EA Sports 'CFB 27' Cover and HOF Ballots. Plus, Is the Sport in Danger?

Summary

Ringer Tailgate Podcast Summary

Episode: EA Sports 'CFB 27' Cover and HOF Ballots. Plus, Is the Sport in Danger?

Date: June 4, 2026
Hosts: Tate Frazier, Van Lathan, Joel Anderson

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Overview

This lively episode covers key college football and NBA crossover topics with the signature banter and deep-dive analysis characteristic of Ringer Tailgate. The crew discusses the NBA Finals, ethical questions around "tanking," the new EA Sports College Football 27 cover, the sustainability of modern college football amid NIL/transfer market changes, Hall of Fame ballots, and spicy takes on program feuds and pop culture.

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NBA Finals Preview and Tanking Ethics

Segment: 00:54–17:10

• NBA Finals Quick Takes:
  • Knicks vs. Spurs is the main matchup. Joel roots openly for the Knicks, citing their exciting fans and historical underdog status.
    • Quote (Joel): “Wouldn't you... I would love to be in New York if the Knicks win the championship.” [03:48]
  • Spurs’ history of “tanking” for stars like Tim Duncan, Wemby, and others generates debate.
    • Quote (Joel): “What's dishonorable basketball? Tanking. Tanking to get generational talents, you know…” [03:34]
    • Quote (Van): “This take about the tanking—I love this take as we're talking about the... I love this.” [04:15]
  • The guys reminisce about the Rockets and the challenge of beating “superteams”—the rivalry with the Warriors, the infamous missed threes, and Chris Paul’s injury heartbreak.
    • Quote (Joel): “If Chris Paul was healthy, we win that.” [07:05]
• Predictions:
  • All three vacillate, but by the end, both Van and Tate lean Knicks (Knicks in 6), Joel goes Knicks in 7, albeit admitting the Spurs are more talented.
    • Quote (Tate): “Nixon six. I like it.” [14:44]
    • Quote (Joel): “I'm just going to have some faith that they'll be able to come through in a real tight Game 7 in San Antonio, man.” [15:49]

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CFB Offseason & College Football Video Game Cover

Segment: 21:54–28:24

• When Does CFB Season Start for You?
  • Joel marks the true start with the arrival of preseason magazines (Athlon, Phil Steele) each July.
    • Quote (Joel): “When I get my preseason magazines... that's when I really get into it.” [22:14]
• Video Game Nostalgia
  • Joel hasn’t played video games since 2007 (“Madden” was the last one) but finds himself pulled back in by the group’s chatter about prep and roster learning.
    • Quote (Joel): “I have not played video Games since 2007. I remember the day I played my last video game almost 20 years ago.” [23:13]
• EA Sports College Football 27 Cover:
  • Deluxe edition features Kurt Signetti and multiple star QBs.
  • The group debates Signetti’s inclusion and personality.
    • Quote (Van): “He is the current king of college football. You have to put him on the cover.” [26:22]
    • Quote (Tate): “It feels a little out of character, though, for him.” [26:26]

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“Is College Football in Danger?” — NIL, Market, and Coaches’ Power

Segment: 28:24–45:51

• Kurt Signetti’s Dire Warning
  • Quote (Signetti, via Tate): “College football won't exist the way that we're going right now.” [28:24]
  • Joel points out the hypocrisy: the sport wasn’t “dangerous” when multi-million dollar coach buyouts were rampant, but now that players are compensated, the sky is falling.
    • Quote (Joel): “No, it’s just that now the players have a little bit more mobility and they have an opportunity to make somewhat close to what their value is…” [28:51]
  • Historical perspective: Ivy League once walked away from big-dollar football when it didn’t fit their model.
• Debate: Are Coaches More Important Than Players?
  • Van asserts coaches are the architects; Joel argues money now should go to players, as in pro sports.
    • Quote (Van): “The coaches bring a specific value in college football that they don’t have in every other sport. The coach... builds a program. A coach builds an identity.” [34:09]
    • Quote (Joel): “College football is pro football… The college coach... there’s probably going to be college programs in the future coming up with a general manager more important because that is a new position...” [39:38]
  • The discussion delves into academic eligibility, program continuity, and how “the game is changing”—with players, not coaches, becoming the main investment.
    • Quote (Joel): “I think we’re going to see that [shift], and I think that's why the coaches are panicked right now.” [37:48]
• Underlying Issues
  • The guys touch on “stewardship” and the elephant in the room: is the hand-wringing about losing control to (often non-white) athletes?
    • Quote (Van): “...there is a stewardship argument there that a lot of times rubs guys like myself the wrong way, as if the sport, if it’s in the hands of the athlete... is not as viable as if it’s in the hands of the oftentimes older white millionaire guy.” [44:12]

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Playoff Debates, Texas Tech vs. Texas Scheduling Drama

Segment: 61:15–67:06

• Story of the Week: Texas Tech’s Joey McGuire calls out Texas (and Sarkeesian) for dodging a game after Sark derided Tech’s “easy schedule.”
  • Joel’s rant highlights Texas’s overrated status: only four Big 12 titles since ‘96, a losing record vs. key rivals even when the deck was stacked in their favor.
    • Quote (Joel): “I'm fucking sick of Texas talking like it's Alabama... you were in the Big 12. You did. You had plenty of opportunities to do so.” [62:05]
    • Quote (Van): “If Texas don't decide that they want to play Texas Tech, then Texas is pussy.” [65:42]
  • Van and Tate agree: Texas can’t run their mouth and dodge the challenge.

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Hall of Fame Ballot: Leach, RG3, Cam Newton & More

Segment: 70:34–75:41

• This Year’s College Football Hall of Fame Ballot
  • Headliners: Mike Leach (“air raid” innovator), Cam Newton, RG3, and more.
  • Joel details how the HOF eligibility bar was lowered to include Leach, noting his extraordinary influence despite not having a high win percentage.
    • Quote (Joel): “It's hard to talk about the last 20 years of college football without talking about Mike Leach.” [73:35]
  • Group marvels at an “oversold” class packed with legends like Alan Faneca, Percy Harvin, Marshawn Lynch, Colt McCoy, Kellen Moore, Terrell Suggs, and others.
  • Leach remembered for unique personality and accessibility: “Mike Leach once talked to me for three hours, until 2am in the morning...” [73:41]

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Hot Topics Around College Football

Segment: 76:05–87:06

• USC QB Jade Maeva’s Hunger
  • Maeva: “I don't think there's anything I've accomplished yet. I don't even feel the tiniest bit successful yet.” [76:05]
  • Van loves the attitude; Joel playfully offers a light dissent.
• Finebaum’s Latest Rant & Sorsby Betting Scandal
  • Discussion of NCAA’s handling of betting scandals. Joel, after reconsidering, sides with upholding a betting ban: “There’s really only a few hard and fast rules to sports and athletics, man. And it's like, you kind of can't bet on your team…” [77:37]
• Pete Golding’s Loyalty to Ole Miss
  • Van and Joel are skeptical of Golding’s claim that he stayed for Ole Miss, not Kiffin.
    • Quote (Van): “For most college coaches, it's the situation is the dream.”
• Brazil College Opener Moved to Charlottesville
  • Van: International college football games “never going to work... Play the game in fucking Charlottesville, man.” [84:47]

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Pop Culture Banter and Beef

Segment: 91:17–End

• Joel vs. Jay Z’s Fans
  • Joel pokes fun at aggressive Jay Z stanning, but clarifies he’s a fan of Jay Z’s work—just not the “over the top” devotion found online.
    • Quote (Joel): “I'm a big fan of Jay Z, the rapper. The problem is... the fans are annoying. I guess I'm... against all fans.” [91:44]
  • Extended riff on the absurdities of online fan wars and why critique, even of icons, is healthy.

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Notable Quotes & Banter Highlights

• “You don't know what character is until opportunity meets character.” – Van, on Signetti’s character being tested [26:30]
• “I'm sorry you're so scared of capitalism.” – Joel, on coaches’ profit anxieties [45:28]
• “You can't call somebody's hands and then turn it down.” – Van, on Texas ducking Texas Tech [65:42]
• “At the end of the day...we're all kind of hoes.” – Joel, on internet fandom and self-awareness [100:23]
• “If you won the Heisman, right, you're into the concept.” – Van, Hall of Fame criteria [71:11]

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Timestamps for Key Segments

| Segment | Time | |---------|---------| | NBA Finals Talk and Tanking | 00:54–17:10 | | Anticipation for CFB Season | 21:54–23:13 | | EA Sports 'CFB 27' Cover | 25:51–28:24 | | College Football “in Danger” | 28:24–45:51 | | Texas Tech vs. Texas Drama | 61:15–67:06 | | College Football HOF Ballots | 70:34–75:41 | | Various CFB Hot Topics | 76:05–87:06 | | Pop Culture/Fan Beef | 91:17–end |

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Tone & Style

The episode encapsulates Ringer Tailgate's blend of insightful analysis, irreverent banter, and natural rapport among hosts. Deep dives on major issues are balanced by running jokes (Tiger growls, “nut up” slogans), personal narratives, and lightning-quick pivots to sports history, music, and digital culture. The approach is unpretentious, often tongue-in-cheek, but informed and passionate about the culture and stakes of college football and basketball.

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For New Listeners

This episode is a quintessential slice of Ringer Tailgate—hitting relevant sports news, exploring subtexts, and enjoying sharp, sometimes rowdy, conversation. It covers everything from who will win the NBA Finals, to existential threats in college football, to the enduring influence of Mike Leach and Jay Z. If you missed it, you missed a lot—both in pure information and memorable personality.

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Transcript

[Joel Anderson]

Foreign.

[Tate Frazier]

Welcome back to Ringer Tailgate, the Wednesday edition of the show. I'm your host, Tate Frazier, and we got a very fun show, NBA Final Season. We're going to talk about some big story lines in college football, but first and foremost, let's say what's up to our guys in studio. Van Lathan. What's up, Van?

[Van Lathan]

Gotta raise it on.

[Joel Anderson]

Yeah, yeah.

[Tate Frazier]

Daddy fired up for another episode of Tailgate.

[Joel Anderson]

We all see how that is his term, by the way. Daddy, that's.

[Tate Frazier]

No, I think he's just trying. He's trying to make you feel comfortable.

[Joel Anderson]

As I said. No, just hope people remember that.

[Tate Frazier]

Very. That's very kind of Van to welcome you into the show because we got Joel Anderson in the Arkansas Pine Bluff T shirt.

[Joel Anderson]

What's up, man? The Golden Lions, you know what I'm saying? For the sweat. You know what I'm saying?

[Van Lathan]

I don't know why I raise the roof for them. I don't with them. Southern University over here. Jaguar.

[Tate Frazier]

Can I ask you about that, Van? There were some people talking about your tiger, your. Your roar, your growl. How do you feel about that? You know, there was some push.

[Van Lathan]

What did they say? They say nice things or they say things that were. Were insulting.

[Tate Frazier]

They were just like saying that they wanted more from your. Your tiger growl or whatever you want to call it.

[Joel Anderson]

I don't know.

[Van Lathan]

Like what?

[Tate Frazier]

I don't know.

[Joel Anderson]

They want you to be like you and Cats, you know what I'm saying? That kind of. You know, I've never seen Cats, so. But.

[Van Lathan]

Oh, hold on for a second. Did you ever see the. The Saturday Night Live sketch where what's his name was trapped in a musical? He thought that his gang was getting ready to fight another gang. But when they came out, they started singing and dancing and one of them was the Panthers and they went meow like that.

[Joel Anderson]

What year was that?

[Van Lathan]

So that must have been. That was like the Will Ferrell years, because Norma Donald that was doing it like early 2000s. But that's the. That's the Tiger, man. We. Some Tigers.

[Tate Frazier]

Shout out to the Tigers. We'll get to some Tiger talk. We'll get to some couc football talk. But it is NBA final season and we do have a finals that is set. First game is happening tonight, really just right after we record this. So, you know, we're gonna just get some quick takes off on the NBA Finals because that's part of the ringer. You know, the ringer loves the NBA. Do we have any. Is there anyone here that has sort of a. A Finals favorite, a team that we really like. Joel, I know you were talking a little bit before about Jalen Brunson. Do you have an affinity for the Knicks?

[Joel Anderson]

Oh, yeah. I was playing that 82.0game Divan brought.

[Tate Frazier]

Yeah, that was the first 20 minutes of our zoom. Yeah, we were trying to build an 8082.0team.

[Joel Anderson]

Hey, man, I had. Right now, I had me a 67 and 5615 squad. I had Bron. Anyway, you asked me, Gail Goodrich. Gail Goodrich is shooting guard. Who's my point?

[Tate Frazier]

You remember Oscar Robertson?

[Joel Anderson]

I had Oscar Robinson at point, but it's just my. The front court Nene and. And Danny Manning. That was kind of tough. But anyway, yeah, was a tough pick,

[Tate Frazier]

but 67 wins with NAE Nae is pretty good.

[Joel Anderson]

Yeah, man. I did what I could do.

[Tate Frazier]

2013 Nuggets homage there from Joel.

[Joel Anderson]

You like that? I'm not. It's. For me, it's always San Antonio. You know what I'm saying?

[Tate Frazier]

Bias. Okay?

[Joel Anderson]

I'm a Houstonian. We. The Rockets had just as much odds to get Wimy and we didn't get him. And, you know, people spent all this time talking about dishonorable basketball with Shea and everything and, oh, they don't like how you, you know, foul baits and all this stuff. You know, what's dishonorable basketball? Tanking. Tanking to get generational talents, you know, and so they did it the year that they got Tim Duncan, and they did. And they did it for Wimby.

[Tate Frazier]

And so they did it three times to get their current core, right? They got Steph Castle by tanking, they got Dylan Harper by taking. And they got Wimby by tanking.

[Joel Anderson]

That's dishonorable basketball, you know, so. No, it's always, fuck the spurs over here. I'm rooting for the Knicks. I want to see. I like New York, man. Knicks fun. Knicks fans are fun. And you look, the Rockets. I got my first NBA championship off the Knicks, so I feel like they're due right now, so I would love to see them have. Can you just. Wouldn't you. I would love to be in New York if the Knicks win the championship.

[Van Lathan]

Joel, don't step on this brilliant take. I love this take. This take about the tanking. Oh, yeah, I love this take as we're talking about the. I love this.

[Tate Frazier]

You're saying the spurs are unethical?

[Van Lathan]

He's saying the spurs are unethical after we've had an unethical conversation about the mother.

[Tate Frazier]

They were on the ethical side.

[Joel Anderson]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Van Lathan]

I love this take.

[Joel Anderson]

Yeah. People, I mean, also, I mean, they. They threw games and didn't show up for a couple years, and they got lucky. The Rockets could have just as easily got Wimby. I was hoping and praying we would get Wimby now, you know, we did up. You know, we. We took Reed shepherd when we could have got Stefan.

[Van Lathan]

Yeah.

[Tate Frazier]

Talk about a drop in quality.

[Van Lathan]

There you go.

[Joel Anderson]

That was. That was a mistake. That was a mistake.

[Van Lathan]

Dumberson's.

[Joel Anderson]

Yeah, that was a. That was a mistake. But other than that. Oh, you know, then, you know, I mean, Jalen Green over Evan Mobley, you know, in retrospect, maybe that wasn't the greatest pick, but. Yeah, man, I don't. I don't respect what the spurs did. And when I was growing up, spurs fans, they had to be on hush. They couldn't talk around. It's like, we talking about basketball over here, guys. The Rocket, you know, the Rockets franchise and the Mavs, they had at least played in a conference finals at some point in my life. Like, we didn't hear nothing about spurs fans. And now, you know, they talk all this and they get to be, you know.

[Van Lathan]

Because they busting your ass. That's why. Yeah.

[Joel Anderson]

I mean, okay, that's. That's great. Good for them. Good for them. But it was dishonorable the way they went about getting.

[Van Lathan]

Wait, wait, wait, wait. I. I understand that, but let's go back to this. You're saying they didn't used to talk.

[Joel Anderson]

Yeah.

[Van Lathan]

And that's actually honorable because they had no reason to talk.

[Joel Anderson]

Right.

[Van Lathan]

They didn't have any reason to talk. Right. But now, yeah, they have a reason to talk, and they're talking. They're busting your ass. They busting the Rockers asses. Bust by the Spurs. All right. Since. Since at least 99. Right? At least since.

[Joel Anderson]

I don't know about that. Because there was those years, the Harden years, you know?

[Tate Frazier]

No, you had T. Mac Yao Ming. That was a moment.

[Joel Anderson]

Those are some good teams, man. Oh, but wait, that was during Team Dunkin years, so. Not really.

[Van Lathan]

Hey, guys.

[Joel Anderson]

Yeah.

[Van Lathan]

What the are you guys talking about? Yeah, you guys went to the Western Conference. Yeah. You guys went to the Western Conference finals, the semifinals a couple of years in between the spurs winning championships and the Warriors. That's so funny. And the warriors win championships. They were winning championships all the way up. They brought in a new. That started winning championships with them. Do you know your guys now they're back in the finals.

[Joel Anderson]

No. Let me tell you something.

[Van Lathan]

So there's no way if between 99 and now, this argue.

[Joel Anderson]

Look, Van, there's one thing. Nobody gives the Rockets any respect for this. But when the warriors got kd, the league was ready to throw it all away. They were like, oh, man, the warriors are unbeatable. Nobody can beat them. Yeah. And the Rockets were like, no.

[Tate Frazier]

They missed every three you looked at.

[Joel Anderson]

Yeah, let's compete. Let's get after it.

[Tate Frazier]

And then, you know, 27 mysteries.

[Joel Anderson]

Chris Paul hurt his. His hamstring and it. And it. You know, there was no opportunity, but if Chris Paul was healthy, we win that. Yeah, we win. We win.

[Van Lathan]

One has a lot of credit. We got.

[Joel Anderson]

We get.

[Van Lathan]

Y' all deserve a lot of credit.

[Joel Anderson]

Yeah. Because it made everybody else nut up. It made everybody else nut up to the finals. Yeah, it made everybody else.

[Tate Frazier]

It's a new slogan for the Rockets. Nut up.

[Joel Anderson]

Yeah.

[Van Lathan]

This is basketball youtuber. What's that guy's name? Scout with Brian or something like that that. Y' all ever see that guy on YouTube?

[Tate Frazier]

Yeah, he. He goes after people. He loves the comments.

[Van Lathan]

He does. See? You know him?

[Joel Anderson]

I heard of this guy, man.

[Van Lathan]

No, he go. He.

[Tate Frazier]

Let me tell you, Joe will respect him, actually.

[Joel Anderson]

Really?

[Van Lathan]

Joel will respect him. This guy Scott with Brian, because on. For some reason on Twitter, he goes crazy. But if you actually watch the videos, he broke down one time, it was a Warriors vs Rockets video where

[Joel Anderson]

the

[Van Lathan]

warriors just realized that the Rockets were going to come out and play the same coverage no matter what, and they just start busting the Rockets fucking ass. They were down big at half. It might have been in Game seven or maybe even game six of that series, but they just realized that no matter what happened, that the Rockets wouldn't change their coverage. And so the warriors came out and exploited them and just took the game from it. It was still a useful video from Scott with Brian, who's a very controversial figure out there in the Twitter streets. Tate Nose.

[Joel Anderson]

Scott with Brian or Scott Scout. Scout with Brian, not Scott with. I thought y' all saying Scout Scott. Okay. Scout with Brian. Okay, I'm looking.

[Tate Frazier]

Scout with Brian. Sounds like a relationship podcast.

[Joel Anderson]

Wait, is that the guy? Wait a minute. I feel like he had a moment a few years ago where he was kind of talking crazy and he had to go away for a little bit.

[Tate Frazier]

He's definitely called someone a ho.

[Joel Anderson]

He's back. Oh, yeah. He had to come back. I remember this guy. Okay, well, whatever. I. I'm not familiar with his work like I should be, but there's plenty of time for that.

[Tate Frazier]

You have your personal affinity for Houston. That's why you're anti Spurs. So we understand that. But is there a reason why you like the Knicks other than that?

[Joel Anderson]

Well, no, I mean, I think that, I mean, they've played the best 11 game stretch in NBA playoffs history, plus 262 point differential. Yeah, man, that's, yeah. To beat playoff teams, even if it was just, you know, the Sixers and the Hawks and the Cavs, I mean those are still NBA playoff teams and they kick their ass. It's not like they played around with them. So I think that they have a chance and I, you know, I, look, man, I, I, I think that the spurs are going to be a very difficult match. I mean, the thing about playing against Wimby and this is the obvious thing to say, every night is going to be hard because every night you're going to have to struggle.

[Van Lathan]

Oh, God. Jesus Christ.

[Tate Frazier]

I sent a Barkley clip to Joel and Van. This Barkley doing the pun, Paul's and that is Joel on the show every week.

[Van Lathan]

Damn, Joe Mike. Every night.

[Tate Frazier]

Every night.

[Joel Anderson]

Yeah.

[Van Lathan]

Hey, all right, you all give, give

[Joel Anderson]

your predictions, Talk NBA Finals. Now.

[Van Lathan]

What, bro? Oh my God, My God. Okay, I just got the jazz in the 2000s. Should I put Van.

[Joel Anderson]

Wait, we supposed to be talking about the Finals, dog. Come on.

[Tate Frazier]

I got feel like, I think Darren Williams. Get Darren Williams in there.

[Van Lathan]

Darren Williams. Wait, what team? What is this?

[Joel Anderson]

The Jazz?

[Van Lathan]

I got, I just got the Utah Jazz.

[Joel Anderson]

Sloan coaching Darren Williams, Dallas. Yeah.

[Tate Frazier]

Good player. One note on the the finals. A team that has come and played less four games like in back to back. The Knicks have had that with the Cavs. They won that series in a sweep. Also coming off a sweep going in the finals, teams are 20 and four in the next series. So I mean, there is a little bit of a history on the side of the New York Knicks if you do want to buy into some of that stuff. And also I do feel like this Knicks team is kind of battle tested a little bit more in the playoffs than the spurs. So there's something to buy into. But again, the talent on the side of the Spurs, I feel like seems to be the better team. Like if you had to really make a pick, I would say spurs and six spurs and seven potentially at home. But for whatever reason, I'm a little bit leaning towards the Knicks. I don't know why. Maybe the toughness, maybe, maybe the fact they can wear out Wimy a little bit. Also OG Anunoby physically, I think is Kind of a. A guy that you can throw on Wimy and give him a different look.

[Van Lathan]

That Wimy stopper.

[Tate Frazier]

Yeah, he can handle it.

[Joel Anderson]

Is Mitch Robinson's hand. I mean, he, like, he heard.

[Tate Frazier]

He's out there. Mitch is out there.

[Joel Anderson]

Okay. He's out there. All right. Yeah, man.

[Van Lathan]

Yeah, they got.

[Joel Anderson]

They got some. Some size, some big guys, you know. Pause. Oh, no, that wasn't what. Joe, I'm waiting on y'. All.

[Van Lathan]

Listen, Joel, listen. Don't. Joel, don't pout. You said it's gonna be hard every night. That's a clear cut case for it. Don't pout, bro.

[Joel Anderson]

Okay, you guys decide. You guys.

[Tate Frazier]

He took a sip of tussle milk to get himself back in line.

[Joel Anderson]

Oh, yeah, man.

[Van Lathan]

Oh, my God. Jesus. I'll say this, look, from a basketball perspective, it seems as if that the spurs are a little too talented, a little too multiple to lose to the Knicks. But, man, the Knicks match up super well with them. Have matched up super well with them all year. And it's just they're playing with this cohesion right now. And like, under discussed, but what a coaching job by Mike Brown with the New York completely transformed that team into a team that can really, really play, like, in the moment and react to what the defense is doing. So we'll see. Another note.

[Tate Frazier]

Yeah, I'm with you. No, I'm with you.

[Joel Anderson]

There.

[Tate Frazier]

Just another note on Mike Brown quickly. He. The last time he was there, 2007 with LeBron, right, against the spurs, he was running. The spurs plays against the Spurs. So they knew everything they was running. They're like, that's our floppy to the side. That's this action that we run. So, like, the scout for them was super easy. And obviously they get swept and LeBron gets the blame for that. But Mike Brown running Spurs plays against the spurs was a very underrated aspect of that series. Now he's the one that has a little bit more experience going up against Mitch Johnson. Mitch Johnson. So maybe this is a redemption story for Mike Brown as well. So that's another reason you might want to buy into the Knicks.

[Joel Anderson]

Yeah, the thing. That's also. The Knicks did the thing because I, you know me, I'm like, winning is hard. Oh, it's hard. Wow. So winning is hard. But Tom Thibodeau, I think.

[Van Lathan]

Yo, just stop, bro. It's not. It's not. That's not what you said. You said it's gonna be hard every night.

[Joel Anderson]

Yeah.

[Van Lathan]

And you emphasized it.

[Joel Anderson]

I don't think. I know. I did Not. Did.

[Van Lathan]

Not every night, Joel. And it's. And it's. That's not the same as some of this other that you say. I don't appreciate you doing what you're doing right now, man.

[Joel Anderson]

I'm being y'. All. I'm being y'.

[Tate Frazier]

All.

[Joel Anderson]

Y' all made me forget my point. Oh, yeah. Tom Thibodeau is. Was a good coach. And I probably would have been like, man, I'll probably run it back with Tom Thibodeau before I make that kind of change. But the Knicks really did something very brave, very courageous. They said, look, that's not good enough. And they, and they said, he's limiting. He. He puts a lower ceiling on this team than there should be. And they went and got Mike Brown and it worked. They was like basically a championship, a bus year for the Knicks, and they went ahead, made to the championship and didn't bust. Oh, damn, Joel. All right, that's enough.

[Tate Frazier]

All right, Van, do you have a pick? Do you have a finals pick or do you want to wait before.

[Van Lathan]

I'm go with this first. I'm gonna go with this first. You know what? It, you know what? Nixon six. Bing.

[Tate Frazier]

Okay, I like the Nixon six.

[Joel Anderson]

Bong.

[Tate Frazier]

Bong.

[Joel Anderson]

Yeah.

[Van Lathan]

Mixing six.

[Joel Anderson]

Six.

[Van Lathan]

How about that? It. I'm going. My heart says the, My brain says the spurs are going, but my heart is with these crazy, wild eyed, fucking insane people from right there in midtown Manhattan.

[Joel Anderson]

That's what's up, man.

[Tate Frazier]

I like it. Josh Hart hitting some threes also. If they steal one game in San Antonio, they come back to msg, win three and four, go back to San Antonio, lose game five, they got game six at home. And msg, that'd be a tough place to win a game on the road for the spurs, especially a young team. So. Nixon six. I like it. Joel, do you have a pick?

[Joel Anderson]

Oh, yeah, I think. Nixon 7. I think they'll have. I think.

[Tate Frazier]

You think they're going to win game seven in San Antonio?

[Joel Anderson]

Yeah, man. Jalen Brunson, you know, is a, is a, is a clutch player, man. And I just kind of feel like, you know, they're, they're the more battle tested team again. I'm going out on a limb here. I mean, I think that, like Van said, that the spurs are the more talented team. They've got the hardest guy to overcome in terms of, like having to fight offense every night. See, See, Tate?

[Tate Frazier]

Hardest guy to overcome.

[Joel Anderson]

Y' all some bullshit, but that's, but, but, but, but I, I think that, yeah, the cohesion. The way that the Knicks have played, I sometimes I just like that stuff has to matter. I think the way that you've been playing and the way that they seem to look down the stretch, so, you know, I'm just going to have some faith that they'll be able to come through in a real tight Game seven in San Antonio, man.

[Tate Frazier]

All right.

[Joel Anderson]

What about you, Tate? What about you?

[Van Lathan]

What about you, Tate?

[Tate Frazier]

I gave Nick, I gave Nixon six. I don't feel great about it, but, you know, I. I'm one of those guys where I think Josh Hart can swing the series. I like the physicality of the Knicks. I think Mitch is going to play. And like I said, I think this is Mike Brown's redemption story. And I do think going up against Popovich in 2007, he's been there with the number one pick. You know, at 22 years old with LeBron, he already saw that feeling, and now he's on the other side with the more experienced team. So I think he gets it back, and I think he gets a win. And I think it's good for the NBA if the Knicks win. I think it's a way to get them kind of like what Boston did a couple years ago when they won. Right? You get that fan base back, engaged and excited with the championship. So I think it's a win for the league overall. And again, as we know, it's NBA entertainment, and I think that would be good entertainment. And then Wimby has a little bit of, you know, fire in his belly to go back and get it right. And Tim Duncan, he lost one Finals 2013 to LeBron. And the Heat, he was 5 for 6. I think Wimby's going to end up being 5 for 6 as well. And I think this is going to be his one loss.

[Joel Anderson]

That's interesting. You know, I always feel like. Because every time people do that thing where they're really young, you can just imagine them winning forever. And it doesn't really happen like that anymore. I just remember people. Not that the warriors were a disappointment because they got five finals, but I think the thought was that the warriors are going to run off like 6 of 7 or something like that.

[Tate Frazier]

I mean, the Heat. The Heat were.

[Joel Anderson]

The Heat, the Heat were going to be like that. And it's just like, injuries happen, salary disputes happen, ridiculous GMs happen, you know, so we'll see. What you doing, Joel?

[Van Lathan]

Getting into the basketball historian bag. That's what the fuck I'm talking about. You know, other dynasties that didn't live up to what you thought they should,

[Joel Anderson]

man, they were a really good team, and they got denied a couple.

[Van Lathan]

That's a great one.

[Joel Anderson]

Yeah, man, you know, great team. The Sonics were the rivals of the Rockets, and if the Rockets had had to play the Sonics in any of those years, they won a championship, they would have lost because they were a bad matchup for them.

[Van Lathan]

You think so?

[Joel Anderson]

Yeah, man. They never. They never beat those Sonics in a playoff series during. During that stretch. It was just all like. They lost in a game 7 in Seattle also.

[Tate Frazier]

5 game series less of, you know, a chance for you to.

[Van Lathan]

Well, that's what happened to the Sonics. The Sonics. Sonics got kicked off Mount Mutombo.

[Joel Anderson]

That's right. That's right. Man, Rip, Deke, man, Rip.

[Van Lathan]

Yeah. They couldn't climb Mount Mumbo. Open the thing up. I will say that, like, the Rockets did get those two championships, there is some fortuitousness in their two championship run. To me, they had the best player in the NBA not named Michael Jordan. They had one of the. To me, five to 10 best players in the history of the game at this. At his pinnacle and peak, so that being Akeem Olajuwon. But, you know, they. There was some stuff that was going on during that time that allowed them to take advantage of what was happening, you know, so, yeah, you gotta get a little luck.

[Joel Anderson]

Yeah, man, you gotta. I mean, look, I. I'll be the first to. To admit that the Rockets were lucky a lot down that stretch. They wanted some games that they shouldn't have won. They were not overly talented, but they really came together, man. And. Yeah, bro, you know, man, I was out on Westheimer and Richmond, man. We all flooded into the streets, dog, and just, you know, saying, hit some seven elevens. We were out there, bro. That was most.

[Tate Frazier]

City was supporting City, man.

[Joel Anderson]

Yeah, man, it was. It was a lot of fun, man. I'm glad, man. We swept the Magic the next year. I was great, man. Those are some good times.

[Tate Frazier]

And that was after the Magic knocked out Jordan when he came back.

[Joel Anderson]

That's right. That's why I always say, you know, Jordan and the Bulls, man, they could have got their heads tapped too. You know what I'm saying? They just didn't make it. They bow.

[Tate Frazier]

I would say it does kind of like, not the mirror exactly, but it does feel like when Wimby and the spurs knocked off okc, they celebrated the same way that Shaq and the Magic celebrated knocking off the Bulls. Like, they kind of celebrated like they already won the championship. And I think that concerns me a little bit, like, the tears and everything. It's like you won the Western Conference finals, you didn't win the NBA finals. So I'd be a little bit. I'd be a little bit concerned. But Shaq was partying. I think Wimby was just, you know,

[Joel Anderson]

I tell you what, Shaq was part of Shaq, man. Shaq gave dream, was the better player. But dream couldn't do with Shaq. Neither, though. Like, I mean, people, the people that, the kids that watch this, which probably aren't many, I get out, I bet our Median viewers like, what, 41. But. But they don't remember young Shaq. Man, young Shaq was incredible. They see this big, heavy guy. Even, like Lakers, Shaq, like, was just not. He was a little bit heavier than he was those early years with the magic. But, man, he was, he was an incredible athlete. That was the thing. You'd never seen anybody that big, that massive, that move like that. Man, he was. He was unbelievable.

[Tate Frazier]

He was, like, in military shape, like, early on. Yeah, he was. He was fit and ready to go. Yeah, that was a fun team, fun times.

[Joel Anderson]

LSU guy.

[Tate Frazier]

Yeah, big LSU guy there. He's a Tiger. That's right.

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[Tate Frazier]

When do you start counting down to college football? Is it after the NBA Finals? Because I do feel like once the Finals wrap, we get NBA draft and then everyone's like, what's next in college football? Is right there on the docket. Obviously, NFL as well had some big trades. Miles Garrett's Miles Garrett coming out here to the Rams is a big deal. But when does it start for you, Joel? When you start counting down the days to college football?

[Joel Anderson]

Oh, when I get my preseason magazines in the mail, you know, when I get my. My Dave Campbell's Texas football. The Athlon national edition.

[Tate Frazier]

Early July, right?

[Joel Anderson]

Early July, yeah. And you get the. The regional edition. I always get the regional edition of the Athlons wherever I live. So because I live in Maryland, I get the Big Ten edition of Athlons now, you know, the best conference in college football. So I get to read. I get to read all about that. I think Phil Steele told me he was going to send me one of his preseason magazines, too. So. Yeah, man, that's when I really get into it, you know, I start doing my research. I remember when we were doing this show last year, and it was really funny because I didn't know y' all really at that point. And Van said something about, man, we're going to have to get the new NCAA football game and play it so we can learn all the rosters and all this shit. And I was like, damn, you make that sound totally unfun. And I was. I was telling my wife. I was like, man, I'm at the. About PS5. I know, I know it's gonna look crazy, but I'm gonna have to play video games.

[Tate Frazier]

I love that you're trying to sound like it was a chore. That sounds like, you know, what the.

[Van Lathan]

Is going on.

[Joel Anderson]

I have not played video Games since. Since 2007. I remember. I remember the day I played my

[Tate Frazier]

last video game almost 20 years ago.

[Joel Anderson]

Almost 20 years. I'm coming up on that anniversary. Yeah, man, I never thought I would.

[Tate Frazier]

The last game that you played.

[Van Lathan]

Halo.

[Joel Anderson]

No, you know. No, it was Madden. It was Madden and I. I was.

[Tate Frazier]

It was on the COVID Sean Alexander.

[Joel Anderson]

Was it Vince Young? Was Vince Young on the COVID one year on the.

[Tate Frazier]

Madden.

[Van Lathan]

He might have been. I think he might have got a Madden cover. I don't know. He might.

[Tate Frazier]

I can't remember if there was anyone on the Titans. I would say Chris Johnson, man.

[Joel Anderson]

Let me see. No, man, he was. He was on the COVID He was on the COVID Yeah, he might have got one. Something like that. Yeah, man, because remember, he went to a Pro bowl and everything.

[Tate Frazier]

I mean, yeah, they were a fun team.

[Joel Anderson]

So I remember I was playing what

[Van Lathan]

just happened to Me, bro? Let me tell you what just happened to me, bro.

[Joel Anderson]

What, What.

[Van Lathan]

What y' all talking about? I got a. I got a. A clear cut 82, 10 team.

[Tate Frazier]

Come on, dog.

[Van Lathan]

Hold on, hold on. I got over in the last one. So I got Will Chamberlain at center.

[Joel Anderson]

Oh.

[Van Lathan]

I got Dwight Howard at power forward.

[Tate Frazier]

Damn.

[Van Lathan]

I got Jason Tatum at small Ford.

[Tate Frazier]

No, you're not winning 82.

[Joel Anderson]

A lot of hype. A lot of hype.

[Van Lathan]

I got John Stockton at point guard, and they just gave me the Utah jazz from the 90s. So now I need a point, I need a shooting guard. I gotta get. I gotta put a Utah jazz from the 90s on there. I gotta go with.

[Joel Anderson]

Yeah, yeah. Who else did they have?

[Van Lathan]

They had Byron Russell.

[Tate Frazier]

Yeah, that's who Jordan hit the shot over.

[Joel Anderson]

Yeah, man, you. I mean, look at you, man.

[Van Lathan]

Just went, bro, These just went 58 and 24 this game. It's like. You mean to tell me. Hold on for a second, bro. You mean to tell me, man, this team is only averaging 77 points per game?

[Joel Anderson]

Yeah, man.

[Van Lathan]

This is because Jason Tatum is from Boston in the 2010s, so he wasn't quite the man yet.

[Joel Anderson]

Yeah, young.

[Tate Frazier]

Young Tatum.

[Joel Anderson]

Yeah, man. I mean, and I mean, you've got like two. Two really bad free throw shooters. They're packing the paint.

[Tate Frazier]

Yeah, they're hacking, Dwight. Yeah, hacking Will.

[Joel Anderson]

Yeah, it's tough.

[Van Lathan]

It's not really a. It's not really a great Celtic from the 2010s that you could put in there. Besides maybe like Kyrie you could put in there. Yeah, yeah, you could put him in there. But it's like, I don't know, man. I went with Jason. Tim. I should have done that.

[Tate Frazier]

I wish you could pick the era that your team plays in, you know, like 90s.

[Joel Anderson]

No, no, this is like 2000s with your team. No.

[Tate Frazier]

You know what I mean.

[Joel Anderson]

Yeah, yeah. I. I was just introduced to this game three minutes before we went on air, and now I'm in love with it. I'm glad that I didn't learn about it until the end of the day because I would have off my whole day if I had access to this website.

[Tate Frazier]

Well, you got more time after this. You can still waste it. Speaking of games, though, speaking of college football 26 that Joel did not buy. College football 27 came out deluxe edition cover. And here's on the who. These are the people that are on the COVID Kurt Signetti in the middle, Dante Moore, Malachi, Tony Jaden, Maa Kawan Lacy, Colin Simmons, and Leonard Moore. So these are the guys. Last year we had two cover stars. This year, a slew of COVID stars. Plus. Plus Kurt Signetti. Van, do you like Signetti being on the COVID of College Football 27.

[Van Lathan]

He is the current king of college football.

[Tate Frazier]

Okay.

[Van Lathan]

You have to put him on the

[Tate Frazier]

COVID Feels a little out of character, though, for him. Yeah.

[Van Lathan]

I mean, this is what happens, though. See, this is the thing that people don't understand. You never know what character is until opportunity meets character.

[Tate Frazier]

There you go.

[Van Lathan]

There's a lot of people right now that are saying, yo, man, I would never do that. I would never take that. Them ain't your kind of problems. You don't know what you'll. Shut the fuck up. I hate that shit. You don't know what you'll do. I never sell out. You don't. Ain't nobody buying. You don't know what the fuck you'll do. Shut up. Right? And so, like, now, if you get to that point and it's on the table and you don't take it, hey, more power to you. I love people that stick to their guns. There's nothing more that I love than

[Tate Frazier]

Dave Chappelle with Chappelle's Show.

[Joel Anderson]

Rick. Rick Patino.

[Van Lathan]

Stick to their guns, right? I love that. But Kurt Zagnetti, we didn't know what was it? Kirk Signetti, we might see him with a Jordan Hudson pretty soon. We don't know.

[Joel Anderson]

Oh, damn.

[Tate Frazier]

Wow.

[Van Lathan]

We have no clue, you know, what's going on.

[Joel Anderson]

That is true. It's. It's tough. Like, already, Kurt Signetti was probably one of the most famous people in the state, but now he's a. He's sort of a. You know, I don't know how much of a national celebrity he is, but there's a lot of people who know who he is. And now you got to turn down a lot more shit when you're Kurt Signetti. He's making people know that he makes $13 million a year. You know, he's handsome for 64. And he didn't make our top 10.

[Van Lathan]

Now he. Yeah, he made the top 10. Maybe he should have. But he.

[Tate Frazier]

He.

[Van Lathan]

He famous now. Now he out there. And when him being out there means that, now people are going to have to. He's going to have to be more definitive and actually defining that character. I don't see what being on the COVID of the video game has to do with character. I think that that's fine, but Kurt Signetti now is going to have people shoving a microphone in his face and asking the questions, and they're going to be picking apart every answer, and we'll see how he deals with that.

[Tate Frazier]

Yeah, it's a different day for Kurt Signetti. And speaking of Signetti, let's do one big reaction because he came out and said college football is in danger if something doesn't change soon. Here's the quote. The market is pretty expensive. It's scary. It's really scary. I think players should get paid, but something's going to have to be done in the next 12 to 24 months or universities not be. Might not be able to handle this. College football won't exist the way that we're going right now. Joel, this is in your wheelhouse. Your thoughts on Signetti's comments.

[Joel Anderson]

I just, I just told you. Kurt Signetti makes $13 million a year. Okay, so college football wasn't. It didn't face an existential risk when A and M paid $77 million to Jimbo Fisher to go away. 54 million for Brian Kelly to go away. Kentucky to pay 37 million for Mark Stoops to go away? No, it's just that now the players have a little bit more mobility and they have an opportunity to make somewhat close to what their value is as college football players. And also, what do people mean when they say college football won't exist? I want people to walk me through what's going to happen. Are you just telling me, Coach Signetti, that colleges that will realize, oh, man, this is a lot of money. We're not getting the return on it, so maybe we should stop spending money or spend less money or play against programs that spin at the level that we do? What the fuck is wrong with that? That's what's happened in the history of college football. People Ivy. The Ivy Leagues used to be major college football early 80s. And they were like, no, we don't want to do this. We don't want to have to play. We don't want to have to build massive stadiums. We don't want to have to spend the kind of money that it requires. So we'll just go to the level down.

[Tate Frazier]

They bowed out.

[Joel Anderson]

Princeton played in the first fucking college football game. Okay, so like the Ivy League was like, you know what? This isn't what we need to do, and we're not going to do it anymore. So I'm sorry if colleges realize, man, that $21 million salary cap, that's a lot, man. We might. I don't know if that's worth our while. We should pay less, then go ahead and play North North Dakota State with your ass. You know what I'm saying? Like, I just. And they're pretty good hearing that, you know, that's crazy.

[Van Lathan]

So I guess I'll ask this. Okay. So do you think that there's a structural difference here in like the comp. The comparison that you make? There are way more players than there are coaches.

[Joel Anderson]

Yeah.

[Van Lathan]

So even though coaches make tremendous salaries,

[Joel Anderson]

about half of what the players make. If they make good, if they're, if they're good, if they're really good, they make about half of what they're saying you should spend on the roster.

[Van Lathan]

I will continue.

[Joel Anderson]

Okay, my bad. I'm sorry.

[Van Lathan]

I'm just joking. I just saw somebody do that on a YouTube video. I cut people off all the time. It's kind of what I'm known for. So there are a couple of coaches who make these exorbitant salaries, right? A couple of them. Like enough for us to have a conversation about the coaches salaries. But the players represent a way larger portion of the monetary stress that will be put on the sport or the financial mechanism or whatever.

[Tate Frazier]

Right.

[Van Lathan]

There's way more players. And then not only that, but you're paying a bunch of players based upon like you're paying them, they're more of them to pay. And then you're paying them based on beating wars with the other universities and stuff like that. Is it a. Is it a chance. I'm not caping for the coaches here. Is it a chance that one is more sustainable than the other? Is there a chance that there is a financial stressor that exists with this many players that you would have to pay that might not exist with the coaches? I'm asking.

[Joel Anderson]

You know, it is a slightly different stressor, but if I have to pick, it's the players that should be getting paid. In all the other major leagues in America, the players make more money than the coach. You can't. Mlb, NBA, NFL, those guys don't make what the players make.

[Tate Frazier]

And so the reason that coaches got paid so much in the first place is because you didn't pay the players. So who else are you going to pay with all the money that you're bringing?

[Van Lathan]

Okay, can I say something though?

[Joel Anderson]

Yeah.

[Van Lathan]

Can I say something though?

[Joel Anderson]

Yeah, yeah.

[Van Lathan]

There's a difference even between those sports and the sports that we're talking about now. In this sport, the coaches are more important than the players are.

[Joel Anderson]

I don't. Okay.

[Van Lathan]

I mean, it's just, it's, it's, it's a. It's a. If you have a good one, if

[Joel Anderson]

you have a great one. If you have a great one.

[Van Lathan]

Well, that's true in anything. A player is not as important, like good Players are the players that are important. So if you are, and the coach

[Tate Frazier]

stays, the players move on.

[Van Lathan]

That's the point. So, like in, in what we're talking about now, you essentially have. It would be different in, even in the NFL if every coach was on like a. These coach, these players play four years and then they can't play in the sport anymore.

[Joel Anderson]

They're gone.

[Van Lathan]

At the most, they can play four years and then they can't play in the sport anymore. Not that they can go to another team and play in the sport. Not that they can go. They play four years, they have four years of eligibility, and then they're out of the sport. So they're gone. So what you actually need are coaches and people that can connect eras of players and win for your university that is going to be there for a very, very long time. So the coach doesn't build a roster like a coach builds in Major League Baseball or anything else. A coach builds a program, A coach builds an identity. A coach builds something that's supposed to be able to last from recruiting class to recruiting class. So the reason why they get paid the way that they do in college football and the way that it's always been is because they are architects that are supposed to do two things. Number one, coach players up who weren't highly touted recruits. And then on the other side of that, be able to endure players that bust out and stuff like that. Right? Because these guys can't really get. I mean, you can wave them and cut them and stuff like that, I guess now. But what I'm saying is when we compare these things to pro leagues, oftentimes we do it in a way that robs the context of the differences between these two things. And yeah, if you, if you get Wimby, the guy who coaches Wemby is important, but it's certainly less important than Wimby, who you want to have there for 15 or 20 years if, if, if all goes right. Knock on wood for Wemby and his health. But that is just different fundamentally than how things work in college football.

[Joel Anderson]

I hear what you're saying, but.

[Van Lathan]

Because it's right.

[Joel Anderson]

No, you know what? No, because what happened when things change, if we had gone to 2018, 2018, 2019.

[Van Lathan]

What's that?

[Joel Anderson]

Motherfucker that. Man, you done got me to forgetting the guy's name now, man. Hold on. Oh, Davos Sweeney. Okay, yeah. James Franklin and Brian Kelly, they were all like great coaches. And once the economics of the game changed, things changed. As soon as the game, the the economics of the games changed. Nick Saban got his ass out of college football. And I'm just going to throw this at you. So for you, LSU spent, you know, $67 million in coaches. Well, I mean, they're not playing paying out all of the Brian Kelly this year, but they played probably about $30 million on coaches. What if I told you, you get 30, you can have Lane Kiffin for $30 million this year. Or I give you Jordan Seaton, Sam Levitt, Kaden Durham. Maybe I might be able to get you a nice receiver like Cam Coleman. But I'm just.

[Van Lathan]

But this is the point. This is the point about this sport. Is this, this type of sport. That roster really matters. But the coaches, then the pro at the coaches have such an inordinate amount of effect on what happens in the game in this sport. It's just a fucking fact. I don't know what else to tell you.

[Joel Anderson]

I think the game is changing. I think the game is changing now. I don't think that's. I don't think that's as important as it used to be, which is why.

[Van Lathan]

Well, then how do you explain Kurt losing the game, huh? How do you explain Kirk Signetti?

[Joel Anderson]

Kurt Signetti did not. I will. No, no. Kirk Signetti is, Is a. Is. Is an incredible exception. Like, there's nobody who's been Kurt Signetti. If you happen to get Kirk Signetti, then it's all worth it. I didn't hear what you said.

[Van Lathan]

Right.

[Joel Anderson]

Okay.

[Van Lathan]

I was with you because you were kind of sweeping over your words, but go ahead.

[Joel Anderson]

Okay. Yeah.

[Van Lathan]

This is tough.

[Joel Anderson]

See, look at you.

[Tate Frazier]

Hey, Joel, this is good practice for Fine Bomb.

[Joel Anderson]

What?

[Van Lathan]

Oh, yeah, Keep getting like. Oh, keep going, Joe.

[Tate Frazier]

My bad for when you do. When you do this on Fine Bomb.

[Joel Anderson]

Yeah, I'm not gonna go back on five bomb. But anyway, what happened now? See, man, cursing. Okay, yeah. If you get Kurt Signetti, then hell, yeah, it's worth it. But more often than not, you're going to get a replacement level coach. You're going to get somebody that's like, I don't know, is Eli Drinkwitz good? Is Clark Lee good? Without Diego Pavia, we'll find out. But it's that kind of shit that happens year to year now. I think it's just different. The money has changed things, and it's going to be more like professional sports, which it is. We just a little weird about saying it, but it's professional football. And in professional sports, the athletes are always worth more than the coaches. And I think we're going to see that. And I think that's why the coaches are panicked right now. Oh, they'll never be the same now.

[Van Lathan]

I totally agree with you.

[Joel Anderson]

I used to.

[Van Lathan]

I totally agree with you. But I will say this, though. You still got to go out and recruit and do stuff. The coaches still bring a specific value in college football that they don't have in every other sport. The coach, college coaches, period, when we were talking about these things, they have a specific value here as program builders. We could talk about college baseball in these terms. We could talk about college track in these terms. We could talk about college gymnastics in these terms. When you go to these different places, you see statues of players and all of that type of stuff too. Right. But that field in Alabama is named after Nick Saban. And that's because what Alabama is looking for is not.

[Tate Frazier]

And the coaches are the stars.

[Van Lathan]

Yeah. Not a great two years or three years for someone that can be legendary. They want 10 years.

[Joel Anderson]

Yeah.

[Van Lathan]

They want 15 years.

[Joel Anderson]

They're going to have to want different things.

[Van Lathan]

Not only that, though. Not only that, but the continuity between, like Stoops leading into Lincoln Riley or Urban Meyer leading into Ryan Day, like all of that type of stuff, that's what long lasting program success is built on, that type of continuity. Now when you say that the game will have to totally change, then maybe that's what they're talking about. The question is, can the game sustain that? So I'm not saying that you're right and they're wrong, or they're right and you're wrong. What I'm saying is a lot of times when we make these comparisons, we don't make them completely and totally in context to what it is that we're actually talking about. We're talking about two things with two different mechanisms, two different expectations. We're talking about two completely different sports is really what we're talking about.

[Joel Anderson]

I'm talking about where do you want to spend your money? That's what it all comes down to. Me, college football is pro football. And I know people feel a little weird about thinking about it in that way, but it is professional football. And now that is professional football. The college coach who used to have a lot more influence and power over this whole shit, there's probably going to be college programs in the future. Coming up with a general manager is going to be more important because that is a new position on a lot of these. In a lot of these programs, there may be. There may be somebody that decides to construct their athletic department in that way. So I think that, I think you're right for the football that happened before 2024 or 2023. But I think that now that things are changing, that the players are going to be where you need to put your money and that you just can't, you can't depend on the, the 15 year, 20 year guy. Just, just like you don't.

[Van Lathan]

Can I ask you a question? Can Miles Garrett flunk out of the Rams?

[Joel Anderson]

Can he flunk out of the Rams? No. I mean, yeah.

[Van Lathan]

Can Miles Garrett be deemed in academically ineligible to play for the Rams?

[Joel Anderson]

No.

[Van Lathan]

What else does Miles Garrett have to do for the Rams besides concentrate on football?

[Joel Anderson]

Stay out of, stay out of the blotter, you know, just maybe. Yeah, maybe, maybe that's fair point. Maybe I will concede that maybe he

[Van Lathan]

has to do that depending on what happens.

[Joel Anderson]

Yeah, that's true.

[Van Lathan]

Like, like maybe in this case, like if you're Miles Garrett and you go to. At least for the time being, who knows? You have to still to a degree for these coaches, you still have to like have these guys go to college. You still have to.

[Joel Anderson]

There's ain't nobody flunking out no more, bro. Ain't nobody flunking out college no more, man.

[Van Lathan]

I mean, honestly, Honestly, like at lsu, I'm not going to name no names with no players, but we had a player that was a five star running back, a legitimate five star running back. Love this kid who. I still love this kid who had injury problems but also could not stay on the field because of academic stuff. And I'm not saying it doesn't happen all the time, but what I'm saying is it's still a concern and that these are. The job is different, the game is different. It's not the same game. You don't. You can say that they're going to be professionals, but they're professionals insofar as they get paid. But they're not professionals in the terms of what professional athletes do, what their responsibilities are. The infrastructure is different.

[Joel Anderson]

I have. Coaches will be slightly more important in college football and it is better to have a good one than a bad one. But on the whole, I would rather take my. I would rather take my risk every year with a $40 million roster as opposed to a $40 million coach in college football going forward. Again, I understand this. College football is very complicated. You got to keep those boys in line, you got to develop them, you got to teach them football because they don't even know football that level yet. And all the other little distractions that are happening, even if they're not really on campus like they used to be, because they're taking remote classes and all that other shit. And they're mostly at the football facility. But, you know, there's a lot of.

[Tate Frazier]

Golden said they're in his country club area. He said they live next to him there.

[Joel Anderson]

I mean, that's what they said. Darien Minster, man, they were moving in. That was part of his thing. He was going to get a country club membership or some shit like that down there in Miami. I'm like, yeah, man, this is some totally different shit. But, yeah, I agree that college coaches are important. Maybe a little bit more important than the NFL. But, like, again, I just don't think they're as important important as they used to be. And people are going to have to get used to that. And the people that are finding that out are the ones that are panicking the most. They're like, I have a lot more impact on the game than I used to. I better say that college football's in danger.

[Van Lathan]

Joe.

[Joel Anderson]

Yes.

[Van Lathan]

Do you know what you have in common with this shirt?

[Joel Anderson]

I can't even see your shirt, bro. Let me see. Hold on, Doc. Is that okay?

[Van Lathan]

Hold on.

[Joel Anderson]

You're in the top of my. You're in the top of my screen and my teleprompter, and I have bad vision. Okay, man. You're looking good, man. You know what I'm saying?

[Van Lathan]

I appreciate it. I'm losing a little weight, bro. I'm losing weight. Do you know what? You have common in common with this shirt, though.

[Joel Anderson]

Okay. What about it?

[Van Lathan]

Y' all both just got washed. That was a good time. But no, seriously Altered Jose Society. Like, all. All Joe Societo. All Jose Society. These are kind of the things that we're talking about. And I would be lying, obviously, POD and having this conversation. I think we both make interesting points. But a lot of this stuff, a lot of Joel's right about a lot of this stuff. A lot of this is pouting. A lot of this is a bunch of guys who had all the power.

[Joel Anderson]

Y.

[Van Lathan]

All the power, all the same.

[Tate Frazier]

Nick Saban.

[Van Lathan]

Yeah, Nick Saban. A lot of this is a bunch of guys who don't think that this sport works unless they are the Mount Olympus of it. And I'll just be honest with you. People don't like when we do this because we're supposed to act like we're not who we are. That is a little uncomfortable for me. It is. Because there is a stewardship argument there that a lot of times rubs guys like myself the wrong way, as if the sport, if it's in the hands of the athlete or the sport, if it's on the back of the athlete, is not as viable as it is if it's in the hands of the oftentimes older white millionaire guy. And whereas that's not supposed to be like, what we're talking about. We're talking about college football. We love college football. But it's sort of elephant that you can't help but ride at some point.

[Joel Anderson]

No, I feel that. I feel that. Yeah. I mean.

[Tate Frazier]

I mean, that's the subtext of all these conversations.

[Joel Anderson]

Absolutely.

[Tate Frazier]

Nick Saban said that. I mean, he said it's an arms race who spins the most, best chance to win, but I think it's a race to the bottom, because if you don't spend a win, you lose your fan base and you don't have any revenue. So it's like this very, like, existential threat that he's putting out there about the sport.

[Joel Anderson]

I'm sorry you're so scared of capitalism. You know, the people that have the most money have the most advantages, and they take the end. They take advantage of it, and then the team. The people that don't have any money get their ass kicked. And they live at the bottom of things, and it's very tough to get up every day. Welcome to reality, sir. Okay, sorry, sorry. That you can't be the overseer that you used to be 15 years ago.

[Van Lathan]

I never knew this about.

[Tate Frazier]

Overseer is kind of the right word.

[Van Lathan]

Overseers. Crazy. You can't come hang out with me and Hasan Piker now. You can't be. You can't chill with us no more. I thought you was one of us.

[Joel Anderson]

Wait, do you really be hanging out with Hasan Piker? Of course you do. Of course he did. I saw you on stage. I saw Tate. I saw Van on stage talking to somebody, man. Who was that? It's that guy from the Bulwark.

[Van Lathan]

Who?

[Joel Anderson]

You were on stage making people laugh. Who was that dude? What's that boy?

[Van Lathan]

Tim from the bull work. He's an LSU fan. Yeah, he's a.

[Tate Frazier]

He's a Tiger.

[Van Lathan]

What? You. He's a tiger. That's a tiger.

[Joel Anderson]

I got to fight with him on Twitter a few years, a few weeks, a few months ago.

[Van Lathan]

Now, this is what I'm talking about.

[Joel Anderson]

Let's see what happened with Tim Miller and me. I'm probably not gonna be able to figure this out.

[Tate Frazier]

Do you have, like, I'M saved like my beefs. And you have them in your.

[Joel Anderson]

I mean, you know, some. If a person is prominent enough or like, I felt like your argument was inane enough that I wouldn't. Okay, here he goes. Let's see. Okay, so here's Tim Miller on March 4. All the MAGAs I follow are retweeting Talarico tweets from five years ago. We'll see what the impact is, but it does reinforce my belief that the Dems would really benefit from finding an upstart in 2028 who emerged in 2022 and didn't really post during peak woke. And then I said, why should Dems give a shit at any critique from the magus? Can the people confused here not tell the difference between wanting good things to happen to people and wanting bad things to happen to them? Okay. And it goes on for a few more weeks. It goes off.

[Tate Frazier]

Right?

[Van Lathan]

So you said you and him got to. You and him got to a tiff. That's not what happened. You got Adam and. And now I want to hear. I want to hear what else?

[Joel Anderson]

So the reason them should give a shit is because this is from Tim, is they are going to need to earn the vote of some people who voted for Trump but are unhappy now. And I don't want to say that those people struggle with the difference you present, but maybe it would help to at least try not to give them an excuse to tip the wrong direction. And I said, I'm not saying there's people who won't become Trump Talarico voters, but I'm of the assumption that they're so small a number and people who clearly have no real core political beliefs that it's much more likely that they won't vote at all. And then we kept going for a little bit longer. I mean, again, you know. Yeah, I just don't like that shit when people. Anytime somebody is starting to use woke as, you know, a reason for why things went wrong and the excesses of 2020 wokeism or whatever, I just think that's bullshit and you falling for it. You fell for the bait. And so when people use that word in public, I had to. I got to go with him, dog.

[Van Lathan]

I have to say something here.

[Tate Frazier]

I have to say something very scout with Brian from you, Joel.

[Joel Anderson]

Yeah, sorry. Is that what he did?

[Van Lathan]

Okay, I have to say something here, though. Okay, now, once again here, I think you and Tim are having two different arguments. I think you're having. I think you're having an argument about what should happen and he's probably having an argument about what did happen. And I think a lot of times when we're talking about all of this stuff, we end up talking past each other. Because some people live in the world, guys like you and me, we get triggered. Or I love to speak for myself, I won't say what triggers you, because fucking everything triggers you. But we live in the should world a lot of times, okay. And the did world is sometimes un. Inconvenient for us. But it's difficult to say for me and not to turn this podcast into something else. It's difficult to say for me that a certain framing and obsession with identity didn't turn a lot of people off, because it almost certainly did. The question is. The question is to me, whether or not you completely pivot away from what you think marginalized communities and people need or whether or not you continue down into this sort of cynical. We don't discuss these types of problems anymore. And that's why you have political figures to kind of figure out what the best way to message is.

[Joel Anderson]

My thought is that we've bought that line of argument for a while, that you can scare people off by acknowledging that white supremacy is a thing or that maybe that there have been some excesses in police abuse and we should consider reallocating our resources. And they'll turn it into. You want to defund the police. So all the people. What I think that what Tim is doing.

[Van Lathan]

No, we said defund. We said what you just said. Some people said it. Not everyone defund the police. What you just said is the way to say it. But we said defund. And I'll still say defund. But when you say it, you have to come to terms with the fact

[Joel Anderson]

that it scares some people again. So. But this is the thing that Tim, your boy, Tim, your boy. This is your boy. Tim Miller said, okay, yeah, he didn't. He didn't like, stage made. His presumption is that there are people out there that were like, man, I really. I normally. I don't fuck with Democrats. I don't believe in the excesses of woke now and. But all of a sudden I may vote. I may decide to vote against Ken Paxton because he doesn't. Those people are always going to vote for those people. Like, they're never going to vote for James Tallarico. I think that is. The foolishness is that we believe that those people and that we give so much attention to these dummies, the handful of dummies that are like, well, yeah, man, I was Obama voter, and I'm a Trump voter. You are a fucking idiot dog. You don't believe in anything, and there's not enough for you to go vote. Most of you don't care enough to vote. You have no core political beliefs. And so, like, why are we just giving so much rhythm and attention and oxygen to these people that are a very small sliver of society, as opposed to people who might be inspired by, you know, what, that white boy is against white supremacy. I might get out and come to vote. I think there's more people that might get out and look at that and be like, oh, shit, he talking my language. I might come out and vote.

[Van Lathan]

So last thing I'll say, another core argument and disagreement. And this is the core argument and disagreement. The core argument and disagreement is whether or not you should create a voter or whether or not you should influence a voter. That's a. Some people will say, hey, get people who agree with you to go out and vote. I understand that. But what kind of flies in the face of the argument that you're making is that America elected Barack Obama twice, then Donald Trump, then Joe Biden, then Donald Trump again. So that means that there were certainly, certainly people who voted for Barack Obama twice and then voted for Donald Trump, and not just a handful of them, millions of them. There were certainly people who voted for Joe Biden and then voted for Donald Trump, and not just a couple of people, a lot of them. So if that phenomenon is either to you, if that phenomenon is a fringe phenomenon, then you can ignore that and just move on to something else. The problem is it's not. And pretending like it's not all the time and not even having a conversation robustly about what it actually is is the reason why the center left keeps losing. Because I want you to listen to something real quick. Chuck Schumer said out of his mouth, what did he say? Do you remember what Chuck Schumer said

[Joel Anderson]

about the rural voter? You remember what he said? No.

[Van Lathan]

Schumer said, we can afford to ignore the rural voters in parts of America that, like, have rural people living in them, because we can run up the score with the suburban voters with. We can double the. Our presence with the suburban voters that. That might have not loved us before, but we can make more of them. He was wrong. And so, like, he legitimate. He was wrong. He was wrong. Those voters are more sophisticated and they demand a more sophisticated candidate. So a lot of times it's easier to turn them off. What happened was the Democrats lost their speaking mechanism to rural Voters and people like that come from where I come from, and now they can't speak to it. And so like that, the strategy that you're actually talking about, in my opinion, and I'm to the left of all of these guys, it actually was tried and it did not work.

[Joel Anderson]

I don't think so. And I think every election year is different and every candidate is different. And so the thing is, is that in some years, put Joel in a body, the Democrat, the Democratic candidate is somebody who they've never voted for before. At that scale, there could have been a lot of voters that were like, I don't want to see a black woman up there. Which I. Now I'd be more interested in having an argument about whether a black person should run a president again, which I don't think. But. But that that person may look at Kamala and be like, well, I'm definitely not voting for no woman and a woman who doesn't have biological children and. And also who used to date Willie Brown. And also she won't speak out against for Palestine. You know, she won't speak.

[Van Lathan]

She won't.

[Joel Anderson]

She won't speak to the abuses, all that stuff for those people. So every year is different. And so again, the course, there's people that some years they're like turned off by wokeism or whatever, but there are also years that the people that would be convinced on other sorts are less inspired to come out and vote. And like, they would if you spoke to their desires and the kind of politics they want to hear about. That's all I'm saying. And again, I understand that this is probably more fantasy, but I feel like we've tried the other way. It hasn't. Well, we're in hell right now. Things are going really poorly. I feel like we've tried.

[Van Lathan]

Which way do we try?

[Joel Anderson]

We've tried. We've tried the.

[Van Lathan]

The. Wait, which way?

[Joel Anderson]

We try left, right, like the. The, you know, almost like the kind of centrist type of argument. We don't want to offend them. Poor people over there in north. And in Iowa or Ohio.

[Van Lathan]

Who tried it?

[Joel Anderson]

Or Florida.

[Van Lathan]

Who tried that?

[Joel Anderson]

Who tried what?

[Van Lathan]

Tried that. Who tried that one?

[Joel Anderson]

I don't think. I don't think. I don't. And Biden, I think. I don't think. I don't think they were like, over, you know, who's the leftist?

[Van Lathan]

Do you know?

[Joel Anderson]

No, they never would. What are we doing?

[Van Lathan]

We gotta get back on time. But what is that sound? Who's talking?

[Joel Anderson]

Did somebody come in to break in oh, no, but look, you lost control of the show, man.

[Van Lathan]

Controller, I'll say this, the last thing I'll say.

[Tate Frazier]

I just have one wrap up statement and then we'll go to the story of the week.

[Van Lathan]

After you get the people. The people who. The people who tried that really, that, that kind of. From a. From a democratic situation. The people who tried that were more like Barack Obama tried that. Right? That's what Barack Obama did. Barack Obama ran.

[Joel Anderson]

I mean, he talked about inclusion, but

[Tate Frazier]

I mean, like, it was a weave. There are a lot of people.

[Van Lathan]

Wait, wait, wait.

[Joel Anderson]

Hold on, hold on, hold on. Is Obama left? Who do you think is more right of those two?

[Van Lathan]

Joe, let's talk about what Barack Obama ran as. Barack Obama ran as an anti gay marriage, immigration, hawkish, pragmatic, arms around you, centrist Democratic figure. He was. He was seen in order to demonize Barack Obama. They made him look like at that time, like he was running to the left of aoc. But he didn't. He never did. He didn't at all. And neither did Bill Clinton.

[Joel Anderson]

Everybody's politics feels different depending on who the candidate is.

[Van Lathan]

The candidate. I understand what nobody.

[Joel Anderson]

Obama.

[Van Lathan]

Hey, hey, hey, Joe. I get it. But what I'm telling you right now, he also ran one of the greatest campaigns of all time. But what I'm telling you is if you're talking about policy, that's a separate conversation. Like, because if I'm not talking about not having a conversation about, like, reallocating the wealth of police budgets and talking about how we can reinvest that into neighborhoods and into cities, I'm never gonna stop talking about that. I'm never gonna stop saying defund the police. But this is the last thing I'll say. I'll tell you that when I went back to Baton Rouge and I said it to my mother and my grandmother, they said, you don't know where the fuck we at. They said, you come from here and you come back here and you try to. But we need the police around here and we don't like that. That's what they said. And so when I went back to where I'm from, I thought, you know what we should do? We should think of a way. I'm not gonna stop saying defund, because that's what I believe. But I also understand that. I'm not talking about the leftist crazies and people like that or, excuse me, the maga Right. Crazies or people like that. I'm not talking about that. I'm talking about people who I know People who. I love, people who marched and did all of that stuff. And they were like, hey, Van, guess what? We feel safe with the police around here. I looked at them and I have to have conversations with them, conversations with my people about why they're not safer, about why police presence honestly, and actually is something that keeps us in the cyclical nature of mass incarceration. Have to have all of those conversations

[Tate Frazier]

back to Overseer, as you talked about.

[Van Lathan]

But. But absolutely. But it does not mean, though. It does not mean that from a rhetorical sense, I'm not going to learn lessons that it seems like the left is slow to learn election cycle after election cycle after election cycle and just say, hey, we're not doing anything wrong. It's just that sometimes the evil people win. It's not going to work.

[Joel Anderson]

I'm going to leave it on this. And then. And then take. We can move on. I know those same kind of people. One of them is my mom. Love her. Have those conversations. And I just refuse to concede the rhetorical argument because I think we're always doing that. And it doesn't. I don't. I don't think the other side has worked. But again, you know, I get what you're saying. I just don't think that what I'm saying is. Is pie in the sky leftist hunt. Okay?

[Van Lathan]

It's not. I'm to the left of you, and I know that because you support capitalism. You support. You support so much capitalism. Like, it's like. So I'm to the left of you. But. But what I will say, though, is I'm not. He's not my dog, but that's my guy. He's my guy. Hey, you know what? By the way, that's my guy. And I'll tell you something else.

[Tate Frazier]

He's Italian.

[Van Lathan]

I could put you on blast. I could put you on blast with some of that.

[Joel Anderson]

By the way. You know what happened.

[Van Lathan]

Go ahead.

[Joel Anderson]

I don't give a. You know what I'm just realizing? I'm just realizing. I'm just realizing that Brian had Tim Miller on the press box and never thought for a second to ask me to be in that interview.

[Tate Frazier]

He probably saw your.

[Van Lathan]

Wait, but me. Me and Tim argue all the time. You wasn't gonna say all you was gonna do.

[Joel Anderson]

I mean, I said it to Tim's face on the Internet is no less me talking.

[Tate Frazier]

They were a little too Woke back in 2022.

[Joel Anderson]

Why would I not say it in his face?

[Van Lathan]

How can we? Cause we didn't had you before with People that you was talking about.

[Joel Anderson]

It was a different thing. It was a different. That's. That was different. That was different. It never came up on Paul's show. But that's fine.

[Tate Frazier]

Next time. You got him. Next.

[Joel Anderson]

Next time. Yeah. He has me on to talk about Jesse Jackson, man. I was. What to talk about Jesse.

[Tate Frazier]

One, one last thing. A person can always be smart, but people are always stupid. So anytime you're trying to speak to people, you know, that's always. I feel like a tough game. So try to speak to people. It's tough speaking to a person. It always works out. Let's get the story of the week. Texas Tech's Joey McGuire said he's called Abilene Christian and Texas State in efforts to schedule Texas. And we talked about Sark's comments last week about how he was talking about, you know, Texas Tech, easiest schedule. The twos and threes could go undefeated with their schedule. And Joey McGuire said. I heard what he said, and now I'm calling his bluff. We are trying to play them in week one. Van, do you like this behavior from Joey McGuire? Because I do.

[Van Lathan]

I want to hear Joel on this. Love it, but I want to hear Joel on this Joel special. I want to hear Joel on this.

[Tate Frazier]

He's not fine bombing.

[Van Lathan]

Oh, no, you're not. Because this is the type of. That you with.

[Joel Anderson]

Okay, well, look, I mean, yeah, I do think Steve Sarkeesian and the Longhorns are being some hoes. You know what I'm saying? You talk this shit. They offered you to fade and you've declined it. Okay? But the most important thing. That is outrageous. Outrageous. I'm fucking sick of Texas talking like it's Alabama. I'm going to give you some trivia. Texas joined the Big 12 in 1996. Final season was in 2023. How many conference championships do you think the Longhorns won in this league where their twos and threes could go undefeated today? How many championships you think they won over that stretch?

[Tate Frazier]

I'm going to go four.

[Joel Anderson]

They won the first and the last ones, and they won one with Vince Young, and they won another one, Colt McCoy. If Oklahoma is popping this shit, I probably could live with it. They legit ran the Big 12 and they were the standard. If you were going to be the motherfucker in the Big 12 in that era, you had to be Oklahoma. But who. Who the fuck is Steve Sarkeesian talking to? I mean, like, let me, Let me, let me first. I mean, to say nothing of the fact that TCU won four. Eight of the last 12 games against Texas before they ran their ass out to the SEC, they were 12 and 7 against Kansas State in the Big 12. 11 and 18. Bill Snyder, 6 and 6 versus West Virginia. Think about how many coaches they have there. They're 2 and 4 all time against BYU. Like, what? Who do y' all think y' all are, bro? You were in the Big 12. You did. You had plenty of opportunities to do so. And you. And. And you had all the advantages then. You could stack your rosters. You could offer more shit because they couldn't pay the players. And when all the odds were stocked in your favor, you won four championships over 27 years. So I just don't want to hear that shit. You know what I'm saying? So, look, you could have won the Big 12. You could have run it with your twos and threes, you dummies. What happened in the playoffs a year ago when Kenny Dillingham in Arizona State, the champion of that league that you dissing, was a fourth down conversion and double time, double overtime away from beating the best Longhorn team in years. So, again, I just like people like it is. That's why I don't concede the argument again, because Texas thinks they can pop this. Like, I don't know who they are, but I know who you are, dog. You're eight and four against TCU in the Big 12. Error. Okay, so, like, you can't. You can't do that with me. I'm not falling for that magic that everybody else gets fooled by.

[Van Lathan]

So can I just say that this is another argument that you seem to be making for Billy Gill's flex idea?

[Tate Frazier]

Yeah.

[Joel Anderson]

You know what? I was thinking that, man, and he's right. This is a good idea.

[Tate Frazier]

Where is Billy, by the way?

[Van Lathan]

Oh, wow. Where's Billy today? Oh.

[Joel Anderson]

Oh, we know where he is, Joe.

[Van Lathan]

Thank you. No, no, we don't know where Billy at. He's in Sweden.

[Tate Frazier]

He's in Sweden?

[Van Lathan]

Yeah.

[Tate Frazier]

He's a Swedish fish. Yeah.

[Joel Anderson]

Oh, yeah. We should have told people at the top of the show that Billy wasn't gonna be here because they stopped bitching about it in the comments. Well, I had to watch this whole episode to see if Billy was gonna be here, and he wasn't here. He wasn't here. Sorry.

[Tate Frazier]

Spoiler.

[Van Lathan]

Anyway, what's your problem?

[Tate Frazier]

To a character that went for the smoke and now Joel has leaned all the way in. He's going for everybody.

[Joel Anderson]

Wait, y' all haven't said, you know, that. What? Van, what was your what was your van said?

[Van Lathan]

He loved it on Texas. I love this. Like, to me, I agree with you. Like, I agree with the fact that. And I agree, honestly, that if Texas don't decide that they want to play Texas Tech, then Texas is pussy.

[Tate Frazier]

That's right.

[Van Lathan]

I'm being straight up. If right now you can't do that. You can't call somebody's hands and then turn it down right now. If you want to. If somebody. If you want to turn it down. If you want to go around, turn this shit down, turn it down. If you want to turn it down, but you specifically can't call somebody's hands, then turn it down. If I'm Sarkeesian, I'm like, fuck it, let's line it up. I'm looking for a way to get this gameplay. I know it's bullshit in Illinois, but at least I'm coming out and acting like I want to get the gameplay. Since you said what you said, you can't call somebody hands and turn the shit down. You can't.

[Tate Frazier]

Yeah, it's rules of engagement. He shot first, and then they're ready to shoot back. And now he's like, oh, no, we're not trying to do that.

[Joel Anderson]

Yeah, yeah. I mean, stereotypical ho. I would expect it from that program. It's just. Again, who the do y' all think y' all are, dog? I mean, again, we've seen you, man. You were in the Big 12. All this you popping now. You had to. You had. You had almost 30 years to prove that you were who you say you are.

[Tate Frazier]

It just felt like a very strange thing for Sark to do. But I do think he was in an SEC setting, so he kind of had the SEC see propaganda around him. He started feeling himself a little bit, decided to call out the Big 12, you know, Kirby's. For his boosters to call out Texas Tech. Yeah, Not a good move.

[Joel Anderson]

Yeah. You're not Kirby. Smart dog. You're not Nick Saban. I don't know who the you think you are, bro. With something first.

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[Joel Anderson]

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[Tate Frazier]

[e-mail] Mike Leach is on the 2027 College Football hall of Fame ballot, and that also features cam Newton and RG3. Pretty good ballot, right, Ben? You look at those names?

[Van Lathan]

I do. I think it's a great ballot. I'm looking forward to Coach Leach's contributions to college football to be recognized. He was like a signature staple in college football. I think RG3 is a no brainer. It's a good, it's a good group. Good group. We've had a conversation before. What makes a College Football hall of Famer? Obviously, if you win the Heisman, right. You're. You're into the concept.

[Joel Anderson]

Not always.

[Van Lathan]

Yeah, okay. Who's, who's not in it.

[Joel Anderson]

That's a great, that's a great point. You know what? I think maybe every Heisman is that. I don't know. Let me see if Eric Crouch is in the hall of Fame. Eric Crouch, I would assume if he

[Van Lathan]

was what, a Heisman Trophy.

[Joel Anderson]

Yeah, Yeah, I know, but I'm just saying everybody ain't treated the same. Everybody don't. You know, hold on. But you probably right. Let's just see. He was officially inducted into the College hall of Fame as part of the class of 2020. Okay.

[Van Lathan]

Yeah.

[Joel Anderson]

That was back to when if you went.

[Van Lathan]

If you win a Heisen Trophy.

[Sponsor Voice]

That's right.

[Van Lathan]

I would expect that you would make the college award.

[Tate Frazier]

I feel like if you win any of those awards, Maxwell Award, Ray Guy Award, Belitnikov, whatever it is, I think if you win as the best player, your position, you're probably.

[Joel Anderson]

Oh, I'm looking it up because I was looking it up earlier about what the standard is. And. Yeah, it's like, if you're All American on a first team, All American on, like, a recognized team, you know, that makes you eligible as well. There's a couple other things that get you.

[Tate Frazier]

I wonder if, like, Manta Tea will

[Joel Anderson]

be, oh, yeah, bro, this. Like, we undersold how crazy this class is. I'm gonna throw Alan Fanica, Troy Edwards,

[Van Lathan]

Percy Harvin, Alan Sebastian, Jaka.

[Tate Frazier]

Wow.

[Joel Anderson]

MARSHawn Lynch, Colt McCoy, Kellen Moore. Blindside himself. Michael or Patrick Peterson, Antoine Randall, L. Sammy Watkins. Terrell Sucks, man.

[Van Lathan]

By the way, all of these guys are making it. Like, who doesn't?

[Joel Anderson]

I don't know. But there's so many people that are on this ballot that. Yeah, I just.

[Van Lathan]

I don't.

[Joel Anderson]

I don't. I mean, I would. I would be inclined to put everybody on there just by looking at the name, but.

[Tate Frazier]

Yeah, you want Pavia in. In a few years.

[Joel Anderson]

Yeah, I mean, I think pop, man. I just. Like, he. If he had only done it at one of the two schools, I'd say one thing. But to do it at both schools that are traditional doormats, that's what elevates this case to me. But about Mike Leach, man, that. You know, the foundation basically changed the rules to include Leech on the ballot because the barrier for entry used to be that the winning percentage had to be like 60% and Leech was like 59.6%, something like that. And so that they lowered it to 5.59.5% to basically, he could be eligible. He could get in there. I think Jackie Cheryl is another guy. And I mean, the thing is, that's just one of those things where sometimes record is deceiving because his influence on the game is just crazy. Like, it's hard to talk about the last 20 years of college football without talking about Mike Leach.

[Tate Frazier]

The air raid changed everything. Also, the best interview after a game, before a game, at any point. Mike Leach.

[Joel Anderson]

Mike Leach. Mike Leach once talked to me for three hours, until 2am in the morning. And he talked about his group chat with his old BYU rugby guys. And he was telling me about how he met a dude named Pete at a pizza parlor in downtown Palo Alto. And he was like, yo, we were. Every time we get together, we made fun of this redheaded guy that ran for Oregon, and we called him Pete. And he was like, man, I wonder what happened to Pete. He spent like 40 minutes telling me that story over and over again. Just. Just. I mean, just One of the easy. And every national college football writer has a story like that with Mike Seuss. Just, I mean, I'm sorry. Mike Leach, he's just one of a kind man and just the character alone. And at the schools he had to win it like Washington State, Mississippi State, Texas Tech, those are all schools that have historically been hard to win at. So, yeah, man, we got to get Mike Leach in there.

[Tate Frazier]

He also walked to campus while he was at Wazoo. So, like there were all these stories about like he would be walking to campus. It was like Forrest Gump when he was running around the country. And then people started following him. Like, Mike Leach would just have like people caravanning behind him, you know what I mean, as he walked to campus.

[Joel Anderson]

So have y' all ever been to Pullman Washington before?

[Van Lathan]

I have, I have not really.

[Joel Anderson]

If that is. You've been most remote. Yeah, like three times. Like three times. I, I did a, a profile on Gardner Minshew. I covered Mike Leach's class.

[Tate Frazier]

That was on great College day game. Justin Herbert versus Minshew.

[Joel Anderson]

Yeah, man, Dusty mentioned the mustache, bro. The whole. Yeah, that was a real fun profile. And gardener, I got real good access to him.

[Tate Frazier]

But yeah, man, that is a football school. That's like an SEC football school in the middle of the Pacific Northwest. Like, they are die hard fans.

[Joel Anderson]

Ain't much to do up there, bro. This is, it is, it's beautiful.

[Tate Frazier]

It's beautiful in the summertime, like when the hills. Well, the hills are green, you know what I mean? It looks like Rome. That's what a bill, bro.

[Joel Anderson]

Actually, I was there in winter when there was snow on those same hills and it was gorgeous. It looked like some Ansel Adams type. Like just, just beautiful terrain.

[Tate Frazier]

Also like legendary coaches from up there. George Raveling was there.

[Joel Anderson]

Mike Price. Roll, Ty Roll, you know?

[Tate Frazier]

Yeah. Tony Bennett. Yes. I mean, some incredible characters. So shout out to Mike Leach. That's a great story. Next up, USC quarterback Jade Maeva tells Pete Nakos he has, quote, a lot to prove heading into his senior season. And he followed it up. I don't think there's anything I've accomplished yet. I don't even feel the tiniest bit successful yet. Van, do you like that quote?

[Van Lathan]

I do. Because it tells me that that fire is still in your belly and you're ready to roll.

[Joel Anderson]

You're ready to rock.

[Van Lathan]

Always like people saying that, like they, they haven't really gotten there yet. Even if we know that they kind of really have. But that's what you have to say because we always want that fire to be burning deep down low.

[Tate Frazier]

I like it. That fired me up. Yes. Next up, Paul Feinbomb.

[Joel Anderson]

Wait, I didn't get to say what I felt about Ch my.

[Tate Frazier]

Do you care? Do you have anything to say?

[Joel Anderson]

I did. You know what I'm saying? All right.

[Tate Frazier]

What do you have to say? I'm sorry.

[Joel Anderson]

I mean, not that it's not that much, to be honest. I just. I was going to say that seems fair. I mean, but it didn't seem like

[Tate Frazier]

you had much to say.

[Joel Anderson]

Yeah, I was kind of overselling it. You know what I'm saying? But whatever.

[Tate Frazier]

You think he was overselling it or

[Joel Anderson]

he is, but also, I had. Yeah.

[Tate Frazier]

All right, next up, Paul Fine Bomb, Joel's guy, one of his favorites. He came out and said he is. He's basically ripping the NCAA for denying Texas text requests for reinstatement for Brandon Sorsby. He basically said that they're the most hypocritical organization in the history of mankind and said that he should basically only miss three games instead of the whole season. Joel, I'll go to you first here. This is your guy. Fine Bomb. Do you agree?

[Joel Anderson]

Yeah, Fine Bomb and I were texting about that earlier because, you know, I said something very similar last week. I'm just joking. My jokes ain't going. I ain't ringing off.

[Tate Frazier]

Would you. Would you agree that. Do you own his show? If he said that, would you.

[Joel Anderson]

Would you say what?

[Tate Frazier]

If you were on his show and he said this to you, would you agree?

[Joel Anderson]

You know what? I agreed up until a few days ago, and I rethought this because, man, there's really only a few hard and fast rules to sports and athletics, man. And it's like, you kind of can't bet on your team, you know, like, period. You can't bet. Yeah. And like. And they've. I mean, the evidence that came out at the hearing was that, you know, he'd been. He betted. He was betting when he was in Cincinnati and he was betting at Texas Tech up until recently. And then he only stopped because they found out that they, you know, investigating him. And again, I did this. To me, that does suggest that he has a problem that maybe he is an addict and needs to get.

[Tate Frazier]

Because he couldn't bet in Texas, but he was sending out his picks to

[Van Lathan]

people in other states to make sure that it seems like it was a compulsion. He had to do it.

[Joel Anderson]

Yeah. And again. But. And that is really sad and I hope he gets help for. But I kind of get like, if you can't, the NCAA has to hold the line somewhere. And if he doesn't play again, you know, they just can't let him play in college football anymore. Man. That sometimes there are things that you do that can end your career. And it's happened to a bunch of guys who've gone on to have great NFL careers. And so he still has a whole. His whole life ahead of him. But I actually rethought that, man. And it's. And it's not just because Paul agreed with me last week.

[Van Lathan]

So. So then you. What made you rethink it, though? Because it, you know, it's like for you, you always. You're so draconian in everything that you believe you are. What, Like, I've never heard you change your mind before. Like, what makes you change my mind all the time?

[Joel Anderson]

This is a. This is a false narrative. That's fine. I changed my mind all the time. It is. It is.

[Van Lathan]

You don't be changing your mind about shit.

[Joel Anderson]

I change my mind all the time. Go ahead.

[Van Lathan]

So then for him, for him personally, then what's the next step for him then? Like, what's the next step for this guy? It seems as if he's going to be made an example of in terms of gambling for the ncaa. What's next for Brendan Swordsby? It's supplemental draft. I know, we've talked about that.

[Joel Anderson]

Yeah.

[Van Lathan]

So talk about whether or not that's.

[Tate Frazier]

He's trying to file an injunction. He's trying to get basically a court to rule that he can play at some level. But, you know, a lot of. A lot of litigation ahead.

[Joel Anderson]

I mean, I'm sure he wants a piece of that 6 million and he doesn't want to have to go in the draft through the supplemental way. But, you know, I, I was kind of dubious about his pro prospects and then shout out, Quincy Avery hit me up and was like, no, man, some NFL teams would be interested in him. He's got good size. He said he thought he was the fourth best prospect in the draft that had the most athleticism, even over, like,

[Tate Frazier]

Taylor for next season or for this

[Joel Anderson]

class, for this past. This past class. And he was like, people are really interested in him. So some teams will spend a pick on him and give him a look. So, yeah, you know, so I. He's not. He can go on and have an NFL career. But I, I just hearing the arguments that people were making about, like, the reasons, you kind of have to hold the line on that stuff. You know, you have to make it punitive so that people don't think that they can do that. You know, he needs to be made an example of, unfortunately. Or you got. Or they just got to apply the rules as they always are and just, you know, move on. Move on and rule them ineligible and he can go into the supplemental draft.

[Tate Frazier]

So, yeah, there you have it. Yeah. Next up, draconian. Yeah, very draconian of you. Ole Miss head coach Pete Golding tells basically, I think it was Chris Lowe that he never considered leaving for LSU with Lane Kiffin. And here is the quote I wanted to give Van's thoughts on this. He said, that's not why I came here. This had been going on for two years. Whether Lane was going to leave. Even the Florida talk the year before, I was like, hey, bro, I love you. Don't get it twisted. I didn't come here for you. In quote. Do you believe Pete Golding?

[Van Lathan]

No.

[Tate Frazier]

But do you think he was asked to go?

[Van Lathan]

He was asked to go.

[Tate Frazier]

Okay.

[Van Lathan]

I don't know that Pete Golding. Because if I was to believe this, then what I'm being led to believe is that it's Pete Golding's dream to have a job at Ole Miss. And the reason why I don't believe that is because I don't know that there's very many college coaches that have a dream school. They have a dream situation, but have a dream school. I mean, I'm sure they're.

[Tate Frazier]

Maybe they're alma maters, but even then, people leave.

[Van Lathan]

Yeah. I mean, but, like, you know, like, you.

[Joel Anderson]

You.

[Van Lathan]

You look at people in there like, yeah, I would love to get back in coach Notre Dame, or I would love to get back and coach Michigan. I would love to get back and coach lsu. Like, but, like, for most college coaches, it's the situation is the dream. Right. And so when he says, I didn't come here for you, the question would be then, like, why did you come here? You probably did come there because Lane Kiffin was the head coach there, because Lane Kiffin kind of made that job. Not that Ole Miss doesn't have a football tradition, because it does. But Lane Kiffin would have been the reason why people would have followed to Ole Miss in that situation. So I don't know. It's kind of difficult to believe that he went to Ole Miss for any other reason than the reason that. That Lane Kiffin was the head coach at Ole Miss.

[Joel Anderson]

Yeah, I mean, I don't. The thing. I mean, Kiffin has shown. My ears are bothering me, dog. It was hurt Kiffin has shown proof.

[Tate Frazier]

Why'd you take your glasses off?

[Joel Anderson]

Yeah. Cause they hurt, man. It's just like the ear.

[Tate Frazier]

Oh. Like.

[Joel Anderson]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's why I stopped wearing them. I don't know. People know. But anyway.

[Tate Frazier]

Can you see us?

[Joel Anderson]

It's. It's difficult. I. I could not. I can't really see. Even when Van was asking me, what's that on his shirt? I wouldn't know what Deadpool was anyway. But I can't. I can't. I could. You don't even.

[Tate Frazier]

You don't know who Deadpool is. Just.

[Van Lathan]

You don't know who.

[Joel Anderson]

I know. It was a movie. He's a guy always a comic book character.

[Tate Frazier]

They turned him into.

[Joel Anderson]

Okay. Right. Go. Kiffin has shown proof of concept in Oxford. It's possible to win and compete for a national championship there. And so Hugh Freeze did, too. Hugh Freeze it. And Golding, he earned a lot of notice for having worked for Nick Saban and. And Lane Kiffin. But it's not like anybody was talking about him for a head coaching job as good as Ole Miss. Like, I saw that was like, maybe he might go to Arkansas, maybe he might go to Memphis, that kind of stuff. But Ole Miss came open. You damn right he didn't want to leave. He could. Like, there's an opportunity to win there, and they've got. They've shown that they've got the support. They're willing to put the money up. So, yeah, why would he go?

[Tate Frazier]

And you get one of the best quarterbacks in the country and one of the best running backs in the country coming back to play for you. So that's a nice haul there. And also he can focus more on the defensive side of the football. That is his forte. So a pretty good spot for Pete Golding. Last story of our top five. This is kind of fascinating. NC State had a season opener that was supposed to be in Brazil, and now it is being moved to Charlottesville. They're not going to play the international game. This has been in talks for the past couple of weeks from what I've heard, because of logistics and other things involved. But, yeah, this game no longer in Brazil now will be in Charlottesville. People are saying there's a Fogo de Chao, which is about 30 minutes away from, you know, Charlottesville that they could go to if they need to have the feeling of Brazil. But pretty strange. The international push seems to be falling by the wayside a little bit. Van, do you read into this at any level?

[Van Lathan]

Yeah, the international push, to me, for College football is all. Is always misplaced to me. So international push. There's nothing, okay? The NFL is having a hard enough time translating this very directly American sport, both by rule and culture, to an international fan base. Now take that sport, which is difficult to translate to an international fan base, and make it even more niche, because now is not the. The LA Rams that are playing now. It's the University of Southern California, right? What the fuck? It's like. It's not a thing. It's. It might look. It doesn't even look cool on TV to me. I don't like it. I don't like international college football. It's never going to work. Play the game in fucking Charlottesville, man.

[Tate Frazier]

I'm with it, man.

[Joel Anderson]

But is that why you didn't want to go, man? Because, look, Joel wants to go to Ireland, though, man. You know, we still can do that, man. We still could do that because I didn't get to go to Sweden, so, you know what I'm saying? We could do.

[Tate Frazier]

I mean, week zero you.

[Van Lathan]

And why didn't you go? Why don't you go to Sweden?

[Joel Anderson]

Oh, man, it was just hard.

[Van Lathan]

What's. What's the issue?

[Joel Anderson]

No, that's just. I mean, it's awkward. I mean, because I don't know if I was supposed to go or not, probably, but, you know, man, look, I have a lot of. To do with y', all, man. Y' all ask me, is it bad?

[Tate Frazier]

Is it bad for us that you do? Is it bad for the show?

[Van Lathan]

No.

[Joel Anderson]

To travel. To travel.

[Van Lathan]

Joe, what the hell is going on? I mean, how did you go to Sweden? Like, what's the deal?

[Joel Anderson]

I just kind of. It just kind of passed me by, to be honest. My.

[Van Lathan]

You know what?

[Joel Anderson]

And also real. Real. My. My assistant does have access to my working.

[Tate Frazier]

That's a very.

[Joel Anderson]

And I wonder. I wonder if she know. I would have given it more consideration. Hold on, hold on, hold on.

[Van Lathan]

Are you saying that in some way you couldn't go to Sweden?

[Tate Frazier]

Is it an obligation or a consideration?

[Joel Anderson]

I think it's. I think it's a strong consideration. Like, you really should probably go. I haven't been to Sweden yet at all. Because I think you're supposed to go pretty soon after you get hired, and I couldn't have gone then because our baby was a few months old. And it's tough, man. You know what I'm saying? I got to be here to take care of, you know, again, when you all call me away. That's really hard. We have to do a Move a lot of around to fill in me when I'm not here, dog.

[Tate Frazier]

Go ahead and box out some time for like, I think third week of

[Joel Anderson]

August I was gonna say, man, you know what? I don't think we're gonna do it now. I'm prepared.

[Tate Frazier]

I think we are.

[Van Lathan]

Oh, we definitely do it.

[Joel Anderson]

I'll race Billy anyway, by the way, it doesn't matter, but you know, there's this guy.

[Van Lathan]

So I want to say something about somebody who I'm really proud of. Back in the day I did a story and the story was about a kicker on UCF's team who left the college football team to be a YouTuber. Oh yeah, right. And so I did that story and I met that guy during that time and he has gone on. Cause during that time, leaving anything to do YouTube and social media and all of that stuff was like such a crazy idea. Even at that time. It was a crazy idea. He has gone on to become one of the Most gigantic sports YouTubers. YouTubers, period. His name is destroying. Do you guys know who I'm talking about?

[Joel Anderson]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. You ever heard of destroying?

[Van Lathan]

Uh huh. Yeah. So he's two E's, right?

[Joel Anderson]

Two E's.

[Van Lathan]

Yeah, two E's. And so I actually did that story.

[Joel Anderson]

Oh shit. That was you.

[Van Lathan]

Sports contacted him, talked to him, the whole nine. And I see his videos going crazy. I just watched one of his videos this past weekend where there was a kid who hadn't had a hot shower in two years that was out there routing people up in Arizona for like $10,000 and something like that. That's the kind of stuff, the one on ones that destroying does. I want him to actually help us with the ringer. A field day. I want him to help us with the. Because they had, they had. What's your man from the. From the 49ers out there. Do it all, player, for the 49ers. I know what I'm talking.

[Joel Anderson]

Oh, Debo. Oh no.

[Van Lathan]

Debo.

[Tate Frazier]

Yeah, sorry.

[Van Lathan]

They had Debo Samuels out there. They had Devin appear out there. I want to do this for the ringer field day. But half the people could be like destroying people who actually are good athletes. And the other half could be just

[Tate Frazier]

like, I show speed. Destroy.

[Joel Anderson]

I mean, I show speed. He made me a believer, man. Yeah, yeah. I don't think we gonna pull it off. I just, I don't think, I don't think, I don't think we're gonna successfully make that happen in the time.

[Van Lathan]

Because you, because you don't Want it to happen. You don't.

[Joel Anderson]

Look, I'll race Billy on in the street in front of the office. This I don't. That's not a problem.

[Tate Frazier]

That's not a field day. That's a shit.

[Joel Anderson]

That's how. But I don't care. I mean, but this all started because you all were dubious of the idea that I could beat Billy in a foot race. I'm gonna race him and then that'll be the point. Now, if we do anything else. Field day. That'll be great. I'll make sure to bring my cleats and some shorts. We're doing the field day, Austin Dad Fitness pro. You know what I'm saying? He getting me right now. You know, I'm. Look, man, the nutrition matters.

[Tate Frazier]

It's not just the workout.

[Joel Anderson]

Oh, yeah, the nutrition. No, look, man, I'm telling you, bro, I'm. I'm getting. And actually, I'm think. I'm thinking, you know what. Because I'm not above taking any PEDs, so, you know, if the. One of them shots.

[Tate Frazier]

If you take PEDs, it doesn't count.

[Joel Anderson]

No, no, no. Right.

[Tate Frazier]

If you take any sort of performance enhancement, that's that. Wait, a blockers or something.

[Joel Anderson]

Would a GLP1 count as a performance enhancer?

[Tate Frazier]

No, I'll let that.

[Joel Anderson]

All right, well, there you go. There you go.

[Tate Frazier]

I thought you're talking about like, steroids.

[Joel Anderson]

Oh, man. If I. Again, I'm gonna put out my call for hgh. Plug in the dmv.

[Tate Frazier]

Steroids in your system.

[Joel Anderson]

Hit your boy up. Because I'm. I'm not above it, man. I've actually. What I've heard from people, they take hgh, is that it's just like, great. Like, your skin is amazing. Like, your hair. Oh, the whole, like. It's a really.

[Van Lathan]

It's a problem with it, though.

[Tate Frazier]

I thought a lot of people lost their hair with that.

[Van Lathan]

Their head, it grows everything inside of. So if you have any tumors in your. Yeah, it grows the tumor.

[Joel Anderson]

So that's right.

[Van Lathan]

You gotta go get a whole full body scan before you do it.

[Joel Anderson]

Yeah, I would do that. I mean, I would be willing to. To do that. You know what I'm saying?

[Tate Frazier]

Last thing I wanted to hit before we do our parting shots. Ringer. Tailgate. Field day is happening. It will happen. Beef of the week. Last thing I just wanted to check in. Temperature check here. Joel versus Jay Z fans. Joel has been on Threads going after Jay Z fans. He's. He's saying Rockefeller Roc Nation is paying for these trolls and Joel, what's your beef with Jay Z and what is your real beef with their fans?

[Joel Anderson]

I don't have any beef with Jay Z. Jay Z is one of the greatest rappers of all time. I have all his albums. I know most of his songs. Songs. I'm a big fan of Jay Z, the rapper. Musician. And the problem is that. And I'm still. I can't. Me and Bomani are still. There's still people writing under Those comments under 9th wonder and fat Joe who are complaining about what we're saying about Jay Z, which was, I wonder if

[Van Lathan]

Fat Joe are complaining.

[Joel Anderson]

Yeah. Remember I told you they were in.

[Tate Frazier]

You and 9th Wonder have a beef. I think we have to get them on.

[Van Lathan]

Yeah,

[Joel Anderson]

I don't have a problem with. Nice one. We talked about this already. Y' all said y' all were gonna reach out to him. And again, because y' all don't follow up on nothing. Y' all not gonna talk to him. Y' all not gonna follow up on this either. What happened?

[Tate Frazier]

We're gonna reach out to him. We might race you on field day.

[Joel Anderson]

We don't follow up on nothing, man. So I'm not worried about it. I'm not worried about it. But what were we talking about?

[Tate Frazier]

Jay Z. You're.

[Joel Anderson]

Oh, yeah, Jay Z. Yeah. I'm not. I love Jay Z. But his. I mean, his.

[Tate Frazier]

But last week, you took shots at Drake. You on the show, and says he needs to grow up and he's immature and that you don't understand his music. So you would think by saying that, you would be on Jay Z side. Right? At least that's how I would view it.

[Joel Anderson]

Oh, I'm not on anything.

[Tate Frazier]

But then I get on Threads this week, and you're attacking Jay Z fans, and I'm like, what side is Joel on?

[Joel Anderson]

Well, no, I mean, the thing is, again, the fans are annoying. I guess I'm. I might be a person against all fans. You know, just when I think about it, only fans, and I'm against only all fans because I just don't come. Did y' all like that? Was that good?

[Van Lathan]

Get it? Yeah. Come on, man.

[Joel Anderson]

All right. Anyway. All right. But I mean, the thing is, is that. I mean, I just don't want to hear. I was trying to think about who would I get on the Internet for, like, which celebrity? A sports star. And I'll be like, you know, like, bonita betrayal. You bet. Nobody says, better not say nothing about Ms. Jenkins, you know, doing some like that. You know, you're.

[Tate Frazier]

You're the number These people are doing that.

[Joel Anderson]

That people are coming to my. Who you. You gonna say something about Jay Z? Huh?

[Van Lathan]

Oh, you.

[Joel Anderson]

Good enough. Good enough. Say nothing about no Jay Z. You know what the. Is your problem, man? You a grown man, dog. You're a grown man. You think your grandfather would be proud of you going on the Internet, riding that like, it's embarrassing. And so, yeah, so everybody knows that there's a joke about him wearing a wig, you know what I'm saying? What that hair is. We don't. Look, I. I know people said they allegedly turned up to people that untwisted his. His braids, whatever, and they say, no, that's his real hair. But there's a real question out there about whether or not that's a lace front joint. You know what I'm saying?

[Van Lathan]

That's not. There's no real question about that.

[Joel Anderson]

And it was a joke. And I put it out there on Threads. And then people got, well, maybe your mama want one. Maybe do you want one for your mom? And I'm like, damn. I was like, you got on the Internet, bro. Like, you have access to all this information. You can talk to whoever you want to. And that's what you wanted to say to me, you know what I'm saying? Like, I'm just trying to get my shit off on Threads, bro. You know I'm saying, follow me.

[Tate Frazier]

So you're just trying to crack jokes and you're saying that these people just have some fun.

[Joel Anderson]

Just have a little fun. I mean, I, like, again, the other week, you know what it is? Threads is going to get on my nerves. Because remember when I got into them fight with them people from Boston when I came out, that all was on Threads, you know, But I think. I don't know if it's bots or it's just like, people are trying to recreate the feeling of twin Twitter in 2014, but, you know, they want to start fighting with strangers. I'm like, what did you say about Jay Z? No, he talked about real. Did you not listen to where I'm from? You know, that kind of 444 was amazing. You know, like, you say, he's not deep. He's a billionaire. You never made a billionaire. You never made a billion dollars. Watch anybody. Listen. Listen to you.

[Van Lathan]

Okay, wait a second. So are you saying that you don't understand why people have such an affinity for Jay Z? Why they're such Jay Z fans? There's nobody. There's nobody that you would defend? Like, that is what you're saying no,

[Joel Anderson]

I was trying to think about it. Do. Who do you think is responsible for the advancement of more black people?

[Van Lathan]

Warren Moon and Jay Z. Warren Moon or Jay Z?

[Joel Anderson]

Yeah, War Moon and Jay Z. Think about it. I don't think about it. One of the first full time starting quarterbacks in the NFL. They created a whole generation of athletes that believed also an incredible jersey, a starting black quarterback, could thrive in the league. And that just in college the whole shit changed. And Warren Moon was at the forefront of that.

[Van Lathan]

Yeah, so, okay, this. Okay, so this is a great question. This is the type of shit that we should be doing. Fine, this is what I'll say. Okay, so Jay Z is influential in so many different spheres though.

[Joel Anderson]

Yeah.

[Van Lathan]

So he's influential with business acumen, he's influential on rap. And then as much shit as I have said about Roc Nation, and I've said a lot of shit because of the way I felt like Roc Nation dealt with the Colin Kaepernick thing. People get mad or whatever. I also do know a lot of activists, A lot of activists. I know a lot of activists and those activists will tell you a lot of them that when they need to be bailed out of jail, when they needed like legal representation, some of them when they needed their rent paid or to be sponsored, because you know, you gotta go places, that money would come from Jay Z and Beyonce. So if you're talking about the advancement of that, I'm not saying that there's not some cynicism there. I'm not saying that they haven't worked with people who I would not like, like for them to work with or that there hasn't been some times that capitalism has overshadowed what some of the stuff that they've done, what it's amounted to. I'm not saying any of that. But I am saying that that is still influence in that sphere. And if you talk to those people, people who are good people, people who lead the marches, who go to the things, who went to jail and all of that, they'll tell you how much the organization has done for them. So I don't know, I'd have to know more about Warren Moon's accolades.

[Joel Anderson]

Okay, yeah, well, here's the thing is that I'm glad and look, I'm amazed at what Jay Z managed to take from just having an extraordinary gift with words. Because that's what rap is at the end of the day, an extraordinary gift for words and wordplay and melody and everything else. Like he's one of the, he's Going to go down as one of the greatest musicians ever and raising to flip that and become a billionaire. Right? And then like marrying to a family that is. Has two billionaires. That is amazing. That is an inspiring story. That don't mean I can't have a critique of things he's done or not done and how he's treating people or not. No, no.

[Van Lathan]

I want to go back to the Warren Moon thing. That's fine.

[Joel Anderson]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. No, right, so any. Oh, yeah, my bad. I'm sorry. Yeah, you're right. You're right. Well, anyway, I'm a, I'm a Jay Z fan and I'm just saying about War Moon. And again, I was kind of joking. It's a joke, you know what I'm saying? I mean, although he's done a lot of, man, he was, you know, forefront of a lot of charities in Houston, man. And you, you know, he did a lot of work.

[Van Lathan]

Look, I'm not.

[Tate Frazier]

Yeah, he does.

[Van Lathan]

Yeah.

[Tate Frazier]

I'm looking up his. Yeah, he does. The Ronald McDonald House.

[Joel Anderson]

You know, he was a very influential guy.

[Tate Frazier]

Cystic Fibrosis Foundation, American Heart.

[Van Lathan]

This was the question, guys. I don't like this type of shit. This was the question, guys. The question was, who is more meaningful, influential to black people, Warren Moon or Jay Z? And then the, the statement was made that Warren Moon,

[Joel Anderson]

Amen. Ron Moon got a, a compelling story as well.

[Tate Frazier]

Joe, is your final answer, Warren.

[Joel Anderson]

But his dad, his dad died when he was 7 years old, man. He was the middle child among sixes, so he had to fight Claw. It didn't come easy for Warren Moon.

[Tate Frazier]

He also played in the CFL before

[Joel Anderson]

he played in the cfl. One of the greatest, maybe the greatest Canadian football Eskimo.

[Tate Frazier]

What team was he on?

[Joel Anderson]

Edmonton. The Edmonton Eskimos, they're now the Edmonton. There's something else because, you know, Eskimos, they had to change that. But yeah, man, I, but look, I know that Jay Z does a lot of great work and I'm. And I'm inspired by his gift, his gifts and the wealth and the life he's built for himself. I just still have some critiques of it and I think it's okay for me to critique him in public and if you come on there acting like a hoe, you know what I'm saying? Jay Z, he saved Meek's life. You know, come some shit like that. I just, I just, I think that's weird, you know, But I guess, you know, my grandfather would probably be looking at me like, why are you just Putting words in to. You spend so much time on this phone and with words. Why don't you get out and chop a tree or some. So, you know, I guess we all kind of hoes at the end of the day.

[Tate Frazier]

All right, that's a nice message there. We're all kind of hoes at the

[Van Lathan]

end of the day. No, Anderson, we all hoes at the end of this day.

[Tate Frazier]

Put that on a T shirt. That's nice. All right, there you have it. Van, any parting shots for the people?

[Van Lathan]

Hell, no. Yeah, that's a lot of potting right there. Y' all got all kinds of stuff. That's a lot of pod right there.

[Tate Frazier]

Shout out to y', all, man, for the off season. I mean, my goodness, we. We hit everything. We went all the way through the spectrum there. Joel, any parting shots?

[Joel Anderson]

No, man, I think we're all hoes. Check out the press box, man. I'm gonna be on there.

[Tate Frazier]

Are you plugging your other shots?

[Joel Anderson]

Yeah, man, I might as well. You know what I'm saying? We're gonna be. Brian's gonna check in from Sweden. You know what I'm saying? Like, it's just. It's that important. And we don't even talk about California, man. You know what I'm saying? Because, bruh, we. I know. I gotta go. We gotta have a man.

[Van Lathan]

I just.

[Joel Anderson]

Like this Spencer Pratt ends up being y' all mayor.

[Van Lathan]

I don't.

[Joel Anderson]

I don't know how I feel about that as a city that I should be moving to.

[Tate Frazier]

Well, we need you out here for another vote.

[Joel Anderson]

Oh, no, that's. That'd be a tough one, bro. I don't know. So, anyway, that's a developing story.

[Tate Frazier]

You know, not to bring up NAS at the end of this, but. Signs of the times, Joel. You know what I mean? That's. That's where we are these days.

[Joel Anderson]

But always bring it in, bro. I appreciate that.

[Tate Frazier]

Shout out to everybody for tuning in

[Joel Anderson]

to R Mo from la.

[Tate Frazier]

All right, thanks, everybody, for tuning in. I hope they can go look up Warren Moon and Jay Z and figure out who you would actually ride with on that debate. But we'll discuss that at a later date. Appreciate everybody tuning into the show, and we will see you all next Wednesday. Must be 21 or older in President. Select states for Kansas and affiliation with Kansas Star Casino are 18 and older and present in DC, Kentucky or Wyoming. Gambling problem. Call 1-800-GAMBLER or 1-800-MY RESET call 1-887-897777 or visit ccpg.org chatinceneticut or visit mdgamblinghelp.org In Maryland, Hope is here. Visit gamblinghelplinema.org or call 800-327-50 50 for 24. 7 support in Massachusetts or call 1-877-8-HOPE&Y, or text HOPE&Y in New York. For Louisiana, call 1-877-770-7867.