Chambliss Returns, Praying on Michael Jordan’s Downfall, and Headlines of the Week

Summary

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Ringer Tailgate – Episode Summary

Podcast: Ringer Tailgate
Episode: "Chambliss Returns, Praying on Michael Jordan’s Downfall, and Headlines of the Week"
Date: February 18, 2026
Hosts: Van Lathan, Joel Anderson, Tate Frazier

“It’s your ultimate CFB hangout: smarter than your average fan forum, but way more fun than your coach’s press conference.”

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Overview

This lively episode covers the return of Trinidad Chambliss to college football, the continuing chaos and transformation of NCAA governance and athlete eligibility, notable headlines from college football and basketball, and a playful exploration of Michael Jordan’s “downfall” internet discourse. Through smart banter and unfiltered debate, Van, Joel, and Tate navigate the complex present and future of college sports.

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Main Topics & Key Insights

1. Joel's Media Rounds, Finebaum, & Athlete Tributes

00:13–07:18

• Joel is called out for showing up tired — he had been on Finebaum discussing Jesse Jackson’s passing.
• Joel shares an emotional story about his late friend and fellow ESPN reporter Ed Ashoff, emphasizing the fragility of life and the importance of camaraderie and taking photos with friends.

  "We should take a picture now, because you never know, one of us might not be here the next time." – Joel, 06:29

• Brief digression about Clay Travis and mutual sports media adversaries, blending personal experience with pointed humor.

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2. Mike Evans’ Legacy & Hall of Fame Debates

07:17–12:00

• Jason McIntyre’s claim that Mike Evans “hasn’t sniffed a Super Bowl” sparks incredulity and fact-checking, as Evans was a champ with Tom Brady.
• The crew debates Evans’ Hall of Fame credentials, referencing Pro Bowl stats, All-Pro honors, consecutive 1,000-yard seasons, and past Twitter arguments over his legacy.

  "He won the Super Bowl. I don't know what y’all talking about." – Van, 10:14

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3. Trinidad Chambliss Returns to Ole Miss: Eligibility & NCAA Controversy

12:20–33:35

• News: Ole Miss QB Trinidad Chambliss wins a court injunction to play a 6th season, pending NCAA appeal.
  • Recap: Chambliss missed most of 2022 with respiratory illness and was denied a medical redshirt, but a state judge ruled in his favor.
• Van’s take:

  “When the courts have an opportunity to decide, it seems like they are pro player. … The culture probably wants this.” —12:20

  • Emphasizes that it’s a “paint by numbers” extra year, increasingly common, and the public’s desire to see Chambliss play outweighs NCAA resistance.
• Joel’s systemic critique:

  “The NCAA is made up of the same members who challenge these rules. … When the rubber meets the road, they just want to win.” —14:21

  • He calls NCAA governance “a mess,” highlighting that member schools challenge their own collectively agreed-upon rules whenever it suits them.
• Discussion on professionalization:
  • NCAA’s tension between amateurism, education, and a lucrative, entertainment-driven product.
  • Racial undercurrents in compensation debates and public discomfort around Black athletes making money:

    “One of the biggest predictors in what you feel…is if you’re Black or if you’re white.” —Joel, 23:58

• Changing the model:
  • Speculates about commissioners, boards, and a “top 40” super-league; recognizes players as de facto professionals/mercenaries with only superficial connection to academics.

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4. QB Depth Chart Fallout: Deuce Knight & Transferring Trends

30:54–33:35

• With Chambliss’ return, freshman QB Deuce Knight will likely sit.
• Hosts agree it’s a familiar situation, not a crisis for Knight:

  “Deuce is only 19... he’s got this season to sit, learn the system, figure out whatever he wants to do, and then he’ll still have time.” – Van, 32:01

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5. Joe Judge’s Odd Testimony on Football vs. Fatherhood

33:30–36:37

• Former NFL coach Joe Judge’s testimony in support of Chambliss sparked controversy:

  “He tells his players to tell their pregnant partners during the season that the father has to play good football…He needs to be in another room, detached…he ain’t waking up for midnight feedings.” —34:35

• Reaction:
  • Joel: “They don’t care if whoever is a good father…They want these boys to ball.”
  • Panel lampoons the quote, detouring into a spirited debate over ice cream hierarchy (Haagen Dazs vs. Talenti).

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6. Belichick’s “New Trinidad Chambliss” and Catamount QB Hype

37:05–47:26

• Bill Belichick, now a college coach, names Western Carolina transfer Toron Dickens a starter after his record-setting FCS season.
• Crew describes Dickens as a “black Drew Brees”: hyper-accurate but undersized and not mobile (“the boy can't run”—Joel, 45:02).
• Regional banter about Appalachian “hillbillies,” including playful ribbing about Tate’s North Carolina roots and “Freak-a-Leek” being filmed in his town.

  “Tate, you a hillbilly?” – Van, 39:01

• Dickens’s potential for the North Carolina program is parsed, particularly his fit for Belichick’s system and whether FCS success will translate at a higher level.

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7. Internet Wants Michael Jordan to Fail? Viral Video Discourse

47:52–52:15

• Discussion of a recent viral video that led to speculation and meme-ing about Michael Jordan’s status and reputation.
• Takes:
  • “People really pray on Michael Jordan’s downfall every day.” —Tate, 47:55
  • Isaiah Thomas, Grant, Bill Cartwright, and Craig Hodges named as actual MJ haters.
• Debates about how race, cultural climate, and social media shape perceptions of Black celebrity, especially amid ongoing scandals (Epstein, NBA all-star controversies).
• Joel:

  “…it just was the wrong time to be touching little boys like that in public. See?” —50:46

  • Discussion kept light with signature irreverence while not ignoring serious context.

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8. Playoff Expansion, MAC Coach Exodus, and More Headlines

53:04–66:00

• 24-team CFP Playoff Model:
  • The Big Ten is circulating expansion beyond the new 12-team playoff.
  • Van:

    “Bulls are dead. … Just do it. Let them in. Let’s keep adding until we get to a number that fucks the sport up.” —54:30

• MAC Exodus:
  • NIU’s Thomas Hammock leaves for NFL, frustrated by poaching/NIL.
  • Joel points to racial dynamics in coaching security (“might fire your Black ass” —57:37), job volatility, and player transfers killing “mid-major” stability.
• Nostalgic tangent: Mac and college basketball legends (Gary Trent “Shaq of the MAC,” Demetri Hill “The Meat Hook,” and Big Country Reeves), tying the past to the present-day churn.
• Pac-12 Flex Week & Conference Realignment:
  • Pac-12 implements a “flex week,” an idea Billy previously floated, with Joe reluctant to fully apologize but acknowledging its adoption.
  • The hosts bemoan the death of traditional conferences and the weirdness of new geographic alignments.

    “I’m sorry, man. … The Mountain West used to be the conference… Pac-12… was a marquee conference with its own culture…” – Van, 72:04

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9. Loose Ends: Shoutouts, LA stories, and Running Gags

66:00– end

• Van shares a story about Jay Glazer’s kindness to TMZ staff, reflecting on Hollywood interactions.
• Playful escalation about Joel’s alleged “perceived slights” from minor celebrities and willingness (or not) to box Tom Segura.
• Cedric “Big Nasty” Williamson, Nolan Richardson, and faded college stars get nostalgic appreciation.
• More Hillbilly vs. city-raised banter.
• Offseason, the show is self-aware about its looseness and friendship-first vibes, closing with a toast to Billy’s “flex week” legacy in the new Pac-12.

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Notable Quotes and Memorable Moments

• “Every time you become Joel Muhammad X…” – Van teases Joel about recurring race-conscious rants. (56:19)
• “Just do it. Let them in. Let’s keep adding until we get to a number that fucks the sport up…” – Van on playoff expansion. (54:30)
• “He tells his players to tell their pregnant partners during the season that the father has to play good football…” – (recounting Joe Judge testimony, 34:35)
• “People really pray on Michael Jordan’s downfall every day.” – Tate (47:55)
• “I don’t like the way, I don’t like how there's no loyalty in the game anymore… just gonna keep watching.” – Joel on fandom, change, and hypocrisy. (22:12)
• "Take a picture now, because you never know, one of us might not be here…” – Joel on Ed Ashoff, on loss and friendship. (06:29)
• “The thing about going to the NBA and coming back, that's fucking ridiculous.” – Van on eligibility and re-professionalization. (25:57)

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• 00:13 – Show open, Joel’s Finebaum story, tribute to Ed Ashoff
• 07:17 – Mike Evans’ Super Bowl/HOF debate
• 12:20 – Trinidad Chambliss eligibility saga and NCAA critique
• 23:28 – Racial dynamics in athlete compensation/college sports governance
• 33:30 – Joe Judge’s testimony, “football vs. fatherhood” soundbite
• 37:05 – Belichick, QB Teron Dickens, Western Carolina, and FCS ascendance
• 47:52 – Michael Jordan viral video, “praying on downfall”
• 53:04 – Headlines: 24-team CFP, Mac coach Hammock, realignment
• 66:00 – Shoutouts, Jay Glazer story, Tom Segura boxing dare
• 72:04 – Pac-12 flex week, interactive coach concept, nostalgia for old conferences

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Tone, Style, and Group Dynamic

• Tone is smart, profane, and deeply colloquial, with relentless roast-style banter.
• Racial issues are approached with candor and humor, true to the show’s ethos.
• Frequent self-referential asides (“Raise the roof! Ringer Tailgate!”), digressions, and revisiting old inside jokes.
• The show’s heart is in its chemistry—a genuine friendship and a willingness to debate, joke, and disagree in the open.

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Final Thoughts

This episode is quintessential Ringer Tailgate: an unpredictable blend of deep college football analysis, nostalgia, race/class commentary, comic tangents, and inside-baseball media takes. The hosts never shy from confrontation—whether about NCAA hypocrisy, the future of “amateur” sports, or the ever-shifting terrain of fandom and tradition.

Useful for listeners who want:

• Context on the NCAA’s crumbling grasp & what might replace it
• Honest, humorous takes on realignment and playoff expansion
• Up-to-date chats on the most meaningful (and ridiculous) headlines of the college football & basketball world
• A sense of how race, region, and money shape the college athlete’s world

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“It’s the offseason. We’re having a lot of fun here. Appreciate everybody tuning in once a week… and shout out to the Pac-12 for adopting Billy Gill's flex week model.” (87:55)

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Transcript

[A]

Foreign.

[B]

Welcome back to Ringer Tailgate, the Wednesday edition of the show. I'm your host, Tate Frazier. We got a very fun show, a very big decision. We'll get reactions on Trinidad Chambers. Sounds like we will have him back in college football. Also, did Bill Belichick find his very own Trinidad Chambers? We'll talk about that. We'll also do some headlines of the week. A lot happening in the world, but first and foremost, let's say what's up to our guys. Van Lathan in studio. What's up, Van?

[A]

What up, what up, what up, what up? Raise that rule, fella. Yeah, Tailgate's back.

[B]

Tailgate's back. We love it. We're raising the roof. Also, we got Joel Anderson in the TCU sweatshirt. Joel, how's it going, man?

[C]

I'm good, man. You know, I'm a little tired, but I'm gonna. I'm gonna soldier through. I got. I dressed up my water. I got some caffeine in here, so I think I'll be able to handle it.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

A time where you're ready to do the podcast where you're prepared and, like, you're excited. Like, is there a time?

[C]

Well, I mean, you know what it is? Sometimes you want to under promise and hopefully over deliver. And so I'm setting the expectation very early on. I'm just like, look, man, I had a long night. I was up all night, didn't sleep very much. I feel like I've been talking since I woke up. And, you know, I'm trying to get it together right now, but I think that, you know, eventually. Oh, Billy, come on, man. What are you doing here?

[B]

Billy's early. Billy, what are you doing?

[C]

Doing. Your segment is at the end of the show.

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

Yeah. Your segment is at the end of the show.

[B]

So you're the horse, Joel. What are you talking about?

[A]

You're the horse.

[C]

The horse.

[A]

You know.

[B]

You know what's going on here, Van. And I don't want to snitch on anyone here, but we're getting sloppy seconds, Joel, right now. Because Joel was on Fine Bomb a little while.

[C]

That's right.

[B]

So, like, he's already. He's already busted his college football load for the day, and he's just now just going through the motions with us, you know? Yeah. Father Joe, what was Fine Bomb talking about, by the way?

[C]

Yeah, man. He wanted to talk about Jesse Jackson, man. He. They reached out yesterday. Billy, who doesn't follow the news, thought that somehow that Paul Fine Bomb and his staff were clairvoyant and he knew that Jesse Jackson died a day before he actually did. Then I had to inform Billy. No, actually, Jesse Jackson died yesterday, not today. And so, yeah, they had me on to talk about. They wanted me to talk about him yesterday. And I was like, man, I can't do that. I'm writing. And so then they, they said, hey, can you come back on? I was like, yeah, sure. I come to do it today. Which is actually a real sad commentary on the availability of voices to talk about Jesse Jackson in college football, because they did not have to wait for me another day. Like, there really was no excuse.

[A]

They wanted you to come on there. You're one of the biggest voices in college football. They wanted you to.

[C]

No, I'm not. We saw the list. Billy shared the list of the biggest voices.

[A]

Got a little bit more work to do. Let me ask you this. Since you were on with Fine Bomb, did you take the opportunity to talk with him about his politics, which you've been really critical about?

[C]

No, I didn't. I mean, there was no. What was it called? That wasn't really. That's not. No, that's not.

[A]

That's called a bitch out right there. First of all, that's what that's called.

[C]

First of all, you've talked a lot.

[A]

You talked to his face at the end. You could have been like. And Jesse Jackson stood up for a lot of leftist values and progressive things, which, Paul, I gotta be honest with you, man. I know that you don't now. Boom. And then you could have had a little moment there with Paul, but you had a moment.

[B]

Well, could have gone viral. You could have made the list.

[C]

Here's the thing. I didn't call Fine bombs apparent politics, right? But he didn't. I didn't have a problem. Problem with him. I had a problem with. With him casting it as if, like, ESPN had done something wrong or was limiting him or whatever because of his politics. And I didn't like that he went on with Clay Travis. And if he were to ask me that and we were to talk about it, I would tell Paul that to his face. But Paul's a nice guy. I think the one thing I think about Paul is that he's willing to have the conversation. I would have the conversation with him. If you think. I don't think I bitched out. If there are people that could make that accusation, and I would say, fuck

[A]

you,

[B]

would you have. Cfb Reddit was tweeting about it that they were shocked you didn't say anything last time I checked. Would you have gone on with Clay to talk about Jesse Jackson?

[C]

Absolutely not.

[B]

Oh.

[C]

Oh, man. I just. I feel like I. I've always been waiting for opportunity to talk about. About this real quick. I used to have a colleague at Ashoff. I brought it up outside of the garage. Remember we were in la, and I was like, we should always take a picture as friends.

[A]

Because.

[C]

Because you just never know if you're gonna make it to the next level.

[B]

Joe, it still sticks already.

[A]

Yeah, I don't wanna.

[C]

You don't wanna talk about that?

[A]

No. Like, we can talk about it. But don't say what you said again. Cause it's so morbid, bro. Oh, okay.

[C]

So where are you? Okay, well, I gotta say, I gotta.

[B]

At least I got with me.

[C]

I gotta give people a background on who my boy, Ed Ashoff were. We were at ESPN together. We worked on the college football team. It was like three black guys, me, Ed and Myron Metcalfe. My boy, who is still there at espn, does college basketball. I'm sure Tate knows who he is. And so we had our little thread. We called the black actors. We all hung out together. I was going to go to his wedding, whatever. The healthiest motherfucker I ever met in my life. That's great. He was in shape, did everything right. He was 34 years old and looked like he was 24. Anyway, one in November of like, 2019, he hits me up, and me and Myon, he's like, man, I'm still sick. I don't know what's going on. Like, Joel, you told me you had pneumonia before. It just feel like this. I said, I don't know what that is, bro. And so he was, like, sick for, like, two weeks. And then finally me and Myron was like, but we got to check back on. And we had heard back on him. And then his fiance at the time, Katie, hit us back, and they're like, actually, Ed is an icu. He took a real turn for the worst. I don't know what's going on. Long story short, and I hate to say it, it makes me sad even thinking about it. I almost tear up. Ed passed, and it turned out that he had leukemia. Like some sort of rare, undiscovered form of leukemia that acted very rare, and it presented as kind of like pneumonia. And he passed on his birthday, his 35th birthday, which was, I think, Christmas Eve or Christmas Day. And I was thinking back to the last time I'd been in LA with Ed, and we had gone to brunch, had a great time, and we were walking up the hill, back to our cars, and I just. I want to say this. Ed looked beautiful. He was a very handsome man. He just looked really good. Now he was kind of glistening in the sun, and I was just like, I should take a picture with Ed right now. We don't have any. We only have, like, one picture together. And then I was like, man, I don't want to bother him, bro. I'm going to let it go. And then I never got another chance to take that picture with him because he passed. And so I told y' all when we were there in la, I was like, yo, we should take a picture now, because you never know, one of us might not be here the next time we get together, bro. And so you all took the picture reluctantly, but you did it. But anyway, just before you talk about that Ed Ashoff, nicest human I've ever known. Just a sweet human being. I would. I would just say he's just the nicest kid in the world. The only person that he did not like was Clay Travis. And Clay Travis earned it because he's asshole. Anyway.

[A]

Wow. There you go.

[C]

There you go.

[B]

There you go.

[C]

I nailed a landing.

[A]

You nailed.

[B]

Yeah, you did, you know, say, like, you really wrecked us when you told that story. We were all together. We took a picture. Glad we did. It was weird. Yeah, it was.

[C]

We.

[B]

Karma move.

[C]

I was trying to. Again. I'm always trying to create comradery, man. Y', all, this is. We're friends, fam. You know, I'm saying this is a team, right? I'm a big. I'm a big team guy. I feel like I've been in teams in my life. I like to create team chemistry.

[A]

Before we get into the show.

[C]

Yeah, we're going way on that now.

[A]

Just one thing. This is from Jason McIntyre, who is the co host of the Herd with Colin Cowherd, Mike Evans. Unbelievable career in Tampa. He's going to be motivated to chase a Super Bowl. Hasn't sniffed one in Tampa. Am I tripping?

[C]

Hasn't sniffed one. He won one.

[B]

He won one with Tom Brady.

[A]

Did he not? Am I tripping?

[B]

Yeah, yeah.

[C]

No, these. Tripping. Jason McIntyre's tripping.

[A]

Oh, this is why awful announcing put this up because.

[B]

Yeah, I mean, I guess Chris Godwin was the best receiver that year for Brady. Maybe that's. But still. I mean, that still would be arguable.

[A]

He won the Super Bowl.

[B]

Yeah. Yeah, he definitely won the Super Bowl.

[C]

Do y' all remember that? The earliest text interaction I ever had with Van was Us arguing about if Mike Evans would go to the hall of Fame.

[B]

Took it to Twitter. Van, you, like, fought the good fight. You went out.

[A]

Definitely.

[B]

I agree.

[C]

I agree with that. I think, Lee, very good results.

[A]

Do this again, okay?

[C]

We don't have to talk about it. We can move on.

[A]

So, so, so. Okay.

[B]

Created Texas A M as well.

[A]

Six time Pro bowl, two time All Pro, two time All Pro, super bowl champion. Touchdowns co leader. He has 108 receiving touchdowns, right?

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

Like two NFL records. Consecutive thousand yard receiving seasons to start a career. Consecutive thousand statistics.

[C]

Offhand like that. What happened?

[B]

The Internet. I think he has the notes.

[A]

I have the notes. Consecutive thousand yard receiving seasons. 11 tied with only Jerry Rice.

[C]

Can somebody go back to the top three? Can somebody go back into our three? I think it was with Bill, actually, when Bill used to text with me, let's go.

[A]

And I can't do it. I can't do it today, bro. Anyway, I can't do it.

[C]

But.

[A]

No, I'm saying I can't, Joel. Joe, Tate, please, bro, I have one

[C]

last thing to say about.

[B]

Okay, one last thing, Joel. Then we'll get into the show.

[C]

This is. This does me. No, it does me. No benefit to bring this up, but I'm doing it for the show. Okay.

[B]

Okay.

[C]

So my homeboy who listens to the show, my boy Broderick, man, he used to play basketball out at Wake Forest. Big dude, works at the Wasserman.

[B]

Shut up.

[C]

Big agent guy. Yeah. And he ran into Bill at a party out there and. For All Star Weekend. I don't know. Tate, did you go? Were you. You don't know this fight because you were in Vegas.

[B]

That's right. Yeah. I wasn't. I wasn't at parties.

[C]

I don't. I don't know. Was it the party you were at? Were you at a party with Bill? Nah.

[A]

Hell nah. Bill didn't go to that party. That party was some nigga shit.

[C]

Okay, you saying Bill couldn't fall through anyway.

[A]

One receive, one reception, 31 yards.

[C]

Yeah. Super bowl champion Mike Evans.

[A]

He won the Super Bowl. I don't know what the hell y' all talking about.

[B]

He only had one target, so he won. I mean, he was the number one receiver, but Godwin was the one that was kind of eating off him. Gronk and Godwin. All right, Joel, continue with the story. Broderick.

[C]

Oh, yes. So, Broderick, we are way deep into the show. We're not going to make our time. But anyway, Broderick comes back, he was like, yo, bro. Joel. I talked to your boss this weekend. I'm like, who are you. Are you talking about Mallory? Are you talking about Ben Glicksman? Who are you talking.

[B]

Van.

[C]

Van.

[B]

You get a lot of bosses, Billy.

[C]

I mean, Billy, you're technically my boss. Producer. Free us. Yeah, yeah. Jack, Connor, Nevins, anybody. And I'm just like. I'm like, who are you talking about? Who did you run into? And he's like, your boss says that you've got to move, that you're going to have to move to la. It's time for you to move to Los Angeles or something like that. And I was just like, classic Bill

[B]

move, by the way. Bill loves that.

[C]

Damn, bro, that hurts. I. It puts a lot of pressure on me. I am never going to talk up LA again when I come out there again, because that. That's where this all came from.

[B]

What's happening right now.

[C]

Okay, we can move on.

[A]

No clue.

[C]

Trinidad Shambless.

[B]

Let's get to it. One big reaction. Maybe Joel is going to have to move to la. We'll get a reaction for that someday, but let's get this reaction. Ole Miss quarterback, we talked about it a couple weeks ago. We were sad that he was not going to be playing college football. Apparently his team, they went to a state court judge and they have an injunction that has been issued and that is going to pave the. For Chambers to be eligible in 2026. Judge Robert Whitwell ruled that Chambers clearly met the criteria to receive a medical red shirt for a sixth season. So again, the NCAA could get involved here. They also are going to be under investigation from the NCAA due to Dabo Sweeney and Forelli, the whole situation there. So the NCAA will be involved at some point with Ole Miss. Maybe they, you know, go a two for one investigation. But for now, Trinidad Chambliss will be playing football for Ole Miss and. And it is official, he will be back for a sixth season. Van, I'll go to you first. How excited are you? Are you tempering expectations? Because there's still a chance he might not play. How do you feel about this?

[A]

Well, it's a big win for him and it looks like it puts him in a good position to have this work out in his favor. Be interesting to see how hard the NCAA fights this, like what level they're willing to go. They're going to appeal it and do it. How far they're willing, really willing to go to stop this. Because I think the college football culture and public probably wants this. They want to see him with Another year. And they want to see what Ole Miss can do with him and they want to see if he can, if he can go for that Heisman Trophy. You know, it's. I don't think anybody ever thought that he wouldn't get this. It seems like these players always win these. When the courts have an opportunity to decide, it seems like they are pro player. It works for me. I don't know that it says all that much. Trinidad Chambliss's situation isn't. He's not a. This is my eighth or ninth year in college. He didn't go to the NFL, went for Super Bowls, then come back to college. Like, Joel likes when players are able to do that. Yeah, he, he. None of that stuff is true with him. This is pretty much, when you look by it, look at it, this is a paint by numbers, I need an extra year situation. As far as we understand it, the players have been doing this for the last couple of seasons. So there's really not a lot to, to, to, to get your panties in a bunch about this. But it is still, I think the most interesting thing about it is that we get to see him actually play football for another year if he's successful. Yeah.

[B]

And the argument right was 2022, he had respiratory issues. He tried to get a medical red shirt. It was not granted and that's what they were arguing for. So they had to bring out the medical records. He was one downs back in 2022. So like the journey of Trinidad Chambers to go from Ferris State to now finishing, I think seventh or eighth in the Heisman voting this season. And you know, obviously a great story, great comeback story there and shout out to him for fighting his way through this. And Joe Judge, we'll get to Joe Judge in a second. But Joe, I'm going to get your thoughts on Jamba's coming back to college football.

[C]

I mean, I think the NCAA and obviously Ole Miss fans, college football fans all across the country should want Trinidad to play. Like he's going to make, you know, four or five million dollars probably. But the, the issue is he's putting a lot at risk. He could. He's playing for a different head coach, a different offensive coordinator. There's the natural turnover and roster. Like LSU took a lot of ole misses, good players. They have a tougher schedule this year. They at Oklahoma, at Texas, at Vandy, at Florida. I mean, they play LSU to open the season. Like a lot could go wrong for Trinidad Chambliss this year. And so I think college football should Be fortunate that he wants to come back instead of go out in a weak draft class and where he would probably be the third rated prospect, maybe second. I haven't done my Joel Bigboard yet, but this case is an example of why the NCAA is probably on borrowed time. As the governing body for major college athletics, the principles of the organization always run up against the competitive desires of its members. Because don't forget the NCAA is not just some random group of executives in Indianapolis making up rules. The NCAA is made up of the same members who challenge these rules. So for instance, there's, I have a list of people here that are on The NCAA Division 1 Academics and Eligibility Committee roster. They have administrators from the University of Oklahoma, the University of Nebraska, the University of Washington, Purdue, Boston College and the University of Mississippi, among many others. So these schools don't want to be governed by the rules that they agree to every academic year because when the rubber meets the road, they just want to win. They just like, well, look, we're going to do everything we can, even if it's fine judge in a favorable venue to get these guys to play. So look, man, the eligibility rules are a complete mess. It just seems like they're going to have to start over at some point. And I doubt very seriously that when they start over that it'll be called the NCAA that's doing it.

[A]

What will be the structure? What makes it the most sense?

[C]

You got to ask them. I mean, they got, maybe they hire a commissioner and a board and a board that the commissioner responds to made up of people from around, you know, I mean, really, they only want 40 schools and whatever the new, you know, realignment is going to be. So make it up for those people. But because, I mean, it's just it right now they're, they're fighting their own rules that they agree to every year, but the reason they do it is because they want to win, naturally. I mean, Joey Aguilar is waiting on word for his. He's waiting on an appeal to play his eighth season of college football. Most people would be like, that's ridiculous. But Tennessee's going to fight it. But Tennessee is also part of the problem.

[A]

So yeah, so this is the issue as far as I can see it. So in the NFL, in the NBA, in hockey, which I love, one of the biggest sports and one of the biggest fans of hockey ever, the goal is clear. This is a money making endeavor. Everything comes back to that. Even efforts to make the competition pure to make sure people aren't cheating at the game. Fair, even efforts to control salary. All of that stuff comes back to, you know, the bottom line. Competitiveness and competitive purity allows the fan to believe that the game that they are watching is fair. And that is something that creates a lot of connection between the fan and the sport, whatever. It is all to drive bread money into the pockets of the owners so that you can get a big TV rights deal and split it up. The ncaa, college athletics as a whole hasn't fully made that switch, and I don't know if they can. They haven't been able to make the philosophical switch to, we are in this for the money. It's difficult to do that when the kids or the young men or young women aren't exactly professional athletes when they're 18 or 19 years old. some point they're just out of high school. Sometimes they're just out of high school. You still have to consider development and education and how their fucking brains are developing, all of that stuff. So you can't be as directly cutthroat about what this is actually about. So that kind of muddies the water a little bit of how direct you can be with dollars and cents and setting the rules and who you let in and who you keep out. Because it's still school, it's still college, and it's looked at in a different way. I'm wondering at some point if the NCAA or whatever new organization comes about, if they'll have the nuts to be like, you know what this really is? This is about bread. And every university president is actually an owner and every univers. And that's the way we're going to do it. Because in the situation where the owners in the NBA or in the NFL, their word matters more. You don't have to go around and choose who you're going to pick and who you're going to put in anything. The guys who fucking own the teams. Those are the opinions that matters. We're still having questions right now in college football about whose opinion matters because there's so many different voices and so

[B]

many different judges to go to if you want to change the outcome, right? I mean, you can go to your local judges. We saw it with, we talked about college basketball, right? All these temporary restraining orders. And Alabama plays a guy from the G League, Charles Medioco, for like three weeks and then gets rescinded. And now the NCAA finally wins a court case against him. Now he can play. Now we're talking about eligibility. And also the NCAA owns the NCAA tournament in basketball, they don't own these championships in college football. So that also creates a situation where like a lot of what they say it's just kind of like rolls over and the conferences have way more power in football. And what happens when the conferences decide, hey, we're going to create a new member institution or organization and like joel said, the 40 teams and programs, we want to be a part of it, go and do that. And that's what Herb Street's basically been pitching, right? Because he kind of knows what's happening in the inner workings of the situation. So the ncaa, they're just getting sued to oblivion and until some other new member institution gets created, yeah, they're just

[C]

going to have to create their own system is Van Sa. But they're reluctant to do that because they got to pay lip service to the idea that this is amateurism and that this has anything to do with school, which it doesn't. I mean, bro, I mean, I don't even, I don't even have a problem with the Carson Beck thing, like take all your classes online. I know that that's how education works now, but it's like the idea that that guy really has anything to do with the University of Miami other than play football for it is ridiculous. Like, most of these guys are just, they're mercenaries, amateurs in name only, but they're basically professionals going from school to school trying to figure out where they're going to get the best deal.

[A]

I know. So what, so what changes if we just, if we do what we say, if the NCAA or whatever organization comes, if they do what we're saying for them to do and just acknowledge that we're in a professional sport now, what changes?

[C]

I don't think anything. I think people think they'll be mad or they'll come up with reasons to be mad just like they do now. Man, college sports have totally changed, man. I don't like the way, I don't like how there's no loyalty in the game anymore. I'm just gonna keep watching it and help. The college football set ratings records this year and everything else. And the sport is as popular as it's ever been. It's the second most popular sport in the country, but. But I'm just gonna be mad about it because I don't like the fact these 17, 18 year old young black men are making millions of dollars and they get to go to school wherever they want. I don't like it. And so just complain about it and then, you know, they'll change the system, move into whatever the new Thing is. And they'll accept it, just like they did when Rutgers started playing in the Big Ten and when UCLA played in the Big Ten and they formed all these other ridiculous conferences. They'll. They'll. They'll shut up and they'll enjoy it every fall Saturday, just like this fucking supposed to. Because it's football and it's fun.

[B]

And one constant in life and in college sports has changed. Everything has changed. I mean, look at, look at what the Southern Conference used to be back in the 1960s, you know what I mean? It's like. And look what the ACC turned like, all this stuff has changed so much over time anyway. So, I mean, like, you're right, Joel. It's going to be.

[C]

College football is always evolving. I was a Southwest Conference football fan growing up. There hasn't been a Southwest conference in 35 years now. You know what I mean?

[A]

The only thing I'll say is this. First of all, I think, you know, we, we either on the edges of it, on the podcast, but I think the. Let me ask Joel straight up. You think the fact that these athletes are young black men is a huge calculus in this.

[C]

I think it's always why there's this push and pull over whether or not they should get paid or get their deserve part of the revenue, that.

[B]

That's the quiet part. They don't want to say it's the quiet part.

[C]

And even if people don't know that that's what it is, they may, they may not consciously know that that's what they're objecting to, but subconsciously it is. And there's been plenty of data, plenty of surveys that show that the. One of the biggest predictors in the way what you feel about if college athletes should get paid is if you're black or if you're white. Black college football fans, they don't mind seeing these boys get paid. For white college football fans like the Duke, they don't, you know, saying they don't want to see him get paid. I didn't want to just talk about Tate being a white for some reason.

[B]

I just, I thought you were talking about Duke University. I was like, that's a good point, Joel.

[C]

Yes, true.

[B]

So.

[A]

So I guess, I guess with that framework, what we're basically saying is, okay, you know what? Overall, the conversation around athlete salaries has a lot. There's a racial component there, right? Like $100 million to this. Whatever, whatever. And in college, maybe it's a little bit. It seems to be a little bit more intimate and pronounced because There might be more of a connection to a lot of people, to these different schools. Let me ask you this, though, seriously. There are structural changes and real changes that happen once you professionalize these games to the degrees that they're being professionalized right now. One of them is the thing we continue to see in college basketball where you have guys that are professionals that come back. Right. Another thing is people doing everything that they can to stay in college for like six, seven, eight, nine years.

[C]

That's great.

[A]

I actually don't think that it is.

[B]

Okay, T.J. finley.

[A]

I actually don't think that it is staying in college. To me, I could almost understand your argument for that. Hey, if you could stay in college as long as you wanted to and make $4 million a year to stay in college and do that whole deal, who wouldn't want to do that? Right?

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

The thing about going to the NBA and coming back, that's fucking ridiculous.

[B]

It's done now, though. They won the case against Betty Ako. That's done.

[A]

Right. So that would be the only thing. You know, I. I guess I do see. I see people's point in this. All change is hard. This change is fundamental. Right?

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

This isn't just change with, you know, you're an animal and you run a little bit faster. I could argue that this is that wolf going to the beach and then like turning into a whale. Like, this is like Darwinism, you know? You know that the whales come from wolves. Did you know this?

[C]

Not at all. I didn't know. I didn't know what else. Wolves come from whales.

[A]

No, whales come from wolves.

[B]

The aliens. I don't know if you saw this too. Like a meteor. Like they found like all the particles of like, human existence and like a meteor and they're saying, like, maybe we are the aliens that came to Earth.

[C]

We could be.

[B]

Yeah, yeah.

[A]

So apparently there was this. I don't know, apparently there was this like, wolf like creature.

[B]

So Obama was right.

[A]

There are aliens that continued to go to the water. And he went to the water over and over and over again. And then he started hanging out in the water and then he developed like a blowhole. And then you start swimming around and before you know it, he was like, I don't want to be on the land anymore. I am now a whale.

[B]

That is what, the Galapagos.

[C]

That sounds like the story of Jakob or something. I don't know.

[A]

Jakub. So I'm just saying this. This change is a little fundamental. This is not. This is like a new sport.

[B]

Right.

[C]

Is it. I mean, they're going to play football. They're going to have LSU and North Carolina and tcu.

[B]

They just need to. They need to be able to separate the programs, the athletic programs, from the academic instit, with the licensing of the academic institutions to the programs. Right. I mean, that's really what the new thing will look like. And also a cba, there has to be a collective bargaining agreement with the players for it to make sense. And like, who's going to do that?

[A]

You guys, you have a cba, you have all this. There's going to be a day coming up where school's going to be in session and the LSU players are going to be on strike. Right, Okay, I know. I'm just saying this is a lot. This is a lot for people. This is.

[B]

What if they don't go to school

[A]

or they don't go to school, they

[B]

have the option to go to school for like a 40 year period, and in that time they can go get their, you know, their degree and for the time they represent the university which is licensing its name, image and likeness to the program. You know what I mean? It's gonna, it's gonna be a lot

[C]

of the reason all this ridiculousness has happened is because the NCAA and their member institute don't formalize all this. They don't have any eligibility rules that make any sense. So that's why it differs person to person. If they standardize their eligibility rules and treated this a little bit more like the professional enterprise it is, y' all wouldn't have these problems, but you're racist like, Van. You don't want to see the brothers get paid.

[A]

Hey, I will say this just quickly, like, not having an LSU football season, anything that disrupts this is the thing. I'm the regular traditional college football season. Good old boy. Van.

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

Anything that's too disruptive to the college football tradition and understanding that, I know it's going to be very, very hard for me to get into it because this was always the pure part. The, the NFL and the NBA and all of that stuff. You understand all the pitfalls that come along with professionalism and all of that stuff. You get it. Professional sports, it's. Understands the same thing at your job, but college sports felt. It felt pure, it felt different. And now it is basically just the same. You know, it's the same. It's the same product, it's the same structure, it's the same everything. So not saying it was pure, I'm saying it felt pure. I think A lot of people are having problems waking up and smelling the coffee.

[C]

Feel what I'm saying, little dog? I mean, I guess. I mean, here's. This is Van. Well, I guess I'm a Tiger then.

[A]

I guess I'm tiger. I guess I'm a. I guess I'm a tiger.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

I mean, yeah, it could have been. It could have been fixed so many times or at least addressed, and instead they let it get so far down the rabbit hole that now we. We can't even see daylight anymore. And that's the problem with the whole thing. But back to Trinidad Chambliss. A couple more things I wanted to hit here. One, Deuce KN was brought and apparently promised to be the starter for Ole Miss. And he said that he is excited about Trinidad Chambers getting this injunction to be able to play. Joel, you're nodding your head. Do you believe that? Do you think Deuce Knight actually is happy?

[C]

I mean, I could. I mean, it. It does kind of suck. Cause he didn't really get a chance to play much last year. But anybody can look at like Dante Moore or Arch Manning, you know, the guys that are still going to be considered top draft prospects in the future, they sit a little bit. It's a year or two. That's how it always used to be, I don't think. I mean, it's one thing to sit behind Trinidad Chambers. It's another to sit behind. I guess if Austin Simmons came back this year, then I'd be like, wow,

[B]

he's going to Missouri, right?

[C]

Yeah, yeah, right. He's not there anymore. Yeah. So. But you know what I'm saying? So, like, Deuce McKnight. Deuce Knight had to have no. Yeah. I don't know why I want to call him Deuce McKnight.

[B]

Hey, shout out to Joe McKnight. Little shout out there.

[C]

Shout out to Deuce McAllister. The. The thing is, though, is that, like, I don't know who his people are. I'm sure they're capable. They got him to a new school, got money. But if you didn't consider the prospect that Trinidad Chambers was going to come back, you. They would have had to been stupid. So obviously they had to have known this was a potential and they're going to be cool with it. I mean, I don't know. I mean, that would. Seems like that would work for me. I mean, ain't like Garrett Nussmeier played a bunch, right? Van, he waited a couple years too, right?

[A]

He waited a bunch of years. Dude's only 19, so that's a good thing for Deuce. Deuce won't turn 20 until December of 2026. So Deuce is only 19. He's got this season to sit, learn the system, figure out whatever he wants to do, and then he'll still have a little bit more time in his development to go play somewhere else or to take over the reins at Ole Miss. So the good part of it is he's not a player that, that's coming in, that was coming in for that one year and thought that this was going to be their shot to put some tape together to maybe get to the NFL or get a big nil deal either this year or down the line. He's a young quarterback that still has a lot of time. So if it does end up that he has to play behind Trinidad, it's not the worst thing in the world.

[C]

He'll get a chance to play, too, presumably because you know how all college programs are. They're going to play, you know, about four teams that they should be able to beat, you know, anyway. So he'll get some, he'll get some burn, he'll get some time behind.

[A]

You don't play too much if you're him now, right? If you're, if this QB is, is, is getting a bunch of snaps, he might be able to, you know what I mean, take the year and use the red shirt.

[B]

I think it's four games, so, yeah, he gets.

[C]

But did Deuce red shirt this year? Did he get a red shirt this year? Did he play in enough games to. For that year to count? It doesn't matter because he'll petition and be able to.

[B]

I don't think he played in enough games. I think he only started too young, so maybe he already used his red shirt.

[A]

He might have already done it. Yeah. Yeah, he only played in two this year.

[B]

I said it was the Deuce nightmare, but I think he's going to be all right. And like you said, the age part of it factors into it. The last thing I wanted to hit on the Chambla situation, Joe Judge, former NFL head coach, he had, he testified here and he pointed out that three or four college quarterbacks with one year as a starter in major college football were, you know, ones that ended up with lucrative second contracts, basically saying that Chambers needed to come back to help him maximize his, you know, profitability at the next level. And he also had a very strange quote where he said that he tells his players to tell their pregnant partners during the season that the father has to play good Football, he said, quote, he needs to be in another room, detached. He ain't waking up for midnight feedings in quote. Now, he has come out and sort of said that. It was taken out of context, but Lane Kiffin, you on the court stand. Joe, with like, the hand in the face, like, what are you talking about? Joel, your thoughts on. On Joe Judge's comments? That. That was very strange for him to say that.

[C]

No offense to North Carolina, but he seem. He seems like the kind of guy that used to work for Bill Belichick.

[A]

Man. That's crazy.

[B]

Yeah, it's a very Belichickian.

[C]

I mean, you know, take.

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

I mean, also, I mean, it's just. I mean, I mean, again, this is all the farce of amateurism and that they're making better men. Any of that stuff. They don't care about none of that shit, man. They want these boys to ball and like, he don't care if. He doesn't care if whoever is a good father or not, because that's never going to affect Joe Judge. The only way they would affect him is if it affected his players play in some way. And so it's easy to see why he says that. Usually most people are smart enough to not say that in public. Like, usually you would just give some lip service to, well, we want our young men to be good fathers and everything else. And then you'd lie and behind their backs you'd be like, look, man, you better get your ass on another bed and how your girl take that baby to a grandmother or something. But you. Like, he. He was dumb enough to think that he could say that in public and that it would sound that it. That it would explain something and it would.

[B]

He thought he was helping chambers his case.

[C]

Yeah, yeah. What he actually explained was like, yeah, I mean, these dudes don't give a. About these dudes as men, basically.

[A]

Well, as fathers, legitimately, as dads. Yeah. But look, here's the deal. Like, you know, is there something to be said? Like, for example, when Trinidad. When TJ Finley came on here and said he was playing again, he's playing for his kids, right?

[C]

Yeah, man.

[A]

So if you playing for your kids, is there a time where you might need to say stiff arm? Cause I gotta watch this film. Cause you know what I'm saying, if these kids want to eat Haagen Dazs, Right. If they want a Haagen Dazs trip.

[C]

Haagen Dazs.

[A]

Yeah. Cause it could be the thrifty ice cream, right. That daddy could provide Or I could provide to you the Haagen Dazs, the

[B]

dolechi, the high level.

[A]

The high level ice cream is Haagen

[C]

Dazs, the high level ice cream now?

[A]

I think it is.

[C]

Really? I thought it didn't. I didn't think it still met that standard. I thought like, talenti was like the big one.

[A]

Oh, oh.

[B]

To see.

[A]

I don't fuck with the talenti like that because I don't eat like gelato and all of that dumb ass shit.

[B]

Yeah, I feel like that's gelato. Yeah.

[A]

Do you like, do you like, like gelato?

[C]

Yeah, I love gelato.

[B]

I like gelato.

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

Y' all like gelato?

[B]

I mean, not, not domestically. I like gelato like, you know, Italy,

[C]

man, You know, bro, if you're going out on a. You're having a nice night on a town with your lady, a male friend,

[B]

a little bit lighter.

[C]

Yeah, you go get something, you say, hey, we gonna walk up and down the street, let's get a gelato and you have one.

[B]

Speaking of Chambers, one big question. Another big news in college football. This was nice for Bill, but you mentioned Bill Belichick. Did Bill Belichick find his next Trinidad Chambliss, Western Carolina transfer to Ron Dickens, remember, set the NCAA record, 46 consecutive passes completed against Wofford. He was 53 for 56 in the game. He is apparently going to be the starter for Bill Belichick next year. Joel, you look a little disgusted. You're not buying the hype on Tehran?

[C]

Oh, no, I like to run. Well, what do you think of Toronto? That's going to be a quarterback.

[B]

I'm a big fan. I mean, I got some, you know, cat amounts in my life. They were, they were fired up about it, man.

[C]

Yeah. That school. How do you pronounce? It's in Chloe. North Carolina. Is that what it's called? Western Miss Carolina is in Kalohi. Is that what it's called?

[B]

It's not quite right, but you're good.

[C]

You could help me. How you say, oh, the name of the school is Western Carolina, but it's.

[B]

Yeah, yeah, the Western Carolina Catamounts.

[C]

Yeah, it's in. It's in. It's in like, it's kind of. That's Appalachia, right?

[B]

Appalachian.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

Appalachian Mountains.

[C]

Yeah. Okay.

[A]

Are you. Are you technically a hillbilly?

[C]

Who?

[A]

You.

[B]

Why?

[A]

Because, wait a second. In North Carolina, aren't they in this? They hillbilly. They're hillbillies there, right? In the state. North Carolina.

[C]

Right.

[A]

The hillbillies Right.

[B]

I mean, yeah, in the mountains.

[A]

Wait, hold on. Is J.D.

[C]

vance from that part of the world?

[B]

No, he's from Kentucky.

[C]

Yeah, but those areas kind of are closer in touching than you think.

[B]

Tennessee, North Carolina, right there on the Appalachian Mountains.

[C]

See it kind of close.

[B]

West Virginia.

[C]

You know who went to west Western Carolina? Greg Bovino. David Sedaris.

[A]

Okay, so listen.

[B]

Yeah, Macy ot Bay people.

[A]

It's hillbillies in North Carolina, of course.

[B]

Koe. By the way, color we.

[A]

So, Tate, you a hillbilly?

[B]

I'm not from the mountains.

[A]

I know, but, but, but, but hold on. Why Tate? This is racist.

[C]

The Catamount.

[B]

Have you ever read the fact that you read the book Cold Mountain?

[A]

That Tate is. No, stop trying to change the subject to talk about movies and all of that type of Appalachian mountains. So, like, you're trying to change the subject from the fact that you have something. You clearly have something against hillbillies.

[B]

Like, clearly I don't have anything against.

[C]

Oh, you don't want to be identified.

[A]

You don't want to be identified as like a hillbilly.

[C]

That's why he don't want Georgia.

[B]

If I was from the mountains, I would. I would honestly accept the, you know, the moniker, but I'm not from the mountains, so I can't, you know, I would accept it if I was from there.

[A]

What is.

[C]

What is the black version of being from the mountains? Is it from being from the country as it being from the hood? What is. What's that like? What is that? Because, you know, white people's like, oh, yeah, I grew up, you know, my family's from Appalachia or whatever. Like, what's the black version of that? Is that like.

[A]

Well, it is, because. Did you read Outliers?

[C]

Kind of, sort of.

[A]

So you don't give a. About Gladwell. You just.

[C]

Sorry. I saw him once at a. At a coffee shop I was at in Palo Alto. But that's.

[A]

Oh, fantastic. Tate doesn't want hillbilly stolen.

[B]

Yeah, I don't want the hillbilly.

[C]

Oh, that's right.

[A]

So. So there was a part in Outliers where he's talking about the fact. He's talking about honor culture. Oh, pretty sure this Allies might be a different book.

[C]

Is this about the Philza McCoys?

[A]

Like that honor culture thing that exists where if you stare at somebody too long, they like, what's up? And they're already ready. When I was reading the book, I was like, I know those guys. I know the guys that he's talking about to where you know, you don't look at me like. Don't look at me like you want it type of situations, right? Like, I know that. So I think that the Hillbillies and the Hood brothers, I think they the same.

[C]

I think they're the same.

[A]

I think it's the same thing. I think it's the Hillbillies and the Hood brothers, and I think it's the same.

[B]

Yeah, we're all a lot more alike

[C]

than it can read like that. Because that's the Jason Williams, remember the former point guard from Florida and Sacramento Kings. He's from West Virginia, you know, right up there. He played with Randy Mosson in high school. But, like, if you didn't know him, you would think, oh, he spent a lot of time around the brothers, who are from inner city or whatever. But no, he's just a country hillbilly motherfucker, man.

[A]

So where are you from, Tate?

[B]

Henderson, North Carolina. There's Hendersonville, which is in the mountains. That's where people want me to be from, which is a very nice town. That's where you can't get two trees

[C]

up in Hendersonville like that.

[B]

That's. Hendersonville is where Jim Lampley is from, by the way. HBO boxing.

[A]

Interesting state, because I'm looking at it right now, and it says that the people from Hendersonville, they are hillbillies. These are your enemies. These are the people you do not.

[B]

They're not my enemies.

[A]

You don't want to be. Hey, bro, it's okay.

[C]

I'm just tripping.

[A]

You don't want to be one of them.

[C]

I'm just tripping to Taters from a town that's two thirds black. Man, this is crazy. I mean, it explains a lot. But his town is. Henderson is 65% black. It's crazy.

[B]

Not the hillbillies.

[A]

Not the hillbillies. The other side. Yeah, that's why Tate don't want to be one of them. Tay was walking around with a cigarette in his ear.

[C]

I mean, remember we talked about this? Well, he couldn't take his lunch pill. He couldn't take a lunch pail to school.

[B]

You remember. You remember Petey Pablo's freak? A leak? The video?

[C]

Yeah, of course.

[B]

They shot that in Henderson. Yeah.

[A]

What

[B]

freak?

[A]

He was just like. He was just shouting out the names of Chick, Tamika, Alicia, Sandra Cassandra. Yeah, you know Sandra. Tate knows Tate. You know Sandra, you know, from around the way, man. Boy, I gotta say one thing about freakily Freakily dropped. It's the Baxter came out in that. I was like, what the hell Is that. It's like, yo, man, I gotta get out of Baton Rouge. We got. He's like. I was like, I gotta see. I gotta see what else is out there, man.

[C]

I was like, yo, wow.

[A]

What the hell?

[C]

Yeah, man.

[A]

That was.

[C]

Because this comes out in that like I don't think it was a. It's not an uncut video, but it was bet uncut adjacent.

[A]

I'm about to put that bitch on right now.

[C]

Yeah, man.

[B]

I mean he shot it all over North Carolina, but he shot it in Flint Hill, some of it, which is in my hometown. So that was a.

[C]

That's crazy.

[B]

Wow.

[C]

That's crazy. 52 year old Petey Pablo, man, I feel like I saw him on the Internet recently doing so.

[A]

So the interesting thing about this qb.

[C]

Yeah,

[A]

he is freakishly accurate. Yeah, he's kind of a black Drew Brees in that mold. Freakishly accurate. A little diminutive, like smaller guy, but is always on time and delivers the ball with a great deal of accuracy. So you would think that like for a coach like Belichick, who really wants a quarterback that's not going to take a lot of chances to make a lot of plays, is going to make, take the plays that are there and let the defense do his job. If he can come and like kind of be that point guard type of QB for North Carolina, we might finally get to see if Belichick's coaching style works in college. Because last year it was just too much dysfunction along the offensive side of the ball to really be able to make that determination, you know?

[C]

Yeah, I saw, I watched a little bit of clips of the boy, Teron Dickens, man, and yeah, he's really, he's really small. Like, he's like defensive backside. He'd be small for a defensive back. Okay, so he's not. But he surprisingly can throw over the middle of the field more than you expect. Calm feet. It kind of reminded me of Cam Ward and that he has a really calm feet. He's very calm in the pocket. Very good touch. The boy can't run. It was kind of surprised. I'm like, man, maybe this is why he ended up at Western Carolina. First he only ran for 371 yards three years there.

[A]

The pocket passer.

[C]

Yeah. 2.3 yards per carry average. So he's not. I know. The thing is. The thing. What's going to be funny when he plays the first couple games this year. Well, you know, the thing about Toront Dickens, he's a. He's a dual threat out of the pocket. They're gonna be like, oh no, actually cannot run. I said, I guarantee that's gonna happen the first couple of games and then they're gonna be like, oh yeah, that guy actually can't run. He's just freakishly accurate. Yeah. So yeah, I'm interested to see what, what they can do with him, man.

[B]

He also grew up in Billy's backyard. He set the Miami Dade county all time passer.

[C]

He's a Northwester, man. I wonder if he played for Teddy Bridgewater when Teddy Bridgewater was a coach there.

[B]

Yeah, maybe so.

[C]

But yeah, so he, you know who, you know, he, he's got the TCU defense, first game of the season out there in Dublin, you know what I'm saying? We could be there if Van ticket

[B]

tickets are on sale. I was asked Lombardi's like, you're going to be there. You guys tickets. We could get tickets.

[C]

We could go, yeah, I'm not going

[A]

way out to Dublin for going Dickens.

[C]

What? You saw the game winning play once but have to replay it three times on the way back to the hotel because some moments don't end at the buzzer.

[A]

Life's a trip.

[C]

Make the most of it at Best Western. Book direct and [e-mail]

[B]

they also play Miami this year. It feels like Dickens might have a little, you know, he's upset he didn't get, didn't get recruited in his backyard. You know, little redemption game.

[A]

These numbers last year were crazy. We're talking about 74% passing, 3,500 yards, 32 touchdowns. How many picks you guys want to guess?

[B]

I'm going to go three.

[C]

I'm going to say one.

[A]

Two interceptions.

[B]

There we go.

[A]

38 touchdowns, two picks.

[C]

Crazy.

[A]

He is putting the ball where it

[C]

needs to be and it's not like he's playing it like one of those overwhelming FCS schools like Northwest North Dakota State where they've got a lot more talent than everybody. Like West Western Carolina went 7 and 5 and I was looking up them scores. He had to, they had to put some points up, man, to win those games.

[B]

He's also throwing it like 50 times a game.

[C]

His leading rusher had 420 yards last year like for the whole season. And they playing like, you know that conference that has like Mercer, Furman and Wofford. So these are like pretty good. So he thrived. He did really, really well in a situation where it was seems like it was mostly on him to produce. We'll just see if it translates at that, at that next level. But I mean, yeah, I mean, got

[B]

Damond June coming back and running back for North Carolina. Got Jordan ship coming back from North Carolina.

[A]

All right.

[C]

Yeah, coming back.

[A]

Hold on, hold on for a second. Jordan ship is back.

[C]

That.

[A]

That changes everything. No disrespect to that young man.

[B]

I mean, good player, former four star. He's the Jordan that we care about, not Jordan. All right, last one.

[A]

Do you guys care about Michael Jordan? Because there was some video, man, that was.

[B]

That was such a, like, weird, like, reaction from people in general. Like, people really prey on Michael Jordan's downfall every day. That's all I know. Like, people really want Michael Jordan every day.

[C]

People, downfall.

[B]

I'm just. I'm just like, man who prays on Michael Jordan's downfall?

[C]

Too many comments.

[B]

Yeah, Isaiah Thomas, definitely.

[A]

That's the one. Isaiah Thomas and probably like, clutch. Like, that's. That's the only people.

[C]

That's Grant and Bill Cartwright didn't like him neither. Oh, for real?

[B]

Jordan likes him?

[C]

Yeah, they didn't like him.

[A]

So.

[B]

So you know, Bill Cartwright likes Jordan.

[A]

So you feel like this, you know,

[B]

he doesn't like Jordan. Craig Hodges.

[C]

Craig Hodges.

[A]

Oh, yeah, because Craig Hodges got over. Do you feel like. You feel like Jordan is in the crosshairs?

[B]

What do you mean? After this, after the video.

[A]

What you're saying is that people are out to get Jordan because they saw this video?

[B]

Look, it's Duke propaganda at the highest level. Adam Silver.

[C]

And you think they're trying to talk to the Epstein files? Basically, yeah.

[B]

I'm sure you'll see it in a few weeks. They'll try. Try to. Try to get my man for trying to sell sneakers. You know what I mean? Try to get him all, like, caught up in that every single time. Michael Jordan. And what does he do? Just be philanthropic, be in the community, help people out. Nobody talks about that. They just were like, here's this video. We. We messed with AI and made it look weirder.

[C]

It did look weird, though. I mean, you know, you gotta. You got a kid had ice that

[B]

got dumped down trying to pull his shirt to get the ice out. You know what I mean?

[C]

You gotta. You. I mean, come on. You know, when we first saw that video, it was like, what is.

[B]

That's what I'm talking about. The pray on the downfall. Like, no, no one's giving the benefit.

[C]

Yeah, I don't know. I just. I wasn't praying no downfall. I was just like. I know. You know what I'm saying?

[B]

But then.

[C]

But it turns out it was just

[A]

ice this is the deal.

[B]

LeBron praise on his downfall. I'm just adding to the list.

[A]

So this is the deal. I think that if that video had come out maybe like, I don't know, like two years ago, people all look at Michael Jordan, y like, whatever the grab ass or whatever's going on and all that stuff, whatever was happening.

[B]

The dad, Tyler Reddick, who won the Daytona 500, was like, it's weird, people's reaction, you know?

[A]

Right.

[B]

Thank you.

[C]

Okay.

[A]

But I think with everything else, the climate that we're in right now, that was the wrong time for the grab ass video to come out and all that stuff.

[B]

It's an extrapolation of Epstein. Yeah.

[C]

Like, yeah, we live in a world where it appears that there is like this large international sex traffic. Like there's. This is a whole group of pedophile freaks who run the world.

[B]

Right.

[C]

And then that's the week. You kind of did a weird thing with the little boy. You know, I just. Again, I think Van is right. If it had happened two years ago, four years ago, whatever, maybe we'd be like, oh, Mike's just messing around. But it just was the wrong time to be touching little boys like that in public. See?

[B]

Praying on his downfall.

[C]

It went down. I would pray for his downfall. It was just. I will. I was not a huge Jordan fan.

[B]

I mean, you're an Elijah.

[A]

That was the wrong, Wrong, wrong way that the video was. Because even I was like, what the is going on? I posted that on Twitter. Then I took it down because I was like, the video, come on, it's Jordan, man. It's. Nothing's going on. It's like, whatever. But it did. It was like the wrong time. And also with everything that was coming out from the NBA All Star game.

[C]

Oh, man.

[A]

Like, there was a triple whammy of things that hit, like, within hours of one another.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

First of all, I know we're not going to talk about it, but the LeBron press conference, when he was asked about Israel, Okay. Then the KDF files dropped, and then Michael Jordan video, I was like, yo, what the fuck is happening right now? Yeah, like, what the fuck is. Is the. Is the league trying to draw eyes and all of that stuff? Like, what the fuck?

[C]

The thing I'll say about LeBron, we don't have to talk about it to talk about it. I kind of thought, like, his brain turned off halfway through the que. Through his answer. I thought he was just kind of like, he didn't know how to end the sentence. He's like, yeah, I've heard great things. Hope to go visit someday. But I thought. I thought he had stopped thinking about that sentence by the time that part of it came out.

[B]

See, not praying on his downfall.

[C]

Not praying. I'm not praying on mics, man. You know who's old boy? The. The guy that looks like, oh, shit, man. Wright Thompson wrote that.

[A]

Thompson, great. I like Wright Thompson.

[C]

Wright is a great, great writer. One of our very best. Wrote this great profile on Michael Jordan after the Last Dance. And it talked about him growing up in Wilmington and his family and like the work ethic he inherited and blah, blah, blah. You know, not trying to talk. Try not to draw attention to yourself by speaking out. Just keeping your head down. It really did explain a lot. I was like, you know what? Got a point. Got. But that doesn't mean that, you know, he shouldn't have weighed in between Harvey Gantt versus Jesse Helms. But, you know, whatever. That's fine. I mean, but I understand it a little bit better now.

[B]

Shout out to Wright Thompson. Good piece. Always writes good pieces. But yeah, can we talk? I got just. I wanted to do this. Just some headlines of the week, you know, a lot of. Not a lot happening in College Sports. Big Ten is obviously circulating a 2014 CFP model that it includes the elimination of conference championship games and also an additional weekend of on campus CFP games. This is from Pete Thamel, who reported this. Does this sound like a good idea or should we just enjoy the 12 team model we have right now? And obviously Notre Dame, a little bit different situation for them. They're included if they're in the top 12 in the rankings, which is a little bit strange. But 24 teams, Van, is that too many when you hear that it, bro,

[A]

like, it's like, what?

[C]

Who?

[A]

You know, just put, just put them in. Just do it. Just like we're eventually. We're careening towards like the March Madness type of situation.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

The question is, can it exist the same way in football that it does in basketball? The answer is no. Basketball is a different sport. It's very compacted. The energy is high for every single game. I do think that there's a point to a point that you get to with NCAA football where with this playoff you're going to get diminishing returns the more teams that you have in it. I don't know what that number of games is. I'm not. I'm really not sure of it. But 24, I don't think is it. I don't think that 24 what is the. The. The FCS playoff? How many teams are in with the FCF playoff?

[C]

I think 16.

[B]

16.

[A]

So, you know, this is a little bit expanded from that. So I don't think that at this point, the Bulls are dead. They're all dead. They've already died. It's over. No one gives a fuck. Okay? So the, like, the Bulls are dead if they're not tied to playoffs. We got the fucking Pop Tart Bowl, Cheez it bowl, and the goddamn Mayo bowl that are, like, holding things down. Those are the big bowls right now. So, like, just. Just do it. Let them in. Let's. Let's keep adding until we get to a number that fucks the sport up, and then we'll take some away. Right? That is the way that we must do it, because we don't know. It was fine with four. That was awesome. They went. They moved it. Now we're at 12. 12 really worked this year. So what do I know?

[B]

I like 12. I feel like we should stay at 12. But this, of course, is leaked on purpose. The Big Ten created this idea. They've shared it internally, and then they leaked it to Thamil. So, I mean, we're moving in that direction. They're one of the two power conferences, really, at this. So we're getting there. Another story, another headline. Northern Illinois head coach Thomas Hammock famously beat Marcus Freeman. He has accepted a job to become the next running backs coach and senior offensive assistant for the Seattle Seahawks, the Super bowl champs. He's expected to become the NFL's highest paid running back coach and chose Seattle amid multiple NFL opportunities. So this is a guy we thought would move up in college football. Instead, he does the. The Halfley, right, Was that Jeff Halfley was at Boston College and goes to the Green Bay packers. Now the Dolphins head coach. So Thomas Hamm moves up to the NFL. Is this bad for college football, Joel?

[C]

I mean, I don't think so. It's bad for the Mac. That's a really tough job. But I also think you got to look at the context. And again, I'm sorry if I have to bring race up into this, guys. I don't. Just don't get mad at me, okay?

[A]

But you just. I just want to let you know that, like, every time you become Joel Muhammad X. Yeah, like you, I bounce

[C]

between Rick James and Joel Muhammad X.

[A]

Like, you're trying to catch up. You're trying to catch these other. These podcasts that you were talking about.

[C]

Oh, yeah.

[A]

They don't have no content like this.

[C]

I'm fucking it up. You right? All right, we are not, we are never gonna get Josh Pate doing this. The bussin with the boys. We not gonna get to be doing this. But just hold, just. Please, people, just listen to me for a second and then just think about the reality of the situation. Thomas Hammack. It's already very hard to win in the Mac right now. Like every year, all the big schools come and take your best players. As soon as they make third team all Mac and that team gets named and put out there, teams start calling them and trying to get them in the portal. So it's really hard to win there. Thomas Hammack knows, man, I don't know how many more years I got here in Northern Illinois. Like, they might fire me. He went five and seven this year. They might have fired his black ass in a year or two. This way he knows I don't have to be at this hard ass job. Basically a dead end job.

[A]

When you say, hold on, when a white guy is jogging on the line, you. They might fire him. But whenever it's a black guy, they might fire this black.

[C]

It's a great. I'm talking brother to brother to Thomas Hammock, man. I'm just letting him know. I was like, hey bro, I might fire your black ass.

[B]

He also saved Marcus Freeman's career at Notre Dame.

[C]

That's right.

[B]

I mean, he beat them and then basically he said that he gave him some sort of tip and they ended up making the national championship.

[C]

And man, Thomas Hammock was complaining midseason about what was going on. Like, I remember there was a press conference. The only reason people would talk about Thomas Hammock and his football team is if they beat Notre Dame, which is never happening again, or if he was complaining about NIL and the changing dynamics of college football. And he was just like, yeah, man, people are already reaching out to my kids. So you do all the hard work identifying a talent that could help you at Northern Illinois, you might get them one year and then somebody offers them 150, $200,000 to go play it, you know, Illinois or whatever. So I can understand why he probably was like, enough of this shit. Let me go to the NFL, play for a guy that I've already worked for and you can figure it out. I mean, again, he also knew it ain't like he was ever going to get a better job in fbs, you know what I mean? Like he wasn't. I don't.

[B]

I would have thought he would.

[C]

I feel like he kind of kept out.

[A]

You think you. You don't think he had a chance to maybe build off of that big time victory where he put his name out there, you know, people were talking about him and stuff like that to maybe go grab something else.

[C]

That year he was 8 and 5. Finished 8 and 5, finished 6th in the Mac and had to go back to Northern Illinois. So if you're going to cap it, because that was his 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6. That was his sixth year at Northern Illinois. So if it was going to happen, it would have happened that year. Like, when his name was in the news, he'd beat Notre Dame, and then all of a sudden, you know, he would have been gone by now, but he had to come back. And when he came back, they went 3, 9 this year, and they finished tied for 11th in Northern Illinois. I just wonder if he was like, I probably capped out here. I better get out before they make me leave.

[A]

Tate is supposed to be a college basketball expert.

[C]

Yeah, he is.

[A]

Tate, what player was known as the Shaq of the Mac?

[C]

Oh, man.

[B]

The shack of the Mac.

[C]

I remember this. Oh, yeah.

[B]

See, this is a little bit before my time, but I mean, shout out to Mac time.

[A]

What? Like, what, What? What? What player was known as the shack of the Mac?

[C]

I know it.

[A]

I know the shack of the Mac.

[B]

JoJo.

[C]

I want to say it. Can I say it? Trent, say, yeah, say it. Gary. Trent.

[A]

Gary Trent. The shack of the Max.

[B]

See, I know. Gary Trent, Jr. Oh, man, we had

[A]

great college players back in the day. Who was the guy from Florida that had that move called the Meat Hook?

[C]

Oh, Demetrius Hill.

[A]

Yeah, he was like.

[C]

He.

[A]

They. Florida got to the national championship game. It was like, 90s.

[C]

Oh, 2000. I think it was 2000. Yeah, yeah, 2000.

[A]

The meat hook was 2000.

[C]

Yeah, bro. That's it. Because that's.

[A]

I think.

[C]

Is that the year that they. They lost the Michigan State? That was the one year. The Meat Hook is his name, actually. Demetrius Hill.

[A]

It's Demetri hill. That was 2000. Damn, that's great. Hell, no. That wasn't no 2000. Y' all crazy.

[C]

Yeah, I knew that.

[A]

No way. Like, he was at 4. It wasn't. He was at Florida 92.

[B]

He was before that. He was before the Mike Miller.

[A]

Yeah, he was before.

[C]

Oh, he was even before then.

[A]

Oh, there's no way that could have been two.

[C]

Oh, damn.

[A]

I was in middle school watching that. The Meat Hook, man, he's.

[C]

Oh, man.

[A]

Tay did like, the fact that I brought up Jack of the Mac. And then he didn't know it. Look at him.

[C]

But, I mean, you have to be old.

[A]

I. I have.

[C]

I don't know.

[B]

That was before. That was before me. But like I said, Gary Trent Jr.

[C]

When I told y' all on this show.

[A]

Nah, he was. He was. You was a baby when he was the shack of the Mac. You don't even know.

[C]

Yeah, that's what I'm saying. Remember when I told y' all that two or three years can make a big difference in, like, your cultural frame of reference, like, if you're a little bit older than the people on the panel. Difference. Yeah. So that's why you don't know about the meat hood.

[B]

That was. That. That was the me. I mean, honestly, like, when Gary Trent Jr. Was coming up, everybody kept talking about Gary Trent, but I, you know, I didn't know the shack in the.

[C]

Man. Do you know who looked good?

[A]

Do you know. Do you know who Bryant Big Country Reeves is?

[B]

Yeah, I know. Yeah, I know. Big Country.

[C]

Yeah, I told. Did I tell you my big country story?

[B]

He's a hillbilly.

[C]

Yeah, he's the hillbilly. One time I was in the Memphis airport, and I was walking past, you know, one of the little stores in there, we could, like the, you know, Hudson and Bryant. Reeves walks in. You know what I'm saying? He walks into there, and then a second later, like, two seconds later, Otis Thorpe walks in there. And they didn't even acknowledge each other. They didn't even. Like. I was like, bro, this dude 73. This dude 16. You guys have to know each other. And they didn't even know each other and walked out. Yeah, I know. Maybe they had beef. I don't know.

[A]

Boy, Big Country.

[C]

Remember who Big Nasty was? Who was Big Nasty?

[A]

Big Nasty.

[B]

There's been a lot of Big Nasty.

[A]

Harrington?

[C]

Nah, close. Good.

[B]

Corus Williamson.

[A]

Williamson from Arkansas.

[C]

Williamsonville, Arkansas.

[B]

Nolan Richardson.

[C]

Todd Day.

[A]

Hey, I saw. I saw Corliss Williamson on the sidelines.

[C]

He's like.

[A]

He's a coach.

[C]

Yes. The reason I brought up, because I was like, man, Big Nasty. Coaching.

[A]

He's a coach. He's a coach. I saw him on the sideline talking to someone. Corliss Williamson, the Big Nasty. Scotty Thurman hired an agent, and then he. Then he didn't get drafted, and then they. Over Scotty Thurman. Scotty Thurman used to be my mother, man. Those. Those are good teams.

[C]

Yeah, he probably played over in Italy or some shit like that for a long time, huh?

[A]

What else we Got before we go. Hey, bro. Hey, Big Country Reeves wasn't as bad as I thought he was.

[C]

He's all right.

[A]

I'm looking at his. I'm looking at his career look. 16 and 7 and 97, 98, 60. Before. Before he started getting injured up. He was. He was that decent little player right there.

[C]

Yeah. No, man, he wasn't bad. I just think, you know the name. I don't know. I mean, you know, he. He went to the Grizzlies when they were in Memphis. Memphis. You know what I'm saying? So I guess people. Probably not.

[A]

Hoover, you mean?

[B]

Yeah, yeah. Vancouver. Mike Bibby. Vancouver.

[C]

Oh, that's right. Well, he was in the Memphis airport, though, that time.

[B]

Maybe he knew something.

[C]

Maybe he knew there was something. He might have been down there. Now, I was in the 2000s. He was. He was long gone, but he might

[A]

have been down there doing stuff with the Grizzlies organization.

[C]

That's right. There you go, man. Tape. What they gonna do about your boy Penny, man? He ain't gonna make it, is he? It's over.

[B]

I feel bad for Penny. I love Penny. I just, like, in the worst time of college basketball for him, like, I feel like if it was the old model, Penny would be crushing it. You know what I mean?

[C]

Yeah. It was inevitable that he was going to fail.

[A]

And he did play a little bit for Memphis. When they move.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

A little bit. He started the season on the injured list. He never played another game. He played two games with Memphis, and they were preseason games.

[C]

Damn.

[A]

So. So he. He. He. He announced his retirement. Shaq said he was the toughest m matchup he ever faced in his career.

[C]

That's. He just wants to disrespect David Robinson. That's. Which is it. Which is it, Elijah, what are you talking about? Shaq. Sha Be saying, bro. He really does. Scotty. Alex Dillard, Cory Beck, DWIGHT Stewart, Clint McDan. You remember Darnell Robinson, who played on that team?

[A]

Arkansas team.

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

Yep. The Arkansas team was filthy.

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

Filthy.

[C]

Nolan Richardson. You know what I'm saying?

[B]

Nolan Richardson. Yeah. The best. I love that Caliper. Is like, giving him, like, a new life.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

You know, he always gives him some love. That's cool.

[C]

I mean, the thing about Nolan Rich, he did. He dared them people to fire him, and they went ahead and did it.

[B]

The last. The last thing I was gonna hit. Van. No, big van on campus, right?

[A]

No, I have a Mardi Gras story, but I have to. I have to save it for higher learning. Louisiana is in More trouble than it's ever been.

[C]

What are you doing, man?

[B]

Shia LaBeouf. Is that why.

[A]

Don't.

[C]

Don't.

[A]

You can't. We can't say it.

[C]

Don't be coming on here and saying. And embargoing.

[A]

I have to save it for higher learning. I have to save it for higher learning. I have to. I have to. Louisiana is in major, major trouble, though. We've never been in this much trouble like.

[B]

We've never been in this. Tuesday was yesterday.

[A]

Yeah, it's tough.

[C]

Do you get a King K when it's this time of year?

[A]

I did. My mom's in town.

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

So I got the King cake. I got the King Cake. It's. It's. It's fucking fantastic. You know, Took mom out to Mother Wolf last night. Let me tell you something. My mom. My mom saw Bill Murray yesterday in real life. In real life.

[C]

Oh, shit.

[A]

Y'.

[B]

All.

[C]

At Bill's house.

[A]

I forget. Shut up. I forget that. I forget that not everybody lives in Los Angeles. So she cannot get over the fact that she saw Bill Murray at the Brentwood Country Mart, where, like, famous people

[C]

go, yeah,

[A]

well, she can't get over the fact that she saw him.

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

And that's funny to me. She's like, oh, we saw. We saw Bill Murray. We saw Bill Murray.

[C]

Oh, yeah. Well, I mean, it's a big deal, man.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

You know what I'm saying? Did she like the. The Life Aquatic? Was she a big fan of that movie?

[A]

Nah, that's not what she talking. She on that what about Bob type. All right, T, what else did you have? You said there was one other thing I saw that was interesting.

[C]

Oh, wait, hold on. Can I just take this one? You know what? Forget it. Yeah, go ahead. What's up, Tate?

[B]

Well, I mean, I was going to do the Pack 12 thing with Billy. I mean, they. They've accepted flex week.

[C]

Oh, yeah.

[A]

Oh, yo, Bill. Duke, you got to pop on.

[B]

Yeah, yeah. Come on here, man.

[A]

Is.

[C]

This is fair point, Duke.

[B]

You hated the idea.

[C]

We don't have to talk about that. We could talk about. No, no, no. They recognize Billy's idea.

[A]

Joe. Joe Duked you.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Okay.

[C]

We were. Our ideas weren't in. We weren't in opposition to each other.

[B]

You were disgusted by that.

[C]

I don't think it was gonna work. I mean, we don't know if it's gonna work yet. They're just adopting it. It. It doesn't know that anything is going to come of it. But do you think that they heard the show? Billy and took and stole your idea.

[B]

It's coincidental. Yeah, they probably did not. If I were to guess, like, season two, season three, tailgate, if I'd say for sure they heard it and they stole it. You know, season one, we all had

[C]

another for that, you know?

[B]

So, like, all it takes is one person in the PAC 12, which is kind of like not that many people these days to, like, an intern. Heard the podcast, saw the clip, and then just said it to his boss, and his boss is like, it's a pretty good idea in Texas state in.

[C]

In fact, 12. Now.

[B]

Pac 12 is wild. Yeah.

[C]

Yeah. So my homeboy went to Texas State. He graduated. My best friend, Matt Womble. Shout him out. Yeah, yeah.

[B]

Shout out to Matt Womble.

[C]

Anyway, so I wonder if Matt was listening to the podcast, told somebody in Texas State, and he was like, you should check out somebody. Look at that episode. And then, bam, they stole Billy's idea.

[B]

So just apologize then, Joe. I guess. Guess, right? Yeah.

[C]

I mean, we don't know if it makes any sense. And also, it's like a pool of four teams. Like, they may play Fresno State to help. I guess Fresno State is in this new PAC 12. I don't.

[B]

They are.

[C]

Boise.

[B]

Good job.

[C]

Yeah. So that's what they'll use to build

[B]

their resume to San Diego State as well. They could be in there.

[C]

They should be in there.

[A]

Joe, apologize to the Duke man.

[C]

Oh, no, man. I mean, got to everybody's attention.

[A]

You said. You said his idea was stupid. Dumb.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And you talked about.

[B]

You said it would never happen.

[A]

You said it would never happen. Happened. You did all kinds of stuff.

[C]

I was wrong about that. I was wrong about that. I was wrong about that. I still don't think.

[B]

Usually it means an apology.

[C]

I still don't think it's a good idea.

[B]

Be like your dad, Joel. Apologize.

[A]

Duke. Be like, Daddy Duke. Next time, throw a at the end of that. Like Duke. Next time. Next time, throw a at that.

[C]

That.

[A]

Be like your daddy. Apologize. Just.

[C]

Man, you look at Billy's face, man. Oh, my God.

[A]

Him up. Duke. The United states is up 10 in Sweden.

[C]

I don't know. Oh, wow, that's tough. That's tough. I don't. I mean, I'm. I'm. I'm happy.

[B]

Good for the Pac 12.

[C]

I brought it up. That's why I was like, damn, Billy, I'm proud that they stole your idea and that it had some purchase in the world. I still think it's a bad idea. There are a lot of things that get implemented in the world right now. Now that I'm like, I don't think that's a good idea, but I just got to live with it. This is one of them.

[A]

Yeah, the pack.

[B]

Kind of an apology. It's kind of backhand.

[C]

I don't think I feel the need to apologize, but I'm giving him his props on.

[A]

So no dis. No dis. No diss. And when I say no diss, this means it cannot be considered as a diss.

[C]

Oh, gosh.

[A]

Okay. It's impossible. You can't consider it as a diss. It can't be considered as a dis.

[C]

You don't get to make that decision. But just go ahead.

[A]

I'm saying no dis to the Pac12. The past 12 right now is Boise State, Fresno State, Colorado State, Gonzaga, San Diego State, Texas State, and Utah State.

[C]

Colorado State.

[A]

My God.

[B]

Washington State, Oregon State, Washington State or not Oregon.

[A]

I'm looking at it right now.

[B]

You're saying the new teams.

[C]

Right, Right, right.

[A]

The new ones right here. The new teams that are in, bro, this. This is.

[B]

I mean, Boise State's a win for that conference. Colorado State's a win.

[C]

They get the. What market is that? The Fort Collins market?

[B]

Yeah, Fort Collins. I mean, those are two good. I mean, Boise State for sure. I mean, Boise State and Gonzaga are two good ads. Like Gonzaga for basketball, Boise State for football.

[A]

Yeah, Gonzaga. Okay, bro, I'm sorry, man. I'm sorry, man. Nah, dog, this dog. Some of this is. Bro, I'm sorry, bro. Like. Like the Mountain West. Like, this is the thing.

[B]

They just took the Mountain West.

[A]

Yeah, I know. So, like, the Mountain West Conference used to be the conference. Those used to be, like, quirky games. I'm talking about my love for Bradley Van Pelt.

[C]

Yeah, Bradley Van Pelt.

[A]

This is what I'm talking about. The Mountain west used to be that. The Pac 12. I don't care what nobody says. The Pac 10, the Pac 12. A marquis football conference with his. His own culture and everything. Pretty boy quarterbacks, John Elway, the goddamn Tree. The band is on the field. Reggie Bush, like the K McNow. Whatever you want. Like, all of this. The Pac 12. This is the Pack 12, bro. This is the Pac 12. Texas State in that. I'm so.

[C]

I'm so.

[A]

I'm sorry, man. Yeah, that's. This is tough. Maybe they can make it work. Work. Maybe they can make it work.

[B]

You gotta blame la. I mean, UCLA and usc, they did this. They created this monster. They destroyed the Pack.

[C]

I don't think. You think Oregon and Washington are having a good time doing this. They don't want to be. I mean, they don't want to send their kids to play in Maryland on a Wednesday, man. You know, to play volleyball or some shit like that, that's annoying. That's horrible. But, yeah, I think the game that

[B]

they hate the most is Rutgers. I feel like they all, like, when they have to go to Rutgers, they're like, what are we doing?

[A]

Is this. This is.

[C]

This is whack as, man.

[A]

What other rules could they adopt that would help them besides the flex? What else should the PAC 12 do to, like, stand out from the SEC, the Big Ten, in the ACC?

[C]

That's a good.

[A]

Like, what else could they do?

[C]

Maybe they need to do something with, like, a gambling company. Like, real, like, you know what I'm saying? Like, have, like, real. Like the. What do they call those things? I don't, you know, I don't follow gambling. Shout out. Van fanduel. But what's the. What's the thing? What do you know? We prop. Prop bets. They should run prop bets on the screen during the game.

[B]

PAC 12 props.

[C]

12 pot props.

[B]

Someone's going to steal this idea.

[C]

Yeah, they should.

[A]

They should. The PAC 12 should let. They should do an interactive coach. So they should let the fans be like an interactive coach, right?

[B]

Like the controller. Like, it's like, it's a nominal controller

[A]

interactive coach that's actually the fans. So in a game, if the fans want to see, like, a flea flicker or if they want to put in, like, the fifth string back and see if he could get some carries, this

[C]

is disrespectful to PAC12.

[A]

They should. The PAC12 should have an interactive coach that's made up of the fans. Everybody gets it and then they vote and then they say, what do y' all want to see? Do y' all want to see? I don't know, the game manager. I mean, the manager of the team. Y' all want to see him, like, actually get a couple of carries at half back, like, interactive. This will. This will make you. Because think about it. If I had the chance to call a play in the game.

[C]

This is so disrespectful.

[A]

Like, interactive coach. Then I would watch Utah State versus Texas State because I'm not watching that game otherwise. Right?

[B]

We're going to talk about it.

[C]

We're going to watch.

[A]

I guess I watch that game.

[B]

I'm watching Wazoo play all these teams.

[C]

Yeah. Wazu, Oregon State.

[A]

Y' all like the idea? The interactive fan. The interactive coach.

[B]

I like that. I like the idea.

[A]

Every team interactive coach, they had a

[B]

league called fan controlled Football. Like in Vegas. Yeah.

[A]

Rach was a part of this.

[B]

Was she?

[A]

Rach, I think Rage.

[B]

Yeah. You know Rach, it should have been stars.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

Rachel, she was the sideline reporter for it.

[A]

No, I think she was a team owner.

[B]

Owner, yeah. Oh, wow.

[A]

Rachel was a part of this fan control Football.

[B]

She was part of disrespect. I thought she was, like, working in the media for it.

[C]

Wow.

[B]

No, Rachel, Austin Eckler and Drew Ski all owned the team together

[C]

this much. Is that this kind of. Y' all want me to move my family out there for. For this?

[B]

You can see Bill Murray.

[A]

Yeah, actually. Actually, it's better off that you don't come to la, because recently there was this like, gigantic human trafficking sweep that happened.

[C]

Okay, you know what? That is not okay. I have nothing to do with that.

[A]

It was like 10 brothels got shut down. So it's probably a good thing for you.

[B]

It's not a good time, Joel.

[A]

It's not a good time for you

[C]

to come out here because, I mean,

[A]

you know, your type of hobby, Joe,

[B]

you like Tim Robbins.

[C]

Let me check. I'm going to change the subject by telling. Telling you a story because this guy may hear it someday. So that same place, that brunch plat that I went to with my boy Ed Ashoff, RIP oh, man. I'm walking across the street, full circle here with my wife. Okay. And we're in the crosswalk. I can't. I wish I could remember the name of this place. Was it Millie's or something? It's like a vegan, a vegetarian or vegan brunch spot. It's great. Very good food. I love that place. Try to go every time I go.

[A]

Where's it at?

[C]

I don't know, dog. It was near a pizza. There's a pizza shop on. What's. On the other corner. I think it's. I think it's called Millie's. I think it's called Millie's, but I'm not sure.

[B]

I'm a.

[C]

Look, Millie's Brunch, Louisiana.

[B]

Brunch still exists.

[C]

You can sit. You can sit outside. Yeah, okay.

[A]

Oh, Millie's Cafe. Yeah, yeah. On Sunset.

[C]

Yeah, Millie's Cafe. That's it. Yeah, that's the place I go to when I try to when I get back there. So anyway, I had to park on the other side of the street.

[B]

Silver Lake. Shout out to you, Joel.

[A]

Silver Lake.

[C]

So I'm crossing the street with my wife, life. And I see Nelson George walking. I like Nelson in the middle. In the middle of the crosswalk. And I'm like, Mr. George. And he looks back at me, he's like, yeah. And he turns around, keeps on walking. I was like, God damn. I was like, you think? No, sir, George. Like, you ain't that famous, dog. He's very famous. But I was just like, you know who else did that to me?

[B]

That was crazy.

[C]

But I kind of got get it now.

[A]

Will Roden.

[C]

When I lived in. When I lived in Harlem, and I was walking back down to my apartment on St. Nicholas Place in 153rd, and he was walking forward, I guess he was going to the train station. And I was just like, Mr. Rhoden, I'm so. I'm so excited to see you. It's like, I'm a big fan of yours. And he said, yeah, all right. And he just kind of like. He gave me his card. And I emailed him a couple times, and he never responded.

[A]

Let me tell you something. I know we gotta go, but let me tell you something I've noticed about Joe.

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

No one.

[C]

No one wants to deal with me in public.

[A]

Takes a perceived slight. Nobody takes a perceived. Like Joe. No one. Joe. Every slight that has ever happened to

[C]

Joel, you know, Bomani says.

[A]

Remembers it in great detail.

[C]

Bomani says, same thing. He said, I can't let any shade slide.

[A]

It's tough.

[B]

Must be everyone but you, huh? Nothing.

[C]

Say it again, Billy. Go ahead. Nobody even talks about how I support our team because I was. I think I. I shout out, billy got the panther preserve at fiu. And I was excited for you, dog. And I shared with everybody for it.

[B]

That's not real, though.

[A]

It is real.

[C]

It is real. You got to talk about it.

[B]

It's not a real Panther. It's not a real Panther reserve.

[C]

There's not a bunch of people fans on here pumping up higher learning. You should pump up your side, too, since we on the show side. Well, okay.

[A]

This is my side. Okay.

[C]

Okay.

[B]

My bad,

[C]

my bad. I'm a faithful listener. Give your thought Warrior. I'm a thought warrior, but, yeah.

[A]

Hey, congratulations, Duke. For the. For the Whatever with that. I couldn't really understand what it was.

[C]

There you go.

[B]

Thank you.

[A]

Whatever.

[C]

Well put. Yeah.

[A]

Congratulations. You got the Panther reserve at fiu. Shout out to the Duke also. I gotta say something. Another shout out to the Duke. Duke is. They miss you over there at that old shop. A lot of people are talking about it, the changes that have happened and what Things are like now that they don't have the Duke anymore. So if you want to speak on it.

[B]

No, we're just happy to have you here, Billy.

[C]

Yeah, man, you know, whatever. I'm not gonna say it. This is fine. But I.

[B]

How many times you do that an episode? Like three or four.

[C]

Right. Well, you know, you're right. And I was. You know what is funny? You point that out and I can see that this flaw in myself because Van has done that thing twice a day. It's like I'm tell the story and I'm not going to tell it. I do it all the time. You're right. I. I'm realizing that's something that I do. I'm sorry.

[B]

You also like a call out at the end of the episodes. Last week, Tom Segura, this week, Nelson George.

[C]

I didn't call out Tom Segura.

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

Did you get on Bill Bellamy? What do we. What's the. What's the status of Bill Bellamy that

[B]

has been put out there? But I will say Tom Segura's people saw that and got got back to me on that situation.

[C]

They did not.

[B]

They 100.

[C]

Okay, what did they say? What did they say?

[B]

This isn't an on air thing. Do you have two lava lamps now

[C]

or were they mad? Were they. Were they mad about me?

[B]

Two lamps.

[C]

Hey. Oh, man.

[A]

Shout out to Tom Segura.

[C]

It could have been a big deal. I mean, nobody.

[A]

See, that's why I told you. I told you to stop around.

[C]

I mean, nothing happened. I just found out about it.

[B]

You found out about his popularity and

[A]

now you done fucked around and now you done woke up to sleeping dragon. And I'm letting you know right now. When Tom first came into Phil's to box feels.

[C]

Oh yeah, Philz. Okay. We didn't know that place.

[A]

Joe, if you want to come get some work in at Phil's, I would love to, man.

[B]

Let's all go out there.

[A]

When Tom first came into Philz to box, Tom was green. He didn't know much about it, but. But boy, did he learn soon. Tom is a decent boxer. So if you're talking that shit, I mean we ain't even pause pulling you.

[C]

This is ridiculous. This is ridiculous to escalate outside the

[A]

mothership because this was comedy type shit. Rogan, all the fucking rest of them. They might take turns whomping your motherfucking ass. I'm just letting you know that.

[C]

Okay, here's the thing. There's a couple things about that. 1, 2, 2, 7, y' all on some.

[B]

Yeah, you're arrested.

[C]

Y' all would just let that happen. Y' all wouldn't even support me. The second thing about it is that I'm 47 years old, bro. I'm not about to fight nobody, man.

[B]

Well, you know, Tom, he's close to your age.

[C]

I fell down on the ground a couple years ago, and it took my knee, like, three weeks to heal up, right?

[B]

46.

[C]

So.

[A]

46 is a year older than me.

[C]

If it was 18 versus 18 year old Tom Segura versus Joel Anderson, I would have handled him, bro. I'd handle anybody on this. 18 years old.

[B]

But what about 12 year old Joel?

[C]

That too. I was.

[B]

He'd run. Well, you could. You could have ran away.

[C]

Yeah, I could have done whatever I wanted. I mean, the fight. The fight would have ended how I wanted it to end at 12 years old, maybe 18 things, you know, whatever. But now 47. I don't even want to find out if I can fight my plan.

[B]

I think 47 could go 227.

[C]

It's to never fight it all the time.

[A]

We gonna take you, and we gonna take you and Tom. We gonna put y'. All.

[C]

No, we ain't doing like that.

[A]

And we gonna let. Just jabs.

[C]

Just jabs. No, I'm not doing that. No, Joe.

[B]

Joel.

[A]

Joel. If you turn down a fade with Thomas a girl, I mean, there's no

[C]

need for us in fade. We got.

[A]

No. We don't even have jabs, bro.

[B]

Was.

[C]

He didn't know who I was.

[B]

Yeah, you did.

[C]

You did not do the bear.

[B]

Yeah, you did.

[A]

You poked the bear. You did it. And

[C]

two bears in a cave, really?

[B]

They did reach out, and they didn't seem thrilled. I don't know if we're gonna get them on anymore. It was looking good.

[A]

Us up to Tom. Now.

[B]

Is it age? Is it age, Joel? Like, could you take a 56 year old?

[C]

Depends on who the 56 year old is.

[B]

Jay Glaze.

[C]

Glazer.

[A]

Jay Glazer.

[B]

No, Nelson. George.

[C]

Jay Glazer, man. He's like a. He's like a professional fight. Grapples and all the time. Yeah.

[A]

Hey, let me tell you, look, I don't know if I've ever told you so before. Before we said this like five times. Jay Glazer, good guy. Let's tell you why. Did I ever tell y' all to Jay Glazer TMZ story? I think I did.

[B]

He was nice at Fox when I saw him.

[C]

I don't think so. So.

[A]

So I was on Bedford with My camera working for TMZ at one time, and Jay Glazer came down and he, Jay Glazer was always great. I would see Jay Glazer with his son, right? And I, and, and so I will. And if I saw, for me, personally, personally, if I saw you with your kids, I would not shoot you. Like, if I saw, like, respect. Well, if I saw you with your kids, the other paps don't give a about that, right? The kid makes a better shot. But for me it was like, come on, man, if I saw it with your kids, I'm not gonna shoot you. So I go up to Jay Glazer because there was NFL news breaking and I'm like, I see that you're with your son. Is it possible that I could get a shot with you when you guys come out or something like that? Maybe because they were going to eat. He eats inside the restaurant, you come out and get a shot with you solo and stuff like that. He goes, yeah man, no problem, no problem. So then he gives me the shot. He calls back to tmz. He calls back to tmz. True story. He calls back to TMZ and he says, I just wanna let you know that one of your camera guys was courteous enough to not put my son on camera. And I really, really appreciated that. So when I walked into the office and I got pulled to the side and then. And Charles was like, van, I want to let you know what you did with Jay was awesome. Blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. I got big up and stuff like that. And so, and people that are famous, that used to work there, if you had a good interaction with them or something like that. Because obviously, you know, your blood sucking legion, your paparazzi and all that stuff like that, but they would, you would never get that type of feedback. And Jay Glazer did that. And I was like, what a great guy.

[C]

That's really nice.

[B]

Yeah, that is nice.

[C]

That's really nice. Yeah.

[B]

I mean, yeah, way to pay it forward.

[C]

I mean, that's really, that's, that's really cool. And, and also, I mean, man. So let me ask you a question then about your TMZ.

[B]

Did you have a hard out? Like 15?

[C]

It was 5:15. But so here's the thing. So you were like the, on the TMZ videos to be like, so Scotty, so what do you think about Michael Jordan? What do you think?

[B]

I mean, praying on his downfall, his

[C]

kids or whatever, man, what do you think about that? Like, were you asking those kind of questions behind the Camera.

[A]

So let me tell you what my. What, what, what my theory was here, okay? My. My deal with it. Always thought about the grand scheme of things. My deal with it was to always have fun.

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

Sometimes you couldn't because sometimes you'll see somebody and they were in the middle of a story. You had to ask about the story.

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

But my thought was never to make the website. It was always to, like, just make the show.

[C]

Okay.

[A]

Right. It was so. So it was like, like. But. Cause the new stuff makes the website. The fun stuff that you can make a TV package out of makes the show. So I would walk up to somebody and I'll ask John Tesh. Cause he makes all this. I would ask him a question about Round Ball Rock or something like that. My best one was with Blake Griffin during the lockout when I asked Blake Griffin to join my league basketball team. And so that was a funny clip. He laughed. It was always to get some kind of laughter or engagement out of celebrity that can be used on the television show are asking interesting questions. I never wanted to run up and go like, who you fucking? You know what I'm saying? Not that TMZ really did that. But that was my deal. And so I left there with a part of my reputation intact around the town. If you work for tmz, you work for tmz. There's nothing you can do to get away from that. But like, yeah, so that was my deal. I never wanted to be. Because the rest of the paps didn't give a fuck. It was very, very funny to watch them see somebody just draw a brother walking down the street, the street. And Gerald Butler goes, how many pictures you guys gonna take? One of the paps asks, answers back about 15,000. Just hold still and shut the up.

[C]

Oh, wow. Wow. You were using some real Hollywood language on us too, Paps. I had to pick it up.

[B]

Bill was obsessed with that TMZ show. Like when we were at the ringer and it first started, Bill was like, I want to make a show like this. And I remember I watched that show because I was like trying to figure out, like, what, what, like, you know, the segments, all sort of stuff. So I watch Van on that show quite a bit. Van.

[C]

Back in the day, a real change, a real change in. In life and culture is at my barber shop in the Bay. It used to be they had Sports center on all the time. You know what I'm saying? It used to be Sports center in there. By the last three, four years, it was TMZ live. They had that whole one all day on that TV in there, man, watching that.

[A]

So, yeah, I was one of the hosts, baby.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

Yeah. You were locked in every single time.

[C]

Time. Yeah.

[B]

Raise the roof.

[C]

All right.

[B]

Yeah. All right. There you have it. Ringer, tailgate. It's the offseason. We're having a lot of fun here. Appreciate everybody tuning in once a week. We are back. We are breaking down all things and shout out to the Pack 12 for adopting Billy Gill's flex week model. He deserved it even though Joel will not apologize for apologize.

[C]

But congratulations to Billy. That's speaks well, no apology at least

[B]

congratulations on the way out. Thanks everybody for tuning in the show and we will see you all next week.

[A]

Foreign.

[B]

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[A]

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