Podcast Summary:

Relatable with Allie Beth Stuckey
Episode 1290 | Why Is Israel Dividing the Right? Here's the Real Reason | Dr. Frank Turek
Date: January 19, 2026

Overview

This episode, recorded at AmFest, features three key conversations: first with Dr. Frank Turek (apologist and author), then with Lucas Miles (Senior Director at TPUSA Faith and pastor), and finally Blake Knapp (longtime producer for Charlie Kirk). Allie discusses the intersection of Christianity, conservatism, and current controversies concerning Israel, division on the political right, and the legacy of the late Charlie Kirk. The episode aims to provide clarity, encouragement, and practical wisdom for listeners navigating complicated topics within Christian and conservative spheres.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. How to Respond to Accusations and Conspiracy Theories

• Frank Turek discusses recent accusations against TPUSA after Charlie Kirk's death, notably conspiracy theories pushed by Candace Owens and others (01:14–06:34).
  • Spiritual Warfare Context: Frank frames these accusations as spiritual warfare, drawing parallels to how both Jesus and New Testament writers characterized Satan as a "murderer, liar, slanderer, and accuser."

    "We had a murder, and then what did we have that followed it? Lies, accusations, and slander. This is spiritual warfare." — Frank Turek (02:20)

  • Responding Biblically: Frank cites the Apostle Paul’s willingness to confront false teachers and stresses the importance of defending truth and integrity.
  • Clarifying the Legal Process: He explains that investigators do not disclose case details, referencing his experience being questioned by the FBI because of accusations in online theories. This, he notes, is standard procedure to avoid compromising investigations or witnesses.

    "Anybody that's done a prosecution, particularly a murder trial, will tell you this is the way they do it." — Frank Turek (06:18)

  • Boundaries for Christian Discourse: Frank emphasizes that asking questions is reasonable, but not if the questions carry embedded, unfounded accusations.

2. Division Over Israel on the Right

• The hosts and Frank Turek explore why Israel is such a divisive subject among conservatives and Christians (07:33–12:31).
  • Antisemitism is Not Conservative:

    "Jew hatred is not a conservative value. So why would we want to be conserving Jew hatred to begin with?" — Frank Turek (07:38)

  • Criticism vs. Hatred: Frank distinguishes between thoughtful criticism of Israeli policy and outright antisemitism, urging people to read foundational documents like the Hamas Charter.

    "The Hamas charter basically says that the only way forward is, is to kill Jews. Jihad is the only way." — Frank Turek (08:26)

  • Christian Support for Israel: Frank argues for “wounds of a friend” — supporting Israel when it’s right but critiquing when it’s wrong, noting that blessing does not mean rubber-stamping everything a nation or person does.
  • Search for Consensus: Allie asks whether consensus is possible; Frank says Christians must speak the truth and trust results to God. He highlights the disproportionate land mass held by surrounding Muslim countries as a crucial context for debates about Israeli policy.
  • Moral Clarity: Frank gives an analogy to cartel violence in Mexico as a way to frame clarity about good and evil in the Israel/Hamas conflict.

    "To say who are the good guys and bad guys in this... somehow when it comes to Israel, we lose our minds. I think it's demonic." — Frank Turek (11:45)

  • Hope for Christians: Concludes with a Gospel focus, tying the conversation back to grace and Christ’s work.

    "Christianity is the answer to the problem of evil. If we had never sinned, there'd be no reason for Jesus to come to earth. But because of our sin, he came to earth. And by trusting in him, we are forgiven. That's the real message of Christmas." — Frank Turek (12:03)

3. Mentorship, Pastoral Courage & Cultural Engagement (Lucas Miles Interview)

• Marriage and Faith Foundations: Lucas celebrates 25 years of marriage, attributes it to the Gospel, humility, communication, and mentorship (13:54–15:56).

  "If you don't understand that you by yourself are completely depraved and you have no righteousness of your own... it allows you to have those conversations." — Lucas Miles (14:09)

• Mentorship Gaps: Addresses the current gap between older and younger Christians, encouraging initiative from those seeking mentorship.
• Pastoral Challenges:
  • Sunday always comes—pastors must feed their own souls, not just create content.
  • Hesitance to address “controversial” issues stems from fear of losing the congregation, finances, or political ramifications.
  • Many pastors, especially those educated in more progressive or “woke” institutions, aren’t equipped to handle topics like Marxism, CRT, or Islam.
• Three Types of Pastors (17:08):
  • True pastors
  • Traitorous pastors
  • Trembling pastors (know the truth but fear acting on it)
• Charlie Kirk’s Legacy of Courage:

  "Courage is easy. All you have to do is say yes... Here I am, Lord, send me." — Paraphrasing Charlie Kirk (17:44)

• Woke Pastors & Social Justice: Allie and Lucas recall how many fumbled after George Floyd, often echoing secular scripts instead of proclaiming biblical truth.
  • Many failed to repent for missteps, due to lack of education in liberation theology or fear of upsetting diverse congregations.

  "When you don't have a history and you want to be likable... your job is actually to proclaim the full counsel of the word of God. But you think your job is to gather people because that's what feels like success." — Lucas Miles (21:28)

• Living Out the Gospel Publicly: Plans to continue courageously engaging secular culture with a tour called "Make Heaven Crowded."

4. The Impact and Legacy of Charlie Kirk (with Blake Knapp)

• Transition from Background to Spotlight: Blake, longtime producer, describes being thrust forward after Charlie’s death and the emotional weight of public life (27:33–28:29).
• Dealing with Conspiracy Theories:
  • He expresses frustration and pain at watching innocent colleagues be targeted by baseless accusations, linking the dynamic to “cruelty justified as moral righteousness.”

  "There are few things more intoxicating than to be told that you can do cruelty to someone and it's morally righteous… The left loves to do that… it's unfortunate to see that come out of this tragedy." — Blake (29:58)

  • Outlines the internal debate about whether or when to respond to online speculation (30:57), ultimately deciding to defend the falsely accused for their own morale and in the interest of truth.
• Restoring Focus to the Mission:
  • Decision making now rests with Erica Kirk, who, as Charlie’s widow, has authority over Turning Point’s course.
  • The battle going forward: focus on spiritual and national revival, not distractions.

  "Charlie's life's work was not responding to weird theories about him. Charlie's life's work was spiritual revival, American revival, young people revival, successful families, having children..." — Blake (32:34)

• Entering a New Era of Conservatism:
  • 2026 is seen as a turning point for the movement, coinciding with an election cycle and the “post-Trump” conservative coalition.
  • Recognizes that debates about Israel, while intense, are not as foundational as debates about the Constitution or American identity; optimism for eventual synthesis and unity (36:21–40:13).
• Historical Perspective & Individual Responsibility:
  • Offers historical parallels to fractured periods in America’s past that eventually gave way to triumph.

  "The founders were black pilled during what we now know was the beginning of a very global, glorious century for America." — Blake (40:34)

  • Calls listeners to "live like Charlie," cultivating discipline, virtue, and agency—"the sort of thing anyone can do."

  "Most of what made Charlie amazing was this: the ability that is perfectly accessible to an ordinary person." — Blake (42:12)

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• Frank Turek on Spiritual Warfare:

  "Jew hatred is not a conservative value… If you hate Jews? I don't consider yourself a conservative." (07:38)

• Frank Turek on Investigation Procedures:

  "Anybody that's done a prosecution, particularly a murder trial, will tell you this is the way they do it." (06:18)

• Lucas Miles on Pastoral Fear:

  "There’s true pastors, and there’s traitorous pastors, and then there’s this middle category of trembling pastors..." (17:12)

• Blake Knapp on Team Response to Accusations:

  "There are few things more intoxicating than to be told that you can do cruelty to someone and it's morally righteous to do so..." (29:58) "Charlie's life's work was not responding to weird theories about him. Charlie's life's work was spiritual revival, American revival, young people revival, successful families, having children..." (32:34)

• Blake Knapp on the Timelessness of Charlie Kirk:

  "Charlie does not fade away. He is always as bright as he was that day at Utah Valley... They shall not grow old." (34:33)

• Blake Knapp on Ordinary Heroism:

  "You can cultivate discipline, you can cultivate virtue, you can cultivate agency... Most of what made Charlie amazing was this: the ability that is perfectly accessible to an ordinary person." (42:12)

Timestamps for Key Segments

• [01:14] – Frank Turek on spiritual warfare and Candace Owens’ accusations
• [03:22] – On the complexities of asking questions vs. making accusations
• [06:34] – Clarifying legal procedures and authorities in the Kirk case
• [07:33] – Why is Israel dividing the right?
• [08:26] – The Hamas charter and its implications
• [10:19] – Christian approach to Israel and support for Jewish people
• [13:54] – Lucas Miles on marriage, faith, and mentorship
• [17:08] – Types of pastors: true, traitorous, trembling
• [20:19] – Pastors' response to race and justice post-2020
• [22:30] – Charlie Kirk's passion and legacy
• [27:33] – Introduction of Blake Knapp
• [28:55] – On conspiracy theories and internal team decisions
• [32:34] – Returning mission focus after Charlie’s death
• [36:21] – AmFest as a pivot point in conservatism
• [40:34] – Historical lessons for American unity and renewal
• [41:58] – What every individual can do: live like Charlie

Conclusion

This episode delivers a multifaceted, heartfelt look at the turbulence and opportunities currently facing the Christian conservative movement. With biblical and historical wisdom, the guests urge listeners to pursue truth, unity, and courageous public faith while keeping Charlie Kirk’s legacy alive by focusing on what truly matters—revival, relationships, and living out the Gospel in the public square.