The Coaching Carousel: Lane Leaves for LSU, and What’s Penn St. Up To?

Summary

Ringer Tailgate: The Coaching Carousel — Lane Leaves for LSU, and What’s Penn St. Up To?

Date: December 3, 2025
Hosts: Van Lathan, Joel Anderson, Tate Frazier ("Joe House")
Theme: The seismic movement in the college football coaching ranks, the impact of Lane Kiffin’s controversial departure to LSU, Penn State's tumult, the role of power agents, and reflections on culture and loyalty in college football.

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Episode Overview

This episode dives deep into the chaotic world of college football’s coaching carousel, focusing on Lane Kiffin’s headline-grabbing jump from Ole Miss to LSU. The panel unpacks what this means for both programs, the shifting culture of college football loyalty, and the ripple effects around the country—especially at Penn State. Along the way, the crew delivers their trademark sharp analysis and irreverent banter, while exploring the outsized influence of agent Jimmy Sexton on the sport.

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Key Segments & Timestamps

| Segment | Timestamp | |------------------------------------------------|------------------| | Cold Open, Lane Kiffin to LSU: Initial Reactions | [03:00-10:15] | | The Nature of Coaching Loyalty & Culture | [04:15-13:00] | | Comparing Lane Kiffin and Brian Kelly at LSU | [10:15-18:20] | | Expectations vs. Reality: The Coach-Fan Relationship | [18:20-22:30] | | Main Character Energy: Lane as CFB’s Drama Magnet | [22:30-26:35] | | Coaching Carousel: Reactions Beyond LSU | [29:07-32:48] | | The Jimmy Sexton Segment: Agents' Power Over CFB | [44:00-62:13] | | Conference Titles & Playoff Chaos | [73:57-80:25] | | Big Van On Campus: Lessons for Ole Miss & Cautionary Tales | [86:34-92:01] | | Extended Banter/Banter & Stories, Show Close | [92:01-104:36] |

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Detailed Summary

Lane Kiffin Leaves Ole Miss for LSU: A Cold Game ([03:00–10:15])

Van Lathan opens with personal pride in “recognizing a problem and doing the root work” to bring Lane Kiffin to LSU. He calls the coaching carousel both what’s great and what’s “cold” about college football:

• “This is a cold game...everybody do a little soul-searching right now…how much does [your coach] really love your school?” —Van, [04:15]
• The group jokes about Lane's reputation for leaving jobs—“You don’t marry a lady like Lane Kiffin...always looking for something better.” —Van, [06:23]
• Joe House highlights how Lane Kiffin’s departure stings Ole Miss fans amidst a historic season.

Memorable Moment:
Van Lathan uses a Jay-Z lyric to sum up the modern relationship between fans and itinerant coaches:
“Our time together is our time together. Our time apart is our time apart. So love Lane with your mind, not your heart. Or you might get left at the airport.” —Van, [07:13]

Loyalty, Culture, and the Changing Coaching Landscape ([04:15–13:00])

• Van underscores that coaches like Woody Hayes or Joe Paterno—lifers deeply enmeshed with their schools—are gone:
  “Those guys don’t really exist like we think anymore...You might be next.” —Van, [06:01]
• The panel agrees: everything is transactional now, including the fan-coach bond.
• Joel points out the emotional whiplash for fans: “It’s hard not to either love or hate your coach,” [07:40]
• They note Lane evokes strong feelings—few “really like” him, most either tolerate or revile.

Lane vs. Brian Kelly: LSU’s New Chapter ([10:15–18:20])

• Comparing Lane Kiffin and Brian Kelly, Van insists Kelly underwhelmed at LSU—failing at talent development, especially on the offensive line and defense:
  “Worst special teams...worst defense we've ever had...no identity, and he simply wasn’t running a program on par with Lane Kiffin, at least these last couple of years at Ole Miss.” —Van, [11:12]
• Joel defends Kelly’s consistency but concedes LSU fans “never really loved him.”
• LSU’s expectations for Lane are sky-high, especially with his new contract making him #2 in salary:
  Current Highest Paid CFB Coaches:
  1. Kirby Smart (Georgia)
  2. Lane Kiffin (LSU)
  3. Ryan Day (Ohio State)
  4. Lincoln Riley (USC)
  5. Dabo Swinney (Clemson) — [19:09]
• Lane’s awkward press conference is noted—possibly a sign of feeling pressure:
  “He didn’t seem like he was quite in his own skin yet…hasn’t quite sunk in.” —Van, [19:44]

Main Character Energy: Lane & the Chaos He Brings ([22:30–26:35])

• Lane Kiffin is seen as the drama magnet of CFB; his departure becomes the main story because of his flair for the spotlight—complete with elaborate justifications and a flair for narrative control.
• Joel observes, “Absolutely, people are going to be hate-watching Lane Kiffin at this point,” [23:33]
• Joe lays out the timeline/rumors—Lane and his agent orchestrated this for months.

The Coaching Carousel: NBA, Not NFL ([29:07–32:48])

• Van argues CFB’s off-field drama is more akin to the NBA than NFL—storylines, personalities, and booster drama are woven into the experience:
  “The drama is an essential part...it’s much more like the NBA, a drama-filled league, than the NFL.” —Van, [32:48]
• Coaching moves at Florida, Auburn, Arkansas, and Oklahoma State are rapid-fire, many with playoff implications.

Power Broker Deep-Dive: Jimmy Sexton’s CFB Empire ([44:00–62:13])

Who Is Jimmy Sexton? ([45:13])

• Van: “Jimmy Sexton is the commissioner of college football.” — [45:18]
• His journey: Former roommate/agent for Reggie White, now agents for 14/16 SEC coaches.

How Sexton Controls the Carousel

• Negotiates contracts with buyouts/flexibility, normalizes massive salary escalation.
• Sets the terms for coaching musical chairs—schools fire his clients, then hire his other clients.

“His negotiations are like adding laws to the constitution of college football.” —Van, [55:35]

• Coaches at big playoff-contending schools increasingly rotate through his stable.
• “When we talk about what’s changed about college football…we oftentimes don’t talk about the movement of coaches and contracts. And that might be by design.” —Van, [61:40]

Ethical Debate

• Panel largely supports agents negotiating for coaches in the modern, capitalistic CFB world, but questions the insularity of hiring and how few Black coaches rise through the ranks:
  “If you’ve got all that power, Jimmy, put some more brothers on the wall.” —Joel, [58:14]

Memorable Exchange:

• “The only person who was completely happy was Jimmy Sexton. So there’s nothing nefarious about it...he decides when the domino falls.” —Van, [56:44]

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Penn State & The Shifting Sands of Expectation ([37:32–43:14])

• Joel runs through “blind” qualifications for a coach—revealing it’s James Franklin—and asks if fans would want that résumé.
• "All true, but…expectation. If we’re telling Penn State to lower their expectations, that’s one thing. They wanted to fuck. They kept getting everything else, but they wanted to fuck." —Van, [41:08]
• The group debates disappointment, patience, and the agony of “almost” programs.

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Playoff Picture & Conference Championship Weekend ([73:57–86:21])

Which Game Matters Most?

• Van picks BYU vs. Texas Tech as the game with the biggest playoff ramifications:
• “That’s the game that can signal the chaos...BYU wins, all hell breaks loose—especially for Notre Dame.” —Van, [75:47]
• The panel notes the oddity of a “meaningless” #2 vs #1 (Indiana vs Ohio State):
  • “I cannot think of a more meaningless two vs. one matchup. Even regular season ones meant more.” —Van, [76:46]
• Panel breaks down playoff hypotheticals, focusing on second/third at-large selection drama and the volatility around Notre Dame, Miami, Alabama, and more.

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Big Van On Campus: A Parable for Ole Miss ([86:34–92:01])

Van delivers his signature motivational segment—this time, a Hollywood allegory warning programs about over-identifying with a single charismatic coach.

Parable: The story of Lee Majors, Ryan O'Neal, and Farrah Fawcett. Lee Majors trusts O'Neal with his girl (Fawcett), she leaves him for O'Neal, and the two stay together for decades.

Message for Ole Miss:

“Be careful showing off your girl. Don’t make your coach your whole personality...when you identify too hard with the coach, you show your girl off—and there might be a Ryan O’Neal on the other side.” —Van, [89:55]

Hopeful note: Even the “Six Million Dollar Man” bounced back, just like programs can.

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Notable Quotes & Funny Moments

• On college football culture:
  “O line, D line, storyline. You put those three together.” —Tate, [32:48]
• Van on drama:
  “College football is more NBA than NFL. The drama is an essential part of the watching experience.” [32:48]
• On the Sexton effect:
  “He negotiated a contract…that made his departure from Ole Miss easier if the chancellor or AD left. His negotiations change the money, the calculation…It’s like changing the constitution.” —Van, [55:01]
• On Lane’s reputation:
  “Lane exists in two pockets: people who tolerate him, and people who revile him.” —Van, [09:05]
• Mocking the mess:
  “If you see any of us in public, feel free to raise the roof.” —Joe House, [01:38]
• On fan pain:
  “The only time you’re mad you didn’t have sex is when you expected it.” —Van, [41:00]
• On media narratives:
  “At some point, they’re gonna all say the same fucking shit because all the coaches are repped by the same fucking guy.” —Van, [69:59]

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Extended Banter & Show Close ([92:01–104:36])

Culminates in classic Ringer Tailgate fashion:

• Wild personal stories, digs about relationships, racing, old 70s love triangles, and inside jokes about wrestling, parties, and “showing off your girl.”
• Political sidebar: Diego Pavia, college football expansion, and social media antics.
• The show ends with everyone roasting each other and a reminder for listeners to join the live show on Saturday.

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Takeaways for Listeners

• Lane Kiffin’s LSU move encapsulates modern college football: ambition, drama, and transactional relationships.
• Cultural loyalty is dead: Van Lathan mourns the loss of coaches-institutions unions.
• Jimmy Sexton wields king-making power, shaping narratives and contracts to suit coaches’ interests, leaving schools (and sometimes fans) to scramble and adjust in his wake.
• The coaching carousel is CFB’s real “main character”— drama drives the sport as much as on-field action.
• Caution against over-investment: Programs that hitch their identity to one coach risk heartbreak when the next big offer comes.

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For Further Listening

Catch the crew live every Saturday or check out Wednesday drops for a weekly dose of analysis, banter, culture, and a pinch of chaos—wherever you get your podcasts.

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Note: All timestamps in MM:SS format as per transcript.

Transcript

[Joe House]

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[Joe House]

Chevrolet together, let's drive foreign.

Welcome back to Ringer Tailgate, the Wednesday edition of the show. We have a lot to get to. Lane Kiffin has finally made his decision. He did not need Jim Gray. He did not need the boys and girls club. He just needed a plane, a tarmac, and Marty Smith chasing him around. We'll get to all that. But first and foremost, let's say what's up to Van Lathan. Van, what's going on, man?

[Van Lathan]

This is a football.

[Joe House]

That's it. That is a football. Literally.

[Van Lathan]

There's no other where I'm ready to talk ball. We have no time for the today. This is a pack show.

[Joe House]

This is a pack show. It's national signing day, by the way. A lot of teams out there getting their top flight recruits nil money. Nlis being signed. Joel Anderson in the place to be in the TCU sweatshirt. Joel, what's going on, man?

[Joel Klatt]

What's up, bro? What's up, man? Good to see y'. All.

[Van Lathan]

Yeah, all three of us get every time. Yeah, we'll bring that back.

[Joel Klatt]

We're gonna bring that back.

[Van Lathan]

Just like, I mean, that's our thing. That and you know, I'm a G. Just like, you know I'm a G. That's right. And we. We gotta raise the roof.

[Joel Klatt]

Yeah, man.

[Joe House]

If you see any of us in public, feel free to do all that.

[Joel Klatt]

Hit us up with that.

[Joe House]

Yeah, raise that roof. Let's have some fun here. Ringer Tailgate is presented by fanduel. Fanduel's got it all. Same game parlays, quick bets for jumping in live and your way so you can build the that fits your play. Plus, you don't want to miss out on holiday offers and surprises all month long. Download the FanDuel app and head to FanDuel.com tailgate to get started. Must be 21 or older and present in select states or 18 and older and present in DC, Kentucky or Wyoming. Gambling problem. Call 1-800- gambler or visit rg-health.com, call 1-887-897777 or visit ccpg.org chat in Connecticut. And let's start. We usually start with the CFP rankings. We're gonna get to that a little bit later. Obviously, Hunter, your check was on TV last night. Giving some irrational, irrational rationale, I guess, would be the best way to put it. But we'll get to that a little bit later. Let's talk about the coaching carousel. And let's start with. They're calling it the lane train going down to lsu, but I think it should be the Lane plane because he has officially landed down in Baton Rouge. He's obviously got a history on tarmacs. This time it was a private airplane with different coaches getting on the plane. You had Ole Miss fans booing him, yelling at him, you know, throwing out all types of slurs and sayings as they boarded the plane. It was an insane setting, to say the least. Lane Kiffin has done the press conference. Van, I will go to you first because I have to give you a little bit of credit. You did the who do on the show, and now you have a new head coach down in Baton Rouge. How are you feeling after all this kind of Hale, melee, whatever you want to call it?

[Van Lathan]

I'm feeling great. No one gave me credit for the fact that I recognize that there was a problem and I got energy, work and root work into the situation. Out with the old, in with the new look. We're gonna talk a lot about Lane Kiffin. Everybody's talking a lot about Lane Kiffin. It's one of those situations to where it demonstrates both what's wrong with college football and what's right with college football. I have been less than enthusiastic about sneering and beating my chest in front of the Ole Miss fans because it's just not my nature. There's a lot of that happening. I understand what it must be like to be having the type of season that they're having and then lose your head coach while you're embarking on something historic. That sucks. I get it. But, you know, overall, my takeaways from this are twofold. One, this is a cold game and your college football coach.

The head of your culture, the cultural king of your land. Everybody do a little soul searching right now in college football and ask yourself how ingrained with your culture is that head coach? Yeah, he's recruiting. Yeah. He's talking to parents. He's talking to coaches. He's trying to get people in. But how much does he love Athens or Tuscaloosa? How much does that coach love Los Angeles? How much does that coach love the tradition and the history of the university that they're at? I know that that can be difficult to gauge and to measure, but everybody look around and ask yourself, if your coach gets a call from whomever. The NFL gets a call from the school that might be a little bit shinier and glossier, would they leave? And if you really do the soul searching, there are not very many coaches in college football that wouldn't. That wouldn't. Woody Hayes, not there. Bo Schembechler, not there. Joe Paterno, not there. Those guys don't really exist like we think that they do. Those guys who are inextricably linked to those schools, who help build those cultures and start those traditions and live for those traditions. That's as much gone as the player that we all want to have grown up dreaming to play for a school that is going to turn down an extra $100,000 in nil to go to a place that. That they always wanted to wear the uniform. This is where we are. And you might be next.

[Joel Klatt]

Damn. That's right. So do you think.

[Van Lathan]

Do you.

[Joe House]

Honestly? Yeah. Everything's for sale, I think is the best way to put it.

[Joel Klatt]

So do you. Do you feel that way about yourself right now, then, fan, do you feel like, all right, this is a rental?

[Van Lathan]

Well, I would feel like it was a rental if I thought that that rental was one year.

But you don't marry a lady like Lane Kiffin.

[Joel Klatt]

What kind of lady is he?

[Van Lathan]

A lady that's always looking for something greater. A guy who's always looking for something greater. Right. I said it on billboard.

[Joel Klatt]

A different opportunity. Yeah.

[Van Lathan]

You know, like, if he or she has dated around a lot and hasn't settled down quite yet, you have to be pretty naive to think that you're going to be the person that makes him or her settle down.

[Joel Klatt]

You probably couldn't make that person a housewife.

[Van Lathan]

Well, I'm not calling them a hoe.

[Joel Klatt]

I didn't say that.

[Van Lathan]

I don't look at it like that.

[Joel Klatt]

Okay?

[Van Lathan]

But this is the way LSU should deal with Lane Kiffin or any of these college coaches, and it comes out of the mouth of Jay Z.

Girl, our time together is our time together. Our time apart is our time apart. So love Jay with your mind and not with your heart. That is the way LSU should deal with Lane Kiffin. Our time together is our time together. Our time apart. Is our time apart. Love Lane Kiffin with your mind and not with your heart. Because if you do that, you might get left at the airport.

[Joel Klatt]

Man, that's just really tough because it's hard to not either love or hate your coach. It's very rare that you have a coach of your favorite football team and you're just sort of. I'm not committal on this guy.

[Joe House]

Like, he feels like Kalyn DeBoer is that guy for Alabama.

[Joel Klatt]

You know, I feel like he's kind.

[Joe House]

Of the perfect one.

[Joel Klatt]

I feel like most people hate him there. I feel like in Alabama, they're just. They waiting for him to fuck up.

[Joe House]

You know, they just won the sec.

[Joel Klatt]

I know.

[Joe House]

Well, crazy.

[Joel Klatt]

Yeah. But I don't. You feel like they're just kind of waiting for him to fuck up, you know?

[Joe House]

Of course.

[Joel Klatt]

Yeah. They want to see, you know, if he's going to be able to pull it off and if his next misstep, because I don't feel like there's any. And maybe this is the thing about Kaylin DeBoer, but you could have said it about Nick Saban, is that there's just. They're not, like, warm and cuddly. They're not characters. You know, they're not playing the Sam Pittman role in Arkansas. Like, they're not, but they're not trying to. Like, that's just. They're being authentically who they are and just kind of, you know, a hard driving guy who doesn't have a lot of time for fun. So, yeah, I don't. The thing about Lane is it's very hard to also not have an opinion about him. Right. Like, people either really like Lane and they swear by him, or there are a lot of people that don't like him. It's just very hard to enter a relationship with Lane and to just be like, well, that's just Lane, though.

[Van Lathan]

You know what? I actually disagree. I think that there's not many people I can think of that really like Lane.

[Joel Klatt]

Oh, damn. I was trying to be nice. I.

[Van Lathan]

Well, I think Lane exists in two pockets. The people that tolerate him and the people that revile him.

[Joel Klatt]

Damn.

[Van Lathan]

And if you're tolerating him, the question is why you're tolerating Lane. Because Lane delivers and relevance to your team and your program. I'm not saying don't love him. I'm just saying love him with your mind and not with your heart. Because if you start to think that Lane is at your school or a part of your program to leave an indelible cultural mark there for it to one day be the Lane Kiffin field or to have a statue or any of that stuff. That's not why he's there. He's there at your school for the enterprise of Lane Kiffin. The question is, what do you get out of it? Do you get memories? Do you get trophies? Do you get dominance? Do you get relevance? If you get those things square deal, fair trade? If you don't, then that's the problem. That's the way I look at Lane Kiffin as the head coach of lsu.

[Joel Klatt]

Didn't you just have that guy.

[Van Lathan]

No.

[Joel Klatt]

Brian Kelly, like, no. Who likes Brian Kelly? And everybody kind of like, he doesn't really fit with the culture down here, but we're making an arrangement with this guy because we think he can fit, finally get the most out of our talent. Like, we'll never really love him because he's not really us, but he's the.

[Joe House]

Guy that can, you know, he was barely tolerated. I think he was just in the reviled bucket. Yeah.

[Joel Klatt]

It wasn't long before he got there that people already were kind of like this guy, you know, And I just. I. You know, again, I. If you had asked me this question a year ago, if you had said, who's a better coach, Lane Kiffin or Brian Kelly? I probably would have said Brian Kelly, man.

[Van Lathan]

Yeah, I heard Bo say that. I disagree, and let me tell you why. The only reason why, the only people that would really say that is people who haven't been paying attention to LSU football. And let me tell you what I mean by that is. And I've heard. It's not the first time I've heard that, that, like, Brian Kelly overall, in totality, was.

Like, a better coach than Lane Kiffin. Sure. If you go back 10 years in the track record and all of that stuff, right. Then you're gonna find somebody who's accomplished more, who's done more and who's been more consistent. Right. But if you look at LSU since Brian Kelly's tenure there, during Brian Kelly's tenure, there were high highs, but also we put on the field the worst special team unit, special teams unit of all time. The worst defense of all time. When I say the worst of all time, I'm not using that as, like, that's not hyperbole with the worst defense we've ever had, the worst special teams we've ever had, and at a different point, one of the worst. Actually, I'm going to go out on a limb. This year's offense was the worst offense I've ever seen at lsu. This year's offense was an offense that I'm not sure is adept at anything. So you cannot look at Lane Kiffin in the last five or six years and say that now if you want to take their entire coaching career. If you look at Lane Kiffin, he had teams that had identity teams that were better than lsu, teams that beat LSU with transfer portal players and not quite the same type of recruiting classes. Another thing, let's take it out of just the win loss records. Let's look at the talent development that went on under Brian Kelly. If you look across LSU's offensive line right now, what you see is a lot of players who were pretty highly recruited, pretty highly recruited guys, guys that you know had some pretty decent stars by their name. But what you don't see is those guys ever fix things or get better individually or as a unit. You see the same types of problems. Something happened to Brian Kelly when he got to lsu. He was a different coach than what he was when he was at Notre Dame. The development wasn't the same. He had been consistently a great offensive line coach. We did not have great offensive lines at lsu besides one year where we could pass protect really well with Emory Jones and Will Campbell and. But we couldn't run the ball. There was a physicality missing, there was an identity missing, all kinds of those things were missing. And he just simply wasn't running a program that was on par with what Lane Kiffin has done at least the last couple of years at Ole Miss.

[Joel Klatt]

Well, I would say that he definitely didn't live up to his reputation.

[Van Lathan]

Right.

[Joel Klatt]

Like the bargain that LSU made and getting Brian Kelly again. We're going to get this very smart guy who's done more with less for most of his career and still been mostly competitive. Is going to take all that talent and now it's just going to explode. Right. And it didn't come to pass. But I mean he won 10 games twice, won nine games last year and I bet if he coached out the end of this year, they would have won nine games. Like the only game they probably flipped. That Oklahoma game possibly.

[Van Lathan]

He won nine. Nine games plus. Plus the bowl game, plus the goal when you include the bowl game.

[Joel Klatt]

Right.

[Van Lathan]

So that's an eight, that's an eight win regular season.

[Joel Klatt]

So nine win regular season, nine win regular season, eight win regular season. That's right, yeah.

[Van Lathan]

So when you, when you. No, no, look at the, some of those plus the ball game. I'm not saying that the bowl game doesn't matter. Yeah, but what I'm saying is some of those teams were teams that were so inherently flawed that you're looking at eight and four teams. The problem is not even this. We're talking about Brian Kelly, last year's offense at LSU with, you know, or the year before with Daniels and all of those guys. Prolific, historic. Right. They just did not have a defense that in any way could stop LSU from being overall just a pretty, okay, above average team. There was always something wrong and we kept waiting for the team to turn the corner. This year the defense is a top 15 scoring defense in the country. The offense can't do anything. If year after year, the inability to play complimentary football or have a complete team.

That reflects on your coach and whatever decisions we want to. It was time for a change. This guy thinks he can come in and do something different. Give him a chance.

[Joel Klatt]

I hear what you're saying. We can move on after this if you can follow up or whatever. But the thing that. The charitable way of looking at that is that Brian Kelly can win in a lot of different ways. When one unit is down one year, he still has enough to get you to nine, 10 wins. And that maybe if he had a little bit more time, he would eventually get it right. That's the way. Because you'd be like, oh, well, he doesn't. He's not style. He's not style dependent. Like, he can take what he has in any given year and he'll get you at least nine wins. That some people could look at that and say that is actually.

A talent, a part of his coaching talent. Be like, all right, I don't have as much as I used to have. And again, everybody's figuring out the nil era, right? Or in the transfer portal era. So it's like things are sort of shifting under you. So you're not going to quite be the exact same coach that you were five years ago. I hear what you're saying. I don't want people to accuse me of defending Brian Kelly. I think LSU should probably be happy, I guess, but we'll see. So.

[Van Lathan]

This is the. Okay, so it's tough because.

The, the ability to, to, to, to win despite having sore, sore thumb units like we're talking about.

I get it. But like, there was a full year where we couldn't fill the punt. We put Jack Besh back there, he dropped the punt, we put Malik Nabors back there, he dropped the punt. We couldn't field the punt, we could not field the Punt like we in the game against Florida State when, you know, Brian Kelly gets there. The special teams cost us a game. Like we have a problem at center. There was just the team never, ever, ever, ever seemed like it was a unit where cohesion and excellence was like a possibility. We were always overcoming something. To me, that is the mark of a coach that's lost it a little bit. And now, you know what? We know a lot more about Brian Kelly and how he viewed his job at lsu. I think he actually thought, in my opinion, that he wouldn't have to work quite as hard at lsu.

[Joe House]

I agree.

[Van Lathan]

As he did at Notre Dame.

[Joe House]

I think he thought the talent there would supersede. I think he thought he could just show up and the talent would dictate the terms. Right. Van? I mean, that's really the vibe that he gave off. Like he was content with the type of team that he had, talent wise. And he was like, yeah, we should win.

[Van Lathan]

Yeah. I don't think that he thought he had to work quite as hard. And part of me thinks that Brian Kelly lost a little bit of his edge. He's been doing it for a long, long time. Our salary package was part of his retirement plan, and he thought that the soil in Louisiana would lead him to national championships. He accomplished things at lsu. I think what you have now is, is a younger, hungrier coach that maybe has a little bit more of a competitive edge and maybe has more to prove. However, you're not getting them. To me, to be a guy that is going to be.

An ingredient in a cultural gumbo. Like, legitimately, he's more a waiter than he is an ingredient in a gumbo.

[Joe House]

And that's honestly the, I guess, the spin zone for the good vibes of Lane leaving like he did. Because now he does have a lot of pressure on him to deliver because of the way that he left. He left a playoff team.

[Van Lathan]

He.

[Joe House]

He left kind of in the dark of the night. He said that he prayed on it on Saturday. He obviously has taken Charlie Weiss Jr. With him. And now we get the word that Charlie Weiss Jr. Is going to coach in the playoff and then come back. He also, when he put the letter out right, he kind of told his version of the way that things went down. It was later disputed by many players, the athletic director, that his version was not necessarily the truth. So it does feel like Lane has a lot to prove. And I got a fact for you guys. The new top five highest paid coaches in college football right now as it stands, number one, Kirby Smart still The number one highest paid coach at. At Georgia, which does make sense, obviously. Number two now is Lane Kiffin.

[Joel Klatt]

Okay.

[Joe House]

Number three is Ryan Day. Number four, Lincoln Riley. Number five, Dabo Sweeney. So the pressure for Lane to deliver is obviously there right now. And Van, we. We talked during the press conference. You were watching the press conference. He seemed to come out of the gate stammering a little bit like Lane Kiffin. It felt like the lights kind of hit him in that room and he was like, oh, man, I got a purple suit on and now I'm facing the music. And, you know, like, I think the peer pressure of what the expectations are really do help the LSU side of things, because it's like, all right, now you're in the big time. We expect big time results. Am I. Am I wrong to feel that way?

[Van Lathan]

Van hadn't. Hadn't quite sunk in. Like, Lane wasn't ready for it quite yet. He was up there and he was kind of looking around. He didn't see. He didn't seem like he was quite in his own skin yet. We'll see how long it takes him to get into his own skin. But he's got the entire support of the fan base, the brass and everyone.

[Joe House]

The governor. The governor said he got everybody.

[Van Lathan]

If it doesn't work for Lane, it'll be about lane's limitations, not LSU's.

[Joel Klatt]

I'll say this. This is the first time in his career as a head coach that the people aren't just happy that he's there. You know, they're like, Ole Miss was really grateful to have Lane Kiffin, as you know, and he did. And by how mad. The way that they're mad lets you know how much he meant to that program and how much they wanted him to stay at Florida.

[Joe House]

He said that? Yeah. He was like, obviously, I was doing a good job. If they're that upset. Which was, I mean, talking about spin zone. That was an impressive spin zone.

[Joel Klatt]

It ain't like when Memphis sent Ryan Silverfield to Arkansas, they did not respond it the same way. You know what I'm saying? Like, Ole Miss had some. Had some heat for it. Like, Memphis was like, thank God.

[Joe House]

Arkansas FedEx is like, we'll fly you.

[Joel Klatt]

Yeah, right. Like, do you need car service? Like, what can we do to help you out?

[Joe House]

But two day delivery.

[Joel Klatt]

Yeah. And Florida Atlantic, I mean, has really only had success under Lane Kiffin. Right. And so they were just happy he was there and, like, he brought some attention to that program, and they were having their moment, and it's Like LSU ain't. Like he's going to have to start showing improving immediately. Right. And so we'll. We'll see.

[Van Lathan]

And honestly, as far as places, and once again, this is not to besmirch Ole Miss, but as far as places with huge history and gigantic expectations, he's 0 and 2. Tennessee, South Carolina, those are.

[Joe House]

And the Raiders, I mean, maybe zero.

[Van Lathan]

And three, like blue bloods or places that are flirting with blue bloodness. If you're talking about Tennessee, I consider them to be a blue blood. But if you look at the way Lane Kiffin responded to both of those situations, wasn't great. Now he's a different coach than he was then. He's older, he's more seasoned. He hasn't just figured out himself a little bit. Lane has figured out his process a little bit more. But the entire world of college football is looking at him and looking at us and just like, he's a little nervous about it, probably, judging by the press conference. I'm not gonna lie, I'm a little bit nervous, too. I don't know if I enjoy everyone paying attention to the soap opera at LSU as much as I enjoy them paying attention to what we do on the field, but we'll see how this all resolves itself in the off season in next year.

[Joe House]

Lane Kiffin is the main character. I think that was my big takeaway from the whole situation. It was like, you know, you talk about main character syndrome. I felt like this Lane process was the perfect example of what Lane character, Lane Kiffin expects of himself. He expects to be the main character, and that's what he made himself. Throughout this process. There's been reports about when he actually committed to lsu, how much LSU has known this for quite some time. If you kind of read the tea leaves and you follow the breadcrumbs throughout the season, we all remember Jimmy Sexton walking out of the tunnel at the Georgia game with him. Right. There's been some reports that maybe he was, you know, already kind of doing some diabolical deals on the back end during that time. There's also his son Knox, were in the LSU headphones two weeks ago. But in Lane's version of the story, he made the decision Saturday after praying, and God, I guess, responded to him and told him that Ole Miss was not the place and LSU is the place. So Lane is always going to happen. Well, of course, of course. But this is the Lane version of the story. You know what I mean? That's the, that's the interesting part about him being the soap oper, like you said. And Joel, I mean, just from that vantage point, how much do you think people are going to be hate watching Lane Kiffin at this point?

[Joel Klatt]

Oh, absolutely. I mean, you know, I think the thing is, is the funny thing for me is I've been listening to, you know, all these college football podcasts for years, and one thing that kind of came up there, like, you know, one day there's going to be a coach who gets a job offer and he's going to have to leave his team in the playoff. But, you know, that's probably not going to. The. The idea was that that was going to be way off in the future, you know what I'm saying? Like three, four, five years from now. And that it happened right now and then it happened with Lane Kiffin is just so amazing and so perfect because it's like, of course Lane Kiffin wasn't going to stay. Right? Like, I don't. I do think that there's a world in which another coach who was in that position stays, right? It's like, it's not. It's not. It wasn't such a clear cut decision that he should have gone to LSU as opposed to stay at Ole Miss. But of course, give me an example.

[Van Lathan]

In college football history of a coach in that type of position where they.

[Joel Klatt]

Stayed, man, Funny you should ask. I was just randomly reading up about Lavelle Edwards the other day because I was like, man, I don't know shit about Lavelle Edwards, man. Lavelle Edwards, bro. So when BYU won the national championship in 1984, okay, he got an offer from. This is how crazy football used to be. The University of Texas and the Detroit Lions, and he stayed at byu.

[Van Lathan]

Now, what's the difference in that situation?

[Joel Klatt]

He had only coached there, but he.

[Van Lathan]

Had won a national championship.

[Joel Klatt]

He had just recently won a national. Yes, that's right.

[Van Lathan]

That would be. That's a solid answer. The only difference is he had won a national championship. So, like, he had been to the mountaintop of his profession. The NFL is more. I'm more. The NFL is more surprising to me than leaving for another job. Because in college football, because the way it used to work for these college football coaches was they would leave for the NFL.

[Joel Klatt]

Yeah, well, remember Lavelle. I mean, byu, they threw the ball. I mean, you know, at that time it was, you know, kind of shocking the way they threw the ball around, right? Like, that's just commonplace now. So it seemed like, oh, maybe that'll translate pretty well to the NFL. But, yeah. So I know that Lavelle Edwards and there's other examples of guys that have been able to kind of walk away from this. But with the thing about Lane, and I mean, it's probably half and half like, I mean, it just depends on the guy. But the thing with Lane is that there's certain. In retrospect, it was dumb that we ever thought that he was going to stay at Ole Miss. Like, it was clear that he was going to go one place or another by virtue of the fact that he refused to commit in the first place. He sort of entertained the drama. And then. Yeah. So it.

[Joe House]

He made a documentary this year, which was basically a pitch to the rest of the, you know, ads in the sport to say, hey, I'm a changed man. And, you know, he kind of told his sob story of, I get fired on the target Mac at usc. I basically get written off as a head coach. Nobody wanted to give me a head coaching job. I go to Florida Atlantic. I, you know, re kind of discover who I am as a head coach. Ole Miss takes a swing at me. I owe this place everything. I love Oxford forever. This is home for me. But in reality, that whole thing was like, I'm ready to find a new home.

[Joel Klatt]

I have. I've been kind of. I had kept up. Kept up with the black assistant coaches that were with me when I was at TCU at 96. Okay. Just kind of to see how things went.

[Van Lathan]

So there was to wrestle them. So you know who to wrestle.

[Joel Klatt]

I'll never wrestle Coach Pope. So it's Coach Tommy Robinson, Coach Curtis Watkins and coach Kenneth Pope. Okay.

[Joe House]

Room 227.

[Joel Klatt]

I mean, I was not afraid to wrestle, you know, if they. I was not afraid to wrestle.

[Van Lathan]

Yeah, we know, we know.

[Joel Klatt]

You know, I mean, only one time that I. Maybe a couple times I turned up. Cause sometimes you just don't have your shit together like you need it. But anyway. Yeah, but anyway. The whole point of this is. So I followed these guys. They've been in. I don't know if they're all coaching now. Tony Robertson is a name that people probably know if you're connected to college football. He's like a legendary recruiter, assistant coach in college football. He was at lsu. He's been at Texas A and M. He's been a lot of different places since.

[Joe House]

He's like a John Blake type.

[Joel Klatt]

Yeah, there you go. Yeah, Those dudes have. Out of their years of coaching, there were like three total years that they were ever even coordinators. And like, in Two of those years, they didn't even get to call players. So Lane Kiffin's up here, man. Nobody wanted me, man. I had just come off the Tennessee USC job and SNCC Saban offered me a job as offense coordinator three months later, which is basically like a head coaching job to a lot of other people. And it was a sob story. And I'm like, I'm thinking of these assistant. These black assistant coaches I had who ain't never. Nobody ever talking about them for any head coaching job at any point. Like, not even Southern Miss, right? And I'm just like, oh, Lane Kiffin, man, it was really tough, man. I see you really had to struggle your way back to the top.

[Van Lathan]

What are you doing?

[Joel Klatt]

You have to go through the hood. I just. It was funny.

[Van Lathan]

What is this? Like, what? Like, what's this injecting race? That's my job.

It's like I'm the guy like, Joe, how dare you?

[Joel Klatt]

Well, I didn't mean to. First of all, I know it's a sensitive subject with Lane coming from Ole Miss and everything. You know what I'm saying? So.

What I mean, disconnecting the dots, that's your point. Now you gotta defend your boy.

[Van Lathan]

I'm not defending him. What I'm saying is I'm taking a very sobering look at the Ole Miss Lane Kiffin situation. But I think the thing that I'm more interested in is what this means for the entire sport, like how the sport is being perceived and played and consumed. I think it's just very interesting.

[Joe House]

Yeah, we still got the pageantry of the exit, which I think to see both sides of the coin, to see Ole Miss in the vitriol as he leaves, and then see the excitement and enthusiasm of Baton Rouge when he lands and he's in the office and he comes out and he throws the fist up and they got the number one player in the class already there with him in the like. It's just. That is the college football experience in a nutshell there. That is not going to change, really, outside of the timing of this whole thing. So let's talk coaching carousel. Obviously, Lane Kiffin, we know going to lsu, Florida hires John Sumrall. Sumrall brings up Lane Kiffin during his press conference, which was also fascinating, saying that they're the two guys that are in the situation where they have a playoff team, but they're also looking for other jobs. Alex Golish at Auburn, Silverfield, we mentioned at Arkansas, Eric Morris, Oklahoma State, we talked about him. So one big reaction we got a lot of, you know, Brian Hartline, USF Colin Klein allegedly is going to Kansas State. So there's a lot of names, a lot of faces moving all over the place. But Van, I'll go to you first. One big reaction outside of Lane Kiffin from the coaching carousel.

[Van Lathan]

College football is more NBA than NFL. When you compare college football to a sport, you should compare it to the NBA. The, the NFL is a sport to where drama actually subtracts from the overall experience of watching the sport. The drama is not what you're in it for. You know, it's different to be me, me, me in the ultimate highest level of that type of team sport. College football is totally different. It's more like the NBA in that the drama is an essential part of the watching experience. If you look at the NBA games on Christmas, it's just a bunch of mess, right? For a while it was Kobe versus Shaq on Christmas, Lakers versus Heat. These are two guys that not only do they not get along, these are two guys that had real personal beef is always going to be, oh, LeBron just left fucking Cleveland and, and, and went to the Heat. Let's do Heat vs. Cavs on Christmas, right? All of that, that is the way college football is oriented. All of this stuff, these coaching carousel lists and all of this, some of this stuff is important for the actual football that's going to occur on the field. But that's not what you hear being talked about. You're not talking about the way John Cumrall's offense or defense will translate to the SEC or the way Alex Golish, his philosophy will exist at Auburn or.

[Joe House]

If he'll bring his quarterback from usf Byron Brown. Right?

[Van Lathan]

What you're hearing is how Alex Goelish is going to deal with the structures in place at Auburn. Can he keep the boosters at bay? Can he keep the Auburn tie wearing people away from his football product?

[Joe House]

Will he play golf?

[Van Lathan]

Right. What you hear about at Florida is whether or not John Sumrall can get the fan base on his side. A fan base that, that wanted Lane Kiffin. This is after they hired another Sunbelt guy, another Power 4 guy in, in Billy Napier, all from Louisiana. Also all of these story lines that you're looking at, these story lines are emotional. These storylines are story lines not necessarily about the product that that's going to be on the field. And that works for college football, it works for the sport. The drama is an essential part. It's much more like the NBA, a drama filled league than it is like the NFL.

[Joe House]

I like that. It's like the three lines in the three phases, I guess, of college football. O line, D line storyline. You know, you put those three things together.

[Van Lathan]

Look at Tate.

[Joel Klatt]

Yeah. Yeah, man. Yeah. I mean, yeah, even. I mean, Arkansas had a protest. Their fans came out. I mean, you cannot even care about football. And just. Arkansas hired a new head football coach, and, like, two dozen people showed up to protest.

[Van Lathan]

Now, I bet you. I bet you. Now I bet you something. I bet you couldn't have get the. Couldn't have got them people to protest for George Floyd.

[Joe House]

There you go, man. He's back.

[Van Lathan]

I bet you couldn't have got them people to protest for George Floyd. But Arkansas hired a raw coach, and.

[Joe House]

They out there, man, fighting the good fight.

[Joel Klatt]

Yeah, man. All the people from Harrison, Arkansas heads know. Heads know about Harrison, Arkansas.

[Van Lathan]

Harrison knows about. I want to go there.

[Joel Klatt]

No, you don't.

[Van Lathan]

I want to go to Harrison.

[Joel Klatt]

You really want to go to Harrison?

[Van Lathan]

I want to go there. You don't want. I saw that video. I want to go on there, bro.

[Joel Klatt]

My friend, Arkansas. You know what I'm saying?

[Van Lathan]

Like, I want to go. I want to go to Harrison. The funniest part of the Harrison video was the people, because there was a guy standing on a corner with a sign that said Black Lives Matter. And there were people that were sympathetic to him that were passing by and stopping and going, hey, man.

You should probably leave, bro. I don't know if, you know, I'm.

[Joe House]

Trying to protect you.

[Van Lathan]

There were some people that were walking by and just going crazy, but then there were some people that were walking by or driving by and going, bro, you're not going to want to stand out here too long. These people are going to kill you.

[Joel Klatt]

Wait, okay, so which city in your state is like that?

[Van Lathan]

It's a couple of them. Like, Denham Springs, when I was growing up, wasn't the nicest place to be.

[Joel Klatt]

Okay.

[Van Lathan]

Like, I don't know if it was on the level of Harrison, but Denham Springs, when I was growing up, wasn't the nicest place to be. It wasn't nice to be around. Fucking around in Denham Springs, Louisiana.

[Joel Klatt]

Yeah. Texas is Vita. Vita, that's the. That's the town. Texas Vita. That's the one comes up. We injected race into the show. Sorry about that.

[Van Lathan]

I apologize.

[Joe House]

I just googled most racist city in North Carolina. Getting a lot of answers.

[Van Lathan]

What is it?

[Joel Klatt]

Yeah, what is.

[Joe House]

I mean, honestly, they're saying places that I wouldn't suspect, so I don't Think it's the. I don't think it's true.

[Van Lathan]

How do you know?

[Joe House]

I'm just saying, I. I just. I wouldn't expect Greensboro to be on the list.

[Van Lathan]

What? Well, has a long. I mean, maybe not now.

[Joe House]

That's what I'm. I guess. I guess.

[Van Lathan]

Okay.

[Joe House]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I'm talking about now.

[Van Lathan]

Yeah, I went to Greensboro, to the Civil Rights Museum and talked to him on all of that stuff. And the people in Greensboro were lovely.

[Joe House]

That's what I mean. Greensboro. Yeah, Greensboro.

[Joel Klatt]

I've been on the A and T campus. Yeah, man. You know, I mean, the thing is, though, I always say from my travels, I was like, no matter where you go in this country, the black people there feel like they done got fucked over. You know what I'm saying? Like, no matter if you go to Key west, you go to Seattle, you go to Holyoke, Massachusetts, you go to.

[Joe House]

Manhattan beach, out here, Bruce's beach, anywhere.

[Joel Klatt]

You go, it ain't even got to be very many of them, but they got. You know, they have some legitimate gripes about their situation, where they at. So.

[Van Lathan]

So, yeah, I used to piss the people. We gotta get back to college football after this. We took a little highland detour.

[Joe House]

Joel got you fired up. That's what it was.

[Van Lathan]

I used to piss the people in Atlanta off with that because. Shout out to, like, Isaac Hayes and, like, Killer Mike and all of these great black men that I know from Atlanta. And they talk about, like, how.

Atlanta is a mecca for black people. And in many ways, it really is, right? In many ways. You got so many black millionaires and all that stuff. But then I looked up the. The wealth inequality in Atlanta.

[Joel Klatt]

Oh, yeah.

[Van Lathan]

Between the white people that live in Atlanta and the black people that live in Atlanta, I'll be like, hey, man, Wakanda got some growing to do. Like, I'll be honest with y'.

[Joel Klatt]

All.

[Van Lathan]

Like, Wakanda got some growing to do. And it really bothers him. Cause there's nothing prouder than a black Atlantean. Nothing prouder. So I go, hey, man, you know, it's still. It's fucked up. It's fucked up there. Like, you don't know what you're talking about. Why don't you move here? Move out of the white jungle of Los Angeles and move with your people? I'm like, nah, man. I like West Hollywood.

[Joel Klatt]

Did y' all know that I. I lived in Atlanta for two years.

[Van Lathan]

Let's move on, bro.

[Joel Klatt]

Yeah, man. Yeah.

[Joe House]

Yeah, you did.

[Joel Klatt]

Y' all right. Across the street from the old Gold Cup. You know that the strip club that was part of the. The federal trial, The Gold Club Go Club. Or they call it the Gold cup now. They. They turned it into a legit club. While when I lived there, like, I lived in. For people in Atlanta off Piedmont, I was in the Piedmont area, right up the street from the Piedmont MARTA stop. So. Yeah, there you go.

[Van Lathan]

Oh, Joel, Detour.

[Joe House]

I went to church at Ebenezer Baptist. Right? That's. Yeah.

[Joel Klatt]

Oh, man. Because it's right across the street from the mlk. Yeah, bro. You gotta, gotta do it, gotta do it.

[Van Lathan]

Yeah.

[Joe House]

Shout out. Shout out to Atlanta. Joel, one big reaction to the coaching carousel.

[Joel Klatt]

So I want to ask people here if Penn State if they would be interested in hiring this kind of a coach. Okay. He's a Pennsylvania native. He's a former college qb. He's known for recruiting area. His top recruiting area is like an area that's pivotal for Penn State is the DMV key. Part of a coaching staff that turned around in a historically mediocre ACC program and has never been as good since he left. In his first head coaching job, he turned around a historically terrible program and led them to consecutive bowl games for the first time in school history.

[Joe House]

I'm just so glad it's not Art Briles.

[Joel Klatt]

Yeah. Oh, man. Art Briles, man, he got. He's busy right now. He's got Eastern New Mexico, but he's up. He's up. If he, if he gets him, he gets 10, a couple 10 win seasons down there in Portales, New Mexico. Boy, you be ready.

And then at his next job, he kind of takes over a traditional power, kind of on some shaky ground. Won a conference title in his third year and has won 10 or more games and more than half his seasons there. And just last year he was really in contention for the national championship game, man.

[Van Lathan]

Like, he was talking about James Franklin.

[Joel Klatt]

Yeah.

Would you like to hire that guy?

Would you like to hire a coach like that?

[Joe House]

Oh, Joel.

[Joel Klatt]

Would you like to hire a coach like that? It sounds like a good coach. Like, if you ended up with a coach like that, you feel good about your situation right now.

[Joe House]

You got a program.

[Joel Klatt]

Yeah. You would have a program. Yeah. Yeah. And look, man, I understand that everybody is going to be disappointed in college football, man. Like, you know, once you get outside the top five, like, maybe half the fan base is in the top 25, are frustrated or recently frustrated, but you just cannot let that overwhelm your common sense, man. Being good in College football is hard. You can't take it for granted. Imagine being an Arkansas fan today, being a Florida State fan today, or a South Carolina fan, North Carolina, North Carolina fan, North Carolina State fan. Right.

[Joe House]

You know, they're all right.

[Joel Klatt]

Yeah, right. Let me.

[Van Lathan]

You know who.

[Joel Klatt]

Appalachian State fan. They, they feeding for the old days of Appalachian State. Do you. Do you know who else Loaded up last year, brought in a great portal class, the best portal class in the country. They were supposed to go to the playoffs, lost a couple more times. They're supposed to and fell short of expectations. There's Lane Kiffin and Ole Miss. Look at him a year later. Man, this year's team's 11 and 1. Probably going to host a playoff game.

[Joe House]

It's a good point, Joel.

[Joel Klatt]

That could have been y'. All. Now, now, right now, right now you have a recruiting class that you. It's going to take you years to recover from this. Okay? You have the 144th over overall ranked recruiting class. You're behind Sam Houston, both Montana's. Montana and Montana, Montana State, Columbia. It's hard to get people into Columbia. That's not an easy school to get into. They got a recruiting class ranked ahead of y'. All. So anyway, man, just before you. Before you end up to wallowing in your disappointment, just make sure you don't make a disastrous decision. Because right now, Penn State you in hell, man, you would love to have you some James Franklin right now. Don't lie to me. Don't lie on the Instagram comments and say, we don't want James Franklin. He didn't do all. No, you would want.

[Van Lathan]

Joel, let me ask you a question.

What is the only time that you're mad you didn't have sex?

[Joel Klatt]

When is the only time in the.

[Van Lathan]

Moment.

The only time that you're upset that you didn't have sex?

[Joel Klatt]

The only. When you expected it. Of course.

[Van Lathan]

When you expected it.

[Joel Klatt]

Oh, your birthday.

[Van Lathan]

That is the only time anniversary that you didn't have sex. Valentine's Day, Expected it.

[Joe House]

Third day.

[Van Lathan]

What I am trying to tell you is everything that you are saying is true. But you have to intersect it with one thing that your entire thing leaves out. Expectation. And if we are telling Penn State to lower or change their expectations, that's one thing. They had an expectation out of James Franklin to one day get over the hump and it didn't happen. They were expecting sex. They were getting rubbed. They were grabbing booty. They were grabbing a little bit on the top. They were getting deep, long, passionate kisses. They were getting Spooning. They were getting like body to body contact. They were getting all of that, but they wanted to fuck.

[Joe House]

Yeah, it's a BYU student.

[Van Lathan]

And time after time, time after time, they would get right there and they would not get no nookie. And they got sick of it.

[Joel Klatt]

Joe, man, that happens to every, pretty much every college football program in the country outside of like four. You know, you just kind of. I just think you gotta get. I hear what you're saying. You're right. The expectations have been fucked up. If it, if it, if it had been. What if I told you that last year, a team that had been good in the past, a good, really good coach, they just all of a sudden fell apart one year and had their worst year, season and a half century. And then the next year they went like 7 and 5. Most fans would be happy about that, right? They'd be like, well, I could kind of. I mean, that's an improvement. You had horrible. Like, this is the worst season we ever had this year. I went seven and five. But if I told you. Oh, but you're actually. Florida State, they're not happy right now neither. You know, I'm saying. And I just, I just feel like the year to year thing, you've got to let it go, guys. Like sometimes you just got to allow a coach to have a bad year. Now Florida State, something. Yeah, I, you know, I'm interested in that take because I was like the.

[Joe House]

Thing about number 17, recruiting class on National Signing Day, North Carolina. Nobody talking about it, bro.

[Joel Klatt]

And he the quarterback they had that was supposed to come in. I wonder if he still the kid that busted up his knee in Georgia this year. Is he part of that Class 2 tape?

[Joe House]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. And then they're also got a portal quarterback coming in. Okay, well, yeah, I mean, maybe Lenora Sellers.

[Joel Klatt]

I was. Tape. Could be they got better over the year. Now I know it's.

[Van Lathan]

They started playing better. They were, they were never good, but they started playing better.

[Joel Klatt]

Yeah, man. I mean, do you think. I mean, you got a little. You just like, man, if we can.

[Joe House]

Make some changes, I'll take seven. I'll take seven wins next year and be a little. I feel a little bit better, you.

[Joel Klatt]

Know, and then just moving on over to Steve Billich, take over.

[Joe House]

Nah, we're. We're willing Bill out there for as long as we can. He's gonna be 80 years old on the sidelines as far as I'm concerned. We're gonna do a. Joe Pa. You mentioned Penn State. Can we Talk about this. So Todd McShay, our teammate, he went on Bill Simmons podcast and he talked about Penn State, and he alluded to the fact that there is one man who might be holding them back for their next head coach. And he's a man I mentioned a little bit earlier, Jimmy Sexton, who is an agent amongst, you know, all of the agents in all of sports. He's Herb Street's agent. He's Nick Saban's agent. He's 14 of the 16 SEC coaches head coaches agent right now. He also has players like Sam Darnold or Drake May. He's everywhere. He caa. So, I mean, look, Jimmy Sexton is a name. If you don't know, you need to know. So the one big question is, who is Jimmy Sexton? I want to dissect this a little bit with you guys, because now they're saying McShay was saying basically that Penn State might be boxed out of some of their candidates because Jimmy Sexton is not happy with the way Pat Kraft decided to get rid of James Franklin, who's also one of his clients. One, Van, when did you come into your first kind of, you know, meeting with Jimmy Sexton in your life? When you learned about who he is? And then two, how much do you think Jimmy Sexton is actually kind of playing Game of Thrones and putting all these coaches in different places?

[Van Lathan]

We say that we need a commissioner of college football.

A league commissioner would essentially manage the sport.

Would bend the sport to his will based upon what he thinks is best on the sport, would control different things about the sport and make the sport run. We do have a commissioner. Jimmy Sexton is a commissioner. He is the commissioner of college football.

His power and his influence, the decide where the coaches go to coach. It decides the economic breakdown and flow of the sport. The coaches themselves are actually the owners in college football. They are the guys who do all the hiring. They're the guys who have the most power. Can they be fired by presidents and ads? Sure. But once that happens, it has got to be a gigantic job. The people who actually run, who are the cultural owners of college football.

Are the coaches. Those coaches, the majority of them, the ones that really matter, they have a boss. They have a guy that moves them around and tells them what to do and gets them opportunities. And that guy is Jimmy Sexton. The story is amazing. Do you know how Jimmy Sexton ends up as an agent?

[Joe House]

Illuminate us.

[Joel Klatt]

Yeah, tell us.

[Van Lathan]

He was Reggie White's roommate in college. He's Reggie White's roommate. In college, he leverages that into being Reggie White's agent when he comes out. And through a career that took him to the NBA, that took him to college football, to pro football, he ends up being a guy that not only essentially controls the coaching carousel in college football, but also controls the way the coaching carousel in college football is covered. Because on the most watched show in college football, which is not ring or tailgate currently, but we're not yet.

[Joel Klatt]

One day, not yet. We're getting there.

[Van Lathan]

He was able to obviously, obviously manicure and massage the conversation around Lane Kiffin and the coaching carousel in a way that made sure his clients did not come out looking bad.

[Joe House]

Blame the schedule. Don't blame Lane.

[Van Lathan]

So the schedules in college football, the coaches make them, right? The coaches schedule these games. All of those guys work for Jimmy Sexton. Like, all of those guys work for him. If we want to get Billy Gill's opt out into college football, we don't need to talk to the ncaa. We need to talk to Jimmy Sexton.

[Joe House]

We need to talk to caa.

[Van Lathan]

We need to talk to caa. Cause he could get it done right now in the College Football Playoff. He's got, let's say that these teams. So Oklahoma, we talk about the sec. Let's talk about the teams that are in the playoff. Oklahoma, Alabama, Ole Miss, kind of. I mean, the Sexton clients is not there now. Oregon, Georgia, Kirby Smart, Dan Lanning, Brent Venables, Kaylin DeBoer. Further down, Mario Cristobal, Jimmy Sexton. Steve Sarkeesian. Jimmy Sexton, Utah. Like Kyle Winningham. That's Kyle Winningham's not. Dude. Yeah. He's the coach of Utah. I don't know why. Jumping on my mind like, Jimmy Sexton. Jimmy Sexton. I don't know why.

[Joe House]

When I saw you, Will Stein, the new head coach of Kentucky. Jimmy Sexton.

[Van Lathan]

Jimmy Sexton. All of these guys, right? Those are playoff wannabes down there. All of his clients. So if there is a chance to redo the College Football Playoff or, or. Or to think about it, if the coaches have a say, right? If it's a conversation that involves the coaches, what are the chances that it doesn't involve the power play that is behind the coaches? Right? The power player. If there's a change in the actual yearly schedule of college football and the coaches get to say, what is the chance that it doesn't involve this guy and making decisions for his clients that are advantageous to his clients? I can't think of, besides, you know, Scott Boris and, you know, maybe David Falk, a couple of guys in the past. I can't think of anyone in any sport that has as much of an influence on. On a particular sporting culture as this guy does on college football right now. I'm not saying it's good. I'm not saying it's bad. I'm just saying that it is fucking remarkable. And everybody is winning. He's winning because his salaries are going crazy. Jimmy Sexton just had us go from paying Brian Kelly $100 million to playing Lane Kiffin $100 million. LSU didn't win really anything. But you know who did win? Jimmy Sexton. Twice. He's 2. 0 against LSU.

So, I mean, when we're talking about all of this stuff, I looked into his career. He seems to be just a go getter. But the reality is there is a consolidation of influence that exists in college football at the top level. That is really, really interesting.

[Joel Klatt]

Yeah. I mean, the thing is, actually, Billy, is Jimmy your agent? Are you repped by caa? You don't have to answer that.

[Joe House]

That's how he has his Heisman vote. It's from Jimmy.

[Joel Klatt]

Yeah. Are you a CAA guy?

[Joe House]

You want to vote, Joe? I can make some calls.

[Joel Klatt]

I do want to vote. I said that last week. You should have been.

[Joe House]

Joel's so upset that Billy's not your assistant.

[Joel Klatt]

You know, I mean, I'm not that assistant. I was a voter in the Posmon Trophy. Do y'. All.

[Van Lathan]

Y.

[Joel Klatt]

Did y' all ever get to vote in the Piesman Trophy?

[Joe House]

Is that about pies? Like pumpkin pie?

[Joel Klatt]

It was about apple pie. The thick six. Big guy. Touchdowns.

[Joe House]

Oh, okay.

[Joel Klatt]

Who you vote for? Lyman? Yeah, the thick six.

[Joe House]

Who'd you vote for? Billy asked.

[Joel Klatt]

I mean, it was like four years.

[Van Lathan]

Which one? So you voted for a lineman?

[Joel Klatt]

Yeah, I voted for a lineman.

[Van Lathan]

It was the thick six. Which one did you think was the thickest? Where was it?

[Joe House]

Which one would you wrestle in 222?

[Van Lathan]

Hold on. Wait. You said that you voted in the thick six? Yeah. When I think thick, I think of Keto Johnson. White chocolate. You know, I think of the. That's what I think when I think thick. When I think of thickness, you know what I'm saying?

[Joe House]

I think of Vince Welfork.

[Joel Klatt]

I mean, there's a lot of. Thick has many, many different meanings. I mean, you can look it up. My friend Stephen Fatsis, who wrote a book. Stephan Fatsis wrote a book.

[Joe House]

Didn't even know his name. Well, he's his friends.

[Joel Klatt]

I got. I got distracted. Stefan, you know, I Know your name, man. Come on, bro. He wrote a book about the. The dictionary anyway, so there's that. Yeah.

[Joe House]

What did he annotate the dictionary?

[Joel Klatt]

It's actually very fascinating.

[Joe House]

Kind of genius.

[Joel Klatt]

It's. It's very fascinating. It's a very good book. It's about just like the history of how words get put in the dictionary.

[Joe House]

Oh, that's pretty cool.

[Joel Klatt]

You think about it. Yeah, just like, just think about how word becomes something enough that they'll include in the dictionary the whole concept. The history of dictionaries. It's actually a really good book. You should guys check it out. And he had that packed. He had a book of. In here in D.C. man. He had that. That whole packed out, man. It was crazy. The best attended book event I've ever been to.

[Van Lathan]

What the are you talking about right now?

[Joe House]

You asked his friend Stephen Stephan.

[Van Lathan]

Okay, like, wait, this book. Like, what do we. What you.

[Joel Klatt]

The one that sat me down because you were talking about.

[Van Lathan]

We talking about Jimmy.

[Joe House]

Yeah, Jimmy Sexton, I think, man.

[Joel Klatt]

But you were talking about thickness. And I got. I went to Posman trophy. Okay, let me get that.

[Joe House]

You lose your vote.

[Joel Klatt]

Let me get it. Yeah, it just. They just stopped giving it out. They don't do the trophy anymore.

[Joe House]

Oh, man.

[Joel Klatt]

Anyway, you would. You had. Because you all distracted me with that, man.

[Joe House]

We didn't ask about your friends.

[Joel Klatt]

Y. Sex. So anyway, the thing is, is Jimmy Sexton. I was trying to think of how to describe him. I was like, is he like the white Worldwide west or like the white Al Heyman?

[Van Lathan]

You know, Al Heyman is a good comp. Good comparison.

[Joel Klatt]

Yeah. You don't see any pictures of Jimmy on the, you know, for the. Well, you can look him up, I mean, obviously, but he's not a guy that is desperate to be in front of the microphone. Right. Which is.

[Joe House]

No, he's the opposite. He.

[Van Lathan]

He.

[Joe House]

He is actively tried to make it so that you don't know who he is. And he wants it to be known that he's actually not doing any of the. He's like, I'm just doing the deals. You know, if you read anything about him, he's like, I'm trying to keep my hands out of the business. I pull for both my coaches. I don't like when they play each other. I mean, he plays it perfectly.

[Joel Klatt]

I respect. I respect it, man. Also, you know, I don't. I guess the thing is, is, like, if you care about journalism ethics and college football, media coverage, that's one thing, right? What are people alleging that Jimmy Sexton is actually doing that we should care about.

[Van Lathan]

So I. I'll say. This is what I'll say.

[Joel Klatt]

Okay.

[Van Lathan]

What he's saying is probably true. Right. But this is the deal. So Sexton's first client was Tommy Tuberville, Right? His first major coaching client, Tommy Tuberville. When Tommy Tuberville was coaching Ole Miss, he negotiated a contract with Tommy Tuberville that made his departure from Ole Miss easier.

If the school's chancellor or athletic director left.

The reason why I say that is because he is negotiating these contracts. This is the biggest deal. But his ability to negotiate those contracts changes the way college football works. As he gains more power, he gains more leverage in his negotiations with a school. As he gains more leverage, he puts more things in the contracts that are friendly to the coaches.

[Joel Klatt]

Yeah.

[Van Lathan]

Those standards in the contracts then become the norm.

[Joe House]

Right.

[Van Lathan]

So it's. His negotiations are like adding laws into the constitution of college football. They change the money, that changes the calculation. They give the coaches this type of flexibility, which changes the pot, all of that stuff. The more power you have, the more influential every single thing that you do is. And because he's never actually really thinking about, which he shouldn't be the good of the overall game, yet he is negotiating on behalf of guys whose job it is to keep an eye on the quality of the game. He's essentially, in a way, informing what it is they do and how it is that they do it. And the fact that none of the other places could hire coaches and do stuff until the Kiffin domino fell. And then it went so fast. And the only person. Some schools were happy, some schools were sad. The only person that was completely happy was Jimmy Sexton. So there's nothing nefarious about any of it. Just the question is that he decides.

[Joe House]

When the domino falls.

[Van Lathan]

He decides when the domino falls. Everything, all the schools, Auburn, lsu, Florida, Alabama, whomever, Penn State, all of these are waiting to see what his clients do.

[Joel Klatt]

Right. I mean, so the thing is, is that. And I guess it depends on your idea of labor, right? Because I think the base labor force that I have the most empathy for in the whole equation. Assistance. Oh, no. Players. The players are the labor.

About them either. I mean, I want them to be treated well. But. But I, I'm. I'm. I'm on the side of labor in this. So, like, I don't give a. About what happens to the institutions, how they had to come up with the money, what the buyouts are, whatever else, and in the. In the broader implications up To a point, right? Because I mean, I guess the thing is, is if. If you agree that college football is never more popular than it's ever been, there's more eyes on it, it's, you know, whatever, and you think the game is in a good place. Cool. If you think that, like the escalation of these contracts is going to lead to bad financial decisions that will impact non revenue sports and so on. And it has, then I buy that too. Right? But on the whole, with what Jimmy Sexton is doing, I'm like, man, he's getting more money for his clients out of these big institutions and got the money to spend it. So I'm usually with that, with the caveat, the other caveat, that like, if you got all that power, man, you need to get some more brothers on the wall. Jimmy Sexton, you got all that power. Put some brothers on the wall.

[Joe House]

There you go.

[Van Lathan]

What would be your idea? You really, you really going Huey P. Newton all day today, you know, like, what would be your example? What would Jimmy Sexton putting brothers on the wall look like to you?

[Joel Klatt]

Oh, well, I mean, like, like we. There would be. I guess the thing is, if it. So the most nefarious accusation against Jimmy Sexton is that the people that he employs work to put out certain narratives about certain candidates and certain jobs and other people that become. That hardens, right? And it affects like who, who goes where and where the money goes and where the opportunities are, right? Like that. Is that the most. Is that the most nefarious accusation against Jimmy Sexton I get?

[Van Lathan]

I mean, I don't know that any of these things.

[Joe House]

I don't think anything's nefarious. I think it's more.

[Joel Klatt]

I'm just saying, like, it's the thing that is like the thing that most would say is leveraged against them. Well, then I would say then, like, all right, well, you can put the names out of Danton Lynn, the defensive coordinator at usc. They made a big improvement right there. Tim Skipper, why aren't those names out there with all those other guys? When I heard all off season, this hiring cycle, man, this is a really bad hiring cycle, bro, you know, because they did. Nobody thought about hiring anybody other than the names that everybody had talked about, like Matt Rule and, you know, I mean, they don't even talk about poor Matt Campbell anymore over at Iowa State, you know, but it's just like the same, the same few names were in those mixes. And I'm like, yo, if you're Jimmy Sexton and he actually has this Power. And he exerts it in that way. Then it was like, well, I would like for you to put some more brothers on the wall. Like, a brother could have had the Oklahoma State job. Right. Or whatever.

[Joe House]

Eric Morris going from North Texas, man.

[Joel Klatt]

I like Eric Morris. I wouldn't mind if Eric Morris was my.

[Joe House]

Summerall and Eric Morris, for the record, are both coaching their teams in the playoff, which is why Jimmy Sexton was trying to put that narrative out for Lane Kiffin, because he's like, these guys are doing it. Why can't Lane do it? That was another angle that felt like it was coming from the Sexton regime. I did want to bring this point up, too. Jimmy Sexton was. So he's a Tennessee guy. You mentioned Reggie White, obviously. So he got Phil Fulmer the job at Tennessee back in 1992. He got Lane Kiffin hired at Tennessee. He also helped Lane Kiffin navigate leaving Tennessee to go to usc. So for a lot of people that are like, how could Lane do this? He's already done it before with Tennessee. Maybe he had some experience. Well, Jimmy Sexton has already helped him do that one time. So to do it again, that was no threat to them. Yeah, it was maybe a little bit higher stakes because it's one state over and there's a rivalry, and they play a rivalry game every single year. But, like, they have done this act before together, so. So, like, that's the other kind of thing with Jimmy Sexton is like, he was never afraid to make this move, and neither was Lane, obviously.

[Joel Klatt]

Yeah.

[Van Lathan]

Yeah. I mean, with the coaches being as, you know, hired Gunnish as they are right now. Part of the reason is because of the money. Part of the reason is because of the power to leave and the leverage that they have over the programs. And part of that is because the business of the game has been reshaped by. By a power broker that sits at the top of the sport. I mean, there's not anything necessarily wrong with it. But when we talk about what's changed about college football and we talk about nil and we talk about the transfer portal, we oftentimes don't talk about coaching and the way that the coaches move around and the contracts that the coaches are getting, and that might be by design, we might not be having those conversations because there might be people who really don't want us to have them.

[Joe House]

Mm. And that's maybe the nefarious part that you could allude to a little bit, because that's part of by the design. You know, it's the wizard of Oz. There is a wizard.

[Van Lathan]

Is Nick Saban gonna go on the game day and say that this shit is fucked up? No. If he thinks it's fucked up, is he gonna go on there and say that? No, he's not gonna say that. He's not gonna say that because it's all in the family. He's not gonna do that, man.

[Joel Klatt]

It's just interesting.

[Joe House]

It's Mafioso. Yeah.

[Joel Klatt]

I don't doubt, disagree, but I just, the, the, the, the prospect of Jimmy sex and telling Nick Sa what to do, man, I just, I don't know. Like, I'm not saying that. It's not.

[Joe House]

Hey, if somebody's cutting you that check though, Joel, like if someone's getting you hundreds of millions of dollars at some point, you're like, I'm gna listen to this guy.

[Joel Klatt]

Do you, do you think that Nick Saban thinks that Jimmy Sexton has any impact or influence over his life whatsoever? Do you?

[Joe House]

Right. I think he's made it better. Yeah, he made it.

[Joel Klatt]

I bet you Nick Saban thinks, man, I could hire.

No limit sports agency to get me a good deal.

[Van Lathan]

But you know what's funny? It's just you always tell on yourself. You bring up no limit sports, right?

Hold on, hold on.

[Joel Klatt]

This ain't racism. Don't do that.

[Van Lathan]

Low limit sports is one of the all time examples of this. No limit sports came in, Master P had Ricky Williams, right?

[Joel Klatt]

Yeah, right.

[Van Lathan]

He negotiated, man. This is shout out to my people, man. First of all, I'm not in no way dissing. They negotiated a contract with Ricky Williams. That is absolutely absurd. It's just a fact. It's absurd. I think Ricky Williams then hires a little while after that Lee Steinberg to come in and he brings in Lee.

[Joe House]

Steinberg, Jerry Maguire, for people that don't know at home.

[Van Lathan]

Yeah, yeah. So he hires Lee Steinberg to come in. Lee Steinberg has to come in and get Ricky Williams what is essentially a standard to almost regular NFL contract for a guy of that ilk. So Ricky Williams, who was a, for a lot of people, a can't miss prospect coming out of college, went on to have a really good career. He wasn't the juice enough to get what he wanted if he did not have powerful representation. So I'm not in any way saying that, that Sexton pulls the strings on, on, on Nick Saban, but I definitely think Nick Saban listens to his counsel. Why would you want to have an agent that you don't listen to his counsel?

[Joel Klatt]

No, you'll listen to your counsel. But if your counsel is like, hey, man, why you up there on game day? Nick, man, could you just say something about this nonsense that they're saying out there about Lane and making him look like a villain out here, think you might as well put throw a little lines in your bars on that.

[Joe House]

I think that's a definite conversation.

[Joel Klatt]

Leave me the fucking on that.

[Joe House]

I think it's 100% a conversation conversation.

[Joel Klatt]

I know. You telling me I don't have to do my job, Jimmy, you know?

[Joe House]

Nah, I think he's thinking, I don't really have a take here. And Jimmy's like, I gotta take for you. How about this? The schedule's wrong. Billy. Like, how many coaches, though, have you heard? Like, we heard it with Lane this past week. Like, in his introductory press conference where, I mean, you. No one believes him, but he says, like, I don't even know what I'm getting paid. I just let Jimmy take over. Like Hugh Freeze in his introductory press conference at Auburn. They were asking him about assistant coaches, and one of the things he said was, I don't know. But Jimmy sent me a list of assistants that he trusts that I should look at. And it's like, hold on a second.

[Van Lathan]

What are we talking about?

[Joe House]

Right? Like, it's wild. And this guy has so many clients that are great and so much power that even when his clients screw over a school, they just call Jimmy back to say, who else do you got that you can put in at our school? Like, it's wild. How many schools fire a Jimmy Sexton client? Like, Florida fires Billy Napier, hires John Sumrall. Arkansas fires Sam Pittman, hires Ryan Silverfield. Mario Criswell leaves Oregon for Dan Lanning to come into Oregon. Another Jimmy Sexton client, Jay Norvell, fired by Colorado State. They hire Jim Mora Jr. Nick Saban retires. They hire Kalyn DeBoer. And then in that whole thing, Jimmy Sexton pretends all of his other clients are going to go to Alabama. So they all also get raises at their schools. So cashing checks left and right, whether or not it's all leverage plays leaving or not. Also, like, Will Muschamp at Florida was a Jimmy Sexton client. And Florida and Tennessee are supposed to hate each other. And Jimmy Sexton is hiring both of their head coaches and has been doing it for over two decades. You know what I mean? Like, if you really break down the wall, it's like there's one guy on both sides of the rivalry that's dictating who the head Coach is the reason.

[Joel Klatt]

Actually hilarious. Jimmy Sexton. Because he's effective, man.

[Joe House]

Right?

[Van Lathan]

Nobody's goddamn not saying that. I know, I know. Like, nobody likes Brad. What do you. No one is saying. What do you have. What the fuck is happening, bro? I'm about to take this football and throw it into the wall here. No one's saying he's not good at his job. What do you want to happen?

[Joel Klatt]

What do you want to happen?

[Van Lathan]

It's a unique situation to have a guy with this much influence at all levels of college football at a time of where college football is particularly lawless and wild. Wild West.

[Joel Klatt]

Awful. Announcing vans headline here is that Jimmy Sexton feeds Nick Saban lines on the college game.

[Joe House]

Joel. Joel. But Kirby Smart said the exact. Who's also Jimmy Sexton. Klein. Kirby Smart said the exact same thing that Nick Saban said about the situation.

[Joel Klatt]

About what the schedule part of it or whatever.

[Joe House]

About how it was the schedule's fault about how he felt for Lane situation.

[Joel Klatt]

But, I mean, all of that makes sense because Lane is fierce with Kirby Smart and they all. Everybody has been talking about the schedule fear like it is the coach's fault. And it's the everybody who is not a player and is involved in college football. It's your fault that the schedule is the way that it is.

[Van Lathan]

So let me bring politics into this. So when they were doing the redistricting in California.

[Joel Klatt]

Yeah.

[Van Lathan]

And after. After.

[Joe House]

Billy, what are your thoughts on this?

[Van Lathan]

Yeah, After President Trump. Billy Maga. Okay, good to have some diversity on the thing.

[Joe House]

So he's the Duke.

[Van Lathan]

The Duke. So after. After. They were. After they were. After they did that. We have diversity here. We have different points of view. There's no nothing wrong with that here.

[Joe House]

We out of this.

[Van Lathan]

How do we, by the way, just.

[Joe House]

Gloss over the fact that, like, minutes ago, Joel had Master P representing Nick Saban.

[Joel Klatt]

Well, I'm just saying. I was just like. It's not like he was gonna have.

[Joe House]

Nick Saban and camouflage.

[Van Lathan]

I'm not trying to hate on P. I'm not trying to hate on P. I'm just saying Lee Steinberg had to come in immediately.

[Joe House]

I got a masterpiece story for another day for you guys, Right?

[Van Lathan]

Like. Like, T. Ferris might have. Not.

Scott might have negotiated that contract with Ricky Williams. I think he was the head of no Limit Sports.

[Joel Klatt]

Anyway, that's.

[Van Lathan]

But so the Democrats were like, you know, they were gonna do their own redistricting, right? They were gonna do their own redistricting. And everybody that came out and talked about this said, we gotta Fight fire with fire. Everyone said that. Everybody was like, we gotta fight fire with fire. We gotta fight fire with fire. We gotta fight fire with fire. I know enough about, like, how the media stuff works to know that those lines are coming from somewhere. There's messaging that's happening amongst an intelligentsia of left voices that are saying, this is the way we're going to discuss this. And the same way on the other side, you go over there and you hear the same line that a swath of politicians use, and they use that line to get their message out to people. And there are talking points that are being disseminated, be it from some group like whatever, or be it from Turning Point usa or be it from the Heritage foundation, whomever it would be. And so I'm saying is when people are together sort of in this intellectual colloquy, like, what ends up happening is there tends to be groupthink and if all of the coaches are fucking represented by the same fucking guy, at some point they're gonna come out and say the same fucking shit.

[Joel Klatt]

Think it's a Jimmy Sexton email listserv or a group.

[Van Lathan]

Oh my Jesus.

[Joel Klatt]

Like, no, no, no, no, cuz I understand, I understand all this, but we don't have email talking points. Those same dis. Those same talking points could be disseminated at an ESPN production meeting. Like, this is not. Like it's not.

[Van Lathan]

But why would they be, Joel? This was. Where would the talking points come from?

[Joel Klatt]

Simple ass argument. Like it's the easiest thing to say. Like it's the easy to be like, man, well, you know, it's really the schedule, this fucking things up here.

[Joe House]

It's the easiest thing to say if you're trying to protect or give the vantage point of Wayne Gifford.

[Joel Klatt]

If you were trying to. If you were trying to.

Alleviate yourself of responsibility, of the burden for how things are in the system right now and you were looking for another villain, you've already tried to say, well, the players are not as loyal right now. They want money, things different. Now, you, you know, I get they don't have AAU to blame, but maybe they said maybe they blame seven on seven coaches. I'm sure somewhere along the way parenting, whatever, something and nil. Right? But then they also would just be like, well, man, the ncaa, the way that they've set this whole thing up with the schedule and is really making it difficult for us. Like it just is the one of the more obvious points. Again, I'm not saying that maybe some points weren't disseminated. Not saying that, but it's just like, it's not like Jimmy Sexton had to come up with that for people to come up with that. Like, I could think you could think that organically or whatever. And again, I just don't know. I've been. Jimmy Sexton worked for Nick Saban. I just, I don't think that Nick Saban needs the Jimmy Sexton to come up with that point. That's all I'm saying.

[Joe House]

All right, there you have it. Jimmy Sexton, the man behind the mirror, the man behind the scenes making everything happen. We're gonna take a quick break and when we come back, we got conference championship games we're gonna do instead of our favorite other matchup, just our favorite matchup of the weekend. And of course, we got big van on campus and maybe a little bit more Billy Gill. If Billy Gil has some thoughts on Joel's take on Master P representing Nick Saban. We'll see. We be right back after the break. Ring your Tailgate is brought to you by FanDuel. The college football season is heating up and FanDuel's got a boost you don't want to miss. It's called boosting with the boys and it's giving everyone a college football profit boost every single week this weekend. I like the ACC championship game. I'm going to fade Virginia. I'm going to take the Duke Blue Devils, and I'm going to see if some chaos can happen in college football. We're talking the biggest games of the year. We're talking an extra payout on the line. It's easy, it's fun, and it's only on FanDuel. Go to FanDuel.com Tailgate to download the app. Check out the boosting with the boys offer and get in on all the action. Must be 21 or older and President select states are 18 and older and President DC, Kentucky or Wyoming. Opt in required bonus issued as non withdrawable profit boost tokens. Restrictions apply including any token expiration and max wager amount. See terms@sportsbook fanduel.com gambling problem. Call 1-800-gambler or visit rg-help.com call 1-887-897777 or visit ccpg.org chatinconnecticut this episode is.

[Van Lathan]

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[Joe House]

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[Joe House]

All right, we're back. Ringer Tailgate. Conference championship weekend. Big games. We got number two Indiana versus number one Ohio State. Number four Georgia versus number 10. 10 Alabama. Number 11 BYU versus number five Texas Tech. So those are the three big ones. Obviously some more games on the board. Troy vs Madison, Kennesaw State vs Jacksonville State, UNLV vs Boise State, Miami Ohio vs Western Michigan and of course the ACC dumpster fire Duke verse number 18 Virginia. Van, I'll go to you first favorite matchup on the board of all those games. I assume it will be number two versus number one. But maybe there's some other game that has your interest.

[Van Lathan]

It's BYU versus Texas Tech.

[Joe House]

Okay, there you go. Game of the week.

[Van Lathan]

Because that's the game that's going to essentially set the playoff field, right?

[Joe House]

Alabama jumped. The big news is Alabama jumped Notre Dame this week. And Hunter, your checks reasoning behind that is because they look so good against five and seven Auburn and he specifically mentioned the fourth and two play. So now Notre Dame and Alabama or Notre Dame and Miami. There we go. We got, we got the rankings right there. Shout out to Freez for pulling that out for us.

[Van Lathan]

Yeah.

[Joe House]

So now Miami and Notre Dame are side by side and they had said before that if they were in the same cluster they would be compared head to head record. But now they're saying if they're side by side they were they would be compared together. They also said that the rankings are not locked in so teams that are idle, that are not playing this weekend still can move. So those are kind of the big news. And notes from Hunter Yurchick. Again, very irrational stuff. But if you BYU, Texas Tech result goes in BYU's favor, that's when the chaos starts. I think that's what you're alluding to, right?

[Van Lathan]

Van well, yeah. If BYU beats Texas Tech, then it seems like there are a couple of teams that have real shots. Right? So if BYU were to beat Texas Tech, that's essentially how Miami gets in the playoff.

[Joel Klatt]

No, no, I think the Miami gets out of the playoff.

[Van Lathan]

No, excuse me. That's how. No, that, that's.

[Joe House]

If byu, that's when it's over.

[Van Lathan]

BYU beats Texas Tech, then Notre Dame would be out, probably.

[Joel Klatt]

Yeah, right.

[Joe House]

Yeah, they lose. There's only two at large spots at that point.

[Van Lathan]

Right, right. There's only two at large spots at that point. Then Notre Dame is out. If Notre Dame is out, all hell's gonna break loose because the entire college football watching public has been watching Notre Dame over these past weeks and is convinced at the quality of the team. I'm not disagreeing with them, but what I'm saying is the reason why that game is the most interesting game to me is because that game is the game that can signal the chaos. And the chaos going into the College Football Playoff season is what's going to be the most interesting thing. This is crazy. Number two Indiana versus number one Ohio State. I cannot think of a more meaningless two versus one matchup. It's crazy.

That I can remember in college football.

[Joe House]

And what's crazy, that could be the national. It should be the national championship game.

[Van Lathan]

In the old way and in other years, maybe it would have been 15.

[Joel Klatt]

Years ago, would be the national championship.

[Joe House]

Yeah, right.

[Van Lathan]

I can't think of a more. This is the more. The most meaningless two versus one that I can think of. Even regular season two versus ones way earlier in the year meant more because the team still had stuff to play for inside the season. The game could have a psychological toll on them. There could be attrition throughout the season. This game right here, like, it doesn't matter at all. I mean, it might give us a little something on Ohio State. It might give us a little something on Indiana. It might prove something about the teams. But I wouldn't be surprised if these teams didn't go out there feeling like these are two proud programs. Well, one proud program and one program that we're learning is pretty proud. They're going to go out there and try to win this game and try to prove that they're the best in their conference. I'm not saying that, but what I'm saying is, like, it's a meaningless game that neither team has very much to play for. So that game is out. Like, that is window dressing to me. You look at the SEC championship, it's nearly the same situation. Not quite, because Alabama could get blitzed in the SEC championship and it could actually change some people's perspective on Alabama. Alabama is a team that still kind of has something to prove. But BYU versus Texas Tech is a game that actually is very meaningful. Not just for those two teams, maybe less so for Texas Tech, but definitely for the entire College Football Playoff for sure.

[Joel Klatt]

Yeah, I'm really, you know, this is one of those times when I miss Texas and ou being in the, in the Big 12 because I would have loved to have seen ut or ou have to put play against this Texas Tech team. This is the best Texas Tech team in my entire life. Like even better than the 2008 one or I think it was 2008 team with Mike Leach and Michael Crabtree, that whole crew.

[Van Lathan]

Fun, fun squad.

[Joel Klatt]

Yeah, they were really fun. And so Tech can win pretty much a first round buy and BYU is in a winning in situation. So I would say this though, and.

[Joe House]

If BYU loses, they're probably out.

[Joel Klatt]

They're probably out.

[Van Lathan]

They're probably out.

[Joel Klatt]

Normally, normally I would make an argument on behalf of a two loss team under the circumstance because BYU has a lot of factors showing that they've got, you know, that they've got a stronger record than Notre Dame and I think Oklahoma, whatever. But I kind of get why 2 loss BYU wouldn't make it because at that point we know you're not better than Texas Tech. And I just kind of feel like if one team is already that dominant over you that just kind of disqualifies you from the national championship competition. Like you had a good year, but like you're not even better than Texas Tech. And if Texas Tech don't win the national championship, whatever. But like you've kind of had your opportunity to prove whether or not you need to be in the playoff or not. So I wouldn't, I wouldn't sweat it too much.

[Joe House]

Yeah, it's a double kill. If they lose that game, they'll probably fall. If they lose, lose that game 29 to 7 like they did in the first matchup, they'll probably fall behind a team like Vanderbilt in the final rankings. You know what I mean? Just based on like you're saying that. We've seen it, it's not quite there. So that'll, that'll be fascinating. Obviously, if byu.

[Van Lathan]

What is the scenario though? The scenario is if BYU wins, then.

[Joe House]

That, then, then Texas Tech has to take an at large, Texas takes an.

[Van Lathan]

At large, and then Texas Take. Taking it at large means there's one less at large, which means the committee has to compare Miami to Notre Dame. They would be in the same tranche, and then Notre Dame is probably out.

[Joel Klatt]

Yeah, I mean, that's the thing.

[Joe House]

Or they just get in over Miami and Miami's out, and they're the first team out like they were last year, which kind of.

[Van Lathan]

I don't think that the committee would do that, man.

[Joel Klatt]

It's just funny because they haven't had.

[Joe House]

Him in front of him the entire time, though. It just feels like.

[Van Lathan]

I don't think that they would do that. I think that they would look for a reason to put. Noted to put Miami in over Notre Dame. And I'm already seeing the propaganda come out one.

[Joe House]

I mean, Cristobal's done a good job pushing it.

[Joel Klatt]

Yeah, he has.

[Van Lathan]

Who?

[Joe House]

Mario Cristobal. Like, Sarkeesian was talking about them running up the score, and he was like, well, we played a team, a common opponent. We dominated that common opponent opponent. And they got dominated by that common opponent talking about Florida. And it was like, okay, well, Sark, your argument's dead.

[Van Lathan]

So I'm looking at this comparison between Miami and Notre Dame and all the teams that they've played that was sent by one Mr. Tate Frazier. And there's an argument to be made here. You know, Miami. Miami and Notre Dame both played pit. Miami won 38 to 7. Notre Dame won 38 to 30, 37 to 15. Miami and Notre Dame both played Stanford. Miami won 42 to 7. Notre Dame won 49 to 20. Miami and Notre Dame both played NC State. Miami won 41 to 7.

Notre Dame won 36 to 7. So if the reason why we are so in. Beyond the eye test, which tells you that Notre Dame is a fucking fantastic team. Right. If the reason why we're so enamored with Notre Dame is because the results and the dominance that we saw on the field against some of these teams, then if you. If you're really being objective about it, Miami could say the exact same thing in some cases. They could say that these victories are actually more sound. So what's the big difference?

[Joe House]

Also, they have a better scoring defense. They have a better overall defense. Right. I mean, they obviously beat them head to head, which I know at this point, that's. Everyone's just, you know, hammering that point home. Yeah.

[Joel Klatt]

No one cares about it, you know, so. Crystal ball, really. I. I have this thing that I told my wife and argument once. I was like, you think I go make me dinner?

Is that how you talk to Kiku, man. Is that. How is that go down in the Lathan household?

[Van Lathan]

No, no.

[Joel Klatt]

Talk to my wife like that. I don't. I mean.

[Joe House]

Just your assistant.

[Joel Klatt]

Yeah, just my assistant.

[Van Lathan]

Hey, actually say the line again. Say the line again. Joel, which one that you said, you have this thing that you say to.

[Joel Klatt]

Oh yeah, right, yeah. So I say something that I say to my wife is that I don't care about consistency.

[Van Lathan]

No, no, no, no. Say the line again. I have something that I say to my wife during the argument. Say the line again.

[Joel Klatt]

Okay, right. You know, babe, you think that I care about consistency, but I actually don't. Oh yeah. And I'm gonna say the line. Okay. I don't, I don't. What I care about is being right and like having the right information and the right data and the right facts. You know what I'm saying? So like I feel like a dumb person doesn't change their mind, like if they don't think things through right. And I don't want to be a dumb person. Like, I'm like, you can persuade me with more information and more data. And as I think about it, as I get further along in the season, I'm like, if the committee looks at that schedule and says, you know what, Miami did beat Notre Dame, they should probably be ahead of them. Their schedules are a lot more similar than I thought they should be ahead of them. But the other piece of it is that like I would might. All right, let's also kind of look at Alabama now too. Like now they've got three losses.

[Joe House]

Yeah, maybe, maybe if Alabama gets beat up bad by Georgia, they're the ones that are the odd man looking. But they won the sec. They're the number one seed.

[Joel Klatt]

You know what I'm saying? They lost. They, they, they lost to Florida State. Like that game should count now. Like we were counting. Now we're all agreeing that the first week counts again. So it's like, I don't know, I don't know. Maybe Alabama don't need to be in here neither.

[Joe House]

Florida State finished 13th in the ACC, tied with UNC for, for the record. So yeah, not good.

[Van Lathan]

I'll be real, man. I think psychologically.

The game is. I think psychologically Georgia, they want to try to beat Alabama, man. I think the game is, like I said, is like not that meaningful unless Alabama gets throttled and the community holds it against them. But Georgia just has an Alabama issue.

[Joe House]

Yeah, Kirby especially.

[Van Lathan]

Kirby's especially. So anytime they get the opportunity to play them, they need to Be able to demonstrate that they figured out their Alabama problem. So whereas in the other game, maybe it's not that meaningful. Maybe Indiana has something to prove in terms of their schedule. Maybe Ohio State has something to prove in terms of their schedule. But I think that those teams are two quality teams, and it means less before Georgia and Alabama. I think it means more.

[Joel Klatt]

Stop it. Also, you know what?

[Joe House]

We need a score behind that.

[Joel Klatt]

That was not great. Stop it. Stop it.

[Van Lathan]

That was crazy. You being a hater. That was. I don't know if you realized, but I weaved in the slogan of the SEC into that whole thing on the fly.

[Joel Klatt]

I was aware it was.

[Van Lathan]

Did you see that?

[Joel Klatt]

I did see it. I mean, you just.

[Van Lathan]

Yeah.

[Joel Klatt]

I mean. All right. I mean, it was good. We don't have to.

All right, Royce. Five, nine. You know what I'm saying?

[Van Lathan]

Shout out to my man, one of the greatest rappers of all time.

[Joe House]

Oh, man. Well, I think you're right. If Georgia can do some damage to Alabama, maybe that's a conversation. How funny would it be if Notre Dame and Miami both got into the playoff after they've done so much head to head arguing with each other this entire time? Yeah, it would be great. I don't think it's possible, but it would be funny.

[Joel Klatt]

I would. I mean, also, the kind of thing. I mean, it's not going to happen because Georgia is where they are in the rankings, but, I mean, if they did lose twice to Alabama, I could just reasonably make an argument that like, well, y' all have already proved you're not better than Alabama. You've lost twice.

[Joe House]

Oh, you're going to use the BYU argument? I could use the BYU argument. That's the problem with the committee, because, like, you can. Any argument could be brought up, and it just depends what they listen to.

[Joel Klatt]

Yeah, it's like, all right, I mean, y' all are good, but y' all not better than Alabama. So we already kind of know that They've handled y'. All. So anyway, yeah, man, that.

[Joe House]

That is going to be a crazy conference championship weekend. We're excited. We're going to be live on Saturday, reacting to the games as they happen. Let's turn to it. Big van on campus. Van, do you have a message this week?

[Van Lathan]

I have a message for Ole Miss. First of all, I want to say this to Ole Miss. I. I really, really. All jokes aside. All jokes aside, I really feel for y'.

[Joel Klatt]

All.

[Van Lathan]

I feel for the fans of Ole Miss. This had to be hard, right? Had to be hard. But there's A lesson in this, and this is the lesson. I'm gonna tell a story that I love. And the story is about three people.

The best looking man on the earth, the best looking woman on the Earth, and a $6 million man. This happened in the 70s. At this time, the best looking guy was a guy named Ryan o'. Neal. The best looking woman for that demo was a woman named Farrah Fawcett. And the six million dollar man was a guy named Lee Majors. Now, Lee Majors and Farrah Fawcett were in a relationship. Lee Majors had to go and do a movie, leave town for something. Lee Majors then told his friend Ryan o' Neill to hang out with his girl while he was gone.

[Joe House]

Crazy move.

[Van Lathan]

Crazy move. I'm sure you guys can see what happened after this. What happened after this Was Farrah Fawcett the best looking lady in the world, she gone. And Ryan o' Neal, the best looking guy in the world. In that demographic, they end up doing the thing. And it lasts legitimately until Farrah Fawcett left us, right? They were together basically forever. On and off. Whatever. They stayed together, right?

You gotta be careful when you show off your girl.

Ole Miss. You gotta be careful. When you are so anxious for everyone to see your girl, for everyone to get into your girl, for everyone to be around your girl, you gotta be careful. Cause you might be showing your girl off to Orion o'. Neal. You might be showing your girl off to someone that has a little bit more of an attractive package. Now, if y' all solid, it don't matter. If y' all are good, it don't matter. A good man or a good woman is not gonna leave you for the next thing, right?

[Joel Klatt]

If the relationship is solid, what kind of woman would.

[Van Lathan]

A woman that never really intended to stick around, one that is kind of open to somebody that's a little bit better looking. So this is why I would say to Ole Miss, your next coach. Don't make the entire personality.

Of your program about him. Don't make the entire from the ground up situation about him. Don't go crazy over the dog on Twitter. Don't go crazy over him on Twitter. Promote, do all of that stuff. But when you do that, when you become insempatico so much to the point to where your coach is your whole identity, you're showing your girl off.

And there might be a Lee Majors, actually there might be a Ryan o' Neal on the other side. And he might have a Cajun accent.

[Joe House]

And to give like Ole Miss a little bit of hope, Lee Majors Ended up marrying the playboy bunny of the year.

[Van Lathan]

Oh, he was a pounds back. Don't give me a $6 million man.

[Joe House]

Yeah, and that's another thing.

[Van Lathan]

That's a $6 million man, so you wouldn't go hold Steve Austin down. All right, that's the Six Million Dollar Man. And that's why I say it's gonna be cool for Ole miss. That's the $6 million, man. Celebrate your girl. Exalt your girl. But at the same time, just know on the other side of it could be Ryan o'.

[Joel Klatt]

Neal. Man, it's just crazy that Ryan o' Neal's daughter is Tatum o'. Neal.

[Van Lathan]

Tatum o' Neill from paper.

[Joel Klatt]

Yeah. Two years old. Yeah, I mean, I just. I've just.

[Van Lathan]

This was the 70s, dog.

[Joel Klatt]

Yeah, I know. I just. Shocking.

[Joe House]

See, the 70s feel like 30 years ago, but they're really 50 years ago. Yeah.

[Van Lathan]

Yeah.

[Joe House]

What if Majors was looking for a way out but didn't know how to kind of, like, do that?

[Joel Klatt]

You know what I mean?

[Joe House]

Maybe that was Ole Miss.

[Van Lathan]

So, honestly. Honestly, I had this conversation. It's actually the only thing that makes sense. Mm. The only thing that makes sense. This story that has vexed me to the point to why I wrote a script on it, like, it. The only thing that. That makes sense is that he was over it. That's the only thing that makes sense. So maybe Bill maybe doesn't want to.

[Joe House]

Be the bad guy in the situation, you know?

[Joel Klatt]

Yeah.

[Joe House]

And he's like, everyone's gonna think I'm an idiot if I divorce Farrah Fawcett. She's the most beautiful girl in the world. Is your script, like, based on a true story, or it's, like, just strictly facts.

[Van Lathan]

It's. The names were changed, but it's essentially from. It's basically like, I wrote it some years ago. I have to dust that off. It's basically kind of like almost like Challengers, but it's, like, inspired by that story.

[Joe House]

Trent Reznor, Atticus Ross. They soundtrack it, Van. That'd be nice. You gotta get, like, zombies in on it or something, you know, like, spice.

[Van Lathan]

It up, give it a little.

[Joe House]

Yeah. Twilightify it. Yeah.

[Joel Klatt]

Can I ask y' all a question? So have any of y' all ever told your homeboy to match take my girl out and show her a good time? Or have you been that guy? What?

[Van Lathan]

Nah, I've never been either.

[Joel Klatt]

Okay.

[Joe House]

Never been on either side of the coinboy.

[Van Lathan]

One of my homeboys has hung out with my girl before. Yeah, but it wasn't because I told them to go out and hang out.

[Joe House]

Okay, Right?

[Van Lathan]

It was just like, hey. It was. This was. This is what happened. It was like, hey. They came to. I was on set. They came to set. I wasn't ready yet. They came to pick me up. And then they. I was like, hey, I'm gonna be another two or three hours. And they're like, well, shit, we not going all the way back. And I was like, all right, just go out and do whatever. So they hung out for a little while. Whatever. But I wasn't like, yo, look after her.

[Joel Klatt]

See, I've been that guy twice that.

[Van Lathan]

A friend.

[Joel Klatt]

A friend has asked me, yo, my girl is. Whatever, one of your wrestling buddies. Show her a good time.

[Van Lathan]

Think about his wrestling brother talking to his. Hey, if you give him a hug, just know his body is very warm.

[Joe House]

Got a lot of body heat.

[Joel Klatt]

Well, I gotta be like that, right?

[Van Lathan]

What happened, though?

[Joel Klatt]

Okay, well, so the. The first one was my homeboy. And he don't probably care if I say, rusty. Rusty, man. We used to kick it. And he. This is the only time I'd ever been to one of them white fraternity parties, you know, it was one of them things. And he's like, man, can you take my girl out and, you know, go to this thing? And it was like a costume party or whatever. So I was like, man, I've never been. I've never even been over to that part of campus. I was just kind of curious about it, you know?

I got white boy wasted that night, bro. I don't even remember how I got back.

[Joe House]

Joel turned into Cheryl Moore.

[Joel Klatt]

Hold on.

[Van Lathan]

You know what? Joel doesn't realize? Joel doesn't realize that what a sick cuck, black bull situation he was in.

[Joel Klatt]

Man, with these freaky ass people.

Don't say that about Rusty, man.

[Van Lathan]

That Rusty girl probably had, like, a spades tattoo on her butt.

[Joel Klatt]

No vote.

[Van Lathan]

It's like this sick. Like, this sick.

[Joel Klatt]

I knew the girl, though.

[Van Lathan]

Situation that you was in.

[Joel Klatt]

They was trying to dry the girl.

[Van Lathan]

So that you could come in and they could redo the movie Mandingo from the 70s, man.

[Joe House]

Well, did she have the tattoo?

[Joel Klatt]

She did not have a tattoo. She ended up being like a tv.

[Van Lathan]

How do you know she didn't have the tattoo?

[Joel Klatt]

That's a great question. You know what I don't have. She didn't seem like the kind of person that would have.

[Van Lathan]

Why? Okay, got you.

[Joel Klatt]

Okay.

[Joe House]

Seems like a person that has tattoos.

[Joel Klatt]

Come on, let's just move on to the next one in that. My homeboy so with, man, this.

How did that went?

[Joe House]

He got white boy wasted. What do you mean?

[Van Lathan]

How did it end? Joel had sex with a girl while his homeboy watched. That's how it is. Like, that's how it ended.

[Joe House]

Don't say that about Rusty.

[Joel Klatt]

Yeah, don't say that about. Right, Rusty. Rusty more G than that. No, Rusty's a G, man.

[Joe House]

Rusty just said, you know, I'm a.

[Joel Klatt]

G. Yeah, you know. You know, Rusty said that. I'm not going to use the names of these other people because I know some people, some bad habit who watch this, okay? Or whatever. And it's a. It's a very sensitive situation because this is about a friend that I was very close with that I'm no longer close with. But it. It wasn't. It didn't break up over this. Anyway, point is, so one time I'm in Dallas, and his girl. Oh, shit. I. Let me. Oh, man.

[Joe House]

We'll pretend you didn't say Dallas.

[Joel Klatt]

Okay? And his girl was kind of from that area. She was somewhere from the Dallas area. I'm living in Dallas. And he's like, yo, my girl is at home with her family. Like, she wants to meet you. Like, you should go take her. You know, go meet her friend. Go take her out or whatever. So I drive all the way out to this suburb on the far flung edge of Dallas. And I mean, actually, his girlfriend was beautiful. Like, I mean, she was. I mean, she. I mean, just a beautiful woman. Like, tattoos, like, literally stop traffic.

No, I don't think so. I don't think so. But anyway, so I go. I pull up to their house. First of all, when she comes out, she was in the pool. Like, she's in her bathing suit and she, like, comes out of the pool, rises up out of the pool, and then starts to get ready. And I'm just like, oh, okay. You know what I'm saying? I'm being cool. And so I'm meeting her family or whatever and talking to them, and I'm vibing with him. Like, you know, people. You know, when I showed up, people like me, dawg. And so we were talking, having a good time.

[Joe House]

You know, I'm a G. You know.

[Joel Klatt]

I'm a G. So anyway, after that, we went to Papa Dough. Okay. We went to have dinner at Papa Doe, and then we went to a movie. Okay. And I take her home. Nothing. Nothing untoward.

[Joe House]

That's a date.

[Van Lathan]

That's a.

[Joe House]

You took it.

[Van Lathan]

Right?

[Joel Klatt]

So this is so, like. I'm like, I'm so. You know, the. The Friend. It was very hard not to say. The friend hits me up later, and he is just like, yo, bro, bitch, you took my girl on a date. And I was just like, hey, man, what the fuck was I supposed to do? We were supposed to go to a bar and play pool. I didn't. Maybe we should have done.

[Joe House]

Sounds like a date also.

[Joel Klatt]

But it was just like.

[Joe House]

I was just like, another date.

[Joel Klatt]

Let's go get dinner. You know what I'm saying?

[Van Lathan]

And. Oh, this was the next question. So it was your idea.

[Joel Klatt]

No, it was to go to the.

[Van Lathan]

Dinner and then to go to. No, that. You just said it.

[Joel Klatt]

Oh, yeah.

[Joe House]

I don't remember.

[Joel Klatt]

I don't remember how the dinner in the movie thing happened.

[Van Lathan]

I really don't.

[Joel Klatt]

You just can't. She want. She went with me.

[Van Lathan]

How many times? Joe, what the. Is going on? You demon, you. You stud.

[Joel Klatt]

Don't do that, Joe. You stud.

[Van Lathan]

Oh, my God. Oh, my God.

[Joel Klatt]

But are they together? No. Oh.

[Van Lathan]

Did you ever date her?

[Joel Klatt]

No.

[Joe House]

Okay. Just the one night stand.

[Joel Klatt]

I did try.

I did try to date a couple of her friends.

[Van Lathan]

Okay, that's. That's acceptable.

[Joe House]

Yeah, that's right. That's what you should do.

[Van Lathan]

That's acceptable. That's what you're supposed to.

[Joel Klatt]

I met her at their wedding. Right. A few years ago.

[Van Lathan]

So they got married.

[Joel Klatt]

They did get married.

[Van Lathan]

Then they got. Oh, okay. Oh, wow.

[Joe House]

Joel. Too early. Too early or too late? Yeah, good question. Yeah.

[Van Lathan]

Probably a little late. Okay, so then for you, then they broke up, and you're no longer friends with this guy. So if I'm putting two plus two together.

[Joel Klatt]

Yeah.

[Joe House]

He thinks you had something to do with it.

[Van Lathan]

You had something to do with it. You were in the middle of it.

[Joel Klatt]

No, because this happened years later. The thing.

[Joe House]

He just never got over it.

Did her friends not date you because you had been with her?

[Joel Klatt]

Really, man? What you doing, man? I never was with this young lady.

[Van Lathan]

I don't think.

[Joel Klatt]

You know. And I'm not one of those people. I'm not one of those people. This person is out of my league or whatever. But I don't. Maybe she would. Oh, God. In a different world, she saw. Maybe today she'd be like, well, you know, Joel is aged well. He's got a professional career, whatever.

[Joe House]

She might have got an assistant.

[Van Lathan]

If it was in a different time. This. Back then, in college.

[Joel Klatt]

You're married in college. I was broke.

[Van Lathan]

This guy's nuts, man.

[Joel Klatt]

But I was broke.

[Van Lathan]

What are we going to do with this guy?

[Joe House]

Joe, you're my favorite character.

[Van Lathan]

This guy's something else, man.

[Joe House]

He's still thinking about this date.

[Joel Klatt]

Ever.

[Van Lathan]

How does work if she pop up? This guy would never.

[Joel Klatt]

That would never happen. I don't want. I'm happy in my life, but if it did, I'm not going to get the picture down. It doesn't matter, because I don't want to show your girl off. Don't want to show your girl off, you know?

[Joe House]

Yeah, don't show your girl off. Ryan o' Neal is probably watching right now.

[Joel Klatt]

Ron o', Neill, unfortunately, is not in the league anymore, man. Oh, man.

[Joe House]

Oh, he passed away, did he?

[Joel Klatt]

Yeah, man. He's 80 something. I mean, his daughter's 62 years old.

[Joe House]

Yeah, I guess. Yeah.

[Van Lathan]

Yeah. Ryan, out of here.

Before we get out of here, can I say one last thing?

[Joe House]

Yeah, please.

[Van Lathan]

Okay. So we talked about Diego Fabio, right? And we talked about Diego Pavia. And I said that Diego Pavia is annoying. And there were a lot of people who came out and they said, man, it's a college kid. It's a college kid. If he was, you know, getting a master's degree, it's like, Van is a college kid. You really shouldn't say that. Right? And I thought to myself, I thought.

Maybe they're right. Maybe it's not fair to call Diego Pavia annoying because he is a college kid, postgraduate, whatever he is, he's a college kid. And you don't want to do that. Like, he's out there having fun. And then a headline came across my Twitter feed, vandy qb, Diego Pavia is calling for President Donald Trump to sign an executive order to expand the College football playoff to 16 teams at Real. Donald Trump make the executive order, please. That's what the fuck I'm talking about.

[Joel Klatt]

See, man, I'm taking a deep breath because why? What are you doing?

[Van Lathan]

That's what the. I'm not. This ain't got nothing to do with Trump, okay? Batman could be the president. Somebody who I deeply love. All right? What are you doing? Asking the President of the United States of America. I could say so much shit right now to get involved in college football on an executive order tip. Particularly in these times right now. It's annoying Kid Gerber garbage bullshit from somebody. You know why he did that? For attention.

That's not gonna happen. He goes to Vanderbilt. He's gotta know that that's not gonna happen. He can't fucking do that for attention. Attention. This happened to be one week where we weren't going to talk about Diego Pavia, right? We weren't Going to talk about Diego Pavia because they're not playing football. So how does Diego Pavia get back into the news cycle? By tweeting Donald Trump and asking Donald Trump to get involved by signing an executive order for college football to be expanded to 16 teams. That is annoying.

[Joel Klatt]

Yeah.

[Van Lathan]

It's not the biggest crime in the world, but it's annoying.

[Joel Klatt]

He's really connected himself, like the Theo Vaughn of it all. He got Theo in. He's like Johnny Manziel. He really is, like, tried to, like, make himself a, you know, a personality. His mama's, like, tried to, you know, throw it up out there, bro. You know.

[Joe House]

I don't know what that means. What does that mean?

What?

[Joel Klatt]

Show some leg.

[Joe House]

In his. In his defense, Marco Rubio, like, two days ago was saying if Miami doesn't get in, that Trump should be in charge of the college of the cfp. Yeah. And he's like the Secretary of State. So it seems like they're itching to get involved as a member of maga.

[Joel Klatt]

What do you think, Billy? Do you.

[Van Lathan]

Okay.

Billy, all opinions.

Let me tell you something. Billy, let me tell you something. This right here is a place where we can have healthy debate about things that we disagree on.

[Joe House]

Trying to see if I had a red Marlins hat somewhere.

[Van Lathan]

This is a place where we can have healthy debate on things that we disagree on. Am I in la? Yes. Am I willing to talk about this with you, Billy? Absolutely. We disagree now.

[Joe House]

We don't disagree.

[Van Lathan]

It's legitimately. Yeah, I'm trying to tell you it's legitimately okay. Now, as a Cuban man, what do you think about Hegseth going in on that boat again?

[Joe House]

Oh, man.

[Joel Klatt]

All right.

[Joe House]

What a way to wrap up the show. I feel like that's the ultimate parting shot. Joel, you know, parting shots from you, right? You already told your. Your one night stand story.

[Joel Klatt]

It wasn't a one night stand. Man. Don't do that. That's. There's a couple of things that y' all be doing that are uncomfortable. Don't do it.

[Van Lathan]

Because people. People, watch.

[Joe House]

We did not bring this up.

[Van Lathan]

You heard what Joel just said. What did you say? What'd you say?

[Joel Klatt]

What did I say about what?

[Van Lathan]

You said there's a couple of things. What'd you say?

[Joel Klatt]

A couple of stories that are coming up.

[Van Lathan]

Joel said there's a couple of things that we do that are uncomfortable. That's actually what he told his people that he wrestles with as well.

[Joel Klatt]

Stop it.

[Joe House]

Get a little uncomfortable. Which one of them.

[Van Lathan]

No, I made you know, checking the order.

[Joel Klatt]

As a wrestler, I made it uncomfortable. Comfortable for people, you know.

[Van Lathan]

Oh, my God.

[Joel Klatt]

All right, people, you know, good for you. I'm muscling through the homophobia. You're not gonna do that.

[Van Lathan]

It's not that.

[Joel Klatt]

What the.

[Van Lathan]

See. All right.

[Joe House]

Oh, man, what a great show this is. Ringer Tailgate. We appreciate everybody tuning into the show. Got to talk about a lot on this show. Covered a lot of topics. We'll be back on Saturday. Conference championship weekend. Come hang out with us. Most fun or most viewed show we had on Saturday. So everything's trending up. Come hang out with us. Like subscribe comment as Van said on Saturday show. Share with a friend. You know, we're having a good time. So again, ring your tailgate. Appreciate everybody tuning in and we will see you on Saturday.

I like the roll. I like to roll into it.

[Joel Klatt]

All right, let's catch it on again.

[Joe House]

Must be 21 or older and present in select states for Kansas and affiliation with Kansas Star Casino or 18 and older and present in D.C. kentucky or Wyoming. Gambling problem, call 1-800- GAMBLER or visit rg-help.com, call 1-887-89-7777 or visit ccpg.org chat in Connecticut or visit mdgamblinghelp.org in Maryland. Hope is here. Visit gamblinghelplinema.org or call 800-327-50504 for 24. 7 support in Massachusetts or call 1-877-8-HOPE NY or text Hopeny in New.