Podcast Title: Reveal
Episode: The Bible Says So…or Does It?
Release Date: July 30, 2025
Host: Al Letson
Guest: Dr. Dan McClellan, Religious Scholar and Author of The Bible Says So: What We Get Right and Wrong About Scripture's Most Controversial Issues
Introduction
In this compelling episode of Reveal, host Al Letson engages in an in-depth conversation with Dr. Dan McClellan, a renowned religious scholar and author of the upcoming book, The Bible Says So: What We Get Right and Wrong About Scripture's Most Controversial Issues. The discussion delves into the pervasive misinterpretations of the Bible and how its teachings are often co-opted by those in power to further their agendas.
Guest Introduction and Background
Dr. Dan McClellan introduces himself as a scholar dedicated to bridging the gap between academic Bible studies and public understanding. With a strong presence on social media platforms like TikTok and Instagram, Dan has made a name for himself by debunking common misconceptions and challenging hoaxes related to biblical texts.
Notable Quote:
"I combat the spread of misinformation about the Bible and religion for a living."
— Dan McClellan [01:36]
Misinterpretation of the Bible
The conversation highlights the immense influence of the Bible, noting its status as the best-selling book in history with an estimated 5 billion copies sold globally. Despite its profound impact, many individuals misinterpret its messages, often aligning them with personal ideologies rather than the original intent of the scriptures.
Notable Quote:
"The Bible is a text that has no inherent meaning. We create meaning in negotiation with the text, which means we're bringing our experiences and our understanding to the text."
— Dan McClellan [26:40]
Use of the Bible in Political Contexts
Dan addresses the rise of Christian nationalism, emphasizing how the Bible is being leveraged to influence government and justify policies that may harm vulnerable populations. He criticizes figures like Charlie Kirk for using biblical references to support divisive and exclusionary agendas.
Notable Quote:
"Christian nationalists... attempting to take over the government... means hurting an awful lot of people along the way."
— Dan McClellan [09:15]
The Sin of Empathy Debate
A significant portion of the discussion revolves around the controversial notion of the "sin of empathy," propagated by some right-wing religious groups. Dan clarifies that the Bible does not endorse empathy as a sin but acknowledges that certain texts advocate for limited mercy in specific narratives.
Notable Quote:
"There's certainly no point where anyone says empathy is a sin just in general."
— Dan McClellan [10:51]
He differentiates between "outward-looking empathy," which fosters cooperation and social bonds, and "parochial empathy," which can lead to antagonism towards out-groups.
Old Testament vs. New Testament Depictions of God
Al brings up a common perception contrasting the Old Testament's portrayal of a wrathful God with the New Testament's depiction of a loving deity. Dan agrees but nuances the discussion by highlighting that both testaments contain a mix of divine attributes and that such dichotomies can foster anti-Semitic interpretations.
Notable Quote:
"You have numerous different divine profiles being represented throughout both the Hebrew Bible and the New Testament."
— Dan McClellan [22:03]
Dan's Book: The Bible Says So
Dan elaborates on his book, which aims to address 18 controversial claims about what the Bible says. Each chapter dissects a specific assertion, providing historical and scholarly context to clarify misunderstandings.
Notable Quote:
"I'm trying to understand what would have made this text meaningful and useful to its authors and earliest audiences, irrespective of how meaningful and useful that may make it to us."
— Dan McClellan [17:25]
Impact on Personal Beliefs
When questioned about how his deep dive into biblical studies affects his personal faith, Dan maintains a boundary between his academic work and personal beliefs. Raised without religion, he joined the LDS Church as an adult and strives to keep his scholarly analysis separate from his devotional practices.
Notable Quote:
"I have always tried very, very hard to ensure that I was compartmentalizing my academic approach to the Bible from my devotional approach."
— Dan McClellan [30:36]
Challenging Preconceived Notions
Throughout the episode, Dan emphasizes the importance of re-examining long-held beliefs and recognizing the diverse portrayals of God within the Bible. He encourages listeners to approach the scriptures with a critical and informed perspective rather than accepting superficial interpretations.
Notable Quote:
"It's very rare that we have someone who comes to the text and can think critically enough to realize, this is about me. This is saying that I am the problem. I better fix myself."
— Dan McClellan [26:40]
Conclusion
The episode concludes with a reflection on the societal implications of misusing biblical texts. Dan stresses that when powerful individuals manipulate religious scriptures to maintain privilege and control, it leads to significant social ills and perpetuates inequality.
Final Notable Quote:
"Folks who love power more than they love people are the actual problem that is causing a lot of the social ills that we have today."
— Dan McClellan [09:15]
Listeners gain a profound understanding of how the Bible's teachings can be both a source of inspiration and a tool for manipulation. Dr. Dan McClellan's insights encourage a more nuanced and informed engagement with religious texts, fostering a healthier dialogue between scholarly interpretations and public perceptions.
Learn More: To explore Dr. Dan McClellan's work and his efforts to demystify the Bible, visit his TikTok at @McClellan and stay tuned for the release of his book, The Bible Says So: What We Get Right and Wrong About Scripture's Most Controversial Issues.