The Collapse Isn’t Coming—It’s Already Here

Summary

Podcast Summary: "The Collapse Isn’t Coming—It’s Already Here"

Rich Dad Radio Show: In-Your-Face Advice on Investing, Personal Finance, & Starting a Business
Host: The Rich Dad Media Network
Episode Title: The Collapse Isn’t Coming—It’s Already Here
Release Date: July 9, 2025
Participants: Robert Kiyosaki (Host), Adam Taggart (Guest)

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Introduction

In the episode titled "The Collapse Isn’t Coming—It’s Already Here," Robert Kiyosaki welcomes longtime friend and financial expert Adam Taggart to discuss pressing issues in higher education, macroeconomic challenges, and strategic investment advice. The episode delves into the current state of the economy, the flaws within the education system, and practical steps investors can take to safeguard and grow their wealth.

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1. Critique of the Higher Education System

Timestamp: [02:28] – [06:52]

Adam Taggart opens the discussion by expressing his deep dissatisfaction with the current state of higher education in the United States. He criticizes the shift from genuine educational values to what he perceives as "wokeness" and political correctness, arguing that universities have become environments that stifle free thought and real-world preparation.

• Key Points:

  • Wokeness in Education: Taggart describes the transformation of higher education into arenas dominated by woke ideology, leading to intolerance for differing viewpoints.
  • Escalating Costs: He highlights the skyrocketing costs of college education, resulting in substantial student loan debts that burden graduates for years.
  • Lack of Practical Skills: The education system, according to Taggart, fails to equip students with practical skills necessary for the real world, rendering many degrees less valuable in the job market.

• Notable Quote:

  "The least tolerant movement out there, where if you don't line up behind whatever today's woke ideology is, you're going to get canceled, fired, whatever."
  — Adam Taggart [05:15]

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2. Macroeconomic Analysis

Timestamp: [06:52] – [34:17]

The conversation transitions to a deep dive into the current macroeconomic landscape, focusing on inflation, the bond market, and national debt.

a. Inflation Concerns

• Inflation Trends: Taggart explains how moderate inflation can be insidious, likening it to a frog slowly boiling in water—unnoticed until it's too late.

• Impact of COVID-19: The pandemic-induced spike in cost of living has made the general populace more aware of inflationary pressures.

• Future Outlook: He emphasizes the importance of educating the public to maintain vigilance against ongoing inflation, even if official figures stabilize.

• Notable Quote:

  "You don't need to be an economist to know inflation's here."
  — Robert Kiyosaki [09:23]

b. Bond Market Dynamics

• Current Trends: Kiyosaki observes that investors are moving away from U.S. Treasuries towards assets like gold, anticipating a decline in the dollar's purchasing power.

• Yield Implications: Taggart explains that reduced demand for Treasuries leads to lower bond prices and higher yields, a fundamental market reaction.

• Notable Quote:

  "If people start buying other assets like gold instead of Treasuries, there's less demand for Treasuries. So bond prices will go down, bond yields will go up."
  — Adam Taggart [11:10]

c. National Debt Crisis

• Debt Spiral: With the U.S. national debt surpassing $37 trillion and student loan debt at $1.8 trillion, Taggart warns of an impending sovereign debt crisis.

• Interest vs. Revenue: He points out that government income from taxes is now below the interest accrued on the debt, signaling unsustainable fiscal policies.

• Potential Solutions: While pessimistic about long-term prospects, Taggart remains cautiously optimistic that current administration policies might buy some time to mitigate the crisis.

• Notable Quote:

  "Once your spending, including your interest on the debt, your non-productive spending eclipses your tax receipts, it's like you're basically entering the death spiral at that point in time."
  — Adam Taggart [31:25]

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3. Investment Strategies and Advice

Timestamp: [13:12] – [35:26]

Kiyosaki and Taggart exchange insights on prudent investment practices amidst economic uncertainties.

a. Avoiding Emotional Decisions

• Headline Trading: Taggart advises against making investment decisions based solely on sensational headlines, which can often misrepresent the true state of affairs.

• Discipline Over Emotion: Emphasizing the importance of staying informed and disciplined, he warns that emotional reactions can lead to poor investment choices.

• Notable Quote:

  "Don't just trade by the headlines. If you see the headlines and make a decision based on that, you're often making the wrong decision at the wrong time."
  — Adam Taggart [13:40]

b. Risk Management

• Understanding Goals: Taggart encourages investors to clearly define their financial goals and design a strategic plan to achieve them, which often requires taking calculated, rather than reckless, risks.

• Simplified Investment Models: He advocates for the "Keep it Simple" (KISS) approach, utilizing a minimal number of diversified funds to manage investments effectively.

• Notable Quote:

  "Why try to swing for the home run where you're going to strike out a lot more? Focus on hitting doubles and singles that'll safely get to your goal in time with a lot less risk."
  — Adam Taggart [15:14]

c. Asset Protection

• Gold and Silver: The duo discusses the importance of owning tangible assets like gold and silver as hedges against currency devaluation and inflation.
• Strategic Allocation: Taggart highlights silver as an emerging opportunity due to its increasing demand in various industries, predicting significant price appreciation.

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4. The Importance of Mentorship and Education

Timestamp: [16:02] – [35:26]

A significant portion of the episode is dedicated to the value of mentors and continuous learning in achieving financial success.

a. Building a Board of Mentors

• Expert Guidance: Taggart shares his practice of cultivating a diverse board of mentors and advisors to gain insights from seasoned experts in economics and finance.
• Trusted Sources: He differentiates his approach from mainstream financial media by focusing on "financially nutritious content" that offers actionable and practical advice.

b. Influential Educators and Mentors

• Notable Figures: Taggart mentions several economists and financial experts he respects, including Lacy Hunt, Thomas Honig, Darius Dale, Stephanie Pomboy, and Melody Wright, praising their contributions to financial education and their integrity.

• Passing the Torch: Both hosts emphasize the responsibility of the financially educated to mentor the next generation, ensuring the continuity of sound financial principles.

• Notable Quote:

  "Information in and of itself has no value. It only has value when you apply it."
  — Adam Taggart [30:27]

c. Personal Stories and Inspirations

• Educational Impact: Taggart recounts how Kiyosaki's teachings inspired him to educate his own niece about financial literacy, illustrating the ripple effect of effective mentorship.
• Legacy of Learning: Both hosts express their commitment to teaching and empowering others to achieve financial independence and contribute positively to society.

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Conclusion: Final Insights and Takeaways

Timestamp: [35:26] – [40:07]

As the episode winds down, Kiyosaki and Taggart reinforce the episode's central themes.

• Responsibility of Wealth: They discuss the ethical obligation that comes with financial success, citing Robert F. Kennedy Sr.'s words: "To whom much is given, much is required."

• Core Values: The importance of relationships, purpose, and health as the true measures of wealth is highlighted, emphasizing that money should be a tool to enhance these areas rather than an end in itself.

• Call to Action: Listeners are encouraged to value good teachers and mentors, continue their financial education, and apply their knowledge to improve their lives and communities.

• Notable Quote:

  "If you're rich in relationships, purpose, and health, you're already winning life. And the irony is, if you're rich in those three things, the money is much more likely to come because you're living your full authentic self and you're likely to outperform."
  — Adam Taggart [34:17]

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Key Takeaways

1. Reform Higher Education: There's a pressing need to reform the higher education system to make it more practical, affordable, and free from ideological biases.
2. Understand Macroeconomic Indicators: Awareness of inflation trends, bond market dynamics, and national debt is crucial for making informed financial decisions.
3. Adopt Disciplined Investment Strategies: Investors should avoid emotional trading, clearly define their financial goals, and utilize simple, diversified investment models.
4. Value Mentorship and Continuous Learning: Building a network of trusted mentors and committing to ongoing education are essential for financial growth and resilience.
5. Prioritize Core Values Over Money: Relationships, purpose, and health are fundamental to true wealth, with money serving as a means to enhance these aspects of life.

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This summary encapsulates the core discussions and insights from the episode "The Collapse Isn’t Coming—It’s Already Here," providing a comprehensive overview for those who haven't listened to the full podcast.

Transcript

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[Rich Dad Radio Show Announcer]

This is the Rich Dad Radio show, the good news and bad news about money. Here's Robert Kia.

[Robert Kiyosaki]

Hello, Robert Kiyosaki, the Rich Dad Radio Show. We're broadcasting from Phoenix, Arizona, where it's either heaven or hell. And right now it's hot as hell. And I was talking to a friend who's a real estate agent. It's so hot she has to wear hot, you know, hot pads to pick up her real estate signs. That's hot. So anyway, and my guest today is a longtime friend, Adam Taggart, and honored to be with him on the show. And Adam has his MBA from Stanford. That's where my poor dad went to school and my dad knew I was never going to get into Stanford anyway. But the reason I bring up Adam's background is because his show is called Thoughtful Money, because I've known him for years and I watch his show religiously. And the reason for that is Adam has a classically trained mind in the world of economics and finance and macro and minor. But he is a classical trained one. And most of These guys on YouTube are like me. We're kind of dogs that go sniffing around the trash bins and sniff stuff out. So I thought, Adam, your title of your show, Thoughtful Money is excellent title because you come from greater depth on this whole macroeconomic disaster we're cruising into right now. So, Adam, long time, welcome to the show.

[Adam Taggart]

Such a pleasure to be back. Robert, thank you. I will try to live up to that intro. I kind of see myself maybe as sort of bridging the world of the academically trained and the regular guy sniffing around the trash can like you. So my role, at least as I try to have it be, is to crawling the brains of those really smart money experts and then try to distill what they think into regular person speak. So hopefully I can do that today. While we're talking, just a quick editorial note. I am not wearing hot pants in case anybody was wondering what was happening below the camera here.

[Robert Kiyosaki]

Okay. Anyway, your show is, well, well thought. It is thoughtful money.

[Adam Taggart]

It is. It is thoughtful money.

[Unknown Speaker]

Y.

[Robert Kiyosaki]

And I. I watch it religiously. So I honored to have you on my program this morning.

[Unknown Speaker]

Well, thank you.

[Adam Taggart]

And it's a huge honor to hear that you watch the show, Robert. So, anyways, very happy to be here. It's always fun talking to you. And it's not only fun, but it's always just real. So, you know, since we've known each other so long, Robert, let's dispense with all the pleasantries and let's just be real today.

[Robert Kiyosaki]

Yeah, so let's. Let's get into what's real right now. I mean, you come from higher education and you have Trump going after Harvard and all that stuff and what, as a layperson, you know, somebody sitting on the sideline watching Trump go after the Department of Education and all this. What goes through your mind?

[Adam Taggart]

Honestly, as somebody who, you know, went to Ivy Leagues, I went to Brown undergrad, My brother actually went to Harvard, and then I got my MBA at Stanford, as you mentioned. Honestly, I kind of feel like it's about damn time. Yes.

[Unknown Speaker]

Yeah.

[Adam Taggart]

You'll be hard pressed to find somebody who went through the formal education system, higher education system in this country, who is kind of more down in it than I. And maybe that's a little bit hyperbolic. You can still get a great education at a lot of places, but I think more and more, and this really started when I started college back in the early 90s. Back then it was called PC or politically correct. That was the movement that then sort of metastasized into what became wokeness and wokeness really just. It was a contagion that kind of completely infected our higher education schools, especially the elite levels of education, to the point where you probably heard people say this. They almost became madrasas for this kind of woke ideology. And at the end of the day, look, I'm all for the tolerance and the understanding and the mutual respect that was sort of part of the initial seeds of this movement, but it just devolved into the least tolerant movement out there, where if you don't line up behind whatever today's woke ideology is, you're going to get canceled, fired, whatever. And the university has to be a safe space for anybody who doesn't want to be challenged in Their thinking really the opposite of what higher education should be. At the same time, costs just ballooned out of control. So, you know, most people who were going to college were. Had been paying a ridiculous amount and too many of them taking on loans that they're probably never going to be able to. To fully repay, given the reduced salaries they're going to be able to command, given the fact that their degrees mean nothing because they were studying, you know, whatever gender fluid, you know, social songwriting of the 1920s.

[Unknown Speaker]

Right.

[Adam Taggart]

So honestly, I feel like kind of a cleaning of house and a restoration, both of both merit, but also just sort of the traditional canon of what education is supposed to do, which is to prepare people for practical work out in the real world. I think that time is long overdue.

[Robert Kiyosaki]

And.

[Adam Taggart]

And I think that the university has really made a big mistake in the way that they fought back on this. I think they still are. And as a result, I think the comeuppance that they're getting right now is heartily deserved.

[Robert Kiyosaki]

Right. And the thing I value that because both you and I value education. I mean, that's the business we're in.

[Unknown Speaker]

Yeah.

[Adam Taggart]

Or probably better. We value learning.

[Unknown Speaker]

Right. Yeah.

[Adam Taggart]

And I don't think the education system has done a great job recently of delivering valuable learning.

[Robert Kiyosaki]

Yeah. You know, my, my education began when I. When I was looking at, you know, this thing, this little thing. Why is it copper today? You know what I mean?

[Unknown Speaker]

Yeah.

[Robert Kiyosaki]

Why is it copper? And I didn't know it, Adam, but this is. I'm 1965. That's how long ago it was. And I said, they're messing with our money. And that's when I got. Like I said, I'm a, I'm a. I'm a junkyard dog. Stand for the garbage cans. What are they not telling us? Why is this thing copper? And then in 71, you know, Nixon took the dollar off the gold standard. And at that time, I was, I was, I was flying this baby in Vietnam, you know, cruising around the place. And I said, they took the dollar off the gold standard. What does that mean? So again, that's why I acknowledge you for being classically trained. And I had to go sniff it out, you know, what the heck would this mean? What does this mean? And I had to fly behind enemy lines to go buy some gold. And I found out that the story I tell is I talked to the gold little Vietnamese woman, you know, we're behind enemy lines because the NV had gone south already. We were going to get our asses killed. And I tried to buy gold at a discount, and she educated me hard on the line Adams. She said, spot. I said, what the hell's that word? Spot? And she has red teeth because you eat beetle nuts. She said, did she go to Harvard or something? That you told me something. As you know, that's why we're in this trouble today.

[Adam Taggart]

Well, and what's emblematic about that story is sometimes you find the greatest capitalists in communist or socialist societies because they know really where the end. The end game is on on those regimes, and they. They become hearty embracers of capitalism again. You go to our. Our higher education, you know, institutions of higher learning here, Robert, they don't even teach you about money. I mean, all this stuff about how money is created, what you sussed out, you know, haggling with that Vietnamese woman behind enemy alliance in Vietnam. You learn more about money than what a Harvard graduate gets taught.

[Robert Kiyosaki]

Yeah.

[Adam Taggart]

Except they get the rationale for why printing it is always a good thing.

[Robert Kiyosaki]

Yeah, yeah. And that's why Jim Rickards always says, you don't need to be an economist to know inflation's here.

[Adam Taggart]

You don't. You don't. Now, you know, one of the nefarious things about inflation is that when it's moderate, it is hard for the average person to suss out. They can kind of feel the accumulation of it over time. But it's sort of like that frog in the pot, right? One of maybe the silver linings of the injury that we took from COVID in terms of the spike in cost of living, is it sort of pulled back the curtain and the average person now, got to see, wait a minute. Something's going on here. Like our money is losing purchasing power at a rate that just doesn't feel like it really should. And we have a moment in time here, I think, where we can try to bring more people into the tent of education to explain what's going on here, because they're actually able to. They've been able to see it now. And I think one of the things that I hope doesn't happen here is if the Fed is successful in getting at least the official inflation rate down to 2% or whatnot, and we go back to kind of the slow burn. I really don't want the populace to go back to sleep on this. I want them to remember this and then demand of their future elected officials, hey, we want you to embrace policies that are going to prevent that from happening to us again.

[Robert Kiyosaki]

Right. So let's speak to the average person. The thing that's on my mind like 71, when Nixon took the dollar off the gold standard, then the U.S. treasuries and U.S. bonds became gold, basically. And then today I'm watching the bond market, people are dumping bonds to buy gold now. And so I look at that and I go, my God, what's the end result of all this? So from your position as a classically trained finance guy, what's going to happen with this bond market if they keep dumping it?

[Adam Taggart]

Well, so eventually, eventually with the bond market, rates will go higher.

[Unknown Speaker]

Right.

[Adam Taggart]

So for two reasons. One, if people start buying other assets like gold instead of Treasuries, there's less demand for Treasuries. So bond prices will go down, bond yields will go up. That's just simple math. But as the, you know, if and as the world starts saying, you know what, like, I don't think dollars, I think dollars are going to continue to lose their purchasing power now at a faster rate going forward. You got to compensate me for that. And you're just going to see the treasury yield just start shooting the moon right now. A lot of people, I just want to correct one narrative here. A lot of people are saying, oh, well, nobody wants to buy the US Treasuries anymore, and the US Dollar is going to lose its world reserve currency status and whatnot. It could, and history shows it probably will at some point in time. But that's going to be a slow process, a lot slower than a lot of people who are really ginned up about this, I think are taking into account. And a big question you have to ask yourself is, okay, well, if you don't want to hold U.S. treasuries, whose debt do you want to hold? And the honest answer is nobody else's is any better. And for a lot of reasons, very few other countries debts could replace the Treasury. Just from a scale standpoint, it is highly unlikely that the world is just going to abandon the U.S. treasury system tomorrow. Abandon the dollar tomorrow. Now, that being said, this slow burn, maybe even over time, accelerating burn of purchasing power in the US Dollar, I believe is one of the things I've got the highest confidence is going to happen here. It's just going to happen with all fiat currencies. And so you want to ask yourself, how do I protect my wealth against that? And obviously, Robert, that brings us to things like gold.

[Robert Kiyosaki]

Right. Thank you. So what advice would you have for. I asked Trump this question one time. What advice would you say to the average investor? And Trump says, don't be average.

[Adam Taggart]

Yes, I Think that's great advice. All right, well, it's going to be hard for me to top that one, but I do have. I do have several bits of advice on that. And. Well, okay, so first off, kind of to my point there, like, don't just trade by the headlines. Oh, world's dumping the dollar. I gotta get out of it tomorrow.

[Unknown Speaker]

Right. Type of deal.

[Adam Taggart]

A lot of regular investors do that. And you gotta understand that the headlines are partial at best in terms of what reality is. And oftentimes they're wrong. And sometimes they're the opposite of what's really going on. And a lot of times those headlines are written to kind of trigger you emotionally. And so an emotional decision around money is very often forcing you to make the wrong decision at the wrong time. So I would definitely not just see what's on CNBC or look at what's in the headline of the Journal or whatever, and then rush to trade based on that. I would get smart. Another thing that investors tend to do, too, is they tend to take on a lot more risk than they need to, either swinging for the home runs or. Robert. They just haven't done the work to really identify what are my goals, what are my financial goals, what am I shooting for in life, why am I doing all this? And if you're specific about that, if you can really craft and say, look, I want to hit this goal by this time, and you sit down, you actually create a plan on how to get there, you will oftentimes find that you can hit your goal on time by taking less risk than you think. So why try to swing for the home run where you're going to strike out a lot more? And why not focus on hitting doubles and singles that'll safely get to your goal in time with a lot less risk. And so, yeah, I find I've been. A lot of people just, just, just are too reckless.

[Robert Kiyosaki]

Yeah. Let's call it in my world. Kiss. Keep it super simple.

[Adam Taggart]

Keep it super simple. Exactly. Exactly. I mean, I could tell you. I could tell you how to be a millionaire if you're, if you're graduating high school, which I just did this with my niece. I was like, look, I can, I can tell you how to become a millionaire with a high degree of probability by the time you're my age. And it's, it's pretty easy. It actually doesn't. It's not that heavy of a lift. You just have to be really committed and really disciplined. But it's a keep it simple strategy.

[Robert Kiyosaki]

That's the Problem discipline.

[Unknown Speaker]

Yeah, yeah.

[Adam Taggart]

We're. And oftentimes we're our own worst enemies.

[Robert Kiyosaki]

We need to go to break. But I want you to think about this, okay? Because you and I are technically teachers. And if you listen to a crackpot that's on YouTube, a lot of whack jobs out there. You know what I mean?

[Adam Taggart]

Absolutely.

[Robert Kiyosaki]

So I'm going to ask you, who do you respect and listen to? In other words, I look, I look to you as one of my teachers.

[Adam Taggart]

You know, it's a super honor.

[Robert Kiyosaki]

Yeah, well, it's a, it's an honor to be a teacher. So I'm going to ask you when we come back from the break, who do you respect? And if you're getting an education, let's say you're not at Harvard or Stanford, but you're a junkyard dog, you know, sniffing around the garbage.

[Unknown Speaker]

Yeah.

[Robert Kiyosaki]

Who can you tune in on YouTube that you would respect? That's the question I'm going to ask you. Okay.

[Unknown Speaker]

All right.

[Adam Taggart]

Look forward to answering it when we come back.

[Robert Kiyosaki]

Okay. And we'll be right back with Adam Taggart. We'll be longtime friend and fellow teacher. We'll be right back.

[Rich Dad Radio Show Announcer]

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[Robert Kiyosaki]

Welcome back. Robert Kiyosaki Radio show we're so old we still call it a radio show instead of the clickbait show or whatever we should call it. But anyway, we've been on for a long time. Adam's been a great friend of ours and we're talking today about education. And Adam is classically trained and I consider myself a junkyard dog who sniffs around the garbage cans or YouTube, should I say. And there's a lot of clickbait, a lot of false prophets up there, a lot of people promising, you know, you'll be a millionaire if you do this. And I listen to that stuff, I, I just cringe. And yet Adam, you know, when you see their following, they're followed. So my question to Adam Tagard is, who do you listen to that's the most? Who are your teachers? Because a teacher is a very, very important position in anyone's life.

[Adam Taggart]

Well, I couldn't agree more about that. And to your point about, you know, some of these people out there, Robert, who have very large followings but you're concerned about the quality of advice they're giving, a lot of times they have a very Large following because they are playing to what I was talking about earlier with the headlines right there. I think you used the term clickbait, right. They are, you know, trying to sort of foment emotional responses in people to get views, to get clicks. And they're not really focused on the substance of what they're or the value of what they're delivering. They're just trying to do what's going to get them the most revenues per viewers.

[Unknown Speaker]

Right.

[Adam Taggart]

And I'm not going to mention any names in this world, but there are definitely people that are out there doing that. Now what I like to do with my channel, which you know is a more modest channel, but I like to develop, you know, what I call more financially nutritious content. And I think that's why channels like mine and like yours, Robert, attract the viewers that they do. These are people who feel like, you know, I'm not getting well served by the regular mainstream financial media. It's just not actionable for me. It's not practical enough for me. So they're coming online to self educate and they're trying to find trusted sources like you. So again, kudos to you for what you've been doing here. One of the things that most of the more successful self made people that I know, Robert, do is they cultivate a board of mentors, a board of advisors. In fact, you do this right, with the rich dad advisors.

[Unknown Speaker]

Right.

[Adam Taggart]

And so, you know, that's essentially what I've done with my channel which is, as you know, Robert, it's, I get on the best minds and money in the markets and then I do a really deep dive, hour long interview with you where I just tried with them, where I just try to pull out, you know, what's in their head and make it as visible and understandable to the viewer. So the viewer can say, okay, this really smart person thinks these key things and I might want to take action on that, you know, based on this.

[Unknown Speaker]

Right.

[Adam Taggart]

So to your question about who do I listen to or who do I respect? Who are my teachers? I'm very fortunate to be able to talk to a ton of smart people every week like this. So I do four to five interviews a week. I would say some of the ones are at the top of the list are, I'll give you a few names and they sort of span the age and experience spectrum. At the high end are guys like Lacy Hunt and Thomas Honig. And those are probably not like everyday names. I'm not sure if it's going to.

[Robert Kiyosaki]

Resonate with second name was Thomas. What?

[Adam Taggart]

Thomas Honig. H O E N I G okay.

[Robert Kiyosaki]

I'll follow him now. Okay, good.

[Adam Taggart]

Yeah, yeah. So both of them have worked for the Federal Reserve, which you might be like, oh my God, why are you listening to folks in the Federal Reserve? These are guys that worked in the Federal Reserve and then after their time there, what came out of it saying that is one of the most dysfunctional institutions around and it is, it is, you know, doing policy that is, you know, anti what we should be doing. And Tom Heineg was quite famous because he ran the, the, he was the CEO of this St. Louis Fed I think for a number of years, but then he actually sat on the Federal Open Markets Committee. This is that small table of people that vote on what the interest rate's going to be. And he is on record as having the longest stretch of dissents of anybody on the fomc because this was during the era where Bernanke was starting to usher in quantitative easing and he wanted a unanimous vote. And at every vote Haunting was like, no, this is going to end up overinflating asset prices, creating wealth inequality and eventually leading to inflation. And he eventually left and history has proven him right. So it's incredibly value to hear these guys who have been there in the sense center of the seats of power, they know how the institution works, they know how the people work at them and they come out of it basically being willing to be honest and saying, look, these are all the elements that are going on in these areas that do not serve the interests of the American public. And they've been very big advocates for what they consider to be much better monetary policy. Sadly, the system isn't listening to them. It treats them more as outsiders and heretics at this point in time. But I think over time eventually they're, you know, they're kind of the early guard of the folks that are delivering the hard truth. And eventually that standard will get picked up as the current system really starts to fail. On the younger end of the socio economic spectrum. I'm going to mention this guy named Darius Dale. Don't know if you're familiar with him. D A L E. Last name is D A L E?

[Unknown Speaker]

Yeah.

[Adam Taggart]

Dale.

[Unknown Speaker]

Yeah.

[Adam Taggart]

Darius was a former football player and highly well educated young man. I think he's in his early 30s but he puts out basically institutional grade analysis. So he's got a lot of big Wall street firms that buy his analysis. But his passion is creating a version of that for the regular retail investor. And if you Watch a video with Darius. Let's say it's an hour long video. You get about three or four hours worth of content packed into that hour one, because he's a very animated, you know, very fast speaker, but he, he just brings a, a torrent of charts. So everything he says is backed up by just reams and reams of data. But I think one of Darius real skills is he's able to take all that and break it down in a way that the average investor can take in. And at the end of the day, he runs a portfolio for the regular investor, which he calls the KISS portfolio, the Keep it simple Stupid model. And actually his stands for Keep it simple and Systematic. But he ends up basically just using three to four different funds. And depending on what's going on in the world, you know, it's either, okay, we brought this fund down a little bit, we increased our exposure to this fund, but it's a way to basically surf what's happening in the markets using about the simplest number of inputs that I've ever seen. But I will say of all the people that I've interviewed over the years, Darius's track record over the past two to three years has been spookily good. And oftentimes, you know, sometimes the simplest approach can be the best approach. So he's a, he's a great mind.

[Robert Kiyosaki]

And Lacy Hunt, I love Lacy because he just keeps it simple.

[Adam Taggart]

He does. And Lacy, you know, he, he personally knew the greats, Milton Friedman, Paul Volker. Lacy actually worked with these people, met with these people, talked with these people. They were friends of his. So, you know, of the act greats of the real tried and true economic thinkers, not the bastardized version that we have now before it all got corrupted. He's of that generation. He really is kind of like the last of the greatest generation in economics. And man, the fact that he's still willing to share what he knows at our age and be as transparent about what he thinks is wrong with the current system, it's, it's a gift to be able to talk to him.

[Robert Kiyosaki]

Yeah. Anybody else you can break? That was a good time because, you know, like, like, sorry, I'm rich dad, poor dad. Both were teachers, you know, great teachers, but they didn't teach me the same subject.

[Adam Taggart]

Same subjects, yeah. So, I mean, literally, Robert, I could give you a long, long list. I'll throw out a couple of names. Stephanie Pomboy is another great macro thinker.

[Robert Kiyosaki]

Oh, she's amazing.

[Adam Taggart]

Yeah, she's, she's wonderful and a delight too. And again, you know, a lot of these people have the ability to think big but, but talk in just real terms. And Stephanie's wonderful at that. There's a housing analyst named Melody Wright. I don't know if you follow her, Robert, but she is fantastic.

[Robert Kiyosaki]

What's her name?

[Adam Taggart]

Melody Wright. And she, she had a front row seat to the R I G H D. Exactly. W, R I G H T. Yeah. And she publishes a free substack for anybody that's interested in following her. She had a front row seat to the global financial crisis. She worked for, was it GE Capital when they got involved in lending and everything hyper exploded there. She was there basically trying to do the workouts on all these horrible mortgage loans that they had. So she really had a front row seat to that crisis. And she has been following the housing market ever since. She's been increasingly worried over the recent years as the housing market has started to get weaker and weaker. And she does a great job of combining both like a very rigorous data driven approach with a boots on the ground approach. So she gets in her car every couple of weeks and goes to a Houston, a Dallas, a Phoenix, whatever, and drives around and tries to marry what the, the data that she's finding in her data sets, how that maps to the, what people say on the ground. You know, she drives to housing developments. Is this development getting abandoned by the developer? Like she, she really marries the real world and the academic.

[Unknown Speaker]

Yeah.

[Adam Taggart]

And she's just again a wonderful person to boot.

[Robert Kiyosaki]

That's, that's called integrity. Do you know what I mean?

[Adam Taggart]

You know what, that's a great word to describe Melody. I, I do, I know this is kind of sound like I'm, I'm, you know, trying to cozy favor with you, Robert, but you know, a great teacher of mine has been you. And I just, my, my niece just graduated high school last week and she came up to me because she knows vaguely what I do and she says, uncle Adam, I want you to teach me how to do money. So I put together kind of an hour long curriculum for her and she came over the other night and we went through it and I started and ended with examples from you, Robert. So yeah, just know that your work continues to inspire, not even just generation, but, but you know, even the young up and comers.

[Robert Kiyosaki]

Well, I appreciate that because that's, you know, I think as teachers, nothing makes us happier than, you know, seeing your students blossom.

[Adam Taggart]

Oh, absolutely. As I like to tell people, look, information in and of itself has no value. It only has value. When you apply it.

[Unknown Speaker]

Right.

[Adam Taggart]

So the fact that we're, we're passing the torch along to people who are going to be taking it to improve their lives and hopefully improve their communities as well and the overall economy, I mean, that's where the real, where my real passion and gratitude comes from.

[Robert Kiyosaki]

Okay, so I'm asking one big financial question.

[Adam Taggart]

Sure.

[Robert Kiyosaki]

I'm, I look at the debt, you know, the national debt of America, about 37 trillion and something. And increasing student loan debt, 1.8 trillion. Income from our taxes are now below the interest on our debt. What is that telling you?

[Adam Taggart]

It was. So, Luke Roman, another great name to follow for folks that don't know Luke. Luke Gromen.

[Robert Kiyosaki]

Yes.

[Adam Taggart]

G R O M E N so he's been beating this drum for a long time about the sovereign debt crisis, about the inevitability of the sovereign debt crisis, which he thinks is already underway. And he basically says once your.

[Unknown Speaker]

Your.

[Adam Taggart]

You know, spending, including your interest on the debt, your non productive spending eclipses your tax receipts is like you're basically entering the death spiral at that point in time. So, Robert, I think we are entering that death spiral. When does it actually all come apart? I don't know. Is it tomorrow? Is it ten years from now? I don't know. But what I do know is the one thing that I think could buy us some Runway. I don't really have confidence it's going to get us out of the spiral in the long term. I think we're going to end up with a currency crisis where the currency will eventually die and have to be replaced by something more sound, but something that could buy us time would be if the current Trump administration's economic policies get enacted and have the outcomes that the administration hopes they will. There's a lot that's going on there that is making me more optimistic in the midterm. I'm kind of pessimistic in the near term. I do think that the odds for a substantial market correction and a recession are uncomfortably high in the next 12 months or so. A couple years out of that, I'm actually becoming more optimistic than I've been in a good long while because I think that if these policies end up getting implemented and have the results that we hope, that's actually going to boost economic growth pretty substantially and that can be used to hopefully reduce our government deficit spending at least as a percentage of gdp. Trump has at least given lip service to throwing some of this money at the debt. Will he? I don't know. But all that can Slow things down for a bit. I'm then very pessimistic in the long run for the issues that we've talked about, Robert, you know, the, the debt spiral and, and the currency devaluation.

[Unknown Speaker]

Yeah.

[Robert Kiyosaki]

And did you have any great teachers in school?

[Adam Taggart]

That's a good question. Yes, I did have some great teachers in school. I mean, I don't want to say, look, I think we should have a great education system. I'm not for dismantling the education system, I'm just for reforming it. I did have some great teachers. But what I do want to say real quick, Robert, before we wrap up is something that's very important to the message I try to get out there about money is you want to understand it. It is very important, but it is not all important. And at the end of the day, money is the means to an end. It's not the end in and of itself. The goal is not to die atop a huge pile of cash.

[Unknown Speaker]

Right.

[Adam Taggart]

It's to use that money to invest in the things that are going to give you the greatest happiness in life.

[Unknown Speaker]

Right.

[Adam Taggart]

And research is really clear on what those are. It's three things. It's quality relationships. So at our base level, we are social primates. That's what we evolve from. And we still see the world and derive our happiness from it through our relationships. You don't need a ton of them, but you need at least a few good ones. I consider you one of my good solid folks. I could call at 2am in the morning, Robert. So it's that it's purpose, it's having meaning when you wake up in the morning and feeling that the world is at least marginally better that you existed in it. You don't have to cure cancer, but you just have to be doing something that's important to you, that you think net net makes the world at least a little bit better. And then the third is health. Because if you don't have health, life's pretty, pretty miserable, right? So at the end of the day, money is great. But really focus on those key three things and you know, with the money comes, if the money goes, if you've got, if you're rich in those three things, you're already winning life. And the irony is if you're rich in those three things, the money is much more likely to come because you're living a full, authentic, your full authentic self and you're likely to outperform.

[Robert Kiyosaki]

I like what Bessant Robert Kennedy Sr. Said. He says to those whom so much has Been given. Much is required. And the word was required. You know, I thought that was a very interesting thing. So the reason I want to acknowledge you is because you and I have enough money, but it is required. We teach.

[Adam Taggart]

Yes.

[Robert Kiyosaki]

Does that make sense to you?

[Adam Taggart]

Absolutely. I see it as an obligation, if you are fortunate enough to, I think, educate yourself to the point where you feel like you see the world relatively accurately and you've been able to use that information to advance your station, then your responsibility is to bring your community, your culture, and the next generations along with you. In fact, I'm just watching a documentary right now about one of my favorite presidents, Theodore Roosevelt. And that was what he said was the key thing his father taught him. Because Roosevelt grew up in a very privileged family. And his father said, son, look, wealth is great and you should make the best use of it for yourself. But with it comes a responsibility that you need to, you know, basically use it as a tool to bring up society. And fortunately, Roosevelt took that very seriously.

[Robert Kiyosaki]

Adam, Amen on that one. That's our job as teachers. You know what I mean? We both blessed from different directions, different paths, but we're giving back now. So it's required we do this.

[Adam Taggart]

It is. And I just want to note that it's all about passing the torch. And, Robert, you did pass the torch to me. I'm a little younger than you. I read your book when it first came out when I was 29. I bought it for all my siblings. Then my daughters have received it. And now, hopefully with my channel, I'm inspiring folks younger than me and trying to pass that towards, too. So, anyways, thank you for being the key link in the chain in my life, but in the lives of all your viewers, too.

[Robert Kiyosaki]

Well, Adam, thank you very much for being a fellow teacher. And then let's stay in touch and keep teaching. So thank you for being a friend and a fellow teacher. Thank you.

[Adam Taggart]

Thank you for having me on, my friend. It's been wonderful.

[Robert Kiyosaki]

Thank you. And we'll be right back for our final word. Again, thank you to Adam Taggart.

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[Robert Kiyosaki]

Welcome back. And again thank to longtime friend Adam Tagard and a fellow teacher. Final words is this is that your teachers are the best and the worst in your life. You have a bad teacher or it'll screw you up. But you have a great teacher that'll inspire you to greatness. And I've been blessed to have several great teachers, teachers and in fact, several men I consider like my Rich dads. They're called mentors. So I seek them out and that's how I learned. But one of my best teachers had us in. I went to military school and we had to read this book here. And I asked my, I'm at military school. I didn't, I didn't go to some woke liberal arts college. And so I asked my teacher, he was a West Point graduate, B17 pilot. I said, why are we studying communism? He says, you have to know your enemy. I went, wow. And when I read this book here, as you know, America's coming apart right now. We don't need to go to China or Russia to find communists. They're all inside us. As Marines would say, they're inside the wall right now. So, ladies and gentlemen, it's best to know your enemy. And that was my teacher at the academy, and he says you got to know them well. So I thank you all for listening to the Rich dad radio show. You know, thank your teachers and keep learning. Thank you again.

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This podcast is a presentation of Rich Dad Media Network.

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[Adam Taggart]

Let's go.

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[Robert Kiyosaki]

Brad, you're on mute.

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