Podcast Summary: ReThinking with Adam Grant
Episode: Building Confidence with Mentalist Oz Pearlman
Release Date: December 2, 2025
Host: Adam Grant
Guest: Oz Pearlman
Episode Overview
In this lively episode, Adam Grant sits down with renowned mentalist and performer Oz Pearlman to unpack the psychology behind confidence, risk-taking, and creating memorable moments. Recorded during an Authors at Wharton series event, the conversation blends live mentalism demonstrations, personal anecdotes, and practical advice on conquering fear and making genuine connections. Pearlman peels back the curtain on his journey from Wall Street to the finals of America’s Got Talent, emphasizing the transferable tricks and mental frameworks that foster resilience far beyond the stage.
Key Discussion Points & Insights
Can Mentalists Really Read Minds?
- Oz addresses the myth: “I cannot read people's minds.”
[02:45] - The desire to believe in something beyond the visible motivates audiences to seek 'real magic,' even when science is powerful.
— “People want to believe in something more than what they see. ... Even the most scientific person...has some level of wanting to know what is possible.”
[02:48]
From Wall Street to Showman
- Oz left a finance career for magic and mentalism, eventually performing for celebrity audiences and presidents.
[03:19]
Memorable Moment: Live Mentalism Demonstration
- [03:58–05:08]: Pearlman has Adam throw a frisbee into the audience to select a volunteer. He deduces the name of a trusted person the volunteer is thinking of with precision, showcasing his skill at reading subtle cues, not minds.
- “It doesn't say world's greatest mentalist on the book for no reason.”
— Oz Pearlman [04:42]
Mentalism: More Than Tricks
- Intentional skills:
Pearlman emphasizes that while he won’t reveal the “how,” his craft rests on a developed set of people skills and intuition, not supernatural powers.
— “What you're seeing is a skill that I've learned and developed, as opposed to a prop that is helping me.”
[07:52] - He distinguishes between magic and mentalism, stating that memorable moments—not just tricks—are the aim.
— “I want to create a moment that for both of them, they will talk about later, they will tell other people about.”
[10:16]
Taking Risks and Planning for Failure
- Oz attributes his career success to “taking bigger swings than almost anyone else in my field,” and always having backup plans—though sometimes “countless.”
[08:40], [09:53] - He likens trick-performing to movie directing: if the audience doesn’t know the destination, failure is unseen.
— “If we start driving and you don't know where I'm going to end up, that's...the beautiful part about what I do.”
[09:29]
The Power of Empathy and Audience Focus
- Key insight: Focus entirely on the audience, not yourself, to be memorable and successful.
— “The more you make the focus on the other person in life, the more success you will attain. … The person who I find the most appealing and most interesting is the person who's the most interested.”
[12:50], [14:20] - Relationships, from pitching TV segments to personal interactions, all thrive on tuning into others’ needs, interests, and mindset.
Building Connections: Practical Strategies
- Oz’s early restaurant magic gigs honed his ability to quickly reduce resistance and connect, such as by making quick introductions, setting time limits, and using curiosity-driven language.
[16:40–20:19] - He explains the importance of “eliminating every point of resistance” in any interaction, refining his approach with each rejection.
— “I ask yourself, what does someone think about you when they meet you? ... How quickly can I do it?”
[19:53] - Adam and Oz discuss how honest vulnerability—and even calling out the awkwardness—disarms others and facilitates connection.
[23:29–24:55]
Overcoming Fear of Rejection & Building Resilience
- Cognitive reappraisal: Oz details how he reframed audience rejection while young, depersonalizing negative reactions by attributing them to external factors, not his own value.
— “I started making it not about me. ... If they didn’t like me, I said, they don’t know Oz Perlman. ... They didn’t like Oz the Magician’s tricks.”
[25:43–27:34] - Adam marks this as a classic self-distancing technique from psychology, calling it a “masterclass” in emotion regulation.
- Procrastination hack:
Oz shares a personal system for overcoming anxiety-driven avoidance—setting a 24-hour alarm asking, “How do you feel about X?”—which reveals how quickly dread dissipates after action.
— “If you could find a way to fast forward your feelings and feel the way you’re going to in 24 hours now you don’t dread it anymore.”
[28:21–29:35]
Applying Mentalist Principles to Everyday Life
- Tactics like anticipating others’ hesitations (e.g., in job interviews) and surfacing vulnerabilities help disarm autopilot social responses and foster authentic connections.
- Oz: “Ask yourself, what can you do to make the elevator get stuck when you’re with someone else?”
— prompting memorable, non-routine moments. [24:04]
Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments
- “I can’t read minds. I can read people. I can influence people, and that’s what I’m doing. It is not supernatural.”
— Oz Pearlman [11:21] - “The person who I find the most appealing and most interesting is the person who’s the most interested.”
— Oz Pearlman [14:20] - “Once you start doing that [negative self-talk] on repeat, you stop looking for the paths for where it can be done.”
— Oz Pearlman [25:40] - “The anxiety and the dread is not real. … That in the last two years, ever since I started doing it, has changed my life.”
— Oz Pearlman [29:35] - “Find some way to help them that no one else has offered. … Find what can you do to be memorable?”
— Oz Pearlman [35:57]
Lightning Round (Rapid-Fire and Audience Q&A)
[32:25 onward]
- Oz’s ultra-marathon experience (153 miles, slept five mins) toughens his mental stamina, making other risks feel trivial.
- Worst career advice? “Listening to haters.”
- Best reason to leave Wall Street? “You only live once. If you have a passion, go for it.”
- Most influential magician: David Blaine
- Favorite mentalist: Derren Brown
- Hardest part of his craft? “Being okay with tremendous risk.”
Finale: Another Live Trick
[36:36–39:37]
- Oz demonstrates an uncanny ability to deduce details—like the name “Sahar” and that she’s the volunteer’s fiancée—using audience cues and psychological tactics, while breaking down his own method in real time for listeners.
Takeaways & Actionable Lessons
- Confidence and memorable moments are not built on supernatural gifts but on practiced empathy, resilience in the face of rejection, and meticulous planning for failure.
- The most memorable people are those who make others feel seen and heard.
- Small psychological tools—like reframing rejection or using honesty to break social “autopilot”—can help anyone build genuine connections and take bigger swings in life.
Timestamps for Key Segments
- Myth-busting Mentalism: [02:42–03:43]
- Live Demonstration (Frisbee Name Guess): [03:58–05:08]
- Performance Philosophy & Risk: [07:55–10:16]
- Audience Empathy & Memorable Moments: [10:04–15:41]
- Handling Rejection & Building Resilience: [25:28–28:06]
- Procrastination & Anxiety Hack: [28:06–30:03]
- Lightning Round + Audience Q&A: [32:25–36:36]
- Final Trick (Fiancée’s Name): [36:36–39:37]
Tone & Style:
The episode sparkles with Oz Perlman’s humor and openness, Adam Grant’s thoughtful curiosity, and a sense of playful challenge. Oz’s advice is direct, practical, and layered with his performer’s charisma, making psychological concepts relatable and actionable.
This summary captures the essential insights, best moments, and actionable advice from a truly engaging conversation on confidence, human connection, and mastering the psychology of risk.