The Huddle Is More Important Than the Position | Building Winning Cultures with Brian White

Summary

Podcast Summary: The Huddle Is More Important Than the Position | Building Winning Cultures with Brian White

Revenue Builders Podcast
Hosts: John McMahon & John Kaplan
Guest: Brian White (football coach, author of "The Locker Room is Not for Sale")
Release Date: February 22, 2026

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Episode Overview

This episode centers on the essentials of building and leading winning team cultures, with insights from football coach and leadership author Brian White. The discussion is rich with practical advice relevant not just for sports teams but also for B2B sales leaders, executives, and anyone integrating into—or seeking to shape—a high-performing organizational culture. Core themes include the dynamics of trust, assimilation into new environments, selfless leadership, and the power of peer influence versus top-down direction.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Dual Nature of Trust When Entering a Team

• Assimilation before transformation:
  When stepping into a new organization or team, it’s crucial to “be the same before you try to establish your difference.” (01:51) Attempting to change things prematurely often leads to friction and exclusion.
• Trust is bi-directional:
  Both the new individual and the existing team must build trust for successful integration (02:35).

Quote:
“Be the same before you try to establish your difference. And I've learned that the hard way in my life.”
— John Kaplan, (01:51)

2. Leadership Styles: Transactional vs. Team-Oriented

• Transactional leadership creates subordinates, not teams:
  Leaders who focus on compliance and fear tend to build groups of individuals, not true teams (03:12).
• Selfless leadership for collective buy-in:
  Great leaders, like Brian White, foster environments where team members buy into collective goals and act selflessly, even as they pursue individual excellence.

Quote:
“As a leader, you're either going to build a culture of a bunch of individual me... But there's no team. And a leader like Brian builds a team… It's selfless versus selfish. And it has to start with the leader.”
— John McMahon, (03:12)

3. Compete Selfishly, Give Selflessly

• Balance between drive and altruism:
  Players (and employees) are encouraged to be relentless in their pursuit of excellence, yet generous in their contributions to the team.
• Brotherhood as the foundation:
  The true “floor” of high-performing teams is the sense of brotherhood, enabling resilience through adversity.

Quote:
“What I try to drill into my players: I want you to compete selfishly. Compete selfishly, but give selflessly.”
— Brian White, (04:05)

4. Handling Ego and Integration Challenges

• Peer-led transformation:
  The most lasting cultural change comes from within the peer group. Coaches and managers must empower senior team members to lead by example and mentor newcomers, especially those with outsized egos (Kaplan analogy) (06:13).
• The power of peer pressure:
  Senior members guide the juniors, perpetuating team values and enabling magical team dynamics (06:36).

Quote:
“Peer pressure is always going to be the most powerful influencer and it always will be.”
— Brian White, (06:36)

5. The Human Touch and Authentic Engagement

• Dialogue builds belonging:
  Success stems from creating genuine human connection—knowing people’s stories, what drives them, and fostering open communication.
• Magic in team-building:
  Teams that invest in the human side often achieve extraordinary results (07:20).

Quote:
“It starts with direct engagement. It starts with the human touch. What’s the human touch? It’s really simple. Getting far with people, talk to them, create dialogue, get to know them.”
— Brian White, (06:36)

6. The Huddle Metaphor: Inclusion Over Position

• Huddle is more important than position:
  Being outstanding individually is meaningless if one does not integrate and uplift the core group (the huddle). The episode reinforces the idea that success is more about team chemistry and less about individual brilliance (08:20).

Quote:
“The huddle’s more important than the position. If I thought I was the best, but I didn't work well in that huddle, it didn't matter.”
— John Kaplan, (08:20)

7. Broad Relevance Beyond Sports

• Universal lessons:
  The conversation translates team-building wisdom from football to business, encouraging listeners to reflect on their roles as both entrants and leaders in various "locker rooms" of life (08:44).

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Notable Quotes & Moments (with Timestamps)

• Assimilation before change:
  “Be the same before you try to establish your difference...” — John Kaplan (01:51)
• Transactional vs. team-oriented cultures:
  “As a leader, you're either going to build a culture of a bunch of individual me... But there's no team.” — John McMahon (03:12)
• Compete selfishly, give selflessly:
  “Compete selfishly. Every rep you take, as hard and fast as you can go... But you need to give selflessly.” — Brian White (04:05)
• Peer-led culture enforcement:
  “Peer pressure is always going to be the most powerful influencer and it always will be.” — Brian White (06:36)
• The human touch and dialogue:
  “It starts with the human touch... Getting far with people, talk to them, create dialogue, get to know them.” — Brian White (06:36)
• The huddle over the position:
  “The huddle’s more important than the position...” — John Kaplan (08:20)
• Universal applicability:
  “These are life and business. Reality is not just football.” — John Kaplan (09:38)

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Segment Timestamps

• 00:10 – 01:11: Introduction and episode theme
• 01:12 – 03:12: John Kaplan shares lessons on assimilation and trust
• 03:12 – 04:05: John McMahon distinguishes team vs. individual cultures
• 04:05 – 05:46: Brian White on selfless play and building culture
• 05:46 – 06:35: Integrating high-ego individuals (the peer-led approach)
• 06:36 – 07:56: The role of peer influence and direct engagement
• 07:56 – 08:20: Sports-to-business analogy of team loyalty
• 08:20 – 09:40: The "huddle" metaphor and universal leadership lessons

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Conclusion

This episode offers actionable insights on how to build and sustain winning cultures—whether on the football field or in the sales office. The core message: being an effective team member or leader is less about individual brilliance and more about genuine engagement, earning trust, and creating space for others to shine. The "huddle," not the position, makes champions.

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Recommended for:
Sales leaders, managers, new hires, coaches, and anyone responsible for team culture or organizational integration.

Transcript

[A]

Welcome to the Revenue Builders podcast with John McMahon and John Kaplan. In today's segment, football coach and author Brian White shares powerful insights on building winning cultures and what it really takes to lead a successful team. Brian's latest book, the Locker Room is Not for Sale, is a great read on leadership. In this segment, Brian breaks down why trust has to go both ways, from the individual entering a new organization and from the team itself. And why assimilating into an existing culture before trying to change it is the key to lasting impact. If you're a sales leader trying to establish yourself in a new company, maybe you're a manager building team cohesion or a CRO focused on building a culture where people compete selfishly but give selflessly. This episode is for you. Let's dive in.

[B]

Johnny, I'd like to hear your. Your thoughts on as well. I learned this the hard way. It's not just. It's not just the trust for the individual. It's the trust for the locker room, or it's the trust for the. You know, for the company that you're entering. My example is I transferred from Boise State to Bowling Green. They made me report with the freshman. The coach that. Hi. The coach that recruited me was gone. Blah, blah, blah. Sad story. I'm in there whipping everybody's tail because I'm mad because my coach is no longer there and I can't transfer again. There's no. There was no portal back then. And I remember later on in life when somebody said something to me, they said, john, the people that learn, the people that assimilate best into cultures are the ones that learn how to be the same before they try to establish their difference. Be the same before you try to establish your difference. And I've learned that the hard way in my life. I've learned it. I learned it when I transferred to Bowling Green and I started fighting on the first day when the vets showed up. And. And, you know, that wasn't endearing me to anybody, wasn't winning me any favor in the locker room. I learned it when I went to PTC, and PTC had a. You know, I came from 10 years of Xerox, and PTC had a very specific way of doing things. And, you know, yes, they wanted input, but they wanted me to learn first the culture of ptc, and then not for me, because Johnny called me very specifically and said, I don't want you to be ptc, but I want you to help take PTC to the next level. So there's this. This trust thing was on both sides. It was for the individual entering the circle, and it was for the circle itself to be able to accept somebody into it. So I just think that's so powerful. What, what you guys, what you guys are talking about, it really resonates for me. Really resonates. Johnny, do you remember that phone call?

[C]

No, but I think, you know, as Brian was saying earlier, you know, what I heard in him, what he's saying, I just put it in different words. You know, as a leader, you're either going to build a culture of a bunch of individual me, which is just subordinate. Whatever you tell me to do, coach, okay, I'll do it, you know, because I just want to play. If I don't play, you're going to penalize me. So it's very transactional leadership. You know, it's just. I'm an individual subordinate. I want to play. You tell me what to do, I'll do it. But there's no team. And a leader like Brian builds a team of. I don't know if I'm using the right word, but they are in some ways followers because they, it. They're a bunch of team and they're saying, okay, Coach, I got it. We're a team and we're gonna go make this happen. You know, it's selfless versus selfish. The individual selfish versus being selfless. Right. And it has to start with the leader.

[D]

Yeah, it absolutely does. And people are innately selfish. Yeah, people, whether it's me, you, people innately are selfish. But what, what I try to drill into my players, I want you to compete selfishly. Compete selfishly, but give selflessly.

[C]

Love that.

[D]

So compete selfish. Compete selfishly. Every rep you take, as hard and fast as you can go, be a maniac. Be a beast. But. But you need to give selflessly. You need to give of yourself to the team. You need to understand that there's a bigger purpose to. To. To your life into the. Into what you're going to do on this football team. You could be the greatest quarterback in the world. But, you know, if you're not getting protection, people, Receivers are dropping balls. You're not going to. You're not going to play well, you know, so it's all going to be coordinated. And it all starts in the locker room by building the. The walls of the. Of the locker room. And then the floor of the locker room is brotherhood. That's what everyone stands on. Everyone stands on the floor of the locker room. That's the brotherhood. That's blood. That's what you're trying to create so that you can move through adversity. And the Patriots will be just fine. Don't worry about the Patriots. Mike Vable is a great leader and those players believe in him. They'll be just fine. I know they're critical of, of Drake May right now and Will Campbell the tackle. You know, those two young players will be great too, because they believe in Mike Vrabel and Mike Vrabel believes in them. And that's what you're doing in the locker room, Brian.

[C]

When you get a guy like Kaplan who comes in and he thinks he's a prima donna and you want to build a. And you recognize, hey, these other players, Kaplan's basically like radioactive. I got a problem over here. How do I get that guy to conform? I don't know if conforms the right way, but start to become part of the team and build respect and trust with the rest of the players.

[D]

Yeah, you know what? It has to happen. It has to be player led. Now, as a coach, if you see that, then you go to the leaders that you think can transform him and you say, hey, take this Kaplan dude under your wing and get him fricking right, okay? Or he's not going to be here very long. It's not going to work.

[B]

Right.

[D]

So peer pressure is always going to be the most powerful influencer and it always will be. So that's why the seniors have to teach the juniors and the juniors have to teach the sophomores and. And the younger guys have to learn from the older guys to teach the values of who you are, what do you believe in. And when they do it, when you have a locker room like that, then it's going to be magical. But it starts with direct engagement. It starts with the human touch. We talk about the human touch all the time. What's the human touch? The human touch is really simple. Getting far with people, talk to them, create dialogue, get to know them. I mean, how many people in your company, do they really know John Kaplan's story? Do they really know who you are, what makes you tick, what makes you go? And the only way you can do that is to create dialogue and to talk and communicate and get to know one another. And that's the fun part of building a team. And there's magic in it. There's magic in those teams go on. And they, they do ridiculous things and I just love it. I just, I mean, I.

[C]

There's two lenses all the time. I mean, your football coach. But you do see, it's very evident in hockey. When somebody gets slammed into the boards by an illegal hit, you see another player come to his rescue and fight the other guy, and they know that if somebody doesn't come to my rescue, there's no way for us to be a team when we get back inside that locker room.

[D]

Yeah, there's.

[B]

There's two lenses that are so powerful here that we're talking about because I lived them both, and all of us have lived them both. We were either somebody trying to get into. I used to call it the huddle. I call it the. The huddle's more important than the position. And I learned that the hard way. If I thought I was the best, but I didn't work well in that huddle, it didn't matter because if that huddle didn't get better by me being my position and being in that position, and I learned it the hard way, I really, really did in my life. And so there was this. There was this. There's this lens of the person trying to enter the locker room, and then there's a lens of the person leading the locker room. And so I'm hoping no matter who you are listening to this, you're either trying to establish yourself in the locker room or in the huddle or in the team, but please don't just turn it off because you never played football or whatever. You know, that's not just what we're talking about here. We're talking about entering into cultures. We're talking about leading cultures. So as we continue to go through there, think about that as like in life, we're always. We're either. We're either trying to enter into the huddle or the locker room and stay powerful in the locker room, or we're trying to lead it and bring people into the locker room. So this is. This is a life. These are life and business. Reality is not just football.

[A]

Thanks for listening to today's episode. If you enjoy the content, please subscribe, rate and review the show to help us reach more people. This show is brought to you by Force Management, where we help companies improve sales performance, executing the growth strategy at the point of sale. Check out forcemanagement.com for more information.