Podcast
Relating to DevSecOps
Hosted by Ken Toler and Mike McCabe · EN
A Podcast dedicated to forging iron clad relationships between developers, engineers, operations, and security practitioners by discussing hot topics in the world of DevSecOps. This podcast aims to air out some of the common gripes, misconceptions, and hardships that these teams face in the real world every day.
11episodes
Episodes
Newest firstAll episodes
Episode #083: AI Mythos, Security Fundamentals, and the Zero-Day Panic Cycle
Apr 2900:43:38Tap to summarizeSend us Fan MailKen and Mike are back in the AI trenches, this time unpacking the hype, fear, and practical security implications surrounding Anthropic’s Mythos preview. As the industry reacts to claims around AI-driven vulnerability discovery and exploit generation, the hosts ask a more important question: are we actually ready to fix what we already know is broken?The conversation cuts through the zero-day panic and focuses on the fundamentals that still matter: patching, hardening, reducing attack surface, validating AI-generated code, and keeping deterministic security checks in place. From supply chain attacks and GitHub Actions misconfigurations to agentic development workflows and the future of CI/CD, Ken and Mike explore where AI may genuinely change the threat landscape and where security teams are still fighting the same old battles.If your organization is rushing to build faster with AI, this episode is a reminder to also use it to build better.
Transcribe →Episode #082: AI Hype, Human Cost
Mar 1700:44:25Tap to summarizeSend us Fan MailKen and Mike are back from the grave to kick off 2026 with a timely debate on the AI panic cycle hitting software and security. They dig into the biggest questions flying around the industry right now: Is AI taking developer and security jobs? Is SaaS dying? Is software engineering being replaced by vibe coding and agents? From maker-checker workflows and token costs to AI-generated bugs, false positives, and attackers using autonomous tooling to move faster, this episode cuts through the hype from both the doomer and evangelist camps. The conclusion: software isn’t dead, security definitely isn’t solved, and the teams that adapt their craft instead of abandoning it will be the ones that keep up.
Transcribe →Episode #081: Burnout by Budget Season: Surviving Q4 in Security
Oct 2900:21:57Tap to summarizeSend us Fan MailIn this candid and cathartic episode, Ken and Mike unpack the chaos that is Q4 for security professionals. From budget burnouts to end-of-year pentesting sprints, they explore why the final months of the year feel like a perfect storm for stress. Tune in as they share hard-earned lessons, practical advice for maintaining your sanity, and some gentle reminders that not everything needs to ship before Christmas. Whether you’re a tired vendor, an overwhelmed engineer, or just trying to make it to PTO, this episode is for you.
Transcribe →Episode #080: Patch Me If You Can: Compliance, SLAs, and Other Fairytales
Aug 2500:34:05Tap to summarizeSend us Fan MailIn this no-punches-pulled return from hiatus, Ken and Mike dig deep into the messy middle of vulnerability management, SLA fatigue, and the illusion of compliance. Are we building secure systems or just passing audits? From legacy cruft to exploitable CVEs, this episode unpacks the real-world pressures of SOC 2, the auditor dance, and whether fixing every “critical” is even feasible.Perfect for practitioners trying to balance the checkbox culture with actual risk reduction, this one’s got stories, strategies, and spicy takes. Bonus: tips on managing auditors without losing your mind—or your security posture.
Transcribe →Episode #079: CISOver It: When Dashboards Replace Direction
Jun 1000:37:00Tap to summarizeSend us Fan MailIn this episode of Relating to DevSecOps, Ken and Mike discuss the challenges faced by CISOs in today's security landscape, particularly the struggle to balance immediate security needs with long-term preventative strategies. They explore the disconnect between security leadership and practitioners, the urgency of addressing security issues, and the importance of understanding the root causes of vulnerabilities. The conversation emphasizes the need for CISOs to engage more deeply with their teams and to focus on effective, context-driven security solutions rather than simply reacting to the latest threats.
Transcribe →Episode #078: 🔥 Burn Your 30-page Policies: Tanya’s Got Better Ideas
Apr 22, 202500:46:48Tap to summarizeSend us Fan MailIn this must-listen episode of Relating to DevSecOps, Ken welcomes the ever-inspiring Tanya Janca, aka SheHacksPurple—author, AppSec expert, and champion of making security usable. Together, they dig into why so many application security policies fail, why developers ignore them, and how to make them actually work. Tanya shares real-world experiences from both dev and security perspectives, plus her journey from being ignored to lobbying governments for change.From communication failures and TL;DR policy pages to leveraging wikis and code reuse, this episode is a practical masterclass in creating impactful, developer-friendly security standards.
Transcribe →Episode #077: Is Google Eating the Cloud? 🔥 Wiz.io Acquisition Hot Takes
Mar 24, 202500:31:59Tap to summarizeSend us Fan MailIn this episode of Relating to DevSecOps, Ken Toler and Mike McCabe dive deep into Google's blockbuster acquisition of Wiz.io for a reported $32 billion. They explore the implications for cloud security, the consolidation of the DevSecOps tooling landscape, and how this move compares to Google’s previous acquisitions like Mandiant and Chronicle. The duo debates the future of multi-cloud strategies, platform fatigue, and whether Wiz will remain the darling of the security community—or get lost in the labyrinth of Google Cloud products. With sharp insights and a dash of hot takes, they paint a picture of a cloud security ecosystem at a pivotal turning point
Transcribe →Episode #076: ShmooBalls & Open Source Brawls: DevSecOps, Risk, and the Final ShmooCon
Feb 4, 202500:33:32Tap to summarizeSend us Fan MailWelcome to 2025! Ken and Mike kick off the new year with their security resolutions (or lack thereof) before diving into the bittersweet farewell to ShmooCon, one of the most beloved hacker conferences. Ken shares his experiences from the final event, including insights on hardware hacking, radio security, and the unique hacker culture that made ShmooCon special.They also unpack one of the most practical talks from the conference: a deep dive into open source security tools versus enterprise solutions, highlighting ways security teams can cut costs without sacrificing effectiveness. Speaking of open source, the hosts discuss the controversy surrounding Semgrep’s licensing changes and the rise of OpenGrep, the latest community-driven fork in response to closed-source shifts—drawing parallels to the Terraform/OpenTofu saga.Finally, the duo explores cyber risk from an insurance perspective, breaking down how breaches translate into real-world financial costs (hint: mailing breach notifications alone could bankrupt you). Whether you're a security pro, an open source advocate, or just here for the ShmooBall nostalgia, this episode has something for you!
Transcribe →Episode #075: Ghosts of DevSecOps: Past, Present, and Future
Dec 24, 202400:36:08Tap to summarizeSend us Fan MailIn this special holiday-themed episode of Relating to DevSecOps, hosts Ken and Mike channel their inner Dickens with a retrospective journey through the "Ghosts of DevSecOps Past, Present, and Future." From lessons learned about security awareness and collaboration challenges of the past, to the growing pains and contradictions of today’s implementation of security basics, they explore it all. Wrapping up with a hopeful look at future innovations like policy-as-code and preemptive security measures, the hosts outline their visions for a more integrated and automated security future. Packed with insights, humor, and holiday spirit, this is a must-listen for those charting the path forward in DevSecOps.
Transcribe →Episode #074: Battling Budgets in Security
Dec 9, 202400:36:11Tap to summarizeSend us Fan MailIn this episode of Relating to DevSecOps, hosts Ken and Mike tackle the complex challenges of managing security budgets in organizations of all sizes. From small, scrappy teams to sprawling enterprises, they explore how security leaders can navigate tight financial constraints while maintaining strong security postures. They share insights on integrating security into IT operations, leveraging open-source tools, and rethinking traditional budget allocations. Whether you’re a CISO grappling with scaling or a developer looking to improve security outcomes, this discussion is packed with actionable strategies and thought-provoking debates on the future of security spendinghttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8U3QzJBCNZ0
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