Minnesota Fraud: It’s Worse Than You Think + Jayme Franklin Joins the Progrum

Summary

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Ruthless Podcast: "Minnesota Fraud: It's Worse Than You Think + Jayme Franklin Joins the Progrum"

Date: December 30, 2025
Hosts: Josh Holmes, Comfortably Smug, Michael Duncan, John Ashbrook
Featured Guest: Jamie Franklin

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Main Theme & Purpose

In this episode, the Ruthless crew dives deep into the explosive reporting on massive daycare fraud within Minnesota—allegedly perpetrated primarily by members of the Somali immigrant community—shedding light on systemic abuse of the American social safety net and the failures of Democratic governance and media oversight. The show mixes sharp conservative commentary with trademark irreverence while also welcoming guest Jamie Franklin, known for the popular Sincerely American podcast and her leadership in creating a platform for conservative women.

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Key Discussion Points and Insights

1. Minnesota Daycare Fraud - An Unchecked Scandal

• Background:
  The team discusses Nick Shirley’s investigative reporting (“old-school journalism” [02:26–02:36]) which revealed extensive fraudulent daycare operations in Minnesota. State-registered daycares, mostly attributed to the Somali community, were receiving millions in taxpayer money with no children onsite or legitimate operations.
• Scope & Method:
  Shirley conducted on-the-ground checks (door-to-door), exposing facilities with no children or staff during business hours, darkened windows, and even misspelled signs ("Quality Leering Center" instead of "Learning" [13:57–15:14]).
• Consensus:
  The hosts assert that this is not an isolated incident but a symptom of systemic problems, likely present in other states and cities (Ohio, inner city areas [04:44–05:56]).

"You can't be a farmer in Minnesota and put a seed in the ground without the EPA... But if you're this operation entirely dependent upon government taxpayer dollars, you can't even walk up and check out the sign."
— Josh Holmes [15:14]

2. Political & Media Complicity

• Failures of Oversight:
  The show contends political leaders and legacy media are unwilling to scrutinize these programs out of partisanship or fear of being labeled racist, allowing abuse to fester [06:10–07:35].
• Journalistic Insight:
  While major networks ignored the issue, independent reporters like Shirley have amassed large followings through this hands-on work, suggesting a "path forward" for credible journalism [02:36–03:06].

"This guy is doing everything that the major broadcast networks refused to do over and over again."
— John Ashbrook [02:36]

• Democratic Party Critique:
  The hosts liken Democratic governance to old-school machine politics (Tammany Hall), with bulk disbursements of federal funds in exchange for dependable voting blocs, regardless of fraud [20:37–21:39].

3. Broader Social and Fiscal Implications

• Impact on Social Services:
  Fraud siphons resources from truly needy Americans, especially those reliant on Medicaid and similar programs. Real families and disabled adults sit on endless waiting lists while fraudsters exploit the system [07:35–09:11].

"You think about the American families who actually need this social safety net and the money isn't there because it's being stolen by foreigners."
— John Ashbrook [07:35]

• Taxpayer Burden:
  The scandal is framed within the larger context of America's ballooning national debt, with fraud as a major driver of fiscal imbalance [09:42].

4. Immigration, Culture, and Policy Debates

• Cultural Component:
  The show touches on the role of cultural assimilation, arguing some communities may import less scrupulous practices or see fraud as “normal” [30:29–30:46], and proposing stricter enforcement, including deportations [09:11–09:20, 23:46–24:21].

• Political Calculation:
  The system is, in the view of the hosts, designed to perpetuate Democratic electoral advantages: “if I put money here, I get votes out of it" [20:13].

• Rhetoric of Race:
  Any questioning of where money goes is met with accusations of racism (“The cheat code for fraud” [16:36]). They see this as a tactic learned from the left to shield wrongdoers from accountability.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Journalism:
  "[Nick Shirley] basically did what 30 or 40 years ago would be referred to as journalism, where you just knock on doors and ask questions, dude."
  — Michael Duncan [02:26]

• On Systemic Fraud:
  "It's gotten to a point where it is bankrupting a nation."
  — Josh Holmes [04:23, 11:43]

  "A system does what it's designed to do. The question is, do you understand what the purpose of the system is?"
  — Michael Duncan [20:04]

• On Social Impact
  "There are people who depend on Medicaid... always operated under the assumption that Medicaid was going to have some sort of jobs program... In reality people are just sitting on a waiting list for years and years and years."
  — John Ashbrook [07:35]

• On Media Response & Framing:
  “MAGA world zeroes in on Minnesota over fraud state. So it’s conservatives pounce.”
  — John Ashbrook quoting The Hill [28:38]

  "[The Star Tribune] excused the whole thing and said the actual fraud doesn’t begin to come close...as Republicans pounce."
  — Josh Holmes [29:05]

• On Political Machine:
  "This is Tammany Hall, Huey Long, daily Chicago old school shit..."
  — Josh Holmes [20:37]

• Irreverent Analogy:
  "Nobody ever sends their first dick pic and gets caught for it... You don’t just go from 0 to $8 billion in fraud on your first time."
  — John Ashbrook [26:19]

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Highlighted Segments with Timestamps

• Introduction to the Fraud: [01:45–04:23]
• Nick Shirley's Door-to-Door Journalism: [02:26–03:27], [13:57–15:14], [18:15–19:26], [24:24–25:17]
• Systemic Critique (Cultural and Political): [05:56–11:43], [20:04–22:07]
• Media Framing and Deflection: [28:38–29:55]
• Calls for Deportations and Systemic Reform: [09:11–09:20], [23:46–24:21]
• Role of Culture and Immigration: [30:29–31:45]
• Role of "White Supremacy" and Leftist Tactics: [38:09–40:49]

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Jamie Franklin Interview

Jamie Franklin (Host, Sincerely American podcast, founder of Conservatour) joins to discuss:

• Her conservative upbringing in the Bay Area as a child of Canadian immigrants (and first-time Trump voters) [48:15–49:12]
• Experiences at UC Berkeley during the rise of the campus left, including attacks for being openly conservative [49:28–52:10]
• Launching the Conservatour as a response to the leftward skew of women’s media:

  "There is just no space for conservative women. ...They are only pro-woman if you're a liberal leaning, progressive woman."
  — Jamie Franklin [53:05]

• The need for positive role models for conservative women—focused on style, family, faith, and substance [54:56–54:57]
• Her team’s authentic friendships as the foundation of their success [55:55–57:10]
• The myth that family and career are mutually exclusive for women, and how digital media can now empower stay-at-home moms [59:23–60:47]
• The growing divide between Gen Z men (moving right) and women (left), and how the movement can better reach young women [53:41–54:56]
• Plans for more events and engagement in 2026 [61:40–62:22]

"The conservatory is all about encouraging women to look their best, to be their best, Be the best in their career, be the best mom they can be... and it's just, it's really an empowering message."
— Jamie Franklin [54:56–54:57]

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Tone & Noteworthy Exchanges

The Ruthless team's coverage is aggressive, sarcastic, and unapologetically conservative, blending policy critique with humor and blunt metaphors. Anecdotes, pop culture nods, and explicit analogies keep the energy high while underscoring their critiques. The Jamie Franklin segment adopts a warmer, mentorship-oriented tone, celebrating women’s achievements and the importance of authentic platforms filling the gap for the right.

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Notable Moments for New Listeners:

• [13:57–15:14, 18:15–19:26, 24:24–25:17] — Nick Shirley's on-the-ground fraud investigations
• [20:37–22:07] — Comparison to historical political machines
• [55:55–57:10] — Jamie Franklin on authentic friendship and success
• [53:05, 54:56–54:57] — The mission and impact of Conservatour and Sincerely American

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Summary

This episode delivers a scathing, entertaining, and detailed breakdown of an alleged multi-billion-dollar daycare fraud in Minnesota, using it as a lens on broader political and cultural decay. The team highlights the importance of accountability, media vigilance, and reform, then shifts to an inspiring conversation with Jamie Franklin about building authentic platforms for young conservative women. The tone ranges from fiery and irreverent to supportive and empowering—making for an engaging listen whether your aim is insight, outrage, or inspiration.

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Transcript

[Josh Holmes]

The modern day Democratic Party is a robber baron.

[Michael Duncan]

But I don't think it's going to take prosecutions. I think it's going to take deportations.

[John Ashbrook]

You think about the American families who actually need this social safety net and the money isn't there because it's being stolen by foreigners who are imported to this country. It's a travesty.

[Josh Holmes]

It's gotten to a point where it is bankrupting a nation. It just is. And unless you can face facts, there is no such thing as a moderate Democrat. I've worked at Coca Cola for 21 years.

[Ad Voice]

We're delivering Dr. Pepper from our brand.

[John Ashbrook]

New facility in Dallas, Texas.

[Michael Duncan]

We're really proud to still make Pepsi products in America. You don't need a college degree to.

[Josh Holmes]

Work here, but I put four kids through college by working here.

[Commentator/Guest]

This is a great place to work with great people and great American brands.

[Michael Duncan]

Grocery stores, convenience stores, restaurants, they all depend on us. We deliver great paying jobs.

[Commentator/Guest]

We deliver beverages people love.

[Michael Duncan]

We deliver for our community.

[Josh Holmes]

Ladies and gentlemen, your attention please.

[Michael Duncan]

Keep the fate, hold the line and own the lids.

[John Ashbrook]

It's time for our main event.

[Josh Holmes]

Good Tuesday to you. Welcome back to the Ruthless Variety Program. I am Josh Holmes along with comfortably smug Michael Duncan and John Ashbrook. Left to right across your radio dial as we wind up a big 2025. Exciting news here from the Ruthless Variety Program. We're going to have, you know, maybe another endeavor. I think what we should do, fellas, just judging by the news, is open up some kind of a daycare. Some kind of like one of you, you're probably the best suited to take care of.

[Michael Duncan]

Here's what I'm saying is like, you know, you think about what has created the most wealth over like the past five years. People are like, oh, has it been like crypto or AI? Nope, actually just like zero occupancy daycares or like generational wealth building.

[Commentator/Guest]

That's how you make money in your sleep.

[Josh Holmes]

It's incredible. So of course what we're referring to is the Somali daycare situation that has now come to an acute point with the reporting from Nick Shirley, where he basically went door to door on a whole bunch of places that were listed by the state of Minnesota as receiving millions of dollars for their daycares. They didn't have any children.

[Michael Duncan]

I mean, kudos to him. He basically did what 30 or 40 years ago would be referred to as journalism, where you just knock on doors and ask questions, dude.

[John Ashbrook]

What he is doing is journalism. And everybody who is saying, oh, journalism is Dead. Oh, there's no path forward for the media. Like, this guy is the path forward for the media. This guy is the path forward for journalism. This guy is doing everything that the major broadcast networks refute refused to do over and over again. And here he is putting out 42 minutes of content that has been viewed more than any other video on Twitter to date.

[Commentator/Guest]

Yeah, there's that great line out of the Big Short, like, how did Michael Burry get to know that this financial crisis was coming and that all these mortgages were fraudulent? He read them. And that's what Nick has sort of done, I think, to the journalism industry is instead, instead of just reading what other people are writing, he actually went there and knocked on the door.

[Josh Holmes]

Knocked on the door.

[Commentator/Guest]

That's how you really figure out the system is fraudulent.

[Josh Holmes]

I mean, I have so many observations to make, not the least of which it does seem like a good line of work to be in. I mean, me without my headdress here, I don't know that I could get into that line of work. But it appears as though this has gone unchecked for years. Consider for a moment that we had a vice presidential nominee with 120 days of being at the top of a ticket where everybody should be. Look, I mean, we found out that he didn't coach a football team. He wasn't in Tiananmen Square, you know, that he was like putting tampons in high school bathroom. We found out all that stuff. We didn't. Nobody decided to take a look at the state budget. Nobody was like, oh man, maybe there's $8 billion worth of fraud that is going into communities that are purporting to service the hungry and the children of those communities that never got a dime that just got shipped to fucking Mogadishu.

[Commentator/Guest]

It's too.

[John Ashbrook]

I mean, it's unbelievable because the people who are like put on a pedestal as the journalists in our society were more interested in helping Kamala win and that guy be her number two than they were in actually telling the story that's behind everything on this guy. Like, he's the worst of the worst.

[Josh Holmes]

The worst of the worst. And what I fear is, and we've talked about this a little bit pre show. What I fear is that we've got a fine point on this because of the community in focus and just how egregious this is and people like Nick Shirley doing good homework to show you exactly what's happening. My fear is this is in every state in the union, it may look a Little different in different communities. But I think this is going to be something you're going to see everywhere. And anytime you dump $6 trillion into an economy and say, oh, you guys manage it, this is the kind of thing that comes out of it. And so would I be surprised. There was a thing about Ohio that you surfaced today smug in communities there. I think you can go to almost any state in the union and have this exact same thing, in particular in inner city areas where, you know, I mean, you could take people at face value and they want to help the underprivileged people, and this is why they do whatever they do. But increasingly, you see this entrenched Democratic establishment that is basically there to ask no questions.

[Michael Duncan]

Yep.

[Josh Holmes]

Whatsoever. It's like if you start discussing whether or not money actually makes it to the homeless, to the hungry, to the children of those communities, well, you're a racist.

[Michael Duncan]

Basically, the modern definition of corruption. It's how the left has now figured, this isn't corruption. This isn't a waste of taxpayer money. This is how you get the votes. This is, I will show up to this group of people at their event. I will say, I stand with your community. Not saying, I stand with Americans. I. I will stand with X demographic or nationality or whatever. And if I help channel money your way, you deliver the votes to me. And they accept this. They've championed it. They're totally fine with it. We saw the video of that Minneapolis mayor who counted on Jacob Fry.

[Jamie Franklin]

Yeah.

[Michael Duncan]

His wedge is like, well, there's warring Ethiopian or Somali clans. It's like a clash of clans is gonna be his election plan. And it worked. So, like, they are so cynical and indifferent towards hardworking Americans who have their money taken from them every year. And you're told by the government, what you do is with this money we take from you, it will go to make this a better country. But now everyone is seeing that's not what's happening here at all. It's essentially just being stolen from us by a bunch of scammers who are laughing at us. And it's all part of Democrat process of how they get elected.

[John Ashbrook]

Right. We all bear the cost. Everybody on this show, everybody listening to this show pays taxes into a system like you were talking about, where you feel like, okay, well, I'm paying taxes in. It's more than I want to pay. But you got to hope that it's being doled out in the way it should be. I mean, that's part of the bargain that you have. And what we're Learning here is it's being stolen. And so we aren't the only victims here. Josh hit on this a second ago. I mean there are people who depend on Medicaid. My own wife started a very small nonprofit to help families with adults who have disabilities. They've grown out of the high school and they like always operated under the assumption that Medicaid was going to have some sort of jobs program or something for their children who are now adults with disabilities. Because that's the promise that Medicaid claims to people. And what she has found is that in reality people are just sitting on a waiting list for years and years and years and years. And it's like, oh, the Medicaid help never really comes. And I didn't understand that until I started hearing some of these stories about the people who are stealing money from Medicaid. And so you think about the American families who actually need this social safety net and the money isn't there because it's being stolen by foreigners who are imported to this country. And it's a travesty. And I really hope that not only there are prosecutions, but there's actually like a fix to this system so that the people who need these resources are actually able to access it.

[Michael Duncan]

And that's to me like, I also, I don't want to get black pilled or too cynical about this, but I don't think it's going to take prosecutions. I think it's going to take deportations.

[John Ashbrook]

I don't think you're wrong.

[Michael Duncan]

I don't want for someone in some Somalian guy to get convicted in Minneapolis and then have the like Soros judge be like time served back on the streets with him. I want these people put on planes and sent back because we can't, it's sad. We can't trust our own judges in this country to execute the rule of law.

[Josh Holmes]

It's a really good point. And I think, look, you could be pissed off because you're sending half of your shit to the federal government that turns around and doles out this cash and never pays attention to where it goes. And you know, you've got these communities of first generation, sometimes illegal immigrants that see that as their role to try to scam the government because that's like the culture that they grew up in. That's what they do. But if that doesn't piss you off, consider the fact that we're $37 trillion in debt and it's imperiling the American economy itself and the fact that your bond Ratings are jeopardized by that, by the strength of the American dollar. And what you can buy is jeopardized by that. The existence of Medicare, Medicaid, Social Security, threatened by all of that. And I'm not saying that those programs in and of itself would be changed irreconcilably by making sure that we root out all the fraud, but it's sure as a great place to start. And when you learn about this stuff, and then the utter indifference of people who claim to be the saviors of the poor, they are the ones who are most focused on the impoverished and the immigrant communities and the children of this country. And that's everything that they talk about all day, every day. And then they're surprisingly not concerned at all about the fact that we've stolen all of their money.

[John Ashbrook]

Oh, you're exactly right, dude.

[Josh Holmes]

And that tells you everything you need to know about where the partisanship lines are. The modern day Democratic Party is a robber baron. They are what they are. They rely on a group of votes that they subject these people to saying that you are entirely reliant upon the federal government. I'm just gonna keep the gravy train rolling. You guys figure it out once it gets there. And there's, you know, four or five head honchos that dole it out into their community. But what I expect in the end is that you keep checking the D box.

[Michael Duncan]

Bingo.

[Josh Holmes]

Right. And that is nationwide. That's not just in north Minneapolis. That's not just in Ohio. That's not. That is a nationwide proposition that they have executed since the 60s. And it's gotten to a point where it is bankrupting a nation. It just is.

[John Ashbrook]

Yeah.

[Josh Holmes]

And like, unless you can face facts, there is no such thing as a moderate Democrat. No, there just isn't.

[Michael Duncan]

Nope. There is nothing.

[Josh Holmes]

Because they are all bought in to a system that fundamentally doesn't ask questions about whether they are fairly representing the constituencies that they say that they represent.

[John Ashbrook]

Right. A moderate Democrat that does not exist. But a moderate Democrat would be all over this problem.

[Josh Holmes]

They would be all over. Never would have taken Nick Shirley.

[John Ashbrook]

Right.

[Josh Holmes]

It never would have taken the great reporting that's been done up to this point to try to get it or the FBI showing up or anybody else, because they'd have been policing their own. They're like, oh my gosh, there's fraud. These people are stealing money from people who actually are the intended beneficiaries of the billions of dollars of largesse that we all collectively have decided needed to go to Them and they're stealing it. And they know it. They know it. Like, Tim Walsh shows up and he's like, yeah, we do a lot to root off. Do you? Do you.

[John Ashbrook]

He's full of shit.

[Josh Holmes]

You don't. You don't. You can't have. The entire budget is $13 billion. He had fucking 8 on his own watch that just went out the back door. And he's like, I don't know. Yeah, we're prosecuting. Oh, are you?

[Michael Duncan]

I was seeing so many tweets, especially from Florida, of people who are like, I run a daycare. And like, every 30 or 90 days, like, someone from the state comes and visits and checks, like, who all is here? What all is going on? I need to monitor everything. Like, this has been going on for years in Minnesota, and it is with the consent of all the elected officials that this system's allowed to continue. Like, one of the one that had that, like, leering center, the one who came spelled learning correctly, had, like, 98 violations.

[Josh Holmes]

Let's get. Let's get to the clip, because you'll see all this. This is the setup of everything we're talking about in clip one.

[Nick Shirley]

Here in Minnesota, massive fraud is taking place within the government and the Somali population here. This building alone, Quality Learning center, is a daycare. Yet they spelled learning wrong, and they said leering. This daycare alone, in 2025, has received $1.9 million from the government. And the strange things about these child care centers is there's no one here right now. It's midday on a weekday. If you were to try to go inside, it's completely closed, and the windows are all blacked out. No one's working midday. Children should be in here. And this place is licensed for 99 children. And this is the outside. There's no windows, no nothing. And like I said, they literally spelled the word wrong on their sign. This is open and blatant fraud taking place here inside of Minnesota. The government is complicit with this. And this is just one of the hundreds of child daycare centers here inside of Minneapolis being ran by the Somali population. It's sad that it's happening here in Minnesota, and instincts that it's happening and it's being labeled on the Somali population, however, that's just the facts of what's happening here inside of Minnesota. $1.9 million for this daycare center that can't even spell learning right.

[Josh Holmes]

I mean. All right, so this is the tip of the iceberg, right? This is what he uses to introduce and he goes to just like a ton of these different places. But like you can't be a farmer in Minnesota and put a seed in the ground without the depart the epa, the Department of Agriculture, all these other things, making sure that you're doing your business. Right. Right. Because you make a dollar out of that. But if you're a ta, if you are this operation entirely dependent upon government taxpayer dollars, you can't even walk up and check out the sign and say like, I don't know, something that's supposed to be a learning center should probably spell learning. Right?

[Commentator/Guest]

I don't see a playground there either.

[Josh Holmes]

Like how many visits? How many visits? Zero, obviously, because the first time you showed up you'd be like, oh, they're obviously not learning a lot.

[Michael Duncan]

And as I was watching his whole video that he'd done on this, it's tremendous how again and again and again he visits these places. It's the same story. No kids are present. It's the middle of the day and this place gets 2 million. This place gets this many million. None of them are actually operational. But the folks that you would see pop up and pop out of there would like call the police and be like, this is racism. This is harassment. They've learned from the left. This is what you do is if you say racism then Americans are supposed to be terrified and let you to go about your business of robbing this country blind.

[John Ashbrook]

It's the cheat code for fraud that's.

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[Josh Holmes]

Our good friends at Fox News put a little compilation together of all the stuff that he did.

[Nick Shirley]

In clip two, we've arrived to ABC Learning Center. All the windows are blacked out. I would like to check a child in the daycare.

[John Ashbrook]

Why? Can I speak to you?

[Nick Shirley]

I would like to see if I could bring little Joey, my son, little Joey here. Is there a paperwork or can I check out the daycare?

[Josh Holmes]

You got 2.6, $6 million this year in funding and 2.5 million last year. We're just wondering where the, where the kids are.

[Nick Shirley]

Hello, we'd like to ask where the money's going.

[Commentator/Guest]

They locked the door.

[Josh Holmes]

I mean, that's it.

[Michael Duncan]

That's it. It's so infuriating.

[Josh Holmes]

You want to get your blood boiling.

[Michael Duncan]

Yeah, it is so infuriating.

[Josh Holmes]

It's incredible. But at the same time, you've got a governor who was on the vice presidential ticket, a national profile for a matter of months. Everybody knows this guy's name. You know, damn near 70 million people cast a ballot for this asshole and he's got a huge profile. What has he been up to on this? Look at graphic one for a second. This is Minnesota's economy doesn't work without childcare providers. So we're giving them a raise.

[John Ashbrook]

Come on.

[Commentator/Guest]

Well, they burned it.

[Josh Holmes]

Well, so. But again, my God, you work back the math on this stuff, right? I mean, that sentence, if you're just a pure politician, a progressive politician sounds.

[John Ashbrook]

Like a basic thing to say.

[Josh Holmes]

You're like, yep, I would think our childcare providers do deserve a raise. At the same time, you realize that there are thousands of child care providers that don't have a single fucking child in it who you're also giving a raise. And you never did the math on that. You never before giving them a raise. You didn't figure out how you could reappropriate the money that went in pure fraud to an entire community.

[Michael Duncan]

And that's the thing is, like I've said it before, is that saying of like a system does what it's designed to do. The question is, do you understand what the purpose of the system is?

[Josh Holmes]

Yes.

[Michael Duncan]

So, like, his, he's like, yeah, they deserve a raise. He doesn't see it as I want to see. Is this group of people that we provide money to, are they getting better outcomes for the kids? Are kids getting better educations, better Outcomes. Have we seen some data that makes me think if we allocate more money here, it's going to be even better for kids. No, he knows if I put money here, I get votes out of it. And that's what I'm aiming for.

[Josh Holmes]

This is the Tammany Hall, Huey Long daily Chicago old school shit that a lot of people have cast ballots to try to undo in generations since the beginning of the federal government becoming a primary funder of many state activities. And it has been a thing where the most corrupt amongst us in the early days of America would appoint people to, like the Port Authority, for example, where they could tax people on the way in and way out. That just goes into their pocket. That's what this is all about. And these people have built an entire political machine off of guaranteeing bulk payments to state and localities that they then give to communities who obviously don't have to do a damn thing for it. But the inference is just keep coming back.

[Commentator/Guest]

Well, I mean, that's how keep sending me back. That's how the Biden epa, you know, tells Stacey Abrams to open a bank account.

[Josh Holmes]

Bingo.

[Commentator/Guest]

And there's gonna be a billion dollars in there to put in what, convection ovens into Section 8 housing, right?

[John Ashbrook]

Yeah.

[Commentator/Guest]

It isn't just like daycares or health care or whatever.

[Josh Holmes]

It's everything.

[Commentator/Guest]

It's everything. It's dei, it's the green scam. All of these left wing cottage industries that exist around the Democratic Party are just like you said, it's Tammany Hall.

[Josh Holmes]

It doesn't matter how many bean counters you put in charge. I mean, you saw what happened to Elon Musk. He tried to do Doge for five months. They basically burned down Tesla and ran them out of D.C. to the point of complete frustration because they were trying to curb the international spending that we have.

[Commentator/Guest]

Which, by the way, this has a component of that as well.

[Josh Holmes]

This is the same thing.

[Commentator/Guest]

Really fascinating thing. After this Nick Shirley expose came out on Axe, were people digging up other reporters who had discussed stuff like this? And it goes back years, almost a decade. You can find local media stories from I think a Fox affiliate in Minneapolis talking about suitcases full of millions of dollars working their way through msp.

[John Ashbrook]

Yeah.

[Commentator/Guest]

You know, on their way back over to the Middle east and sort of drawing attention to this fact that there are millions and millions of dollars leaving the Minneapolis St. Paul Airport every year in suitcases from people who live in the Middle East. And it sort of asks the question, what are we doing about this? And I Think at one point it referenced one prosecution. Clearly, they didn't do enough.

[Josh Holmes]

That's not it.

[Commentator/Guest]

Right, Right.

[Josh Holmes]

I mean, if the end of all of this is eight people that are the ringleaders of this situation go to prison, I don't give a shit about that at all. It doesn't matter to me at all. Like, the community that gives rise to it is the issue. The fact that this is permitted at all if there's nobody in the community. And I don't blame, like, you know, somebody who's impoverished, who's trying to figure out how to make this work, and the only thing that they see coming their way is somebody who's just, like, doing the crimes. Like, they're not obviously to blame, but the culture that surrounds it.

[Michael Duncan]

I think they gotta go.

[Josh Holmes]

I agree.

[Michael Duncan]

I think we can't be like, you know what? If you're poor, you don't know any better. They gotta go. You got to go. If you're not from here and you're stealing American money. And the reason it's so pervasive, like, when he opens the door and he's like, I want to sign my kid up for daycare. And the lady's like, what are you talking about?

[John Ashbrook]

What do you mean?

[Josh Holmes]

What are you talking about?

[Ad Voice]

Daycare?

[Josh Holmes]

He says, fucking daycare.

[Commentator/Guest]

Yeah.

[Michael Duncan]

The fact that it's so blatant and obvious.

[John Ashbrook]

Right.

[Michael Duncan]

And pervasive means word has spread so widely among the community that, like, this is the easiest money you will ever make. These people are so dumb. This is so easily exploited.

[Josh Holmes]

What a perfect example of that. Clip 3.

[Nick Shirley]

This fraud is here at this daycare.

[Josh Holmes]

Don't open up.

[Nick Shirley]

So this is Quality Leering Center. Meant to say Quality Learning Center.

[Josh Holmes]

Don't open up.

[Nick Shirley]

They said, listen to that voice in the background.

[Josh Holmes]

Don't open up.

[Nick Shirley]

How do you have ice here, ma'?

[Josh Holmes]

Am?

[Nick Shirley]

I'm literally a YouTuber.

[Josh Holmes]

Don't open up.

[John Ashbrook]

Ma', am.

[Nick Shirley]

What do you think about the fraud that's taking place here in Minnesota?

[Josh Holmes]

Don't open up.

[Various Political Figures]

We have ice.

[Josh Holmes]

What do you think about this place being licensed for 99 children? Don't open up.

[Michael Duncan]

And getting $4 million.

[Josh Holmes]

Steal from me. $4 million, two years.

[Various Political Figures]

Go away.

[Josh Holmes]

What do you think about that? Are you in favor? Are you in favor of that? Go away. You're not welcome here. Shame on you.

[Nick Shirley]

Are you in favor of $1.9 million going illegally fraudulently to this business that has Quality Learning center but can't even spell learning right on the door?

[Josh Holmes]

Don't open up. She looks Like a nice lady.

[Michael Duncan]

I don't care who you are, you don't belong here.

[Nick Shirley]

I belong here, just like you belong here.

[Josh Holmes]

Don't open up its ice, dude.

[Michael Duncan]

And she's gotta go, too. She's gotta go too.

[Josh Holmes]

So that, I guess that's the point is like, at some point they're insulated entirely from any sort of community action against what it is that they're doing by bozos like this who are. They are in the parking lot accosting the guy doing the journalism to say like, you just paid $2 million for something that doesn't actually exist. And she's like, no, your ice. You got to get out of here. In her horn rim glasses. And I like, I hate.

[Commentator/Guest]

She loves the fraud.

[Josh Holmes]

Loves it, loves it.

[John Ashbrook]

Right. And. And the other thing is, and we talk about this all the time in different context, and I won't bring up that context right now, but you don't go from zero to $8 billion in fraud on your first time.

[Josh Holmes]

No.

[John Ashbrook]

Right. This has been going on for years. The context that we always bring up is much funnier. It's. It has to do with DPs. Yeah.

[Josh Holmes]

Nobody ever sends their first dick pic and gets caught for it.

[John Ashbrook]

Exactly.

[Josh Holmes]

It's been something that they.

[John Ashbrook]

They did it before. You don't just do it the first.

[Josh Holmes]

Oh, okay.

[Commentator/Guest]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Josh Holmes]

So it's a tried and tested move is the point.

[John Ashbrook]

Right. You don't just go from 0 to 8 billion out of nowhere.

[Michael Duncan]

What an incredible analogy.

[Josh Holmes]

It's true.

[John Ashbrook]

It's true. These politic who get caught, you know, it's not their first time.

[Michael Duncan]

And I think that. So speaking.

[Josh Holmes]

You get a little fast and loose over time. And that's the politician thing.

[Michael Duncan]

The politician thing, I think is the key component of it is I think there's a lot. There's a lot of frustration.

[Josh Holmes]

Not the first.

[Michael Duncan]

There's a lot of anger. Like you're seeing how conservatives are reacting to this. There's a lot of rage where they're like, all we're gonna get out of this is some tweets and some angrily worded letters and nothing's gonna happen.

[John Ashbrook]

Right. We'll weather this storm. We'll get away with it. Just like we have every other time before.

[Josh Holmes]

This is another to north Minneapolis, and we won't have to worry about it in Chicago and in Columbus and Cleveland and all across the United States. Like, that's basically what the fraud station is.

[Michael Duncan]

But even then, it's like, you know, days that have gone by where Democrats are held accountable for all the crimes they're doing openly. It's like still waiting. And there's a lot of, and I think correctly built up pent up resentment of what is it going to take because we are openly. I mean this is the most fraud that we have. Elected officials all the way up to Tim Waltz championing this for years.

[Josh Holmes]

Well, they're still saying, they're still saying like, no, we're on top of all of this. This is, is being politicized by the Right.

[John Ashbrook]

Right.

[Michael Duncan]

And that's the thing is like this is not gonna take like, you know, we get like 20, 30 Somali guys in handcuffs. Will you guys leave us alone out. No, no. There's gonna have to be dire, dire consequences. There's gonna have to be politicians locked up because other politicians need to see. Wait a minute, I thought this is just the system because like you said, like, this is absolutely happening in California. This is absolutely happening in. This is like how blue states are operate.

[John Ashbrook]

It is. And part of my point about how this isn't the first time you don't go from 0 to 8 billion without some infrastructure underneath it to get you to that point. The media, the legacy media is a part of this. I want to read you a headline from the Hill on this situation. They wrote MAGA world zeroes in on Minnesota over fraud state. So it's conservatives pounce.

[Josh Holmes]

Yeah.

[John Ashbrook]

On fraud.

[Josh Holmes]

Well, the Star Tribune did something the local newspaper that said basically excused the whole thing and said the actual fraud doesn't begin to come close. This is before the Nick Shirley thing begin to come close to the claims as Republicans pounce, basically. And it's an insulation and they know it and they're using it and it works out pretty well for them. This administration is doing something. Remember we had Darimer on the Secretary of Labor who talked about how this is before the Nick Shirley stuff, how they were surging a whole bunch of Department of Labor folks in there to try to look at this exact same thing. You saw over the weekend. The FBI director say basically the same thing from their standpoint. So they're doing. I guess the point that we're making is like you arrest eight guys. I don't give a shit. I really don't. It needs to be a wholesale.

[John Ashbrook]

We can stop situation, stop the problem from happening.

[Josh Holmes]

And it's also an immigration policy issue. It's a city management issue. It's assimilation issue. It's an American issue. Like if we're going to begin to just import third world countries into this country and act like it's 1939, which it's not, right? Then you're going to have to check up on that situation to make sure that you've got an assimilation component to it where people understand that it is against the law to steal taxpayer dollars.

[Commentator/Guest]

In many other cultures outside of the west and particularly the United States, it's not seen as corruption. It's just part of.

[Josh Holmes]

That's just part of their deal.

[Commentator/Guest]

It's like, it is not bad to get over on others and use those connections, illegal or legal, to gain advantage over others.

[Josh Holmes]

And they have adopted, the federal government of this country has adopted a frictionless importation system of communities across this globe in that, well, I don't know. In Dearborn, Michigan, we already have 20,000 of them. What's another 20,000?

[John Ashbrook]

No problem.

[Josh Holmes]

So now all of a sudden you've created like ISIS in the Midwest where they're like flying ISIS flags. And Democrats now who rely on their votes are like, ah, that's a Michigan problem. We can't have a Jewish guy on the ballot because those people are going to vote again. Instead of thinking about the fact that like you as a political, nationwide political party have to make a decision about who represents your political party based on their religion as a result of a swing state importing 150,000 people who want death to America like that, that is the logic that we're dealing with with today's Democratic Party. There are no moderates. There are no moderates.

[John Ashbrook]

Not one.

[Josh Holmes]

This is what they have adopted. There is a reason why they are not upset. There is a reason why they are not concerned, why they want to turn the page, why they say, MAGA does this, Republicans do that. Republicans pounce. $8 billion and it's a Republican Pounce story. No, dude, even the New York Times couldn't go that far, right? Even New York Times was like, yeah, it seems like it's a thing. And yet here they are. Tim Walls. We're on top of it. They're promoting this stuff and we're all over it. Fuck these people. It's unbelievable.

[John Ashbrook]

The media is one of the worst actors in this, and not limited to just this particular situation, but an aside on the media related to the Christmas season. I want to read you a headline from Politico Europe, ok? On the Republicans, Conservatives pounce. You got to hear this. Far right parties are claiming the festive season as their own, recasting Christmas as a marker of Christian civilization that is under threat and positioning themselves as its last line of defense against a Supposedly hostile and secular left.

[Michael Duncan]

This is a headline from Politico.

[Josh Holmes]

What is that? What the hell is that? Do you know how many knots you have to twist yourself in to get that headline? Get out of here.

[John Ashbrook]

How about Christmas is celebrated? Like, under what circumstances would you write a sentence like this? First of all, it's tortured.

[Michael Duncan]

But that's the thing. It's like. That's the thing is the media is concerned with that kind of bullshit. And modern journalism is a bunch of failure sitting in their apartments in Brooklyn pontificating on how, like, Christian is white or Christmas is white supremacist or some stupid shit like that. Meanwhile, you found some kid from YouTube who goes door to door and uncovers tens, hundreds of millions of dollars being stolen from taxpayers. That's the state of journalism.

[John Ashbrook]

He's the real journalist right now.

[Josh Holmes]

Yeah, totally. So this is what the administration is doing about it. So we're not leaving you in the darkest of places. 3A, that's the Department of Homeland Security. They're walking in. You know, when the last time locked up and closed.

[John Ashbrook]

But we have.

[Josh Holmes]

Have you seen anybody come and go from there?

[Nick Shirley]

Yesterday I was working in Jordan.

[Jamie Franklin]

I go around. So yesterday I was not here.

[John Ashbrook]

Okay.

[Josh Holmes]

So I'm not sure, to be honest with you.

[Commentator/Guest]

So they go into what, like a vape shop or something like that, the place next door, and they're like, you.

[Josh Holmes]

Know, when's the last time you saw.

[Commentator/Guest]

Somebody, anybody at that daycare?

[Josh Holmes]

You're like, I don't know. I wasn't here yesterday.

[Commentator/Guest]

Seems locked up.

[Josh Holmes]

God bless it. While the Minnesota fraud is probably the biggest democratic failure of 2025, there are a lot of other noteworthy failures. When we come back, we're going to explore a lot more of these things that we've had some yucks about, but also just. It just paints a picture of where these people are at, you know, like Republicans. You have a tendency of taking a look at your own. You're like, yeah, we're not exactly where we want to be. And then you look where the Democrats are and the approval rating that Harry Antman keeps tweeting out from cnn, and you understand why they're in the teens, how bad the Democratic Party is when you see what we have right after. Okay, so, you know, like, we covered in the first segment how the Democrats have failed everybody in terms of their whole fraud thing and everything else. They're not alone on that. It started very early on this last year about what it is that they claimed would happen or could happen because of Trump administration policies and this, that and the other. I think the governor of Wisconsin deserves some special here. Clip 5 I believe that in Wisconsin, our ability to keep our undocumented people working like they are now at a really high numbers in the state of Wisconsin. If he takes us to an improper end, our economy will be gone.

[Commentator/Guest]

Our economy will be gone.

[John Ashbrook]

Yeah. Nobody's going to buy cheese anymore.

[Josh Holmes]

So what he's saying is any kind of deportation of illegal immigrants is going to ruin the Wisconsin economy. Which what I find most fascinating about that is he's flanked by a bunch of civil rights leaders not understanding the irony of modern day slavery in many ways bobbleheading along with the idea that Wisconsin in and of itself and every Democrat believes the same thing, has to pay below a living wage to a bunch of people who don't belong here in order to keep their economy going.

[Michael Duncan]

He was like, the thing with all these undocumented workers, it's a peculiar institution, but I think it's one that our economy is dependent on. Thank you for your time.

[Commentator/Guest]

Nice.

[Josh Holmes]

And he just looks like the worst.

[Michael Duncan]

I mean, he's who you'd expect. It's heartbreaking to see these Midwestern states that have governors like that clown and Tim Walls and things just get worse and worse and worse.

[Josh Holmes]

Yeah. And everybody's surprised. Here's another one. This one we got a kick out of. This was several months ago, Elizabeth Warren had a less than a gymnastics routine in the United states Senate. Clip 6 There she is. She's walking on. You see her in front the teal.

[Michael Duncan]

Senators voting in the affirmative.

[Josh Holmes]

Your customary Native American.

[Commentator/Guest]

She's trying to lean on the desk.

[Josh Holmes]

Yeah.

[Michael Duncan]

Down it goes.

[John Ashbrook]

Everybody's going to check on her.

[Josh Holmes]

Yeah, she's up. She's up.

[Michael Duncan]

Kim King, Klobuchar.

[Josh Holmes]

Good work. Good work.

[John Ashbrook]

Yep. No, the worst thing that could happen in the Senate is communism. Gets a broken hip, can't abide. So good.

[Josh Holmes]

Jazzy jazz, one of our absolute favorites here on the Variety program, Jasmine Crockett, a newly minted candidate for the United States Senate in the great state of Texas. And clip 7 and if you really.

[Various Political Figures]

Want to know who the criminals are in this country, you can Google it.

[Michael Duncan]

You don't have to trust me.

[Various Political Figures]

But the people that commit 80% of.

[Michael Duncan]

The most violent crimes in this country.

[Various Political Figures]

Are white supremacy supremacist. Yet for whatever reason, they sit and.

[Michael Duncan]

They serve at the pleasure of the president.

[Josh Holmes]

Don't want to get into the crime statistics, do we?

[Michael Duncan]

It's always incredible. It's always incredible. Like the demand for white supremacy always far outstrips supply. Like, this has been year after year after year. The Democrats are like, this is the number one issue that we're facing in America.

[Josh Holmes]

I gotta say.

[Commentator/Guest]

I mean, the thing I love about her most is her confidence. Oh, totally. Her totally misplaced confidence. She's like, no, Google this thing I'm about to just completely make up.

[Josh Holmes]

Yeah. And if one goo one Google. And you're like, well, none of that is true.

[Commentator/Guest]

None of that was true. None of that is true. And she's like, nah.

[Michael Duncan]

She's like, there wasn't the Epstein. Just not the Epstein. She always thinks she's done something when all she's done is just show everyone how incredibly stupid she is.

[Josh Holmes]

Well, and then she pretends like she's just like, you know, F. Lee Bailey, because she's like, I'm an attorney and I pick my words very carefully. And what she did there was the most violent. I don't know how she characterizes the most violent, but whatever that is, I'm sure she's got an argument for what the most violent. And there's like two versus one. Well, she's not even saying.

[Commentator/Guest]

She's not even saying white people. She's saying white supremacists. White supremacists. They commit 80% of the most violent crimes in America.

[Josh Holmes]

Yeah, yeah.

[John Ashbrook]

Well, yeah.

[Josh Holmes]

But again, it's to perpetuate this idea that white supremacy is run rampant throughout this country and that everybody is a victim of white supremacy on the downstream of all of that, which is like, fundamentally not true, but it is. The way that Democrats run government is that they. Because it is a way of doing what we talked about in the first segment, which is if you question where the money is going, then you, sir, are a white supremacist. Exactly. And it just, it codifies the entire argument about who's the victim and who's the perpetrator here in a way that is fundamentally just untrue.

[Michael Duncan]

It's just a label to slander and establish the system of control. The same way that you saw that deranged lady being like, don't open up. It's ice here. Because she's been conditioned to believe that, oh, no, you're not a white supremacist. You're one of the good people. If you do what we want.

[Commentator/Guest]

Can you imagine if you don't deranged.

[Michael Duncan]

To eat like that, you're one of the good people. You're not a white supremacist. So they've like programmed their supporters into Thinking you have to do what we want or else you're a white supremacist.

[Commentator/Guest]

Nick Shirley released this over the holidays, so I don't think the Dem machine is fully organized yet with all that pto, you know, but I have Kwanzaa and such. Yeah, right, right. I saw that Newsom clip of them. Wasn't that class sincerely celebrated?

[Josh Holmes]

Like, he's like, oh, yeah, I just.

[Commentator/Guest]

Want to give up the fake holiday invented by. In the 60s by a Marxist radical.

[Josh Holmes]

Radical was in prison.

[Commentator/Guest]

Yeah, yeah. But can you imagine the horrible things they're going to say about Nick Shirley?

[Josh Holmes]

No. I mean, this kid's got it coming. So he's invited on this program, by the way, anytime. It was a short notice deal. We sent an invite out, and I understand why he can't. I'm sure he's got a thousand things going on, but welcome to come in anytime, because the. The stuff he's doing is more important than anybody that calls themselves a journalist these days. The next clip. We can't get enough of this. Kamala, she was talking about the VP process, trying to roll out her book, and stepped in. Absolute dog shit.

[Various Political Figures]

Clip 8 It made me very sad, but I also realized it would be a real risk no matter how. You know, I've been an advocate and an ally of the LGBT community my entire life, so it wasn't about. It wasn't about.

[John Ashbrook]

Yeah, right.

[Various Political Figures]

So it wasn't about any. Any prejudice on my part, but.

[Josh Holmes]

Oh, no, no, no, no. Just the American people are so homophobic.

[Various Political Figures]

A short period of time.

[John Ashbrook]

Yeah.

[Various Political Figures]

And the stakes were so high. I think Pete is a phenomenal, phenomenal public servant, and I think America is and would be ready for that.

[John Ashbrook]

Except you didn't take him.

[Various Political Figures]

But when I had to make that decision with two weeks to go.

[Josh Holmes]

Two weeks to go and what?

[Various Political Figures]

You know, and maybe I was being too cautious. You know, I'll let our friends. We should all talk about that.

[Josh Holmes]

Oh, yeah, maybe I was.

[Various Political Figures]

But that's the decision I made. And I'm. And I, as with everything else in the book, I'm being very candid about.

[Jamie Franklin]

That.

[Various Political Figures]

With a great deal of sadness.

[Josh Holmes]

Oh, sadness and candor.

[Various Political Figures]

The fact that it might have been a risk.

[John Ashbrook]

We have been a country for 250 years now, and I'm sure there have been a lot of idiots nominated who we've read about in history books but didn't have a full picture of how dumb they were. There is no way I would ever be persuaded that she is not the stupidest person to Ever be nominated as a major party candidate for president?

[Commentator/Guest]

No way.

[John Ashbrook]

You can't convince me.

[Commentator/Guest]

There's something remarkable about, you know, straight up saying I didn't pick the gay guy to be my vp, Pete Buttigieg. Because we only had so much time. We only had so much time when.

[Josh Holmes]

I was worried about the gay thing.

[Commentator/Guest]

Worried about the gay.

[Michael Duncan]

And then also telling it to Rachel, not being like, I'm on your show. I first want to preface.

[Commentator/Guest]

Because you're gay, Rachel, I'm an ally.

[Josh Holmes]

You know, I'm a hero, right?

[Michael Duncan]

I'm a hero.

[Josh Holmes]

Hero and an ally.

[Commentator/Guest]

I'm a hero and an ally. But when it counts, I'm a coward.

[Josh Holmes]

Dude, that's like 8,000 words to describe why it is that she didn't. And here it is. It's. She had a few weeks to pick a nominee. She didn't want the Jewish guy because the Michigan problem. She didn't want the gay guy because, I don't know, maybe people don't like gays.

[Michael Duncan]

And then she's like, but America's ready for it. But also, I mean, I couldn't take that risk.

[Josh Holmes]

I'm a champion.

[Commentator/Guest]

I mean, I think the real risk is he's way more talented than she is. Way more.

[Josh Holmes]

Probably.

[Ad Voice]

Right.

[Josh Holmes]

Which is, of course, part of the calculation. Probably was for Shapiro, too.

[Commentator/Guest]

100%.

[Josh Holmes]

You know what I mean? Like, they would have carried Pennsylvania with Shapiro.

[Commentator/Guest]

Yeah.

[Josh Holmes]

Like, everybody knows that.

[John Ashbrook]

Right.

[Josh Holmes]

And. And they didn't put him on the ticket. Took a real risk by taking somebody who was state that was never going to be in play with a guy like Tim Walls instead of the guy because of Michigan problem. It's a Michigan problem. You create ISIS and Dearborn, and all of a sudden you do have a problem.

[John Ashbrook]

No wonder the Somalis think that it's so easy to take advantage of all.

[Michael Duncan]

Exactly, dude.

[John Ashbrook]

She's at the top of the country, and everybody's like, oh, well, if she can do it, I guess I can steal 8 billion.

[Josh Holmes]

She's the one mining the till. They're like, I gotta get around that.

[Commentator/Guest]

I mean, if you look at her FEC report, it puts this whole fraud scheme in Minnesota to shame.

[John Ashbrook]

It does, dude.

[Josh Holmes]

And honestly, there needs to be like, you know those. Those seminars on how to help your elderly parents, like, work through financial scams and whatnot? People need to do that to the Democratic Party writ large. Like, if you sent Kamala Harris more than $1,000, you're hereby enrolled in this webinar that's gonna talk to you about scammers and their ability to steal from you. I feel like it's necessary. There's another one, this lady. I still don't really know who she is. Apparently she's a member of Congress. Clip 9 I just.

[Various Political Figures]

I've been told I have 30 seconds.

[Josh Holmes]

So I am gonna tell you that.

[Various Political Figures]

We do have to.

[Josh Holmes]

I don't swear in public very long, but I'm gonna do it. We have to fuck Trump. That'll show him.

[Ad Voice]

Please.

[Josh Holmes]

Please don't tell my children that. So while this guy's pinning her knees behind her ears waiting for Donald J. Trump, that's what she said? I didn't say it. Did she say mix on tape?

[Michael Duncan]

It was like mixed cheering, confused cheering, people being like, wait, what?

[Josh Holmes]

Yes.

[Michael Duncan]

There's only one way to beat him.

[Josh Holmes]

You just. You can't.

[Michael Duncan]

If you can't beat him, fuck him. Oh, man, it's so funny.

[Josh Holmes]

Not his type, lady.

[Ad Voice]

How is it real?

[Josh Holmes]

I don't think that that salt and pepper hairdo was gonna do the trick. How is it real? Listen, we got a great interview. So Jamie Franklin has been a friend of the program for quite some time. She's got a bunch of different projects going on. You know her from the Conservatour. Now she's got Sincerely American, a new podcast which we like a lot. They are good friends you're going to see in a lot of them. I think that they're like expanding everything and we look forward to doing more things with them in the future. Enjoy. Jamie Franklin.

[John Ashbrook]

Juan.

[Josh Holmes]

And welcome to the program. A good friend, somebody who've gotten to know here over the last couple of years. You've probably known her and seen her and seen her new podcast, which I'm told is quite a hit.

[John Ashbrook]

So good.

[Josh Holmes]

The co host of Sincerely American, Jamie Franklin. How are you?

[Michael Duncan]

Good.

[Jamie Franklin]

I'm so excited to be here. You guys. You guys are the best. I appreciate it.

[Josh Holmes]

Very kind of you. This is fun. We've been wanting to do this for a little bit. You bring, well, a perspective that four dudes don't.

[Jamie Franklin]

We have some guys that love the pod. They like to know how women are thinking our age.

[Josh Holmes]

Is that right?

[Jamie Franklin]

Yeah.

[Josh Holmes]

Do you find that creepy or no?

[Jamie Franklin]

No, I think it's good. We talk to the guys sometimes.

[Josh Holmes]

We'll be like.

[Jamie Franklin]

And guys, you should know, you know, this is what girls want in the relationship. So it's like their research. I.

[John Ashbrook]

That's fun.

[Josh Holmes]

That's fun. All right, so before we get into that project, because I want to know everything about it, like Tell us a little bit about yourself, where you grew up, how you got into politics. Like, what's the career trajectory You've done a lot in a small amount of time.

[Jamie Franklin]

Yeah, it's been a whirlwind. So I grew up in Northern California. I was born in San Francisco and then I grew up in the Bay Area. Not really known to be very conservative. No one was.

[Josh Holmes]

You and Wolf, I think, were basically it.

[Jamie Franklin]

Oh, I love that you're a Californian.

[Josh Holmes]

Yeah. He is amazing. He is a Marine too. So, you know, see a lot of that in San Francisco either.

[Jamie Franklin]

And I joke. I'm like, my parents fled socialism, AKA Canada.

[Josh Holmes]

Got it.

[Jamie Franklin]

But my dad actually, like, he truly moved him. He grew up during the Reagan time and he moved to the US because he wanted to be an entrepreneur and he just thought America is the greatest country on earth. And he was really lucky to get an opportunity out in San Francisco area. And so I was born there and my dad was a small business owner my whole life. And so he kind of always talked to me about politics and he told me why he was at the time, he couldn't vote for actually. It was funny. Trump was both my dad and my mom. And my first vote.

[John Ashbrook]

You're kidding.

[Jamie Franklin]

Yeah.

[Josh Holmes]

Really?

[Jamie Franklin]

They had just become citizens right before. And then I just turned 18 right before 2016 election.

[Josh Holmes]

That's crazy. So where in Canada were they from originally?

[Jamie Franklin]

My dad's from Alberta, which is like the Texas.

[Josh Holmes]

Yeah. I'm just gonna say I can understand where there's some conservative overlap there.

[Jamie Franklin]

They do not like Justin Trudeau particular.

[Josh Holmes]

They have a real. Yeah, it's a problem politically for them.

[Jamie Franklin]

And then my mom's from Toronto. But what's really funny is my dad's always been conservative. My mom was like, apolitical, I feel like most of her life, but loved Trump. And now she's like lecturing my dad that he's like a rhino and my dad's like, I was conservative for all you people. So she went hardcore. But anyway, long story short, I ended up going to UC Berkeley in 2016 and people were like, Jamie, did you know, I knew it was gonna be liberal, but that I went two months in is when Trump was elected. So then it just like blew up there. Like, I'm sure you guys remember that news site. Oh my gosh, Milo Protest. You know, we skipped school the day after the election because everybody was grieving. And I went to an all girls super Catholic school ran by nuns, where I met my co founder for the conservatory, Isabel. She Ended up going off to Texas and had a much different college experience than me. Just like, when I went to Cal, I was just like, what is going on here? And it's funny. Cause, like, I grew up, you know, Christian. My parents, like, love America. Like, you know, I'm white, obviously. And I'd just be on this campus. Like, these people just hate everything that I am.

[Josh Holmes]

Everything you are.

[Jamie Franklin]

And I was just interested all the time, like, why do you think the way that you do? And I always joke I have a very contrarian personality. So maybe if I went to an uber conservative school, it might have been different.

[Josh Holmes]

Yeah.

[Jamie Franklin]

But I was like. And just people there. The number one thing I feel like I took for granted my faith when I was at Catholic school, having to go to mass three times a week. And I'm like, this is a very godless place. That was the first thing that stood out to me and that people were just miserable in general. And so I would say that my experience at Cal, especially with the dating culture in particular and just like, seeing this uber feminism, like Brett Kavanaugh was a big thing when I was at Calvo Woman. And I just saw so much of. It's like just a cultural zeitgeist there of just, like, extreme leftism. And I'm like, this is just making people miserable. And then, long story short, I actually wanted to go into fashion. I was like, there is no place for me at Vogue. A lot of you guys know, like, I wanted to be like, a journalist, like Devil Wears Prada. You know, everyone grew up my age. And a lot of guys don't know just how far left this, like, woman's magazine.

[Josh Holmes]

I want to get into that.

[Jamie Franklin]

Yeah, no question. Yeah.

[Josh Holmes]

And so you're like, okay, well, I can't probably. It's not going to be a perfect fit.

[Jamie Franklin]

No. And then Isabel, my co founder, was working in D.C. i came and visited her. I'm like, wow, I want to do this. Ended up working on the Hill one summer as an internship. Then I graduated Cal and went and worked on the Trump campaign, where I met my husband. Then went over to the White House and I launched the conservatory. This is actually really funny summer of 2020, because my parents would not let me do the conservatory when I was at Cal for, like, truly safety reasons. Which, by the way, they've been really correct because look at obviously what happened with Georgia. So it was dangerous to be on these campuses and speaking just mainstream conservative beliefs, nothing crazy. We launched three days before George Floyd. So if you can imagine the backlash that we got.

[Commentator/Guest]

Oh, man.

[Jamie Franklin]

You guys, it was off the charts. Basically, everyone I knew at Cal, like, turned against me. People were like, posting that I was a white supremacist and not. I grew up in Northern California. They were like, putting me in front of a. The Confederate flag, like, photoshopping me. I literally should send you guys some of these things because I still haven't saved. I'm like, this is insane. So anyway, like, I was at the, like, just so much hate constantly. And then, you know, look where I feel like the audience that we built today, where we have over 300,000 women that follow us, that just love what we do, and it's just really a story. If you see Stand by Truth. And like, I think Clarence. Clarence Thomas said it best, like, north is always north. Even if there's fogs, north is still north. And just standing firm in what you believe in, it always pays off in the end.

[Josh Holmes]

So.

[Commentator/Guest]

So explain to our listeners and viewers, like, why. Why did you launch. Launch Conservatour? Where did you feel like there was a hole in the marketplace there in that sort of fashion world that you wanted to get into?

[Jamie Franklin]

Yeah. So if you look at, you know, Vogue, Cosmopolitan, you look at the number one podcast for women is Call Her Daddy. There is just no space for conservative women. And, you know, it's. It's kind of almost cliche to say now, but, like, Melania didn't get a cover.

[Josh Holmes]

Yeah, amazing, right?

[Jamie Franklin]

And she's like the most beautiful woman of all time. Our most beautiful first woman.

[Josh Holmes]

And she was on the COVID many times before that she was associated with any of the political side.

[Jamie Franklin]

Exactly. And like, I remember my senior year at Cal, which actually really ended up sparking this, like, AOC got a huge thing in Vogue magazine, you know, beautiful fashiony spread that she.

[Josh Holmes]

Michelle Obama.

[Jamie Franklin]

Yeah. So inspirational. And I look at these feminists and I'm like, you guys are a bunch of hypocrites because you are. They are only pro woman if you're a liberal leaning, progressive woman. And, you know, as much as the politics did matter to me, you know, obviously I supported President Trump. I ended up working in his administration. For me, it's more of the cultural things I saw so many issues with. And, you know, I ended up getting married at 23, I had my daughter at 24. And so this has only grown for me, my passion for just saying, like, how amazing family life is for women, and you're seeing there is an attack, especially on young women, that marriage is oppressive, motherhood is oppressive, you know, have your mimosa brunches and work in an office for the rest of your life. And, you know, and don't have kids and that. And just live in a city and live for yourself in a very narcissistic way. And, you know, there's a real attack on America, on the church. And which is why I think we've seen with men and women, you know, young men, people are very interested in Gen Z right now, and Gen Z men are going more and more right, and Gen Z women are going more and more left. And I think because in the conservative movement, we don't do a good enough job talking to young women about cultural issues. And I really just. What I say at the end of the day, the conservatory is all about encouraging women to look their best, to be their best, Be the best in their career, be the best mom they can be. Be the best wife you can be. Be the best friend you can be.

[Josh Holmes]

Role models.

[Jamie Franklin]

Yeah, exactly. And it's just, it's really an empowering message at the end of the day. And, you know, even if I always say this, you don't have to vote for Donald Trump to come and read our stuff. I think we have a. Or watch our podcast. We have very common sense topics that we talk about that I think a lot of people could get on board with. And so I'm like, hoping to be building bridges with the other side.

[John Ashbrook]

You know, the other thing that sets you guys apart from the rest is friendship. You know, you have relationships with your. Your pals who you're doing this with that go back years. And it's not just like a marriage of convenience. Oh, we need to do a show. Find somebody. Find somebody.

[Josh Holmes]

We need a blonde and a brunette.

[John Ashbrook]

Exactly.

[Jamie Franklin]

Isn't that funny?

[John Ashbrook]

Exactly. These are like, these are real friends who you. You've lived life with over time. And I think that really comes through to an audience. That's the sort of authenticity people are looking for. And I wonder if you could just talk a little bit about, you know, sort of the birth of the conservator on that front and then the birth of Sincerely American on that front.

[Jamie Franklin]

Of course. I love that you brought that up. Cause truly, we are all best friends. And it's. I, you know, a lot of people are like, don't do business with friends. And I, I guess maybe in some respects that can be hard for some people.

[Josh Holmes]

I mean, we're totally screwed out for.

[Jamie Franklin]

Us, I think if you're good people, it can work out. And I think you guys are a testament to that the conservator and Sincerely American are. And Isabelle and I met. She was one year below me. She was my little ring sister in high school. So we met when we were like, 14 years old.

[Josh Holmes]

Wow.

[John Ashbrook]

It's incredible.

[Jamie Franklin]

And it's just. It's so great. We've just grown up together. And just watching us go through all these different seasons of life has just been spectacular, and I'm so thankful for that. And I really look back at Santa Catalina was my school I went to, and I'm so thankful for the friendships I got there. And then Cameron, which is really cool, I met in the White House. So this was back in 2020. And we immediately just became like sisters like this. And we always joke, like, sincerely American is basically our FaceTimes that we have every day. Because I know you guys have wives. We talk on the phone. Men are like, why? What are you guys talking about all day long? But we're like, we need to just. I feel like everyone says that, but I'm like, we need to do a podcast about this because there's a lot of funny things we go over, and I think it's resonated with a lot of girls. They're really liking what we do. And I think you're right. The friendship is a huge component of that because it's just so warm, and it was just easy right off the bat.

[John Ashbrook]

Yeah.

[Josh Holmes]

It's just a natural conversation, which, of course, I mean, this is what podcasting is. If you can't have a authentic natural conversation with somebody, you shouldn't do it. You're trying to force it. The audience knows 100%. I want to ask you, just because, I mean, look, you're married young, you have a child young, you're a mom, you've got fashion interests, political interests, like an accelerated pace. Right. For what most young women go through. Is that difficult in that you've got undoubtedly a ton of peers that. I mean, you just look around D.C. for example, and everybody on Capitol Hill, it seems like people are older when they're getting married, they're older when they're having families in comparison to our parents generation, for example. Is that a challenge?

[Jamie Franklin]

Well, I always joke I'm a teen mom in D.C. i use that joke.

[Michael Duncan]

A lot of times.

[Josh Holmes]

No, it's kind of true.

[Jamie Franklin]

I think I'm actually not making this up. People a lot of times think I'm Vivian's nanny because I think, like, D.C. it's funny. I'm from the San Francisco area and also live in D.C. which are the two. I think it's like the average age of women and having kids for the first time is like 34 in some places in D.C. probably.

[John Ashbrook]

Yep.

[Jamie Franklin]

And you know, I'm, I will not lie. I'm not one of those people that like, is like coming on. You need to have kids at this age or this age. Like, I do think it's most important you meet the right person and it happens. And, and you know, there's pros to having kids really young. There's also pros to, you know, being a little bit more developed in your career. But I do think in this age where a lot of people are dealing with like infertility issues, if you can have kids young and you meet that right person, don't wait. I tell all my friends that. But in respect to, to my career, a lot of I hate the message that, oh, when you have kids, your life is over. Because my career has only gotten better since I became.

[Josh Holmes]

I guess that's kind of what I'm getting.

[Jamie Franklin]

It boosts you in a way. And I feel like I'm so much more intentional about every time I take outside of the house because I am a stay at home mom that's making it work. And I'm really thankful my husband is very supportive of me. My family is so supportive of me. Like, I have to give a huge shout out to my dad. He's like helped me so much with everything that he's always believed in from the beginning, even when everybody was hating me online. But I think I hate that message towards women because I think you and the data bears out with both men and women, that you can become more successful.

[Commentator/Guest]

Well, because, you know, the left views, all of this is zero sum. Right. Like you can either have a career or you can have a family. Right. And what I think is lost in that and it's what you bring, I think a lot to this conversation is like being a good mom can make you good at your career. Like these things can, can feed each other in sort of a virtuous cycle of like how you build a career.

[Jamie Franklin]

And I'll say this too, a lot of, we talk a lot in the age about the digital age, social media and all of the downfalls. You know, I was on Fox yesterday talking about, you know, we need age verification for young kids and stuff. And there's a lot of bad things that have come with the Internet. I will say though, the positive thing that's come, and I'm a testament to this, is that stay at home moms can build A whole career from home.

[Josh Holmes]

Yeah, that's true.

[Jamie Franklin]

It's like, I can do so much from home, but between naps and all, like. And I. It's great being in the media. Cause I work actually really, like, funny hours, you know, where I'll do like a Fox and Friends hit, for example, at 5am sometime.

[Josh Holmes]

Just working around the schedule.

[Jamie Franklin]

Yeah. And then I'll do Trace's show at like 11pm and that works for. I put Vivian down to bed and then I'm off to the studio. But you can do it from home now. And so I built, you know, the conservatory through social media. And it's been great to be able to do that. I'll laugh. Like, Vivian will be like in the back of like a work zoom and stuff, saying hi as well. She joins in. But that's the era that we live in. So that has been a really big positive, I think, for women. And I just never let anything hold you back. Like, if you really want something, you can make it happen. I really believe that.

[John Ashbrook]

Yeah. And there are so many girls out there who are looking for that sort of, you know, role model in the media. Because you see the opposite with what the mainstream and legacy press is feeding.

[Josh Holmes]

Johnny's got three daughters.

[John Ashbrook]

Yeah, I got three girls.

[Josh Holmes]

Speaks from experience.

[John Ashbrook]

I do. And, you know, my oldest is like, oh, dad. Brett Cooper. She seems so normal. She's got all of these things that she's saying and like, what you guys are doing, we do the best we can, but we're just. We're bros talking to bros. Right?

[Commentator/Guest]

Limitations.

[John Ashbrook]

There's a lot that we just don't understand. And I feel like what you guys are doing fills such an important role in the marketplace. And I'm just, you know, thinking ahead. Here we are right before. For the New Year. We're looking ahead to 2026. Everybody's doing their New Year's resolutions. I just wonder what. Sincerely American and everything else you're working on in conservatour. What do you. What do you guys have planned for 2026?

[Jamie Franklin]

Oh, my gosh. We have a lot planned. 1. I want to do a lot more events because we've done a few events so far and the girls just love it. And the guys love it as well. Because a lot of these single guys are, like, dying to meet a conservative woman because we're not as easy to come by.

[John Ashbrook]

Maybe we can.

[Commentator/Guest]

Maybe we can do like a mixer.

[Josh Holmes]

Yeah, we'll bring the bros. We'll bring the bros. Yeah.

[Commentator/Guest]

Yeah.

[Jamie Franklin]

So we want to do a Ton more events. We want to get more people together. We're really excited. You know, we have some great profiles coming up because I always. Conservative woman who, like example, Brooke Rollins, who's a good family friend. Drake and I, she is a fantastic woman who's an incredible role model, but she would never get that feature. And. Or like a Susie Wiles or a Caroline Levitt, who we absolutely love.

[Josh Holmes]

She's fantastic.

[Jamie Franklin]

We've done a profile of her. We've done profile of Lara Trump. Just these women who are spectacular and never get their due. And, you know, I've been real. I think all of us can agree with this. When Charlie was assassinated, I feel like it really sparked that. And I think this is what he would have wanted for us to go, okay, we need to work harder than ever now to, you know, carry on his legacy. And I don't think anyone can, you know, take that role as Charlie Kirk. But I hope that the conservatory can at least be a small piece of that, to carry on his legacy, especially for young women, because the work that he did to change young men is just. My brothers are younger than me, and I've just even seen it with them in their peer group. And so I hope to even be like a tenth of what he's done for young women that we can do for young. Sorry. What he's done for young men that we can do for young women.

[Josh Holmes]

Well, you're well on your way. You're a busy gal. In addition to being a mom and a great wife and everything else. I mean, you guys have projects going all the time. We should throw a party.

[Michael Duncan]

This.

[Commentator/Guest]

We should do that.

[Jamie Franklin]

Yeah. We should definitely do a ruthless conservatory. Sincerely, American party.

[John Ashbrook]

Let's do it.

[Jamie Franklin]

Yeah.

[Josh Holmes]

Wouldn't that be fun?

[Jamie Franklin]

That would be so fun. I feel like our audiences would, like, really get along. Well.

[Josh Holmes]

They would. They would. That is awesome.

[Commentator/Guest]

We could make some marriages.

[Josh Holmes]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. And then they. Well, we'll leave it at that. We'll let our creativity work for here. Listen, Jamie, thank you for everything you're doing. Thank you for coming in here.

[John Ashbrook]

Of course.

[Josh Holmes]

And look forward to a whole bunch of different opportunities. And we're gonna follow you guys closely at Sincerely American to see what all you're up to next year.

[Jamie Franklin]

Well, I'm so thankful to be here, and you guys are great. I just love what you guys are doing. Thanks. And you guys have just had such a spectacular year, and so I'm honored to be here on the pod.

[Josh Holmes]

Very fun. Thanks again.

[John Ashbrook]

I mean, what a great interview. She's obviously been all over Fox. Like you said before, we threw to it, Josh, you're gonna see a lot more of her and everything else that they're producing over the next year, and I think that's a good thing.

[Josh Holmes]

Yeah, it's an interesting concept because, you know, I mean, she's right in that my wife used to complain for years before we had kids and whatnot. I mean, she's super. My wife's super into fashion and whatnot, but she would complain for years when she had time for all of that, and she would get like, the Glamour magazine, the Vanity Fairs and the this, that, and the other thing that she's like, why is it half full of left wing propaganda before I can see, like, what's in style for the next. And. And so we always used to laugh for like a decade about how incredibly overtaken women's magazines have become by the left wing. And they sought to do something about it, which I. I give my hats off to. I mean, that's. That's. Look, it's not easy to try to establish a marketplace, but I think these gals are doing everything they can. So we encourage you to listen to all of them and give them a like and subscribe because I think they're doing great work with that. Fellas, I'm looking around here and I think we did it. Yeah.

[Michael Duncan]

Absolute banger of an episode. Gentlemen, thank you so much, Jamie Franklin, and thank you to the listeners. Remember, if you have not yet, go to our YouTube. Hit that. Subscribe, subscribe, because it's more fun in video. So until next time, minions, keep the faith, hold the line, and own the libs. We'll see you on Thursday. Stay ruthless.