Reveal – "How Project 2025 Is Reshaping Our Country"

Air Date: February 11, 2026
Host: Al Letson
Guest: David A. Graham (Staff Writer, The Atlantic, author of "How Project 2025 is Reshaping America")

Episode Overview

This episode delves into the far-reaching implications of Project 2025, a comprehensive conservative blueprint for overhauling the US government, spearheaded by the Heritage Foundation. Host Al Letson interviews David A. Graham, who has studied Project 2025 in-depth, to analyze how its playbook has shaped the current administration, transformed federal agencies, influenced immigration policy, and threatened civil rights and social safety nets. The discussion also explores the historical roots of such political documents, their lasting impact, and the potential repercussions for future administrations.

Main Topics & Key Insights

1. Origins and Ambitions of Project 2025

• Background: Project 2025 is a 900+ page document by the Heritage Foundation, intended as a policy and staffing roadmap for a conservative president ([02:13–03:07]).
• Difference from Previous Efforts: Unlike earlier conservative strategy documents, this one was massive in ambition and focused on both policy and personnel, responding to perceived failures in Trump’s first term ([03:16–04:19]).
• Quote:

  "I think at the heart of all of this is they want this Christian conservative vision of society. And the way that they want to achieve that is by dismantling many of the institutions of government as we know them and then using what's left and sort of reorienting it to create that Christian society that they envision."
  — David A. Graham [00:07, repeated at 04:35]

2. Trump’s Relationship with Project 2025

• Trump publicly distanced himself from Project 2025 during the 2024 campaign due to its political liability, but its policies are now being implemented in his administration ([05:07–05:32]).
• The relationship is symbiotic: Trump gains loyalists and tools for retribution, while conservative operatives get policy execution ([06:09]).
• Quote:

  "Trump cares about very few things. He cares about tariffs, he cares about immigration. He cares about retribution... What Trump gets is control over the Justice Department, revenge on the deep state, the ability to get a lot of things done that he felt like he couldn't do in the first term."
  — David A. Graham [06:09]

3. Attack on the Administrative State

• Unprecedented efforts to consolidate executive power have led to the Justice Department acting as a White House political arm, mass layoffs of civil servants, and the closure or curtailing of federal agencies such as the Department of Education ([07:03–07:54]).
• The Supreme Court largely acquiesces, fulfilling a long-term conservative project to reshape the judiciary and regulatory framework ([08:19–09:35]).
• Quote:

  "We've seen the Justice Department acting basically as a political wing of the White House... We've seen mass layoffs of civil servants. So just across the board, he's taking control of the executive branch, getting rid of the things he doesn't want, and that allows them to flex a lot of political muscle for the rest of his term."
  — David A. Graham [07:03]

4. Deconstruction and Ideological Re-orientation of Agencies

• Agencies like USAID, CDC, and HHS have been stripped down or redirected ([09:35–11:28]).
  • USAID: Reimagined to focus on anti-abortion and anti-China policies.
  • CDC: Attacked in response to pandemic-era actions, especially the closure of churches on Easter 2020.
  • HHS: Targeted over "wokeness" and DEI, with a focus on combating "woke" initiatives.
• Attacks on scientific funding and environmental agencies are driven both by climate change denial/indifference and pro-privatization ideology ([12:14–14:49]).
• Memorable Moment:

  "There's this trauma from the pandemic where they're really, really furious that the CDC closed churches on Easter in 2020."
  — David A. Graham [09:55]

5. Privatization of Public Functions

• Across education, weather, and emergency management, privatization is a recurring goal: reduce federal involvement and shift taxpayer money to private or religious hands ([14:49–15:43]).
• In education, the vision is public funding for private (especially religious) schooling rather than a universal public system.
• Quote:

  "What they really want is to get the US out of public education. They would like a system that's publicly funded for private education."
  — David A. Graham [15:06]

6. Immigration and Demographic Goals

• Immigration enforcement has become extreme under Project 2025, with mass deportations and an expansion of ICE's power ([16:52]).
• The ultimate goal is, as Graham asserts, "a whiter America" and preservation of a narrowly-defined cultural identity ([16:52–17:36]).
• Notable Exchange:

  Al Letson: "Is it fair to call Project 2025 a guidebook for white supremacy?"
  David A. Graham: "You know, they would object to that... But you look at their immigration policy, you look at the obsession with wokeness and DEI and you see not only those obsessions but like a desire to push back on the entire kind of civil rights apparatus in this country."
  [17:36–18:49]

7. Civil Rights Rollback and Social Safety Net Dismantling

• Project 2025 seeks to redirect or eliminate civil rights enforcement, especially around DEI, racial, gender, and voting rights issues ([18:49–19:03]).
• The “big beautiful bill” slashes health, welfare, and social services, affecting Medicaid, Medicare, rural health, and more—including Trump’s own voter base ([19:17–20:53]).
• Reliance on private charity and churches is expected to fill the gaps, but Graham doubts this is plausible.
• Quote:

  "They're sort of hand wave that they want private institutions or churches to take that work on. But I don't think there's any evidence that that is...going to fill the hole."
  — David A. Graham [20:14]

8. Public Backlash and Political Calculus

• Much of Project 2025’s agenda is deeply unpopular—even among Trump’s base—but disbelief that it would be enacted led to an electoral win. Now, as the policies are implemented, public ire is growing ([21:19–22:26]).
• Memorable Moment:

  "People hated the things in Project 2025, but just didn't believe that Trump would actually do them...Now we see them happening and people do hate it."
  — David A. Graham [21:19]

9. Authoritarian Logic and Long-Term Strategy

• Project 2025’s architects hold an “apocalyptic vision,” believing they must save America at any cost—even if their actions are unpopular ([22:40]).
• The plan was designed to outlast Trump: future leaders such as J.D. Vance may implement it with more discipline ([23:10–24:27]).

10. Irreversibility and Future Trajectories

• Many actions taken under Project 2025 are likely irreversible: lost civil servants, dismantled agencies, and changed legal frameworks will make a return to the previous status quo difficult ([25:50–28:04]).

• It will force a rethinking of American governance for any future administration.

• Quote:

  "Rehiring tens of thousands of civil servants, I mean, these programs are gone. These people who've moved on to new jobs, they're not going to trust that the government is a reliable employer anymore. So I think these are really long term things and I think they're gonna force a rethinking no matter who comes to power next. There's no going back to January 19, 2025. It has to be more forward looking."
  — David A. Graham [27:05]

11. Progressive Response – Lacking Equivalent Planning

• There are stirrings about a progressive analog (i.e., a "Project 2029"), but so far the left is less organized, more focused on electoral wins than comprehensive agenda-setting and execution ([28:04–29:06]).

12. What’s Next?

• Upcoming likely pushes: a national abortion ban, elimination of access to abortion pills, further deregulation, expanded oil & gas drilling, and additional tax cuts ([29:14–30:05]).
• Quote:

  "I still have my eye on abortion...But it's just so important to the authors. They would like a national ban on abortion...All of these things are, you know, they're going to keep pushing for that because it's so important to them."
  — David A. Graham [29:14]

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On the Vision of Project 2025:
  "They want this Christian conservative vision of society...by dismantling many of the institutions of government as we know them."
  — David A. Graham [00:07, 04:35]

• On Privatization Goals:
  "So much of Project 2025 and a lot of the talking points on the right around privatization is really about taking public money and moving it into private hands."
  — Al Letson [14:49]

• On Civil Rights Rollback:
  "You see a desire to take the civil rights section of the Justice Department and turn it away from enforcing voter suppression laws and use it instead to pursue bogus claims of voter fraud."
  — David A. Graham [18:49]

• On Unpopularity and Political Risks:
  "People hated the things in Project 2025, but just didn't believe that Trump would actually do them...Now we see them happening and people do hate it."
  — David A. Graham [21:19]

Timestamps for Key Segments

• Introduction and Main Theme – [00:02–02:06]
• Origins of Project 2025 / Heritage Foundation – [03:07–04:19]
• Trump's Relationship with Project 2025 – [05:07–06:09]
• Overhaul of Executive Branch – [07:03–08:19]
• Supreme Court and Judicial Shift – [08:19–09:35]
• Agency Dismantling and Privatization – [09:35–15:43]
• Immigration and Whiter America Vision – [16:52–17:46]
• Civil Rights System Overhaul – [18:49–19:03]
• Social Safety Net Cuts (The Big Beautiful Bill) – [19:17–20:53]
• Public Backlash and Political Calculus – [21:19–22:26]
• Long-Term Strategy, Irreversibility, and Next Steps – [22:40–30:10]

Conclusion

This incisive episode illuminates the methods, motives, and real-world effects of Project 2025. It draws a comprehensive portrait of how the right’s latest playbook leverages executive power, targets government institutions, and aims to reshape American society along sharply ideological lines. The guest’s analysis is frank about the symbiosis between Trump and the conservative movement, the risks and contradictions inherent in autocratic overreach, and the challenges any future administration will face in reversing these changes. The episode is a vital listen for anyone eager to understand the ideological forces shaping contemporary America—and the high stakes for its future.