Robert Krok (2:42)

The holiday debt hangover isn't just about money. It's about the habits and beliefs that got you here. If you don't fix those, you'll be up to your eyeballs again in debt next January. And we don't want to see that happen.

Austin Hankwitz (2:54)

We definitely don't. But before we jump into the episode, let's talk about the real cost of this holiday debt, because I'm sure some people are listening right now. They're like, oh, yeah, I've got my credit card and I travel. I'm written ready like it's, it's, and it's getting up there. And so, you know, for example, let's say someone's got $2,000 on their credit card and they're looking at it. It's January here, right around the corner and they're saying, I can pay it off throughout the year. It'll be fine. That's the wrong mindset. That $2,000 is probably at a 20, 25 or 30% interest rate, which means if you only make minimum payments of 50 bucks a month, you're going to be in credit card debt. Robert, here we go. For six years. And no one wants that to happen. During that six year period of time, you're going to pay over $1,500 of interest. So that $2,000 of holiday credit card debt has now cost you $1,500 of interest, which if you just invested that interest, you could have had thousands, if not tens of thousands of dollars more in your lifetime. But all because you need to buy that cousin Billy the sweater that he's probably just going to toss in the back of his closet anyway, right? Don't do that. Here's what you need to remember. Broke people pay interest. Wealthy people earn it. So let's talk about getting rid of this interest and actually starting to earn it.

Robert Krok (4:05)

And Austin, that's just the financial cost. There's also the psychological cost. High interest debt creates stress. It sits in the back of your mind. You wake up thinking about it. You avoid checking your bank balance because of it. You feel guilty every time you spend money on anything. And that's definitely not a way we want to see anyone live. And here's what really gets me. Holiday debt is 100% optional. I'm going to say that again. Holiday debt is 100% optional. You choose to spend that money, nobody forced you. Which means you can choose not to do that next year. But first you need to clean up the mess you've created. And we're going to break that down right now.

Austin Hankwitz (4:44)

That's right, Robert. So now that we understand the real cost of it, let's start walking through how to think about getting out of this holiday debt. The prioritization of paying it off, the mindset shifts, everything you need to do. So if you find yourself in January, up to your eyeballs in credit card debt from travel or gifts or whatever else went on over the last two or three weeks, here, a holiday debt hangover, as the title calls it, Step one is you need to stop the bleeding. No more spending on credit cards. Not a single dollar. If it's not in your checking account, you can't afford it. I don't care if it's a great deal. I don't care if something's on sale or your friends having a birthday. You are in debt recovery mode. Which means the only way you're going to be able to dig yourself out of this hole is, is for the whole to stop getting deeper and deeper. You need to look at your checking account and ask yourself, how much money do I actually have? Because that is your new reality. That's the number that we have to work with. Every spending decision from here on out for the next 30, 60, 90 days is based on that number.

Robert Krok (5:43)

And step number two, you need to prioritize your debt repayment. So now let's talk about the repayment strategy. If you have multiple debts, you need a system for which to pay off first. And there are two main approaches we like the debt avalanche and the debt snowball strategy. These are both great and we're going to break them down for you. Debt avalanche means you pay off the high interest debt first. This saves you the most money in interest. If you have a credit card at 25% APR and another at 18%, you focus all of your payments on the 25% card while making minimum payments on everything else. Because we want to knock out the high interest card first. Mathematically, this is the most efficient method and you'll save more money and get out of debt faster.

Austin Hankwitz (6:25)

I prefer the debt avalanche. You're going to save the most money doing that. But there's also the debt snowball method. The debt snowball means that you pay off the smallest balance first, no matter what the interest rate is. So if you have $500 of debt over on this card, 2,000 of debt over here, maybe 4,000 on another. You focus on the card that's got the $500 of debt, and then you go to the 2000 and then you go to the 4000. This strategy helps you build momentum from one card to the next. One debt after another. So which one should you use? It's honestly up to you. Again, I prefer the Avalanche because I think it's going to save you the most money in interest. But if you are someone that's like, listen, I got to pay this off here, I'm going to roll it over here. We got feeling that momentum, the snowball rolling down a hill. Whatever you got to do to get out of the debt, that is what's most important.

Robert Krok (7:12)

The key is to pick one you will commit to. So many people get started and then they end up just making minimum pay payments on everything. And that's how you stay in debt forever. So pick one, read up, see what works for you and keep going because you want to target this debt, throw every dollar at it and knock it out as soon as possible.

Austin Hankwitz (7:31)

So, Robert, to recap, step one, stop the bleeding, right? We're not digging ourselves into a deeper hole. We're not spending more on these credit cards. The second step was for us to figure out what debt to pay off. I gotta prioritize my debt repayment. Now our third step is to do the 30 day no spend challenge. Here's how it works. In the month of January, for the next 30 days, right? You spend money on only the absolute essentials. Think rent, utilities, groceries, gas, minimum debt payments. That is it. Everything else is off the table. No restaurants, no coffee shops, no online shopping, no runs to Target, as my fiance calls it. No just browsing into buying something. No TikTok shop, right? Absolutely nothing. And it's funny because I have friends that do this. I think it's called no spend January. They just, at the first of the year, they don't spend any money on anything. And I'm going to do it this January right around the corner here. I'm really excited because it really helps you put in perspective how much money you frivolously spend on things that you do not need. You eat what's in your pantry, you make coffee at home like I do. You become a spending minimalist for 30 days. Because then once you have those 30 days go by, you look around, you say, oh wait, I don't have to go to the bars every weekend. I don't have to go to these restaurants. I don't have to go buy those little lunch Lee packets at Kroger. I just needed to make my one sheet pan meals and I really have a sort of better understanding of what's real and authentic spending for my day to day life and what is more of a want type of category.

Robert Krok (9:03)

I love this because so many people feel they have to do taco Tuesday and something on Thursday and go to the game on Saturday and go to the bar on Sunday. All of this stuff, even if you stop it for that 30 days during January might sound extreme because it is. That's the point. You're in a hole. You need extreme measures to get out fast. And that's what this episode is about. So here's what happens during a no spend challenge. First, you immediately free up hundreds of dollars. The average American spends three to $400 a month on restaurants alone. It's a lot higher for me. So this is a wake up call for me as well. Cut that out and you have $300 to throw at that debt immediately to wipe out these credit cards. Second, you break bad spending habits, considering most spending is habitual. And third, you recalibrate your sense of what's necessary that 30 days within it, you realize you don't actually need all of this stuff you are buying. You survived without it. You didn't go have the $17 avocado toast at your favorite cafe twice that month, but you were fine eating scrambled eggs at home. And that mindset shift is what we're all about here today, helping you guys overcome it. So you start the year off on a bang and on a good note and wipe out that holiday debt, that.

Austin Hankwitz (10:21)

30 day no spend January. I got to try it. It is. It's really going to help put in perspective what is a need, what is a want, and the money you're frivolously throwing away every month. Oh, Austin. Robert, it's not even the holiday debt. Oh, I can't max out my Roth IRA or I can't invest a dime. I don't have any of the money. You go do a no spend January or a 30 day cleanse of your wants type spending category and you're going to realize that you have a lot more money than you think. Now, Robert, you mentioned the mindset shifts. Let's talk about how to use this mindset shift to prevent this happening next year. Now, it's been a couple months. You pay off the debt, which is incredible. But if you don't fix the underlying mindset and the habits, you're going to be Back to where you were this time next year. So let's talk about how this happened in the first place. Robert, give me some reasons as to why people find themselves into so much holiday debt.

Robert Krok (11:09)

Yeah. Reason number one, you didn't have a holiday budget. You winged it and hoped it worked out and it didn't. And next year you're going to do the same thing. And here's my solution of what I would like to see everyone listening do. Create a budget based on every person you want to buy for and assign a dollar amount to each person. That way you're just not out there winging it and buying all this stuff because it was cute or on sale or whatever, and you stick to the budget. That's reason number one for me. Because if you have a total budget and break it down by person, not just by overall, because if it's overall, you're going to go way past it because there's so many cute things you see on TikTok or at Target or wherever you're going. So that's the key for me. And reason number one.

Austin Hankwitz (11:50)

Reason number two, why people find themselves in all of this holiday debt is you feel obligated to spend money. Right? Family expectations, friend expectations, social pressure. You spent money you didn't have to avoid disappointing people. So next year, have some of these conversations earlier. Hey, guys, we're doing smaller gifts this year. Or let's do a Secret Santa instead of buying gifts for every single person. Or, hey, we're not traveling this year. We're going to stay at home. We got to. We're going to put some money away. Right. Just set these expectations early, before the holidays hit. To give you an example here, we're actually doing this with my fiance's family, going up to Asbury Park, New Jersey, which is where she's from. And we're going to do. What is it? We've all got like the. The Secret Santa thing, right? So I'm getting a gift for. For one family member, not gifts for the 18 of them. Right. So it's just like we all get one person, we all get a gift. It's great. Have those same conversations. Do that same thing yourself.

Robert Krok (12:43)

Yeah. And reason number three for me is you view spending as a way to show love or to celebrate. You're making more money. Life is going better. You want to be the cool uncle or the cool dad, and you spend way more than you should because it felt good in the moment. It made you feel generous, it made you feel festive. But feelings fade and debt doesn't you need to separate celebration from spending? This is the key here. And you can have an amazing holiday without going into debt. Homemade gifts, quality time, experiences that are free or cheap. Love isn't measured in dollars. So maybe instead of doing that lavish trip, do a staycation with family, invite everyone in and get a big Airbnb in the mountains or something. That's a lot cheaper than everyone flying to Florida to the beach or whatever. So these are my ideas and that's number three for me.

Austin Hankwitz (13:31)

Yeah. And I think the final reason, the final mindset shift that you have to make to not find yourself up to your eyeballs in credit card debt again next year is falling for the phrase, oh, but I worked so hard this year, I deserve to splurge. Maybe, maybe you did work hard. But did you deserve to start January in a financial hole? Did you deserve the stress and the guilt that came with this? Probably not. Right? So treating yourself is fine, but going into debt to treat yourself is not really treating yourself. It's stealing from your future self. We talked about that. With all that interest you're going to end up paying, Please do not do that.

Robert Krok (14:05)

And we're giving people a lot of leeway in this episode because I know a lot of people watching right now are thinking about this. They don't wipe out that credit card debt in the first two, three months. They have it carry over into the fourth, fifth, sixth, seventh month of the year because they went wild during the holiday season. They play catch up for months and then all of a sudden you're in summer and it's wedding season. So you're traveling all the time for that. And. And it's just a vicious cycle of never getting ahead because you're not budgeting your spending for entertainment, holidays and birthdays. And that all stops with this episode. So what is the prevention plan for next year? What's the playbook? Here's how you make sure it never happens again. Open a dedicated holiday savings account in February. Set up automatic transfers based on your budget. So if you want to spend $1500 on the holidays, save that $125 a month starting in February. And by December, you'll have the cash ready, no credit cards needed. Make a list and budget before November. Who are you buying for? What's the budget per person? What's your total budget, including travel, food, decorations, everything? Write it down and commit to it. And you will be a winner for the holidays and you'll still feel like you're being festive. And you did all the Right, Things you wanted to do.

Austin Hankwitz (15:22)

And not just that, Robert, but shop with cash or debit only. Leave the credit cards home. If the money is not in your bank account, you don't have to spend it. And what you are spending, you should be tracking. Track your spending in real time. Every purchase. Put it down in your own honest budget. Know where you stand relative to that budget. And don't wait until January to find out that you actually overspent.

Robert Krok (15:45)

Holiday debt sucks. There's no sugar coating it. You're starting the year behind instead of ahead. But this is fixable. Stop the bleeding, prioritize your debt repayment. Do a 30 day no spend challenge in January, increase your income temporarily and get aggressive for 60 to 90 days and knock this out.

Austin Hankwitz (16:03)

But more importantly, Robert, you got to learn from the mistakes. Everyone makes mistakes. That's what we're here for. We're full of mistakes. We're here to teach people what we've learned from our own mistakes. And so you got to start learning from yours as well. Next year. You need to have a plan, need to have a budget. You need to have savings set aside. You need to set some boundaries with some friends and family members. Separate celebration from spending psychological logically. And you don't need to go into debt to have a great holiday season. You need to be intentional, you need to be planning and you need to have discipline along the way. Y', all, we are so excited that the holidays are upon us here. Christmas is in a couple days. New Year's is in just over a week from now. And so we hope all of you are getting excited to drink some eggnog, watch the Home Alone movies and do all fun things that happen during the Christmas holiday season.

Robert Krok (16:49)

So I think, Austin, to wrap this up, one of my favorite things you say is that broke people react and wealthy people forecast. So everyone please remember that as you exit the holiday season and you're figuring it all out. And you might want to re watch this episode a couple times because it'll help you get through and never make these mistakes again.

Austin Hankwitz (17:09)

Yeah, Robert, don't be reacting to this mountain of credit card debt. Forecast ahead of time so that this does not happen in the future. I think that is a wonderful phrase. Broke people react. Wealthy people forecast. Forecast your holiday spending for next year and do this 30 day no spend challenge with me. It's. It's going to be fun. All right, Robert, now before we jump to the Q and A section of this episode, got to give a shout out to public the investing platform for those who take it seriously because on public you can build a multi asset portfolio of stocks, bonds, crypto options and now generated assets which allow you to turn any idea into an investable index using AI.

Robert Krok (17:47)

That's right, it all starts with your prompt. From renewable energy companies with high free cash flow to semiconductor suppliers growing revenue over 20% year over year, you can literally type any prompt and put the AI to work. It screens thousands of stocks, builds a one of a kind index and lets you back test it against the S P500. Then you can invest in just a few clicks.

Austin Hankwitz (18:11)

Generated assets are like ETFs but with infinite possibilities, completely customizable and based on your theses, not someone else's. So go to public.comforward/rich habits and earn an uncapped 1% bonus when you transfer your portfolio. That's public.comforward/rich habits paid for by Public Investing.

Robert Krok (18:31)

Full disclosure in the Podcast Description As.

Austin Hankwitz (18:33)

A reminder, if you have a question to ask us, send us a DM on Instagram @ Rich Habits Podcast. Email us at rich habits podcastmail.com or join the Rich Habits Network. We're still running that seven day free trial. You'll get access to Robert and myself for two hours every Tuesday night via a Zoom Call live stream. We do. We had a blast actually. It's. It's so much fun to do those every single Tuesday night. We actually are filming this Wednesday afternoon. So last night was our live stream. It was about two hours, maybe hour 45, something like that. And over 200 people hang out and talk and chat and it's fun. So check out the Rich Habits Network. Now this first question comes from an anonymous listener. Our anonymous listener says, fellas, please keep me anonymous. I love your podcast. Thank you for taking the time to read my email. My wife is 36, I'm 44 and we currently make a combined $340,000 a year plus BO, which is about $130,000 for this year. We've just started making this level of money very, very recently. Our current situation is as follows. We have 450,000 in our retirement accounts, 400,000 in our company stock. We have a brokerage account with about 100 grand in it, 75,000 in savings which is going to be used to finish some renovations on our house, 30,000 in a vehicle replacement sinking fund, 20,000 in our emergency fund, and our only debt is our mortgage at 2.89%, which is about 280,000 of debt. Now we started debating recently purchasing a beach property in the Panhandle of Florida. My wife's family's from there. She currently lives there. We would like to use it a few weeks out of the year and then rent it out for the remainder of the year. Our goal is to move to that area in about 10 years, but obviously that could change. I am very risk averse and don't want to overcomplicate our financial situation. I think we're in a really good spot. We live comfortably below our means, we're not extravagant. However, it would be nice to have a place at the beach and potentially offset some of the costs by renting it out. What is your best advice? In my situation, my main concern is missing out on what looks like a slowing market in that area. Any ideas? Thanks guys so much for your assistance. Robert, you are Florida real estate guy, so I'll let you kick this one.

Robert Krok (20:41)

Off. Yeah, I think you guys are in a great situation. 44 years old, you have a million dollars in net worth, you're making a lot of money. But I do feel you're a little ahead of the horse here. Everyone dreams of a beach house. The Florida Panhandle is an amazing place, but the market has slowed. So there's two sides of this coin. Destin for instance, let's use Destin watercolor area generally has a capital appreciation of about 12 to 14% year over year. But that has slowed tremendously in the last 18 months because the market is down. We had a bad hurricane season in Florida so a lot of people are moving away from these beach house waterfront properties. My suggestion to you, if you really want to have this, this property because you want to have capital appreciation over the years, have a cool house you can rent out and stay in and see the family and friends. I would go off the water a little bit because at the end of the day in those markets like Destin, you can be two blocks off the beach where you're a little safer, little bit more preventative maintenance away from flooding and get into a house that's more affordable because at a million dollars net worth, I don't want to go see you spend a million five on a beach house right now. That could set you back especially if there were more bad hurricane seasons coming. That would be my take because I get where you're at. Everyone wants a beach house, but I don't want you to be house broke either. Or worse. Have so much upkeep on this house because you overbought in the beginning. So I would dial it back a little, find something off the beach that's still affordable but also desirable for rental because then that way you can still make money and offset the cost of the home without having so much risk being right on the.

Austin Hankwitz (22:20)

Water. There you go. The fun part about this podcast is Robert and I are allowed to disagree and I am on the other side of the fence on that one. Robert, a couple things stood out to me that is making me conclude that you should not be doing this, AKA buying a house in Florida. The first one was I am very risk averse and don't want to overcomplicate my financial situation. The other one was we would like to use it a few weeks a year and then rent it out the remainder of the year. So if you're very risk averse and you don't want to overcomplicate your financial situation and you're going to go to Florida for, let's call it, three weeks out of the year, dude, just do the Airbnb. Just like, just. That's what I do. I go to Florida all the time. I like Florida. I went to 30A earlier in May. It was a weekend trip. But do a month long Airbnb, pay 1500, 20, 500, $4,000. Who knows? Pay a lot of money, go enjoy that and then say, cool, not my house, not my insurance, not my hurricane season, not my anything that comes with it. And then you're talking about, it's like, oh, okay, let me rent it out for the remainder of the year. Sure, let's go hire a property manager. Let's go figure out tenants. Let's go fit. Is it Airbnb? Is it vrbo? Is it a long term tenant? Is it a short term tenant? Like, there's a lot that comes with this that you know, if you were someone that says, hey, I'm ready to rock and roll, I would like, yeah, dude, go for it. You have enough money, you can afford it. You guys make a ton. But if you're saying I'm only going to be there two or three weeks out of the year and I'm very risk averse, it's like, okay, then just rent a hotel or do the Airbnb thing or like just rent a house for a month at a time and go pay 5,000 or $10,000 to do it, you can afford it. You make a ton of money. If I were in your shoes with that same mindset, that's what I would.

Robert Krok (23:56)

Do. Well, that's it. Two different takes. Hope it.

Austin Hankwitz (23:59)

Helps. So our next question comes from Morgan C. On Instagram. Morgan says, hey, Austin and Robert, I want to thank you so much for your hard work on this podcast. You guys help help so many people. Here's my situation. I'm 23 years old. I make a whopping 30,000 a year working for a non profit organization. I still live with my parents and I was recently in a boat accident and received $150,000 from a settlement to pay for existing bills from my injury. Because of my physical therapist. I started listening to your show and I opened a brokerage and a Roth IRA on public. I invest a little bit of money each week. The settlement money is split three ways into two different CD accounts, making around 4% per year. And I have a high yield savings making four and a half percent. I'd like to hear your opinion on buying a house with my settlement money and how I should continue to grow my investments. I only put money into public from my monthly earnings at work. Thank you so much for sharing your wisdom and expertise. Well, first off, Morgan, I'm sorry to hear about your boating accident and I hope that you've recovered. Obviously you're working with a physical therapist, which means you're still kind of going through the motions on that. Shout out to your physical therapist for recommending our show. That's really kind of them. Thank you so much. Wow. Okay, so you're 23 and you don't make that much and you probably have like 120 to 150 still left over here. I don't know. You know, you mentioned it's going to be used for your bills, so I don't know how much you're going to allocate there for your bills, but let's say you have over a hundred thousand left over. Congrats. You built your base in a very tragic way, but you built your base. I don't think this is time to go. I'm going to put 100 grand down on a $800,000 duplex and then do the the house hack that, like, no way you're making 30,000 a year. You're living with your parents. You don't need to go buy a house. Here's what you need to do. The first thing you need to do is double your income. This means over the next 18, 24, 36 months, I want you to either one, figure out how to make more than 15 an hour by learning a skill, learning some sort of, I don't know if it's an associate's degree or some sort of certification. Maybe you're working as a plumber, an electrician. Maybe you Learn more about carpentry. Like, like there's a lot of skills out there that pay more than 30,000 a year, that's for sure. And the second thing I want you to do is to surround yourself with people who care most about you, like this physical therapist that are going to help you invest this money properly. Your goal, of course, is to ensure this money is invested in The S&P 500, the NASDAQ, the Dow Jones Industrial Average, things of that nature. But I got a feeling at 23 years old, you're going to have some friends come out of the woodwork and say, hey man, I got this really cool investment idea for us and your 100 can turn into 300 in a couple years if we play our let's go open a restaurant, dude, you make 30k now. We can make 300k with a restaurant. Let's go do a swimming pool repair company, whatever, right? Keep it simple. Stupid, right? The KISS methodology there super, super important in this situation. You're 23, you're learning, you're just getting into your career here, making a little bit of money. So one, let's figure out how to increase that income, learn some skills, do some certificates, do some sort of degrees maybe. And then two, sure this money gets invested properly on public or, you know, if you want to even work with a financial Advisor. Because at 23, I wouldn't know what to do with 100 grand. No shame in that either. Just make sure it's put in the S&P.

Robert Krok (27:10)

500. I love that take. And we're going to keep it really simple here. Morgan. It's very hard at 23 years old to get your hands on $100,000. So here's the playbook. I promise you, everything Austin said is 100% spot on. If you take that $100,000, pretend it does not exist. You go invest that in Voo and the S P500 through your public account and just let it go. By the time in 35 years, let's call it 35, 36 years, you're at that 55 year old range, you'll have $1.5 million if it just makes 8% a year. And on average the S P 500 beats that. So you'll be in really good shape if you never touch it. That's what I would do. You could invest along the way with other money, but get that income up, up, pretend the $100,000 doesn't even exist and you will be very wealthy in retirement. As long as you don't Nibble away at it over the years. Because if you start investing too early and you buy a property, you invest with a friend in a restaurant or a pool repair company, that money is going to be gone in two, three, four years. So quick, because you think you're a genius having that $100,000 when you've got, you know, sadly, you have your base built because of an accident, but you still have it built. Built. Now let's build it for the future by doing what we laid out, and you'll be in great financial shape later on in.

Austin Hankwitz (28:27)

Life. Obviously, people listening right now are like, okay, well, how does this relate to me? I'm not, you know, in an accident. I never got a settlement. I don't have all this money. Kind of goes back to our previous question from our anonymous listener who's like, hey, we get 130,000 in bonuses. So, you know, one of my best friends, he's a lawyer, he's expecting a $60,000 bonus this year, which is really exciting. And I think a lot of people make the mistake of, whoa, I got this, this, you know, 10,000, 5,000, 20,000, 80,000, whatever, bonus I wasn't expecting, or maybe I was expecting it, but it feels like a little bit like free money, right? And so you kind of want to spend that and be a little frivolous with it. Oh, I'll put it into the business idea. Or, oh, I'll put it over here. Yeah, I could throw in and chuck it into that. You need to pretend like this money doesn't exist, Right? So if you're getting a bonus this year, I know it's, you know, December 22nd as this episode gets published, and it's bonus season, and you're over here getting excited about a 20, 30, $40,000 bonus around the corner for you. You need to treat that money as if it was part of your existing investing.

Robert Krok (29:21)

Strategy.

Austin Hankwitz (29:21)

Right? So that means either putting all, if not most of it away toward your goals. If that goal is a down payment on a home you want to buy, maybe your goal is to build your base. Maybe your goal is to, you know, get half a million invested, or maybe your goal is to retire early, or maybe your goal is to max out your Roth IRA or. Or, you know, fund your 529 for your children. Right? There's a lot of whatever, you know, personal finance is personal. We say every episode, figure out what that goal is for you, and make sure that these bonuses, and I'm sure a lot of you are receiving right now, now apply to Those.

Robert Krok (29:50)

Goals. Yeah, everyone just listen to what Austin's saying. Because when you get these bonuses, it doesn't have to be something, a windfall from something bad. You can't immediately level up your lifestyle and spend it frivolously because that is the money. Those lump sums are what set you up for the future and for.

Austin Hankwitz (30:08)

Life. So our final question comes from Jamila on Instagram. Jamila says. Hi, guys. I've been listening to your show for a while now and you've really helped me get my finances in order. I'm currently in college and I was wondering if taking out subsidized loans, which doesn't incur interest until six months after college graduation, and if I were to let it sit in an investment account or maybe a high yield savings account till I graduate, then keep the arbitrage of the interest there after paying my money back. Is that smart? Can I do that? Jamila, Love where your head's at. That's cool. I, I'm all for the arbitrage and finding where you can make some extra money here and there. I think like that you, you're, you're speaking like an investor, you're speaking like an entrepreneur. You're thinking about life correctly. However, what you're thinking about, to my understanding, is illegal. And you can't do that. If you are going to get student loans, you got to have the student loans. You got to use them for actual education expenses like paying tuition or books and housing and things of that nature that student loans are used for. Do not go do the. I'll go borrow 20k from my student loans at 7%. Chuck them in the S P. Trying to get 9 and arbitrage the difference of 2. Don't do any of that. That's not a good ide. But I love where your head's at. That's. That's really cool you're thinking about money that.

Robert Krok (31:25)

Way. Yeah, I definitely love the hustle and the, and the effort and the thought process. But just always remember this in life, when you're trying to get financially free and build wealth, shortcuts generally don't work out. If they did, everyone would do it and get rich quick. Schemes like this generally don't work out and can be illegal. So just keep that in mind. If you want to make more money during school, school or you're trying to figure it out, go get a side hustle, learn an AI skill, do something that can legally make you more money to get you ahead when you.

Austin Hankwitz (31:57)

Graduate. Everybody, thank you so much for tuning into this week's episode of the Rich Habits podcast. We are so grateful that a hundred thousand of you come back every single week to listen to our show. Cannot believe still, Robert, that we were the top podcast for 77,000 people in 2025. Incredibly, incredibly humbling. And we're just, we're wishing you guys the best holiday season, safe travels, lots of good food, lots of good drinks, and lots of fun memories with your.

Robert Krok (32:24)

Family. So have a great holiday and don't forget, we're running a seven day free trial right now for the Rich Habits network. So if you want to treat yourself for zero cost, join the network, check it out, join a live kick around and look at all the cool stuff and check out the community. It's all free right now for seven days and we'd love to see you in.

Austin Hankwitz (32:43)

There. And don't forget to come back on Thursday. We will be posting an episode on Christmas, but we will not be posting an episode the day after Christmas. Our Rich Habits radar is on pause during the holidays because we can batch record some of the stuff, we can't batch record current news and events. So thank you so much for your flexibility on that and we'll see you on Thursday. And Doug, here we have the.

Robert Krok (33:29)

Limu emu in its natural habitat, helping people customize their car insurance and save hundreds with Liberty Mutual. Fascinating. It's accompanied by his natural ally.

Commercial Narrator (33:41)

Doug. Uh, limu is that guy with the binoculars watching.

Robert Krok (33:45)

Us? Cut the camera. They see.

Austin Hankwitz (33:46)

Us. Only pay for what you need@liberty mutual.com Liberty Liberty Liberty Liberty Savings Ferry Underwritten by Liberty Mutual Insurance Company and affiliates Excludes.

Commercial Narrator (33:54)

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