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- [00:00]
Rob Cesternino
The best dancers from across the globe are about to join me for the audition of a lifetime.
- [00:06]
Narrator/Announcer
ABC Mondays. Do they have what it takes to compete and be the next Dancing with the Stars pro?
- [00:11]
Sponsor/Advertiser Voice
I'm here to win.
- [00:12]
Emily Flippin
Nothing is gonna stop me.
- [00:14]
Sponsor/Advertiser Voice
Our star judges will decide.
- [00:15]
Rob Cesternino
This is what hunger looks like.
- [00:17]
Emily Flippin
It was 100% the wrong choice.
- [00:19]
Narrator/Announcer
Robert Irwin hosts.
- [00:21]
Rob Cesternino
The next era of ballroom starts right here on Dancing with the Stars. The next Pro.
- [00:26]
Narrator/Announcer
All new Mondays, 8. 7 Central on ABC. Next day on Hulu. This summer prime video takes you back before Legally Blonde, before law school and into the world of Elle woods in high school. Set in 1995, this Gemini vegetarian knows exactly who she is until her family moves from Bel Air to Seattle. Packed with iconic fashion, 90s nostalgia and a throwback soundtrack, Elle proves one law school was hard. High school was harder. From the world of Legally Blonde, watch Elle, a new original series only on Prime Video. Watch now.
- [01:01]
Sponsor/Advertiser Voice
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- [01:39]
Rob Cesternino
Hey, everybody, what's going on? Rob Cisternino back here. We got a fun podcast for you here today because we are talking with one of the stars of Survivor 45, Survivor 50 here with us. And I think maybe the link when you talk about D Viadaris and Rick Devins, it's Emily Flippin. Emily, how are you?
- [02:04]
Emily Flippin
Hey, good. You know, the funny thing is I think you can find people who both know D and Rick a lot better than I do. But is there somebody who has played with both of them as much as I have and I don't know, I don't think so.
- [02:14]
Rob Cesternino
I think you're the missing link.
- [02:16]
Emily Flippin
Well, I guess Angela.
- [02:18]
Rob Cesternino
Now Angela is Angela. I had this thought earlier. Is Angela the new you?
- [02:24]
Emily Flippin
I'm very deeply afraid of that, Rob. I will say I do. I like to think that I have trained both Rick, Andy pretty well to handle Angela. But Angela, you know, she's on another level. So I think she's going to give us a run for our money this summer.
- [02:36]
Rob Cesternino
Okay. Give us your big brother background, Emily, because I had thought that maybe you were a person who had was not a big brother. Because you do not give Big Brother super fan really at all. And I mess messaged Brandon and he's like, no, no. Emily deeply enjoys Big Brother.
- [02:55]
Emily Flippin
Yeah. You know, look, I watch a lot of reality tv. Out of all the silly reality TV shows I watch, I probably know Big Brother the best. I don't know if that's concerning or not. I will say my mom started watching Big Brother for the first time this year because Dee and Debbins were on it and she became a fan after Survivor and she was horrified after the first episode and was like, are you really sure you're consuming this content? And I started to get embarrassed a little for myself. But no, I love Big Brother. I think it's a great show.
- [03:21]
Rob Cesternino
Was there anything in particular from the first episode that really concerned your mom?
- [03:27]
Emily Flippin
You know, it might have been the velociraptor. Although I will say I think she needs to tune into the live feeds because she texted me afterwards and said, you know, I think there's more action happening in my house and my house only has a couple of retired 60 year olds in it. And I was like, you know, maybe that's the show. The show and the live feeds, I guess, are very different. But as somebody who really only consumes the show because who has time for the live feeds? I mean, goodness gracious. I will say I enjoy it.
- [03:50]
Sponsor/Advertiser Voice
I enjoy.
- [03:50]
Rob Cesternino
Mm. Yeah. So your mom's complaint about episode one was there wasn't enough action.
- [03:55]
Emily Flippin
I think it was a combination between it moved from campy to cheesy. Yeah, I think is part of the problem. And it's just a scripted diary room sessions. Oh, I hate it. You know, I will say I think. I think Rick and D are doing a great job at the diary rooms relative to, you know, I guess people who have less media training. But that kills me. Why do we need everything explained 15 times? Don't treat your audience like idiots. Although I guess we're watching Big Brother. Maybe you should.
- [04:20]
Rob Cesternino
I think that Rick is really going to dominate the diary room this season. I think that based off of Sunday night's episode. Yeah, I really think that he's in his element.
- [04:29]
Emily Flippin
Yeah, look, Rick, he is both in his element and purse in person and in the diary rooms. He's funny, he's quick witted, but getting him alone too, like, he is deceptively a pretty witty dude. So I actually think now, granted, I probably need to tune the live feeds to verify this. Probably funnier off the diary rooms than in.
- [04:48]
Rob Cesternino
Yeah. So I'd love to know more about your relationship with both Rick and D. I thought it was an interesting fit for you and rick in season 50. But you met him on the beach and you seem to take to him instantly.
- [05:04]
Emily Flippin
Yeah, look, neither of them told me they were going on Big Brother this season. I can't imagine why I'm such a trustworthy person to him. I was shocked. No, it's actually. This is. This is the experience that I think everybody is going to have with both D and Evans. And I'm saying this because it was purely my experience and it's only thing I have to go off of. But I think it's true. I think it's true for everyone, which is you think you're going to dislike Devin's. You know, there's a lot of people who watch him on the show and they think to themselves, oh, man, hanging around this guy, especially 24 7, must be exhausting. He is a blast. And when you are being slowly tortured and if you're being slowly tortured on Survivor, I can only imagine how bad the torture is when you're in the Big Brother house. You need the fun, you need the entertainment, you need the excitement. And he is so just like such a chill, fun dude to hang around. He doesn't take anything too seriously. He's not going to get his feelings hurt. If you do something, you know, like walk away from him when you're trying to tell him his name, you know, that sort of thing, then you're going to have a great time with Devin's and D. I mean, God, you see it already. I almost feel like it's a moot point to come in here and repeat this, but people make judgment calls off people based off what they look like. And I think there's a lot of people who are going to make judgment calls based off of D. But D is so, so smart and strategic and if she's smart about, like, balancing that threat level, she will just be a killer in this game. We're already seeing it happening. I'm a little bit worried that she's first head of household because, you know, she didn't have a choice. I understand that. But if she can balance her threat level, I see her winning this.
- [06:29]
Rob Cesternino
Can you talk a little bit about the dynamic between the two of them and how you think it will go long term? As somebody who knows them both so
- [06:37]
Emily Flippin
well, both of these people, I think out of everybody I played Survivor, two of the most loyal people to play with and I think they're locked in with each other. If you get locked in if you're one of their people, if you're one of D or Devin's people, they're not going to turn against you. And that has been my experience. I don't think we have any reason to believe that's going to be different. So I see them too. I think they're locked in automatically together. But I mean, if, you know, excuse my French here, but if everybody else doesn't have their head up their ass, they know that too. Right. And so they're smart to kind of downplay it to the extent that they can. But. But they are. They will ride to the end together, I have no doubt.
- [07:10]
Rob Cesternino
You know, it's interesting just as a concept, loyalty and we saw that Rick Devins really had that a lot in season 50. Very loyal to both you and Christian and would not be somebody to ever turn on. I mean, who's to say? But in the new era it's really. That has not been the story of Survivor in the new era. And also, you know, Dan, who has been by many called the most dominant winner in the new era, also played a game which was pretty loyal to a certain group. So that is a uncommon trait for modern day survivors to have so much.
- [07:48]
Emily Flippin
Yeah, I mean, emphasis on certain group though, I guess. And it's the thing about playing with both D and Devins is you have a hard time telling whether or not you're in their group. And in Big Brother where you have to spend so much time being conscious about even just who you sit around and chat to, you probably left wondering if you're one of the other players, you know, is this a fake alliance or is this a real line? So we already saw some of that happening. You know, we're only three episodes and we already see that D and Devin's kind of have two alliances, one reels, one fake. And I have to say if I'm in that house and I'm in either of those, I'm thinking that alliance is real probably and there's no reason that you know that. What is it? The red corner alliance doesn't think that they're right or dies with both D and Devins, but they're obviously not.
- [08:26]
Rob Cesternino
Rick has talked about how that during Survivor 50 Surrey said constantly she did not have a good Big Brother experience. She would not want to play Big Brother. Were you around for any of those conversations of siree talking about Big Brother?
- [08:40]
Emily Flippin
I don't think there's anything else I heard come out of that woman's mouth. I wish I could say that I Am surprised to see either of these people on Big Brother even after the numerous warnings that everybody gave them. But, you know, don't look a gift horse in the mouth, so to speak. And in this case, I think, you know, they might be better equipped for this type of game in terms of tolerating the silliness and the shenanigans that inevitably happen in Big Brother in a way that I think Sirib maybe just didn't have the tolerance for in the same way. But here's my concern with both of them versus the game that is Survivor. It's the speed and you already see it. I see it happening a bit with Devin where you play hard and fast and maybe look, he's here for a good time, not a long time, more power to him. But this is like a hundred plus day game, right? So you have to be thinking to yourselves, how is this going to impact my game? Not, you know, days from now the way you are in Survivor, but months from now. And that is just such a big shift. I wish Therese spent more time talking about managing threat level over the course of months as opposed to telling us how miserable it is to be living in a house with a bunch of 20 somethings because I think we can all imagine it's not fun.
- [09:46]
Rob Cesternino
Emily, if the powers that be reached out to you and asked you if you wanted to play on Big Brother 28, what would you have said?
- [09:55]
Narrator/Announcer
No. No.
- [09:55]
Emily Flippin
And I, you know, I said this, not Survivor. So like, everyone's like, you're full of shit, grain of salt. But look, I, I'm such a big fan of Survivor or Big Brother. I love watching it. I don't want to ruin it for myself. And look, it's, it's so long to be away. The constantly being videotaped and recorded. I had no idea there was a whole group of people that had devote literally their entire summer to watching these people like sleep on live camera. So no, it's other ways that I can choose to embarrass myself. This is not it.
- [10:22]
Rob Cesternino
Well, how about you? Now you said that there you're surprised that people are watching so much of the live feeds, but now you have two close friends who are playing in the house. Have you yourself turned on the live feeds yet?
- [10:33]
Emily Flippin
Yes, of course, of course. I'm getting some great timing, I will say, you know, I'm plugging in here and there when I've over the course of like my work, I work from home, obviously, and it's great to be able to just plug in. I want to And I've gotten some great D confessionals. You know, I don't. I'd never watched live feeds prior to this season, actually, or at least not any regular basis. I didn't realize that people were narrating to the cameras as much as they are. Here's my concern with this, though. Okay, D, great commentary. I love getting insight into the game that she's playing. That girl is loud. She doesn't realize how loud she talks sometimes. In the back of my head, I'm sitting here thinking, I hope nobody's on the other side of that door, because, girl, they can hear you. You can whisper, you know, if you whisper, they still hear you. Right.
- [11:12]
Rob Cesternino
So that takeaway that D is loud. Is that from watching her in the live feeds or that's your lived experience with her?
- [11:18]
Emily Flippin
That is my lived experience. There's been a couple of times where I've overheard D say stuff, and I'll leave it at that, that I'm, you know, us and the rest of the people surrounding us probably shouldn't have been able to hear. But she's great and she knows she's great. So, you know, she wants to make sure the cameras pick it up.
- [11:32]
Rob Cesternino
Yeah. No, the live feeds can be very addicting, though. I have one friend that he's not even a live feed person, and he told me he was up till 4 o' clock in the morning last night just watching the live feeds. He couldn't turn it off.
- [11:44]
Emily Flippin
So you're telling me is I need to get my mom into the live feeds. I'll be like, no, just trust me. You know, turn on the live feeds. Here's my Paramount login.
- [11:50]
Rob Cesternino
Well, I'm a little worried that if your mom says there's not enough action on the show, you know, sometimes you get maybe, you know, everybody's eating dinner for two hours and maybe not that much is going on.
- [12:01]
Emily Flippin
Yeah, that's more Emily content than mom content, I guess.
- [12:03]
Rob Cesternino
Yeah. Okay. So I'm so interested to hear your thoughts on the new players also because, you know, I think back to you as a new player, and you famously did not like that there was a returning player who was there with you in season 45, and you actually were quite demonstrative that you did not think it was right that Bruce was coming back. And now here's Jason, who's very also anti returning vet.
- [12:33]
Emily Flippin
Yeah, like, if I was on this season as a new player, I would be Jason. That would be my exact reaction. I would see any returning players, but especially people like Dee Devins. And Angela coming in and thinking to myself, well, this is easy, right? We're all on a consensus about this. Nobody wants the returning players around. It's really ignorant, in my opinion, to believe that any returning players are coming in without a, an advantage. Having been through the reality TV sphere, even if it's not specifically Big Brother before, you have an awareness about how things like production work, how social strategy games work, especially when they're being recorded. But also as three people that come in with bigger targets since they're known prior to the show. Right. Everybody has an impression of these three people. They're obviously going to be working together. Obviously. Even if they otherwise wouldn't touch each other with a 10 foot pole, which might have been the case with Angela, if Angela wasn't a returning player, then these people are working together and you're coming in and you know, if you are in a showmance, people always say that puts a big target on your back. Your voting block of two. Right now we have a voting block of three. And I think Jason is entirely right to be drawing attention to that. I selfishly loving Brick and indeed you don't want him to be right and don't want that attention there. But I think that it's fair. The problem is, is that, and we all learn this, if you've been on reality TV before, as I did on my season, coming in and saying, you know, calling out a returning player immediately, not a great way to build your longevity in the game. And unless something crazy happens like somebody quits instead of you going home, I think all Jason is doing is repeating something that everybody already knows and drawing a target on himself.
- [14:03]
Rob Cesternino
But it did work for you in season 45 and I know you're talking about that maybe Hannah quitting ended up maybe saving you in the very early days, but then people did warm up to you. This is it something that he could potentially. Okay, maybe he ends up endearing himself
- [14:21]
Emily Flippin
to those people then, like it took a lot of groveling, right. Where's first Caleb when you need Caleb? So Jason, I think needs a. Caleb needs somebody to hold out a helping hand here and then also needs to go on the apology tour. And right now, granted, I don't have all the information. I don't see that happening for Jason. I'm not even sure if Jason is aware that his comments may have rubbed people the wrong way because so much of the house right now believes that they're aligned with, you know, Hohd and her vet allies here that it's almost easier to just Turn around a narc on Jason than it is to say, oh, I'm gonna hand out a helping hand here and help turn it around. And I think it all comes down to, you know, obviously, who goes home this week, but also who wins HOH next week. As to where that social capital goes.
- [15:03]
Rob Cesternino
I know you're a big fan of the show. I'm sure you must have watched Angela's first season, and so did you. Do you have any feelings about Angela as a returning player?
- [15:13]
Emily Flippin
Oh, I don't even know where to begin. So I watch a lot of reality tv, basically all reality tv. Unfortunately, my husband hates it. Now, that season of Big Brother, Angela season, which I believe is BB26, if I'm not mistaken. Yes, BB26. Eric watched all the way. My husband Eric, watch all of that through up until Angela went home, specifically because he was so entertained by the shenanigans and the antics. And I feel like, as a result, I owe Angela, like, a great deal of debt for getting Eric into Big Brother to some extent. But on the same, I'm just, like, actually a little flabbergasted. I shouldn't be surprised that the vets are working together, but I just think after Dee's experience working with me, she should be aware of the type of player that Angela is. And I think it's very clear that Angela and I have a lot in common and our levels of impulsivity. And it doesn't necessarily mean that Angela's heart's not in the right space, but she takes things very personally sometimes. And I think she's an incredibly impulsive player, which inevitably comes back, usually to reflect poorly on the people who are allied with them. So my hope is, is that at some point Dee or Devins realizes, hey, you know, Angela's a bit of a loose cannon. We need to cut her here. And I say that with the utmost love, as somebody who is. I view myself a bit of an Angela in the situation, but it takes one to no one.
- [16:29]
Rob Cesternino
Yeah. That's so interesting that you describe yourself as an Angela, and I definitely could see some of what you're talking about. But I also. You seem to me like you're also such a strategist also, which I don't know necessarily if that is also part of Angela's game.
- [16:45]
Emily Flippin
It's so funny that people have that impression of me as a strategist, and I can't tell if it's just the way I talk, if it's my job title, if it's the way I look, I Don't know what it is. I. I like to think at no point have I given anybody any evidence to believe that I' a good strategist, especially in games like Survivor or in this case, a game like Big Brother. I'm much more entertainment connoisseur of sorts. But that's all going back to how people perceive you, right? So people do not perceive Angela as a strategic threat. If the extent that she's able to pull some strategy into her game there, that can work to her benefit. The same thing is true with D. I think Dee is really playing up being ignorant about the Big Brother sphere, so to speak, to downplay her experience on reality shows in the past when she obviously has a clue what she's doing. So it's all about managing perception. And unfortunately, I have this perception that I'm a strategist when I'm really not. I promise I'm just here for entertainment value.
- [17:32]
Rob Cesternino
Okay. All right. So of these two people, Rick and D, who do you think is the person who has you see working better with Angela over the course of the season?
- [17:45]
Emily Flippin
Oh, Devin's for sure, I think. I think D will speak very clearly and very directly to Angela, and she will tell Angela to her face when Angela is doing something that bothers her. Now, I don't know Angela personally. I would imagine that one or two times of doing that, maybe Angela takes it well. But after a month of hearing from Dee about how Angela is messing up her game, I can't help but wonder if Angela starts to get irritated after a while and that comes back to blowback on D. And I think Devin's, because he is perceived more as like, this fun, chill dude. The feedback that he gives to Angela, if he even gives her feedback at all, he might just roll with whatever craziness she has, which is way more in his style. I think it's more likely that she will bond closer with him over a course of weeks and months.
- [18:26]
Rob Cesternino
Yeah, that's really interesting because we saw where Dee and Rick had a conversation in the episode we saw on Sunday night where Rick was telling people about the ally, the crossover alliance that they made. And then Dee found out about that, and she's like, rick, you shouldn't have done that. And she said it to him like four or five times of, you shouldn't have done that had that been Angela instead of Rick. I don't know if Angela takes that with the same grace that Rick took it.
- [18:54]
Emily Flippin
Yeah, that's a really good point. I felt for Rick in that moment because I was like, oh, been there, done that. Rick, I've been on the other side of that equation. And yeah, Rick does have it going for him that I think he takes feedback very well. Again, he does not take things personally. I can't speak for Angela on a personal level, but I get the impression, you know, when if I was Angela and I was coming back into the house, what I probably would have done was, it sounds crazy. I don't know, maybe it is. I maybe would have apologized. I would have said, hey, guys, I'm sorry, honored to be here again. I recognize that a lot of you have perspectives or opinions about me after likely watching MB26. I made a lot of mistakes there. I'm looking to come back and try to improve my game and I have so much to learn from all of you. And she, not that we saw, at least didn't really approach it that way. Now, that being said, she did approach D and we saw them have a conversation in the HOH room where she was kind of giving D tips because she recognized that when she was head of household for her first season, she made a lot of mistakes in that first HOH and she didn't want D to make the same errors. So at least there's some part of her that is recognizing, hey, I made mistakes in the past season and I don't want that to impact and make the same mistakes moving forward. But still, even within that context, she wasn't kind of self reflecting there and trying to improve her own game. She was still giving D advice. And I think it's that dynamic that's going to be really interesting to watch, to see how it evolves over time. I just, we haven't seen enough of Angela this season to see how she's changed in a couple of years since we've not seen her on tv.
- [20:15]
Rob Cesternino
It's such an interesting dynamic between those three because you have Rick and D, who are really very celebrated in terms of their Survivor success, with Dee as being such a dominant winner and Rick being such a fun character who's coming off of such a fun ride in Survivor 50. But they are both native to a different show. And here's Angela, who is the person who has actually played Big Brother before, who is the returning player for this specific show. And she's kind of the afterthought in this group of three.
- [20:44]
Emily Flippin
It's actually, it's casting genius because I do think that the three of them, they bring such different Personas and like vibes to the cast that you could almost, you can much more Easily separate them in your head. You cast three strategists or three Devons or. Or three. Angela's right. Just chaotic, crazy players, then you're going to have a problem on your hands. And I love this combination of the three. But I wouldn't say just yet that Angela, you know, we haven't seen it in the edit as much, but I have to imagine that the new players probably are most familiar with Angela and her game. And I can't say that I can speak for myself. And I watch a lot of reality again, I forget most of it. I. I haven't forgotten a lot of the more controversial, crazy stuff that Angela did on her season. I haven't forgotten how that impacted her allies. I can't imagine that other people haven't forgotten that either. And if I'm seeing an alliance with Dee Devins and Angela and X number of other new players, I'm probably thinking to myself, who is the loosest cannon in this group? It's Angela. It's always going to be Angela.
- [21:41]
Rob Cesternino
I'd love to talk about some of the new players also and get your perspective on them. And I had been thinking of you because here is Yash, who is a social media financial consultant analyst.
- [21:56]
Sponsor/Advertiser Voice
Yeah.
- [21:56]
Emily Flippin
And I'm sure his job is a lot more. More legitimate than my job is, but man, do I feel bad for Yash because talk about, you know, getting, getting put up by the first hoh. We didn't even get to see any conversations that Yash had with D. We haven't seen much of his relationships forming in the house. And then most importantly, he was on D's HOH team or, you know, the team that would help her win head of household. And maybe we'll get some of that when we get our next episode. But like, very little commentary here and it always seems like he's like this sad afterthought. And I can't tell if that's just because he's. He's not this big personality that we have elsewhere. Like maybe he just needs to step up a bit or if it's just because nobody really cares about him and he's just, you know, somebody you can throw up as a pawn on the block, but as we know, pawns go home. And it does make me concerned for Yash, but if I'm the only retaining financial analyst here, then, you know, no harm, no foul.
- [22:43]
Rob Cesternino
Yet reality TV's reigning financial analyst.
- [22:46]
Emily Flippin
There you go. Yeah, I don't know about that. Maybe give Yash a second chance.
- [22:50]
Rob Cesternino
Well, maybe you could take Yash under his. Your wing if he comes out of the house.
- [22:54]
Emily Flippin
Yeah. I'll tell him that what he really should do when he's up there on the block is freak out a little bit, make a scene at Tribal Council. I mean, when, you know, at whatever the BB equivalent to Tribal Council is. What do we call that? I don't think it has a name. The circle. Oh, the nomination ceremony.
- [23:08]
Rob Cesternino
Nomination ceremony?
- [23:09]
Emily Flippin
Yeah.
- [23:10]
Rob Cesternino
Ceremonies. Yeah. Because it's also the living room.
- [23:14]
Emily Flippin
It hasn't worked out for me in the past, but maybe it'll work for him.
- [23:17]
Rob Cesternino
Yeah. How about some of these other new players? Is there anybody else that has really given you some fun thoughts?
- [23:28]
Emily Flippin
Oh, gosh. Well, it's even hard to know where to begin. Obviously, the. The showmance is at day two, I think, a hilarious disaster just waiting to happen. Early showmances, especially when they're not slow burns, so to speak, but happen immediately, are just great distractions from everybody else. But to be completely honest with you, I find both Rome and Lyric to be mildly grading, and maybe that's just because the only them is. Is them kind of loudly making out while everybody else is trying to sleep. And I'm putting myself in that position where I'm like, man, you only have certain number of hours. I know. So we told us a certain number of hours that you're able to sleep in the BB house. And the idea that I have to listen to any portion of that with other people who have known each other for two days macking ahead of me, I mean, would just drive me completely up a wall.
- [24:12]
Rob Cesternino
Yeah. So. All right, Roman Lyric. We're not so high on what. What about Barrett, who is somebody who has been working very closely with D and even Devins.
- [24:24]
Emily Flippin
You know, I was a fan of Barrett when I saw his initial casting. Watching him on the show, I am concerned. And it's not because I don't like Barrett as a player. It's not that I don't like him as a person. I don't like his alliance with D and Devins.
- [24:37]
Sponsor/Advertiser Voice
Oh.
- [24:37]
Emily Flippin
And I know. And this is maybe a hot take. I. Maybe I'm projecting here on some point. I. I don't. I didn't quite understand the. Why that group got together. Right. I think it was Drew, Barrett, D, Devins, and Angela.
- [24:50]
Rob Cesternino
Yeah, the crossover.
- [24:51]
Emily Flippin
And that's the. Yes, the crossovers. So the crossovers. And it seems like that's the alliance that Dee and Devins are running. Wanting to run most closely, with which more power to them. They're in the House, they can kind of sense out where their closest connections are. But I think Barrett is, again, just making judgment calls based on what people look like. So maybe he's not a great strategist, but he gives, you know, kind of nerdy guy vibes, strategist vibes. He's somebody who's probably aware of what a big threat the vets are. You want to be, in the interim, aligned with a three person voting block. And the veterans are obviously a good distraction from any new players. They're always going to be people that you probably want to get rid of ahead of, you know, potentially just, oh, little Barrett sitting in the corner. So I just think that Barrett is kind of aware of that dynamic and is maybe more willing to throw that alliance under the bus faster than D and Devins are, basically. I'm just not getting the sense that he's going to ride as hard for them as they might ride for him. And we saw that when Dee didn't put Barrett up for nomination, even though I think Kamu made a really, really good argument for why she should. A really good argument. And D, instead of doing what I think would have been the maybe most logical thing and splitting up the nominations, chose to nominate somebody from her own own HOH group instead, which I think kind of exposes out of lines a bit, exposes that she's willing to do something that's less ideal for her game to protect the crossovers in the interim. I just don't know if Barrett is hoh, if he's going to be making that same decision to protect D, so. Or Devin's.
- [26:15]
Rob Cesternino
Yeah. Barrett and Drew are both in the same position of that they are the real super fans who are there in the house playing with people that they've enjoyed watching on television. Do you feel like is. Is.
- [26:28]
Narrator/Announcer
Is.
- [26:28]
Rob Cesternino
Is there a danger there for the returning players in feeling like, okay, these people have our best interests and then eventually that they want to be ultimately the reality TV legends themselves.
- [26:41]
Emily Flippin
Yeah, I, I always hate it when people come on TV and think to themselves, how am I going to get the most screen time? And I need to either align or vote off people, vote off people who are based off screen time or align with people based off screen time so that I get a good edit. I hate all that stuff. And to be honest, I'm clearly not great about sussing that out myself, so maybe I'm not the best person there. But in the case of the super fans, I. I will say I think deep. You know, you ride that for as long as you can. I don't think anybody is such a big super fan that they're willing to at least consciously hurt their own game in the Big Brother house. Now, whether or not they do that, subconsciously a different decision. I remember what Dee was like on 45, where she had very genuine, close alliances with people who are willing to ride or die for her. And when push came to shove, she was willing to make cuts when needed to advance her own game. And I just hope that, you know, her and Rick, you know, learning from D in this context, are willing to make those decisions if time comes where they need to start cutting some of the super fans, because I promise you, they're not. They're not going to be such big super fans that they will die on their sword for you.
- [27:40]
Rob Cesternino
So back in season 45, it seemed to me as a viewer that Dee's most loyal ally was ultimately Julie. And we have Angela here, who is also like a maternal figure. But I also feel like that Julie and Angela are probably not super similar.
- [27:58]
Emily Flippin
The Julie slander.
- [27:59]
Rob Cesternino
Yeah, yeah, I know. I, I, that, that I. But I feel like I don't know a lot about Julie.
- [28:05]
Emily Flippin
Yeah, this, this is fair. They're obviously, I think, very, very different people. And I think the alliance that was built out between D and Julie, I mean, that was a genuine connection that two people had and grew over a period of obviously days and weeks, lots of times of working together and putting their money where their mouth is. And maybe the same thing can be true for Angela. Angela's case, this is much more in alliance out of convenience from the fact that you're veterans, you could replace Angela with literally any other Big Brother returning player for the most part. And the same exact dynamic would have happened right where D and Debbins would have aligned together. So I don't think D is looking at Angela and thinking to herself, oh, I've worked with somebody like this before. I can figure, you know, like, this is an alliance that makes sense for me independently of the situation of both of us being returning players. I think it's purely. We're returning players. We're all shields for each other. At least in the interim, we have to work together. And it does seem like a genuine alliance from everybody's perspectives right now, but it's been like a week. Right. Like, how much context do we actually have to where their thought processes are? And Angela, again, it's. Sometimes it takes a couple of weeks for people to start to slip, and I think it's hard to keep up. I'm not saying Angel's putting on the facade, but like acting your best behavior when it comes to the game and strategy, there's going to be cracks. And when those cracks start to show, I just wonder how that relationship evolves between Angela, Andy, Rick and D talked
- [29:24]
Rob Cesternino
about how they did not have the best relationship during Survivor 50 and I think some of that might have just been hyping it up for the television show. In the diary room there was the one vote where they were not on the same page. And then. And then you all voted out D at the merge but prior to that at the. At the Charlie vote and I know you weren't there for that, but coming into the merge, did it seem like that there was any animosity between rick and D?
- [29:50]
Emily Flippin
Yes, 100%. I remember one of the first conversations I had with Rick was he told me he wanted D out and this was before I even had the chance to talk with the at that point. And I remember just being heartbroken because I my closest alliance was with Rick and. Or Rick and, you know, Christian and Surya. At that point my closest alliance included him. And I remember thinking to myself, darn it, I was really hoping to hit the merge and have the ability to combine, you know, whatever relationship I have with D prior to this with my existing alliance and have us move together. But that was a no go zone kind of for both of them. Although I talked with it a lot more about Rick. But I know this about both D and Devins. Neither of them are grudge holders and I think both of them have managed to reconcile any bad blood about either these vote outs or the blindside against Charlie on season 50. All of that, I think, is water that is so far under the bridge that it's almost not even worth bringing up. So I wouldn't be surprised. We might not see, depending on how the live feeder see, we might not see a lot of conversations happening directly between D and Devins. I think if we don't that's strategic on their parts for making it seem like they're not as close as they are. But both these people have played survivors together. They the devil you know is much better than the devil you don't. I think they're both aware of that and they're massive targets so it makes all the sense in the world for them to be biggest thieves.
- [31:00]
Rob Cesternino
Yeah, I think that also Rick's loyalty mindset has really infiltrated the house and we know in Survivor 50 where, you know, you and Rick had your back up against the wall at the power broker tribal council, you stuck together. You could have tried to throw each other under the bus. And that was a really nice moment between the two of you in the house that we. I think that this may be getting a little ahead of where the episodes are where Melody did not want to stick with Mallory once she got up on the block, and it was something that's been noticed by Rick. And I think that other people have also said this, like, wow, that's not a loyal person. That's not somebody who's sticking by their friend. That's not the type of person that I would want to work for. And I think that the. It may be in other big brother houses that would not have been looked down upon as much.
- [31:50]
Emily Flippin
Yeah, I think that's really interesting dynamic. And as you mentioned, you know, Rick is obviously has a lot of data to back this up. He's such a bro, for lack of a better word. And I mean that the most love. You know, not in a bro sense, but in the sense that, like, he will ride with you once you're one of his people and he puts his money where his mouth is when it comes to voting and aligning. I. That being said, and I understand why you have nothing else going on in the house. You only see what you see. And so it's a talking point. You see somebody who's maybe not acting the most loyal, and you. You draw that as a character trait. So I don't. I don't fault Rick or others for feeling that way about Mallory or about Melody. Excuse me. Gosh, those names are gonna kill. I know about Melody, but here's what I will say in defense of Melody. This is the first nomination, the first head of household competition. You have known these people for just a handful of days, and. And people are already looping. I believe it was her. Mallory and Lyric up together in a three, because God forbid, people work out together. Right? So I would kind of be in the same mentality where if I see what is perceived to be one of my closest allies that I probably barely know at this point, going up on the block and everyone being like, well, that's your person. Like, whoa, wait a minute. When this is my person, I'm still a free agent. I still want to go out there and chat. But here's what I will say. I would have saved those conversations. Well, I'm giving myself the benefit of the doubt here. Ideally, you save those conversations for, like. Like after the veto nomination ceremony or after at least the first vote off, and then you can Go back and just kind of clarify to people that while you really liked Mel Mallory, you are still somebody who is looking to. To find a home and maybe somebody will take you in. But I kind of sympathize with her because I think she saw that ship sinking and was like, I don't want to sink with it. And it's not like you are, you know, at that point that, you know, Devin's, for instance, on season 50 went to bat with me at that tribal council for Surrey. Our fates, I think, from both of our perspectives were kind of written in the sand at that point. We were social outcasts in the sense that people wanted us out. We had been working together since day one. We'd been through a lot together. So it made sense to ride or die. I think expecting Melody to ride or die with Mallory after just a few days, I mean, it's hard to rake somebody over the coals for that.
- [33:52]
Rob Cesternino
Is there anybody else that you think from Survivor 50 would have been a good fit here on Big Brother 28?
- [34:00]
Emily Flippin
A good fit. I mean, this is so selfish of me, so incredibly selfish of me because of course I want to have all the people that I'm aligned with. And I know, well, in the Biggest Brother house, I would love to have seen Christian. Of course, now I know Christian will probably never do it because he's probably like, I have a life. And, you know, not to say that Rick or D Don't have lives. Yeah, that sounded bad. A different life. I have a different life. I have different priorities right now. Maybe. Maybe as time passes. But you know who I actually would love to see? Joe.
- [34:26]
Rob Cesternino
Joe.
- [34:27]
Emily Flippin
I know that's a controversial opinion, but Joe, I just think he's like people. He really does force people to, like, play around him and Joe on the live feeds.
- [34:37]
Rob Cesternino
Oh.
- [34:38]
Emily Flippin
Oh, it would be magic. It would be magic. He's going under the radar here. Come on cbs.
- [34:42]
Rob Cesternino
Okay, so I was gonna say Joe as a joke that he would not enjoy it, but I know that you were very fond of him, and I know from when I did my post game interviews with Joe that he talked about that you and him had a special relationship. So what is it about Joe that was your experience that maybe the people at home don't necessarily get from the TV show?
- [35:04]
Emily Flippin
Joe. I maintain that for the most part what you see on TV I think is fair and representative of how people are perceived and views by those around them. I think that's true for myself. I think it was true for most people on season 50. I definitely think it was true for Joe. That being said, Joe is obviously, and I don't think anybody will fight me on this, a lovely, wonderful person. But Joe, I think struggles. The bit of cognitive dissonance is maybe the. The word that I would use. And I sympathize a lot, you know, because I feel that way about myself to an extent, which is maybe why I want to see him, because I think it'd be great tv. But I think that forces people to kind of like change how they interact with him. As a result, you never quite understand where his head is. And we saw that a lot in season 50 where he would say one thing but do another and then struggle with himself and that decision making because it went against whatever his perceived values were. That is such an interesting dynamic when you have a lot more time on a show like Big Brother as well as like food and water, obviously to sit and think about your decisions and you're having to play around a larger group of people. You know, it's like the merge all over again. Huge number of people that all have their own ambitions. I just think watching him navigate that and watching other people navigate around Joe's cognitive dissonance would just be so interesting. And what's great about him is that Big Brother casts a lot of these, like, really big personalities and that's fine, you know, fits the Big Brother campiness and stuff, but, like, he's not that. He's not that. So he'd offer a nice balance to, like, the Latrice's of the world, I guess.
- [36:27]
Rob Cesternino
Yeah. You know, it's interesting. I talked a lot about this during Survivor 50 of the similarities or differences between Joe and Evans. And I think that at their center, in addition to being incredible dads, they both have a really strong moral code of like, the. There. These are the lines I'm not willing to cross. And I think that Rick ends up taking some enjoyment out of that. And I think that Joe ends up feeling like a burden due to the moral code that he has. And sometimes, many times during the season he was like, hey, this is not what I want to do, but I'm. But I feel like I'm having to do it out of obligation. Where I think Rick enjoys, hey, you want me to do this and I'm not going to.
- [37:10]
Emily Flippin
There's actually a lot of really interesting psychological studies I think, to back this up, where we. We tend to use values and morals to back up decisions that we've already made as opposed to making decisions based off of our values and our morals And I think the difference between Joe and Rick is that Rick is maybe aware of this dynamic a little more self aware of this dynamic than. Than Joe is. And when Joe makes decisions and then isn't able to back it up with his perceived values and morals, that's what creates that, that, that you know, challenge I guess that's happening in his head. And whereas Rick I think makes a decision, you know, for instance by spilling the beans about his alliances and maybe sharing more than he will and that's logically goes against what he wants which is to be tight lipped or loyal to D and is able to reconcile those two things in his head as yeah. Silliness of. Of himself as the human nature as opposed to feeling really, really challenged in his humanity by that decision making. And that does tend to go over a lot better for reality TV then then taking things a little too seriously.
- [38:08]
Sponsor/Advertiser Voice
Yeah.
- [38:08]
Rob Cesternino
There is a power that America can send to one of the house guests. Who do you think is more likely to get the power here in week one? Do you think it'll be D or Rick?
- [38:18]
Emily Flippin
Okay, here's my question for you. Before I answer that, have you voted? I did voted yet I also didn't and I finished the episode and I was which by the way it was off of Paramount plus for a little while now it's. Yeah, I know it got taken down and it got put back up all I went to Reddit and I confirmed it. So it wasn't me, it wasn't my issue but I did manage to finish the episode and afterwards I didn't cast a vote because the interesting dynamic there was only each person can only win at once.
- [38:44]
Rob Cesternino
Yeah.
- [38:45]
Emily Flippin
And ideally your favorite person is sticking around long enough to really need it. So I think what's probably going.
- [38:51]
Rob Cesternino
But they don't need it now.
- [38:52]
Emily Flippin
They don't need it now. Exactly. My hope is is that this doesn't end up although the general populace we're stupid. We're stupid.
- [38:58]
Rob Cesternino
We're group.
- [38:59]
Emily Flippin
Groups of people are stupid. So maybe I'm giving the general populace too much. My hope is is that what the votes end up shaking out. It's not a fan favorite ranking where the first person to get it is the person that everybody likes most that week and then it just continues down the list but rather a perception of balance between who you like and who you actually believe needs it. Who is in danger. And maybe I'm underestimating the Big Brother fan base and their ability to vote accordingly. My fear is is that one of the three returning players is going to get it. I really hope that's not the case. If their target was not already big enough, they obviously do not need it. It'll make everyone in the house pretty resentful. I would have to imagine and refresh the target. So when I'm thinking, you know, I'm trying to think about somebody, I haven't. Still haven't cast my vote myself. So I don't know where it's going, but I, I fear that it's going in a fan favorite direction.
- [39:43]
Rob Cesternino
Yeah, I think it'll be either D or Rick and it'll be interesting because we don't know if they will tell the house that somebody is getting a power every single week and it might be something where they just sort of keep it under wraps and then people after a couple of weeks might start comparing notes or we might find out that they're going to announce what they're going to end up doing. Emily, did you see the news that Survivor 50 is going to be re airing this summer?
- [40:08]
Sponsor/Advertiser Voice
Yeah.
- [40:08]
Emily Flippin
Couldn't they just spare us? They had to like re air all the embarrassment. Like it was just dying down to the point where I could like, go to the grocery store. Yeah, no, no. Now it's back. Now it's back. You know, hopefully we'll skip over some episodes in the process. But I'll tell you what, I won't be watching it. Okay. I'll be watching Big Brother.
- [40:25]
Rob Cesternino
Why was it painful for you to watch Survivor 50?
- [40:28]
Emily Flippin
No, it's a lot of fun. What are you talking about? Of course it was painful, Rob. Of course it was painful. It was like the Emily embarrassment show. I had. I was painful within context, obviously. I have a lot of regrets about how I. How I acted. It was a lot of fun. I will say, watching TV shows with people that you are genuinely friendly with and know on a personal level, it is a lot of fun. And it was a lot of fun to text message, you know, Rick and Christian when stuff was happening and have a good laugh about it.
- [40:54]
Sponsor/Advertiser Voice
It.
- [40:54]
Emily Flippin
But it's even more fun to be watching them in big brother right now, right? I am. Yeah. I'm enjoying that. That is where my time energy is going.
- [41:01]
Rob Cesternino
Emily, if you had to pick a player to win the season that was not one of the returnees. Okay, I'm going to take. I take all three of the returnees off the board. Who do you think has the best chance to win?
- [41:15]
Emily Flippin
Oh, that's a really good question. The best chance to win right now. I'm sorry, I'm looking, I'm looking off in here. I have them all listed here. I genuinely think it might be Kamu.
- [41:27]
Rob Cesternino
Okay.
- [41:29]
Emily Flippin
I think, and I understand that is maybe I. I think people feel, based off the few comments I've read online, people aren't a big fan of the red corner alliance, which is fair enough. But I think what's dragging that down is other people who are part of that alliance, not necessarily Kamu himself. And I actually thought what game we've seen Kamu play in the world he's operating in has been very strong. He thinks that he is tightly aligned with, like, Dee and Devins and them. And in that world, if that were true, I understand that that's not necessarily the case from their perspectives, but from Kamu's perspectives, he is playing really well within that world. And I think what is probably going to happen is once the awareness spreads that that alliance is dead, it was never going to be, you know, honored by D and Devins and people start to target the red corner alliance. They probably go for people like Haley or Chuck before they go for Camus. I think Kamu, we've seen him have more strategic conversations with more people. I think he's integrating himself more in the house. And then once your core alliance gets kind of decimated, even if it is pre jury, that makes you a bit of that floater, that free agent that maybe allows him to plug in more. And we've already seen that. I think he has some of the strategic chops to get there. He's also, I think a physical, I don't know, MMA seems like a physical thing. Probably a physical threat for some comps, so maybe you can win some too.
- [42:44]
Rob Cesternino
I think it's a really smart take because I think that people are looking at like, oh, well, that he's not in the real power, power core and so that he's.
- [42:52]
Emily Flippin
You probably don't want to be in the real power core this early.
- [42:54]
Rob Cesternino
Well, I think that there's going to be a cause and effect of that at some point. I think the jig is going to be up. Kamu's gonna realize that he's not in with D. And I think that there's a whole side of the house that's thinking like, oh, D is just in with, like, the real people who are running the house are Kamu and Chuck and the other one, Haley, and that they're really running things. The girl.
- [43:20]
Emily Flippin
The girl they felt the need to have to have in this red corner alliance. Oh, my God.
- [43:25]
Rob Cesternino
But I think that at the point where that those guys realize, like, hey, we got hosed. I think that they're going to link up with that other side of the house and instead of going after each other, I think there's certainly a scenario. It's like, hey, the. The returnees duped us that we weren't in charge. They were. And so I think that there is, like, a world where the two sides of the house that aren't the returnees could potentially link up.
- [43:49]
Emily Flippin
Yeah, I. I am hopeful here that we'll see the returnees make a deep run because I love D and Devins. I would be ecstatic. I'm so incredibly, like, biased in this podcast, obviously, because I have a personal relationship with them and I'm. I'm rooting for them. If I was a. A fan who was not emotionally invested, I would probably be rooting against them. To be completely frank with you, I'm also rooting for Angela because she makes great TV and I love great tv and I'll probably get Eric to watch more of the season just because Angela's on it. That being said, I don't see any of these returning players making it deep into the jury phase. I just. Just the nature of the. And they have to know that. They have to have the awareness. Maybe that's why they're playing hard and early. Unless something crazy happens, I just, you know, I see it. I see it happening with the siree level, and Surrey is probably the best. They do.
- [44:32]
Rob Cesternino
Yeah. Okay. Emily, I know said you watch a lot of reality tv. Is there anything else you're watching besides Big Brother?
- [44:38]
Emily Flippin
Well, Love Island's over now. My hole in my heart, of course, is empty now.
- [44:43]
Rob Cesternino
Yes. I loved it so much. This was my first Love island season and so into it.
- [44:48]
Emily Flippin
You know, I will say it was not my favorite season for obvious reasons. There have been better seasons of reality tv, but I think it was, gosh, the Leah season, the Rob season. I cannot remember the names of other people who were on that season, but Leah and Rob. That season was probably the best season of reality TV I have ever seen that in the very first season of Temptation Island. Not the one that's on Netflix. It was pre Netflix buying Temptation Island. The very first season of Temptation island that came out in, like, 2018 or something. That was some great reality TV.
- [45:19]
Rob Cesternino
Should they have sent anybody from season 50? Oh, it's. There's no synergy now. They could have sent them to Love island, but now it's on CBS anymore.
- [45:27]
Emily Flippin
Can you imagine? Send them. Actually make them compete their way back in. Send them on survival.
- [45:31]
Rob Cesternino
I don't know if anybody in the whole cast. 24 people, I don't think. I'm not sure there's one single person. Okay. Emily, thank you so much for coming on and talking some BB28. This was so fun.
- [45:42]
Emily Flippin
Yeah, thanks for having me. It was a pleasure. Blast.
- [45:43]
Rob Cesternino
Yeah. Anything you want people to check out on your end?
- [45:47]
Emily Flippin
Oh, no, I have nothing to plug. I apologize. I'll plug this. Go watch the live feeds on Big Brother. Apparently, they're better.
- [45:54]
Rob Cesternino
Okay. All right. And then check out maybe when Yash becomes Emily's new financial intern.
- [46:02]
Emily Flippin
Oh, there we go. I think Josh can do better than that, but we'll see.
- [46:05]
Rob Cesternino
Okay. All right. Thank you so much for join us. We got so much more Big Brother coming up. I'll be doing the slop over on the patron feed with Chappelle. We'll have another Wednesday night recap, plus everything else going on and a few other surprises, too. So thank you for joining us, everybody.
- [46:20]
Emily Flippin
Take care.
- [46:20]
Rob Cesternino
Have a good one.
- [46:21]
Sponsor/Advertiser Voice
Bye.