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Police Gave Me EVERYTHING Netflix Didn’t Show You About “Unknown Number”
01:51:38
A new true crime documentary has just been released on Netflix titled, ‘Unknown Number.’ The twist at the end is so unexpected and shocking that people start making TikToks of their friends and family’s reactions. The premise: Lauryn and Owen are thirteen year olds navigating a middle school romance until they get put into a group chat with an unknown third number. The texts start off silly. “Best day ever! Only one of you got voted on homecoming court – this is epic! LMAO!” They quickly escalate in severity and occurrence; sometimes up to 50 harassing text messages a day for roughly two years. “Owen loves me and I will always be the girl he loves. He will be with me while your lonely ugly ass is alone. I fucking own Owens dick. Cry more you fucking jealous bitch.” Who is sending these messages? Why do they want Lauryn and Owen to break up so badly? Why does it take the authorities two full years to finally catch the sender? Those were just a few of the many questions ne...
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- [00:00]
A
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Its concentrated formula means less waste, less water and more time for your next true crime Deep dive. It works in cold water. I mean talk about cracking a cold case. No cover ups or compromises here. If it's got to be clean, it's got to be tide free and gentle. Bada bing. Bada boo. Lauren and Owen, they don't really fight as a couple. I mean it probably helps that they're in high school and they're not trying to figure out how to pay taxes together. But even for high school relationships, the two of them, Lauren and Owen, they just seem like they're freaking made for each other. They're both athletes at the school. They both have blondish hair. I feel like that that's high school relationship gold. People call them the golden couple, which is a bit of a dramatic label to slap on two 13 year olds. But they're going to be 14 soon and it's just a nickname until they get a text message in a group chat. It's a group chat with Lauren the girlfriend, Owen the boyfriend, and this number that neither of them recognize. And the text message reads best day ever. Who is this? Only one of you got voted on homecoming court. This is epic. Lmao. For my non Americans, Homecoming weekend is usually the weekend that football season really kicks off at schools. Meaning you have this really big football game, homecoming game, Owen is on the football team. And then you have homecoming which is like it's, I guess it's kind of similar to prom but not as Official. Everybody dresses up. You have to have a date. You have to ask someone to be your homecoming date. It's a whole thing. The price breakdowns of people's dresses, glams everything. It goes viral on TikTok. It's a production and in the sense you have homecoming court students that are nominated to do their dances with other nominated students in homecoming court. And now this random number is texting Lauren and Owen that only one of them got voted onto homecoming court, which it's pretty clear it's probably going to be Owen. He's kind of like the popular one. But it's weird because how do they even know? I mean nobody even knows yet. So they respond. How the fuck do you know the votes? How do you know about the votes? I know for facts, trust me. Friday will be epic. When it's announced, the look on your faces watching one of you with your arm around another person, holding hands, being all adorable, smiling, flirting and posing for pictures with another person. Priceless. Lmfao. Could this be the end of the AKA golden couple? The relationship everyone idolizes? Okay, this is kind of weird. They text back, you're jealous. Friday is going to be the most epic day ever. Lol. We'll see who's jealous then and it won't be me. Lol. Who even are you? There is no response by this point. Lauren and Owen, they kind of brush it off. They focus on getting ready for homecoming until another message comes in. How's the happy couple? It's closer to Friday. Nervous. Preparing for the end of the golden relationship. How are you going to handle seeing one of you on court posing for adorable pictures with someone else? We hear about how you are the perfect couple. You're perfect together. They envy you both and your relationship. They want a relationship like yours. How you're the definition of a perfect couple. And we'll be the forever couple that gets married. Some of us don't want to hear it anymore. One more thing. I recommend Lauren not wearing his jersey anymore. You'll look like a fool if you do. See you at the game Friday. They are both looking around in the classroom because who the hell is sending these messages? And then another one comes in. He no longer likes you and he hasn't liked you for a while. It's obvious he wants me. He laughs, smiles, touches my hair. You're a sweet girl, but I know I can give him what he wants. Sorry, not sorry. Owen loves me and I will always be the girl he loves. He will be with me while your lonely ugly ass is alone. And then another message comes in. I fucking own Owen's dick. Cry more, you fucking jealous bitch. Who is sending these messages? Why does it take two years for this unknown number to be finally caught? They have the principal involved, they have the superintendent of the school board involved, they have the local sheriff's office involved. And the FBI. FBI gets involved. It takes two years and every single day Lauren and Owen are bombarded with 40 to 50 text messages just like this one for two years. Why does this person want Lauren and Owen to break up so badly? All of those theories are going to be covered in this episode along with this whole case recently blew up because of the new release of a documentary called Unknown Number on Netflix. Now, Unknown Number does not go as deep into some of the other messages. Some of the other reasonings that were found in, in this nearly, I think it was almost 1200 pages of a court document file that we received after a FOIA request. As well as we do have the full unedited body cam footage audio all here. The body cam footage audio I am going to put at the end of the episode. But there is so much that hasn't even been touched. So let's get into it. We would like to thank today's sponsors who have made it possible for Rotten Mango to support stamp. We would like to thank today's sponsors who have made it possible for Rotten Mango to support Stand With Nepal Help families of martyrs. On September 8, 2025, peaceful youth led protests against government corruption turned into a national tragedy as the state massacred 19 protesters and counting. Stand with Nepal is a GoFundMe whose mission is to help deliver medical and supplies to hospitals, support the families of martyrs, many of whom have lost their only breadwinners, as well as strengthen the grassroots efforts of Nepal's youth who are risking, I mean everything, including their lives, to stand up against corruption. This episode's partnerships have also made it possible to support Rotten Mango's growing team and we'd also like to thank you guys for your continued support as we work on our mission. As always, full show notes are available@roottenmangopodcast.com Today's case involves mentions of cyberbullying, mental abuse, sexual harassment. Please watch at your own discretion. A few quick things we received in total over a thousand pages in court documents, hundreds of those pages being text messages. I will say that sometimes in the document documentary the text messages are just kind of thrown in there with these very cool edits where it just the context is kind of lost and I don't even know what the conversation is about and it doesn't. I feel like it almost makes it less scary, like less of, oh, this feels serious. Sometimes it might even come off a little bit like, oh, this is kind of weird that they're texting that. So I wanted to give some more context to those text messages. And we also have the unedited full body cam footage from the day that they tell Lauren Licari, who had been cyberbullying and stalking her for two years. But due to privacy, the police have pre blurred the footage. So even though most of us have seen portions of it unblurred on Netflix, I'm going to provide the entire audio footage at the end of this video which I will timestamp for you in the caption or in the pinned comment below. And there's lots of text messages that we pulled from the court documents that it's just a lot. We were also able to talk to Owen briefly. He's a really friendly and sweet guy. I think it's nice to see that he's been able to maintain a positive and kind attitude towards everything. Maybe one day we'll interview him because I'm sure it's been, it's been very interesting to see everyone involved to I guess, watch as this documentary blows up in real time. So with that being said, let's get started. Beale City, Michigan is a very small town. They will probably tell you it's the type of town where people leave their doors unlocked every single night or every person's smile lights up the room. That's the type of town. And this case has nothing to do with unlocked front doors or dentistry. The important thing here is it's a small town. Beale City, Michigan is quintessentially where everybody knows everybody and their mother. They know your grandparents. I grew up in a small town where they would ask you nowhere you really from but in Beale City they're going to be like, who are your grandparents? Where did they live? It's that close knit. It is a small population so technically it should not have taken the sheriff and the FBI this long to find this freaking suspect. It's been over a year that someone in this small town has been stalking two high schoolers. The officers walk into this small house by the lake. It's a bit on the messier side. Inside, one of the tables in the dining area is filled. The entire surface of the table is filled with alcohol bottles. Most of them are unopened, which perhaps is a good thing. But that's not why the Police are here. They're here to talk to 15 year old Lauren. Lauren is sitting on one of those kitchen counter stools and she naturally looks very stressed because what is it now? I mean, they've been through this for the past two years. Every single week, once a week, almost on the dot, she gets taken into this small back office in the high school to turn over her phone where they take all the text messages that have come in. And it feels like a CIA undercover operation without the intelligence to. She's been doing this for so long and Officer Main has not gotten closer to finding out who did it. All that's happened is Lauren's life has been ruined. Like, what do you mean? You don't know who's sending the harassing messages? They're sending 40 to 60 a day. The phone number is right there. Go find them. Every time they would go to the police, Lauren's mom, Kendra would try to give them any information that would help. Maybe it's this person, she's always had some sort of jealousy for Lauren. Maybe it's this person. The way that they sent messages. Kind of sounds like them, doesn't it? Meanwhile, Lauren's dad, Sean, he's getting frustrated with the police. He's pleading with them, we gotta nail this son of a bitch. Whoever is doing this is ruining their daughter's life and stalking their 14 year old daughter. We have to find them. And the police finally do. They're standing in Lauren's living room. Standing in front of Lauren, Lauren's mom, Kendra walks out. She's sitting on the counter stool next to her daughter. And Kendra's reaching over, holding Lauren's hand because they're about to find out who the hell has been sending these unknown messages. For about two years, Lauren and her boyfriend Owen. I mean, the two of them have been in their own specialized version of hell, where the producers of Pretty Little Liars and Gossip Girl have come together and tried to make these random teenagers lives absolutely miserable. This all starts when they're 13 years old. I mean, to be fair, the makers of Pretty Little Liars and Gossip Girl don't even know they exist. But they are living in the real life version of these two shows. Pretty Little Liars focuses on a small town, Rosewood, Pennsylvania, where five friends, best friends, have a sleepover. One of them goes missing, the other four friends, they all fall apart. Until someone starts sending them anonymous text messages. And this unknown number seems to know every little freaking secret that they have. Like how one of them was caught making out with their English teacher. Another one of them made out with their sister's fiance. It's an unhinged show and Gossip Girl is the older, richer New York City version of that. And somehow Gossip Girl and a both find their way to Beale City High School where It starts with 13 year old Lauren and her boyfriend Owen. They start getting messages and in the beginning it's kind of silly, goofy. It's like silly, goofy kindergarten messages. The text messages are juvenile at best. The first few messages, if someone were to hand me a phone and would tell me to text something mean and I sat on my phone, this would be the outcome. It's just like gibberish insults. One message reads, you are the ugliest person I have ever seen.
- [13:08]
B
It's always text to both of them.
- [13:09]
A
Yeah, I mean, it's not particularly original or specific. It's rather subjective of an observation, but coming from an unknown sender, it's a little creepy. Then another one, Bitch, fuck off. You be the ugliest skank. Ain't fucking playing. Ugly motherfucker. Then another one. We will make every day fucking miserable for you. It's a little silly. He be fucking with us tomorrow at Cornhole. Sorry. Not sorry. After Cornhole, he hanging with us. We fucking got plans, bitch. Owen is fucking obsessed with us and everyone knows it. Fucking seniors talk about how hard he want our pussy. Sorry. Not sorry. You trash. We ain't. I mean it's bad. But there are multiple, I mean even above this, there were multiple text messages about Cornhole. Like a cornhole tournament. You know cornhole, the game with the wooden boards and then you try to stick the. Yeah, it's like skeeball. They're like having. It's the most atrocious thing being the spelling of the messages. But clearly by the end of this message it starts kind of escalating and like the seasons of Pretty Little Liars and Gossip Girl, with every episode that passes, the boring text message threats are aren't cutting it anymore. The unknown sender starts amping it up. I mean, it's getting rather mean. We will win, I promise you. Owen doesn't like you. He doesn't love you. Lauren and Owen both have no clue who this person is. They've tried asking around to see if anybody knows who the number belongs to. Nothing. I mean, they've tried, they've tried calling and they won't respond. They just say, stop fucking calling. And they're trying to get them to answer. Stop hiding. Answer my call. Are you scared to talk to me? Just scathing messages come in after this, bombarding their phones, they've tried chasing the number back. These are all burner numbers. Someone is getting an app to get a fake phone number to message them and with annoying frequency. I mean they're just non stop getting haggled by this fake number. Is it a girl in their class? Is it a guy? Is it multiple people? One message says we will win. Who is we and what the hell are they winning? Owen. That seems to be the point. It seems like Lauren gets bullied for being anorexic and not pretty enough for Owen. Based off these messages, the unknown sender seems pretty intent on making sure that they do not stay together and they want Owen for herself, himself, themselves. We don't know how many people are behind this.
- [15:45]
B
So when this is happening, did Owen or Lauren have an idea who it could be? Did they start talking about it at all?
- [15:54]
A
Yeah, they later have an idea and we're gonna get there. But the text messages read, you have no friends and we all fucking hate you. Fuck off you nasty ass skank whore. And that is targeted towards Lauren and it's all a game to the unknown sender. I apologize. It became a game. It was easy. Over the past year we got Owen to say he cheated, wanted nudes, we were better, had better bodies, hated you, didn't want to be with you. You were ugly, lesbian looking anorexic and wanted other girls at games. It's just like non stop 40 to 50 of these paragraphs a day. In another message it reads, he's ready to be with a real girl who gives him what he wants. Fucking trash bitch. Don't wear fucking leggings. Ain't no one want to see your anorexic flat ass. You dress like a fucking sleep. You're trying to get attention. Fuck off. I mean it's mean. Don't get me wrong, I would be crying myself to sleep, especially if I'm that young. But it's just not that personal yet. It feels vaguely mean if that makes sense. But they start escalating to get more scathing and more precise with what the unknown sender is trying to target. This feels like a warm up for real. How do you not break up when he says. When he says you ugly. Embarrassing mistake. Anorexic, worst body ain't given him. He wants sex, BJ's and making out. He doesn't want your sorry ass, he wants a real girl and we will make sure he gets that. Don't come to the game, he ain't want you there. He ain't want to see you. He hates you. Which is probably enough to get Lauren to feel like, wait, I don't know who this person is, but what if there is some truth to it? What if Owen is doing something weird? Then another text message that makes Lauren feel paranoid. We're staying at a hotel with him on Thursday and your sorry ass won't be there. Are you jealous? We'll be flirting and cuddling Thursday and you will be lonely. We're staying with him at the same hotel and he's going to meet us and sneak to our rooms for the night. He wants a hot, athletic, sexy dressing girl. So I'm going to show some shit off and get down in bed. He hates you forever. Sometimes Owen and Lauren will be sitting in science class. Ding. The messages are coming in. Sometimes it happens at 3am Ding, the messages are coming in. Ding. Hi Lauren. Owen is breaking up with you. And so Lauren and Owen, they try to talk to the principal to see if there's any sort of way to try and track down who's sending the messages. Some of them are coming out during class time and it seems like whoever is sending this knows what Lauren is wearing in class, knows all of these things about the kids lives. The principal decides here's the best plan that we can come up with. Anytime you get a text message from the unknown sender, you text me the timestamp on it. So if the message comes in like 3:20pm you text me that I will go through the cameras on the school campus to see who is on their phone at that time. Which means we've got our guy, right? Or gal, whatever. We have our person, they start that. But it's quite tedious to go through all the cameras. And not only that, the school doesn't really have a policy against the usage of phones. So it's hard to tell which students are sending text messages to Lauren and no which ones are just texting, which ones are browsing YouTube, which ones are on TikTok. You can't see it so it's kind of moot point. It's like with every precaution that they try to take or every step that they get closer to figuring out who it is, the menacing nature of the text increase tenfold. Hey Lo, Owen's saying you're a worthless whore. Fucking wish you never in his life you never meant shit. You fucking ruined my life. You biggest regret and mistake ever. You the ugliest hoe. Then another one. No one ever want your anorexic flat ass and tits. No dude ever touching that pussy, you nasty slut. His life would be better if you were dead. Dead. Hashtag bang bang suicide. Whoa. Owen wants you dead today. Jump off a bridge.
- [20:00]
B
How, like how long has this been? Like when they start texting these type.
- [20:05]
A
Of messages a few months in, but it goes on for a long time. Kill yourself, bitch. Project SLAMMER is a CIA project where the CIA goes into prisons and they interview over 40 incarcerated former CIA spies and they try to figure out what makes them a traitor, what makes them turn on the CIA and give information to foreign adversaries. Why do you commit treason? The big one is obviously narcissism. There is a huge money gain element there. But typically it takes a narcissist to become a spy. They also typically like to think of themselves as bigger than a regular employee, someone with a bigger purpose. And the rules and consequences of, you know, literal treason don't apply to them. So it should be fine. But that's not really new and riveting information. Like they can't really find who's a narcissist in the CIA. And I'm sure they can, but that doesn't mean all of them are useless traders. Most of them are probably useful intelligence agents. They've also identified the most critical time point in which someone could potentially become a mole. They already have to have some sort of personality dysfunction like narcissism. The ease of opportunity has to present itself. Nobody's going to go and hunt down the opportunity to become a traitor. And three, they have to have an acute life crisis. I thought that was so fascinating. So it's not the biggest life crisis. It's a middle of the road life crisis. It could be a small professional humiliation, a small to medium sized financial obstacle. It's not bankruptcy. It's like you are now $10,000 in debt because of gambling.
- [21:48]
B
Why is that so crucial for this to happen?
- [21:50]
A
Acute life event means that it has the ability to throw that type of person off and make them vulnerable into making very bad decisions or feeling like they're meant to do something bigger in life. If the life event is too big, they usually don't have the mental capacity to become a traitor. So it has to be like a medium sized life event. So for example, if a parent dies and it's not sudden, it's like old age. That's an acute life event because everyone is under the impression that your parents are supposed to die before you. But if their child dies, that's too major of a life event.
- [22:25]
B
Fascinating.
- [22:26]
A
Yeah, it's interesting so it's like a life event that shakes them up, but it cannot be so big that they're so shaken that they cannot become a mole. And a lot of the ways, I'm sure the CIA has got advanced ways on figuring out who's a mole. Like, you know, when they had Robert Hanson find the mole in the CIA, when he was the mole. So like super advanced. Yeah, I think we covered that case. There was a guy named Robert Hanson, part of he was working with Russians and he's like, oh yeah, let me go find the mole. He's the mole.
- [22:58]
B
Huh.
- [22:59]
A
But one of the easiest methods that even the Kardashians will employ is the planting of false information. That is what the Beale City high schoolers start doing. They run their little own psyop. The inner circle close to Owen start their own find the mole operation. Starting with the classic strategy. Share select information with person A and only person A, see if it ends up in the chat. Share information with person B and only person B, see if it ends up in the chat. And that's how you find the mole. But if it's one of them, well then what do you do? And there's major concerns now because the messages are becoming so relentless, so vicious that it feels like it's about to amp up into two things. Like one of two things is going to happen. One, Lauren is going to self exit after enduring endless torture and harassment by some random number. That is a huge concern. And. And two, whoever this person is, what if they snap? Yeah. What if they go from text threats to something a lot more physical and clearly they're in the vicinity. Lauren will sometimes fight back, responding, stop, please. You're jealous. And you can say whatever you want. I don't care. And I don't care what anyone says or thinks. I will wear his jersey proudly every day. Other times it feels like something bad is going to happen.
- [24:15]
B
I'm assuming they already reported to the police immediately from the beginning, and the police just could not figure it out, right?
- [24:22]
A
No. The police are doing once a week meetings at the school with the kids to get all of the text messages. And it's getting bad because Lauren is starting to lose steam. She's writing things like, please stop. I'm begging you to please stop. Like, what do I need to do for you to stop? I honestly can't take it anymore. And we'll do anything you want if you will, please stop. And they don't stop. More messages. Come in, girl. He said he don't need you to be here. His life better if he never met you, girl. He hitting us up like crazy today. You know, he been messaging and flirting and shit. He was hitting us up from a hotel at Ford Field. And he's talking. He said he's cheating and moving on to a new girl. He was stupid to be with you. You suck. He wants hot, athletic, sexy dressing girl, not you. Then a message is sent to Owen. She don't deserve the air she breathes. She's a pointless human. This has been happening for two years, Shawn. Lauren's dad is saying there are lots of bad changes in Lauren. I mean, she's not as active with basketball. She used to love basketball. She never wants to go to school. They have to force her every morning, and they get into fights. Lauren's mom, Kendra, has had a softer approach. She tries to tell Lauren, I told her to just keep being her and just not even worry about anything. Right. I didn't believe anyone would actually do anything harmful. It doesn't matter anymore, though, because with the help of the FBI, the sheriff's office has finally caught the person threatening Lauren and Owen. And if you guys watch the documentary, you already know. Lauren and Kendra are sitting on the counter stools with Kendra comforting her daughter, Lauren.
- [25:57]
B
This is like police cam recording rolling.
- [26:00]
A
Yeah. Even though she knows that Lauren is about to find out that the entire time, the unknown sender had been inside the school every single day. Taunting Lauren, watching her, texting her. Not in the same classroom as Lauren, not even the same grade as Lauren, but in the school in one of the back staff rooms. The unknown sender had been sitting there talking to the principal about how to stop the harassment. Because the unknown sender is Lauren's own mom, Kendra. My new favorite word only exists in Danish and Norwegian. There is no English translation, so bear with me. It's pronounced Hygge, and it's used to describe a feeling of coziness, comfort, and contentment. This fall season. The only reason I'm able to even bring a little bit of that into my life is because of Wayfair. Wayfair is the destination for all things home. For every style of budget and space, they have everything you need to just cozy up your space this fall. From comfy recliners where you can read a book and just get lost in a cup of tea, to warm bedding and autumn decor. They even sell espresso machines. They're my favorite thing to brew in the morning. It just fills the house with warm notes of a coffee shop. Wayfair is just chef's kisses. Their shipping is completely free and hassle free even on the big stuff like couches, cabinets, entertainment centers. Cozy Fy your space with Wayfair's curated collection of easy, affordable fall updates. From comfy recliners to cozy bedding and autumn decor. Find it all for way less@wayfair.com that's W-A-Y-F-A-I-R.com Wayfair Every style, every home food always tastes better with love. And the same goes for our four legged friends. They deserve the best meal possible Made for dogs. For people who love dogs, Bark in the Belly isn't just premium food. It's the only consumables brand in the world by dogs or four dogs with a baked in mission to leave no pup hungry and every bowl full. Eat good, do good. Every bag, every bite, every dollar goes straight back into feeding hungry dogs. 100% of profits are pledged toward making sure no dog goes without. With your support, Bark donates food and resources every quarter to rescues and shelters across the country, organizations like Greater Good Charities, Austin, Pets Alive, Pup Stars Rescue, Muddy Paws Rescue and North Shore Animal League. And you'll see the impact. The Bark in the Belly Impact Tracker shows every dog fed, every nonprofit supported, every happy tale. And it's not just feeding your dog, it's fueling the mission to end canine hunger. Subscribe to Bark in the Belly today. Fill your dog's belly and help fill bowls in shelters too. My dog Mango is the namesake of this podcast as well as the guard dog for our home, something we never asked her to do. And she is not even a foot tall, so I don't know why she continues to bark every single day because we haven't even had any scares recently. She's probably thinking, you know what, it's my barking that's keeping these bad people away. But as much as I love Mango, her barking is is scaring nobody. The real reason why we haven't had any recent scares is SimpliSafe's Active Guard Outdoor Protection. Their system is designed to be proactive, not reactive, meaning their cutting edge AI enhanced cameras not only record but analyze and recognize potential threats, deciphering the difference between everyday activity or a suspicious person casing your property. Their agents can immediately engage with the intruder through integrated two way communication trigger sirens and spotlights to scare them off and even request rapid police dispatch. All of these protections before a break in even happens. Visit simplisafe.com rotten to claim 50% off a new system that's simplisafe.com rotten. There's no safe like Simplisafe. Kendra has been the one sending these messages. And you already know that. Kendra has been anonymously harassing her own daughter for years. And she knows that's what the officer is going to say. Because just minutes ago, before Lauren even came into the living room, the officer confronted Kendra one on one. Whoa. Here's the deal. When we were doing the investigation and the FBI got involved, we come up with some stuff that comes back to you. Which side note, they don't talk about this in the documentary because I think it was, like, tedious stuff. I don't know if people were gonna find it interesting, but I found it super interesting. The FBI tracked down. She, Kendra, was using a lot of anonymous apps like Pinger to hide her disguise her phone number and make all these fake numbers. And that's how she was texting them. The sheriff's office is like, well, I don't know what to do about that.
- [30:35]
B
Is it like Google numbers? Like a fake number?
- [30:37]
A
Yes, I think it's a little. Yeah, it's like Google number. And the FBI come in, they apply search warrants to Pinger. They apply search warrants to all of these apps, and it comes back to an IP address. And now they need to make sure that this IP address, because it kind of is leading to Kendra, but they need to make sure. So the FBI actually has one of the other moms send Kendra a hidden link to, like, a school thing. She clicks on the link and it's her IP address, and they match the IP address. Oh, so it's freaking Kendra. And Kendra is staring at the officer, not necessarily showing much emotion, and she's just like, what do you mean? The messages coming and originating from you? No. It's just weird. Kendra's not even convincing herself. The no is so half baked. It's very no. Her facial expression doesn't really change. It's weird. Every message that went to the kids, your number came back through pinger or whatever it is. The app that you tried to hide your number, even though it was being hid, showed up in every single message.
- [31:39]
B
Does she really think she could have got away with FBI getting involved?
- [31:43]
A
Yeah. And she says, my number? Yep. Does it have to do with Owen? Is there some sort of infatuation there with Owen? No, nothing like that. Does Lauren know about it? No. She shakes her head and she's asking the detective. I really don't want her to. Once this is out there, I don't know how she can go to school. The officer is like, yeah, well, there's no way around it. So we're gonna bring in Lauren, we're gonna sit her down and talk to her. And she's about to here. Who the hell has been threatening her and encouraging her to self exit, calling her all sorts of nasty names, trying to steal her boyfriend for the past two years. The officer starts. So I'm gonna start the conversation. You guys have been under a lot of stress lately. Some moves going on, some financial issues and everything else going on. Mom got wrapped up in some stuff.
- [32:36]
B
Mom got wrapped up in some stuff. What does that mean?
- [32:38]
A
The text messages. He's kind of vague about it. In the Netflix documentary, he doesn't even really say the text messages. In the unedited audio, he mentions the text messages like once. So it's pretty clear that Lauren kind of understands it's about the text messages.
- [32:54]
B
Oh, okay.
- [32:55]
A
And she didn't start it, but she continued it. So we found some evidence and we have a search warrant. Lauren's mom, Kendra, reaches over and puts her hand on Lauren's thigh in a show of comfort. But if you listen carefully, like, why would they need a search warrant for Kendra's phones? I think Lauren is slowly putting everything together. I will say the officer is just oddly vague about the whole thing. And Lauren is like piecing together. She's glancing around.
- [33:20]
B
Oh, so that's how he unveiling the information. It's your mother. Yeah, but all he says was, your mom, mom being wrapped up in some stuff.
- [33:28]
A
Text messages. So we have search warrant. We found stuff on her phone. So Lauren is like slowly piecing it together. We're gonna take her phone and stuff. You know, sometimes when we're not thinking straight, we do some things that aren't right. Your mom doesn't want to get to get this out, but it's going to be public information by this point. Kendra is up on her daughter. She has her arms wrapped all the way around Lauren like she's like a sloth trying to climb a tree. She's resting her left cheek onto Lauren's head, kissing her forehead, wiping the baby hairs from her forehead.
- [34:01]
B
What we're course of action when you were just exposed for harassing and abusing your child for years.
- [34:10]
A
And the officer is like, she said you had no idea what was going on. And I believe that what has to happen now is I have to make sure you and your mom are safe before I leave. So I'd like you to call your dad and maybe he can come home and meet with us. Okay. Kendra reaches over and grabs Lauren's hand, almost as if she is the one needing comfort. Now, Kendra is a part of the Netflix documentary Unknown Number, which is interesting considering the call is coming from inside the house, literally. But when Kendra sits down, she's a very big reason to agreeing to all of this. She just wants her side of the story to be heard. She says, you guys are gonna think I'm the crazy lady. Every single one of us makes mistakes. Not a single one of us has lived a perfect life. And realistically, a lot of us have probably, I mean, broke the law at some point or another and not got caught. I mean, I'll be honest, you know, I'm sure people drove drunk haven't been caught, right? But again, if you get caught, you're in the same situation I'm in, but for a different thing. So I do feel that people lose sight of that. I know to some, I'm a headline, I'm a villain, I'm a bad mom, I'm whatever. But that's because, you know, one little piece of my story, they don't know my whole story. And she explains, so the messages stop for a little bit, and they pick back up. In my mind, I'm like, how long do we let this go on? So to give you some further context, an unknown sender starts sending harassing text messages to Lauren and Owen. And then they stop. For like 11 months, they stopped sending any messages. And then all of a sudden, the text messages pick back up again. And this time it's 40, 50 a day for a year. Kendra is saying that she never sent the original messages.
- [35:50]
B
Oh, really?
- [35:50]
A
Yeah. We're going to get into that later. More on that later, because nobody believes you, Kendra. But she says after 11 months, she picks up where they left off by sending harassing threats. And her reasoning for this is very simple. She wants to catch whoever sent the first original text messages. She wants to find out who they are. So she's going to send more messages. She says, what do I do as a parent? Honestly, the best way would have been to stop it by shutting her cell phone down, right? But then I was like, well, why would she have to do that? You know, why should I have to get her a new phone? Like, because of someone else's actions, Right. I really wanted to get to the bottom of who it was, right? And that's when I started sending the text messages to Lauren and Owen. I was sending the messages in hopes that maybe they would send back asking, is this somebody? Is this so? And so to just kind of give me something. Right.
- [36:43]
B
Oh, this person is crazy.
- [36:45]
A
Yeah.
- [36:45]
B
Oh my God.
- [36:46]
A
This.
- [36:46]
B
When is she saying this?
- [36:48]
A
When she's getting in the Netflix documentary.
- [36:50]
B
Like this is with the police at the police station.
- [36:53]
A
No, sitting at home. This is like after she. She's a free woman and she's sitting down with Netflix.
- [37:00]
B
Oh wow. She made up this. Really? Nobody even freaking will believe 1% of the reasoning. And she's like telling it with full chest.
- [37:10]
A
Yeah. And all the IP addresses lead back to her and only her, so.
- [37:13]
B
Oh my God, it doesn't even make sense.
- [37:16]
A
No, it doesn't. Her reasoning doesn't make sense. But she says, I was also hoping that as maybe they talked about the messages amongst their friend group and stuff that something might come up that could help pinpoint, you know, where they were originating from. I started in the thoughts of we need some answers. And then it just kept going. It was a spiral kind of a snowball effect. I don't think I knew how to stop. I was somebody different in those moments. It was like I had a mask on or something. She starts spending eight hours a day sending these messages to harass her daughter and her daughter's boyfriend. It becomes her full time job because she lies about having a job. She gets let go of her job and lies about it. She never tells her family that she's been let go of this job. And for a year she pretends to go to work, but instead she is sending messages.
- [38:10]
B
Sorry, what? What's her job?
- [38:11]
A
Before she used to be an IT specialist at Ferris University. She was let go and now this is her full time job sending messages and she.
- [38:21]
B
I'm so sorry.
- [38:22]
A
Did you.
- [38:22]
B
Okay. They're not in the university?
- [38:24]
A
No.
- [38:25]
B
Is that the acute life event that you were mentioning or it's unrelated.
- [38:30]
A
It seems like it's one of them. Isn't that interesting?
- [38:34]
B
She's fired.
- [38:34]
A
Yes. She spent too much time on her phone, on texting and video, calling and calling people that were not work related.
- [38:45]
B
Wow.
- [38:45]
A
So she gets let go and this becomes her full time job, sending messages. And she's saying that she's doing this to catch the real person that sent a few messages 11 months ago. Meanwhile she's over here texting Owen and I down to suck finger fuck.
- [39:03]
B
What?
- [39:07]
A
His dick and fingers, my pussy and mouth making me creamy. And not in the documentary, but in the court doc. It reads Owen. Like our science convo about redacted being fingered. He's ready to do it to me. We know you ain't doing it and like they told you he need better. I will be that girlfriend for him and give him it all. This is again from the court documents. I don't know why they weren't shown in the documentary. Because these text messages, even just the text messages that were shown in the documentary, a lot of netizens are saying how is she not charged with like sexually harassing a minor? But those text messages in the court documents are worse. Worse. It's just worse.
- [39:52]
B
And you're saying like we have some people who are moms in our. In the team and they're just losing their.
- [39:58]
A
Yeah, they're like. It doesn't even make sense to me. I don't even understand. Another text message from the court doc again reads, these are 13, 14 year olds. Owen got the fingering deets and he be. And I be jerking and making him creamy. You be jealous.
- [40:17]
B
So her text message doesn't even like have anything. It's just like vulgar. Just. It doesn't even. There's not even a message.
- [40:25]
A
The message is Owen wants me and not you.
- [40:28]
B
Yeah, yeah, just over and over and over and over.
- [40:31]
A
Another text message just reads creamy. You should have been a real girlfriend and gave him what he needed. Be jealous. My let me my fucking tits in his face. Real ass. Real body. Bed pics for real. FaceTime. Get real. Our fucking text. He jerk off for me. Fuck off. He said I'm fucking hot. Best ever. Fucking making him horny. Fucking make him horny. Make it cream again. Kendra claims she has a very good reason for this. She is basically going undercover to figure out who the real harasser originally was. You have to believe her not being invited to Chloe Wilson's annual Halloween party would probably have me crying in my room at night. Chloe is one of the popular girls at the school. She's on the volleyball team, the basketball team, her parents are popular. She has has friends from nearby schools. Everyone knows Chloe and everyone knows her Halloween parties except Lauren, who does not even want to go. And technically Lauren's not invited. But Owen states, well, if I'm going then you're gonna come with me because Owen and Lauren are dating. Lauren and Owen have been dating for like a year at this point. And Owen by all accounts seems to have. He seems like the more popular one. He seems a little bit more social. He has a lot of friends. He's on the football team. And Lauren is described by everyone as being pretty quiet. She likes to keep to herself in a small group of people that she knows and that's what she likes and the Halloween party does not sound like something that she wants to attend. But they're dating. This is part of the life, so now it's part of hers. Lauren just does not really get along with people like Chloe. Beale City High School cliques seem very intense. It's a small town school. Beale City has one stoplight, two bars, and they're more like pubs. The entire town has a population of a few hundred people with more wind turbines than they have bars. One netizen describes a few hundred people in the town. Yeah.
- [42:40]
B
Wow.
- [42:40]
A
One netizen describes living in a small town like that as, quote, an experience where you have to be careful not to kiss a relative. Not because incest is like a trend or a shared experience, but because there's only so many residents and you can only have so many drinks before you're like, wait, am I blackout drunk and making out with my cousin? It's a numbers game.
- [42:57]
B
Oh.
- [42:59]
A
Lauren describes living in Beale City as a really small school in a really small area, and everybody knows everybody. I feel like you're gonna absolutely love living there or you're going to loathe it. It's cute. If a local is diagnosed with cancer, the whole town will start a meal train and sell shirts that read, nobody fights alone. And there's only about 30 kids per class, meaning Lauren's class that she's graduating with consists about 30 to 50 students. The entire school building is K through 12, all in one building. I feel like the kids are all just in one class completely. And out of the 30 kids, they have separate group chats, separate friend groups. Owen describes it as, you've got the popular kids, like Chloe and her friends. You've got the cheerleaders, and then you have the quiet kids. I guess because there's not as many people, there are less groups. I mean, nobody says it outright, but it seems like Lauren is maybe in the quieter group, Owen is maybe in the popular group, or, you know, Lauren is maybe floating between the groups. And nothing is wrong with any of that. The problem comes when everyone is just talking about everyone.
- [44:05]
B
I mean, if there's only a few hundred people, yeah, that's not that hard to find out who.
- [44:12]
A
That's what I was saying.
- [44:14]
B
Wow.
- [44:15]
A
One of Owen's childhood best friends and fellow potential popular kid is Sophie. And she says no one really has anything better to do than talk about other people. Like, even the parents. Like, they talk about us teenagers, what we're doing. And I feel like that's kind of a toxic thing that gets passed down One netizen concurs by writing a review on Beale City high school on Niche.com's Parents are great, but some care too much about the athletic sphere. The parents are really involved. Owen might say that they're too involved. And even the parents want to talk to the other parents about the kids drama. The parents have drama themselves and it's kind of a mess in a lot of small towns and Beale City is not immune to these social circles. But it seems by all accounts that the popular kids are going to be the ones in attendance at Chloe's Halloween party. And this is when the first text messages come in. One of the first messages from the unknown sender to both Lauren and Owen read. Did Owen say anything to you about what's going on? If he didn't tell you yet, I will. Owen and I agreed and thought it would be a great time for Owen and I to get together and officially hook up. You are not being invited because we want this time together. He's coming to my house on Halloween too and is giving me his sweatshirt to wear. You're a sweet girl, but I know I can give him what he wants. Sorry, not sorry.
- [45:36]
B
This is sent to Owen as well.
- [45:37]
A
Yes, it's obvious he wants me. His attention is constantly on me. When was the last time he paid attention to you or acted like he likes you? He is never with you nor has he ever talking to you. He's always with, quote, other girls or texting and talking to me. He's constantly hitting on me. He laughs, smiles, touches my hair, picks at me and crushing hardcore for me. He always wants to be near me and involved in our conversations. When has he ever acted like that way to you? Don't be jealous when I wear his sweatshirt and jersey. Not sure what he told you, but he is coming to the Halloween party and we are both DTF if they were 13. Yeah, he wants nothing to do with you. He thinks you're annoying and an ugly ass bitch and wishes you would leave him the fuck alone. I feel like these text messages are literally a Gossip Girl episode. Why do you think he's on his phone all the time talking to me? It's obvious he does not want you in his life. He talks shit about you all the time. You didn't get invited to his football game. I did. You didn't get invited to his house. I did. You didn't get invited to sleep with him. I did. I did. I'm spending the night with him. I'm sharing a bed with him, not you. He's comforting me, not you. You didn't get invited to be with him in the hot tub. I did. Then another text message reads, I hope you finally get the point. He wants to spend time with me, not you. We will keep making you look stupid. He promised to keep flirting with me, and I promise to do it all in front of you. He wants to see you run out of school crying. He fucking hates your ugly anorexic ass. What the hell is that? Lauren is so confused. Owen is reassuring her that he is absolutely not DTF and has no clue who this person is. Owen thinks it's maybe one of the quieter kids because they're more techy, but clearly somebody is just messing with them. At the Halloween party, they start going around and asking around to see if anyone knows the number or someone sent it as like a sick joke. Nobody fesses up and they move on. For 11 months, nothing happens. Kendra claims these Halloween messages were not sent by her. She said, not those ones. I did not. It wasn't until way later, 11 months later, the messages start again. And I feel like they're way, way, way, way worse. And we're going to go through a lot of the text messages, the ones from the Netflix documentary, the ones from the court document, they're all going to be in here. And we're going to go through the messages while we go through the theories of why Kendra did this to her own daughter. Because I feel like Netflix kind of at the end threw out a reasoning of why Kendra did this. But a lot of netizens are not even convinced by that reason why happening. Some people think it's got to be something else. And there's actually a lot more theories online and text messages supporting those theories will be included when we get to them. But one thing is a thousand percent. All the roads lead Back to Kendra 18 months into the messages, terrorizing the entire school by month 18. I mean, everybody knows about this by like the first month, everybody knew about it. The principal, superintendent, the sheriff, everybody's involved. Kids are pointing the finger at other kids. The parents are pointing the finger at kids. It's not until April 2022 the FBI gets involved. And like I said, all the IP addresses, even the beginning ones that she claims she absolutely did not send, were all sent by Kendra. So why did she do it? Theory number one, Kendra is jealous of her teenage daughter Lauren. Sick to her stomach, green with envy level, jealous. One message reads, low, which is Lauren's nickname. You be jealous when he's at varsity game today. He ain't wasting time seeing you suck. He knows you suck. Either way, you for real need to quit. No one wants you playing. Ain't no one sad. Break an ankle. It's interesting because usually when there is jealousy from mother to daughter, the mother wants the daughter to do well enough to reflect well on her own parenting, but not so well that the daughter outshines the mother. Basically, this experience, this is a Redditor. My mother always wanted me to be pretty, but not too pretty. Like, I had a cute, tiny waist. So if I wore a belt that defined my waistline, she told me I look like a slap. It's interesting. Some psychologists have said it's like a narcissistic mother views their daughter as direct threat. Anytime they look at their daughter, it is a reminder of their youth and a reminder of the mother's own aging process. They want to provide more freedom for their kids because that makes them look good amongst their friends. But they also resent them for having a better life than they did, so they want to take them down. Another message reads, you have no friends. You fucking suck cock for guys to talk to you. You fucked up. You treat him like shit. You don't get with him in bed. You don't sneak out with him. You fucking dress awful. Ain't no guy want that. You look like an anorexic toddler. That ain't sexy. It's embarrassing. You need to do something about that. You need to change your face, hair, body, clothes. He agreed. He won't give you his jersey to wear. He ain't wasting no time, no waste of space, mistake. Ugly anorexic toddler wearing his shit to embarrass him. He ain't proud of you and wishes he never met your sorry ass. He said it looked better on a dog than you emb when you wear it. That was from the court document. Perhaps Kendra is just jealous that her entire role that she now sees it is. And this is not me saying it, but maybe she just sees herself as a mom now. And Lauren is maybe entering what Kendra believes are her prime years. High school, college. Kendra's cousin was interviewed for. For the documentary, and she said, you know, Kendra is very fun, very outgoing, the life of the party. She likes the attention. I think if she were here right now. So she's being interviewed by the producers.
- [51:04]
B
And she says she knows the whole thing.
- [51:07]
A
And she says if Kendra were here right now and you're talking to me, you're interviewing me, she would be dancing over there to try and get your attention to get you to look at her. Now she suddenly has kids, and she's a baseball basketball coach for Lauren. One report states that while Lauren is quiet, Kendra's like the cool mom. People say that she would gossip with the girls, literally high school girls. During softball or basketball practice, students would film her dancing to Sir Mix a lot and doing cartwheel down a hotel hallway when they would have away games.
- [51:36]
B
Fascinating.
- [51:37]
A
Another odd thing is Kendra would show up to the school to comfort Lauren, but would use it as an opportunity to get close with the other high school girls. She would tell classmates of Lauren's that she's bringing a change of clothes for Lauren because the person texting was making fun of her shirt. So she feels insecure.
- [51:54]
B
She's texting it and she's bringing a shirt.
- [51:57]
A
And then now she's getting sympathy from all these high school girls that are like, Aw, Ms. Lecari, I feel so bad.
- [52:02]
B
What a great mom.
- [52:03]
A
Yeah, that's so sweet of you. And even if she. She wasn't, why would you even consider text or telling someone when the bully is supposedly in the classroom and could use it against your daughter? Or another time, she'll text girls in Lauren's class saying things along the lines of, can you go to the bathroom and check up on Lauren? She just texted me that she's crying in the stalls. Or she would talk to other kids about how stressed she is about how stressed Lauren is about these text messages. But Kendra will swear this is not the motive. She is not a jealous mother. Yes, she was targeting everything that Lauren was insecure about. However, it wasn't to make her feel bad. Kendra straight up says, Lauren knows she's petite. She knows she's small. She knows she's thin. So I might have kind of picked up on some of her insecurities. Her hair, her appearance, her looks, you know? But honestly, the messages weren't really targeted at her insecurities. The Netflix producer does ask something that kind of pissed off a lot of netizens, which is they asked Kendra, were they targeted at you? Were you sending those messages to yourself? And they were like, why are you trying to give her an out to make herself look better? Basically, they're asking her, like, did you feel like, the mean things you were saying, you were almost saying it to yourself?
- [53:19]
B
No. What kind of a question is that?
- [53:21]
A
But Kendra is like, yes, that very well. Possibly because I was way too thin, I was not eating, so you could put me in that anorexic category. A lot of people are like, why would you even Ask that. I also don't think that that's what happened at all. I honestly think that Kendra was saying that because, I mean, I also struggle with my choice of sometimes I struggle with body image as well. Right. Everybody does. Lots of people do. And some people think that Kendra, as she's aging, she notices that her metabolism is not as quick as it used to be and maybe has to work extra hard to stay in that body frame that she likes. And she's looking at her teenage daughter and like lots of teenage kids, they can just eat whatever they want and they don't really fluctuate in weight as much as like a 50 year old woman. And so maybe she's very upset with that. It doesn't. I don't think that she's sending it to herself. I think she's pissed off.
- [54:17]
B
Yeah.
- [54:18]
A
And I mean the messages are insane. Some more read. You jealous bitch. He ain't talking to your sorry ass. He talking to us. How does it feel to lose your anorexic body? Ain't worth shit. He never came back to you. He never want to talk to you again. He want you to fucking stop. You fucking will be crying every day. We could fucking care less. He never come back to you. He didn't even talk to you to get the fucking point. He hates you. Now we ruin your life. You fucking did this. Now we ruin your life. We all hate you. You fucking suck. You're the fucking reason JV lost the basketball game and and only went to the varsity game. We losing. You didn't do shit. You fucking suck. Proved it again. Fucking break a neck, leg, anything today and be done with basketball. Ugly, anorexic. No good. We promise you. You know he's cheating. Fuck you. We won. And he hates you. There have been times that I have just been like deep in the trenches of unsafe lands where I just know all the occupants, all the residents of this online territory hate my existence. And I will go in the trenches, knee deep in the pure hatred spewing out in the comments against me. Mind you not to give any of those people, like very aggressively hateful people any grace, but those people, they don't even know me. I don't know them. I don't personally care for them. I have no interpersonal connection with them. And they still don't say such vile shit like it's crazy. I know it sounds immature at times, which is why I think people aren't taking it as seriously. Well, they are, but it's not not. They don't think the Messages themselves are that detrimental. I think more people are focused on the fact that Kendra is crazy, but these messages are. This is like a freaking bombardment of hatred. If you look at maybe one message, sure, you could say it's goofy, but then when you look at thousands of them coming in non stop, it's like suffocating. There are even photoshopped pictures with vomit emojis thrown on top of Lauren's face, writing words like skank and hoe all over the photos. And it's interesting because even a mean girl in high school will probably not have this level of bizarrely immature pure hatred. And for Kendra to have that against her own daughter is bizarre. And I say immature hatred not because I don't think it's immature in the sense of, oh, this is dumb, but in the sense of like, this feels like jealousy in the purest form. It's not even complicated jealousy. You know, sometimes with jealousy, it's like, I want my family member to do well, but I get slightly jealous because I know when they do well, my parents will inevitably compare me to them and then put me down. So their happiness does indirectly impact my happiness. And it's like, it's a little more complicated, this pure jealousy. It's weird. And she's just so mean. One text message, not in the documentary, it just says, you're no one. Fuck off. Lauren doesn't respond, so she texts, speechless. Keep it that way. Another one just responds, hey, bitch, how ya lunch? Lmao.
- [57:15]
B
Whoa.
- [57:18]
A
One part of the court document reads. The texts go on to suggest that she is losing her peer group and that no one likes her. The effect of these messages have on a teen is devastating and will create lifelong trauma drama. Learning that this was her own mother that perpetrated this crime only exacerbates those effects tenfold.
- [57:33]
B
Wait, did her dad find out? And what was all of that reaction?
- [57:39]
A
We'll get into it. He was devastated too.
- [57:43]
B
Wow.
- [57:44]
A
Yeah, wow. One netizen comment reads, she was obviously jealous of Lauren. Like, be for real, Kendra. And of course, netizens have taken to armchair diagnose. Kendra, is it narcissistic personality disorder? But people are also arguing. Everybody has that these days, according to the Internet. So, like, what does that even mean anymore? Some people are saying, is it borderline personality disorder? Others are arguing again. Everybody has that antisocial personality disorder, but the one that's being more seriously thrown around in this discourse is histrionic personality disorder. HPD is usually characterized by a pervasive pattern of excessive emotionality and attention. Seeking behavior. People who genuinely are annoyed not being the center of attention. And they will act. They will act in strangely inappropriate sexual ways in front of even co workers just to get attention that they crave. Basically another disorder that people like to slap, typically on women on the Internet, but usually incorrect. It's not that common to have hpd, but I do see how in this specific case, some netizens are coming to the theory that Kendra has it. Firstly, it's one of the nicer diagnosis that you can give her. The other one just being like, a pervert, pedophile. But they're basically saying Kendra is the type to pretend to faint or get sick at everyone's birthday parties. And maybe that goes hand in hand with the jealousy that she feels for Lauren. The speculation online being that she cannot stand not being the center of attention and she's being outshined by her daughter. I will say that HPD does have a very strong stigma because I think the need to be the center of attention, and it comes off as someone who is very vapid or vain. But one good comparison that people have with HPD is they say a character is like Harlequin. It's not like, I just want everyone to look at me. It's usually connected to some deep desire to feel accepted, and they just go about it in ways that could be slightly destructive to themselves. Nevertheless, a lot of people believe Kendra might have hpd, which does not excuse her actions, nor does it mean that someone with HPD would do something like that. This, it's just part of the discourse. A lot of people point to the way that even at basketball games, she's, like, doing the cartwheels with all the teen kids. Like, it's weird, but at the same time, she's bullying her own daughter for her basketball performance. Text messages read lmfao, two points. You suck. With one comment reading, she was jealous of her daughter. I mean, she was pretty good. She was pretty good at sports, was the number one couple at school, and her mom envied the attention she got. So she tore down the town in order for her daughter to have a greater need for the mom in her life. Classic narcissistic abuse. Oh, another thing that was just so jolting. In the court documents, Kendra kept a screenshot of all the text messages organized on her desktop. Literal PDF files of text messages.
- [60:38]
B
Like the thousands of them?
- [60:40]
A
Yeah, a lot of them. And then another folder, just titled, titled Snap. It has all of her login history for Snapchat. And then she has a folder that was titled Just O, and it was a letter to Owen, which was not included in the court document for privacy reasons, obviously. But it's weird. We're gonna touch upon that later. So that's theory number one. But being jealous of her own daughter, which is a very real thing that happens. There is the other theory, the second theory. This is the one that Netflix kind of drove more into, which is Cyber Munchausen by proxy. So to give you some context, Munchausen syndrome is someone who loves to pretend to be sick to make themselves either literally sick or pretend to be sick to get sympathy. It's giving I'm dying, but not actually. I just like that you're nice to me when you think I'm dying and I think I look really good in a hospital gown. Munchausen by proxy is when a caretaker makes their caretaking subject, usually their child, sick so everyone can rally around them. And this is actually a lot more dangerous because most of the time, it's not pretend. Most of the time, they are making their child sick, and the child has no idea because the child can't lie to the doctor, so they just physically make them sick. These are the people that like to wrap their little cardigan around them and cry in the hospital waiting room. It's very terrifying. It's my poor child is sick, and I'm secretly poisoning them. And now there's the online variation of it, Munchausen, where people will fake having cancer, posting literal tiktoks of them getting chemotherapy, setting up GoFundMeans, only for everyone to find out that they don't have any sort of terminal illness at all. They are healthy as a horse. Then you have this case, Cyber Munchausen by proxy. Lauren is getting bullied. Cyberstalked, Harassed. Bullied. She is a victim, and Kendra is her poor, sympathetic mother trying to fight for justice to make sure her daughter is okay. That is the theory. I mean, there have been reports of people making fake accounts to bully themselves for sympathy. There have been other reports of people making fake accounts to bully their friends. Okay, so this is where it gets weird. There have been reports of person A making a fake account to bully their best friend online. Person B, and then it's like an anonymous hater. And then person A switches back to their real account and defends their best friend. Oh, to drive their best friend closer to them. Yeah.
- [63:01]
B
Wow.
- [63:02]
A
I know. I was down a rabbit hole looking into this because I was like, cyber Munchausen by proxy. How does that even work? Work.
- [63:08]
B
Wow, that's fascinating.
- [63:09]
A
So now Kendra is a woman who cyberbullies her daughter so that she can feel needed. That is the theory out there on why Kendra did all of this. Kendra's cousin says, you know, Kendra has been always an attention seeker, but when it comes down to it, she's always a good person. Maybe this is her way of making Lauren need her. You know, you do, as a teenager, need your mom, but not in that way. Lauren would come home upset about these text messages, and Kendra got to play the hero and be there for her. The superintendent of the school states she wanted her daughter to need her in such a way that she was willing to hurt her. And this is the way she chose to do that versus physically trying to make her ill, which is typical Munchausen behavior. It is not acceptable, but I think a lot of people have accepted it because it's just more digestible to think of it like that, of, oh, okay. A mom who wants her daughter to need her seems a little bit more maternal and acceptable than. No, she literally hates her daughter daughter. I think, because I don't know why so many people are running with this theory. I think there is maybe a little bit of this, but I don't think so.
- [64:09]
B
Yeah, I don't think so.
- [64:11]
A
I mean, I think the one thing I'm like, okay, I could see that is she does use it as the whole purpose of her life.
- [64:20]
B
I feel like. Like, okay, I'm just. If she wants to do that, I would say wouldn't she do it even more publicly on, like, platforms, on blog blogs, like, just hating on the daughter.
- [64:30]
A
Yeah. Make like a Gossip Girl bully blog or something.
- [64:33]
B
So then the whole freaking. Make it more public, maybe, but this is, like, very personal. She's, like, directly going after the daughter's insecurities.
- [64:41]
A
Yeah, it's weird. And Kendra, she does make this whole thing, her personality. She'll go to the school every day to talk about it. Someone gives her a suggestion of, like, why don't you get her a new phone number? She'll ignore it, come back the next day, talk about it all over again. School members say, I mean, you got Kendra, and then you got Owen's mom Jill, going to the school every day just bitching at Dan, who's the principal. They're demanding that they go through kids phones. But luckily the superintendent is like, hey, are you insane? You're not gonna go through kids phones. Like, we're not gonna have interrogations of the basketball team. Side note, some of the sympathy farming, if you will, is weird. Kendra will take Screenshots of the unknown sender texting her own daughter to self exit it, send it to Lauren's classmates, or sometimes even call them, to which a few of Lauren's classmates are actually very stressed out about this. And they feel like now every text or call from Kendra is going to be the one where they are told that Lauren is gone because that's how concerned they are. One classmate says, how much can a little girl take? So people are saying that Jill, who is Owen's mom, is trying to get to the bottom of this. Every time she's talking to the principal, she's trying to implement new things, things to figure out who the texter is. Meanwhile, Kendra is just like sobbing. She's trying to get thoughts and prayers and a freaking casserole. That's the vibe, which I don't know, but a lot of the documentary runs with this theory. Kendra again says that's not why. She says, I'm not jealous of my daughter. This is also not why she said that she wanted to protect her daughter. She says, When I was 17, I was R worded and as my daughter was hitting those teenagers, I got scared. I got very scared, scared. I didn't want her to go through the process that I'd gone through. And I think that really led me to not knowing how to handle things right. It was hard because I was reliving what I had been through, but also at the same time wanting to protect her. I wanted to try to like control the outcome of her journey. I was afraid of letting her grow up some, right? Wanting to protect her and keep her safe and keep her close and scared to let her grow up because scared of what could happen to her. A lot of people are like, what are you talking about? Yeah, what are you talking about? A lot of netizens are confused why Netflix didn't push back on Kendra's excuse. Side note, another text in the court docs we found was Lauren texting. I don't understand any of this, but it's becoming very hurtful. And honestly, I'll do anything for you to stop and leave our lives alone. Neither of us did anything to anyone to deserve this. And honestly, it just makes me very sad. Kendra. Unknown sender responds, shut the fuck up. Owen fucking hates you and he could care less about how your ugly anorexic bitch ass feels. Give up on him and yourself. You're worthless, bitch. You fucking lost. We will see when you get caught. And I hope you know our lives and feelings are not a game at all. And it's sad. You act like you're proud of this and I might be worthless or whatever you're calling me, but you're not worth my time so please just stop. Kendra just responds, you're fucking jealous. Give up and we won. Owen fucking picks us and you fucking worthless trash to him. One netizen Comments I think she texted her daughter hurtful things. She was projecting her own insecurities onto her daughter. The mother felt worthless losing her dream jobs and probably felt like self exiting so she texted her daughter to hurt herself. And maybe she was jealous that her daughter was having happy teenage years, carefree teenage years while she was not. Then there is another theory in the documentary that's touched upon for like 2 seconds which is Kendra was obsessed with Owen. So like the jealousy of her daughter is stemming from the fact that she's jealous that her daughter is dating Owen. Kendra wants a 13 year old boy is the theory and it mainly comes from Owen's mom stating that she believes Kendra was obsessed. Kendra's own text messages, a lot of them do come off very strangely. So one text message reads, you will never take him away from me. You will never win when it comes to him. I will always win and I have always and will always be more important to him. Owen loves me and I will always be the girl he loves. You will not come into his life and take him away from me. That will not happen. You are a bitch and I want you out of his life. He will always be with me while your lonely ugly ass is alone. Owen and I need each other. Sorry, not sorry. Lauren responds, I'm sorry you feel it's okay to say stuff and if it makes you feel better about yourself then good for you. I don't care what you say. Owen and I are solid and you're not going to break us up. The response later to that is this phone number is no longer inserted nervous because she likes to change her phone number a lot and so it just feels like, it feels like targeted towards Lauren. Yes, but it does feel weirdly obsessive with Owen. Another text reads, you are worthless and mean nothing. You never have Get a fucking life out of here. Owen will never look at you again or talk to you. You fucked up his life so bad his family fucking hates you for it and he will never in his life acknowledge you again. Get the fuck lost bitch. He is fucking done with you. You embarrass him for real. He picks us over you every day at school. He always has and always will. Lol. He hates you. You Embarrass him, make him miserable. Facts. He avoids your sorry ass all day. You see him pick us over you for real. Your worst girlfriend. He wants zero with your sorry ugly anorexic ass. Just feels like some sort of unhinged weird obsession. A lot of people say that it just feels like jealousy in the purest form aimed towards Owen. Saying things like he wants sex, BJ's and making out again. This is sent from a middle aged woman to a 13 year old boy and to her own daughter. You don't give it up. He cheated on your ass for more. She's an ugly anorexic bitch and sucks at everything. Ain't no one like her. She up on your boys. Don't talk to her. Basically accusing Lauren of talking to Owen's friends. Oh, and you fucking promise do not talk to her. She fucking ain't worth it. People argue online that whether it was jealousy towards her own daughter. Munchausen by proxy, Cyber Munchausen by proxy, whatever you want to call it. None of these text messages are appropriate to write to 13 year old year olds and you can't really write it. Some netizens are arguing without feeling something towards that boy. It's just kind of incomprehensible, right?
- [70:39]
B
Yeah. Like these messages are really alarming to say. Yeah towards about a 13 year old boy.
- [70:46]
A
Yeah.
- [70:47]
B
So yeah.
- [70:49]
A
Another message reads owen loves me and I was and I will always be the girl he loves. He will be with me while your lonely ugly ass is alone. In the documentary, Kendra says he liked, you know, talking about Lauren and Owen. They talk, they liked a lot of the same stuff. You know, a lot of the sports they went trick or treating together. Little things like that. How can you say they like trick or treating? Recognize how young they are and still text things like this. Further proof that netizens feel show that Kendra was obsessed with Owen is all of the text messages seem to center around them breaking up, breaking up up the golden couple because Owen likes us more than Lauren. Quote, we will win. Well Kendra does win because Lauren and Owen end up breaking up. Owen says we were on FaceTime and I told her it was just too much. It's clear the texter wanted them to break up. Owen says maybe if we give them what they want and they stop, maybe one day we can try again.
- [71:45]
B
Do you like just in the midst.
- [71:47]
A
Of all of this, in the midst of. And he thought it was going to get better because that was the whole point of all these messages is for them to break up. But it doesn't get better because months later he goes to an away game and he meets this girl from a neighboring city, like two hours away. They're not officially dating, they're just talking. But then he wakes up to a text from her. My mom just got a random text from someone. Owen is like, here we go again. It's the same format, same words. Telling the girl from Pink conning to back off of me because I'm there. The texter went out of their way to find her mom's phone number that lives in Pinkoning. I just felt like I couldn't do anything about it.
- [72:25]
B
I had no, wait, wait, it's texting the girl's mom.
- [72:28]
A
Yeah, this like random girl's mom.
- [72:30]
B
But not texting the girl or Owen.
- [72:33]
A
No.
- [72:33]
B
What?
- [72:34]
A
I just felt like I couldn't do anything about it. I had no freedom. I felt like I couldn't date anyone because I was putting them in danger and I just didn't want them to go through the same thing that Lauren went through. It would eat me alive. Each and every day I feel like they. I would. I was losing trust in everyone. In a text thread, the girl is asking him, you know who it is? No, my mom just got another text this morning. I'm really sorry. Owen states, so me and the girl from Pinconning ended up breaking up because of this. Furthermore, there's an anonymous tip that gets sent in accusing Lauren of bullying Owen. That is sent in by Kendra herself. It feels like in some respects she's competing with her own daughter and all these other girls, girls for this 13 year old boy. When they were dating, you know, Kendra would go out of her way to go on these dates with Lauren and Owen to take pictures of them. She signed up to coach Oren's Owens track team. She wanted to become his quote, second mom. She went out of her way to drive Lauren three hours to watch one of Owens championship games. And there had been this huge tournament in Florida for Owen. Kendra thought, why don't we turn it into a whole, whole Licari family vacation? To which Jill, Owen's mom, gently told her, maybe not. But now in hindsight, it just seems strange because even after the breakup, Kendra is attending games that Lauren is not going to, sitting right next to Owen's mom Jill. Owen's mom Jill says, I think she became obsessed with Owen, which is hard being a mom and that she's a grown woman. But I think there was some level of relationship that she wanted to have with Owen that obviously is not acceptable at her Age. If you looked at the way she treated him, how she glorified him, how she would go out of her way to do anything and everything for him and just be noticed by him. She would just randomly text him and try to keep a connection with him. She came to all his sporting events even after Lauren and him broke up. This is so sweet.
- [74:24]
B
That is weird.
- [74:25]
A
Owen says it felt like she was attracted to me. She was super friendly, super, like, here, I'll get this for you. I'll go do this for you. You know, it's just. It just wasn't like. It wasn't like it was my girlfriend's mom. It felt like it was something more. She would do things for me. She would cut my own stake for me. It was just to the point where it was just like almost too weird. When the police show up with a search warrant for Kendra's devices, they straight up ask Kendra, is there an infatuation there with Owen? And she says, no, nothing like that.
- [75:00]
B
How do you feel? Does it feel weird?
- [75:02]
A
Feels weird now. Need I remind you, she is also texting, hi, Lauren, Owen is breaking up with you. My fucking tits in his face, making him horny. Make it cream. So one person also states that they saw Kendra take Lauren's phone. This is like another student at the school. They saw Kendra take Lauren's phone, read through Lauren's messages with Owen, and then proceed to text him back, I love you. Pretend pretending to be Lauren.
- [75:27]
B
What?
- [75:28]
A
Regardless, when Kendra is confronted, Officer Maine tells her, okay, just like, tell me, you know, did he treat Lauren bad? Was it an infatuation? I mean, because it went on for a while. And she says, what does that mean? She just won't respond. It seems like she's just looking for the best way to come off as least unhinged as possible. She says, it didn't start that way. I'm sure it didn't. I don't even know. It's okay. Just start from the beginning. So they were dating and then they started. They broke up. And so how did. How did it start? Like, why did it start? Did it start during. When they were still da. It did. Was he treating her bad? But, like, the first ones didn't start, like with me. I will say that those ones were like random or whatever. So somebody else started those. You don't know them. Yeah, but then, like, I like, fed off of it some.
- [76:28]
B
What's going on? Like, she just won't.
- [76:32]
A
Yeah. What? One court document states the following repeatedly, Ms. Licari called her own daughter terrible names and suggested that Owen was interested in other girls and that she could never please him the way he wanted wanted. The sexually suggested text and repeated messages calling her ugly, anorexic and worthless all seem to be designed to cause mental anguish to Lauren and break up the teen's relationship. Truly, I have no clue how she wasn't charged with some sort of sexual crime against a minor. In one message from the court doc, she messages them about how she sits next to them in science class and they talk about fingering and jerking. Sorry, not sorry. It is a niche but unescapable feeling. I call it the grocery run. It's the grocery panic where you have to throw on mismatching shoes to run outside, help your mom, or help your partner carry in all the bags of groceries. Or it's like when you try to carry in as many bags as physically possible so you only have to make one trip. Trip. We've all been there. But the grocery panic doesn't have to be this reoccurring thing when life is full time is tight, Instacart helps you stay on track Instacart is more than a grocery app. It's a care company that works around your schedule. You can get groceries, household essentials delivered in as fast as 30 minutes. Whether you're hosting a barbecue, getting back from a trip, or juggling back to school chaos. I mean, there's so much chaos going on all the time. With reliable shoppers and applied platform you can count on, Instacart delivers quality and convenience without cutting corners. I especially love Instacart. Whenever I'm hosting for my family, I can get all of my groceries, even my cooking ingredients cakes. If we're celebrating, I can get all of that, plus candles delivered to my front door. I don't have to make a ton of different trips from the car to the kitchen, back and forth and save my energy for the fun parts. Download the Instacart app and use code Rotten Mango20 to get $20 off your first order of $80 or more. That's code Rotten Mango 20 to get $20 off your first Order of $80 or more or more. Offer valid for a limited time. Excludes restaurants. Additional terms apply as autumn settles in and the leaves begin to change. There's no better moment to update your closet with pieces that combine comfort, style and incredible value. That's where quints comes in. Your secret to looking effortlessly put together while staying cozy, all without breaking the bank or sacrificing quality. You guys know I love quint and Honestly, they have revolutionized the way that I think, view, even buy premium fashion. They have all the elevated essentials for fall. Think 100% Mongolian cashmere starting at $50, washable silk tops and skirts and perfectly tailored denim all at the prices that feel too good to be true. By building relationships directly with ethical top tier manufacturing partners and eliminating unnecessary middlemen, Quince delivers the same luxury you'd expect from high end brand at half the cost. It's premium quality without the premium markup. Keep it classic and cozy this fall with long lasting staples from quince. Go to quince.com rotten for free shipping on your order and 365 day returns. That's Q-U-I-N-C-E.com rotten to get free shipping and 365 day returns. Quince.com rotten I have so many great memories with my husband and I's wedding, but I also have one persistent badge memory which is the struggle we went through to plan the entire thing. It haunts me. This does not have to be the case for you and your partner. Had we known about Zola, planning would have been a positive memory. Zola is modern wedding planning for modern couples. And not only does Zola have every tool that you need to make planning enjoyable, they also really get you. Zola will have your back from day one to the wedding day. Start with Zola and make your vendor search non anxiety inducing. Set up an easy wedding website that feels you and even get an instant registry that you can literally build with one click. Even though we kept it small, we were still overrun with invitations, schedules, different family group chats. Having a central hub for all your wedding details with Zola is priceless. Trust me, if I had Zola back when I was engaged, planning would have been so streamlined. Start planning@zola.com that's z o l a.com com. Yeah.
- [80:50]
B
So what did she get charged with?
- [80:52]
A
Stalking a minor and obstruction of justice.
- [80:56]
B
Oh, that's it?
- [80:57]
A
Yeah.
- [80:58]
B
This is all of this is just considered stalking a minor?
- [81:01]
A
Yeah.
- [81:02]
B
Is it concluded? Is there more? Is there sentencing or.
- [81:05]
A
Yes. So she pled guilty. She actually had like five different counts but she pled guilty. Guilty two counts of stalking a minor and she did ultimately receive just 19 months, which is like nothing. But I think there was an argument of there was no crime, a sexual crime because there was no trying to set up. She didn't send any lewd photos, she didn't try to ask for photos, she didn't try to solicit a minor to meet with her to conduct some sort of illegal activity. I still don't understand how this doesn't count as sexual harassment at the very least of a minor. But yeah, I mean, she just has a sick obsession with the word creamy. Cream. Cream. And sometimes she will literally just text cream. And then another one in caps. Cream and another message. Remember when he used to touch my leg? He be touching more now. He always pick me. Bedroom pics coming, bitch. Bitch be jealous, bitch. He hitting for pussy now. Lmfao. But then in comes a new theory. So after watching the documentary, some people feel that Jill, Owen's mother, was the target. And not as in Kendra wants her or maybe wants to be accepted by her, wants to be taken in as a best friend by Owen's mom. Owen's parents have the life that it appears Kendra really wanted. Kendra really wanted that quintessential small town, popular parents lifestyle storyline. Owen's dad was the star outfielder for baseball at Beale City High School. Jill was a Beale City cheerleader. Jill says in another report that Kendra always talked about Lauren and Owen like they were going to be together forever. So the theory being she wanted the kids to get married just so she could have a good standing in the community as one of the popular parents. Owen starts pulling away because of these text messages. This is like a few weeks before they break up. Up. And he's just saying it's hard to be with someone after all of that. Meanwhile, Kendra really wants them to stay together because Kendra is texting Lauren in the gym. So they're in the gym together and Kendra is texting Lauren. Lauren is not sitting next to Owen. They're on rocky footing and she's texting her daughter. Sit next to him. Answer me. Come here. Now I'm pissed. Move your ass now. Now I'm fuming pissed off. This, this is fucking ridiculous. Answer me and move your ass.
- [83:27]
B
What is happening? So she did all of that to break them up?
- [83:30]
A
Yeah. So that's why some people are like, it doesn't make sense and like, it's complicated. There is a cut article that focuses on this. The Netflix documentary focuses more on Cyber Munchausen. And then the court documents is like a blend of everything. So it's like when you just have one piece of the media, when you just watch the documentary or you just read the cut article and it all seems like, oh, no, it was because of this. It was because of this. But then when you put it all together, it's like, I, she's crazy.
- [83:58]
B
So what, what did the article focus On.
- [84:01]
A
Well, they're providing these text messages. I mean, they didn't really expand more on it, but it just maybe it seems like that's the reason. Maybe if she thought Lauren and Owen got married, she would be connected to one of the more popular families in Beelzeb.
- [84:14]
B
Or maybe she knows that now she is going to be more distance from Owen.
- [84:20]
A
True, right?
- [84:21]
B
They broke. They've broken up. There's no reason for she for her to be hanging out with Owen though.
- [84:26]
A
Yeah, but the text messages are weird. And even after the breakup, Kendra goes to sit with Jill at Owens games. And Jill would be on the phone with Kendra even after the breakup because they're just trying to get to the bottom of who is sending all these messages. And Kendra was more occupied with the idea of the kids getting back together. She would be talking to Jill like, Owen only broke up with her because of the text messages. Right. Some text messages after the breakup from the unknown sender read, he wants a real girl with a body. And about getting down. He's done with Goody Goody. That ain't giving it up. He onto better. Some netizens are theorizing that maybe she is bullying her own daughter to push.
- [85:06]
B
Her to do more.
- [85:08]
A
To do more so that they can stay together.
- [85:11]
B
That is so sick and twisted.
- [85:12]
A
I feel like every theory is more sick and twisted than the last.
- [85:15]
B
Wow.
- [85:16]
A
In the documentary, Kendra also talks about Jill like they're best friends. Kendra says, jill and I spoke about it when we were together. We could just talk about anything, share things, kind of like feel like a support there. And there are constant messages from the unknown sender, oddly stating that Owen's family loves her more than Lauren, which again is odd. One text reads, girl, please, you can't stop us. And we as moms face. She all about us. She loves us. Sorry, not you. Owen messaging us right now. Another one pulled from the court doc reads, we know who his mom wants him with. It's clear. Get on Facebook and you'll see Another one. What the. Be with his mom at the game. For real. He don't want you near his family. Whatever. They like me, not you. He is over your sorry ass. Stay the away. Told me, told you before. You never take my place. He hates you. It's weird.
- [86:04]
B
So after they broke up up. Are these the message after they broke up?
- [86:09]
A
The messages actually get worse after the messages get worse after we fucking talk every day. You fucking suck. I'm better. And give him what he fucking wants. Leave him and his family the fuck alone. So Maybe there's like a yearning of a sense of belonging with Jill, Owen's mom. They're fighting this bad guy together. Bringing them closer, bringing their kids together was maybe what she thought she was doing. Pushing the two families to be trauma, bonded together and nobody else can understand them. Nobody else knows what they're going through. Nobody else can understand and stick together type of mentality. One portion of the court doc reads. To date, we are left to speculate the motive for this crime. But it appears that the goal was simply to cause mental torture to her daughter and then be there to support her in her time of need. It should not be overlooked that Ms. Lekari may have had an unhealthy infatuation with Owen that caused her to create a rift in their relationship. People are confused. Then we just have the pure chaos theory. She just gives the energy that she wants to sow absolute chaos and be the center of attention is how some netizens feel. For over a year, Kendra is playing Sherlock Holmes, Scooby Doo, Criminal Minds, except it's her own brain scan. Dan Boyer, the principal of the high school, he thought he was gonna figure it out. He thought he was gonna crack the freaking code. But it just, I mean, Kendra would come in, she would, she would be so upset every single day, talking to parents, talking to Dan. She would, she would frame the other kids. Also another thing, I don't know how anybody thought that this was a teenager texting them because the way that the text messages, it was just grammatically atrocious to the point where it is clearly an adult trying to be a 13 year old world. Eventually, Kendra just like drops the G to everything and everything becomes everything becomes everything. Playing nothing, which is somewhat more acceptable. But then she even drops it for leggings, which now become leggings. Leggins. Stop wearing leggings. There's just no way that a teenager is texting like this. And the fact that all the administrators and even the sheriff later is going to think that it's a teenager is crazy. Kendra at this point has been let go from her job. She has been lying to Sean, her husband. She's been lying to Lauren about having a job, spending eight hours a day doing this, and then showing up to the school every day demanding answers, pointing fingers, just mayhem. This woman is a menace. And she's complaining. She complains. In the Netflix documentary, she says, we were hoping for some type of action, right? So we really thought the school would, you know, kind of, let's see what we can do. Unfortunately, in my opinion, I don't think the school handled things very well, ma'. Am. You're the one sending the messages. Why are you commenting on the investigation into you? Eventually, the local sheriff's office decides that they are going to try and get to the bottom of this case. And they go about it for a year in the most bizarre fashion. Officer Sheriff Maine is like. Sheriff Maine is like, I got it. The messages start around Halloween. Who was hosting the Halloween party? Chloe Wilson. You know what? Chloe Wilson, a lot of the kids said she likes to use the word bruh. A lot of the text messages say bruh. Her dad's a cop. Her mom is a popular mom at the school, and this is like the popular family. So is it Chloe? Now, it does appear in the documentary that Chloe has a bit of a reputation as a mean girl. Some say that she is the mean girl of the school. Others say that she's just popular and confident and has leadership qualities. And just to give you an idea, Chloe has two best friends, Sophie and Macy. They are like the trio. Lauren's not really part of this group, and all three of them are close with Owen. But there were allegations that Chloe and her friends threw carrots at a girl named Adriana, who also happens to be Owen's cousin. To which Chloe's mom says, you know, there were just multiple allegations against Chloe where she was bullying or she wasn't being nice to this person. The principal called Chloe in constantly and she's like, I'm not doing anything. Her dad, Mr. Cop Wilson, says she was a leader at the time. She had a huge friend group. It spanned to several other schools. You know, so I think that to some people, I'm not going to say they were offended by that, but maybe they wanted that sort of thing for themselves. A lot of people don't like this family after the documentary, and I don't know, I think it's bad to say whether we like or dislike Chloe. I think it's hard to say. And she's in such formative years of her life. But the parents definitely give off mean energy. Yeah, yeah. A lot of netizens have been commenting. Yeah, the girls definitely threw the carrots for sure, but she. Chloe has known Owen since they were younger and they've always had this on and off crush situation. Both of them kind of had crushes on each other but never ended up dating. The reason a lot of people thought it was at her at first is because she seemed really jealous of Owen's relationship with Laura. Lauren, Sophie says about Chloe and Owen they weren't. I don't know how to explain their relationship. They were a little bit more than friends. They kind of always liked each other. Owen and Chloe became, like, really good friends, and then he started dating Lauren, is what Sophie says. Even Owen admits Lauren and Chloe never got along. Chloe wasn't the nicest person. She's not a bully, but she wasn't a nice person by any means. And I think she had some. She said some things to Lauren that just made Lauren not like her. Lauren says Chloe always had a crush on Owen. I think she would always just go and talk to him just to make me jealous. I didn't like her because I feel like we just had two completely different vibes. We played basketball together, and we just didn't match each other. So when the unknown sender starts intentionally texting about Lauren's bad basketball games and taunting her about her scores, it feels like it might be Chloe, who's very competitive on the team. And then there's a message where the unknown sender is like, you scored basically no points. I scored 12. Loser. Kendra is the volunteer scorekeeper at the games. She helps Lauren look up who on the team scored 12 points. And what do you know? The only person that scored 12 points that night was Chloe. She's framing Kendra, is framing Chloe.
- [92:14]
B
Wow. Wow.
- [92:19]
A
Kendra's framing Chloe. Chloe's getting investigated by officer Maintain. Her friends are investigating her. Chloe's so fed up, she ends up giving her phone to Owen for the day. She's like, take my phone. Take my freaking phone. And if you get text messages, then it's not from me.
- [92:34]
B
And then there's no message.
- [92:36]
A
There's no messages coming in.
- [92:37]
B
Oh, okay. Because I was thinking if the mom found out, then she would be like, I'm not texting.
- [92:42]
A
No. So there's no messages. And then even after all of that, nobody believes Chloe. So then her dad, who happens to be a cop, is like, hey, just get your phone extracted. Like, do a phone pole, right? Do a full digital extraction of your phone, which will show when you delete things like how long to die in cold. It'll show you all those things, what apps you've used, hidden stuff like that, all of that. I'll allow it. So then they do it, and there's nothing. And Chloe's parents have been adamant until the very, like, since the beginning that it was not their daughter. They even text the sheriff personally. Honestly, Mike, I don't know if you know Kendra or not, but you really need to be cautious. There's a Pretty good part of me that thinks that she may be very well doing this. This is what Chloe's dad texts Officer Maine in the beginning of the investigation.
- [93:31]
B
Kendra is doing it.
- [93:33]
A
Yeah. Even in the court documents we received in the interview note, the officer writes about Chloe's dad. Have you looked at Kendra Licari as a possible suspect? She has had some issues in the past with Chloe. She used to coach Chloe. Chloe got bumped up, and Kendra was very upset about it.
- [93:50]
B
What does that mean, bumped up?
- [93:52]
A
I guess on the team. Like she was doing better on the team, and Kendra is getting very upset about it, and if there's one thing Kendra's gonna do, it's just too much.
- [94:02]
B
Wait, how did the dad know? So the. The dad. Chloe's dad kind of knew from the get go. Yeah, but nobody else had a. Believed it. Huh.
- [94:15]
A
After Chloe gives an extraction of her phone, another message comes in. I talked police yesterday, then kept my phone, searched it, copied it, found nothing bad. Yeah, still doing it. Yeah. And then a picture of Chloe and Owen hanging out is sent, and then girls be spending night real cream. I don't know what that means, but it got to the point where everyone realized there's just no way that it's Chloe. Which is how Owen's own cousin is the next to be accused, because she is one of the few people that would dislike Chloe enough to frame her for this. She is the one that alleged Chloe and her friends threw carrots at her. Adriana says nervously, they had their grand. And if you weren't part of their group, you were considered what I call the outsiders. And if you were an outsider, they weren't nice to you.
- [95:10]
B
That's the cousin?
- [95:11]
A
No, this is Sophie. Sophie says when we were in middle school, Adriana made up this rumor that we bullied her and that we threw carrots at her. There's no one else that would dislike us that much to make it sound like we were bullying someone else. Meanwhile, Chloe's parents state, you know, parents were involved making Facebook posts. Adriana's mom was saying, like, you know, I'm on a victim, I'm a victim. You know, that kind of journey. So my finger is pointing towards Adriana. That's what I think it is. So they either. So they either think it's Kendra or Adriana. And most people are leaning towards Adriana because they're like, oh, well, she's probably trying to get back at Chloe.
- [95:44]
B
Okay, so that's interesting. So you're saying at this point, there are already fingers pointing at Kendra?
- [95:49]
A
Yes. Okay. That's also another thing. So in the documentary, it seems like a lot of people didn't even suspect Kendra.
- [95:55]
B
Right.
- [95:55]
A
But then in a lot of different articles around that time when it actually happened, a lot of sources are saying a lot of the parents in town suspected Kendra. Wow. Because of the way she was behaving.
- [96:07]
B
Okay. And. And she's still going on with her texts even though people are already coming up. Okay. Wow.
- [96:15]
A
And additionally, there is a picture sent by the unknown sender that of a gift that someone had taken at a Christmas gathering, which only Owen and his extended family would have been able to get. I don't know how Kendra got that photo, but she did. So that's why Adrianna was suspected for a really long time, which I'm imagining naturally put a divide into Owen's family. Adrianna says, I just didn't know how people thought that I could do it. It was just very hurtful because I was the quiet kid at school. Like, I didn't really talk to anybody. I wronged nobody. I was just kind of confused as why they thought I would do that. That. Yeah. Walking into class after being questioned by Sheriff Main, everybody was looking at me like they knew what happened. They were looking at me like they knew I was guilty. Kendra is just ruining everybody's lives at this point. At one point, people start suspecting Lauren, and Kendra is feeding that on too. She's submitting anonymous tips onto okay to say, which is like an anonymous tip site for high schools, and basically saying, yeah, I think Lauren could be trying to get this. Doing this for attention to herself, basically. One part of the court document reads, at numerous stages of the commission of this crime, Ms. Licari had an opportunity to simply quit. But instead, she continued to harass the victim, further inject herself into the case by attempting to thwart the police investigation with false leads and deceitful information. She broke up a group of friends for seemingly no reason other than personal gratification. And Kendra pretends. Oh, Kendra tells text with another new number. Okay. Pretending to be a friend of Chloe.
- [97:47]
B
Okay.
- [97:48]
A
And text Lauren and Owen, quote, I don't know either of you that well. I got your numbers from a friend. I know the people messaging you. I reported it to. Okay. To say I was with one of them while they were doing it. I hope reporting it helps. I recommend being very careful. They were lying, and from what I learned, putting on a very good act. It makes me sick to my stomach to know that they're proud of breaking. Breaking you guys up. I don't want to be friends with anyone who does this. And I'm gonna distance myself from those relationships. I'm just gonna leave it to volleyball only, which Chloe and Sophie and Macy are all part of the volleyball team. I talked to my parents. We made the decision to report through. Okay to say and if needed, they will call the school. You both seem very nice. Hope this helps.
- [98:29]
B
Yo. She is sick and twisted.
- [98:32]
A
There are so many layers to this. And all I have to say is that Kendra genuinely terrifies me. And at one point, she straight up just texts, bruh, the up blue ice is shit. Up being an area in Michigan where Chloe was for winter break. And then immediately text back, wrong person. Sorry, it's winter break. Chloe is in up. Everybody knows she's there. She texts after, like, sorry, not sorry, you look ugly in leggings, bruh. The up blue ice and sh.
- [99:03]
B
Like, she's on vacation.
- [99:04]
A
Yeah. And then immediately, wrong person. Sorry.
- [99:11]
B
Yo.
- [99:13]
A
Or maybe she was just trying to frame them because in the full body cam footage that we received, I did see some part that was interesting. Kendra tells the police she also did this because, quote, Kendra is explaining that she sent the messages because, quote, Lauren struggled with a group of kids at school for a long time. And she was having a really hard. Because they were targeting her, in a sense, and they were trying to come in between him and do all this stuff. So that's just very interesting. Now, Sean Lakari, Lauren's dad, was just not having a good day that day. He found out that day that not only is his wife, the mother of his child, the one sending these messages, but she hasn't had a job in over a year, and she's been lying to him about all of that. That. All of it.
- [99:59]
B
Do we see his reaction?
- [100:01]
A
Yeah, and he's upset. He's trying to confront her, like, you need to tell me now in front of the cops, because if they leave and I'm talking to you, like, one of us is going to get arrested and then no one can take care of Lauren. He's like, what the hell are you saying? You haven't had a job. And at one point she says that she quit from a job recently, but it was. She was let go like a year ago.
- [100:20]
B
But so he's upset with that, obviously, because she's lying. But is he upset about the daughter situation?
- [100:26]
A
A lot of people were upset with Shawn about it because in the body cam footage, it seems like he's more fixated on the job thing.
- [100:33]
B
Right.
- [100:33]
A
I will say, though, I think a Lot of it probably has to do with the fact that the job thing is something that he can actually express anger about. It's something I think is more manageable in his mind to showcase his anger because it seems like Shawn is a really good support system for Lauren afterwards. He does divorce Kendra immediately. But I think the text message thing is so shocking I don't even think he can wrap his mind around it to even ask her the right questions or any questions. So I think he starts with the job thing. I also wonder if there's more to the job thing because in one of the other articles it was talking about how. And this wasn't in the documentary. So it's just kind of like piecing together all the things. It was talking about how. How a lot of people that worked with Sean knew that something was off with, with Kendra because Sean would come into the auto body shop, he's a mechanic and he would talk about how well they're getting evicted because they were scammed by some person in New Mexico. Well, the car. And he believes all of it. And all the co workers are like.
- [101:37]
B
So they're like financially stranded for a year.
- [101:40]
A
Yes. And Kendra is making up all sorts of crazy lies. Oh, her check bounced for the kids, something because she had someone hack her. And Sean just believes it. And I wonder if it got to the point where he confronted Kendra and Kendra got mad at him and he's defending Ken. I don't know. I don't know. But he, he's. I, I think netizens are being hard on him and Lauren based off of this body cam footage.
- [102:08]
B
Lauren?
- [102:09]
A
Yeah, because she doesn't really show much emotion and that even caused people to accuse her of being part of it.
- [102:16]
B
How old was she then?
- [102:17]
A
Fifteen, I think. First of all, I think the language that the officer gave was so vague and I think the officer said it in such a way where it was almost too sympathetic to Kendra for Lauren to have. I think it just, I wouldn't know how to respond to that. Yeah, it's just a weird conversation. And then it's shock to be like, oh, it's your mom who's been telling you to self exit for two years straight and talking about how cream and your 13 year old boyfriend who broke up with you and broke your heart. Like it's weird. And then additionally, I also think that she kind of keeps looking at Kendra frequently and I wonder if you grow up with a parent like that. You're constantly gauging their reactions and then trying to even subconsciously react In a way that you think that they will not have such a big reaction towards your reaction.
- [103:07]
B
Yeah, yeah, yeah, I see the complication of the emotions. The mom's super manipulative and yeah, because.
- [103:14]
A
Even at the end Sean is like, you're gonna go, you're gonna call your parents and you're gonna go. And Kendra is like on top of Lauren is like, no, I can't leave her. And he's like, no, you're gonna go.
- [103:26]
B
Whoa.
- [103:28]
A
Yeah. Now the last theory is very dark and I don't think it's a big, big theory. But there are people who believe and speculate and are concerned stating they felt like it's crazy how this went on for so long. And they believe that Lauren was likely in a lot more danger than people are leading on. They suspect that Kendra wanted Lauren to self exit so that she could trauma bond with Owen and his family and get the town's sympathy as well as unload financial burdens and perhaps even her jealousy against Lauren. Netizens point out the messages of like, like, you done. He fucking hates you. He said he regrets you. You were a mistake. He said you never meant anything to him and his life would be better if you were dead. Just the constant focusing on being dead is just a lot. Jill, Owen's mom, says at one point her and Kendra had gone in to talk to the sheriff and the sheriff is like, well are you scared that your children are going to self harm? Because these are the messages that they're getting. I mean primarily Lauren. And Kendra is quiet to the point where Jill responds, the answer is yes, Kendra, we are afraid Lauren could hurt herself. Herself. Kendra says in the Netflix documentary because she's asked, were you afraid she was going to hurt herself because there were messages telling her to self exit. So I can say that I was not scared of her hurting herself. And I know some people may question that or diminish that or whatever, but I know Lauren and I know the conversations that her and I have. But if you didn't know her as well as I did, it might be different.
- [105:00]
B
It sounds, sounded like she's trying to give herself grace of like oh, I, that's why I send it because I know nothing's gonna happen to her in the doc.
- [105:09]
A
This was not in the documentary but some more messages in the court doc read choke on more pills. We could care less, Owen, promise we won't get in trouble. Fuck off. Take more pills. No one cares about your anorexic, ugly, worthless bitch. She fucking shouldn't have showed her face today. Her fucking fault for being here. Let's fucking go do this shit. Finish the week, ass bitch. Hate the motherfucking bitch. Destroy, wreck, finish her tomorrow. Fucking beat you bitch. We finish it. What the fuck? We said show you bitch. Fucking be gone. Make our lives better, bitch. Fuck you motherfucker. You fucking know what the fuck went down. We ain't fucking lying. We fucking hung this weekend. Motherfucking. She a weak ass pussy bitch need a fucking beat out of her. His fucking sister say you a pit fulfillment. Like pitiful bitch ain't got no friends. And a lot of people also point to the fact that she texts this early on before she's sending all of these like self exit messages. She sends one and then 30 minutes later she takes it back. She says, sorry, I shouldn't say dead, that was too far. Because in previous messages she was saying like he wants you dead. We all want you dead.
- [106:20]
B
Huh?
- [106:20]
A
And then she's like, sorry, I shouldn't say dead, that was too far. So it just feels like. And then a few months later she's like full on like get be gone. It just feels like you have to put you. You're not just texting these things as like, oh, that sounds like bullying. Because if you're saying sorry like dead was too far, it sounds like you mean a lot of the things you're saying.
- [106:41]
B
Yeah.
- [106:42]
A
Others are saying, well, I mean you spent two years bullying your own daughter with her biggest insecurities parties. How do you not think that they're not going to self exit? One netizen theory states Kendra wanted Lauren to self exit so she didn't have to do anything. Even though she's speaking in third person on those text messages. She meant everything. Is my theory she wanted her daughter gone. Others are speculating it's because Kendra is not from the area. Sean is. She marries Sean, but she doesn't really have a good standing in the area. She's not really a popular parent. And maybe she wanted to fit in and get sympathy and do all of these things if Lauren was gone. It just appears that Kendra has no remorse. Even during the initial search warrant where there's body cam footage, she lies about not having two phones. It's actually Sean who outs her and is like, did you get all of her devices? Because she's got another phone and it's like hidden outside the house. House in a, in a little like wooden box.
- [107:42]
B
You're kidding me. So Sean always knew she got two phones?
- [107:45]
A
Yeah, he thought it was a work phone, but now he was like, putting it together, like, oh, well, you got to make sure you get all her phones, because I thought it was a work phone. But if you're telling me she's not even working, then I don't know what that phone is.
- [107:55]
B
Basically, where was the phone?
- [107:56]
A
It was hidden outside near the side of the house, like wedged in between wooden blocks.
- [108:01]
B
They just follow her out. And then she dug it out.
- [108:04]
A
No, they were like, tell us where it is. And they, they were telling her in the body cam footage, hey, so you need to tell us where all your devices are. We don't want to, but we will flip this house upside down to look for every single one unless you just tell us. So she tells them. And about that day, Kendra will later tell Netflix, it was a very high emotional day in our house. A day of confusion, unknown answers, shock. A day of not knowing how we move forward to the next day. So it is a hard day day. But at the same time, it was an end. I think it was more of a mistake. It took me out of real life in a sense, even though it was real life. So when I was doing that, I wasn't myself. It removed me from everyday life. Just kept going and going, you know.
- [108:49]
B
Wow. That's a way to describe it.
- [108:51]
A
Yeah. Lauren says, I think the shock feeling turned into sad, which turned into mad, which turned into crazy. I didn't even know how to describe the feeling. Why would mom do that? This, like, did she really have to do this? Like, I can't believe it. Honestly, I was just really confused. She told me to self exit. It makes me feel a little bit sad. Like, why is my own mom telling me to do that? I've, like, talked to her about it, but not necessarily, like, why did you tell me to self exit? I, I still question it every day. Like, I still don't know why. The documentary director is later interviewed by Variety and they state, Kendra is a little bit of an enigma. I think that she had a lot of time to think about what she did. She was in therapy when she was incarcerated, and I believe that she's still seeing a therapist. She had put thought into what she did. I don't know that she's fully recognized or realized what it was that she did or why she did it. I guess only Kendra could answer that. They're asked by Variety, I would never want to show my face again if I were her. Why do you think that she sat down for your cameras? She was nervous about going on camera because just sitting down and telling your story is A nerve wracking thing sometimes, but she was so great and she actually ended up really loving the experience at the end of it. She said it was kind of fun, she laughed about things and I think it was really an opportunity for her to think about things a little more in depth. Every time I would ask a question, she would really have to think about some things. And I think that was really good for her. To which one netizen comments? I'm sure she genuinely thinks the documentary is about her. Her eyes were excited during the whole documentary. Yeah. Which is interesting because the reporter from Cut who did like a Think piece on this case reached out to Kendra while she was in jail. And Kendra's response to her was, I do ask that you truly think about the kids that are involved in this situation. Kind of rich boys, including my daughter, who is trying to move forward and has a bright future ahead of herself. These stories are doing additional harm. I can handle the pain, but she cannot and does not deserve it. She is moving forward with life and doesn't deserve to be put in the spotlight anymore. Or having people thinking her mom is the villain as that is hard mentally and emotionally for her.
- [111:02]
B
They will never change.
- [111:04]
A
No. Yeah. Sean has been going through it. The officer said Sean was just like a broken person. Sean says, I'm like, are you for real? I said, this is my fucking wife doing this. I just can't believe she would do something like that to her own daughter that supposedly she loved dearly. You know, a 14 to 15 year old girl, you know, it just makes me sick. She stabbed me in the heart, shot me in the heart and threw it away. Netflix interviews Lauren twice. So they interview her while her mom is serving her sentence. 19 months in jail. And Lauren is telling them, not having a relationship with my mom, I just don't feel like myself. I feel like I really need her in my life. I know my dad's angry and probably like never gonna forgive her, but I just kind of put that aside and just have the relationship with my mom that I want. The director asks, do you think people judge you for missing your mom? I think some people might have their own opinions on it, but honestly I would say I don't really care. But when they come back a year later, after Kendra has been released, Lauren is forbidden from seeing Kendra during her. I think it's because of her probation, but Lauren says that she's approaching it with caution. So it seems like she's actually more hesitant now. So maybe that time was good to process everything that's Been going on.
- [112:26]
B
Yeah.
- [112:27]
A
But the judge in Kendra's case states to be candid. You know, this was truly a horrible case. It's the kind of case that makes me glad that when I'm done with my term next year, I'm retiring. Like, Kendra is driving your honor up the fucking wall with this one. To have a judge that oversees criminal cases excited to retire because of what you've done. I mean, that's got to be as far as you can get. The judge goes on a rant about the Internet, telling the courtroom, all the communication on the Internet, just horrible people. Just horrible people. They will hide their identity and they'll act in a horrible manner. Sometimes you see the worst in human nature because people, they realize they can say whatever they want on the Internet. Internet. Kendra states very vaguely that she's embarrassed, she's sorry and this and that. And her attorney is saying that it's all because of the trauma of being r worded when she was 17. And she is reliving it now that Lauren is approaching that age. And it's just, it's a mess. The judge says, I'm empathetic to your mental health issues. I received the psychiatric evaluation this morning. When I read the pre sentence report, I wasn't getting any sense of why this occurred. Normally, you know, acting as a judge when I'm dealing with a criminal defendant, I know why they're doing what they do. You know, people addicted to drugs, they possess drugs, they use drugs, people that are thieves, they steal. It's not right, but you can kind of understand, you know, why a person is in front of me. This case is inexplicable. I read the psychiatric evaluation today. That gives me a little more insight on why you did it. But, you know, it doesn't excuse what you did. And you know, because you know that because you just told me that. Basically saying, like, I kind of get it, but not really. Even after reading your psych eval. I don't get it.
- [114:04]
B
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
- [114:05]
A
Even Owen is like, I, how could a mom do such a thing? It's just crazy that someone that close could do something like that. Not even just to me, but also to her own daughter.
- [114:14]
B
What. What else has Owen and Jill, like, his mom, like everybody said about when they found out, or they said that.
- [114:22]
A
They were just shocked. Yeah. Jill, like, told the FBI agent, no, it's not Kendra. There's no way it's Kendra way. And then it was Kendra and she, she was pissed because, like the act of Kendra every day for Years going and trying to act like trying to find. Let's all sleuth together. Let's find who's harassing our kids. Meanwhile, it's her. And Jill took it really hard. There would be days. There was one time Jill was talking about where Owen came into Jill's room and he was so distraught. He tells his mom, it's your duty as my mom to protect me and find out who's doing this to me and you're not doing that. And she was so frustrated. She's like breaking down crying. There are emails. Kendra is writing emails to Lauren when she was in jail prison and they read, hello, curly monkey head, I'm mad at you. You made me sad. You only said bye. You didn't say I love you, but I forgive you. Xoxoxoxo I love you. Have a Fana Westric day. It's a combination of fantastic, awesome and terrific. Another one reads, good morning beautiful daughter. I miss you like crazy. You are the brightest light in the universe. Sending butterfly kisses Call you tonight. I love you. Love, love, love, love, love, love you. Now that she's out, since August 2024, Lauren has not seen her mom. She says, I think I want to trust her now, but I don't know if I can now that she's out, I just want her to get the help that she needs. So when we do see each other, it doesn't go back to the old ways and how it was before. Being without that relationship, I think is really hurting me. I think rebuilding our relationship will help both of us a lot. Kendra says even though she hasn't seen Lauren, we both know that we're with each other no matter what. I definitely think that we can have a healthy relationship. I know that we both hold that bond that we have very close. There is another part of the documentary that is under fire. Near the end, Chloe's parents are sitting at a table and they say, well, Chloe's mom says, I told someone else that Sean and Lauren are going to play this off like they were the victim in this shit. They had no clue what was going on and they're going to get away with it because Mike Main didn't do his fucking job and investigate them. And that's exactly what happened. So she's accusing Sean and Lauren of being a part of this. What? Yeah. To which netizens are on the sentiment of Chloe's mom is saying cruel things about Lauren and her father who have literally lost. Lost everything, saying they're playing victims. No, ma', am, they are victims and it's so desperately tragic. I feel so bad for both of them. So they're saying yeah, we also feel bad for Chloe, but like you can't just say stuff like that. Furthermore, Chloe's mom apparently last Halloween dressed up as a scarecrow in a prison jumpsuit with a mask of Kendra's mug shot and had a bunch of fake cell phones taped to her hands. Netizens naturally had a field day with that with some writing. The scarecrow thing is demented. Who mocks an absolute horrific tragedy of abuse and mental illness like that? Chloe's mom and the other moms are just as bad in my opinion. To which someone responds, kendra told her own daughter to self exit. In no way are the other moms just as bad for a tasteless joke. Chloe was also a victim here. An adult woman tried to frame and her frame her for harassment and cyberbullying. I give her mom some leeway but another comment reads, what stuck out to me in the documentary was the Wilsons, Chloe's family, all three of them, them the not my kid attitude when clearly their daughter was a mean girl. Again, I have no opinion on Chloe and I don't think we should. We really don't know much about Chloe but I will say her parents are kind of conducting themselves in a strange way, at least in the documentary. Another comment reads, my heart aches for Lauren and her dad Sean Owen and his cousin Adrianna. Owen's parents seem like good people, but poor Lord, poor Lauren. Chloe and her parents give off real bully vibes and Kendra is just batshit crazy. Everybody needs to get out of that small town. That's the moral of the story is what the comment is saying. Some people have thoughts about Owen. Owen says in the documentary that I haven't talked to Lauren since a very long time ago. Yeah, I was mad at Lauren. I don't think I'll talk to her in the future. Some people are really upset with him for that saying that. Why is he upset with Lauren when she's also a victim? I think it comes down to when it came down to Kendra's sentencing. I think Lauren and her family were well, Lauren was very supportive of Kendra and Owen and his family clearly wanted Kendra to have a longer prison sentence. So I think it put them at odds and I'm sure it's really complicated and some people are just confused like how is Kendra not exhausted after lying like this for two years? And that is the case of Kendra Lakari and all of the things that maybe were not in the documentary or didn't deep dive in the documentary as well. Although I I will say it's a pretty well done documentary. I really yeah, you should watch it. But what are your thoughts on it? Let me know in the comments. Stay safe and I will see you in the next one Only Murders in the Building Official Podcast is now streaming on Hulu and Hulu on Disney plus. Join host Michael Cyril Creighton behind the scenes to talk all things Arconia with Steve Martin, Martin Short, Selena Gomez and more. Actors, writers and crew from season five. Watch and listen to the new podcast series Only Murders in the Building Official Podcast now streaming with new episodes Tuesdays. Listen wherever you get your podcasts and don't miss Only Murders in the Building streaming on Hulu and Hulu on Disney plus for bundle subscribers terms apply. So I was just parking my car and then I saw you. The Gecko. Huge fan. I'm always honored to meet fans out in the wild. The honor is mine. I just love being able to file a claim in under two minutes. Minutes with the Geico app.
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