in the church. And my grandparents are really religious and you know, I always grew up like very Christian and loving God. And you know, freshman year was very hard for me. I went through something and you know, it changed a lot. And I stopped believing in God for a bit because, you know, you question your faith, you question how much he actually loves you and if he's really real. And you know, I, he found me again. You know, that's why I relate to the parable so much because Jesus found me. I was that lost sheep. And you know, ever since then I've been fully devoted in being a steward of God and being a child of God and that's who I am. And that's. I want to walk in every room and everybody be able to see like Jesus's love, like radiant, radiating off of me, you know, and that's why, you know, just I wanted to pursue it so bad because I just want to live every day to the fullest and resembling God.
- [15:46]
B
Yeah. Have there been other times you go to public school in Colorado? Have There been other times where you felt like you were that fish swimming upstream or it's been hard to be a Christian at your high school.
- [15:57]
C
I just feel like every day like schools are getting so worth, like worldly, you know, this world. And I feel like for Christians, it's so hard to like see everybody who don't like, believe or don't know Jesus love. And, you know, it's so important to find those God filled communities within your school.
- [16:17]
B
Yeah. What advice would you give other teenagers who might be in a similar position and they're trying to find the boldness to represent their faith when they're trying to go against the grain? What would you tell them?
- [16:30]
C
I just feel like at the end of the day, we're all stewards of God's love and we're all here to represent him. Like it's not our world, it's his world. It's all for him and he loves us so much. And I just feel like we just need to resent, like resemble him and represent him as best as we can.
- [16:47]
B
Yeah. Keisha, what advice would you give parents? Like, what, what rights do they have when it comes to these situations and maybe other situations when it comes to our education system? Some parents feel like they've like lost their kids to the public school and they may not realize they actually have some tools to stand up.
- [17:06]
D
Yeah, I mean, I think you, you have to really be intentional about knowing what's going on because the schools are not gonna, you know, be very transparent in some cases. And so you really have to, to want to know what's happening and to be very engaged and just to know that you have rights as a parent. I mean, the Supreme Court has just ruled in, in a very monumental decision in Mahmoud versus Taylor.
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B
Yeah.
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D
That schools are not allowed to indoctrinate your children without your consent and your ability to opt out of, you know, controversial sexual content in many, in many cases. And parents need to exercise those rights. They need to make it clear to the schools what they believe and what they will tolerate and not tolerate. The other thing is, I think we should really be looking to expand school choice, obviously, because, you know, competition is going to increase the quality of what's going on, I think, in public schools. And if public schools see a mass exodus of parents going to private schools and they're going to have to change what they're doing if they want to continue to operate and, and have funding. And so, you know, parents have, have a lot of power that oftentimes they don't exercise But I also wanted to say that, you know, teaching your children to stand up for themselves is a really important thing, because you're not always going to be there to walk them through their Christianity and walk them through the trials and the inevitable difficulties that come in life. And so if you raise someone like Sophia to stand up for themselves and encourage them to, you know, watch people who are gonna, you know.
- [18:44]
Motivate them, inspire them. And I know you were friends with Charlie Kirk, and I know that she was very much inspired by his life. And she's part of the fruit, the good fruit that has come from Charlie, you know, expressing his faith and sticking up for his faith. And so, you know, that fruit continues to spread when she. When Sabrina does what she does, you do what you do, you decide to stick up for yourself. And so many other people will see her and. And be inspired and motivated. So, anyway, we're so proud of you. And anyway, I wanted you to know that about her being inspired by Charlie, because I think his legacy is just continuing.
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B
Yeah.
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D
And the gerd fruit that has come from his life is just really, really obvious.
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B
So can you talk more about that, about how you found Charlie and his content and how it maybe impacted you?
- [19:35]
C
Yeah, so I think I first found him on Instagram. I was just scrolling on reels, and I was like, I like this guy.
- [19:42]
B
Yeah.
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C
You know, like, he's such a relatable guy. I love his content. I love how he fights for what's right, whether it be Republican views or Christian views. And I just really agreed with a lot of things he was saying. And, yeah, I had watched him, like, every single day. Like, I'd wanted to go to the college things to go meet him, and, you know, it was really heartbreaking what happened, you know, to see this person that I looked up to and, you know, wanted to be like and express my views just like him for that to happen.
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B
And, yeah, yeah, we've seen a lot of young people, colleges, high schools, be impacted not only by his life and his words, but also his death. Like, I can think of some young people in my lives who, yeah, they might have been Christian conservative, but then after that happened to Charlie, it just. I don't know, it emboldened them in some way. How would you say the past couple of months have affected you?
- [20:41]
C
I just feel like really looking at the views, like, oh, if you believe something, then you can die for it, you know, and that's what Jesus did. Jesus believed in something so strongly that he died for it, you know, and part of that is so unfair. But I feel like that's all how we should all live. Like, we should stand for something so boldly and so strongly that we should be able to put our life on the line and be like, I am willing to die for this. And that's what I'm hoping to be like one day. Like, I want to die for Jesus. Well, I don't want to die for Jesus, but I would die for Jesus. I'd stand on that hill. If people are coming at me, I. You know, I just want to stand strong for that.
- [21:25]
B
Yeah. Would you say that among the people that, you know, your friends, that they have this kind of, like, new vigor for their faith? In the past couple of months? Is this a trend that you've seen in your own life?
- [21:38]
C
Oh, definitely. I feel like people who weren't religious and didn't see things, you know, the same way are coming to me and my friends and being like, how are you? How are you feeling about this? How do you see this? Like, what is some advice? And I feel like so many people are, you know, coming to Christ, and I think that's such a good thing. Like, the things that Charlie did and what he died for was so monumental that I think it's just a big revival of the newer generation and stuff like that.
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B
Yeah. Praise God. I hope that that's true. Kesha, if you're looking at the landscape from your legal perspective. I know, I know I'm holding back tears myself.
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And, you know, even just as a Christian, like. And you're like, gosh, I wish that the average person knew this. That's what's going on, or what they could do. What. What would that be?
- [22:33]
D
I wish, you know, Christians knew and felt that God calls us to be bold as a lion and that we're not supposed to cower, that we're not supposed to give in, and we're not supposed to just get run over. Like, that is not true kindness. That is not true empathy. That, you know, standing in truth is really what God wants from us. He wants us to be bold and courageous and stand up for him. And I think so many people in the Bible sort of display that. That kind of courage and boldness where they're willing to. To risk everything.
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B
Yeah.
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D
For the truth and for the gospel. And I see a lot of, like, just weak need Christians, and. And I understand, you know, I. I, in some ways am in a very sort of powerful position, being a lawyer, religious liberty lawyer, a constitutional lawyer, and so I know how to stand up for myself. And for my clients. But God is there all the time, and you don't need me or First Liberty to do that. Like you, God is always going to be with you, to stand with you boldly and firmly and give you what you need in order to. To stand up for him. And so I wish Christians really understood the power of boldness and they really understood that that is what God wants from us. You know, he wants us to be the proclaimers of truth and shout from the rooftops what God has done for us. And I don't think he wants anything less from us than that.
- [23:56]
B
That's such a good point. That it's not Christian just to be a doormat. That doesn't mean that we use violence or retaliation or vengeance, but standing up not just for our own rights, but on behalf of others who come after Sophia and who come after those who are willing to say, hang on, this is not right. It's not just about me, but it's also about all of these other people who maybe don't have the ability to speak up for themselves. And I just think, as you're speaking, just the unique ability that we have as Americans to be able to use the Constitution to our advantage, to be able to exercise those rights. For most of Christian history, there has not been a legal means by which they can say, I have a right to practice this in government. You cannot stop me. I think people don't realize how special that is. I'm sure that means a lot to you.
- [24:50]
D
Absolutely. And you're 100 right. It's such a unique thing that we have in. In America. It's not. It's not everywhere, and it's not guaranteed either. You know, I tell people, China has promised its citizens, you know, the right to free speech, the right to freedom of religion, but we know that they don't get that because the courts don't enforce it. The government gets to do what it wants. And so if we are in a position where we continue to cower and bow down and let the government do whatever it wants whenever it wants, we won't have any rights left. And so we constantly do have to fight for that. Like the Constitution is a promise between the government and the American people. And it's up to the American people to hold the government to that promise.
- [25:39]
B
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- [26:33]
Kesha, can you talk a little bit more about your background? How did you start doing what you do?
- [26:38]
D
Yeah, so I, I did not grow up as a Christian at all, didn't go to church. My parents are not Christians, but I went on a college tour when I was 17 with the salvation army. And I didn't know they were a church because I was unchurched, obviously. I just thought they were humanitarian. And during that college tour they would have these dinners where they were obviously in or voluntary. And I got saved during one of those dinners. They preached the gospel and I got saved and, and then from there it was just kind of a whirlwind.
- [27:09]
B
Had you ever heard the gospel before? Was it totally new to you?
- [27:13]
D
It was. I'd been to church before, like with my grandmother and like a friend or two, but I never heard the gospel like I did that night. And then I. It's like something opened in me and I knew, I understood what was being said and what was being offered and I definitely wanted it. I always wanted truth and I wanted God and I always knew there was a God, but I didn't know what that meant in terms of who you accept, who you don't. Right. And so once I accepted Christ, I, you know, went to college. And.
- [27:45]
It wasn't until after college I was discipled and found a good church community. This was in Atlanta at that point. And I started teaching 4th and 5th grade special education students. And I felt God use me in that role because they were emotional, behavioral students. They were kids who weren't allowed to be in the classroom like the normal classroom anymore. And they really needed love and, and patience and dedication and commitment. And God really just. I felt God used me every single day to change those students and to show them that they were worth more than what they saw in their neighborhood, that they could do more, they could be more. And so I saw them change and transform before my eyes. And so I was, I call it being ruined for the ordinary. Like I knew I was ever never going to be able to do anything ordinary again. Like, everything I did was going to have to be an expression of God. And so I did the teaching. And then I felt really strongly called to go to law school, which I did not want to do, like, at all, really.
- [28:48]
B
Wow.
- [28:49]
D
I did not. And so it kind of chased me for a while and finally said, okay, I'll apply, but I'm never going to get in. You know, I. But if God wants me to do it, I will. But I was not expecting to get in. So eventually ended up at Emory Law in Atlanta, where there's a center for the study of law and religion. And that's where I was introduced to this amazing practice area called religious liberty. And so I studied under a rabbi whose name was Mark Goldfetter. He worked for aclj, that's Jay Sekula's organization. And so I did a lot of work for the Jewish community in the United States. And at the time, the Israel was running the legal committee the United nations, so we did some work there, too. So really robust work. I was doing a lot of great things as a law school student those last two years. And from there, I was introduced to First Liberty and became an intern.
- [29:46]
Worked full time there as an intern and studied for the bar exam, which I don't recommend anyone ever do. Passed. And then they hired me. And so I've been there since 2017.
- [29:57]
B
Wow.
- [29:57]
D
Yeah.
- [29:58]
B
So, you know, your journey is so unique, and I know that's not the primary reason that we came on today, but I just love hearing about it. It's interesting, too. Okay, so you became a Christian after being raised totally secular, and you taught in Atlanta, and you went to law school in Atlanta, and somehow you're also a conservative.
- [30:17]
D
Yeah.
- [30:17]
B
Like, that is also very unique. Were you raised kind of with the principles of the Constitution and things like that, or.
- [30:24]
D
No, no, no, none of that.
- [30:28]
No, I. I actually was surrounded by people who I didn't think like, at all.
- [30:33]
B
Yeah.
- [30:34]
D
And so. And I really never connected a lot of my thinking to being a Christian until later. I. I just didn't make the connection. But a lot of it. A lot of the. The sort of disagreements I had with people, especially in Atlanta, would be about race. And, you know, I was just so maybe overconfident in God, you know, And I would just say, nobody's gonna take anything from me that God wants for me. I don't care how I look. And you'd be surprised how many people wanted to push back on that. But I think that's why I'm here, is because I was just, God can do anything, you know, and it was very much like, you know, throw your. Your water on the altar and God will still like the fire, you know, so that's kind of where I was. I was just very, like, bold and didn't want anyone to stand in my way. And I wasn't willing to sort of succumb to the conversations that say, because you're black or because you're a woman or because you're young or whatever, there are things you can't do. And I know that because I'm on God's side, I can do anything. And so that it did cause a lot of friction because I wasn't really around a lot of people who thought like me. And I can tell you, even in church sometimes I was criticized for my thinking or my beliefs, and it just never stopped me. And it still hasn't. I mean, I have people now who say, oh, you're such an accomplished lawyer. Why do you take cases about a parking space or about a teacher and a crucifix? Like, you could go be a corporate lawyer and make millions of dollars. Like, why are you wasting your time? I thought. But this is where the value is. This is where this is. What God wants is for us to conquer territory for his kingdom. And that's what we do every single day. And so I. I think, think it's an amazing thing. It's that God wants me to do this, that God has asked me to be a lawyer. And the least I could do is dedicate my, you know, my law license to doing what God has asked me to do, as opposed to whatever the world thinks is more important or whatever. So this is. I think this is the most important thing, you know, for me to do right now. That doesn't mean God will always have me here, but I'm willing to do what he wants with this license, with this opportunity. Not everyone gets it, Gets this. This opportunity. So I just feel very blessed and very grateful.
- [32:50]
B
Yeah. Wow. I'm just tearing up because I'm just thinking about even just the three of us here. We're representative of three different realms. You know, we're. We're probably close to the same age, but maybe like three different ages, three different spheres, you know, three different sets of gifts. And it just goes to show that God uses all of his people and their different talents to all work together to advance his kingdom. I love what you said about conquering territory for the kingdom. That is A mentality that more Christians need to have. And by the way, like, that is for the stay at home mom too. That territory may be your home. Like, it may be your neighborhood, it may be your next door neighbor. And sharing the gospel, it doesn't necessarily mean being a lawyer, being a podcaster. It's being a faithful student. Maybe that territory is a parking spot. Like, you just. It's. It's doing the next thing in. In faith and in obedience to God. And God uses all of this unseen and unsung work and acts of obedience to tell this incredible story.
- [33:53]
D
Right?
- [33:54]
B
And we won't even know the fullness of the story until we get to the other side of glory. But, like, what a privilege it is for us to be a part of it. Like, it's, it's very exciting.
- [34:03]
D
It's such a magical thing to experience, you know, And I mean that. And sort of it's just like divinely inspired. Because before I decided to go be a teacher and I felt led to do that, I wanted to be in media. I wanted to be a reporter on tv. And I just think it's such a blessing that God even allows me to talk about my cases on media. It's sort of like just like this kiss of, I know this is what you wanted, you know, and I'm just gonna give you a little bit of that too. It's just. It's such a beautiful thing, what God has done in my life and what I see him do every day in the lives of my clients. So, yeah, it's an amazing thing.
- [34:38]
B
Yes. Praise God. Sophia, are there any just last words of encouragement you'd want to give the people who are watching and listening?
- [34:46]
C
Yeah, just go through every single day, like being a steward of God, you know, like, we should live every single day to the fullest to represent him and, you know, live gracefully and. Yeah, nothing's unstoppable without God. And you should know that he loves you always.
- [35:05]
B
Yeah. Amen. Anywhere that they can go to find out more of what you're doing in First Liberty is doing.
- [35:12]
D
Yeah. So First Liberty.org is where you can go to find out more about our cases. You can also sign up for an amazing newsletter where we talk about our cases, we talk about what's going on in the world of religious liberty. We also talk about judges, which is really, really important because the Constitution doesn't matter if you have judges who are not willing to uphold it. And so you can find all that there. It's FLI Insiders, the newsletter you get it every couple days, every week or something like that. And they will update you and and ask you to pray for our clients who go through a lot when they stand up to the government. It's not easy to do it, and a lot of them face a lot of backlash in their respective communities. So you can go there and find that out. I also wrote a book this year called Uncommon Courage, Defending Truth and Freedom While there's Still time. And I talk a lot about what I do and how Christians can be more bold, like, what are the practical steps you can take?
- [36:09]
B
So, yeah, that's awesome. Well, thank you all both so much. God bless you both, and I'm so thankful for both of your courage.
- [36:15]
D
Thank you for having us.