Feeling wheels and growth mindset: Lessons from 17 years at Wisconsin Humane Society

Summary

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Podcast Summary: "Feeling wheels and growth mindset: Lessons from 17 years at Wisconsin Humane Society"

Podcast: RKD Group: Thinkers
Host: Nipa Eason (B)
Guest: Sarah Trudeau, Director of Data and Annual Fund, Wisconsin Humane Society (A)
Date: November 13, 2025

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Overview

This episode features a deep-dive conversation with Sarah Trudeau, who has spent 17 years growing with the Wisconsin Humane Society (WHS), moving from adoption counselor to Director of Data and Annual Fund. The discussion explores scaling up a nonprofit, fostering a growth mindset, developing a monthly giving program, and the realities of compassion fatigue and self-care in nonprofit roles. It’s a candid, practical, and inspiring look at what it takes to make an impact in animal welfare and beyond.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Sarah’s Path into Nonprofit Work

• Sarah grew up around nonprofits due to her family’s community engagement, though animal welfare was not the original path.
• Originally aimed for accounting, she discovered a passion for animal welfare after a part-time job at WHS.

  “I took a part time job at WHS and just completely and utterly fell in love. I fell in love with our mission, I fell in love with the people...” (04:01)

2. Scaling an Organization: Growth at WHS

• From two to six shelters over 17 years, plus a high-volume spay/neuter clinic and one of the Midwest’s largest wildlife centers.

• Fundraising budget grew from $2.4 million to nearly $15 million in that time.

• Need for rapid systematization and alignment due to widely separated campuses.

  “We had to quickly learn just how to systematize everything, how to scale things … fundraising wise, just tremendous growth.” (05:55)

• Importance of documentation to prevent loss of institutional knowledge during team changes.

  “Okay, yeah, no, we should document this stuff... so much isn’t written down and isn't documented.” (07:26)

• Overcoming challenges in integrating fundraising databases and aligning donor communications, especially during mergers or partnerships.

  “Getting all of those donors used to our language, used to our systems from a direct mail side...” (07:30)

3. Proudest Achievements

• Building new shelters and managing capital campaigns has made a tangible impact.
• Team growth: from two people in development to ~24.

  “To physically see your work in action is a really beautiful thing … building a team. I’m so proud of my team.” (09:50)

4. Growth Mindset & Organizational Culture

• Emphasis on feedback, open-mindedness, and willingness to change is institutionalized at WHS.
• Leaders are encouraged to seek and accept feedback, even when it’s hard to hear.

  “You have to sit with that and let the ego go to the side and know … that we can hear feedback and know that it's coming from a good place.” (12:09)

5. Monthly Giving (“Sustainers”) Program

• The journey: from 50–60 monthly donors to nearing 1,500 over 13+ years.

• Embracing subscription/donation models familiar to millennials.

• Success has primarily been through “unlocking challenge” campaigns rather than substantial investments in face-to-face fundraising.

  “We had maybe, maybe like 50 to 60 at that point. Now we're, we're getting really, really close to 1500.” (15:20) “Our biggest campaign … is an unlocking challenge. … I think that last one we got almost 150 within a 30 day period … no investment from our organization.” (15:32, 16:26)

• Monthly donors now generate around $500,000/year—a reliable, no-overhead income stream.

  “We’re inching closer to about 500,000 per year … that’s reliable income…” (16:56)

6. Reality of the Work: Typical Day & Problem-Solving

• No truly “typical” day; the role covers meetings, reporting, occasional travel to shelters, and hands-on help during peak periods.
• The staff shares a “problem-solving mindset,” adapting to community needs and responding rapidly to crises (e.g., intake of 121 cats in a single day, 47 from one home).

  “There is no standard day in animal welfare ... I had to spend ... I drove that week about 17 hours total ... but I was like, this is so pretty.” (18:02, 18:52) “The team just put their heads down… they put their head down and solved that problem and without complaining and just took care of those animals.” (21:39)

7. Communication and Donor Engagement

• Communication strategy has shifted over recent years to more holistic, community-aware messaging.

  “Our communications and marketing team ... are really trying to put a systematic lens on things ... we shifted that messaging probably really ... 5ish years ago. And it's just been a really beautiful change.” (27:34, 29:05)

• Messaging emphasizes interconnectedness of issues and the broader impact of each action.

8. Advice for Nonprofit Professionals and Self-Care

• Pace yourself; you cannot fix everything at once—avoid the “mouse wheel”.

  “It's easy to get caught in... a mouse wheel ... we're only one human, we're only one organization ... listening first... instead of automatically being the one... shifting things...” (29:49, 30:00)

• Give yourself and teammates grace; compassion fatigue is real and pervasive, even outside direct animal care.

  “Give yourself grace, give each other grace, give the world grace. Because the work that we do is really, really hard. Compassion fatigue is real.” (31:56)

• Leadership models and encourages healthy boundaries (e.g., “get off email at 5 o’clock,” taking vacations).

• Use of the “feelings wheel” to help identify and process emotions, especially after traumatic or overwhelming events.

  “Somewhere, I have a feelings wheel that I always keep really close to me. Yeah, it's something that I even look at on a regular basis ... trying to pinpoint that and really sitting with that...” (33:37, 35:39)

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Notable Quotes & Timestamps

On scaling and growth:

• “We had to quickly learn just how to systematize everything, how to scale things... if I had any clue how to do, I would say absolutely not. But we learned to do that.” – Sarah (05:55)
• “Direct mail still works.” – Nipa (08:43)

On organizational culture and mindset:

• “We’re constantly working through [open mindedness and willingness to change] from the top down... I think as a leader, that's really important.” – Sarah (12:09)

On cultivating monthly giving:

• “We haven't been able to make a huge, sizable investment ... It's really just kind of been these smaller campaigns that just build over time.” – Sarah (15:32)
• “That’s reliable income and similar to a large event ... where you have no overhead.” – Sarah (17:17)

On resilience and teamwork:

• “The team just put their heads down and ... stayed an extra, I think two or three hours ... and just took care of those animals.” – Sarah (21:39)

On self-care and compassion fatigue:

• “Give yourself grace, give each other grace, give the world grace. Because the work that we do is really, really hard. Compassion fatigue is real.” – Sarah (31:56)
• “If you need ... to step away for longer than just a moment, do that. Because the things you are going to see are tough ... it's really important to really connect with yourself and know what you're feeling.” – Sarah (33:37)

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Important Timestamps

• Sarah’s introduction & nonprofit journey — [02:27]–[04:42]
• Organization’s scaling and team growth — [04:56]–[09:50]
• Growth mindset and feedback culture — [11:13]–[13:06]
• Challenges and successes in monthly giving — [13:32]–[17:34]
• Day-to-day realities and teamwork stories — [18:02]–[21:39]
• Organizational communication strategy — [27:16]–[29:05]
• Advice for nonprofit professionals and self-care — [29:49]–[35:39]

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Memorable Moment

Sarah introduces her dog Louis, adopted from WHS, highlighting the personal connections formed over years with the organization:

“He came from WHS about ... almost nine years ago ... I knew within, gosh, five minutes of meeting him, I'm like, this is my dog. We connected right away.” (24:11)

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Key Takeaways (as recapped by the host)

1. Scaling is hard for any organization: Prioritize aligning databases and communications as you grow.
2. Assume positive intent and keep a growth mindset: Continually seek feedback and flexibility.
3. Compassion fatigue is real: Prioritize self-care and encourage it within your team.

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This episode is a practical, heartfelt manual for professionals and leaders in the nonprofit space, offering both strategic insight and honest, lived experience from the front lines of animal welfare.

Transcript

[A]

We've been fortunate enough to build a couple shelters, do a couple capital campaigns in my time in fundraising, and that's been really, really cool. Just to physically see your work in action is a really beautiful thing. We're also on the cusp of another one, and that one, I think, is one that we are all just. We know we need it so bad for that certain community, and it's just going to be something that I think all of us are going to be just incredibly proud of. I'm gonna back up now over 13, almost 14 years. When I first started being a millennial, I knew that was kind of one of the things. I came in and I was like, oh, I really think we should focus on this, because I do. Like, Netflix was kind of just starting and that I knew that subscription and so many people my age were not lazy. We're really driven, but we're used to that model. Yes, exactly. It works.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And so we had maybe, maybe like 50 to 60 at that point. Now we're, we're getting really, really close to 1500.

[B]

That's incredible.

[A]

Slowly built it over time. We haven't been able to make a huge, sizable investment where we would do face to face fundraising or anything like that. It's really just kind of been these smaller campaigns that just build over time.

[B]

Welcome to the RKD Group Chat podcast, where we bring you behind the scenes of nonprofit life. We shed light on the compassion and purpose behind the individuals solving the world's most challenging problems. I'm your host, Nipa Eason. You might remember that Kate McKinley used to host this podcast, and I'm so excited to pick up where she left off. Today we're chatting with Sarah Trudeau from the Wisconsin Humane Society. She started as an adoption counselor, and 17 years later, she's now the director of Data and Annual Fund. This conversation is so inspiring with ideas for your own nonprofits and. And an introduction to Louis. Let's chat. Sarah, so nice to meet you. Thank you for joining us here on RKD Group Chat. I have so many questions for you, but what I really wanted to know, to kind of start at the beginning, really, what prompted you to even consider being a nonprofit? So you've been in a nonprofit for so long? 17 years. Is this something that even as a kid you gravitated toward? I feel like a lot of us kind of fell into nonprofits, so I'd love to hear that story.

[A]

Yeah, for sure. No, definitely had no idea. However, I will say that I have been around nonprofits my whole Life. My mom was on the, she was the president of the Midwest Epilepsy Society and we did lots of, just as a family, lots of different fun fundraisers and helped her with that stuff. So definitely not animal focused by any means, but we definitely had a lot of that mentality growing up. And we're very community driven. And my grandpa was a veteran and a vet. I always like to joke that he was like a double vet, but he, he got, he went to vet school on the GI Bill.

[B]

Oh, wonderful. Yeah.

[A]

Yeah. We were always around animals growing up and just I knew from a very young age that I really wanted to be around animals. However, I also knew I'm not good at science and so it's a challenge.

[B]

A lot of us face. Yeah.

[A]

And so I knew I couldn't do what my grandpa did and so I actually just kind of stumbled into it. I had a. I'm from northern Wisconsin and when I came down to the Milwaukee area to go to school, I definitely thought I was going to be an accountant. I thought that was my track, that's where I would go.

[B]

This is a big shift. Yeah.

[A]

And I took a part time job at WHS and just completely and utterly fell in love. I fell in love with our mission, I fell in love with the people and, and once I was done with school, I shifted from the op side, so animal care side into the fundraising side about 13 years ago. Not to age myself, but so I had about three, three and a half years, almost four of really good in shelter experience and then was able to shift to, to the fundraising side and learn that whole world as well.

[B]

That's amazing. And I mean, I think you've been with Wisconsin Humane for 17 years now. I'm sure there's been a lot of change and a lot of growth. Do you want to talk a little bit about that? How much has it changed since you started?

[A]

Tremendously. I'll speak more of the fundraising side because that's the piece I know the best. But we. So when I first started, we had just acquired our second shelter, which is Ozaukee. We are now up to six in a high volume spay neuter clinic. We also, although it's part of one of our campuses, I also like to point out that we do have a wildlife center, wildlife rehabilitation center. It's one of the largest in the Midwest. And although again, it is part of our Milwaukee campus, I do like to call it out because it is a whole other entity as well. So tremendous growth in that area and our campuses are not right Next to each other, we don't have that luxury. So they span. Here's the state of Wisconsin. They span all the way down here, all the way up here. And they're separated by about, depending on traffic, four hours. Ish. And so it.

[B]

Oh, wow. Yeah.

[A]

Take a while to get from one point to the other. So we. We had to quickly learn just how to systematize everything, how to scale things. That was something. Had you asked me 13, almost 14 years ago at this point, if I had any clue how to do, I would say absolutely not. But we learned to do that. And then fundraising wise, just tremendous growth. When I first started, our entire budget was. Our entire fundraising budget was 2.4 million. And now, gosh, we're close to 14. Almost 15 million.

[B]

Wow.

[A]

Just the annual fund side alone brings in well over that initial budget that I worked with. So that's been really, really wild to see and very fun as well.

[B]

Yeah, I mean, I feel like that kind of scaling is challenging even for companies that are built for that. What were some of the challenges that you face in scaling up that big.

[A]

Yeah, great question. I think the biggest thing is just getting. I'm onboarding somebody right now. And so it's been another eye opener for me because when I think we have systems in place, somebody new comes in and they have great questions and it makes you go, oh, yeah, oh.

[B]

Yeah, that's institutional knowledge. I just had it in my head. Yeah, exactly. Totally.

[A]

Whereas, like, okay, yeah, no, we should document this stuff. We should. Because there's so much, you know, after so many years of being here that maybe isn't written down and isn't documented. We also had a shift just a couple years ago that was another eye opener of our VP had left and she had been. She was kind of tenured in the organization and. And it was a pretty sizable shift. And also just knowing or seeing that again, some of those policy or those kind of standard things that we were used to, we have to shift them. But I think another really big thing, just besides all of the protocols and just the SOP type things, is the database and getting those all aligned. Because that really was tough in the moment. Now we're on the other side of it, but tough in the moment of just getting all of those donors used to our language, used to our systems from a direct mail side. We send a lot of direct mail. I'm really proud of. Brings in a ton of money for our organization.

[B]

Right. Direct mail still works.

[A]

Yes, it does. Yeah. I mean, gosh, I think I just Celebrated last year that it was our highest year ever. Wow.

[B]

Congratulations.

[A]

Really proud of that number. But a lot of the organizations that. That we have acquired or partnered with, they weren't. They were maybe sending one piece of mail a month or, I'm sorry, a year, and we. We. We sent a lot more than that.

[B]

Right.

[A]

So that. That. That is a. I think, a cultural shift that a lot of the. The smaller communities maybe weren't used to.

[B]

Yeah. Yeah, that makes a lot of sense. Okay, so you guys scaled up from two to six, and then two to six shelters, and then also the rehab facility that you were talking about, which is huge. That's amazing. What do you feel like are maybe like, shining career moments that you can highlight, like, two or three things that have happened in the last 17 years that you're just like, this was amazing. Along with, like, the amount of money you guys raised last year. That's, like, a huge thing. Right. But like any other huge moments.

[A]

Yeah, we've been fortunate enough to build a couple shelters, do a couple of capital campaigns in my time in fundraising, and that's been really, really cool. Just to physically see your work in action is a really beautiful thing. We're also on the cusp of another one, and that one, I think, is one that we are all just. We know we need it so bad for that certain community, and it's just going to be something that I think all of us are going to be just incredibly proud of. And then also just building a team. I'm so proud of my team. I'm so grateful for them. And I have five on my team. But I've seen our development team grow from two of us. Gosh, I think we're close to 24 now, so that's been tremendous growth as well. And so, yeah, to be there and helping along the way, not necessarily leading those other teams, but being able to be there if they have questions. Or maybe there's moments where I'm like, oh, we can maybe do this a little differently or easier if we tried this way. I always love to make people's lives easier, and if there's a better, faster way, we can do it. I always love to just kind of help with that, too.

[B]

Yeah, that's really amazing. I think that that's so important, that kind of growth mindset, especially in the nonprofit industry and just in this. Just in this climate in general, just having this mindset of listening and hearing suggestions and trying new things. I think that's amazing. Is that, like, how do you. How do you encourage that in your team, just in general, like being open with ideas and bringing them to you?

[A]

That's a great question. In general, we tend to be that as an organization, I might be misremembering, but I'm pretty sure it's in all of our job or our job. We have job descriptions and I think it's in our annual reviews. HR would not be super proud of me for not totally remembering, but those.

[B]

Happen once a year. There's no way you could remember them.

[A]

Exactly. But I'm like 99% sure we do have a bullet that does say open mindedness and willingness to change. And that's something that just again, as an organization, so from the top down, we're constantly working through. And then it's also just on my smaller team, just something that I love to encourage. If anybody notices anything, I'm constantly asking for feedback. I think as a leader, that's something that's really important. Sometimes it's butterflies and rainbows, sometimes it can be a little tougher to swallow. But you have to sit with that and let the ego go to the side and know that again, even starting from me, that we can hear feedback and know that it's coming from a good place, positive place, and it's going to help everybody in the organization. Including. Including all the animals as well.

[B]

Yeah, yeah, definitely. So one of the things I think you focus on is monthly giving. Right. And I know that's a struggle with a lot of our nonprofits just cracking that code. Like how do we get people to commit in that way to our organizations? Do you have anything that you've done or tried that has been super successful or things that you're like, you know, I just wouldn't do it this way again.

[A]

I just have to giggle because we literally. We had a full team meeting this morning and we just wrapped up a campaign, a monthly donor campaign. And I went, ah, these results weren't what I expected. Right, right.

[B]

Which is always disappointing.

[A]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. And it's hard when, you know, people put time and effort into the. Into it as well. But so for example, the one we just wrapped, we only got nine monthly donors and that's tough. We were shooting for hundreds.

[B]

Oh, no, that's really short. Yeah. I'm so sorry. It's so unpredictable sometimes.

[A]

Exactly. And we are going. I feel like I've been saying this a lot over the past couple years, but really unprecedented times. The shutdown happened the day we launched the campaign. Oh, yeah, yeah. Not super ideal, but not to our team. We had it on the calendar. We, we wanted to continue to try it and so I could. Maybe it didn't have any effect. Who knows. But what our kind of our little, our nuggets of good that we tried to do with it was a premium. So we were giving away a T shirt. In the past that's done really well. However, this time it seems like it kind of fell flat. So I'm going to back up now over 13, almost 14 years. When I first started being a millennial, I knew that was kind of one of the things I came in and I was like oh I really think we should focus on this because I do like Netflix was kind of just starting and that I knew that subscription and so many people my age were not lazy. We're really driven but.

[B]

We'Re used to that model.

[A]

Yes, exactly. It works.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And so we had maybe, maybe like 50 to 60 at that point. Now we're getting really, really close to 1500.

[B]

That's incredible.

[A]

Slowly built it over time. We haven't been able to make a huge sizable investment where we would do face to face fundraising or anything like that. It's really just kind of been these smaller campaigns that just build over time. Most of it is digital focused but we have done direct mail in the past and that's also been really successful. I would say our biggest piece and we're going to be our biggest campaign and we're hopefully going to be trying it again in the near future. Is an unlocking challenge. So if we get X amount we unlock a certain gift for this amount that's been our most successful and I'm really excited to try it again in the future because we. I know, I think that last one we got almost 150 within a 30 day period and there was no investment from our organization whatsoever in it.

[B]

That's amazing. That's huge. Yeah. And those sustainers make such a difference in the organization's just the cash flow. Just knowing what you're gonna get and being aware of what's coming in. Right. So important. And I mean you've shared some numbers. How much of the organization's funding do you think comes from your monthly donors? If you're okay with sharing that.

[A]

Yeah. Okay. Sharing it. However, I don't have that number offhand. Yeah.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

I would say it's not, not huge. Yeah. Again of around it's not huge. We're inching closer to about 500,000 per year. And that's, that's, it's great.

[B]

That's still significant.

[A]

Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. But a fraction of our overall budget. But again, that's reliable income and similar to a large event that, you know, that is. Is reliable, is reliable each year and.

[B]

Where you have no overhead. Right, right.

[A]

That's one of my pitches for it. Always. I'm like, that's it. All we had to do was just turn it on.

[B]

Yeah. Yeah. That's incredible. So I'm going to pivot a little bit. What is your typical day? Like, you've said that the facilities are kind of far apart. So do you visit them? What's your standard day? Kind of structured around.

[A]

I always like to joke, there is no standard day in animal welfare. Right. Or fundraising in general. Nowadays, I tend to have a lot of meetings, a lot of virtual meetings, meeting with my team via teams. I would say that's a good chunk of my day. I also am the one that runs a lot of the fundraising reports for our team, for the organization. So I am often just knee deep in numbers. I don't, unfortunately, get a chance to visit a ton to the other shelters. I was. I was fortunate enough with my new team member to go visit two of them two weeks ago, which was fun because the Wisconsin fall colors were all right.

[B]

It's fall in Wisconsin. That's amazing. It's beautiful. Yeah.

[A]

Yeah. I had to spend. I think I drove that week about 17 hours total that week. And I was just like, most of the time that would make me very crabby, but I was like, this is so pretty and so pretty.

[B]

So all the colors. It's. That's. I'm in Florida, so I don't get that as much, but I'm. I miss the Midwest for that.

[A]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. And this year they just seemed like extra. I was joking with my husband that it looked like a quilt. Like, beautiful. Yeah. So I would say. And then also seasonal. So if, obviously we're heading into one of our busiest times. And so November, December, I often have to be kind of at the ready to go jump over to the shelter to help with my team that is doing data entry and really whatever she needs me to do. Whether you want me to do entry or if I'm just opening envelopes, I can do that and take a meeting wherever. Wherever we need to.

[B]

Yeah. That sounds like a, like, along with the growth mindset. It's just like a problem solving mindset.

[A]

Right.

[B]

Like, I'm just going to be here to do the things that need to get done. And is that something that you. You see commonly in your organization? Like, okay, like, you are. I Mean, as a, as working in a nonprofit, you are trying to solve these like, really big problems in our world. Right? And, and so I feel like that's a pretty common, common trait that you're going to, you're going to see across your, your organization. And how does that, like, how does that manifest for you, like, in, like, just in general with problem solving? Because I know that's like you said, it's a, it's an unprecedented time.

[A]

It is. And we, I'm not going to even speak for my, my own self, but as the organization, we, we used to have managed intake and earlier this year we realized we weren't necessarily meeting people where they were at with it. And so problem solving mindset, we decided to reduce that barrier and we now have open doors. Whenever people need to come to us, they can come to us. And it was a lot on the team. It will continue to probably be a lot, especially as these unprecedented times. But for example, Friday, this past Friday, we had 47 cats come in. Actually, in total, we had 121 cats come in. It was one of our largest days ever. But 47 coming in from one home.

[B]

And it was from one home.

[A]

It was right towards the end of the day. And the team just put their heads down and ended up staying an extra, I think two or three hours on Halloween night when I'm sure they already had plans and it was a Friday night and they just, they put their head down and solved that problem and without, without complaining and just took care of those animals. And it's just, I couldn't be more proud of the team that we have because everybody is often just, okay, we have this thing, let's solve it. We can work together and we can figure it out. And we really try as an organization to have a positive mindset. That's another one of the things that's in our reviews is assuming positive intent. And so we are always just trying our best to look at things from that lens. And I think I know for my own self that has really, really helped me even personally sometimes. You know, like with my husband, if he annoys me, it's like, oh no, it's being positive and intelligent.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Trying to get in this way.

[B]

It's good at work and it's good in life too.

[A]

Exactly.

[B]

For sure. So talking about your day and the problem solving mindset, what's. What's kind of like the best part of your job and maybe what, what's the most challenging part?

[A]

Best part, of course, working with my team, I just, I I really, really, really love them. They're just wonderful people, and I feel grateful to. To. To know them and to work with them each day. And then also, I just. I. Because I'm not in the shelter anymore, I just. It. It's such a highlight of my day to see the animal pictures, whether they are the tough cases. Yeah, we. You know. Yeah, we gambit of tough cases. But even. Even. Even those ones, it's. It's a reminder of, you know, maybe why I put in extra hours or do.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

That we can do. It's like, okay, we get to. We get to help this kiddo.

[B]

Yeah. Wait, are you allowed to say, what's your favorite animal? Or is that, like, not okay?

[A]

Oh, I mean, yeah, of course. Personally, my. My favorite animal at home. Oh.

[B]

Or at the shelter.

[A]

Can I show him?

[B]

Yeah, yeah. Let's see him.

[A]

I just woke him up.

[B]

Oh, look at him.

[A]

This is Louis. He came. He came from. Whs about. He's so confused now. Almost nine years ago, he was. He was brought in. The owner was experiencing some pretty severe health problems, and I. I had resisted the urge for, like, eight years to bring home.

[B]

That's a long time.

[A]

I knew within, gosh, five minutes of meeting him, I'm like, this is my dog. We connected right away.

[B]

He's beautiful. Nice to meet you, Louie.

[A]

Yeah. At the shelter, though. No, I couldn't. I couldn't pick one. I do have a. It's. I. It's kind of fun. I have a folder, a picture folder that's my screensaver, and I've put all my favorite animals throughout the years in. In that. And so it's always fun when my screensaver comes on, because I'm like, oh, there's Delgado. There's Scooby. And just another good reminder of the work that we're doing.

[B]

Yeah. That. I mean, and that's just such a nice little, like, just having it kind of in front of you, but not in, like, just not constantly in front of you, but this little touch point. Like, oh, look at all the things we're doing.

[A]

Right. Exactly. Yeah.

[B]

Yeah. And so, yeah, your favorite, your best part of your job, and then the most challenging.

[A]

Yeah, but the most challenging, I would say it's really one. It's. Of course, it's hard to see animals come in. In tough situations. However, after so long being in the shelter, I think I've maybe built a little bit of a thicker skin. And I also know in my heart that it's really good that they came to us.

[B]

Right.

[A]

Yeah. At Least they're here. At least we can. Whatever the outcome might be, at least we can help them on their journey. I also, I think I've been feeling this more lately. Is fundraising wise? It's just economics tend to just be the thing that is causing me to stay awake longer than I maybe should. And just worrying about, oh my gosh, if SNAP benefits cut off, what is that going to look like to fundraising? What is that going to look like to in intakes? What does this mean? And so many of those things are outside of our control. But that would be over the years when there have been moments like this. I remember the previous shutdown. We saw a huge decrease in fundraising. Those tend to be the things that are just. Those things are really outside of our control. Those are the really tough moments. Because I just want to go into that problem solving mode and fix. And there isn't a magic wand to just fix this. No.

[B]

And everyone's going to be struggling with it in different ways too. So it's hard to know how to communicate that to everyone. Are you all changing anything in the way that you talk to your donors and how you approach them right now?

[A]

Yep, we are. So the cats, for example, that we brought in, in years past, I think I would have seen our language be similar to like, holy cow, we had all of these cats come in. But we are trying really hard. Our communications and marketing team is just amazing. I think they're the best in the biz. Just saying. But they're really trying to take a holistic approach and look at everything that is going out from the smallest thing to our, you know, our major donors, to all of our donors. All of our communications is really trying to put a systematic lens on things and, and, and saying, you know, even though you might not be experiencing this in one county, that doesn't mean that the whole isn't being affected either. And so that, that's been really interesting. And we did that with the cats. The cat email that we just sent out and holy cow, are we getting just beautiful responses to that of like, oh, I didn't think about it that way, that this could affect that. Yeah, I think we shifted that messaging probably really like probably 5ish years ago. And it's just been a really beautiful change. And to, to have the community rally around it as well has been really cool to see.

[B]

That's amazing. I'm so glad that that's, that's going as smoothly as it can. Right. This is kind of a tough time for everyone. And so it's Nice that that's at least moving in a positive direction.

[A]

Absolutely.

[B]

What do you. So having been in, I think being in a nonprofit for 17 years, which is probably longer than a lot of people have had their jobs, what do you, what kind of advice do you give to people that are coming into nonprofits for the first time to work or just in general, like, just good advice for nonprofits? Yeah.

[A]

I think pacing yourself, you want to. It's easy to get caught in. I'll use it like a mouse wheel.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And gosh, I still am guilty of that at times of like, I just want to fix all of it all at once. But we're only one human. We're only one organization. I think finding something that is achievable and, and, and realistic and trying to solve all of these huge things all at once and coming into an organization and listening first and instead of trying to automatically be the one that is, is shifting things and being the one that's trying to find the answers, that's, gosh, that's, that's probably my biggest. I also am just constantly reminding my team of give yourself grace, give each other grace, give the world grace. Because the work that we do is really, really hard. Compassion fatigue is real. Even in the fundraising side, if we're not necessarily the ones that are on the animal side or animal care side, it still trickles down. It has effect on us. Seeing animals and their families go through hard times is hard. And they're, you know, they're speaking with their co workers and being the shoulders to lean on. And so I encourage them to, you know, get off their email at 5 o' clock if they can. I'm guilty of not always doing that. I get that. But taking vacations, you know, go outside, go for a walk, do the things that you can do to take care of yourself, and also know that other people should do that as well. And so giving each other that grace when mistakes happen or somebody else needs to step away for a little bit of time, we're human, we need to do that.

[B]

Yeah, definitely. I think when we come in, people who are working at nonprofits just tend to be more passionate about what they're doing. And so it's really hard to detach. So that's such great advice. Like, what do you, what's your favorite way of detaching a little bit or.

[A]

Unwinding for short breaks? I have to put my phone away, Otherwise I will 100% look at it. And I had, I had a realization probably like three years ago where I Was like, man, I got to stop the doom scrolling. I got to.

[B]

It's so bad.

[A]

It's so bad. I am wasting way too much time on social or even just, you know, new sites, and just. It felt too consuming. So I'm a big, avid reader. I constantly have, like three to four books going at one time. And that is my escapism longer term. I love to travel. We love to get away. We were. My husband and I were just in Hawaii a couple weeks ago. Our home was flooded this year, and we were like, we need. We need a moment. We need to just get away. And so it's nice to go far away, too, because you're not nearly as compelled to look at your phone. And if you can find a place that maybe doesn't have WI fi, I always think that's even better too.

[B]

Yeah. Detaching completely, like, off the grid. I love that. Any advice for people specifically in animal care.

[A]

Compassion fatigue is real. You are going to. You're going to have really hard days. My new team member, she fortunately is coming from a situation where she was in the family services, and so she understands tough days. But I told her, I promise you, this is not just playing with puppies and kittens all day. There certainly are those days, and they are amazing. But you're gonna see some tough stuff. And so when those tough events happen and you see or experience somebody going through probably the hardest day in their life, take a moment afterwards and either talk to me, talk to a coworker, maybe be that shoulder for that coworker to lean on. If you need just quiet space, go find that. And if you need. If you need to, maybe, I know not always, and especially on the animal care side, it's not possible, but if you need to step away for longer than just a moment, do that. Because the things you are going to see are tough and you're going to. You're going to experience some really challenging situations or hear about them. Um, and so it's really important to really connect with yourself and know what you're feeling and how you're feeling. I have a. Somewhere. I have a feelings wheel that I always keep really close to me. Yeah, it's something that I even look at on a regular basis of, like, okay, I feel kind of like scratchy today. Like, what is. What is that I'm actually feeling and trying to pinpoint that and really sitting with that and. And trying my best to work through those feelings. And so, yeah, I. I really think being able to connect with yourself and also, again, just giving yourself and others some grace and, and, and breaks as times too.

[B]

That's such good advice. And I love the idea of being able to put some language to how you're feeling. So, yeah, if you are feeling scratchy, like, how do you, how do you describe that in words that maybe other people can understand or ways that you can kind of understand how to cope with it? So I love that. Thank you so much, Sarah. This has been a really, really fun, enlightening conversation. It's been really great getting to know you and I look forward to talking to you again soon.

[A]

Yes, thank you so much.

[B]

That was such a great conversation. And here are three takeaways I got from our chat with Sarah that I would take back to my nonprofit first, scaling is hard for any organization. It's important to get your databases and tech stack aligned, but then also make sure everyone's on the same page so you're communicating in the same way to your donors. Also second, growth mindset, being open to feedback and assuming positive intent is so important in an organization that's growing. Then last, make sure you take breaks. Compassion fatigue is real and it is so important for us to learn how to take care of ourselves in those moments. All right, if you want to chat with us, please email [e-mail] I hope I hear back from you. Either way, I'll chat with you next month.