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CFB Week 6 LIVE Reactions: UCLA Stuns Penn State, Texas Falls to Florida and More | Ringer Tailgate
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- [00:00]
A
Foreign.
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B
Welcome back to Ringer tailgate. I'm your host Tate Frazier. We have a great slate of games. A lot of people going into this weekend said that was not going to be the case, but, boy, do we have some upsets to talk about. We got reactions, we got big questions, and we got big things to discuss. But first and foremost, let's say what's up to our guys. Van Lathan, live from Miami. Good to see you, man.
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A
What's up? I don't want to take up any time. This is Joel's moment.
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B
Yes, we turn it over to Joel, who said that Nico was the guy that Nico was going to have his redemption tour, and he started out 04, had no leads this entire season, and for the first time since 1985, a team that is 0 and 4 has beaten a top 10 team. Joel, I lob it up to you. How you feeling, man?
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C
My homeboy Nico, dog.
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A
I told y'. All.
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C
Hey, hey. This Joey Aguilar have a win as good as my boy Nico does right now.
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B
This is Ringer tailgate, presented by FanDuel. And if you're betting on college football, FanDuels the place to do it. They've got everything. Same game parlays, quick bets for when you want to jump in live and futures available all season long to make your playoff predictions. The app's fast, it's easy to use, and best of all, when you win, you get paid out instantly. Download the FanDuel app or go to FanDuel.com tailgate to get started. The ringer is committed to responsible gaming. Please visit rg-help.com to learn more about the resources and help lines available and listen to the end of the episode for additional details. Must be 21 or older in President select states and 18 and older in D.C. kentucky and Wyoming. Gambling problem. Call 1-800- GAMBLER or visit rg-help.com Call 1-888-789-7777 or visit ccpg.org ChatInElectric I don't think so.
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A
No, he doesn't. I can't. Hey, this is your moment, dog.
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C
$4 million, dog. That's all it would have took. That's all it would have took, man. $4 million. That's pocket change. Oxville. You sound broke. But I wouldn't give, man. Look, man. Because, look, man, I felt so sorry for UCLA this year, man. Like, I was watching them against New Mexico, and that whole scene seemed funereal. Like, it was just sad. I was like, man, I don't how they Even gonna make it through the rest of the year. So they weren't favored in a game. The rest the. In any game coming up, they were the underdogs decided they were on Track to go 0 and 12. They. A lot of people thought they were the worst P4 team in the country. What about today, dog? What do y' all say? What are y' all gonna say about Nico now, man? 166 yards through the air, two touchdowns, 128 on the ground. Montana, 128 yards rush, man. Nutma would die right now. He would die for that. 128 yards and three. Let me tell you this.
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A
Let tell you this. Let me tell you this. So this is the deal. All right? So two things. Number one, I got to give all the credit in the world to Nico. I give credit in the world to Nico and UCLA for this reason more than anything else. This would have been such an easy game for them to come out and lose 45 nothing. There's not much for them to play for. Their season is not a season that anyone's going to be paying attention to. Something made the Bruins get up and play football today. Something made the Bruins decide that they were going to compete today. And anytime that you compete, anytime you give it your all and you go out there with snap and fervor and determination, you can win. And they did. I don't even want to move on from what UCLA was able to accomplish. This is a magnificent, gigantic win for them. But. Oh, my God. My God, My Lordy. Is Penn State in hell? Penn State hasn't been in this much hell since something happened and we're not going to bring it up, but Penn State is in hell. Yeah, this is hell for Penn State. What the is going on in Happy Valley?
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C
Would you. So this is one of the worst State college. This is one of the worst losses a coach, ostensibly coach a top 10 program has taken. Like maybe the. The last year, Notre Dame versus Northern Illinois. But like, you just can't lose this game so soon after you let your fans down at home when you had everything rolling for you, brother. I mean, let me ask you this. Do you think this imperils James's job security in any way? Maybe not this season, but I felt like people were getting tired of him. There was already. You were hearing those whis. They were getting booed. I mean, I just. That's the kind of game that it feels like an inflection point, right? Where it's just like, oh, something.
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B
The beginning of the end, right? Yeah.
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C
Something broke in the team. Yeah.
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A
So when firing a coach, the question is, how much better can it get? That's always the question that I. Look, look at how much better can it get? You know how much worse it can get. It can get a lot worse. You can go and hire a coach, you can make the wrong.
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B
Like Bill Belichick.
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A
Yeah, precisely. All of a sudden your team automatically is irrelevant. The question is, how much better can it get for Penn State? Right now they're in hell. But I would caution them to overreact to this loss. Although at the same time, if I was a Penn State fan, I would be overreacting to this loss. I'm not gonna bullshit you, man. This will be a tough one. Tough one. A tough one to swallow. I'm talking about. This will be a tough one for Tiana Trump to swallow. Like this is.
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C
We went ahead. Okay.
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A
Like this one is.
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B
This is crazy.
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A
This is crazy, man.
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C
Yeah, man, like that dog they've got. We were talking about this, Tate, remember we were saying, who is they've got. So we were talking about whether or not they're eliminated from the playoff hunt right now. Right? Because they've got two losses. Ostensibly. If they were to win out, they could win their way back in. But what they've got ahead of them is Northwestern. Who cares? At Iowa, Take a week off at Ohio State next week you get Indiana at home, bro. That's a stretch. They could, they could go. I mean, they could e easily. They're going to be. They're going to be the underdog in two of those three. Right. But they could easily lose all three of those. The way this is going, if you're.
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B
Penn State too, like, what is the thing that you point to in this game that's the most alarming? Obviously Nico's incredible and he crushes you on these long third down runs. Right? See these back breaking third down run plays. I mean, he had a 55 yarder, he had like a scamper for 12 yards for a touchdown. So obviously that's something that you point to and say that's concerning. But the other concerning part was the end of the first half for me, the fact that they were trying to go, hurry up. They weren't able to get any of the plays in. They weren't able to get anything going right before halftime. It just felt like a team that was, you know, just a drift at sea with no direction at all. And I feel like that's the most concerning part because it's going to get more difficult when they play the Ohio states, the Indiana's of the world at Iowa, it's going to be a tough game in that environment. So I mean, it doesn't even look like a team that's playing good football at any level. So how can you have any sort of belief in this group that they're going to figure it out? Because Drew Aller at this point does not look like the Drew Aller that was promised. Right? We've had a lot of guys that were promised as the hype, but they have not been the hype guys, right?
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Fan?
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No, none of them have. Not one goddamn person. All of them. Not the hype at all. Nuss Meyer playing, some say injured, but definitely playing terribly. Arch Manning right now on the precipice of maybe losing to Florida. Drew Aller, Lenora Sellers, K Clubnick, whoever you want to name of this class that was supposed to be a deep and rich quarterback class. We just not have, we haven't seen these guys. We have not seen these guys be able to navigate college football and put these teams over the hump. And with this particular team, did Oregon break Penn State?
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C
Yeah, man.
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That game takes so much out of them that they just simply could not get up to fly across the country and beat ucla, man. And, and Texas goes down. Texas goes down.
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C
College football, this goes down, man. Look, we. I, I'm gonna have to. I don't. Maybe I should let Tate get to it because I have. So I have to say something about Texas because I, I took, I took my Nico props, but I might have to. Tate left at me last week and maybe he was right. Maybe he was right to laugh at me.
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B
So yeah, I did the whole Texas bit. I had a lot of Texas people in my life reach out to me. They were upset that I reacted in that way that I gave you the full on te. What, I mean, like. But it is what it is. At this point, they don't look like a great football team. Also, I asked this question leading into the broadcast. Who's the best number 16 on Texas? It's not Arch Manning. Michael Taff, 16 on his team. It's not even, not the best quarterback in Texas. I mean, this is a problem.
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C
Not even close. See, that's the thing, man. Like I. Is archmanning really not good? Is he really not? Because that was when, when I said that about Texas. My, my thought was Sark's going to get him, right? They got a week off. He's going to get him reset and they're going to take off Open up the playbook or narrow down the playbook, one of the two and get on. And get on the same page here. And then again, they came out and I was like, oh, man, this looks like the same Texas offense I've seen all year. And, but for a few flashes, like, you know, some great throws, one to our boy Parker Livingstone, a deep shot to Ryan Wingo. Now he did miss another one to, to Mosley earlier in the game, but.
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B
And we go miss one to injuries, that was like a wide open touchdown on a double pass that, you know, that, that could have changed the game, swung it in the right direction. But I mean, it's the continuous story with this Texas team where they're playing from behind the entire time. They never get off to a good start. And they played the one team in the country that is a, you know, a power four, top level team, talent wise, that also gets off to slow starts. And they still get behind in this game, right, Joel?
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Oh, yeah, absolutely. I mean, the thing is, we knew that it would be a tough game. And although again, I will say my, I thought there was no way Florida's offense would have this much success against Texas's defense, but we knew that this was a dangerous game. And look, Texas moved to the SEC because they wanted these types of games. But the thing is, it's so much more different to go on the road to Lubbock, to Stillwater, to Lawrence than it is to go to Gainesville, right, where this game really matters. That is a very difficult place to play, even when they're not great. And they got a little bit of dose of that today, man. And the thing is, we all knew Florida had talent, like a lot of people thought, and I thought that if things went right, they could be a playoff contender. So they've got a lot of talent and it's not like they've been blown out of their games this year. They just have not had enough offense to get it done. And today they made, they seized on enough mistakes and they, you know, blocked a punt and got a safety out of them. So they did. They won in so many different phases of the game that. Yeah, man, you know, I guess the, the, the gap between Texas and Florida was not that great. We didn't think it was the beginning of the year and turns out it's not in actuality.
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Van, if you're Texas and Arch Manning, do you wipe the commercials?
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No.
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Do you get rid of the, rid of the commercials?
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I got at least get my money. I gotta at least get my war My Warby Parker money. I gotta get my money if I'm not gonna get.
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He said they thought he was an accountant. We're still thinking he might be at this point.
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A
Could be. Plays like one sometimes. So one thing to look at from this Florida game, Jaden Ball, 27 carries, 170 yard. 170, 170, 107 yards and a touchdown. The most important thing there, obviously he rushed for 100 yards. Obviously he had a touchdown. But the 27 carries is the most important stat there. Jaden Ball before this game had been having success on the ground all year long. A really healthy yards per carry average. But for some reason, be it stubbornness, be it dedication to his guy, it seemed like the Florida offense was not particularly interested in handing the ball off to Jaden Ball and letting him control the game and add that dimension to the offense and maybe open some things up for DJ Lagway. It seemed like Florida thought that if they couldn't win games on the arm of DJ Lagway, that they didn't want to win them. They did not play that way today. They ran the football today. They were committed to running the football on offense today. And what you saw from them running the football was a more dynamic passing game where DJ Lagway looked a lot more comfortable than he has in recent weeks.
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North Carolina Centrals Jamari Taylor, by the way, scores for Virginia. They went in Otto.
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There you go, the wahoo shout out to the Cavaliers. I did want to bring up. You mentioned guys on offense for Florida that were incredible in this game. Dallas Wilson, true freshman, had one of the, you know, just a tight line, you know, down the sideline. Incredible touchdown catch in this game. True freshman for the Florida Gators. So we saw some playmaker. Sturtevant had a good game again for this group. So, I mean, there were some encouraging signs for Florida. And we saw last year, right. Napier was dead to rights. And they got things right at the end of the season. And every single game they play, if you look down the schedule, Joel, it's all ranked opponents. So, I mean, Florida got some life back today. Not to say that Texas has shown us much signs of life, but this is a really big win for them.
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C
It's a really big win for them. And again, the one thing you can say about Billy Napier is that his boys play hard for him, man. They're not. They're never. They're never out of any game. And it's just, you know, they. They were limited by whatever was wrong with Derek Lagway earlier in the season. Right. Like, he just did not look the same. People were talking about whether or not he was injured or not. The offense looks st the mud. But today you kind of see the proof of concept for Billy Napier. Run to set up the pass. You can hit him over the top. You've got these athletes, Dallas Wilson and Vernell Brown on the outside, these freshmen. It's just like, it's one of those things. It's like if you're a Florida fan, it's like I kind of see what Billy Napier is talking about. Like, does he nothing? Does he need another year?
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They know that they're talented. I think this is the frustration with the Florida fans. The Florida fans were really, really high on the season coming into this season. They know that they're talented. What they couldn't understand is why the talent wasn't been being utilized in a way that was successful on the field. And when I say utilize, I mean that. I mean why Napier seemed to be so dedicated to playing one brand of football that didn't at all seem like it utilized the skill set of the players that he had. He did it today. And I should say this, there's going to be a lot of talk in this game about Archman. I'm about to talk about him in a second. Arch Manning does not play safety for Texas. Arch Manning does not play linebacker for Texas. He doesn't play defensive line for Texas. He doesn't play corner for Texas. But he knows situations in those positions for Texas. The Florida offense played against the Texas defense, the Texas defense, which has legitimate players everywhere.
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Number two scoring defense in the country, right?
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Absolutely. And they were able to put up points and move the ball, put up yardage against that defense. Now to Arch Manning.
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Let'S turn the page. Yeah.
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Yeah.
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Okay, so here's the deal. Oh, I think there's two different schools of thought on Archman and really on any player that a lot of times get commingled when you're having the Archman discussion. I think when people hear you say Arch Manning isn't good, their brain translates that into Arch Manning won't be good.
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Right.
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That's not what anyone is saying. I don't have a crystal ball and if I did, it would be whack. Right. Because my crystal ball might have not told me the first year that Joe Burrow was with LSU that that was a Heisman Trophy winning quarterback. My crystal ball might not have told me the first year that Jayden Daniels was was with lsu that that would Be a Heisman Trophy winning quarterback. I can go on. My crystal ball might have not predicted Cam Ward and how he could throw the ball around. There's so many other players that get with the right scheme, the right system, and they are in it long enough and it clicks. The light comes on and they go out there and they put up crazy numbers and they become players that control college football at their fingertips. I'm not saying that that won't happen. It's happened before in times when we thought that it wasn't going to happen or it didn't look like it was going to. I'm just saying it's not happening now. Yeah, he is not the type of player right now that you can put the game in his hands and have him go win it. As a matter of fact, if you put the game in his hands, he's more likely to go and lose it.
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C
You know, here's the thing, because that my whole theory for why Texas was a dangerous team and a potential playoff contender, and I mean, once again is Texas. They played themselves onto the playoff bubble, right? But my whole theory behind Texas will be a better team at the end of the year is that Arch Manning is going to look better, he's going to play better, he's going to have so many more reps, he's not going to really be surprised by anything at that point. And then we'll see the full flowering of his talent and also his supporting cast, like somebody would emerge as the lead.
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B
Parker Livingstone.
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C
Yeah, Parker Livingstone, you know, stepping up, looking like Xavier, you know. Yeah, my boy Xavier. So, so the problem is that though, okay, I don't think Arch Manning is bad. I think he's, you know, okay, like he's, he's. If, if he was anybody else, like I said, Arch Smith, and He was a third year sophomore and he went 16 for 29 for 263 with two touchdowns on the road. In a tough place like that, you'd be like, okay, we got something to build around. But you know what? I'm looking at this. And then in the next years, right.
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A
Now what he just like they went into Gainesville with all of that talent. He just lost to Florida. If he was anybody else, the fan base would be begging for the backup. Begging, bruh, just like they were begging. They don't have a backup, I get it. But just like they're begging for the backup in Baton Rouge. Just like they're begging for the backup. I've heard Florida fans, I watch all of this stuff, ask for DJ Language back. Just like they're begging. If he wasn't who he was, but he would be under a completely different type of scrutiny.
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C
But the problem, though, is that the, The, The. The whole thing of Texas is that everybody was supposed to be talented like they had. Where's the talent? Because this is what I'm talking about. Arch manning through for 263. Do you know what? He had 38 of their 53 running yards today. They have no run game. So I'm just saying, like, he. And he had double the carries of Contrivion Wiznard. Like, what happened, C.J. but you know what happened to all the guys that you were supposed to have here? Like, Texas is awash in great high school running backs. How do you not have one right now? Right? And so I think people would also be like, well, man, we're putting a lot on this red shirt sophomore. He's the only offense we got. And unfortunately, the guy is still not that great right now. So it's no wonder you went on the road and lost to Florida. I think the thing is, is that the talent that Texas have, and I have to blame myself for this because I guess I. I didn't believe what I saw in all those other games. They don't have as much talent as we thought they were. This is not the team that was formerly the best team in the country. They were never that good, and we hyped them up. And I should have known better because my whole life, that is the Texas football story. But I fell for the. I fell for it, man. I fell for the propaganda. So my bad for believing in Texas. I'd never do it again.
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A
I'll tell you. I got to say something real quick just to let you know. I turned on the. Because sometimes while we're doing this, I turn on the live and I look at it. I would like to say, what's the name of the studio I'm in today, brother? Attractive mindset Studio Florida Hollywood out here, bro. I look crazy right now, bro. I'm looking at myself on the thing, bro. I look crazy right now. If you got your thing, you're trying to attractive my studios where you want to come look at me? This is the best I've maybe ever looked ever in life.
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B
Look at the logo, too. You don't have to.
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W's in the chat. If I'm in 400k right now, what's going on at Attractive Mind Studios? Oh, my God, bro.
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B
In Ultra HD. You love to see that in 4K. Yeah. I mean, it is fascinating. It does come back to like, who mis evaluated the situation more, the experts going into the season with Texas or the coaches themselves? Because it does seem like Sark and the rest of this offensive staff expected Arch to be able to be a guy who could shoulder the burden of this offense. Right. I mean, we're talking about they have no run game. The, you know, the, the wide receivers really haven't, you know, kind of burst out as we thought they would. They got their sixth guy who's now become their de facto number one guy and Parker, Livingston, Slash Livingstone. So we got a situation there where they're still trying to figure out who they are. But like, who do we hold accountable? Is it the coaches? Is it the experts? Like, is it the people that came in from the outside and said he was the best quarterback they had seen, like Ed Orgeron? Like, I don't understand who we point the finger at the most. I mean, it's not really all Arch's fault for the hype, right?
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C
No, I don't think so. And yo you, I mean, I'm glad you said. Because you know, we got a poll. They just told us they got a poll in the, in the YouTube chat for who's to blame for Texas losing. Arch Sarka, the Texas D. And Arch is leading the poll.
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B
So Sharks also in the conversation.
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C
I mean, because, yeah, all the money you spent on this talent, like where, where is it again? Where? Why haven't we seen it get. It should look better by now.
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B
We're midway $19 million.
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C
Yeah. Like they should look much better than this.
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A
To Joel's point though, if you look at what Justin Sane is doing in, in Ohio State or if you look at what Ty Simpson is doing at Alabama, there's a difference. The difference is, is that you know when you need to have a playmate on the back end there, like when you need to have a playmate, you have Carnell Tate and Jeremiah Smith. In Ohio State you have dominating talents that are going to go win one on one matchups, they're going to win slants, they're going to win one on one jump balls. So as a quarterback, you have to be less perfect you in order to feel good about your game when you're playing with those kind of guys. Right. If you look at what's going on in Alabama now, Simpson is in a different situation than what Arch Manning is. He's been there for a long time, although Arch has as well. But he's got Bernard and he's got Ryan Williams in those Situations, guys that he knows can go dominate the defense and make a play, Make a play for him. Like, he has advantages.
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C
Yeah.
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A
So he doesn't always have to make the perfect read at the perfect throw or the perfect scramble or the perfect run or even a good read or the good throw or the good scramble or the good run. He can be a little bit bad and still be good. Because on the outside, there is great. There is excellent. And that's another thing that Arch doesn't have. And that's a fair point by Joel. On offense, Arch does not have that yet. So I think maybe what some people might have thought was that Arch was so good that he was going to elevate the offensive talent around him and alleviate the issues. Yeah, exactly Right. The question is, if that's not the case, does he have the offensive talent around him that can pick him up a little bit? He certainly didn't today.
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C
What do you all think Coach Orgeron saw that made him say that about Arch? I kind of want to. I'm just like, hey, man, leave him alone. No, no, no, man.
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A
The only one that said it.
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C
He said he was as good as anybody seen since Joey.
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A
Leave him alone. And I'm like, all right, here's the deal.
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B
But he said he's ready to coach, too.
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A
I'm. I'm calling it out. Here's the deal with you. Fine. Bomb said it. You know how many people said it? All of them said it. Everybody said it. Arch Manning was the Arch Deluxe. Remember that hamburger from McDonald's?
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C
Remember the arch Deluxe?
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A
He was the Arch Deluxe. Everybody was saying it.
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B
But now we all got a stump.
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A
Single out Coach O as if he is some, like, overwhelming quarterback guru.
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C
Good, good, good friend and great reporter Bruce Feldman wrote a whole book about how Ed Orgeron is, like, uniquely talented at talent identification and acquisition.
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A
Like, it was a defensive line.
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C
Yeah, but I mean, like, those Ole Miss teams he had were allegedly great. He was a great recruitment recruiter at lsu. And so I'm like, this guy knows what talent looks like. He allegedly coached one of the best teams in college football history. I still don't think so, but whatever. But he coached one of the best. I don't think 2019 LSU is the best college football team in history.
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A
I. Okay, you don't have. You don't have to think they're the best, but they are definitely one of the best if you want to maintain any credibility. Okay, yeah, okay.
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C
Yeah, I'll say one of the best. They're top five.
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A
Yeah. Miami had my look Miami had 60 go in the first round. Okay, okay, okay, obviously, obviously. But look, the N word now the whole audience is oh, look, Van's black. But look, it's so funny because I.
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C
Say it all the time, but I'm scared to say it. And then Vans over here saying it all the time.
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A
But yeah, obviously Miami, but you'd have to say that 2019, LSU, 2019 had Jamar Chase and come on, man, you have to say the to. They're one of the best.
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C
I think they're top three, top five. I don't think they're better than one of those Miami teams.
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A
That's fair enough. Fair enough, fair enough.
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B
Fair enough.
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A
Conversation. Yeah, fair enough.
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B
Can we talk about Diego Pavia? Because I, I want to get your guys reaction. This is one big reaction before this game. Diego Pavia was popping that talk. We talked about it on Wednesday. He was saying that he expected to dominate down in Tuscaloosa. Alexander the running back as well, Cedric Alexander also said that he expected to dominate down there. Now Vanderbilt did look good in this game and they had two red zone turnovers in the hands of Pavia, won an interception, one a fumble that basically determined this game. But pregame, and I want to get the reaction on this pregame, he was practicing his victory formation. Van, is, is that bad juju to do pregame? Like, have you ever seen a quarterback practicing their victory formation before you kick it off?
- [27:50]
A
Well, I think the smaller the quarterback, the bigger the nuts. And that's just the way that it goes. We've seen that at Florida State. We, the smaller the qb, shout out Doug Flutie. The smaller the quarterback, the bigger the nuts. If you're gonna go out there and be a tiny diminutive quarterback, then you gotta come in there and drop gonads all over the game. So I do not care that he did any of that stuff. What I do care about though is when the rubber met the road in this game, he just simply was not good enough today. He was not good enough when they, they had had to have it down on downs, on third and fourth down. And you thought that Diego Pavia was going to be the difference maker. He wasn't good enough in terms of ball security and taking them out of opportunities that they had to gain points and do something else to, to get points and do something else, which is pucker the butthole of Alabama and make them believe that that was a losable game for them. Right. Because it was. Vanderbilt came out and showed that there wasn't this gulf of difference Between Vanderbilt and Alabama, that's gone. I don't know if there's this gulf of difference between Vanderbilt and anybody right now. Vandy's gonna be in these games and they're gonna have opportunities to make plays in these games and, and pull them off. Diego Palmer just wasn't good enough today. So I don't have any problem with any of the, that he was talking before the game. That's the way these guys have to kind of get their going and go. But if you're going to do that, then you need to go out and do what Castellanos did and execute and have your team in a position to win. And he did not do that.
- [29:25]
B
And Joel, they definitely did try to take the blueprint of Florida State by doing that. I guess that is a really good point Van, that, you know, all these guys obviously saw Castellanos, what he said about Alabama. Then they come into this game kind of talk the same stuff and you talk about the puckering. I mean they were, they were pucked up early. First turnover of the season. On the first drive, Ty Simpson throws an interception. They come down, Alexander has a 50 plus yard touchdown run. And all of a sudden you're saying to yourself, okay, Vanderbilt looks like they're in control of this game. They're shovel passing the hell out of Alabama just like they did last year in Nashville. And it looks like, you know, things are moving in the direction of potentially another upset. And then all of a sudden it goes the other way, right?
- [30:00]
C
Joe, two red zone turnovers, man, that's, I mean, at most that's the game. That's, that's 16 points right there. Right? Like that change, that changes the whole complexion of the game. If they don't, if Diego doesn't have that. And yet, you know, like Diego was a very good college player. We've talked about it a lot, but I mean that's kind of how he ended up in New Mexico State, if you know what I'm saying. And I'm not saying that as a diss, but he's not that big, not that fast. Yeah, I mean it would be great if he could be Tommy Castellanos, but Tommy Castellanos is fast, you know what I mean? And that's not die is a hell of a player. He's a hell of a player. But I'm just saying he's not Tommy Castellano. I'm not trying to diss him. What I'm just saying is that he has limitations. He has like an athletic ceiling in a way he's just a very tough guy. He's got a lot of moxie, he's very smart. And like you say, the boy got nuts. Like he's very tough. Like he is a legend as a college player. Like I. And again to the earlier point, he can talk his shit forever. He beat Auburn with New Mexico State talent. He beat Alabama with Vandy talent. And this year I didn't, like you said, I did not think that there was a huge gulf in talent. And I don't know if that, that obviously says a lot for what they're doing there. Well, Clark Lee at Vanderbilt, but I'm also just like down the road, like how good is Alabama really?
- [31:15]
A
You know, you raised a great point. There is player for player. Let me be completely clear in what I'm saying. Player for player. There probably is a huge gulf in talent between Alabama and Vanderbilt. If you go look at people's star rankings, where they played, how they did it, all of that stuff, player for player probably is team for team. No, that is the college football landscape that we exist in now. Like we have a lot of players that are highly rated, ranked players. Tell us something about this. Why does it matter to, to have like go back and look at one of those Alabama halfback rooms, right? I think one of those halfback rooms was, if you guys can correct me, it was Alvin Camara who ended up transferring. Alvin Camara. Was it Henry? Was it who. Remember all the guys that had one room? I don't know if it was Henry. Oh man.
- [32:12]
C
It was a kid that went to the Jaguars. Who was that kid, man? Who's the second round?
- [32:15]
A
All of these guys. All of these guys in the same room. Now let me tell you why that matters. That matters for two reasons. Obviously it matters for depth, right? You're going to keep grinding on teams down after down, getting yards. But it also matters for something else. Not all of those guys are going to work out. Yeah, all of those five stars that you get, some of them aren't going to adjust well to living in Tuscaloosa. They're not going to adjust well to the office of scheme that's being run. They're not going to like Nick Saban. They're not going to adjust well to the speed and the physicality of the college game. So the more of them you have, five stars, four stars, whatever stars, the higher the chances are that you get the most capitalization out of the position that you are recruiting. Now, if you only get one of them or you only get two of them, Then your margin for error changes and that means that another team that's coached up can then come in and compete with you. So if you look at the star ratings or the blue chip ratio of all of that, you're going to see a world of difference between Alabama and Vanderbilt, Alabama and name another and Virginia. But if you look at the teams, the way the teams are actually playing, you're not gonna see that big of a difference anymore because these other teams have had to coach these players up and develop them and get the most out of them. So what they're putting on the field, they believe in. Now today Diego Pavia wasn't good enough and they believed in him and it cost him. But what I'm saying is whereas there's more talent in Alabama, there might be more team in other places.
- [34:01]
C
Imagine, imagine if Alabama, like this is the NFL. Alabama had to go back to Vandy, you know what I mean? Like Vandy played on the road today against a tough team and they lost. Not a bad thing. It doesn't mean that Vandy, you know, failed in any way. They just didn't win a tough road game, which is what you'd expect. But yeah, I mean I still have hella respect for that program and you know, yeah man, it just really says something about like what Clark Lee's building down there, that they're able, that they can go into this game physically stand up to those guys and come out and you just like, okay, like Vandy might not make the playoffs but I mean they're going to be there with everybody all year long. Oh, you know Savannah's other point, just imagine if Alabama had Caleb Downs like back in the day, 2015, 2016, Nick Saban ain't losing Caleb Downs, Ohio State like that guy stays there, you know what I mean?
- [34:44]
A
Right.
- [34:45]
C
So yeah, I mean it's just to your point they Alabama loses guys because sometimes they just see a better opportunity, sometimes they don't work out or sometimes, hey man, this ain't Nick Saban. I want to go someplace else. So it's going to work out in the wash. But to the congratulations to them for recovering from that season opening loss to Florida State because everybody was panicking a month ago and they're not, they don't need to do that right now.
- [35:05]
B
And if you look at that offense, I mean everything is sort of coming together, right? Jeremy Bernard has been the safety blanket for this offense and he continues to be. But also you see Ryan Williams getting into forum, you see Jan Miller are actually making a big impact for this team having a real running game. So I mean Alabama, Kaden Proctor had a two yard rush for a first down again, so they're going to be using him in the offense. Right. So I mean this Alabama team offensively seems to be rounding into form and this was a tough Vandy defense. I mean, we got to give credit to Vandy's defense. They competed the entire game and they definitely made a statement in this game that they're not going to get pushed around. It used to be a difference in class. Felt like they were the same weight this time, you know what I mean? It felt like a good matchup.
- [35:43]
C
Oh, absolutely. I mean they look like a good SEC team, just like Tennessee or anybody else, you know, Ole Miss, lsu.
- [35:51]
A
So right now if we're looking at the Heisman, you have to have Ty Simpson there, right? 23 of 31, 340 yards, 11 for 11 yard average, two touchdowns, one interception. You know, Jan Miller had a better game today. You know, Alabama is not a perfect team. But I think the questions at quarterback have been answered for Alabama and answer to a point to where the thing that you know that Alabama is going to do is pass the ball using Ty Simpson and I think he's the most dependable quarterback right now in the entire college football scene. Like it, you know, obviously, if.
- [36:32]
B
Outside of.
- [36:34]
C
Yeah, I mean, yeah, I mean, look, bro, I had to break out a wood chuck for my boy Nico, you know what I'm saying?
- [36:42]
A
I knew this was going to be a up.
- [36:44]
C
Show my boy Pop something for my boy Nico, man. Show something. Throw some dollars in Miami Gardens tonight, Jerry.
- [36:52]
B
New guys and Nico having a day.
- [36:55]
A
I cannot believe, I literally cannot believe that Penn State went up there and lost that game. I cannot believe.
- [37:03]
C
It's so funny, man.
- [37:05]
A
I just can't believe, I can't believe that. What, what is going on with James Franklin and Penn State right now? I cannot believe they went up there and lost that football game, man.
- [37:19]
C
What do they say? Don't let a team beat you twice, man. That's what, that's what coaches always say in the locker room. Don't let them beat you twice. And it's like Oregon beat them twice. You know, they were so crap. They looked really crestfallen after that game last week too. That is a really hard, emotional thing to come back from like after a game like that. So I, I get it. But it makes more sense if that was Washington or if that was, you know, Oregon or, you know, Purdue, not the potentially the team that we thought was going to be the worst in P4 that.
- [37:50]
B
I mean, or even Iowa. You know what I mean? Like, Iowa would have made more sense than this actually happening. And it does. We got the odds here, by the way. Heisman odds for you, Van. Dante Moore the favorite plus 500 and Ty Simpson the second favorite right now at plus 700. So all according to fanduel.
- [38:05]
A
Speaking of fanduel, the question is, does. Does Dante Moore and the accomplishment of beating Penn state on the road, does that change now that Penn state went out and spilled ragu all over it the next week by losing to. To. To Nico and the boys?
- [38:21]
B
Kind of what happened to Nussmeier? Right? I mean, Clemson falls down and falters, and then all of a sudden Nussmeier gets dropped down the rankings and obviously has struggled since then. So that kind of contributes to it. But again, yeah, it's a. It's a tough situation. But Bama covered this game. That's why cousin cousins sal is texting me right now. He is so upset that Bama covered that game.
- [38:37]
C
That's right. It was like 14 and a half. Fifteen.
- [38:40]
B
Oh, yeah. It got down to like 10 and a half in the end.
- [38:42]
C
Oh, did okay.
- [38:42]
B
But Alabama ends up covering that game. So for everybody that's worried about that. Those sorts of things, that is actually what happened. Can we do a fun start binge cup right, right now of like, who's in the most hell of these top flight coaches? We got James Franklin, dabo Sweeney, Steve Sarkeesian, star bench cut. Okay, three.
- [39:01]
C
James Franklin, Steve sarkeesian and. And dabo Sweeney and dabo man.
- [39:07]
B
These are the three teams that were supposed to be shoe ins to be.
- [39:11]
C
I got. Yeah, you got to start dabo man. What they say who had to. Who had the tree? Who was Kevin Clark talking about now? We're talking about somebody else who came back from a difficult time. You know, guess who else came back. So. Yeah, man, he had a big win today.
- [39:27]
B
Was it a big win?
- [39:27]
C
I mean, I mean, they were one.
- [39:29]
A
Any win right now.
- [39:30]
C
Yeah, that was gonna say they were one. They were one in three, man. I mean, they got it. They gotta take what they can get. I would. I would probably bench Steve because this is a tough loss. But again, he's not in trouble. Nobody. I mean, I'm sure Texas fans are pretty mad at him right now.
- [39:47]
B
They're very upset.
- [39:48]
C
Yeah, they're very upset. But like, you know, they're. They're in with him. Like, people believe in what Steve. Steve Sarkis has done. He's Made the playoffs the last couple years. Like there's a proof of concept. They got a lot of talent. This is just, you know, one of those, one of those things. James Franklin, again, I, I've been the main one saying, Penn State, don't run that brother off, man. You don't know what you're gonna get if you run that guy off. Yeah, it's true. It's true.
- [40:12]
A
Right?
- [40:12]
C
Sometimes last to get hired, first to get fired. You know what I'm saying? So, so that's not James Franklin's life story, though. But, but, but, man, you have, I mean, that is one of those losses again that you just, you broke their hearts at home. It's like, that was a big scene last week, man. Like they, you know, the whiteout, the college game, just the whole thing of it. And then you, to come out this like, this is, you're supposed to say, okay, like, I can pick these guys back up. We're going to be fine like that.
- [40:44]
B
You're supposed to be doing what Notre Dame is doing, right? Which is basically like, look, we've lost these games in heartbreaking fashion, but now we come out and we handle our business and at the end of day the year, we all say, okay, we know they're a better football team, let's get them in the playoff. But now you're in a tough spot.
- [40:57]
C
Michigan and Ohio State showed back to back that you can load up, get all your guys back, pay, you know, do get, spend the money you need on your roster, bring all those guys back and do what you need to do the next year, right, to achieve all the dreams. And like, your teams come up short, but then they finally break through in that last year, this is that team and you failed with them. And again, I think they're probably already out of the playoff playoffs, but again, if they win those games, obviously they can play their way back in. But as it is right now, you cannot think that this team is going to be a playoff contender. And so all the money that was spent, it's just last year's team that didn't get better and lost its best player. That's the only, that's this year.
- [41:36]
A
Let's, let's clarify. Start, bench, cut. Okay? Because I've been.
- [41:40]
B
If you're starting in this situation, that means you're the best case scenario of the, of the worst case scenarios.
- [41:46]
A
VAN STRUGGLES so starting in this situation is you're in the most hell.
- [41:50]
B
No, you're in the least hell.
- [41:51]
C
Least hell.
- [41:52]
A
Oh, so starting is you're in the least Hell, yeah. Okay. That's really a lot of sense.
- [41:58]
C
My bad.
- [41:58]
A
But. Okay. But. But okay. So if you're in the least hell, then yeah, I. Well, then Joel's. Joel's. I agree with what Joel said. James Franklin is the one you have to cut. He is by far in the Mozilla. I'm going backwards. He's cut. You gotta cut. Is in hell right now. You would rather be it. You rather be Billy Napier right now than James Franklin?
- [42:20]
C
Oh, yeah.
- [42:23]
A
Now listen, now listen, now listen, now listen. Let me clarify that Billy Napier is going to get fired. James Franklin's not. Okay, Right. But in this moment, right now, present tense.
- [42:34]
B
We're keeping it all present tense here. No past, no future.
- [42:37]
A
Billy Napier is, in my opinion, going to get fired. I don't think he's going to get fired. James Franklin I don't think is going to get fired. But if we're talking about who's in the most hell right now, one guy just beat Texas and the other guy just lost to ucla. That's hell, baby. Okay, Dabo is actually not in hell. Dabo is in purgatory, and he's been in purgatory. Dabo and the whole Clemson program have kind of been in this purgatory where we're trying to figure out whether or not they are going to get to heaven or fall completely into hell. And for whatever reason, they haven't quite done it yet. Sarkeesian is. He's minted. He's minted right now. Sarkeesian right now has been to the playoffs. He's got Texas into a perennial. He's turned Texas, should I say built them into a perennial playoff team with huge recruiting classes coming in. Texas is a brand that is a thriving college football brand. They're in a weird spot right now with their quarterback. Quinn, Yours didn't exactly set the world on fire. And if Arch doesn't, you can make an argument. An argument. Listen to what I'm saying.
- [44:01]
C
Mm.
- [44:01]
A
I'm not saying Quinn Hughes was a miss what you got out of Queen. Yours was a really dependable, high level, starting college football quarterback. I'm not saying he was a miss. But for the offense that Sark runs and the type of explosion and production that you expect from a Sark offense, you could make an argument that neither one of those guys, either Quinn, yours, in his entire time at Texas and certainly Arch Manning now, that they have not lived up to the promise of what a Texas offense led by Steve Sarkeesian with all that talent should be. So but having said all of that, you believe in what they've been able to accomplish the last couple of years. And I think Sark is just fine.
- [44:48]
C
Easily the best coach since Mack Brown. Easily the best coach Texas since Mac Brown.
- [44:52]
B
Shout out to Mac Brown. By the way, he is winning.
- [44:54]
C
Miss him now, huh?
- [44:55]
B
Yeah, he is. Mac Brown's doing a podcast with Vince Young. He's making picks every week and he's always also watching his 73 year old replacement. He was fired for being too old. They hired a guy who's 73 years old. And can we go to the depths of hell we've been talking about? Hell, let's talk about Carolina football. One big question. Is North Carolina the worst Power 4 team in the country today? UCLA was the answer going into today. 04 had not led at any point this season. But right now I think, you know, it could be the answer. Bill Belichick, arguably the greatest coach in NFL history, now coaching the worst team in the country. If you're looking at the power four, Joel, I'll go to you first. Is that true? Do you think they're the worst team in college football?
- [45:39]
C
So I'm going to look at the bottom of the leagues here. So I don't.
- [45:42]
B
They have Kelsey's in the mix, Wisconsin's in the mix, West Virginia's in the mix, Boston College is in the mix.
- [45:47]
C
Yeah, I mean, they're down there because they don't look good or explosive at all. Like, I was actually just thinking about Max Johnson throwing out the. Throwing out there his brother, man. And I was like, this is how it's going in for you, huh? You know what I mean? It's just like I'm sure Max Johnson's thought was, man, I'm going to go to North Carolina. This is my graduate year. I'm going to learn from the best and I'm going to get on one of his staffs or something because that when old boy who went to. Oh, man. Oh, the boy who wore the mustache at Washington State.
- [46:19]
B
This is my Garner Minshew.
- [46:20]
A
Garner Minshew.
- [46:21]
C
Garner Minshew. That was his deal when he went to Alabama. Oh, he was going to go to Alabama. It's like I'm going to get. Be a graduate student, get into coaching and then I'll be.
- [46:29]
B
Mike Leach said, come play for me.
- [46:30]
C
And then Michael said, come play for me. So I kind of thought like Max Johnson probably was like, oh, I'm going to learn from the best and I'm going to get a chance to, you know, get get my coaching career started. But now this just looks really pathetic. And it had me like, we're done with North Carolina, right? Like nobody, nobody's tuning. Nobody's going to watch them or care about them the rest of the year now. Like, that's over. Like, whatever the buzz, the Bubba Cunningham and whoever else thought they were going to get from hiring Bill Belichick, that's over. Like, it's the only thing positive that happened in Chapel Hill was ludicrous today. That's it.
- [47:05]
B
Had a great performance by all accounts.
- [47:07]
A
There's only one hope for North Carolina football. There's only one hope. Pablo Torre. Pablo's got to sink his teeth back in. That's it. If Pablo doesn't come back with a whole limited series about Jordan and Bill Belichick's relationship, no one is going to give a rat's ass about what's happening in Carolina. They are pathetic. I need a member of the national media. I saw game day and I saw the good old boy. Hey, how you doing? Hey. Remember that? But between Belichick and Saban, it was very funny. It was cute. I guess it was cute. I didn't know Nick Saban could be cute. Very cute. What they were doing there. I need someone to ask actual football questions to Bill Belichick national media. I'm not talking about from the post game Carolina media. I'm talking about from the national media to ask Bill Belichick actual football questions to see whether or not there is a vision and a plan.
- [48:16]
B
Is anybody home?
- [48:18]
A
I don't want to do that line of football.
- [48:21]
C
You're going to implicate Tate because look, man, I mean, this is a Bill problem. This is a Bill Belichick problem. This is also a Mike Lombardi problem. I mean, that's, that's the roster that he assembled. You know what I mean? No, I'm just saying that is your right. You turn that whole roster over every.
- [48:38]
A
That's not lots of codes.
- [48:39]
B
Don't clip this.
- [48:43]
C
You don't do that in this country. I'm not trying to hate, but I'm just like, we don't have to put it all on the 73 year old man. You know, like you put it on that poor, on that poor 73 year old man. He's going through, trying to keep up with his 27 year old girlfriend, man. You know, he's got a lot of things on his mind and so he's, he's depending on his boys, he's depending on his son. Like, hey, man, like, you know, this is a different time in my life, and dad just wants to kind of live his life and also. But I'm bringing y' all down, and this is a chance for you all to blossom in these roles. And when I was retire, you all can take over my whole kingdom here in Chapel Hill. They're supposed to be building him up and lifting him up. Where's the talent, Joe?
- [49:21]
A
He's not supposed to do that, let me tell you.
- [49:23]
B
They're only other teams. I told him to start tampering.
- [49:26]
C
I'm trying to make it not elder abuse.
- [49:29]
A
Nah. When I first. When I first moved to Los Angeles, all my boys came out to visit me. Like, all of my homies, Ian, Gino, Ryan, Brian, Trey, they all came out to visit me. We was. I had no money. Was, like, pedaling around Los Angeles, and my man Bryant brought a girl with him. Oh, man. And. And obviously, you don't do that.
- [49:48]
C
That's terrible.
- [49:50]
A
You know, but the girl is with him, and she's the problem. She's messing up the whole situation. And we complaining about things, but you can't bring that up. You can't, because that's your man's girl. That's the relationship that he has. And my boy Ian did what you just did. We sitting there and we driving around, and she said something, and he goes, all right, now you already up there in the bojacking slot messing up the whole thing. We were like, whoa. You don't do that. You can't bring it up.
- [50:24]
C
Wait, how did she come back from that? What happened?
- [50:26]
A
It ruined everything.
- [50:28]
C
Yeah. Oh, man.
- [50:30]
A
It ruined it. It ruined everything. It ruined everything. Because then she was like, what you mean the BoJack is sliding? And then after. And after she looked back, I was like, oh, hell, not a patriarch. That's what you just did to Tate.
- [50:43]
C
Yeah.
- [50:46]
A
That's like. Tate's. They in a relationship. You can't bring that up on the show. You can't do that.
- [50:50]
C
I. Look, man, if Tate didn't know I was gonna say that, he does not. He is not involved with my disavow. He disavows it. I speak only for myself, and I'm sure it's better that way, but. So where's the talent? I mean, Bill Belichick, I mean, again, what is he supposed to do with that? I mean. Well, I don't understand, like, he's not going to make Clemson out of that.
- [51:13]
B
Well, I will say that the two quarterbacks that they went after, right? John Mateer goes to Oklahoma because our buckle Is going to go to Oklahoma. He wants to stay with his offensive coordinator. So you lose Tim, you offer him 4 million. He doesn't come. Quinn, yours. You offer him 4 million. He says, I'd rather get cut by the Dolphins. So you lose your top two quarterback options to come to North Carolina. But here's my plan. This is a Nathan for you plan that I. Bill Simmons texted me. That's how you know it's bad. Bill texted me, and he goes, this is an unequivocal disaster. And then, you know, proceeds to go down the list of all of Bill Belichick's accolades and, like, how is it this bad? And all this sort of stuff. And as I've, you know, told him, this is Carolina football. It doesn't matter who is there. He can be the greatest coach ever. Things can go south quickly. But this is probably the worst team we've seen. But here's the answer. Here's the plan. This is my taping for you plan. Like, here's the plan. Here's how we get it done. Jordan, what does she love? She loves the media. She loves the moment. She loves the attention. And who else does she love? Taylor Swift. What does Taylor Swift love more than anything? Breakups. Right, this is the moment. Right, this is the time. Now, I'm not saying they have to actually break up, but I'm saying for the PR of it all, let's give her a full cycle of a story. Let's give her a fall breakout where she can become the star of this situation. Her and Bill Belichick. Things did not work out. They've broken up. That helps everything inside the building. That helps all the conversations around the program. Everybody feels a little bit better about the situation now. They could stay together and maybe they are in love, and maybe they'll be happily ever after. But I'm saying PR wise, do an old Hollywood trick here. Do the breakup, do the whole rollout and make everybody feel better. This is the only way. There's only one way to salvage the situation. It's to break up Jordan and Bill Belichick. That's. That's where I stand when we're talking about relationships. That one's got to end. I don't care if it really ends, but it's got a PR end for sure.
- [53:05]
C
My dude, Bunky Perkins, says he tweeted this earlier today, man. He said, the health scare Bill Belichick is about to concoct would make Urban Meyer blush. Blush. And I was just like, the coach gay.
- [53:16]
B
My back hurts.
- [53:17]
C
Yeah, man. It's like, ah, I can get a hip replacement. I didn't know it until now, you know, maybe, man, leave it.
- [53:24]
A
I'm gonna tell you. I'm gonna tell y' all something. The list of things that Bill Belichick gonna break up with before he break up with that girl in so long. Bill Belichick break up with democracy. He'll break up with wealth. He'll break up with football. He'll break up with chocolate, he'll break up there. He'll break up with sugar, he'll break up with hoodies. He'll break. The list of things that Bill Belichick will break up up before he breaks up with that 20 something year old girl that's curling his toes. Y' all crazy. Y' all act like that's not happening.
- [53:58]
B
They don't have to actually break.
- [53:59]
C
Oh, yeah, yeah. It's just like this is create a little.
- [54:04]
B
You can stay at one of his many properties. You can act like you broke up with him, you know, outside to the world, but inside you can stay with him. Everything's fine. But we need something. We need give.
- [54:15]
A
So cash. Cash. A question. How we. Of all the college football shows that are out there, we tend to be, like, one of the most woke. I was on, which is probably not a great thing. I was on CNN yesterday and I talked about sitting down in my driveway when I was handcuffed by the cops. I didn't want to say Indian style, so I said sitting down Native American style. Oh, we. Yeah, I know, I know.
- [54:45]
B
Is that a saying?
- [54:46]
C
Crisscross?
- [54:46]
A
It's not. It's not. I just don't want to know. I don't. I don't want to upset anyone, but this is by far the most gleefully unwoke we are whenever it comes to Bill Belichick and North Carolina football. We gleefully blame the woman. Is her fault, and I stand by it.
- [55:11]
C
I tried to blame Mike Lombardi, by the way.
- [55:17]
A
I stand by it. They will never win, ever, as long as she is there. As long as she is around, he will not be focused on football. It just won't happen. They will never win as long as she is there. Ever.
- [55:32]
B
Salute.
- [55:32]
C
He ain't living that 20 year old. He ain't living that 27. Yeah. I mean, she. I mean, that is. Van makes a very good point. He will. That is. That. That would be because he knows when she walks out the door, that's never happening for him again. Right? Like, that is a. That is a chapter of it. Unless he pays for It.
- [55:49]
A
Right.
- [55:49]
C
I was gonna say Robert Kraft, show him, you know, how we're paying for it now, right? Yeah, but so he. He's probably like, man, like, she will have to leave me. But what I was going to say is, like, you know what this reminded me of? Because I. This is the first time in my life I felt sorry for Bill Belichick. Do you remember when Mike Tyson fought Lennox Lewis or.
- [56:10]
A
Oh, yeah, yeah.
- [56:11]
C
And I was. I was just like, man, you know, I was. I think, you know, Mike Tyson, man, has been the best heavyweight of my lifetime. I always just kind of thought, man, he's still a badass. Like, I've seen him lose, right? I know. Evander Holyfield. I really bullied this man, but I think he still got power in them hands. And then it was around about the second, third round, I was like, oh, man, Mike Tyson's getting beamed on, man. Like, he's about to get his ass beat. It was really sad. I just wasn't used to that. Or like, when Roy Jones Jr. Lost to Glenn Johnson, he got, like, knocked out in the ninth round and couldn't get up. Like, it was scary. I was like, damn, man. He's out there getting his ass beat. That is Bill. That's what I felt for Bill Belichick today. I was just like, damn, bro. Like, he's really getting his ass beat now. This is. It's not six and six bad. Like, you know what I mean? Like, this is. This is the worst possible scenario. The only thing he could have done worse was lose to Charlotte and Richmond.
- [57:01]
B
Which they could have lost.
- [57:02]
A
Laughing stock Joe. This is laughing stock. Carolina football. The laughing stock right now.
- [57:09]
C
Yeah.
- [57:10]
A
Of college football. And there's something else. It doesn't seem like he cares.
- [57:18]
B
I know that's the hardest part.
- [57:20]
A
It doesn't seem.
- [57:21]
C
There's reasons for that.
- [57:23]
A
It doesn't seem like he gives a. About any of it.
- [57:28]
C
It.
- [57:29]
A
Like, Bill. Bill Belichick used to seem to hang on every single win that the Patriots would get or not get. In this case, it just doesn't seem like he cares at all. How could he, in any way about this, man? It's so odd. It's so weird to see him in this situation.
- [57:48]
C
How could he, man? He's been in Super Bowls, you know, I mean, he's been. He's been in. He's been at the height of football. And so I bet, like, I mean, I'm still. He's got professional pride, theoretically. But now you're sitting on the sideline at a. You know, a 10 full stadium losing into a bad Clemson team. How can you feel the same? You're just like, I'm still Bill Belichick. I've got all these super bowl rings. I'm going to go in the hall of Fame. It probably, when he thinks about it, it's like, this is bad, but I'm still who I am. I just can't make myself care. But that's, that's an argument for being like, well, maybe I don't need to coach anymore. Maybe I'll just be. Do the media thing with Jordan. We'll do a podcast or something like that.
- [58:28]
B
Bill used to have this speed limit thing, like, when a coach would hit 55, right? Like any. Anything on the other side of 55 is bad. You know what I mean? Like, it starts, like, trending in the wrong direction. I think it probably is bumped up to around 65. You know, it's probably going 10 years back. But, I mean, he's 70. I. I think that's what we're seeing. I think we're seeing the, the downtrodden version of a Bill Belichick. And yes, he can be involved in all three phases. Yes, he knows football like the back of his hand. Yes, he loves it. Yes, he's involved in all these sorts of things, but it just isn't there. And in the press conference does not inspire much hope. You know, you watch these press conferences, you're like, man, he really doesn't seem bothered.
- [59:05]
C
Yo, somebody said that during the game. They were like. And I was thinking about that, too. I was like, imagine being on that sideline. Who on that sideline is going to pump them up, man? Like, you know, every roster kind of has, like, a Trooper Taylor type dude, you know, something like that. Like, somebody's going to get these guys to pumped up. This is an NFL staff, and they just don't seem to have the kind of juice to them. Right? Like, there's just no. It didn't seem like anybody over there was really frenzied at, like, trying to keep them pumped up into the game. And that's kind of the risk of trying to be the NF, the NFL's 33rd team, you know, Like, I mean.
- [59:41]
B
You know, would they score any points if they played any other NFL team? That's the question. It would be it.
- [59:46]
A
Nothing is. It's, it's. It's. It's bad stuff all over the place. Just let you guys know, first drive of the game, Florida State goes down, gets. Gets a field goal. They were driving Pretty well. It looked like they had some things going. Stalled out in the red zone. They get a field goal now Miami's gonna get their chance on offense.
- [60:03]
B
There you go, Miami, Florida State happening right now. All right, let's do biggest thing. Your biggest thing for the day. Joe, I'll go to you first.
- [60:09]
C
Oh, yeah. So I didn't think. And it's, you know, shout out to my terps who came up short today in College park. But they, they put environment, by the.
- [60:20]
B
Way, in College Park.
- [60:21]
C
Yeah, it really was. I put up a good fight. But again, I. Once again, I just want to say that Lincoln Riley is right, man, that travel is really, really difficult. And I don't think it's a surprise that Penn State, following a crushing loss at home to a top 10 team, flies across the country and looks bad in the first half, and it takes the rest of the second half coming back. And on the other side of that, it's not a surprise that Washington lost a crushing. Had a crushing loss to Ohio State at home in front of a big environment. They thought they were going to be, you know, this was going to be a really breakthrough victory for them in the Jeb Fish era. They lost and, you know, kind of got strangled to death, to be honest. And then they have to fly across the country and play at Maryland. And Maryland's not bad. Like, Maryland's good. They may have, you know, the best freshman quarterback in the country or one of the top two or three in Malik Washington. So they've looked really good early. So in, in Washington looked sloppy and I was like, man, are we preparing for another upset? Right? But they managed to get it together. And in the second half, they, they, they steadied themselves. And Demon Williams put that, got the offense going and they put points up and they won. But that, that, that travel, yeah, great. Yeah, but that travel is unbelievable, man. And for that, that's the thing. Fans are going to have to get used to the idea. This is unprecedented for these kids, man. There's not been leagues this, this, this spread out, and teams had to take them kind of road trips to play week to week to week. And so it's not a surprise, like, it is a surprise that Penn State lost, but it's not a surprise that they had time, that it took them some time to get going. It didn't look like themselves because they're amateurs. And, you know, that is really hard even for professionals to do those sort of road trips. And those going from that emotional high to that emotional low.
- [62:12]
A
Mine is that the college football media ecosystem is behind. It's a little behind where the game is right now. We are so blissfully wrong about everything. Everyone is so wrong about everything. Everything. I watched all week long, people guess and pick these games and tell you who's going to win, why they were going to win, what was going to happen and how it was going to happen. That just doesn't seem to be a handle from a lot of people involved in college football media right now on the reality, the competitive reality of college football as we know it. So know what's going on. So you don't know what's happening. And it's not their fault. It's because things are changing so quickly in the game and in the sport. And in many ways, this season was the benchmark for just how much everybody knew. It was a season where you expected these quarterbacks to take the step to, you know, get to the next level, to where you expect some of these teams to maybe get over the hump to where you expected some of these programs and these coaches stabilize. But none of it's going the way anyone thought that it would. It seems to be some level of chaos every week. And if it's not chaos, it's just simply the team that you think is great, just playing okay, or the team that you think is terrible, UCLA playing fantastic against a team that is supposedly elite. It just seems like the conversations around college football are a tick, maybe even two ticks behind the realities that we're seeing play out on the field. And it's one of the more fascinating narratives and storylines of this season right now. It's just how we simply, at this point, with so much going on, aren't quite sure on how to talk about the game anymore.
- [64:12]
B
And that's why we hold experts accountable here, damn it. I mean, that's what we do, damn it.
- [64:16]
A
That's what we have to hold experts accountable, damn it.
- [64:19]
C
That's right. Give us.
- [64:23]
B
And we're at the point, too, where I think you make a great point, Van, where that's why I'm enjoying us doing the show, because it's such a new landscape. It does feel like the mold is not quite there for what this new world of college football looks like. So you can't really hearken back to times of the past and say, oh, as is tradition, this would be a thing that would happen because everything is so different. Even if there are the familiar faces, the familiar programs that we've seen that have been in powers of position before, they're still not as invaluable as they once were. You know what I mean? It does feel like everybody's up for the taking. And week to week, it is more parody than we've ever seen.
- [64:58]
C
Let me ask you this then, because this is. I'm pretty. Because of my wokeness. This is where my sentiments lie.
- [65:05]
B
Don't go broke.
- [65:06]
C
Yeah, don't go broke. I can't, man. Clay Travis, man, I don't know how much those shirts cost. I look into it. So why does anybody want to change the transfer portal stuff or the nil stuff or the house settlement stuff? The ratings have never been higher for college football regular season games. We all admit that these games are exciting week to week. We don't know what's going to happen. There's playoff. You know, the playoff is like in the hunt. So teams don't play themselves out by late September already. Why do people want to change anything? Y' all don't like this? I love this, right? Like, I. I love that. I don't know who's the dominant program this year, right? And I'm sure there's going to be a good team. Like Ohio State ended up being a really good national champion. Like, I think of them and all their talent. They're really good. They didn't go undefeated, but whatever. And so I'm like, we know Carson Beck. We get to see him thrive in a whole new circumstance, bro. Devon Dampier gets a chance to play at Utah and do some cool things.
- [66:01]
A
Things.
- [66:01]
C
So I just. Why would anybody want to change this then? Like, for all the people complaining about the transfer portal and kids getting paid, it seems like it's working out pretty damn good for us so far, right?
- [66:12]
A
Well, I mean, it depends on your perspective, right? It's. If you. It depends on what your idea of great college football is. If your idea of great college football is college football that everybody else likes as well, then sure, then, you know, the ratings and all that stuff matter. And they do matter. The ratings matter a lot because it's indicative of the health of the sport. And if you love your college football and you want to be exposed to as much college football as possible, then you want college football to rate well and for everyone to be watching. Now, if college football, and we've talked about this, we get into it some kind of way on pretty regularly. If college football is about what it's been about in the past, which was tradition and culture, then you might be a little uncomfortable with what it is you're seeing right now. And there are myriad reasons why, that's true. Having a conference where, you know, USC and Purdue are in the same conference, having a conference that's not based around culture, having a conference that's not based around geography, that's not based around what's always happened, who went where, all of that stuff, it's different. Having players that come from your home state, small towns, guys, Faraday, Nichols, excuse me, Thibodeau, Lake Charles, New Iberia, all of those guys that, you know or supposedly have this connection to lsu, you know, this school that represents what they are, where the people sound like them, talk like them, look like them, all of that, that. And then have somebody like that go to another school because they got outbid. That's new. That's different. There was a guy, I'm not gonna name his name because I'm not sure how he's doing and where he's playing right now, that was a safety for la, not for lsu. It was a safety from Louisiana a couple years ago. And he had been part of a seven on seven team that existed in Louisiana as well. It was well known to anyone. His friends had gone to lsu. He wanted to go there too. That's where he wanted to go. He wanted to go to LSU with his boys. They had, this is what they wanted to do. This is the college football thing. Remember, it's college. It's where you go to, to. To have fun and to make connections and to, to, to grow up and learn who you are as a man and all of that stuff like that, as a person. And he didn't, he didn't go there. He didn't go there. He went somewhere else because he got paid more money and now his career is little, a little bit in limbo. And maybe that would have happened even if he had gone to lsu. Maybe if that would have happened if he had gone to Texas Tech or Oklahoma or Texas or wherever it is. But college football was always, to me, not just about who had the best resources, of course that was a part of it, but it was also about who had the best culture. Was it the speed of the SEC or the power of the Big, big of the Big Ten? Was it the west coast brand of football being played out there? You know, was it like what, what, what area, what geographic region, what culture was dominant? Because when we're talking, we're talking and all these things and we're linking arms and saying, we do this better than you, that losing that, losing that is at least worth discussing because that's the thing that made the game different. Than what happens on Sunday. And if money changes everything to where the deepest pockets, the most well resourced win, that's where we're headed in this earth. We can pay you a million dollars to go do comedy in some place where a guy gets his head cut off for doing journalism. Right? If that's where we headed, that's fine, but we probably should at least have a discussion.
- [70:01]
C
Well, I mean, that already has been happening. The best resource pro. I mean, there's a reason why Wake Forest is Wake Forest and Ohio State is Ohio State. Right. And every. Everybody.
- [70:12]
A
Why do you think that is? Why do you think that is?
- [70:14]
C
Well, I mean, tradition builds on top of resources.
- [70:18]
A
Well, but tradition is the reason why the resources. Tradition is the reason why the resources are there.
- [70:25]
C
Right.
- [70:26]
A
Like, I mean, obviously the size of the schools here matter. I'm not going to act like they don't, but there are plenty of schools that are filthy rich. Filthy rich, Duke. That don't have any college football success to speak of, because it's actually the tradition that denotes the investment from the people who care about the football.
- [70:46]
C
Right, but this is what I'm saying. So the money and the benefits were already influencing where guys went like that. Never. Like, it's just above board now. Right. Like with my kids best believe we're getting inducements to go across the country and play for schools that they weren't used to or whatever else. Like, all that stuff was already happening. We just know about it now.
- [71:06]
A
You think anybody ever got $12 million?
- [71:10]
C
No.
- [71:10]
B
They got $250,000. No.
- [71:12]
C
They might have got it.
- [71:13]
A
Yeah. That's a different type of money is what I'm saying. But that's a different but by the way, I'm not saying it's not great. I'm not saying not. I'm not saying it's not great. I'm saying it is.
- [71:25]
C
Vander want this boy's paid, man. You. That's. That's.
- [71:29]
A
Look, I'll be completely.
- [71:30]
C
Chalk it up, man. We need some.
- [71:32]
A
I'll be completely honest. I'm gonna be totally honest with you. Like, I am pro labor. I want everyone to get paid, right? But I'm not going to shy away from the fact that this change that is existing in college football is a change that fundamentally affects me. And the way that I've watched something Since I was 6 or 7 years old, I'm not gonna. For the sake of looking like I am.
- [72:01]
C
He's uncomfortable. Y' all wearing chains. And like, I got money now.
- [72:05]
A
I am going to. I'M not. This is, this is a change. This is a change and we have yet, we have yet to see. Of course it benefits. This is a change. And whether or not that change is good for the overall health of the sport, I, I assume that it is, but we'll see.
- [72:28]
C
Man, you were for the squatters, so you, you for the squatters on Tuesdays and Fridays, you come over here. You from like. Man, them brothers making that much money make me a little uncomfortable. I don't know if I like that.
- [72:39]
B
You know, I don't know if it's the money. Right? Man, you're just saying you're, you're worried about don't came for him.
- [72:47]
A
I'm perfectly capable.
- [72:49]
B
Look, are you ostracizing the people that are like traditionalist, I guess is what you're saying?
- [72:55]
A
No, this is the best way I can put it. Money is pouring into all of these things. Money is being dumped into all of these things. All of this stuff, whatever it is, people are saying throw money at it. Money, money, money, money.
- [73:13]
B
Yeah, private equity. Trying to get involved with the big ten now. Now, yeah, it's great, right?
- [73:17]
A
Money is pouring into all of this stuff. And yeah, the more money, the more the people who are generating the dollars should be getting some of that money. I, I agree with that. I just have yet to see evidence of the changing aspect of our society where you can buy anything you want and just. It, it's like, the question is, is like when the Saudis buy live golf or when the Saudis buy all of those comedians, is it great that they got paid? Yeah, but there's a cost on both sides. And, and when we, and when we talk about the cost, there is going to be a cost to college football. In the current structure of college football.
- [74:05]
C
Ohio State's great. Texas is great. Penn State, well, whatever. Michigan is very good. Nebraska is very good. USC is pretty good. Florida State, Miami are playing their hearts out. They're both really good right now. The only difference is, hey, man, people in Texas Tech and Lubbock, they got something to think about. Indiana is good at football now. Vandy is good at football. Mississippi State is better. I just, I, you know, I'm looking at the landscape of the game and I'm enjoying these games on Saturday. Like, I'm as hype as I've ever been. It ain't just because I'm talking to y'. All.
- [74:41]
A
I feel pretty good about it. Again, you just, at the same time, you just made a point that Penn State might have actually lost the Game because they had to make. They might have actually lost a football game because of a geographic concern that probably shouldn't exist. They probably shouldn't have to fly all the way to the west coast. They probably shouldn't have to do that. Right? If you want the best football in the teams, they probably shouldn't have to do. So all I'm saying is, I'm not saying that what you're saying that the parody of the game and all of that stuff that that's not great. Like, I'm not saying, but I'm saying that there is a cost, that there are going to be times where you're going to say, hey, did we get the best possible product? Did we get the best possible game? Because we don't know if SC flying to play Minnesota and being jet lagged because of a super conferences that, that that's been built ends in the best actual football game, if that's the best way that we're doing it or if it was better when each region had a conference that represented the football and the type of sport that they play, they got, they'll always say that, that UCLA or USC is the school of champions. We got more national champions than anyone. And we would be like, yeah, that's because y' all got water polo national championships. And we don't play that. And we, and we don't play those sports. But those sports are culturally significant to those places. And so that's all I'm saying. I'm not disagreeing with what you're saying, Joel. I don't know if there is a right answer, and if there is a right answer, probably you, it's probably you. But all I'm saying is when it comes to college football, I am a traditionalist. And that's the only thing in my life where I am.
- [76:33]
C
You're a constitutional conservative, I hear you.
- [76:37]
A
I am a traditionalist. I'm a traditionalist and I'm, I'm, I'm with it. But you know, I just, I'm, I'm willing to say that y' all saw.
- [76:46]
C
Van Woke out there.
- [76:48]
B
No, I like it. I like it. I think we needed some of that, you know what I mean? Because that is sort of the, that is the crux of the conversation that everyone is sort of having independently, within their own households even. You know what I mean? Like, I talked to my aunts and uncles that have been die hard Carolina basketball fans, football fans, whatever, and they're just like, it just feels a little bit different now, you know what I mean? But it's. It's not that the ACC is different.
- [77:09]
A
There's no pack 12.
- [77:10]
B
There's no PAC 12.
- [77:14]
C
I bet if North Carolina was good, they would care about that less, you.
- [77:17]
B
Know, and that's how it works.
- [77:19]
C
If you be. David, if UB Davis was knocking them down a little bit better than that, I think y' all would be.
- [77:25]
B
Yeah, he had the blue white game today. That was classic Carolina right there. You lose a football game and you go watch the blue white qb, Davis.
- [77:30]
C
They'Ll fire your black ass. You better win this year.
- [77:34]
B
That's a good message.
- [77:35]
C
Yeah.
- [77:37]
B
A couple. Couple more games. I wanted to shout out Cincinnati upsetting Iowa State. That was, you know, the board.
- [77:43]
A
They rushed quarterback.
- [77:45]
B
Yeah.
- [77:45]
C
Cincinnati.
- [77:46]
B
Yeah, right. Be the number four team in the country. 14 team in the country. So that was encouraging to see for Cincinnati also. So we talked about the quarterback showdown of that game, but it turned into a run game, especially in the first half. Cincinnati just getting outside the edge, being able to run the football. That was really the difference in the game. Joel, you mentioned this in the group text. Just the athletic limitations of Iowa State on full display there.
- [78:05]
C
Yeah. I mean, the thing is, is that Iowa State had played really well. They're a very good coach team. They got a very solid quarterback and Rocco backed. Right. But they're not explosive. They don't do anything great. Right. They're just not a.
- [78:17]
A
A.
- [78:17]
C
You're not a special team. So it. It's not. It's not hard to imagine them losing. Like, I. They were just a very shaky top 15 team. And again, I think Matt Campbell gets the most out of that squad. Like, no, they lost. Really good spot. Yeah, they lost it. Like, Cincinnati may be actually pretty decent too, but it's just hard to believe. And this is how crazy college football is. The same quarterback I saw play against Nebraska in the season opener, and I was like, man, that guy's terrible. I was just like, oh, he's really bad. Yeah. Brandon Swordsby. I was like, he's not good at all. And now he's really turned it up. I mean, he's, you know, have a completion percentage of 69%. He's 10 to 1 touchdown interception ratio. I think he's the lead in Russia for Cincinnati, too. So he's having a really good year, man. And yeah, Iowa State, they're just, you know, I mean, the hope for the Big 12, if you care about the Big 12, is the Texas Tech is as good as the money they spent.
- [79:13]
B
Well, they're beating Houston pretty handily right now, 22 to 3.
- [79:16]
C
My first team's undefeated.
- [79:18]
A
Yeah.
- [79:18]
B
So there you go.
- [79:19]
A
What's it about that game to me is. Man, God damn it. Cincinnati ran that football. Yeah, Cincinnati ran that football. 34 rushes for 260 yards, 7.6 yards a carry. Evan Pryor 10 carries for 111 yards. Tyree Walker 14 carries for 89 yards and the QB toted it nine times for 64 yards. They went out there and didn't luck up because of some. Somebody had a bad game and threw five picks. They ran the ball down their throats and won a football game. I'm saying like it, like when you watch it, that game, they ran that football and Iowa State, when you look at it, you did not expect them to be able to lose a game in that fashion.
- [80:11]
C
Yeah, I kind of thought they would probably lose like a defensive slug out. Like they wouldn't be. Exactly. They scored. I wouldn't. There's no way you could have told me, hey, I was. State scored 30 points and still lost. Like I didn't think they were going to do that this year, but it happened.
- [80:23]
B
And honestly, Cincinnati let him back in the game in the second half by trying to throw the football a little bit more. When they got back to the run game, they started doing some more options and stuff. I mean, it worked out really well for them. So a shout out to them. K State wanted to give them a shout out. I feel like they're having the season from hell for the expectations of this team. What we saw in Ireland, they, I mean, they have this game. They were ahead of 98% chance to win this game based on ESPN projections, which usually is incorrect and usually far from, you know, the facts of life. But the fact that they had that chance to seal that game against Baylor and they lose it the way that they did, I mean, I just want to pour one out.
- [80:57]
C
Hey, man, they got to change that rule, man. Man. Cuz, I mean I'm. I'm not one of those people that's. That believes in, you know, that this will accelerate people trying to rip people's helmets off when they get away from you or whatever. That's what happened in the K State Baylor game. For people that didn't see K State, Avery Johnson, his receiver deep down the field looks like he's going to score a touchdown. The defender for Baylor rips his helmet off and so official blows the play dead where the helmet went off rather than the guy was going to score a touchdown. And so K State doesn't get the touchdown on that drive. Baylor goes right back down, goes back down and kicks the game winning field goal. Man. So I, That's a terrible rule. I guess I, maybe I knew that rule. I, I'm, I did not know that. That it was, that it makes sense because normally a good rule because when somebody's helmet comes off, the play probably should stop right where it is. But that is, that is heartbreaking, man. Yeah. K State hasn't caught any breaks this year.
- [81:56]
B
So if it feels like an advantage like from like football slash soccer, you know what I mean? Like if he's already going to have a clearing to score a touchdown, you just give him the advantage that he was going to score a touchdown and you go from there, you know?
- [82:07]
C
Yeah. Like in basketball, like where, you know. Yeah, yeah, yeah. A file. Yeah, right, like that.
- [82:12]
B
So.
- [82:12]
C
Yeah, that's. That's really hard to take, bro. I hate that for K State.
- [82:18]
B
Yeah. Poor one out. They were great. Content though. So K State. Thanks for the content. Dylan Edwards, Avery Johnson, the fight. We appreciate it. One more thing that we should probably get rid of. I wanted to bring this up because I don't know if a lot of people saw this, but Keontes Lewis for Oklahoma got knocked out. He ran into the brick wall in the back end of the end. Yeah, he's all right. It says van, he's all right. That's confirmed.
- [82:43]
A
Well, I didn't say it was all right. I said, oh, I thought, no, no, no, no, no, no. I'm not breaking any news. I just. That was crazy. Yeah, for sure.
- [82:51]
B
Yeah, that was crazy. Yeah. I mean, he runs into the brick wall in the back end of. You know, a lot of people are saying, why is there no padding? So maybe that's another thing we can throw out there for Oklahoma. Get some padding behind the inside.
- [83:03]
C
Yeah, but that's. Yeah, I've seen a lot of people almost get hurt there doing that. Like people like slide coming off the field into that brick wall, man. I mean, this sounds broke. I know that. You know, obviously Oklahoma has a lot of money. I can do it. But it's just like, oh, man, every, every year, a few times a year, somebody almost hurts themselves on our brick wall around our fields. Like, seems like there's a way to.
- [83:24]
B
Handle that, especially if it's for aesthetics. You know what I mean? They're like, we like the way the brick looks. It's like, okay, well put some padding.
- [83:31]
C
On it, get some coverage. I'm sure AI can do that too. They can Make a nice.
- [83:38]
B
All right, we got this game. Let's go watch it. Miami just scores a touchdown. Seven, three parting shots. Van, I'll go to you first. Any parting shots on the day before we get out of here?
- [83:45]
A
Okay, So I. I wanna. I wanna say this in. I wanna approach this, what I'm about to say, understanding what we're doing here. We're having so much fun, guys. Like, I never knew that spending Saturdays, Saturdays, the day that you're supposed to have off with Tate and Joel and everybody who's worked so hard to make ring your tailgate would be so much fun. And we want you to guys have. We want you guys to have fun, and we want you guys to have fun with the games today. We want you guys to have fun with the games tomorrow. On Sunday, when you're watching the NFL. Somebody who won't be playing tomorrow when the NFL games come on. Is Kyron Lacey. He's a. He was a wide receiver for the LSU Tigers that took his life earlier this year. And even in saying that it. There's. The reports are that that's what happened. I just don't want to assume anything if you guys don't know what happened. Karen Lacey was hit with a litany of charges, and those charges were pretty bad. He was essentially accused, arrested and charged with negligent homicide and the death. Death of a war veteran, or should I say a military veteran in Louisiana. And the judgment was swift. It was swift on social media. It was swift by members of the news media. A lot of people had a lot of things to say when Kyle Lacey died. A lot of people, including myself, thought that it was maybe that he could not live with the shame of what he had done. It almost seemed, if I'm being completely honest, that his death was an admission of sorts, that the things that he had been accused of that had not been adjudicated in criminal court, that they were true, and that maybe they were eating the kid up. Someone who was beloved by his teammates, beloved by the LSU culture, beloved by all. I didn't know him. I didn't know his family, but he was a popular, lovable player. Maybe he just couldn't live with it, couldn't live with the burden. This past week, a video came out, and the video came out from a. From Karen's lawyer. And it proved pretty definitively to me that he simply did not do what he was accused of doing. I do not know the ins and outs of the case. I don't know the ins and outs of driving at a High speed or whatever. But I do know that what it was said that he did, from what I watched, as explained by his lawyer, it doesn't look possible that he did it. You can see it. It's on tape. And not only is that on tape, what else is on tape is body cam from a police officer seemingly coercing someone into accusing or placing blame on Kyren Lacey for something. You see it and you can hear it, obviously. It's been everywhere. Everyone's seen it. Man, I'm begging for y' all to treat these people like human beings. I'm begging. I'm begging you, man. I'm begging for y' all for treat these young men like human beings, man. I'm begging. I'm begging. It's just very difficult to talk about. It's very difficult to sit here and I can't even look at the camera. Because if you just were around and saw just the love, the focus, the sacrifice, the dedication, the perseverance, what it takes for these young men to get to a place where their lives are valuable to a society that doesn't value their lives. That. What if everything that you did that was deemed good was based upon how fast you ran, how high you jumped, or how far you could throw a ball? And then in one second, one second, someone goes, nah, you are who I thought you were. That's the thing. The thing is, and I'm not gonna drone on, the thing is, is that oftentimes as a black man, particularly a young black man, particularly a young black man from a certain situation, there is this belief that you don't have any worth and that you have to do something. You have to prove yourself in the eyes of the white gaze to prove your worth Earth. And then if something else happens, boom. He is who we really thought he was. Kyren Lacey did not. Did not take his life because he couldn't live with what he did. He took it because he couldn't live with what they were saying he did that. The stress and the weight of all of the things that came out, the fact that he wasn't given the opportunity to be a full person when he was accused of something or that something that he was accused of in the first place was thrust on him because of who he was, that he couldn't get around that. Now he's not here anymore. You guys think it's an extraordinary case. It's very familiar about people who cannot live with this albatross around their neck. I have not. I legitimately haven't slept well.
- [90:06]
C
Yeah. Man, that's. Man, Van, that's so well said. And I'm glad we made space for that because, yeah, this has been a great day of football. But, you know, that is a really sobering thing. And I think people, you know, my career just a little bit about it was that I got to cover crime or cops in a bunch of places. Dallas, Shreveport, Tampa, whatever. Atlanta, I've covered in a lot of places. And the one thing that I can say without inflaming a lot of people is saying that this is why we don't convict people based on police reports. You know what I mean? That's why you are allegedly presumed innocent until proven guilty, and you're supposed to have your day in court. And people are theoretically, like, sometimes. I mean, something can be so obvious is that. Or it can seem as obvious as that. Well, we can pretty much reasonably guess as to this person's doubt, guilt or innocence. But none of us knew anything. All we were reading were news accounts of police reports, and we drew a lot of conclusions about who Kyron Lacey was and what he had done. And the thing about. If you've had enough time to go over police reports and cover crime, you find out a lot of times that those reports are bullshit. You know what I mean? Like, the information of them is. And sometimes it's not because people are trying to fuck with somebody's life or whatever. It could just be. Often the police department, the police officer, or the sheriff's deputy shows up after the thing happened, and they got to ask people around, hey, what happened? Because I wasn't here. So. So that's why you have eyewitnesses. But it's just important to remember that if I can ever. If there's anything I could say, just about. This is a. Don't. You don't have to believe everything in a police report. You can wait. You don't have to make judgments about what is going on. And the last thing I'd say about that is, man, I have a son and a daughter, bro. And I was thinking about this today because I've thought about times in my life where I was like, man, but for the grace of God. But it. How do you explain to your kids that, like, man, sometimes life is just really unfair? Like, you will get. Like, life is going to hurt you. And I'm. There may not be anybody that can help you out of it, right? Like, there may not be a way out of a situation. Like, there's just sometimes for no. You know, for no reason at all, or sometimes you know, some really people sometimes just want to perpetrate evil against or hurt people for whatever reason. And how do you explain to them that, like, you know, a lot of times the way you get to the other side of life and you get to grow old and have whatever success is and experience love is by sheer luck. Like, sometimes some people, somebody you got lucky, nobody fucked with you, you know, Congratulations. And so I was just trying to think about, like, if Kyron Lacey had been my kid, like, what I would have said to him, you know, like, to keep him going on another day. And, you know, man, I just. Yeah, man, it just. That just sucks, man. And, you know, it's just one of those things about, you know, I hate to say it. I don't want to, you know, spoil everybody's fun, but sometimes being black in America, you like to think about that kind of stuff. Just, like, it kind of sucks that, you know, even if people think you have some sort of worth, that you're valuable to people, that it can just go from you in an instant.
- [93:28]
B
And those judgments hold so much weight and they happen without any knowledge. And, you know, Kyron Lacy deserve better. I mean, that's just really what it comes down to. And he is an example of so many that also deserved a whole lot better. And I think both of you guys made great points about that fact. And just reading this story, hearing his lawyer present the facts, and just to talk about their conversations that he had.
- [93:50]
C
Oh, man. For. Seriously, man.
- [93:52]
A
Jesus Christ.
- [93:53]
C
Yeah, man.
- [93:54]
B
He said, I got you. Yeah.
- [93:56]
A
Yeah.
- [93:56]
C
You are not that man's legacy. For real. Yep.
- [93:59]
A
Yeah.
- [94:00]
B
But, yeah, I think that's powerful stuff on the way out here. Appreciate you guys sharing your thoughts on that because there's some thoughts that need to be shared. And we appreciate everybody tuning in to ring or tailgate. We appreciate everybody enjoying college football. Miami, Florida State, go watch that game right now and enjoy it. And enjoy Todd McShay breaking it down later with mention. We will see you guys on Wednesday and we'll talk to you then. 21 or older in president, select states for Kansas and affiliation with Kansas Star Casino. Or 18 and older in President, D.C. kentucky or Wyoming. Gambling problem. Call 1-800-Gambler or visit visit fanduel.com rg call 1-888-789-7777 or visit ccpg.org chat in Connecticut or visit mdgamblinghelp.org in Maryland. Hope is here. Visit gamblinghelplinema.org or call 800-327-5050 for 247 support in Massachusetts or call 1-877-8-HOPE NY or text HOPE NY in New York.